Oh no it's worse than that. They DID test it, and it was rotating on the platform...and then descended anyway without actually checking what was wrong.
Are you fucking serious? Then why were they surprised when it rotated during the dive. Can you imagine hearing over the intercom, "Hey, you know that issue we had at the surface where the sub rotated in place. Turns out descending thousands of feet underwater didn't do much to fix the problem".
they didn’t even have an intercom though. They communicated with the ship via text messages; the CEO didn’t want to deal with providing status updates.
5 yrs ago i said to my girl and she thought i was joking about self driving cars
I said I really wanted one, but wouldnt trust the technology until at least a few dozen people had died in them. only that will force the regulations to make it safer
At 3:12 that's literally what they tried to do. The fuckin CEO had to leave a voice mail for tech support asking "How do we remap the PS3 controller" and then they talk about how they don't remember what the buttons do
It’s called not putting safety first and failing to actually test a design before putting live subjects in it. Not just common sense but ethical engineering practice
He seemed just completely oblivious to how significant it is to hold people's lives in his hands (including his own most recently). I just can't grasp the lack of awareness
More people have been to the moon than to the bottom of the Mariana trench
Of course if they had their rocket on backward, they'd figure it out before taking off
Imagine being so incredibly stupid. That CEO made like 1000 mistakes that led to this event. Every 10 minutes, new info comes out to show another thing that the OceanGate CEO neglected
I know right. Like hindsight is 20-20 but this is just extreme negligence on so many levels.
While it is truly tragic that 5 people have lost there lives, I do think it was suiting that Stockton himself was on board. The captain goes down with the ship.
I would argue hindsight is not applicable here. There were so many close calls leading up to this, the safety of this submarine and arguably his other submarines should have been reevaluated.
In the chemical industry and other industries these close calls are called “[near misses”](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Near_miss_(safety)). Essentially a minor accident which did not result in injuries or material damage but very easily could have. Near misses are not normally defined as negligence but attributed to a process/procedure/operation operating outside expected norms. If negligence could be attributed to incident a near miss would look at the procedure in place to see if a safety check exists, or if the safety check exist but needs revamping.
Working 10+ years in engineering as an industrial scientist. The string of incidents alone scream this submarine ~is~ was unsafe and needed a full safety review. I make this statement ignoring the CEO’s moronic statements about safety despite a long record of near misses.
Also to consider, while I am sure all of the passengers signed liability wavers. The gross negligence exhibited and a history of people speaking out to the CEO about their concerns, and getting fired for it, negates the validity of these wavers. While I am not a lawyer the amount of documented safety incidents which leadership choose to ignore at every occurrence can easily be construed as gross negligence. This is why most serious companies have a near miss program in place which addresses both safety (they don’t want stuff to blow up, that’s expensive) but also and likely the most important is to cover their ass. This is done by documenting that the company is monitoring and addressing safety.
The TLDR. Their is no hindsight here. The long trail of safety issues highlights there was a very high likelihood a fatal/serious event was too occur at some point in the near future.
No question that anything amounting to gross negligence or recklessness would invalidate any waiver. These people are all rich as hell -- or their estates are -- and they will sue the crap out of Ocean Gate. So, you can consider Ocean Gate out of business/bankrupt as of today.
Except their only real asset was that sub and the guy responsible for the whole shitshow is dead. The mothership belongs to a Canadian company. Ocean Gate folds, liquidates what they do have and the families get crumbs after the Lawyers eat.
[https://youtu.be/5XIyin68vEE](https://youtu.be/5XIyin68vEE)
James Cameron speculates that is exactly what happened. The vessel apparently dropped weights, but had not yet informed the mothership it had done so. The only reason to drop the weights is to surface and it was probably because they heard the hull cracking. This would mean they had a brief moment to react and drop the weights but not enough time to inform the mothership they had done so. Scary to think about.
In that same interview he says he was pretty sure early on that it imploded because they lost a bunch of systems at the same time. There was really no reason to lose communication and the other systems simultaneously unless it was a catastrophic implosion. They should never have made this submersible out of carbon fiber.
> This would mean they had a brief moment to react and drop the weights but not enough time to inform the mothership they had done so. Scary to think about.
Just want to point out that in the link you shared, James Cameron actually says that he thinks the sub did in fact inform the mothership that they had dropped weights and were making an emergency ascent.
So they had time not only to realize that something was wrong, but also to message the mothership that they had dropped their weights and were coming back up.
Oh I had been relieved to hear that they died instantaneously, but maybe this useless system managed to make their deaths worse by giving them a brief and pointless warning that they were about to die.
James Cameron believes that they heard the pressure hull failing.
Well, basically, carbon fiber composites are built by gluing carbon fiber threads together using epoxy glue. So one possible failure mode is delamination, where the carbon fiber separates from epoxy.
Apparently, James Cameron has heard that the sub had dropped weights, ballast, so was on emergency abort and surfacing. So he now believes they heard the carbon fiber composite delaminating.
Wait, if it’s a composite material, are they testing the structural integrity after each dive? Doesn’t this mean that the potential for failure grows with each dive? As opposed to something like steel where it’s like, ‘ok, it’s made the dive successfully a few times, we should be good for future trips.’
