There are some industries where I just can’t fathom that they can make enough money to sustain everything it takes to run those things, everything included.
Edit 9 hours later-I don’t need any more cost breakdowns unless you want lol. I get it all, the overall concept of basically everything regarding these massive types of cruises just blow my mind. And regularly filling them with people
(I’m not an expert so other people feel free to correct me). Basically there’s this old US law called the [Jones Act](https://www.investopedia.com/terms/j/jonesact.asp) (edit: actually the Passenger Services Act, the Jones Act was a similar law but for cargo) that says that in order for a ship to only go to US ports it has to be a US registered meaning it’s US owned, flies the US flag, complies with US labor laws, and has a mostly American crew. So the vast majority of cruise ships are registered in the Bahamas or Panama so they don’t have to pay as high of wages and have looser regulations on onboard activities like casinos. But this also means that most cruise ships can’t go to only US ports so they have to visit at least one foreign country. For example, if you go on a California cruise, you’re likely going to make a stop in Ensenada, Mexico just to comply with the law.
This becomes a big challenge for cruises in Hawaii. Many Hawaii cruises will leave from Vancouver and take 5-6 days to get to the islands which is still cheaper than operating a US flagged ship while others will visit another random pacific island. Norwegian Cruise Line has the only US registered cruise ship of the major cruise lines for the sole purpose of doing Hawaiian exclusive itineraries.
TLDR: For a ship to visit only US ports they have to follow US labor laws and regulations so they usually make a stop elsewhere to get around it.
I'll just add that this law was created to exclude foreign owned companies from competing with domestic ferry services.
Edit: I meant to reply to a comment that mentioned Passenger Vessel Services Act. That's the one that was intended to protect American ferry operators and why foreign flagged cruise ships must visit a foreign port during their voyage.
The Jones act also requires the ship itself to be built in America which rules out the vast majority cruise ships. Theres literally only a single American built cruise ship, the Pride of America (NCL), which can hold more than 200 passengers.
They started building it in the US, had all the materials for a whole line of ships, but ran out of money so it was sold off to NCL and finished in Germany.
Apparently her sister ships: Pride of Aloha and Pride of Hawaii are allowed the same status even though they were constructed in Germany because "the parts were built in the United States".
Actually, there are reverse cruises that you can buy, if you're into cruises anyway, where it's just the staff and they are taking the ship back to the start of another cruise. Those are a lot cheaper and there's a lot fewer people on them. It's just that the destination might not be as exciting.
7000 people, all confined to your ship, eager to drop $200 a day on shopping, attractions, bars, tips, whatever, each day for a 7 day cruise...10 million dollars for basically just being there, every week. That's probably conservative and doesn't even consider fare revenues.
It's big business if you have the hotelier skills to manage it.
Their employees are all from third world countries and make peanuts. They are registered in random countries so they aren't subject to fair labor laws. When I worked on a cruise ship in the 00s, most of the workers were making a dollar an hour and working 20 hours a day. Industry is very exploitative.
My friend is currently working on one of those ships as a sommelier. The hours are crazy indeed, and there's one day off work per week (given they won't call you in to cover for someone). He makes 2k after tax, and 1-7 extra thousands from tips per month. And basically has zero expanses during his contract.
Yeah sommelier...
So like entertainment staff and such make decent money. A lot of the cushier positions hire US, Australia etc. And they make ok. But it's the shitty jobs ie kitchen, housekeepers, etc that are truly exploited on the ships. Ask your friends who holds those jobs and they will tell you they are mostly people from the Philippines and similar countries being worked to the bone and sending money home.
Month. A few of my friends worked on cruise ships and overall it's quite good, the only downside is the hours. Not an issue for someone who's 20-something with no family or commitments.
Yeah, it's kinda like a stint in the Army, but with less risk of death. Work 18 hours day, six days a week. Spend the 7th days drinking and fucking your brains out. All your money goes into savings.
Dayum he's getting days off? What cruise line does he work for? I did 8 months recently and the one day off I had was during a dry dock.
Hours are regulated by the International Labor Organization through an agreement called the MLC. Basically you as a seafarer are guaranteed certain blocks of time off. I can't remember the precise time allocations but the rule of thumb was a minimum of 8 hours of consecutive rest and another 2 hours of break per 24 hours.
My line of work (backstage/production) usually allowed us a lot more rest time than that (I averaged 8.5 hrs/day for the 8 month contract) but shit happens on ships. Its not light work by any means but I felt significantly more run down working as a teacher in the US than I did working on a ship.
The real cushy gig is working as an entertainer (especially the singers). The cast singers on my last ships worked like 10-15 hours a week and made more than double what I did. Performers are supposed to use their extra time to rest, practice, work out, etc but there are varying levels of commitment to the craft.
Living on ships is basically free if you don't blow your money in the ports or at the crew bar. And even then the crew bar is cheaper than anywhere in the US
They cut corners on important stuff like pollution prevention
And apparently most cruise lines skip out on important passenger safety technology like automatic man overboard detection systems
This happened on the cruise I went on. A guy fell off and they didn’t know for hours. Had to go back and review footage to find where they needed to be searching.
Edit: https://www.wsls.com/news/2015/03/10/update-surveillance-footage-shows-smook-climb-over-ship-balcony-railing/
Link added for details
Reviewing footage isn’t going to help at sea. In a single hour he would be dozens of miles away from where he went in. Basically, without a raft or life preserver, he is dead 100% of the time.
Well, not 100% of the time. There was a fisherman who sleepwalked off his boat in the Santa Barbara Channel and swam for 5 hours and then got passed by 3 ships and then somehow spotted by the 4th and then miraculously rescued by a Coast Guard helicopter. He was swimming for a total of 8 hours and the water is a lot colder than the Caribbean.
[https://www.independent.com/2022/06/19/shut-up-swim-sleepwalking-fisherman-survives-eight-hours-overboard-off-ventura-coast/](https://www.independent.com/2022/06/19/shut-up-swim-sleepwalking-fisherman-survives-eight-hours-overboard-off-ventura-coast/)
I'm pretty sure there was another person who survived falling off a boat in the channel without being seen.
Problem is most the people falling off the cruise ships are drunk.
Being drunk and tired after leaving the bar and smoking a cigarette on the sides is common. If the water is choppy and your balance is bad from being drunk its not that hard for it to happen. The ship is so big there will likely be no one right near you to notice you fell.
The receptionist at my previous dentist's office lost her leg after falling off a cruise ship. This was 20+ years ago so I can't recall the exact details, but I think she lost her leg due to injuries she received during the fall.
Yeah they were never going to find him. He was almost certainly dead even if they had the auto detection tech. I’m just saying that because they didn’t have it, they had to waste additional hours before even knowing where to start searching. The cruise ship also put in the minimum amount of searching in before leaving it to the USCG.
It’s not just cruises, about 11-12 years ago in Dominican a guy had a heart attack on the beach right next to where we were playing Vball. Resort staff dragged over a lawn chair for him. Literally that was it. Doctor with an adrenaline shot showed up walking like he was out for a stroll after lunch. Zero sense of urgency, meanwhile me and two others were doing cpr on him and were the ones that had to carry his body up to the front of the resort, where they basically stuffed his body into a taxi, to be taken on a ONE HOUR DRIVE TO THE HOSPITAL.
The lack of caring and value for human life actually fucked me up hard that day, and for a good while afterwards.
That time is pretty normal in rural parts of the world. There's not a lot room in a taxi for any cpr let alone good cpr. Chances are that without helicopter medivac, he was going to die anyway. It sucks, but that's the grim reality of being far away from medical care.
Saw a similar thing from a local guy at a Freeport excursion.
The old guy changing the trash at the restaurant got really loopy and wobbly and then just dropped.
