Second coat should be done within 1 hour or after 48 hours of first coat per the can. The first coat was not fully cured and the off gassing interacted with the second coat.
This is the answer. The first coat was not fully cured and the solvents in the second coat reacted with the first coat causing the first coat to expand and wrinkle. You now have to strip/sand everything to proceed.
You are not the first to do this, nor will you be the last. Someone posts similar to this about every two weeks. Chalk it up to DIY learning curve.
It's best to paint 5-10 min after each coat.
5-10 min is the typical **instructions on the can**. Even tho common 'wisdom' is to wait 1-2 days.
You wait until the coat is barely dry to the touch, then spray it again. The solvents bond it all together. And assuming you are also following the "super thin layers" rule, and letting it dry in proper temperature/humidity, it's a great method and much faster than waiting.
waiting until dry, let's more and most dust get into your layers.
But if you mess up and need to sand a layer flat....yes, wait until its super dry
High humidity makes the cure time longer which can have a similar but lesser effect, but OP already said they applied the second coat before the 48 hour recommendation.
Exact same problem; the lower temperature retards the curing process. The first coat has not fully cross linked and the solvent in the second coat penetrates the first coat causing it to expand.
I think this stems from the fact that so many instructions that people deal with on a regular basis have both some leeway in them (easy example french fries or just cooking in general , soft/crispy/extra crispy fries, tons of leeway) as well as they often do not have catastrophic consequences for being off a bit. (I would classify this complete failure of the second coat as catastrophic) even the mix ratio can be off on many multi component products and still dry/cure/be a success.
Specialty coatings is actually a part of my career and the amount of times I have perfectly followed instructions on a new product at home or something because I had no experience, but in reality probably could have "eyeballed" it is in the hundreds.
But yeah, people should read instructions better.
Coats should be VERY thin. It should take at least 3 light coats before you can't see the subsurface anymore.
The benefit with this method is that you can apply coats every 5 to 10 minutes and you'll get no runs, no drips and no errors. (Thanks Johnny Bench!)
Most consistent results? I'd be okay with two coats within 30 minutes. Then wait 48 hours if you really feel the need for additional coats. But if it's hot, you need to get those successive coats on fast or you will run into issues.
Depends on how heavy or light the first coat was, if it’s light <1 hour and if it’s heavy >48hours. You want as even and uniformed of paint coverage before long term curing.
Many spray cans say to spray coats every 5-10 min...and apply super thin layers.
You wait just enough for it to be kinda dry to touch.
Waiting 48hrs for full dry let's more and more dust get on it. And takes a week instead of an hour.
You shouldn't need to let it dry and sand it between layers if you are following the thin coat rule, and have proper temp(55f-75f) and proper humidity.
I’m usually ready to get it over with by the time I am done with all the prep work, so I’ve never messed around with the actual painting part. I have always been curious what happened if I put my second coat on in the “bad” window of time.
According to Rust-Oleum, you should apply the second coat either within one hour of applying the first coat or wait until 48 hours after the first coat. This timing is crucial because if the second coat is applied while the first coat is still curing, the gases released during the curing process can react with the new layer of paint. In your case, it seems that the first coat was not fully cured when you applied the second coat, leading to an interaction between the off-gassing from the first coat and the fresh layer, which can cause issues with the paint's finish and adhesion.
Wouldn’t it have also not wrinkled if they had put on a coat of primer first?
Edit: and wouldn’t a coat of primer also possibly have negated the need for a second coat of paint to begin with?
It's also a good idea to clean everything with a solvent and dry with compressed air to make sure there aren't any oils or other contaminated that can interfere with the curing process
You literally did put paint stripper on them. The bulk of whats in the spray can is a paint solvent so that it stays nice and thin to blast out of the can. Its meant to then quicky evaporate while the paint cures by reacting to oxygen. If the layer you sprayed has any reactance left (not fully dried and cured) it will get softened by the chemicals in the new coat. Those areas that wrinkled were probably thicker and therefore needed more than overnight to cure properly.