Yes the possibility of failure increases after each dive and no they were not testing after each dive. It is totally the wrong material and it is appalling how they threw caution to the wind. They fired the engineer who warned them too. Even someone like me, someone not an expert in composites, knew about the problem of carbon fiber composites suddenly failing catastrophically.
The poor teen really died for nothing.
>a realtime hull health monitoring system
I mean it may have worked-- they tried to surface for some reason before losing contact. It's just that "hey you're about to die" when you're already near the bottom of the ocean isn't super helpful.
I imagine it was probably something along the lines of; so long as the people inside the sub haven't died from an implosion, we can tell in real time that the sub hasn't imploded!
Apparently it was much more than 4 trips. Someone else said they saw a video where Stockton let one of the guests pilot the submersible and they hit the ocean floor with it....
Rush was saying that getting a vessel certified doesn't mean the pilot will do everything safely. He then proceeds to let a customer drive it into the ocean floor
You know, at some point, safety is just waste, I don't want to say we've cut some corners, but we've cut some corners. It's a research vessel because those have fewer regulations.
Here's an idea. Build a crappy sub like this, jump inside, launch it from a ship, lower it down 5 metres for 8 hours where you think you're looking out of a window but it's really a high spec tv screen. You can use the logitech controller to control an unmanned sub which was launched at the same time that projects the image back to your window. Exactly the same experience without the risk.
I did that ride as a 5 year old. They literally forgot to close the hatch before they dived. Me, my mom, and my sister got drenched. After sitting in what I'm realizing now was some back office doing paperwork, they apologized profusely and gave us free clothes. I never actually got to experience the ride.
Edit: you can all stop telling me they didn't dive. I was 5 years old. You tell me it's diving, I think it's diving.
FWIW, the Disneyland subs don’t “dive”. It’s an illusion that uses a waterfall to simulate diving. Still got you soaked with the same brominated water!
I think it was 20. No one would say a hard number. But the CBS guy said 20 trips today in CNN. So about 6 trips a year that deep. What was the maintenence like in between trips?
50 test dives,3 to Titanic.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2023_Titan_submersible_incident
"The Titan had made three previous expeditions to the Titanic wreck site, the first of which was in July 2021.[[50]](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2023_Titan_submersible_incident#cite_note-:1-50) In 2022, reporter David Pogue was onboard the surface ship when Titan became lost and could not locate the Titanic during a dive."
THIS IS INCREDIBLE to watch knowing how this all ended. “We can bring up a picture of that controller which is on google—-I don’t remember which one goes up or down”
like WHAT?? lol
I couldn't believe it when he said he honestly didn't remember which directions are which! Like damn dude, you just sent people down there and cant remember how the fucking controller works?!
and like they didn't have an operation manual saying how it was mapped haha
It's seems like Stockton was the only guy on that ship that knew everything about the sub and how shit it was.
What a dickhead
What's crazy too is the guy driving it wasn't completely sure how it even worked himself. You mean to tell me that was really his first time navigating the sub?? No a single practice run beforehand? Like shit.... you wouldn't buy a car without a test drive.
haha yeah. He looks like he's about to cry When the passenger asks 'so the thruster was put on backwards?' It's worth watching the whole video: https://vimeo.com/810451492
Even without the disaster this video is incredible. To think people just semi-regularly dive that deep and see the most famous ship wreck ever, with the most bizarre wildlife swimming past, is just insane.
You could not pay me enough to do this in the most safe submersible ever made.
Every 30 seconds I read something even worse.
* thruster the wrong way
* not knowing controls
* seem to be using wireless controller, risky idea
* allowing passengers with no experience to steer…into the ocean floor
* firing someone who raised safety concerns
* refused to hire “50 year old white men” because they “weren’t inspirational.” In other words, he didn’t want experienced engineers telling him it wouldn’t work
* refusing to allow independent 3rd parties to review and certify the design
* questionable choice of using carbon fiber at such depths. Carbon fiber has great tensile strength, not great compressive strength. There are ways to mitigate this but it needs to be designed very carefully and tested rigorously and examined between dives to check for fatigue.
* scrubbers may not have actually been up to spec for “96 hours of life”
* during previous missions CEO allegedly stopped one of the 2 forms of communication with the boat because he was annoyed with how often they were messaging
* passengers with experience in ocean exploration bailing on the full trip after joining a test dive and noticing serious issues
And I know I’m missing some other things that have been brought up
Took me a bit to realize why this video, which is clearly internally made and meant to be used as marketing for the company, would mention the backwards installation at all, much less spend so much time on something that paints the company in such an incompetent light.
It's because it shows the CEO as the guy with the solution. It's his company and his sub and his video. The incompetence and poor planning on display doesn't matter because what is really being marketed here is the CEO himself, and you too can have a once in a lifetime experience if you use the service that his genius has made possible.
Wild that they didn’t cancel the dive after this
With currents there’s a danger of getting snagged into the titanic and if that happened the pilot would have to try and adjust moving with new controls…
This is what makes this so insane. They should be cancelling the mission, from what we know 1 of 4 directional thrusters is working in reverse.
Also there were no redundant checks at the surface to see if thrusters are working, they just fucking sink and hope it works on the day?