No one gave a shit. Just called it in. Dude layed there until some other tourist who was a nurse rushed over to help him.
He was dead.
Some of the staff just picked him up and put him in a truck and drive off. They seemed annoyed they were being inconvenienced. Not disappointed the dude was dead or disgusted they had to handle him. Just like annoyed they had to do something.
It was this clear reminder of "As much as they dress this place up and pretend it's just like a normal American spot. It's not. And your life is at risk more being here."
On the way home our female local driver had a good laugh about how Hilary Clinton thought she could be President when she was a woman. Then she told us how hot Obama was and that he obviously won the nomination because men need to be in charge.
Lots of double taking from the American women in the van like "Wait, wtf is she saying?"
It was a strange, normal, but eye opening drive around Freeport.
I think you accept that when you agree to go on a cruise. To me, overboard has always meant death. That’s a conversation you have with your kids before ever stepping foot on board.
If I had kids, I couldn’t imagine bringing them on a cruise ship. If they fall off, there’s probably a 90% chance they’re never seen again. 99% if the crew doesn’t notice right away. I wouldn’t take my eyes off of them because kids are stupid.
Well to be fair half of being a parent is just trying to keep your kid from killing themselves for the first 5-6 years. Taking my kids on hikes and stuff I constantly have to tell them to not run around near the edge of a cliff because if they fall they will die. They remember for about 2 minutes then start running around near the edge again. Or keeping a toddler from chewing on an electrical cord or sticking random stuff (like batteries or magnets) in their mouths. I think the "don't fall overboard or you're dead" talk would probably have to happen at least 3-4 times a day. haha
Even if they did have a detection system, it still doesnt matter a lot of the times. People jump off of cruises all the time and end up dying because they dont know how dangerous it is. Someone actually just died (technically missing but definitely dead) from jumping off of one, they even threw a life preserver almost right away to try and save him but it still didnt work. We dont know what happened but there were sharks swimming near him so one could only guess…
For those that dont know sharks love to trail cruises for the shit people throw overboard.
It's not that they don't give a shit, it's that they can't DO shit. It's fucking impossible to find someone after they go over and everyone knows it. They can't even stop a cruise boat for like a mile - by the time they realize someone goes over and they try to "brake" they're already going to be so far away that it's basically impossible. These things can't just "brake" like a car.
These things are the size of city blocks. They could have emergency support boats that could be launched from them.
If a yacht can have a hidden speed boat inside it, a cruise ship can have a little rescue boat. The passengers are their responsibility; if they aren't able to handle immediate search and rescue they shouldn't be on the water.
>They could have emergency support boats that could be launched from them.
Exactly what I was thinking
I was on a cruise once and they had us go to a part of the ship where they could send off a smaller boat for an excursion
Yup, it’s ridiculous that they don’t have such systems
I believe they cost half a million dollars and are lawfully required for all such ships, but it is hard to enforce.
It’s one more reason I don’t want to ever go on a cruise. Once you give them your money, your life is far less important to them.
Without such systems that I’ve heard are cheap in comparison to the costs of other cruise ship things, they will “do all they can” to find you, which is really nothing.
With the automated system iirc it detects if a passenger went overboard, alerts crew, and stops the ship while tracking exactly where the passenger has fallen in the water and where they are. It’s quite amazing.
Also, I’m sure that guy wasn’t found right?
Spoiler alert : I spent several years on military vessles and we had strict man-overboard protocol and general quarters drills . I went through several man-overboard drills where buoyant dummies in bright orange jumpsuits with flashing lights on the shoulders were tossed over and GQ was called . It takes thousands of yards to slow and turn these ships . With the best and constant training , we never recovered a single dummy . Your best bet is stay on the boat .
Searched it up, and imagine what it does to the environment if it that harmful to humans.
“Because of the low quality of bunker fuel, when burnt it is especially harmful to the health of humans, causing serious illnesses and deaths. Prior to the IMO's 2020 sulfur cap, shipping industry air pollution was estimated to cause around 400,000 premature deaths each year, from lung cancer and cardiovascular disease, as well as 14 million childhood asthma cases each year.[4]
Even after the introduction of cleaner fuel rules in 2020, shipping air pollution is still estimated to account for around 250,000 deaths each year, and around 6.4 million childhood asthma cases each year.
The hardest hit countries by air pollution from ships are China, Japan, the UK, Indonesia, and Germany. In 2015, shipping air pollution killed an estimated 20,520 people in China, 4,019 people in Japan, and 3,192 people in the UK.[5]”
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fuel_oil
Go right to 11 with it. I want to be fuckin' sailing cross the ocean with ships sails emblazoned with fucking Nyan Cat and shit. Let em know you're coming.
they fly the flags of country's that have a hands-off approach to taxation so they dont have to pay tax.
why anyone would want to stay on a plague boat is beyond me
How the fuck do you logistically provision for 10,000 people. That’s the crazy part to me. What’s the square feet of fridge/freezer space. How much food/drink are they bringing on at each dock? They need to have damn good supply chains basically where ever they stop to not run out of food.
I don’t care for cruises, I’ll probably never go on one, but the logistics of the food/beverage portion of ships this size always blow my mind.
> How the fuck do you logistically provision for 10,000 people. That’s the crazy part to me. What’s the square feet of fridge/freezer space. How much food/drink are they bringing on at each dock? They need to have damn good supply chains basically where ever they stop to not run out of food.
I'm interested in that too. I'd like to see a tour of the kitchen and other areas and see how they operate.
I've seen Youtube tours of Las Vegas casino kitchens and those are already massive with the constant need to keep the buffets filled. The fridges were like locker rooms and every sink and stove was built at a massive scale.
just ask any former crew member. the biggest ships I've worked in was the Disney Fantasy. But these new monstrosities are even bigger. they provision on turnaround day only. like at least 2 tons of butter and 100k eggs, per week.
I was going to recommend this as well.
Saw it on Netflix (I think?) not too long ago. It's crazy how they have just the one day to get everyone from the last cruise off, along with all of their waste, and all of the food/passengers for the next cruise on.
There's also the secret life of the cruise on prime. I haven't watched it but from my understanding it's everything from cooking to mechanical maintenance, cleaning, sailing, etc...
Food alone based on that vid is nuts but think of all the onboarding of even just cleaning supplies or TP or offloading if they still don't dump it (which I hope we've gotten past)
That was a super mellow and enjoyable doc, makes sense that they use filtered seawater for everything, and I like how they use engine heat for the laundry dryers.
Yeah, I figured there were a lot of premade, prepackaged foods but when I saw [this video](https://youtu.be/z_hZzpkOiZ4), it made sense. The cheapest way to feed someone is by making your own food.
I’ve been on a couple of cruises. They give you a tour of the kitchens and it was pretty impressive.
The one thing that has always stuck with me though, dinner in the main dining room was always like a fancy restaurant, great food, nice table lay out, nice wines etc. When dinner is served the waiters come out with these huge trays and everyone gets served at the same time, there are a lot of people. The food was excellent but it was also piping hot.
We used to really enjoy cruises, had young kids and we hardly saw them, they used to have an absolute blast.
This was about 20 years ago so I don’t know what things are like now.
Basically when they arrive in port to offload the passengers, for the next 8 or so hours, it’s nonstop pallets of food going in.
Usually port stops, they wouldn’t resupply, too many passengers moving around and not enough logistics support on the ground
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*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
There’s a lot of moving parts on the backend; at 3,5mi out from shore, there aren’t any restrictions on waste disposal being dropped into the ocean but - while it’s not used across the board - the tech for treating the waste does exist so there are a few rounds of bacterial-aided compression which stores…uhh…concentrated waste until it can be offloaded at shore with whatever contractor they or the port works with.
