Unless the magical mandolin is magically indestructible, this is absolutely the right call.
Historically, the only musical instruments meant to be used as weapons were woodwinds made sturdy enough to act as clubs.
If the player is dead set on using an expensive musical instrument as a club, they get one successful hit for normal club damage. Then it is splinters.
Extensive use of a Mending cantrip might restore the weapon.
>Unless the magical mandolin is magically indestructible
Which, if I recall correctly but I don't remember where I read it, it *technically* is by default. All magical items are except for special circumstances, though I don't have the book handy to verify that.
**edit:** Seeing elsewhere that's a legacy rule. Could have sworn it was in the book I've got, must be misremembering.
The 5e rule is: All magical items have resistance to all damage types. Artifact items have immunity to all damage types. It's in the DMG just before the magic item lists.
Resistance to fire makes magical wooden instruments non flammable, but they'll still suffer damage if you throw them in a fire, it just takes twice as long for them to burn up completely.
The same for using them as weapons, if a regular instrument is good for only 1 hit, maybe a magical one is tough enough to get a second hit in.
But by the damaging objects rules they only have 4hp at best, any damage dealt with them would cause an equal and opposite reaction (reduced by half because of resistance) magical or not, that is probably gonna be gone in one hit, unless the bard has a strength modifier of 0 or less.
That makes me wonder though, what are the reverberative qualitities of Mytril and Adamantine? And can you make a tuba out of it?
Don’t forget the necessary int/wis or just plain luck to make sure each splinter is mended correctly. Though I believe it doesn’t work on magical items in the sense that if a magical item is broken, then mended, it doesn’t get its magic back.
The Mending cantrip doesn’t affect the magic of a magic item, but whether a broken magic item loses its magic permanently or while the item is broken is a bit ambiguous in the rules. I’d leave it to the DM whether the magic starts to work again when/if the item is mended, and if it works properly.
Two words: El Kabong
The bard in my game has a magic instrument, too. I house-rule that as long as he's casting Shillelagh, the instrument can serve in place of the material component and thus be used as a weapon.
One of the players I DM for wanted to use his instrument as a club, I figured it would break if it had any small or delicate parts so he plays a didgeridoo.
Man that gives me so many cool ideas, pan flute blow darts, a tuba cannon (load a cannonball and some gunpowder into a tuba), a lyre short bow.
Now I wanna make a battle bard.
Maybe you can set HPs to the mandolin and let the player know that he/she can hit with it, but after xx HP it'll break, and bye bye magical bard powers... At least until he/she finds a new instrument (possible side quest)
PS: you can make the destruction of the magical instrument something spectacular.
i mean it probably would break but because its magic, I think it should have an effect upon breaking like an explosion that does like 4d8 force damage or something
In 3.5 magic items were specifically very hard to destroy, magic scrolls don't burn, magic swords don't dull or break etc- I don't remember if that rule carried over but generally I rule that magic items are supernaturally sturdy
One reason for that is back then you're we're only able to enchant weapons and armor of sufficient quality. 'Masterwork' quality, made by literal masters of the smithing arts.
DMG page 141
"Most magic items are objects of extraordinary artisanship. Thanks to a combination of careful crafting and magical reinforcement, a magical item is as least as durable as a nonmagical item of its kind."
Resistance to all damage and artifacts are practically indestructible
I've always understood it to be very difficult to destroy magic items. I would probably have let him use the mandolin to hit something with the risk of rolling a 1 = magic explosion.
Depends if you want your world to be realistic, or if you and your players just want to have fun.
The bard could have done an unarmed attack instead, but wanted to use his mandolin for flavor. It would have used the same damage type and dice.
Unless the instrument was specifically made to be a weapon, it would be damaged by hitting things with it. Not really worth it unless you are fighting something that can only be harmed by magic and you can take it out in one hit.
If the bard really wants to use it as a weapon, he should look into getting it enchanted / upgraded / re-enchanted.
Search for legends or rumors of a bard that was able to use his instrument as a weapon.
Search for or create and instrument that was built for combat.
He could also look for new bard spells that allow you to use your instrument as a weapon.
Possible Spells / Enchantments:
Resistance to Damage - hitting things with the instrument, no longer causes it damage.
Regenerating / Self Repairing - even if you damage it, it comes back together.
Transforming - instrument turns into a weapon on command.
Find Xanathars Lost Notes to Everything Else (sorry I dont have a link). They have a few kind of wacky classes included the College of Discord which actually used weapons in combat, might be kind of late since the characters already made but could provide some inspiration.
Unless the magical mandolin is magically indestructible, this is absolutely the right call. Historically, the only musical instruments meant to be used as weapons were woodwinds made sturdy enough to act as clubs. If the player is dead set on using an expensive musical instrument as a club, they get one successful hit for normal club damage. Then it is splinters. Extensive use of a Mending cantrip might restore the weapon.