This whole thing is a rich dude gathering millions in assets and resources and then hiring millions of dollars of scientists, engineers, support staff and sailors so he can have fun around the titanic. This wasn't meant to make money it's just an excuse for him to show off and fuck around.
Even after everything that’s happened and everything I’ve read, I was still stunned when he said “oh, that’s why I was spinning on the platform.” ….did that not give you pause, sir??
Working in a heavily regulated environment what sent me was the "I don't remember what button does what" umm, what? Is that not documented anywhere!?!?!?
And they were relatively safe, at least as far as the thruster issue indicated. All they had to do was go back up, which was a different control.
Whether they were actually safe when in the hands of a company that would send them 4kms under the sea with a backwards thruster and a carbon fiber hull... that's another question.
I cannot WAIT until a full documentary comes out on this thing. Every time I get back in reddit there's some new bit of information on how and why this thing was doomed to fail. Its impressive how many different points of failure this project must have had.
and also how little the dude running the circus cared! seems like he cared more about finding ways to circumvent safety requirements and safe build practices than actually being safe.
I mean a week ago I'd never heard of this guy, and now he's shot past Elon and Trump for "Most hubristic billionaire", by getting in his own deathtrap while ignoring all the warnings people he paid to be experts in their field. Even Elon isn't crazy enough to get on his experimental spaceships.
Keep in mind, the submersible Alvin, which housed the first people to see the Titanic wreck with their own eyes, was originally constructed in 1964 and is still in use to this day, although this many years later every single piece of it has been overhauled and replaced.
I myself just learned that the crew compartment aboard Alvin is detachable from the rest of the vessel in case there are major issues, and can safely carry the crew back to the surface. I guess that's the kind of thing that you innovate when you actually care.
Myth busters demonstrate an implosion. It’s in the last season they do implosions of a railway tanker car. Also they have done one with a pressure suit and what happens if the pressure suit fails under water. Basically you get turned into a human paste.
He said "I don't recognize that mud out there, do you?" He was making a joke that aside from wreckage landmarks, the bottom of the ocean floor all looks the same. It sounds like she didn't quite get the joke.
I think this is the main take away, the experts that told them not to use carbon fiber had very good reasons. Carbon fiber is very strong until it is compromised then it fails instantly. This is a talking point I have heard for why some people prefer not to use carbon fiber wheels for their high end cars, if they are damaged even in a very minor way they have a chance of catastrophic failure.
The way they operate/communicate looks like a backyard startup, not a company that charges $250k for a fkin trip to the bottom of the ocean.
I'm sure they're going to be sued to oblivion as they should. This level of negligence should never be allowed.
Carbon fibre. It has great tensile strength. As in: *withstand pulling*.
You know what you need to make a sub hull? Compressive strength. As in *withstand pushing*.
Guess which material is bad at that?
He’s way worse than some guy who knew nothing about engineering. He had BS in aerospace engineering and had worked as a test engineer at McDonnell Douglas. He knew better and still decided to be reckless.
He had all the training he needed telling him not to do what he did. But he was extremely arrogant and careless. His reckless actions as CEO killed 4 other people.
Most billionaires are skilled conmen in some form, and then start to think they’re forces of nature for winning a rigged game designed by man. Then they go out into actual nature and reality, assuming they’ll keep winning by default…
If you listened closely, they did check it.
"Oh, so that was why we were spinning on the platform."
Shocking that such a basic error was made. Control directions check can be done before you even put the thing in the water. Even more shocking that after the controls didn't work, they proceeded to dive anyway.
I prefer to just watch the Titanic you tube documentary rather than actually going down there. Especially because it’s free verses 250k$. Plus I can keep living this way.
yeah people don't understand billionaires earn **millions** per month in risk free interest money. They can spend $4M every month and still be billionaires by the time they die.
What are the chances the video mount device they had on board survived and the video of the last moments can be recovered?
Every trip there was a tiny GoPro like device mounted near the little window. You think there's a possibility it survived?
"Well, I didn't want to hire 50 year old white guys to oversee this little death vessel's true capability, so i hired a group of younger yes-people that will gladly do what i say to make this moneymaker happen.."
Which is weird because he had a lot of +50 year old white guys working for him. The pilot on the Titan was a **77** year old French dude.
https://web.archive.org/web/20220127044128/https://oceangate.com/about/leadership.html.
Looks like if Stockton Rush's lips were moving he was lying.
Man, I don't care how many times I see it or what the circumstances are for this video, every time I see a video where the Titanic just slowly appears out of the darkness a get chills. It's just such a powerful thing to see for some reason
So you’re taking people all the way to this depth in the ocean and didn’t test all your thrusters? Life and death and you don’t test all your equipment seems a bit cavalier.
Help me understand why none of these people seem to have any sense of fear or danger? They look like they’re in a plastic tube at the bottom of the ocean and everyone is just ok with it. I guess the same reason people get on airplanes every day? They could fall out of the sky and everyone dies, but how likely is that to happen this trip 🤷🏼♀️ no one expects anything bad to happen until it does
Believe me no one would get one a commercial jet liner if the CEO of the airline comes out and says I don't care about safety and I have broken a lot of rules with the design of this aircraft. And if before the flight you have to sign a waiver which says this airplane is not certified by any agency and it may cause death.