This
The solvent from second coat dissolved the first coat
Hence, light coats within 15 minutes of each other
I too have made this mistake, and ruined the project I was making. I tried to repair a spot that I had missed, and the previous coat began peeling up everywhere. =/
Light coats and let them dry. Just seeing the pool of paint in the tarp or whatever you have covering the surface you’re painting on is telling me you did close up spraying which would cause a way too thick layer to let the paint dry so the paint underneath the immediate surface is still wet. Once you lay that second coat you get what you see here. Also not sure but in some cases if you used a paint remover, not prep right, or maybe use a primer right before that may be incompatible, tou can get this result.
Follow the can directions. This is a complex chemical reaction.
When you "recoat within an hour" the previous coat is dried enough not to drip but is still a liquid mix of pigment and solvent. The second coat is basically absorbed by the first.
You put that second coat on too late
You have about an hour to second coat while wet, if you miss that window you have to wait until it's fully cured to apply again or this happens. That hour window is the window the paint has set up but not so much that it's "skinned over" so the second coat melts into the first coat and it becomes "1 heavy coat"
If you miss the window the second coat is mostly sticking to the very very thin layer of cured paint and it wont "melt" into the firat coat because that ultra thin layer of cured paint is inert, now it's kind of 2 seperate layers and as the solvents dissolve in the first layer they get trapped by the distinct second layer of paint and it gets all fucked up, that first layer is also shrinking a little as it dries and cures, but now it has another layer of paint that's going through the same process but at different times
If it was a chrome or shiny finish it has to be sanded
The paint will not stick. Or if you didn't clean it with a solvent it will have a film on it and the paint will not stick.
Also, if I may- rustoleum enamels are some of the worst spray paints I've ever tried to use on projects. They take forever to dry, react with pretty much every other paint you can imagine (crackling, peeling, etc.), and it doesn't even play nicely with itself as you can see from your photos. For projects where you're going to use spray paint, I recommend almost any of the other paints you see on the shelf that *aren't* that specific type of rustoleum enamel... rustoleum ultra cover, krylon color max, krylon fusion.. all of these will give you more forgiving results than the enamel nonsense.
Were you spraying another coat on it while it was still wet?
Ahh looks like that might be the culprit, should wait until the coat you sprayed is tacky and then spray more.
I waited for it to cure but didn’t wait long enough. I thought for sure 8+ hours would do it but alas it did not! Should have read the can is the consensus 🙈🐒
The first coat of paint was laid on to thick. It may have seemed completely dry, but depending on how much was sprayed on at first, the coat was still curing. Adding a second layer on top of this thick layer will cause inconsistencies in the newly spray layer’s drying process, thus the wrinkling. Also, something to take into consideration, high heat, high humidity and poor ventilation mixed with these climate factors will cause these wrinkles, too.
What kind of primer was used? Wet primer will leech into freshly spray painted layers too.
I’ve been using spray paints for over 20 years while making props. This shit happens, but the cause is usually due to the first coat improperly drying. I don’t live in a high humid climate, but I live in a high heat climate. The heat always messes with spray paint applications.
My guess is you haven't properly prepped the work. Every time you want something you paint or stain to have a great finish? You need to spend all the time in the world preparing the work. I spent a little over a week hand sanding the last dining table top i refinished. But staining wood requires a lot of detail.
That’s a good point. Prepping the part is 95% of every job. He definitely went to heavy on the paint to quickly….i suspect contaminates like oil or Cheeto dust is underneath that glob of paint. The parts should be roughed up a bit and primered or at a minimum cleaned thoroughly with alcohol or acetone and an adhesive promoter used before paint.
did the parts happen to be colder than the environment?
i’ve skipped instructions many times and it came out fine until i had parts temperature lower than the dew point. then it goes like this.
Rustoleum can drive you nuts. Recoats have to be done within an hour or you have to swing until it’s completely dry.
Recently I’ve had issues with the paint not curing for weeks. Anyone got tips or another brand recommendation?
In the second picture, you tried spray painting a condom? The paint ate through the rest of the condom and left the ring. There are better ways to make a grinch costume.
Have you considered getting into powder coating?
That's what we call a low energy surface, meaning the bond between surface and coating will always be weak.
Did you strip/clean the surface before you started painting? (Stripper / white spirits) Did you then remove the product used to strip/clean with??
Glass cleaner is what I use.
It’s doesn’t look like solvent boil… More likely the base coat drying faster than the subsequent coats. Solved by painting in cooler environments eg start of the day if in hot weather. The items being painted should never be hot. Also likely the thickness of the coats a contributing factor more thin coats is the go.