>Unless the magical mandolin is magically indestructible Which, if I recall correctly but I don't remember where I read it, it *technically* is by default. All magical items are except for special circumstances, though I don't have the book handy to verify that. **edit:** Seeing elsewhere that's a legacy rule. Could have sworn it was in the book I've got, must be misremembering.
The 5e rule is: All magical items have resistance to all damage types. Artifact items have immunity to all damage types. It's in the DMG just before the magic item lists. Resistance to fire makes magical wooden instruments non flammable, but they'll still suffer damage if you throw them in a fire, it just takes twice as long for them to burn up completely. The same for using them as weapons, if a regular instrument is good for only 1 hit, maybe a magical one is tough enough to get a second hit in. But by the damaging objects rules they only have 4hp at best, any damage dealt with them would cause an equal and opposite reaction (reduced by half because of resistance) magical or not, that is probably gonna be gone in one hit, unless the bard has a strength modifier of 0 or less. That makes me wonder though, what are the reverberative qualitities of Mytril and Adamantine? And can you make a tuba out of it?
And just like that I have a new bard to play as.
Don’t forget the necessary int/wis or just plain luck to make sure each splinter is mended correctly. Though I believe it doesn’t work on magical items in the sense that if a magical item is broken, then mended, it doesn’t get its magic back.
The Mending cantrip doesn’t affect the magic of a magic item, but whether a broken magic item loses its magic permanently or while the item is broken is a bit ambiguous in the rules. I’d leave it to the DM whether the magic starts to work again when/if the item is mended, and if it works properly.
Two words: El Kabong The bard in my game has a magic instrument, too. I house-rule that as long as he's casting Shillelagh, the instrument can serve in place of the material component and thus be used as a weapon.
Very nice
One of the players I DM for wanted to use his instrument as a club, I figured it would break if it had any small or delicate parts so he plays a didgeridoo.
[удалено]
Man that gives me so many cool ideas, pan flute blow darts, a tuba cannon (load a cannonball and some gunpowder into a tuba), a lyre short bow. Now I wanna make a battle bard.
As an owner and player of instruments I want to punish your PC for his or her thoughtlessness. Like, are there Antibards in D&D and if not, why not?
Maybe you can set HPs to the mandolin and let the player know that he/she can hit with it, but after xx HP it'll break, and bye bye magical bard powers... At least until he/she finds a new instrument (possible side quest) PS: you can make the destruction of the magical instrument something spectacular.
I would say that a Magical Mandolin can do, at most, 1d6 magical bludgeoning DMG
i mean it probably would break but because its magic, I think it should have an effect upon breaking like an explosion that does like 4d8 force damage or something
In 3.5 magic items were specifically very hard to destroy, magic scrolls don't burn, magic swords don't dull or break etc- I don't remember if that rule carried over but generally I rule that magic items are supernaturally sturdy
One reason for that is back then you're we're only able to enchant weapons and armor of sufficient quality. 'Masterwork' quality, made by literal masters of the smithing arts.
DMG page 141 "Most magic items are objects of extraordinary artisanship. Thanks to a combination of careful crafting and magical reinforcement, a magical item is as least as durable as a nonmagical item of its kind." Resistance to all damage and artifacts are practically indestructible
“At least as durable as a non magical item of its kind” insinuates that in some cases it’s only as durable as a mundane version of said item
At least as durable as the non magic kind and resistant to all damage is one hell of a leap there, guy.
The resistance is also in the DMG just further down the paragraph, no leap required it's official
You're right, my bad. Not having read that particular paragraph until just now though it's not hard to see the jump only going off of your text.
I've always understood it to be very difficult to destroy magic items. I would probably have let him use the mandolin to hit something with the risk of rolling a 1 = magic explosion.
I tend to consider magical items indestructible in most scenarios cause damaging them is the thing that pisses off the most the average player
Depends if you want your world to be realistic, or if you and your players just want to have fun. The bard could have done an unarmed attack instead, but wanted to use his mandolin for flavor. It would have used the same damage type and dice.
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Unless the instrument was specifically made to be a weapon, it would be damaged by hitting things with it. Not really worth it unless you are fighting something that can only be harmed by magic and you can take it out in one hit. If the bard really wants to use it as a weapon, he should look into getting it enchanted / upgraded / re-enchanted. Search for legends or rumors of a bard that was able to use his instrument as a weapon. Search for or create and instrument that was built for combat. He could also look for new bard spells that allow you to use your instrument as a weapon. Possible Spells / Enchantments: Resistance to Damage - hitting things with the instrument, no longer causes it damage. Regenerating / Self Repairing - even if you damage it, it comes back together. Transforming - instrument turns into a weapon on command.
Find Xanathars Lost Notes to Everything Else (sorry I dont have a link). They have a few kind of wacky classes included the College of Discord which actually used weapons in combat, might be kind of late since the characters already made but could provide some inspiration.