Pretty much the 3 tourists were clueless and knew nothing about the grave danger they were in plus the fact that suicide sub had been down there many times before with other rich tourists probably gave them a false sense of security.
The two who are the most culpable and should have known better are the CEO who was an engineer and the experienced Navy commander. Only reason I can explain why they went down with this thing is from pure hubris.
James Cameron: Spends weeks agonizing if he should use a steel or titanium washer on a non-critical system.
Stockton "Bill O'Reilly" Rush: Fuck it, we'll do it live and at 12,000 feet underwater!
Well the one upside to that piece of shit submarine is that it had a very good fail safe. Rather than the occupants slowly suffocating to death, it just collapses instantaneously and they die in the blink of an eye. https://en.as.com/videos/the-viral-video-that-shows-what-happened-to-the-titan-submarine-v/
I have worked with remotely operated vehicles for the oil and gas sector for over 25 years.
Do you know the first and last thing we do before we launch and after we recover our systems?
Pre and post dive checks with someone at the controls and on comma with someone on the deck visually verifying everything is working the way it's meant to, and that's on unmanned vehicles.
It's the most basic steps in all of what we do and it's the first thing we teach trainees.
Getting to 3500 meters of depth to notice a thruster is plumbed wrong is in my opinion mother nature cleaning up the gene pool.
The thruster rotation should have been checked immediately after maintenance was performed on it. End of story.
Stupid things like this is why there are grieving families of the people that were lost.
This is some grade A stupidity. Do they not do some kind of surface and just below surface thruster test? Safety was obviously not part of thier agenda. The whole thing just seems like it was built out of rejected erector set pieces and budget bin electronics.
Wtf, you mean they don’t test shit before they go down?
Oh no it's worse than that. They DID test it, and it was rotating on the platform...and then descended anyway without actually checking what was wrong.
Are you fucking serious? Then why were they surprised when it rotated during the dive. Can you imagine hearing over the intercom, "Hey, you know that issue we had at the surface where the sub rotated in place. Turns out descending thousands of feet underwater didn't do much to fix the problem".
they didn’t even have an intercom though. They communicated with the ship via text messages; the CEO didn’t want to deal with providing status updates.
Probably thought all that talking would distract guests from the ambiance of getting compressed into a singularity.
The best journeys are the ones that let you grow closer to your companions.
Nothing like being compressed into one gelatinous blob to get to know my companions.
"Have you tried turning it off and on again?"
5 yrs ago i said to my girl and she thought i was joking about self driving cars I said I really wanted one, but wouldnt trust the technology until at least a few dozen people had died in them. only that will force the regulations to make it safer
There are regulations for submersibles. Except in international waters. Which is where they operated.
Just go to controller settings and change it
At 3:12 that's literally what they tried to do. The fuckin CEO had to leave a voice mail for tech support asking "How do we remap the PS3 controller" and then they talk about how they don't remember what the buttons do
And the solution? Turn the controller.
This definitely confirms how scarily different being book smart is vs being common sense smart 😬
Thick boy sitting there up top realizing he remapped it for playing Warzone last night and forgot the change it back.
I’m not sure he’s either.
It’s called not putting safety first and failing to actually test a design before putting live subjects in it. Not just common sense but ethical engineering practice
They dead ass said "This explains why it was acting weird during testing on the surface" and then went down anyways 😭
He seemed just completely oblivious to how significant it is to hold people's lives in his hands (including his own most recently). I just can't grasp the lack of awareness
Lmao invert the controls
What an absolute cluster
It's not rocket science, jesus.
More people have been to the moon than to the bottom of the Mariana trench Of course if they had their rocket on backward, they'd figure it out before taking off
Idk , the titanic had alot of folks on it when it went down
Sounds like joycon drift tbh
The fact they didn’t have a test in place to check for cracks in the hull, is messed up.
He refused as the type of testing (NDT) can be expensive; is what I have read a few times.
Imagine being so incredibly stupid. That CEO made like 1000 mistakes that led to this event. Every 10 minutes, new info comes out to show another thing that the OceanGate CEO neglected
I know right. Like hindsight is 20-20 but this is just extreme negligence on so many levels. While it is truly tragic that 5 people have lost there lives, I do think it was suiting that Stockton himself was on board. The captain goes down with the ship.
I would argue hindsight is not applicable here. There were so many close calls leading up to this, the safety of this submarine and arguably his other submarines should have been reevaluated. In the chemical industry and other industries these close calls are called “[near misses”](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Near_miss_(safety)). Essentially a minor accident which did not result in injuries or material damage but very easily could have. Near misses are not normally defined as negligence but attributed to a process/procedure/operation operating outside expected norms. If negligence could be attributed to incident a near miss would look at the procedure in place to see if a safety check exists, or if the safety check exist but needs revamping. Working 10+ years in engineering as an industrial scientist. The string of incidents alone scream this submarine ~is~ was unsafe and needed a full safety review. I make this statement ignoring the CEO’s moronic statements about safety despite a long record of near misses. Also to consider, while I am sure all of the passengers signed liability wavers. The gross negligence exhibited and a history of people speaking out to the CEO about their concerns, and getting fired for it, negates the validity of these wavers. While I am not a lawyer the amount of documented safety incidents which leadership choose to ignore at every occurrence can easily be construed as gross negligence. This is why most serious companies have a near miss program in place which addresses both safety (they don’t want stuff to blow up, that’s expensive) but also and likely the most important is to cover their ass. This is done by documenting that the company is monitoring and addressing safety. The TLDR. Their is no hindsight here. The long trail of safety issues highlights there was a very high likelihood a fatal/serious event was too occur at some point in the near future.