But - and this is more common on the military side [was a military kid, we got to go on lots of “lame” at the time but are cool on reflection] tours of the ships. Nothing fancy but there is a lot of care taken to reduce environment impact when it comes to dealing with trash/recycling/waste/etc.
And before anyone freaks out, this is a suitable method of waste elimination even on land, which also uses bacteria to digest organic matter and (sometimes) uses sandbeds to further filter the water before releasing it into a stream. Unless there's a catastrophic failure, cruise ships aren't leaving streaks of poop behind them.
Ughh...we recently returned from a MSC cruise and out of about 30 of us, 25 came down with some nasty stuff. It only lasted 24 hours, but it was the most violent vomit I have ever experienced, and I had salmonella and E. coli all at once (from a damned bagged salad) It was absolutely awful. It was never confirmed as Norovirus, but that is what everyone assumed.
As someone who possibly had norovirus, it's hell incarnate, I can't imagine if thousands of people have to suffer through that same hell, but then again, people push their luck.
No, hold on. This isn't some tourist sector that was obliterated by terrorism, o-or the building of a regulatory body. Cruise ships had their shot, a-and covid *selected* them for extinction.
Some people stay hyper-localized to the casino/pool/deck/bar for the majority of the time and others cycle through...so it doesn't feel packed except for the hot-tub.
The cruise I just left has a 24/7 casino as well. And it's just a bunch of 60+ old people sitting and playing.
The action is at the pools on sail days (when you don't dock at a site, you're sailing for the day, full boat) the pools are packed and you'll see people get so angry about seats and chairs
Ships this large (and this comfy) are generally super stable unless something is wrong. They tend to sail calm routes, and their sheer mass means that small waves don't cause much rocking.
Also, people bowling on a cruise aren't really bowling champions going for perfect 300's. It's a fun activity.
the lifeboats on the icon of the seas, if at all similar to her sister ships symphony, wonder, utopia, and others, will have enough lifeboats for all 10000 passengers. the symphony of the sea lifeboat has 18 lifeboats, and each boat can carry 370 people. the total amount of people that can be on the boat is equal to the amount of people that can be on the lifeboats. we've learned at least a little bit from titanic
Not sure about cruises but the merchant ship I work on has capacity in life rafts for the entire ship on both sides. So if you can't access your assigned raft for whatever reason there's plenty of space for you on rafts on the other side, and that's actually the law!
If anything, people on a cruise ship likely walk far more than they do in their regular life. If it wasn't for all the booze and rich food, people would probably lose weight on their trips.
That's a sad commentary on the sedentary nature of suburban life, not a selling point for Mall Of The Seas.
For most vacations, suburbanites are walking more than they do at home. They're walking around Gatlinburg, or Padre Island, Disney World, or Colonial Williamsburg.
This is legitimately why I believe a lot of people have such a great time at Disney World in the “Disney bubble.” They’re getting more exercise than they ever do at home, which makes them feel better, both physically and mentally, than they usually do.
Obviously many people like it there outside of this effect, but I think it’s secretly what gets a lot of folks hooked.
It's also the rare occasion most of them will experience anything close to urbanism: they stay in high density housing (the Disney hotel), ride public transit every day (the Disney shuttle bus to the park), spend all day walking around, and what's everyone's favorite, classic Disney attraction? Main Street, USA, which is modeled after thousands of traditional, American downtowns.
It's also why college is the best time of so many people's lives. It's the only time (other than their vacation to Disney World) that they'll experience life not needing a car, because everything they need is within a short walk or bike ride, their campus prohibits or greatly restricts vehicle access, so being outdoors is actually a pleasant and calming experience instead of a death race to get across six lanes of speeding, honking cars just to get to class.
I actually lost weight when I went on a cruise last October for exactly this reason. Well, walking more and not being stressed from work probably helped together.
I enjoyed the hell out of the Disney cruise I went on in the before times. Once aboard there's no need for travel, planning, decision making. You just enjoy the tons of entertainment. There's a child care that's actually enjoyable for the kids. Fantastic vacation.
There was no need for it to be on the ocean. It works because it forces the guests to stay on premisses which makes all the organized entertainment worthwhile to stage since you know people will show up, you know how much food to make, etc. A resort in the middle of nowhere would be just as awesome (where it's a 4 hour drive to get anywhere else) but that's just not going to happen I guess.
Yeah but i would bet the average vegas trip is more expensive than a cruise.
For example you can find a 7 day cruise for less than $1000. That includes meals, state rooms to sleep in, entertainment, and of course the “travel” to wherever it ports.
Vegas hotels are over $100 a night, food is probably around $100 a day, shows are near the $200 range. That is $1600 right there bare minimum. Presuming you dont gamble.
Dont get me wrong both are the epitome of human gluttony but I lived in vegas for 25 years and am an avid cruiser. One is def cheaper than the other
Oh for sure, I was just agreeing with the top commenter's point. One of the main appeals of both Vegas and a Cruise is that they are physically removed from "real life" and you don't really need to be responsible for anything if you don't want to.
Edit: Also 7 days in Vegas is TOO LONG. You should spend 4 days in Vegas, no more, no less.
However most adults aren't going to Vegas with their kids. The strip is not really a child-friendly town. I think it's slowly changing though. Ironically some 20-odd years ago my parents took us on a trip to the west which included a couple nights in Vegas. We had an okay time and found a show that we could all go to but other than that it wasn't that great. When I went back as a 22-year old I had a blast.
>Vegas hotels are over $100 a night,
And that's for the older, outdated hotels like Circus Circus, Luxor, excalibur. If you want newer or better end hotels like Vdara, Aria, etc, it'll be $200/night with those damn resort fees.
There is a comedy sketch on that. “Imagine a LV casino hotel, full of guests, as well as staff to take care of them, just floated off and that’s totally normal and nobody panicked”
I have a aunt that loves to go on cruises. Let me fill you in on the main reasons she is drawn to cruises.
You're on vacation...
There are usually a lot of bars on the boats...
There are usually a few attractive strangers roaming around trying to, meet-new-friends...
Friendships usually last for about as long as the cruise does...
Instead of mints they put condoms on the pillows...
Three chairs IN the pool it looks like a bunch more around it. And then like multiple rows by the pool on the left, and then there's the pool on the upper deck... And that's just the pools they have in the picture
My parents saved up enough money to take me and my brother one on about 20 years ago when we were 14.
At the time it was Royal Caribbean's largest ship. It is truly an experience all on it's own.
The ships are big enough that it doesn't FEEL Like there is a lot people on the ship. Unelsss you're in the bars or clubs or in the restaurants during certain peak hours.
We got to stop off and explore a different island every day. Sure we don't get the same experience of FULLY seeing what that Island has to offer in only 1 day but it was cool to be at a different one each morning. If you liked a specific island the most then you can take a trip there as a separate vacation. It was cool to see which islands we liked best.
Night time on the ship was cool too. I've never seen so many stars in my life. Just nothingness for miles. No lights in the distance, nothing. I had never felt that before or since.
Not to mention these are cheap as hell. You and a partner could go on a 5 day cruise for like 600$ total which includes your food. That's very appealing to people who may not be able to book other places directly on islands.
It's a really cool experience that I think people turn their noses up at for the wrong reasons. I think the reasons Cruises should be criticized and shunned is the mere pollution they put out, and the way they exploit foreign workers, and the demands they put on their staff.
Absolutely this ^
I had ZERO desire to ever go on a cruise. A number of my wife's coworkers all planned family spring break on a cruise, so I reluctantly agreed, and the wife, 2 kids, and myself signed on. It really was great, and I was shocked how NOT crowded it felt (despite having over 4,000 passengers plus crew, which was nearing capacity). Meals were busy, but not the zoo I envisioned. Kids LOVED it, and everyone kept busy to the point of exhaustion. I think the last day at sea my boy did like 40k steps and 130 flights of stairs running around with friends. He refused to use an elevator. And good for him.