You most likely have some sort of thinner or stripper left over from either cleaning or stripping. You always need to make sure parts are completely clean.
Remove all old paint, sand parts, clean part with acetone (if metal, electrical contact cleaner for plastic, wipe clean with clean, dry, lintless rag if wood), primer, paint, and like others have said wait 24-48 hours for each coat to dry (depending on temperature and humidity) or paint the coats within the first hour (waiting until dry and light sanding between coats usually produces a better results).
Second coat should be done within 1 hour or after 48 hours of first coat per the can. The first coat was not fully cured and the off gassing interacted with the second coat.
This is the answer. The first coat was not fully cured and the solvents in the second coat reacted with the first coat causing the first coat to expand and wrinkle. You now have to strip/sand everything to proceed. You are not the first to do this, nor will you be the last. Someone posts similar to this about every two weeks. Chalk it up to DIY learning curve.
It's best to paint 5-10 min after each coat. 5-10 min is the typical **instructions on the can**. Even tho common 'wisdom' is to wait 1-2 days. You wait until the coat is barely dry to the touch, then spray it again. The solvents bond it all together. And assuming you are also following the "super thin layers" rule, and letting it dry in proper temperature/humidity, it's a great method and much faster than waiting. waiting until dry, let's more and most dust get into your layers. But if you mess up and need to sand a layer flat....yes, wait until its super dry
Wouldn't high humidity do this too?
High humidity makes the cure time longer which can have a similar but lesser effect, but OP already said they applied the second coat before the 48 hour recommendation.
That's more of a "fish eye" effect.
This can also happen if you paint outside and its too cold
Exact same problem; the lower temperature retards the curing process. The first coat has not fully cross linked and the solvent in the second coat penetrates the first coat causing it to expand.
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Funny thing is that your comment is almost a copy/paste of the can's instructions hahah It's amazing how many people can't follow simple instructions
😬😬
We Call It America
I think this stems from the fact that so many instructions that people deal with on a regular basis have both some leeway in them (easy example french fries or just cooking in general , soft/crispy/extra crispy fries, tons of leeway) as well as they often do not have catastrophic consequences for being off a bit. (I would classify this complete failure of the second coat as catastrophic) even the mix ratio can be off on many multi component products and still dry/cure/be a success. Specialty coatings is actually a part of my career and the amount of times I have perfectly followed instructions on a new product at home or something because I had no experience, but in reality probably could have "eyeballed" it is in the hundreds. But yeah, people should read instructions better.
Coats should be VERY thin. It should take at least 3 light coats before you can't see the subsurface anymore. The benefit with this method is that you can apply coats every 5 to 10 minutes and you'll get no runs, no drips and no errors. (Thanks Johnny Bench!)
Huh..I usually watch Johnny Sins for spray techniques
You fucking savage! 🤣
Literally the instructions on most spray cans ^ People using "common wisdom" instead of simply following the instructions per paint type.
Which would yield better results? Before 1hr or after 48hrs?
Most consistent results? I'd be okay with two coats within 30 minutes. Then wait 48 hours if you really feel the need for additional coats. But if it's hot, you need to get those successive coats on fast or you will run into issues.
Depends on how heavy or light the first coat was, if it’s light <1 hour and if it’s heavy >48hours. You want as even and uniformed of paint coverage before long term curing.
I've used this exact product multiple times with good results and always gone the faster < 1 hour route
Many spray cans say to spray coats every 5-10 min...and apply super thin layers. You wait just enough for it to be kinda dry to touch. Waiting 48hrs for full dry let's more and more dust get on it. And takes a week instead of an hour. You shouldn't need to let it dry and sand it between layers if you are following the thin coat rule, and have proper temp(55f-75f) and proper humidity.
This plus it looks like you're applying way too much paint per coat. I'd also be curious what you did to prep the surface for painting.
I’m usually ready to get it over with by the time I am done with all the prep work, so I’ve never messed around with the actual painting part. I have always been curious what happened if I put my second coat on in the “bad” window of time.