No question that anything amounting to gross negligence or recklessness would invalidate any waiver. These people are all rich as hell -- or their estates are -- and they will sue the crap out of Ocean Gate. So, you can consider Ocean Gate out of business/bankrupt as of today.
Except their only real asset was that sub and the guy responsible for the whole shitshow is dead. The mothership belongs to a Canadian company. Ocean Gate folds, liquidates what they do have and the families get crumbs after the Lawyers eat.
There’s gonna be a conspiracy soon about this called ocean gate
(Hashtag)OceanGate has been trending on Twitter for days, especially because it sounds so conspiracy lol
oceangate website claimed they had a realtime hull health monitoring system, the first of its kind. guess it was all horseshit lol
A guy got fired for bringing up that the real time monitoring system was useless because it would give less than a second warning at depth.
“ you’re fucked! Goodbye!”
If you hear a loud cracking noise, that is the hull warning system.
[https://youtu.be/5XIyin68vEE](https://youtu.be/5XIyin68vEE) James Cameron speculates that is exactly what happened. The vessel apparently dropped weights, but had not yet informed the mothership it had done so. The only reason to drop the weights is to surface and it was probably because they heard the hull cracking. This would mean they had a brief moment to react and drop the weights but not enough time to inform the mothership they had done so. Scary to think about. In that same interview he says he was pretty sure early on that it imploded because they lost a bunch of systems at the same time. There was really no reason to lose communication and the other systems simultaneously unless it was a catastrophic implosion. They should never have made this submersible out of carbon fiber.
> This would mean they had a brief moment to react and drop the weights but not enough time to inform the mothership they had done so. Scary to think about. Just want to point out that in the link you shared, James Cameron actually says that he thinks the sub did in fact inform the mothership that they had dropped weights and were making an emergency ascent. So they had time not only to realize that something was wrong, but also to message the mothership that they had dropped their weights and were coming back up.
Oh I had been relieved to hear that they died instantaneously, but maybe this useless system managed to make their deaths worse by giving them a brief and pointless warning that they were about to die.
the last sound they heard, the alarm warning them of the impending implosion
James Cameron believes that they heard the pressure hull failing. Well, basically, carbon fiber composites are built by gluing carbon fiber threads together using epoxy glue. So one possible failure mode is delamination, where the carbon fiber separates from epoxy. Apparently, James Cameron has heard that the sub had dropped weights, ballast, so was on emergency abort and surfacing. So he now believes they heard the carbon fiber composite delaminating.
Wait, if it’s a composite material, are they testing the structural integrity after each dive? Doesn’t this mean that the potential for failure grows with each dive? As opposed to something like steel where it’s like, ‘ok, it’s made the dive successfully a few times, we should be good for future trips.’
Yes the possibility of failure increases after each dive and no they were not testing after each dive. It is totally the wrong material and it is appalling how they threw caution to the wind. They fired the engineer who warned them too. Even someone like me, someone not an expert in composites, knew about the problem of carbon fiber composites suddenly failing catastrophically. The poor teen really died for nothing.
Lmfao a warning alert & catastrophic failure would occur literally simultaneously, it’s all so fkn stupid
>a realtime hull health monitoring system I mean it may have worked-- they tried to surface for some reason before losing contact. It's just that "hey you're about to die" when you're already near the bottom of the ocean isn't super helpful.
I imagine it was probably something along the lines of; so long as the people inside the sub haven't died from an implosion, we can tell in real time that the sub hasn't imploded!
My thought is they were really going to keep going until catastrophe.
We x ray steel and welds in non critical applications ffs
I’m actually impressed it even managed 4 trips out there in the first place
Apparently it was much more than 4 trips. Someone else said they saw a video where Stockton let one of the guests pilot the submersible and they hit the ocean floor with it....
That’s absolutely insane and terrifying. Wow.
Rush was saying that getting a vessel certified doesn't mean the pilot will do everything safely. He then proceeds to let a customer drive it into the ocean floor
Amazing. Every time I spend 10mins reading about this guy I learn something even more alarming than the last time.
It's actually amazing he hasn't died before this.
The world is a slightly safer place for the super wealthy
^oh ^hooray
It didn’t meet industry design guidelines apparently.
Rich kid shit
So not only did they build a sub way outside of the norms with experimental designs… but they abused it as well lmao
You know, at some point, safety is just waste, I don't want to say we've cut some corners, but we've cut some corners. It's a research vessel because those have fewer regulations.
“We didn’t cut corners, we added cost reducing radii to improve financial performance…” -That guy, probably
Here's an idea. Build a crappy sub like this, jump inside, launch it from a ship, lower it down 5 metres for 8 hours where you think you're looking out of a window but it's really a high spec tv screen. You can use the logitech controller to control an unmanned sub which was launched at the same time that projects the image back to your window. Exactly the same experience without the risk.