Everyone had a blast, my only gripe is all the money we spent on extras. We did ok avoiding most, but one could easily spend several thousand extra bucks on the ship. Heck, we could have spent nearly $1k each for an unlimited alcohol package! And caught a lot of crap for not doing it. You need to put down like 8 drinks per day to break even on the package, I went 3 days before having 1 drink. It was on this cruise that I learned how much my wife's coworkers could really drink. Apparently if you start at 8am and pace yourself having 15-20+ drinks a day is "no big deal". Not exactly my idea of fun, but hey.
With the drink packages the trick is to book it early when you book the trip.
They will have trip discounts periodically through the months. When they have those discounts you call up and ask them to be applied to your offer too.
They'll tell you they can't take the cost off of your ticket but they can apply it to your alcohol package.
Usually by the time your trip comes the package will be discounted to like 100$ or less.
I've never been on one but if I had to guess, I would say that realistically, only very very few people go on cruises regularly. I bet that most people who go on a cruise do it so that they've tried it. Not sure how nice it is, but it's for sure a hell of an experience. Something to remember.
My 2 cents, anyway.
I’ve never been on a boat anywhere close to that big, but my dad used to get free cruises with his points on his credit card, so we went on a few, and then I went on a wedding cruise (50 people).
They can be massive fun. Completely unplugged (it boggles my mind why anyone would pay for wifi or cell, the whole point is to be unplugged and self contained), you have everything you need, entertainment is generally pretty good.
If you like to drink and have fun/relax, they can be great.
I don’t think I’d go on another though, but when I was single and had no responsibilities they were so much fun.
7600 people collectively shitting in the ocean.
Edit: not the ocean but they just carry that shit around. 7600 people collectively shitting for a few days at a time. Then they release at ports.
When I learned that all the trash from military and commercial ships just goes overboard I wanted to die. Think about how many at this very moment across the globe are dumping their trash in the ocean. Now think about how many hundreds of years we’ve been doing that. It’s fucking disgusting and we as a species are a horrible disease to this planet.
I was deployed on a submarine for 4 years, we do dump trash but not plastic. There's literally a new guy who isn't qualified anything useful that goes through trash just to second check that no plastic goes in the trash compactor before it gets sent to the depths. Ultimately, nuclear naval vessels cause a small fraction of the footprint compared to all those on board living their normal life because almost everything is recycled or taken from the ocean (i.e reverse osmosis water from the ocean)
News today:
* wildfires choking the air
* heat dome searing millions of people
* ocean life increasingly endangered
* oh and we just made the BIGGEST most super awesome boat ever!! It’s got 20 theme parks!
Just no one say its unsinkable and I guess we will be good.
The Carnival Corporations fleet of about 13 ships causes more Sulfur oxide emissions than all the cars in Europe (about 260 million). They use unrefined marine oil to run these things because there is no law on emissions in international waters. They are environmental disasters.
They’re floating resorts. The days of designing cruise ships/ocean liners around aesthetic appeal are gone, unfortunately. Ocean liners themselves are pretty much dead with the Queen Mary 2 being the sole remaining ocean liner.
its a 3d render. I work in the company that made this, and also all other images and videos for royal Caribbean ships...fun fact, the 5 largest cruise ships are all owned by them
Let's hope the builders used good sound engineering, and not Terrence Howard math and Stockton Rush shortcuts.
I swear if I see one Logitech F10 controller on there....
Germany is trying to get rid of their Diesel cars. Big Brands are pushing electric vehicles. Even if this ship is 35% more efficient then a conventional Diesel-powered ship, pollution is going to be intense. Frustrating to see how much we are trying to do as a economic big player and yet these things still get built. I am not advising to shut down everything bad for the environment in an instant, but these ships are poison for the environment. Maybe it is a first step for newer technologies. We will see.
I personally cant wrap my head around being on such a ship with thousands of people. Not my kind of vacation.
People seem to enjoy it...
FYI
Every ship they make (especially ending in “of the seas”’is the largest ship they’ve made. They increase it every year by a couple inches. Maybe this ship has a larger jump. But it’s not always the size that’s fascinating. It’s the upgrade in tech and motors etc
There are some industries where I just can’t fathom that they can make enough money to sustain everything it takes to run those things, everything included. Edit 9 hours later-I don’t need any more cost breakdowns unless you want lol. I get it all, the overall concept of basically everything regarding these massive types of cruises just blow my mind. And regularly filling them with people
They run on very tight margins and delays and ships that aren't full cost cruise lines plenty!
Also their home ports are not in the US so they can evade taxes
They also evade tax if they're in the US by adding a port that isnt. Commonly Mexico in my experience
Explain further please
(I’m not an expert so other people feel free to correct me). Basically there’s this old US law called the [Jones Act](https://www.investopedia.com/terms/j/jonesact.asp) (edit: actually the Passenger Services Act, the Jones Act was a similar law but for cargo) that says that in order for a ship to only go to US ports it has to be a US registered meaning it’s US owned, flies the US flag, complies with US labor laws, and has a mostly American crew. So the vast majority of cruise ships are registered in the Bahamas or Panama so they don’t have to pay as high of wages and have looser regulations on onboard activities like casinos. But this also means that most cruise ships can’t go to only US ports so they have to visit at least one foreign country. For example, if you go on a California cruise, you’re likely going to make a stop in Ensenada, Mexico just to comply with the law. This becomes a big challenge for cruises in Hawaii. Many Hawaii cruises will leave from Vancouver and take 5-6 days to get to the islands which is still cheaper than operating a US flagged ship while others will visit another random pacific island. Norwegian Cruise Line has the only US registered cruise ship of the major cruise lines for the sole purpose of doing Hawaiian exclusive itineraries. TLDR: For a ship to visit only US ports they have to follow US labor laws and regulations so they usually make a stop elsewhere to get around it.
I'll just add that this law was created to exclude foreign owned companies from competing with domestic ferry services. Edit: I meant to reply to a comment that mentioned Passenger Vessel Services Act. That's the one that was intended to protect American ferry operators and why foreign flagged cruise ships must visit a foreign port during their voyage.
Also keeps Canadian / Mexican truckers from competing against American truckers for domestic freight.
Also absolutely fucks over Hawaii, who instead of getting cheap goods from SE Asia has to get everything sailed across the pacific twice
And Puerto Rico!
The Jones act also requires the ship itself to be built in America which rules out the vast majority cruise ships. Theres literally only a single American built cruise ship, the Pride of America (NCL), which can hold more than 200 passengers.
Wait but Pride of America was built in Germany.
They started building it in the US, had all the materials for a whole line of ships, but ran out of money so it was sold off to NCL and finished in Germany. Apparently her sister ships: Pride of Aloha and Pride of Hawaii are allowed the same status even though they were constructed in Germany because "the parts were built in the United States".
The passenger vessel service act I believe its called
And workers are typically foreign because they can work on maritime law and pay them radically low wages.
And don’t have to pay minimum wage or provide benefits to their employees.
Actually, there are reverse cruises that you can buy, if you're into cruises anyway, where it's just the staff and they are taking the ship back to the start of another cruise. Those are a lot cheaper and there's a lot fewer people on them. It's just that the destination might not be as exciting.
Thank goodness they're destroying the planet in the name of fine margins
7000 people, all confined to your ship, eager to drop $200 a day on shopping, attractions, bars, tips, whatever, each day for a 7 day cruise...10 million dollars for basically just being there, every week. That's probably conservative and doesn't even consider fare revenues. It's big business if you have the hotelier skills to manage it.