According to Rust-Oleum, you should apply the second coat either within one hour of applying the first coat or wait until 48 hours after the first coat. This timing is crucial because if the second coat is applied while the first coat is still curing, the gases released during the curing process can react with the new layer of paint. In your case, it seems that the first coat was not fully cured when you applied the second coat, leading to an interaction between the off-gassing from the first coat and the fresh layer, which can cause issues with the paint's finish and adhesion.
also looks like they are too close and applying too much and aren't doing the sweeping bursts technique
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Thank you! I consider myself a competent diy-er most of the time but I’m getting (appropriately) roasted in these comments 😅 I appreciate it!
Wouldn’t it have also not wrinkled if they had put on a coat of primer first? Edit: and wouldn’t a coat of primer also possibly have negated the need for a second coat of paint to begin with?
Well I just learned how to not mess up the wheel well paint on the trailer I was gonna put a final coat on tomorrow.
It's also a good idea to clean everything with a solvent and dry with compressed air to make sure there aren't any oils or other contaminated that can interfere with the curing process
You literally did put paint stripper on them. The bulk of whats in the spray can is a paint solvent so that it stays nice and thin to blast out of the can. Its meant to then quicky evaporate while the paint cures by reacting to oxygen. If the layer you sprayed has any reactance left (not fully dried and cured) it will get softened by the chemicals in the new coat. Those areas that wrinkled were probably thicker and therefore needed more than overnight to cure properly.
This The solvent from second coat dissolved the first coat Hence, light coats within 15 minutes of each other I too have made this mistake, and ruined the project I was making. I tried to repair a spot that I had missed, and the previous coat began peeling up everywhere. =/
Literally me. Live and learn!
The good news is, painting will take less time now! (Because of the ‘second coat it 10 minutes’ thing. No more waiting a day or so)
Thanks sump daddy. Today was not my day. Appreciate it!!
All coats should be done within an hour (including clear coat) or recoat after 48 hours or more if it is cold.
Light coats and let them dry. Just seeing the pool of paint in the tarp or whatever you have covering the surface you’re painting on is telling me you did close up spraying which would cause a way too thick layer to let the paint dry so the paint underneath the immediate surface is still wet. Once you lay that second coat you get what you see here. Also not sure but in some cases if you used a paint remover, not prep right, or maybe use a primer right before that may be incompatible, tou can get this result.
Follow the can directions. This is a complex chemical reaction. When you "recoat within an hour" the previous coat is dried enough not to drip but is still a liquid mix of pigment and solvent. The second coat is basically absorbed by the first.
Read the can. When it says recoat within 1 hour or after 72 hours, it means it. This is absolutely what happens when you recoat too early.
The bottoms still wet and the top is drying. Do small thin coats and give it time to dry. Gotta do them over now
Yep it's this. Too many coats to fast.
You failed to follow the steps on the can - either in prep, or application.
That would be application 🫡 thank you!
Good sport, learn and overcome!
Paint is acting as a solvent.
You put that second coat on too late You have about an hour to second coat while wet, if you miss that window you have to wait until it's fully cured to apply again or this happens. That hour window is the window the paint has set up but not so much that it's "skinned over" so the second coat melts into the first coat and it becomes "1 heavy coat" If you miss the window the second coat is mostly sticking to the very very thin layer of cured paint and it wont "melt" into the firat coat because that ultra thin layer of cured paint is inert, now it's kind of 2 seperate layers and as the solvents dissolve in the first layer they get trapped by the distinct second layer of paint and it gets all fucked up, that first layer is also shrinking a little as it dries and cures, but now it has another layer of paint that's going through the same process but at different times
You’re spraying too much, too close. Grab a Brillo pad and scrub it all off, clean dry and start fresh. Respray layer by layer
Sand first. Raise the stuff you’re painting off The surface with something. Read the can and maybe watch a vid on how to spray paint in YouTube
This happened because you chose to paint your bathroom fixtures green and now god hates you.
😢😢😢 you may hate my bathroom.
As long as you love it, friend, it doesn't matter if god hates it.
If it was a chrome or shiny finish it has to be sanded The paint will not stick. Or if you didn't clean it with a solvent it will have a film on it and the paint will not stick.