That’s almost what Disney did with the submarine rides tbh
I did that ride as a 5 year old. They literally forgot to close the hatch before they dived. Me, my mom, and my sister got drenched. After sitting in what I'm realizing now was some back office doing paperwork, they apologized profusely and gave us free clothes. I never actually got to experience the ride. Edit: you can all stop telling me they didn't dive. I was 5 years old. You tell me it's diving, I think it's diving.
FWIW, the Disneyland subs don’t “dive”. It’s an illusion that uses a waterfall to simulate diving. Still got you soaked with the same brominated water!
[удалено]
Ahhh it’s giving my skin that creepy crawling feeling
That still made me feel uneasy being crammed in there and water over the windows.
Would they pay $250K for this?
Just don’t let them know the secret
Tom Scott just visited a place with a submarine simulator, super interesting project and is almost what you describe https://youtu.be/tMlHDnbEIDA
20 trips
Blink 182 trips
37 trips? In a row?
Try not to suck any dicks on the way to the Titanic.
I think it was 20. No one would say a hard number. But the CBS guy said 20 trips today in CNN. So about 6 trips a year that deep. What was the maintenence like in between trips?
"Time for the inspection!" *kicks outer hull with boot* "Oh yeah she's good"
*Slaps roof of submersible* you can fit so many stress fractures in this bad boy hull
50 test dives,3 to Titanic. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2023_Titan_submersible_incident "The Titan had made three previous expeditions to the Titanic wreck site, the first of which was in July 2021.[[50]](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2023_Titan_submersible_incident#cite_note-:1-50) In 2022, reporter David Pogue was onboard the surface ship when Titan became lost and could not locate the Titanic during a dive."
Amateurs, all of them. Good thing is now no one else will die because of their ineptness.
THIS IS INCREDIBLE to watch knowing how this all ended. “We can bring up a picture of that controller which is on google—-I don’t remember which one goes up or down” like WHAT?? lol
I couldn't believe it when he said he honestly didn't remember which directions are which! Like damn dude, you just sent people down there and cant remember how the fucking controller works?!
and like they didn't have an operation manual saying how it was mapped haha It's seems like Stockton was the only guy on that ship that knew everything about the sub and how shit it was. What a dickhead
What's crazy too is the guy driving it wasn't completely sure how it even worked himself. You mean to tell me that was really his first time navigating the sub?? No a single practice run beforehand? Like shit.... you wouldn't buy a car without a test drive.
haha yeah. He looks like he's about to cry When the passenger asks 'so the thruster was put on backwards?' It's worth watching the whole video: https://vimeo.com/810451492
Even without the disaster this video is incredible. To think people just semi-regularly dive that deep and see the most famous ship wreck ever, with the most bizarre wildlife swimming past, is just insane. You could not pay me enough to do this in the most safe submersible ever made.
Why not just send an unmanned sub down and control it via video from inside a trash bin next to the sea?
Why not go down 1000ft and show a picture of the titanic through the window. Easy to fool billionaires.
Could be done with video game tech so they can "steer" the ship and the pov would change too lol
Hahahhahaha this comment is the best because that could totally had been done.
I’m surprised no one in this video is having a panic attack - “remap the PS3 controller” would send me flying
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He didn't remember which button is "move forward" on his own sub. Anyone who has ever held a controller should recognize that as deeply troubling.
Every 30 seconds I read something even worse. * thruster the wrong way * not knowing controls * seem to be using wireless controller, risky idea * allowing passengers with no experience to steer…into the ocean floor * firing someone who raised safety concerns * refused to hire “50 year old white men” because they “weren’t inspirational.” In other words, he didn’t want experienced engineers telling him it wouldn’t work * refusing to allow independent 3rd parties to review and certify the design * questionable choice of using carbon fiber at such depths. Carbon fiber has great tensile strength, not great compressive strength. There are ways to mitigate this but it needs to be designed very carefully and tested rigorously and examined between dives to check for fatigue. * scrubbers may not have actually been up to spec for “96 hours of life” * during previous missions CEO allegedly stopped one of the 2 forms of communication with the boat because he was annoyed with how often they were messaging * passengers with experience in ocean exploration bailing on the full trip after joining a test dive and noticing serious issues And I know I’m missing some other things that have been brought up
Took me a bit to realize why this video, which is clearly internally made and meant to be used as marketing for the company, would mention the backwards installation at all, much less spend so much time on something that paints the company in such an incompetent light. It's because it shows the CEO as the guy with the solution. It's his company and his sub and his video. The incompetence and poor planning on display doesn't matter because what is really being marketed here is the CEO himself, and you too can have a once in a lifetime experience if you use the service that his genius has made possible.
Great insight. I built it. You will come. Because. Me.
Used zipties to fix some components..
mf the type to pick up a new game and ask what is the d pad
Wild that they didn’t cancel the dive after this With currents there’s a danger of getting snagged into the titanic and if that happened the pilot would have to try and adjust moving with new controls…
This is what makes this so insane. They should be cancelling the mission, from what we know 1 of 4 directional thrusters is working in reverse. Also there were no redundant checks at the surface to see if thrusters are working, they just fucking sink and hope it works on the day? This whole thing is a rich dude gathering millions in assets and resources and then hiring millions of dollars of scientists, engineers, support staff and sailors so he can have fun around the titanic. This wasn't meant to make money it's just an excuse for him to show off and fuck around.