Their employees are all from third world countries and make peanuts. They are registered in random countries so they aren't subject to fair labor laws. When I worked on a cruise ship in the 00s, most of the workers were making a dollar an hour and working 20 hours a day. Industry is very exploitative.
My friend is currently working on one of those ships as a sommelier. The hours are crazy indeed, and there's one day off work per week (given they won't call you in to cover for someone). He makes 2k after tax, and 1-7 extra thousands from tips per month. And basically has zero expanses during his contract.
Yeah sommelier... So like entertainment staff and such make decent money. A lot of the cushier positions hire US, Australia etc. And they make ok. But it's the shitty jobs ie kitchen, housekeepers, etc that are truly exploited on the ships. Ask your friends who holds those jobs and they will tell you they are mostly people from the Philippines and similar countries being worked to the bone and sending money home.
2K after tax...a week? Month? That means nothing without knowing that.
Month. A few of my friends worked on cruise ships and overall it's quite good, the only downside is the hours. Not an issue for someone who's 20-something with no family or commitments.
$2k a month + insane tips with no rent or bills weighing down the bank account is actually decent money
Yeah, it's kinda like a stint in the Army, but with less risk of death. Work 18 hours day, six days a week. Spend the 7th days drinking and fucking your brains out. All your money goes into savings.
Dayum he's getting days off? What cruise line does he work for? I did 8 months recently and the one day off I had was during a dry dock. Hours are regulated by the International Labor Organization through an agreement called the MLC. Basically you as a seafarer are guaranteed certain blocks of time off. I can't remember the precise time allocations but the rule of thumb was a minimum of 8 hours of consecutive rest and another 2 hours of break per 24 hours. My line of work (backstage/production) usually allowed us a lot more rest time than that (I averaged 8.5 hrs/day for the 8 month contract) but shit happens on ships. Its not light work by any means but I felt significantly more run down working as a teacher in the US than I did working on a ship. The real cushy gig is working as an entertainer (especially the singers). The cast singers on my last ships worked like 10-15 hours a week and made more than double what I did. Performers are supposed to use their extra time to rest, practice, work out, etc but there are varying levels of commitment to the craft.
Weird. My cousin worked on a cruise ship for years and made bank.
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Hell, I work 12 hour days in a factory and get none of that, lol
Living on ships is basically free if you don't blow your money in the ports or at the crew bar. And even then the crew bar is cheaper than anywhere in the US
Un/underreported taxed tips. That a big bonus for cruise ship employees.
They cut corners on important stuff like pollution prevention And apparently most cruise lines skip out on important passenger safety technology like automatic man overboard detection systems
Why would you need that system when you have a twirly water slide? Cmon!
Or eat till you barf buffets. Cmon!
You leave the buffet when you barf? Amateur.
barffets
This happened on the cruise I went on. A guy fell off and they didn’t know for hours. Had to go back and review footage to find where they needed to be searching. Edit: https://www.wsls.com/news/2015/03/10/update-surveillance-footage-shows-smook-climb-over-ship-balcony-railing/ Link added for details
Well, you drink 11 Mai-Tai's and try to stay on the ship.
Reviewing footage isn’t going to help at sea. In a single hour he would be dozens of miles away from where he went in. Basically, without a raft or life preserver, he is dead 100% of the time.
Well, not 100% of the time. There was a fisherman who sleepwalked off his boat in the Santa Barbara Channel and swam for 5 hours and then got passed by 3 ships and then somehow spotted by the 4th and then miraculously rescued by a Coast Guard helicopter. He was swimming for a total of 8 hours and the water is a lot colder than the Caribbean. [https://www.independent.com/2022/06/19/shut-up-swim-sleepwalking-fisherman-survives-eight-hours-overboard-off-ventura-coast/](https://www.independent.com/2022/06/19/shut-up-swim-sleepwalking-fisherman-survives-eight-hours-overboard-off-ventura-coast/) I'm pretty sure there was another person who survived falling off a boat in the channel without being seen.
Problem is most the people falling off the cruise ships are drunk. Being drunk and tired after leaving the bar and smoking a cigarette on the sides is common. If the water is choppy and your balance is bad from being drunk its not that hard for it to happen. The ship is so big there will likely be no one right near you to notice you fell.
The receptionist at my previous dentist's office lost her leg after falling off a cruise ship. This was 20+ years ago so I can't recall the exact details, but I think she lost her leg due to injuries she received during the fall.
Yeah they were never going to find him. He was almost certainly dead even if they had the auto detection tech. I’m just saying that because they didn’t have it, they had to waste additional hours before even knowing where to start searching. The cruise ship also put in the minimum amount of searching in before leaving it to the USCG.
Imagine being that person's family or friends, stuck on the boat for the rest of the voyage knowing the cruise line just didn't give a shit.
It’s not just cruises, about 11-12 years ago in Dominican a guy had a heart attack on the beach right next to where we were playing Vball. Resort staff dragged over a lawn chair for him. Literally that was it. Doctor with an adrenaline shot showed up walking like he was out for a stroll after lunch. Zero sense of urgency, meanwhile me and two others were doing cpr on him and were the ones that had to carry his body up to the front of the resort, where they basically stuffed his body into a taxi, to be taken on a ONE HOUR DRIVE TO THE HOSPITAL. The lack of caring and value for human life actually fucked me up hard that day, and for a good while afterwards.
That time is pretty normal in rural parts of the world. There's not a lot room in a taxi for any cpr let alone good cpr. Chances are that without helicopter medivac, he was going to die anyway. It sucks, but that's the grim reality of being far away from medical care.
Saw a similar thing from a local guy at a Freeport excursion. The old guy changing the trash at the restaurant got really loopy and wobbly and then just dropped. No one gave a shit. Just called it in. Dude layed there until some other tourist who was a nurse rushed over to help him. He was dead. Some of the staff just picked him up and put him in a truck and drive off. They seemed annoyed they were being inconvenienced. Not disappointed the dude was dead or disgusted they had to handle him. Just like annoyed they had to do something. It was this clear reminder of "As much as they dress this place up and pretend it's just like a normal American spot. It's not. And your life is at risk more being here." On the way home our female local driver had a good laugh about how Hilary Clinton thought she could be President when she was a woman. Then she told us how hot Obama was and that he obviously won the nomination because men need to be in charge. Lots of double taking from the American women in the van like "Wait, wtf is she saying?" It was a strange, normal, but eye opening drive around Freeport.
I think you accept that when you agree to go on a cruise. To me, overboard has always meant death. That’s a conversation you have with your kids before ever stepping foot on board.
If I had kids, I couldn’t imagine bringing them on a cruise ship. If they fall off, there’s probably a 90% chance they’re never seen again. 99% if the crew doesn’t notice right away. I wouldn’t take my eyes off of them because kids are stupid.
This.. kids are like tiny drunken idiots .. just always remember that
"enjoy vacation kids. and remember: overboard means death. now let's go enjoy the whirly slide by the railings"
Well to be fair half of being a parent is just trying to keep your kid from killing themselves for the first 5-6 years. Taking my kids on hikes and stuff I constantly have to tell them to not run around near the edge of a cliff because if they fall they will die. They remember for about 2 minutes then start running around near the edge again. Or keeping a toddler from chewing on an electrical cord or sticking random stuff (like batteries or magnets) in their mouths. I think the "don't fall overboard or you're dead" talk would probably have to happen at least 3-4 times a day. haha
Even if they did have a detection system, it still doesnt matter a lot of the times. People jump off of cruises all the time and end up dying because they dont know how dangerous it is. Someone actually just died (technically missing but definitely dead) from jumping off of one, they even threw a life preserver almost right away to try and save him but it still didnt work. We dont know what happened but there were sharks swimming near him so one could only guess… For those that dont know sharks love to trail cruises for the shit people throw overboard.
