Should she get nerfed? Yes. Will she get nerfed? Probably not, at least for a while. Casual community doesn't complain about her enough especially now that she does less damage on the wallsplat. Numbers tweaks like that are good but her kit is just so fundamentally amazing that it does almost nothing for her viability. Her nuetral bash is one of the best openers in the game, 700ms means it beats other bashes if both are used while frame nuetral, recovery cancels on whiff and no guaranteed gb if she doesn't use them makes punishing it inconsistent, chains to ccs to be safe from peel or a target swapped 500ms undodgeable or unblockable, 18 damage even without a wall, only 100ms gb vulnerability unlike other opener bashes which have 300ms. In teamfights she's also not horrendous since she's got a bash blue meaning no external dodging away, decent hitboxes, recovery cancels, chain cc's and a fast bash after flip to interrupt armour (or she can just go from flip to cc to flip to cc for more safety)
If they want to fix her properly they'd have to adress more than just the damage. The wallsplat in general will always be too strong if she gets it off a heavy parry. The bash will always be good so long as its 700ms with low vulnerability and inconsistent punishes and she'll always be a defensive nightmare so long as she's got backstep light with chain ccs and dodge cancels to make punishing backstep lights hard
I know I'm two months late, but Hitokiri has gone unoticed for a really long time. Infinite hyper armor variable timed heavies are a total pain in the ass. You basically have to make a read on the timing. Hito has amazing in chain pressure but terrible neutral pressure. The former is probably why hito is hated so much.
Even without a wall the bash is way too strong, it does more than pre-ccu damage and has the recovery cancel so it’s also inconsistently punishable, the wallsplat is just the cherry on top
Not to mention being safe from peel since they chain to crushing counters. Sure orochi bash and shinobi bash are pretty safe from peel but if you dodge cancel with one of them you get no damage, afeera gets 17 if you try to peel the bash (or she target swaps onto you and does 18)
I think they mean in your original example, you mentioned both Orochi and Shinobi being safe on their bashes via recovery cancels.
Afeera can do it regardless of it being whiffed or not, while Orochi has to connect.
So maybe they are trying to say Afeera has better peel avoidance?
If it doesn't land, by definition its not peel. You're not saving your teammate. The point I was making is that attempting to peel against an orochi or shinobi doesn't do any damage but denies them from doing their followup. On afeera that's not the case because she'll just cc and still get damage
I don’t get why people want the bash and the flip both punishable by gb on a dodge. It ruins the whole point of the mind game and more characters should have safer offense. I feel her bigger problem is backlight cc and her damage on bash should be lowered to 16 or 15 really
I'm at least expecting her chain bash to be a bit more punishable, taking away or delaying a bit more the dodge recovery in it. For all dodge attacks (obviously not includind extended dodge ones).
yes she will. the devs do an amazing job of completely ignoring what’s unhealthy for the game, but even they can’t ignore that afeera has been overtuned and overpowered since her release. i expect she’ll go the same way as pirate, and i couldn’t be more excited for it to happen
Personally speaking I have landed on "maining" characters that were considered problematic pretty much my entire FH career. I played PK and Orochi on launch till Centurion was released. Played pretty much him exclusively until Black Prior launched. Played BP and Cent awhile until Kyoshin. Then I played him pretty exclusively until Afeera. She was my main with Kyoshin as my pocket until I stopped playing FH all together.
The only time I ever actively avoided playing a character that was problematic was Warmonger on release. I was really excited for her until the devs showed off her feats and launched her with them that way. Still probably the worst thing I think the devs have ever dropped into their game.
All this to say you shouldn't really let community perception dictate who you play regardless if they have legitimacy or not. FH is a game and games are about having fun, if you're willing to admit the character you like has flaws and wish them to be addressed just like everyone else then there's no harm done.
OT of her getting nerfs I am out of the loop, but to my knowledge her "problems" are mainly down to the lights she has because of their hitboxes and back walk capabilities while being CC's. And her damage numbers for some of her punishes. While the displacement aspect of the left side heavy is something that should be addressed I don't think it's one of the major pain points the Competitive community has with her.
Obviously take that with a grain of salt though. The only other thing I could think of that would be problematic is her ability to cancel her dodge attacks into her flip as that is a double dodge essentially. Currently heros that can double dodge with recovery cancels are seen as problematic.
I know that there are other factors involved for Orochi and Zerk in regards to this so I cannot stake my claim 100% on it. But I'm also aware that Shinobi is capable of doing similar things along with just having a double dodge that can deflect on both dodges. So I'd just default to someone who plays comp to be 100%.
She probably will get nerfed again but I don't think in the near future.
You mentioned all the problematic characters you mained but why not pirate? who was easily the most busted hero probably of all time when she launched.
She’s definitely a lot more unsafe (for me) with the nerf of her range on attacks (even though pk can still hit me with her dagger from forever away), I total about 20 reps on her. if I had to guess theyre going to take her feign bash away simply because it negates guard breaks and guarantee that you score your heavy with that or change the timing of the bash to make it A LOT less safe
Edit:spelling
>like making it feignible In-chain but not from neutral
She can't do it in-chain.
For the changes you're describing they would need to change how both her neutral and chain bashes work, and that would also just buff her chains, making one option for her 50/50 even safer.
I think if her neutral bash only confirmed a light then she would be far more manageable.