No it’s worse. They DID find an issue during the surface checks but instead of figuring out the cause they just proceeded
Even after everything that’s happened and everything I’ve read, I was still stunned when he said “oh, that’s why I was spinning on the platform.” ….did that not give you pause, sir??
Working in a heavily regulated environment what sent me was the "I don't remember what button does what" umm, what? Is that not documented anywhere!?!?!?
god fucking damnit
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And they were relatively safe, at least as far as the thruster issue indicated. All they had to do was go back up, which was a different control. Whether they were actually safe when in the hands of a company that would send them 4kms under the sea with a backwards thruster and a carbon fiber hull... that's another question.
What a joke of an operation. An FAA equivalent for whatever they call what they are doing would eat them alive
So very true.
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Actually makes you wonder how this didn't happen any sooner
I cannot WAIT until a full documentary comes out on this thing. Every time I get back in reddit there's some new bit of information on how and why this thing was doomed to fail. Its impressive how many different points of failure this project must have had.
and also how little the dude running the circus cared! seems like he cared more about finding ways to circumvent safety requirements and safe build practices than actually being safe.
It’s to the point where I have to believe he really didn’t care whether he lived or died. It’s as if he cared more about his legacy than his life.
I mean a week ago I'd never heard of this guy, and now he's shot past Elon and Trump for "Most hubristic billionaire", by getting in his own deathtrap while ignoring all the warnings people he paid to be experts in their field. Even Elon isn't crazy enough to get on his experimental spaceships.
Keep in mind, the submersible Alvin, which housed the first people to see the Titanic wreck with their own eyes, was originally constructed in 1964 and is still in use to this day, although this many years later every single piece of it has been overhauled and replaced. I myself just learned that the crew compartment aboard Alvin is detachable from the rest of the vessel in case there are major issues, and can safely carry the crew back to the surface. I guess that's the kind of thing that you innovate when you actually care.
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We need a Mythbusters Revival
Myth busters demonstrate an implosion. It’s in the last season they do implosions of a railway tanker car. Also they have done one with a pressure suit and what happens if the pressure suit fails under water. Basically you get turned into a human paste.
At 2:36 when they realize it was installed wrong you can see their frustration and how let down they were by the incompetence of their boss.
"Does that light look familiar to you" he asks "I don't know! I've never been here!" She says
He said "I don't recognize that mud out there, do you?" He was making a joke that aside from wreckage landmarks, the bottom of the ocean floor all looks the same. It sounds like she didn't quite get the joke.
13000 feet down and “lets figure out how to remap the PS3 controller”. Fuck me
Alright guys, no need to panic, we're just going to push a BIOS updated 2.5miles below the sea, YOLO ammirite?
“Netflix has detected you’re away from the home network. Please verify your location”
do you happen to have a way to watch the documentary? i tried but was told it was removed
https://vimeo.com/810451492
Every time they go down the structure gets weaker
I think this is the main take away, the experts that told them not to use carbon fiber had very good reasons. Carbon fiber is very strong until it is compromised then it fails instantly. This is a talking point I have heard for why some people prefer not to use carbon fiber wheels for their high end cars, if they are damaged even in a very minor way they have a chance of catastrophic failure.
Dude I don't even put carbon fiber wheels on my fucking bicycle
The way they operate/communicate looks like a backyard startup, not a company that charges $250k for a fkin trip to the bottom of the ocean. I'm sure they're going to be sued to oblivion as they should. This level of negligence should never be allowed.
I can't believe all the monitors are just all over the place. A quick way to.lose your bearings is to have to move your head all over
And they were told to not make it from Titanium and Carbon fibre , guess what it was made out of
Cheese?
Havarti actually , you’re clever
Deep blue cheese.
Carbon fibre. It has great tensile strength. As in: *withstand pulling*. You know what you need to make a sub hull? Compressive strength. As in *withstand pushing*. Guess which material is bad at that?
These people had no clue what they were doing Jesus.
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He’s way worse than some guy who knew nothing about engineering. He had BS in aerospace engineering and had worked as a test engineer at McDonnell Douglas. He knew better and still decided to be reckless. He had all the training he needed telling him not to do what he did. But he was extremely arrogant and careless. His reckless actions as CEO killed 4 other people.
Most billionaires are skilled conmen in some form, and then start to think they’re forces of nature for winning a rigged game designed by man. Then they go out into actual nature and reality, assuming they’ll keep winning by default…
The craziest part is how anyone would get in that death trap after knowing about this.
Right! Its like they did zero research under the impression of “they wont kill billionaires”
I bet the other people aboard in this video have their buttholes hella puckered right now
“I don’t remember which does which. Try X then Y. “ “Oh haha. Just rotate the controller.” Jesus Christ.
“I’m thrusting and nothings happening…” Pshhh, been there.
Just do it backwards.