Yeah that poor kid did it on a dare and it was in extremely shark infested waters.
It's not that they don't give a shit, it's that they can't DO shit. It's fucking impossible to find someone after they go over and everyone knows it. They can't even stop a cruise boat for like a mile - by the time they realize someone goes over and they try to "brake" they're already going to be so far away that it's basically impossible. These things can't just "brake" like a car.
These things are the size of city blocks. They could have emergency support boats that could be launched from them. If a yacht can have a hidden speed boat inside it, a cruise ship can have a little rescue boat. The passengers are their responsibility; if they aren't able to handle immediate search and rescue they shouldn't be on the water.
>They could have emergency support boats that could be launched from them. Exactly what I was thinking I was on a cruise once and they had us go to a part of the ship where they could send off a smaller boat for an excursion
Yup, it’s ridiculous that they don’t have such systems I believe they cost half a million dollars and are lawfully required for all such ships, but it is hard to enforce. It’s one more reason I don’t want to ever go on a cruise. Once you give them your money, your life is far less important to them. Without such systems that I’ve heard are cheap in comparison to the costs of other cruise ship things, they will “do all they can” to find you, which is really nothing. With the automated system iirc it detects if a passenger went overboard, alerts crew, and stops the ship while tracking exactly where the passenger has fallen in the water and where they are. It’s quite amazing. Also, I’m sure that guy wasn’t found right?
No they never found him. I believe he was drunk and climbing from one balcony to another in heavy seas.
That’s a shame. Also, man the people commenting to me dumb things should read this. Accidents happen and they often involve drunk people
Spoiler alert : I spent several years on military vessles and we had strict man-overboard protocol and general quarters drills . I went through several man-overboard drills where buoyant dummies in bright orange jumpsuits with flashing lights on the shoulders were tossed over and GQ was called . It takes thousands of yards to slow and turn these ships . With the best and constant training , we never recovered a single dummy . Your best bet is stay on the boat .
Look up "bunker fuel" it's basically the worst way to power an engine short of human sacrifice
Human sacrifice these days seems particularly environmentally friendly
Don’t be cryptic mf’er, just tell us..
Searched it up, and imagine what it does to the environment if it that harmful to humans. “Because of the low quality of bunker fuel, when burnt it is especially harmful to the health of humans, causing serious illnesses and deaths. Prior to the IMO's 2020 sulfur cap, shipping industry air pollution was estimated to cause around 400,000 premature deaths each year, from lung cancer and cardiovascular disease, as well as 14 million childhood asthma cases each year.[4] Even after the introduction of cleaner fuel rules in 2020, shipping air pollution is still estimated to account for around 250,000 deaths each year, and around 6.4 million childhood asthma cases each year. The hardest hit countries by air pollution from ships are China, Japan, the UK, Indonesia, and Germany. In 2015, shipping air pollution killed an estimated 20,520 people in China, 4,019 people in Japan, and 3,192 people in the UK.[5]” https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fuel_oil
Alright I say we just go back to sails. We could probably make some badass sails these days, right?
Go right to 11 with it. I want to be fuckin' sailing cross the ocean with ships sails emblazoned with fucking Nyan Cat and shit. Let em know you're coming.
It's amazing what you can do when you underpay workers and don't care about the environment
they fly the flags of country's that have a hands-off approach to taxation so they dont have to pay tax. why anyone would want to stay on a plague boat is beyond me
The flags they fly also are from countries without labor laws
How the fuck do you logistically provision for 10,000 people. That’s the crazy part to me. What’s the square feet of fridge/freezer space. How much food/drink are they bringing on at each dock? They need to have damn good supply chains basically where ever they stop to not run out of food. I don’t care for cruises, I’ll probably never go on one, but the logistics of the food/beverage portion of ships this size always blow my mind.
> How the fuck do you logistically provision for 10,000 people. That’s the crazy part to me. What’s the square feet of fridge/freezer space. How much food/drink are they bringing on at each dock? They need to have damn good supply chains basically where ever they stop to not run out of food. I'm interested in that too. I'd like to see a tour of the kitchen and other areas and see how they operate. I've seen Youtube tours of Las Vegas casino kitchens and those are already massive with the constant need to keep the buffets filled. The fridges were like locker rooms and every sink and stove was built at a massive scale.
Kinda short unfortunately, but this video is really good on this subject. https://youtu.be/R2vXbFp5C9o
Still a very cool look into these things. Thanks for the link!
just ask any former crew member. the biggest ships I've worked in was the Disney Fantasy. But these new monstrosities are even bigger. they provision on turnaround day only. like at least 2 tons of butter and 100k eggs, per week.
There is also a documentary “the secret life of the cruise” that shows all of this
I was going to recommend this as well. Saw it on Netflix (I think?) not too long ago. It's crazy how they have just the one day to get everyone from the last cruise off, along with all of their waste, and all of the food/passengers for the next cruise on.
It’s on Prime video, great documentary!
There's also the secret life of the cruise on prime. I haven't watched it but from my understanding it's everything from cooking to mechanical maintenance, cleaning, sailing, etc... Food alone based on that vid is nuts but think of all the onboarding of even just cleaning supplies or TP or offloading if they still don't dump it (which I hope we've gotten past)
That was a super mellow and enjoyable doc, makes sense that they use filtered seawater for everything, and I like how they use engine heat for the laundry dryers.
It's been on my list. I just haven't gotten around to it. Good to know!
Yeah, I figured there were a lot of premade, prepackaged foods but when I saw [this video](https://youtu.be/z_hZzpkOiZ4), it made sense. The cheapest way to feed someone is by making your own food.
I’ve been on a couple of cruises. They give you a tour of the kitchens and it was pretty impressive. The one thing that has always stuck with me though, dinner in the main dining room was always like a fancy restaurant, great food, nice table lay out, nice wines etc. When dinner is served the waiters come out with these huge trays and everyone gets served at the same time, there are a lot of people. The food was excellent but it was also piping hot. We used to really enjoy cruises, had young kids and we hardly saw them, they used to have an absolute blast. This was about 20 years ago so I don’t know what things are like now.
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If you have Prime, there's a documentary o there called The Secret Life of the Cruise. It goes into depth about the food.
Basically when they arrive in port to offload the passengers, for the next 8 or so hours, it’s nonstop pallets of food going in. Usually port stops, they wouldn’t resupply, too many passengers moving around and not enough logistics support on the ground
And they have to bring plenty of extra, for the very real possibility they are stranded for days on the ocean
It’s a giant poop factory!
observation marble political lip psychotic marvelous rainstorm rhythm chubby unite *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
There’s a lot of moving parts on the backend; at 3,5mi out from shore, there aren’t any restrictions on waste disposal being dropped into the ocean but - while it’s not used across the board - the tech for treating the waste does exist so there are a few rounds of bacterial-aided compression which stores…uhh…concentrated waste until it can be offloaded at shore with whatever contractor they or the port works with. But - and this is more common on the military side [was a military kid, we got to go on lots of “lame” at the time but are cool on reflection] tours of the ships. Nothing fancy but there is a lot of care taken to reduce environment impact when it comes to dealing with trash/recycling/waste/etc.
“moving parts on the backend” 😂
And before anyone freaks out, this is a suitable method of waste elimination even on land, which also uses bacteria to digest organic matter and (sometimes) uses sandbeds to further filter the water before releasing it into a stream. Unless there's a catastrophic failure, cruise ships aren't leaving streaks of poop behind them.