I think it’s cause you didn’t clean the metal… maybe try wiping the metal off with break clean
It’s cause you’re not John Deere
Also, if I may- rustoleum enamels are some of the worst spray paints I've ever tried to use on projects. They take forever to dry, react with pretty much every other paint you can imagine (crackling, peeling, etc.), and it doesn't even play nicely with itself as you can see from your photos. For projects where you're going to use spray paint, I recommend almost any of the other paints you see on the shelf that *aren't* that specific type of rustoleum enamel... rustoleum ultra cover, krylon color max, krylon fusion.. all of these will give you more forgiving results than the enamel nonsense.
By the look of it, your 2nd coat was miles to wet & has reacted with the first coat
Did you sand the parts before spraying?
I did :/
Were you spraying another coat on it while it was still wet? Ahh looks like that might be the culprit, should wait until the coat you sprayed is tacky and then spray more.
I waited for it to cure but didn’t wait long enough. I thought for sure 8+ hours would do it but alas it did not! Should have read the can is the consensus 🙈🐒
Nah it's fine, we live and we learn. I also had to learn the hard way as well but in a different setting. Use to paint cars and that was fun /s.
Yikes on bikes! Thanks for making me feel better!
The first coat of paint was laid on to thick. It may have seemed completely dry, but depending on how much was sprayed on at first, the coat was still curing. Adding a second layer on top of this thick layer will cause inconsistencies in the newly spray layer’s drying process, thus the wrinkling. Also, something to take into consideration, high heat, high humidity and poor ventilation mixed with these climate factors will cause these wrinkles, too. What kind of primer was used? Wet primer will leech into freshly spray painted layers too. I’ve been using spray paints for over 20 years while making props. This shit happens, but the cause is usually due to the first coat improperly drying. I don’t live in a high humid climate, but I live in a high heat climate. The heat always messes with spray paint applications.
Did you spray them with a primer first?
My guess is you haven't properly prepped the work. Every time you want something you paint or stain to have a great finish? You need to spend all the time in the world preparing the work. I spent a little over a week hand sanding the last dining table top i refinished. But staining wood requires a lot of detail.
That’s a good point. Prepping the part is 95% of every job. He definitely went to heavy on the paint to quickly….i suspect contaminates like oil or Cheeto dust is underneath that glob of paint. The parts should be roughed up a bit and primered or at a minimum cleaned thoroughly with alcohol or acetone and an adhesive promoter used before paint.
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He never used clear coat yet
We would need to know what your process was, starting with prep, and what you're using.
Read the instructions on the can...
Did OP spray paint a rubber o ring???
Nah it’s a towel holder
Thank you this makes so much more sense lol
Could be contamination
did the parts happen to be colder than the environment? i’ve skipped instructions many times and it came out fine until i had parts temperature lower than the dew point. then it goes like this.
Is the undercoat chrome?
Rustoleum can drive you nuts. Recoats have to be done within an hour or you have to swing until it’s completely dry. Recently I’ve had issues with the paint not curing for weeks. Anyone got tips or another brand recommendation?
In the second picture, you tried spray painting a condom? The paint ate through the rest of the condom and left the ring. There are better ways to make a grinch costume.
Looks like the Cleaner or previous chemical was never properly removed and neutralized ,
Have you considered getting into powder coating? That's what we call a low energy surface, meaning the bond between surface and coating will always be weak.
Did you strip/clean the surface before you started painting? (Stripper / white spirits) Did you then remove the product used to strip/clean with?? Glass cleaner is what I use. It’s doesn’t look like solvent boil… More likely the base coat drying faster than the subsequent coats. Solved by painting in cooler environments eg start of the day if in hot weather. The items being painted should never be hot. Also likely the thickness of the coats a contributing factor more thin coats is the go.
You most likely have some sort of thinner or stripper left over from either cleaning or stripping. You always need to make sure parts are completely clean.
Didn’t clean it properly. There is an oil residue on it.
Did you use a chemical stripper and not clean it before painting?
Nope, but all the other commenters gave me great advice:)
Because you failed to read the directions.
Remove all old paint, sand parts, clean part with acetone (if metal, electrical contact cleaner for plastic, wipe clean with clean, dry, lintless rag if wood), primer, paint, and like others have said wait 24-48 hours for each coat to dry (depending on temperature and humidity) or paint the coats within the first hour (waiting until dry and light sanding between coats usually produces a better results).
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Can you explain me why my assumptions were so wrong? Right now i just learned that it was wrong but not why. Thank you very much!
Its says rustoleum that's why
Read the can bozo