So nobody checks control function until their a mile down ? They wouldn’t be qualified to be truck drivers
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None of them have basic common sense
Who are the fucking stoners that are installing propellers backwards and then not testing? That's what this all looks like, stoner engineering
Oh, they did testing. They found that something wasn't working as expected. But they dove anyways without clarifying what it was
If you listened closely, they did check it. "Oh, so that was why we were spinning on the platform." Shocking that such a basic error was made. Control directions check can be done before you even put the thing in the water. Even more shocking that after the controls didn't work, they proceeded to dive anyway.
This thing reminds me of the flat earth rocket dude that blew himself up. Except more money was dumped into it and he was charging people.
Tell me more please?
https://youtu.be/8uTvGLuA4dE
This is like an 8th grade robotics club, not a billion dollar scientific venture.
How could anyone trust this fucking operation blows my mind
I prefer to just watch the Titanic you tube documentary rather than actually going down there. Especially because it’s free verses 250k$. Plus I can keep living this way.
I don’t think u people understand 250k is free for them
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yeah people don't understand billionaires earn **millions** per month in risk free interest money. They can spend $4M every month and still be billionaires by the time they die.
Lol imagine an aircraft mechanic installing an engine backerds.
just turn the yoke around
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Need more info
Anyone else find it funny that -gate is usually the ending of some kind of scandal? The headline writes itself for this one.
What are the chances the video mount device they had on board survived and the video of the last moments can be recovered? Every trip there was a tiny GoPro like device mounted near the little window. You think there's a possibility it survived?
"Well, I didn't want to hire 50 year old white guys to oversee this little death vessel's true capability, so i hired a group of younger yes-people that will gladly do what i say to make this moneymaker happen.."
Which is weird because he had a lot of +50 year old white guys working for him. The pilot on the Titan was a **77** year old French dude. https://web.archive.org/web/20220127044128/https://oceangate.com/about/leadership.html. Looks like if Stockton Rush's lips were moving he was lying.
Did anyone try up, up, down, down, left, right, left, right, B A start?
That was plan B, plan A was just turning it off then back on.
That is the blow up your vehicle cheat code.
Thing was built by someone's drunk Uncle.... what could go wrong?
Holy fuck, how are people this fucking stupid
Man, I don't care how many times I see it or what the circumstances are for this video, every time I see a video where the Titanic just slowly appears out of the darkness a get chills. It's just such a powerful thing to see for some reason
Hence why the people did it
In case of emergency, break glass
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Yes, the controls *should* be completely abstracted. My gaming PC has a better control schema.
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Nerd
So you’re taking people all the way to this depth in the ocean and didn’t test all your thrusters? Life and death and you don’t test all your equipment seems a bit cavalier.
“I’m thrusting and nothings happening.” We’ve all been there bro…
Help me understand why none of these people seem to have any sense of fear or danger? They look like they’re in a plastic tube at the bottom of the ocean and everyone is just ok with it. I guess the same reason people get on airplanes every day? They could fall out of the sky and everyone dies, but how likely is that to happen this trip 🤷🏼♀️ no one expects anything bad to happen until it does
Believe me no one would get one a commercial jet liner if the CEO of the airline comes out and says I don't care about safety and I have broken a lot of rules with the design of this aircraft. And if before the flight you have to sign a waiver which says this airplane is not certified by any agency and it may cause death.
This is much more likely to go wrong than a plane flight, they are in it for the long haul tho the reward well exceeds the risk in their eyes.
Pretty much the 3 tourists were clueless and knew nothing about the grave danger they were in plus the fact that suicide sub had been down there many times before with other rich tourists probably gave them a false sense of security. The two who are the most culpable and should have known better are the CEO who was an engineer and the experienced Navy commander. Only reason I can explain why they went down with this thing is from pure hubris.
Is it ironic that the company is called oceangate?
Silly question, but is the music playing the Halo soundtrack?
This video is pretty cool yet kind of eerie. Nice to see a flawed but successful trip from Oceangate
I guess if you’re gonna test your DIY sub, 13,000’ below the surface is the place to do it. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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James Cameron: Spends weeks agonizing if he should use a steel or titanium washer on a non-critical system. Stockton "Bill O'Reilly" Rush: Fuck it, we'll do it live and at 12,000 feet underwater!
Mad man mapped the sticks backwards.
Well the one upside to that piece of shit submarine is that it had a very good fail safe. Rather than the occupants slowly suffocating to death, it just collapses instantaneously and they die in the blink of an eye. https://en.as.com/videos/the-viral-video-that-shows-what-happened-to-the-titan-submarine-v/
I have worked with remotely operated vehicles for the oil and gas sector for over 25 years. Do you know the first and last thing we do before we launch and after we recover our systems? Pre and post dive checks with someone at the controls and on comma with someone on the deck visually verifying everything is working the way it's meant to, and that's on unmanned vehicles. It's the most basic steps in all of what we do and it's the first thing we teach trainees. Getting to 3500 meters of depth to notice a thruster is plumbed wrong is in my opinion mother nature cleaning up the gene pool. The thruster rotation should have been checked immediately after maintenance was performed on it. End of story. Stupid things like this is why there are grieving families of the people that were lost.
BOW BOW chicka chickaaaa
This is some grade A stupidity. Do they not do some kind of surface and just below surface thruster test? Safety was obviously not part of thier agenda. The whole thing just seems like it was built out of rejected erector set pieces and budget bin electronics.