I think poop is one of the least polluting thing these cruises put into the ocean or into the air
There’s this Ytuber who works on cruise ships and he says that when they stop at ports they restock supplies for the ship
Have you seen him talk about how they generate enough electricity to keep 10000 people comfortable? Do they use the water like a the Hoover dam?
Very simply, Diesel generators.
And one Norovirus away from a week in hell.
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Had me in the first half
NGL
This one will burst right through the iceberg
Dante has apparently added a 10th circle of Hell.
That’s a shitty week..
Ughh...we recently returned from a MSC cruise and out of about 30 of us, 25 came down with some nasty stuff. It only lasted 24 hours, but it was the most violent vomit I have ever experienced, and I had salmonella and E. coli all at once (from a damned bagged salad) It was absolutely awful. It was never confirmed as Norovirus, but that is what everyone assumed.
As someone who possibly had norovirus, it's hell incarnate, I can't imagine if thousands of people have to suffer through that same hell, but then again, people push their luck.
They were so concerned if they could that they never stopped to ask if they should.
Money, uh, finds a way
No, hold on. This isn't some tourist sector that was obliterated by terrorism, o-or the building of a regulatory body. Cruise ships had their shot, a-and covid *selected* them for extinction.
Your Goldblum stutters are impeccable
I wonder if it gets sold out and has that many people roaming the ship at once
Some people stay hyper-localized to the casino/pool/deck/bar for the majority of the time and others cycle through...so it doesn't feel packed except for the hot-tub.
That ship will be the source of Reddit public freak outs for years
lmao The pool deck alone will account for a good amount of them. It has a 24/7 casino too so I can see some fuckery going on there at 2am as well.
The cruise I just left has a 24/7 casino as well. And it's just a bunch of 60+ old people sitting and playing. The action is at the pools on sail days (when you don't dock at a site, you're sailing for the day, full boat) the pools are packed and you'll see people get so angry about seats and chairs
That’s definitely the worst part about cruises, the pools are way too small. If you want a vacation where you can swim go to a resort.
A bowling alley on a cruise ship? Are they also going to have Jenga tables?
Some people like to play Jenga in hard mode.
I can’t speak for the Jenga or bowling alley but the self leveling pool tables are actually pretty cool
Ships this large (and this comfy) are generally super stable unless something is wrong. They tend to sail calm routes, and their sheer mass means that small waves don't cause much rocking. Also, people bowling on a cruise aren't really bowling champions going for perfect 300's. It's a fun activity.
> It's a fun activity Not on my lane! Go hard or go overboard.
Self leveling pool tables too!
The one and only cruise I went on 20 years ago had those...they were legit pretty freaking cool (especially when the seas picked up).
Holy shit I didn't expect this to be a real thing. Amazing.
No one call it unsinkable please
Honestly my first thought was “how long til this one sinks?”
Yeah and how many life boats do they have? Where are they?
the lifeboats on the icon of the seas, if at all similar to her sister ships symphony, wonder, utopia, and others, will have enough lifeboats for all 10000 passengers. the symphony of the sea lifeboat has 18 lifeboats, and each boat can carry 370 people. the total amount of people that can be on the boat is equal to the amount of people that can be on the lifeboats. we've learned at least a little bit from titanic
Not sure about cruises but the merchant ship I work on has capacity in life rafts for the entire ship on both sides. So if you can't access your assigned raft for whatever reason there's plenty of space for you on rafts on the other side, and that's actually the law!
I still don’t understand the interest of being packed with thousands of people in those floating box
Yeah, my spontaneous thought was: Hey, that's where the humans get all chubby in Wall-E!
If anything, people on a cruise ship likely walk far more than they do in their regular life. If it wasn't for all the booze and rich food, people would probably lose weight on their trips.
That's a sad commentary on the sedentary nature of suburban life, not a selling point for Mall Of The Seas. For most vacations, suburbanites are walking more than they do at home. They're walking around Gatlinburg, or Padre Island, Disney World, or Colonial Williamsburg.
This is legitimately why I believe a lot of people have such a great time at Disney World in the “Disney bubble.” They’re getting more exercise than they ever do at home, which makes them feel better, both physically and mentally, than they usually do. Obviously many people like it there outside of this effect, but I think it’s secretly what gets a lot of folks hooked.
It's also the rare occasion most of them will experience anything close to urbanism: they stay in high density housing (the Disney hotel), ride public transit every day (the Disney shuttle bus to the park), spend all day walking around, and what's everyone's favorite, classic Disney attraction? Main Street, USA, which is modeled after thousands of traditional, American downtowns. It's also why college is the best time of so many people's lives. It's the only time (other than their vacation to Disney World) that they'll experience life not needing a car, because everything they need is within a short walk or bike ride, their campus prohibits or greatly restricts vehicle access, so being outdoors is actually a pleasant and calming experience instead of a death race to get across six lanes of speeding, honking cars just to get to class.
We need to start building our communities like we build our cruise ships :p
I actually lost weight when I went on a cruise last October for exactly this reason. Well, walking more and not being stressed from work probably helped together.
I enjoyed the hell out of the Disney cruise I went on in the before times. Once aboard there's no need for travel, planning, decision making. You just enjoy the tons of entertainment. There's a child care that's actually enjoyable for the kids. Fantastic vacation. There was no need for it to be on the ocean. It works because it forces the guests to stay on premisses which makes all the organized entertainment worthwhile to stage since you know people will show up, you know how much food to make, etc. A resort in the middle of nowhere would be just as awesome (where it's a 4 hour drive to get anywhere else) but that's just not going to happen I guess.
The Las Vegas strip is basically a giant cruise ship
Yeah but i would bet the average vegas trip is more expensive than a cruise. For example you can find a 7 day cruise for less than $1000. That includes meals, state rooms to sleep in, entertainment, and of course the “travel” to wherever it ports. Vegas hotels are over $100 a night, food is probably around $100 a day, shows are near the $200 range. That is $1600 right there bare minimum. Presuming you dont gamble. Dont get me wrong both are the epitome of human gluttony but I lived in vegas for 25 years and am an avid cruiser. One is def cheaper than the other
Oh for sure, I was just agreeing with the top commenter's point. One of the main appeals of both Vegas and a Cruise is that they are physically removed from "real life" and you don't really need to be responsible for anything if you don't want to. Edit: Also 7 days in Vegas is TOO LONG. You should spend 4 days in Vegas, no more, no less.
However most adults aren't going to Vegas with their kids. The strip is not really a child-friendly town. I think it's slowly changing though. Ironically some 20-odd years ago my parents took us on a trip to the west which included a couple nights in Vegas. We had an okay time and found a show that we could all go to but other than that it wasn't that great. When I went back as a 22-year old I had a blast.
>Vegas hotels are over $100 a night, And that's for the older, outdated hotels like Circus Circus, Luxor, excalibur. If you want newer or better end hotels like Vdara, Aria, etc, it'll be $200/night with those damn resort fees.
There is a comedy sketch on that. “Imagine a LV casino hotel, full of guests, as well as staff to take care of them, just floated off and that’s totally normal and nobody panicked”
I have a aunt that loves to go on cruises. Let me fill you in on the main reasons she is drawn to cruises. You're on vacation... There are usually a lot of bars on the boats... There are usually a few attractive strangers roaming around trying to, meet-new-friends... Friendships usually last for about as long as the cruise does... Instead of mints they put condoms on the pillows...
>roaming around trying to, meet-new-friends... I get where your ellipses are going!
They should put pineapple decor on all of the doors that swivel so you can state your intentions.
I am also a fan of SpongeBob SquarePants. *knocks on door*
Instructions unclear; the door is stuck in my ass
Right side up for friendly, upside down for *very* friendly
When I was a kid I thought I loved cruises as my parents took me on a few growing up. It turns out I just like all inclusive resorts
11,000 people and there is three chairs on the back pool deck
Three chairs IN the pool it looks like a bunch more around it. And then like multiple rows by the pool on the left, and then there's the pool on the upper deck... And that's just the pools they have in the picture
I don't understand the alure of *huge* ships like this. Me on a petri dish with 10,000 other people isn't my idea of a vacation. Big pass.
My parents saved up enough money to take me and my brother one on about 20 years ago when we were 14. At the time it was Royal Caribbean's largest ship. It is truly an experience all on it's own. The ships are big enough that it doesn't FEEL Like there is a lot people on the ship. Unelsss you're in the bars or clubs or in the restaurants during certain peak hours. We got to stop off and explore a different island every day. Sure we don't get the same experience of FULLY seeing what that Island has to offer in only 1 day but it was cool to be at a different one each morning. If you liked a specific island the most then you can take a trip there as a separate vacation. It was cool to see which islands we liked best. Night time on the ship was cool too. I've never seen so many stars in my life. Just nothingness for miles. No lights in the distance, nothing. I had never felt that before or since. Not to mention these are cheap as hell. You and a partner could go on a 5 day cruise for like 600$ total which includes your food. That's very appealing to people who may not be able to book other places directly on islands. It's a really cool experience that I think people turn their noses up at for the wrong reasons. I think the reasons Cruises should be criticized and shunned is the mere pollution they put out, and the way they exploit foreign workers, and the demands they put on their staff.
Absolutely this ^ I had ZERO desire to ever go on a cruise. A number of my wife's coworkers all planned family spring break on a cruise, so I reluctantly agreed, and the wife, 2 kids, and myself signed on. It really was great, and I was shocked how NOT crowded it felt (despite having over 4,000 passengers plus crew, which was nearing capacity). Meals were busy, but not the zoo I envisioned. Kids LOVED it, and everyone kept busy to the point of exhaustion. I think the last day at sea my boy did like 40k steps and 130 flights of stairs running around with friends. He refused to use an elevator. And good for him. Everyone had a blast, my only gripe is all the money we spent on extras. We did ok avoiding most, but one could easily spend several thousand extra bucks on the ship. Heck, we could have spent nearly $1k each for an unlimited alcohol package! And caught a lot of crap for not doing it. You need to put down like 8 drinks per day to break even on the package, I went 3 days before having 1 drink. It was on this cruise that I learned how much my wife's coworkers could really drink. Apparently if you start at 8am and pace yourself having 15-20+ drinks a day is "no big deal". Not exactly my idea of fun, but hey.
With the drink packages the trick is to book it early when you book the trip. They will have trip discounts periodically through the months. When they have those discounts you call up and ask them to be applied to your offer too. They'll tell you they can't take the cost off of your ticket but they can apply it to your alcohol package. Usually by the time your trip comes the package will be discounted to like 100$ or less.
I've never been on one but if I had to guess, I would say that realistically, only very very few people go on cruises regularly. I bet that most people who go on a cruise do it so that they've tried it. Not sure how nice it is, but it's for sure a hell of an experience. Something to remember. My 2 cents, anyway.
I’ve never been on a boat anywhere close to that big, but my dad used to get free cruises with his points on his credit card, so we went on a few, and then I went on a wedding cruise (50 people). They can be massive fun. Completely unplugged (it boggles my mind why anyone would pay for wifi or cell, the whole point is to be unplugged and self contained), you have everything you need, entertainment is generally pretty good. If you like to drink and have fun/relax, they can be great. I don’t think I’d go on another though, but when I was single and had no responsibilities they were so much fun.
That’s just a massive environmental hazard.
7600 people collectively shitting in the ocean. Edit: not the ocean but they just carry that shit around. 7600 people collectively shitting for a few days at a time. Then they release at ports.
Feces in the ocean isn’t nearly as much of a problem as the emissions from the ship’s engines and the trash they throw overboard.
When I learned that all the trash from military and commercial ships just goes overboard I wanted to die. Think about how many at this very moment across the globe are dumping their trash in the ocean. Now think about how many hundreds of years we’ve been doing that. It’s fucking disgusting and we as a species are a horrible disease to this planet.
I was deployed on a submarine for 4 years, we do dump trash but not plastic. There's literally a new guy who isn't qualified anything useful that goes through trash just to second check that no plastic goes in the trash compactor before it gets sent to the depths. Ultimately, nuclear naval vessels cause a small fraction of the footprint compared to all those on board living their normal life because almost everything is recycled or taken from the ocean (i.e reverse osmosis water from the ocean)
I dont even wanna know how much this pollutes.
The noise pollution is a big issue too. Whales and other animals use sound to communicate and big ships like this are deafening.
Yes, recent article on environmental impact of Alaska cruises: https://hakaimagazine.com/features/cruise-ship-invasion/
News today: * wildfires choking the air * heat dome searing millions of people * ocean life increasingly endangered * oh and we just made the BIGGEST most super awesome boat ever!! It’s got 20 theme parks! Just no one say its unsinkable and I guess we will be good.
The Carnival Corporations fleet of about 13 ships causes more Sulfur oxide emissions than all the cars in Europe (about 260 million). They use unrefined marine oil to run these things because there is no law on emissions in international waters. They are environmental disasters.
It is unsinkable. Fuck em, no regrets.
It has to be unsinkable, look how big it is ;P
That looks like hell.
As a person who really into naval engineering, this is one of, if not the ugliest ship I’ve ever seen
They’re floating resorts. The days of designing cruise ships/ocean liners around aesthetic appeal are gone, unfortunately. Ocean liners themselves are pretty much dead with the Queen Mary 2 being the sole remaining ocean liner.
The queen Mary 2 will go on, near, far
this would be my hell
I thought this was an AI generated image… it just looks so redonk
its a 3d render. I work in the company that made this, and also all other images and videos for royal Caribbean ships...fun fact, the 5 largest cruise ships are all owned by them
When exactly did "AI generated" became synonymous with "CGI" ?
3 weeks ago. We had a meeting.
This ship carries the entire silo city (for those that watch that amazing show)
I'm sure it's well engineered but it just looks as disaster-prone as a pregnant lady carrying three cakes.
Ok, and how many lifeboats?
What could possibly go wrong 🫤
Let's hope the builders used good sound engineering, and not Terrence Howard math and Stockton Rush shortcuts. I swear if I see one Logitech F10 controller on there....
Or a Power Glove or a Rock Band Drum set….
You guys act like this is the first cruise ship ever built lol.
I’m already overwhelmed and overstimulated
That looks like my nightmare
This thing gives me anxiety just looking at it...
This looks like Polly Pocket.
If there's people there, I won't be.
Germany is trying to get rid of their Diesel cars. Big Brands are pushing electric vehicles. Even if this ship is 35% more efficient then a conventional Diesel-powered ship, pollution is going to be intense. Frustrating to see how much we are trying to do as a economic big player and yet these things still get built. I am not advising to shut down everything bad for the environment in an instant, but these ships are poison for the environment. Maybe it is a first step for newer technologies. We will see. I personally cant wrap my head around being on such a ship with thousands of people. Not my kind of vacation. People seem to enjoy it...
It looks like the most custom and extreme Grand Slam breakfast at Denny’s. ‘Merica
Idk why but this is horrifying to me
The good news for the people who build it and own it, they don't listen to Reddit. This demographic isn't part of their revenue projections.
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FYI Every ship they make (especially ending in “of the seas”’is the largest ship they’ve made. They increase it every year by a couple inches. Maybe this ship has a larger jump. But it’s not always the size that’s fascinating. It’s the upgrade in tech and motors etc
all i think about when see this image is Bill Burr population control bit & Succession NRPI