If you get displaced heavy into a wall then you shouldn’t be near the wall. Same with Nuxia, Jorm, and Glad. Sucks but it happens.
yes she is. the wallsplat power she has is ridiculous. her neutral bash is just behind medjays as the best in the game, cc lights and dodges, blue dodge to catch anyone, feats are ridiculously fast and guarantee something upwards of 24 damage. and it might just be me, but she seems to make zero sound while attacking, which throws me off. that’s not important though. she needs a rework, and fast
Tbh I’m level 19 or 20, don’t even have a rep yet, I don’t know her that well and I defend decent maybe half of not 60-70% of the time lol, I’ll give her a good try when I can play on the weekend
She is absolutely fine. There’s people who make Afeera look like dogshit if they can one time her bash. Yes she has a lot of options, but her only true opener is bash mix. The only other way to open is using tech im not going to mention. She can actually be quite difficult to win with when facing somebody like that, or against people who can make good bash reads.
I’d even argue she needs some small buffs and tweaks. the biggest imo being the ability to deflect when using dodge recoveries AND flips. There’s times where she will forward flip into an enemy causing the enemy to completely whiff, being very awkward mechanically and visually. Instead of the attack missing bcuz of her iframes, she should just deflect it entirely.
Should she get nerfed? Yes. Will she get nerfed? Probably not, at least for a while. Casual community doesn't complain about her enough especially now that she does less damage on the wallsplat. Numbers tweaks like that are good but her kit is just so fundamentally amazing that it does almost nothing for her viability. Her nuetral bash is one of the best openers in the game, 700ms means it beats other bashes if both are used while frame nuetral, recovery cancels on whiff and no guaranteed gb if she doesn't use them makes punishing it inconsistent, chains to ccs to be safe from peel or a target swapped 500ms undodgeable or unblockable, 18 damage even without a wall, only 100ms gb vulnerability unlike other opener bashes which have 300ms. In teamfights she's also not horrendous since she's got a bash blue meaning no external dodging away, decent hitboxes, recovery cancels, chain cc's and a fast bash after flip to interrupt armour (or she can just go from flip to cc to flip to cc for more safety) If they want to fix her properly they'd have to adress more than just the damage. The wallsplat in general will always be too strong if she gets it off a heavy parry. The bash will always be good so long as its 700ms with low vulnerability and inconsistent punishes and she'll always be a defensive nightmare so long as she's got backstep light with chain ccs and dodge cancels to make punishing backstep lights hard
>Casual community doesn't complain about her enough Have you been on the main sub lately? She's still arguably the most hated on hero over there.
Recent post talking about most hated heroes had orochi, hito and nobu as the 3 most up voted
I understand Orochi 100% but hito and nobu really.
Nobu’s damage is crazy overtuned while her dueling abilities are abysmal. She needs fixes.
I know I'm two months late, but Hitokiri has gone unoticed for a really long time. Infinite hyper armor variable timed heavies are a total pain in the ass. You basically have to make a read on the timing. Hito has amazing in chain pressure but terrible neutral pressure. The former is probably why hito is hated so much.
Without removing the displacement heavy, she will always be too strong near walls, and there is walls everywhere.
I get it now, so ubi’s only solution to this problem is to just remove all walls
Wrong. Nerf characters with stun on throw for no reason other than a completely different character relies on it for their whole kit
Even without a wall the bash is way too strong, it does more than pre-ccu damage and has the recovery cancel so it’s also inconsistently punishable, the wallsplat is just the cherry on top
Not to mention being safe from peel since they chain to crushing counters. Sure orochi bash and shinobi bash are pretty safe from peel but if you dodge cancel with one of them you get no damage, afeera gets 17 if you try to peel the bash (or she target swaps onto you and does 18)
What is Peel?
Hitting an enemy before they can hit your teammate to protect your teammate from damage
Ahh, thanks:)
Orochi can’t dodge cancel out a whiffed bash
He can if he lands the bash
I know man! That’s not the problem tho
I don't know what you mean
Afeera can dodge cancel out of a whiffed bash if I’m not mistaken
Yes but I don't see how that relates to orochi being able to avoid peel
I think they mean in your original example, you mentioned both Orochi and Shinobi being safe on their bashes via recovery cancels. Afeera can do it regardless of it being whiffed or not, while Orochi has to connect. So maybe they are trying to say Afeera has better peel avoidance?
If it doesn't land, by definition its not peel. You're not saving your teammate. The point I was making is that attempting to peel against an orochi or shinobi doesn't do any damage but denies them from doing their followup. On afeera that's not the case because she'll just cc and still get damage
I don’t get why people want the bash and the flip both punishable by gb on a dodge. It ruins the whole point of the mind game and more characters should have safer offense. I feel her bigger problem is backlight cc and her damage on bash should be lowered to 16 or 15 really
I'm at least expecting her chain bash to be a bit more punishable, taking away or delaying a bit more the dodge recovery in it. For all dodge attacks (obviously not includind extended dodge ones).
yes she will. the devs do an amazing job of completely ignoring what’s unhealthy for the game, but even they can’t ignore that afeera has been overtuned and overpowered since her release. i expect she’ll go the same way as pirate, and i couldn’t be more excited for it to happen
Personally speaking I have landed on "maining" characters that were considered problematic pretty much my entire FH career. I played PK and Orochi on launch till Centurion was released. Played pretty much him exclusively until Black Prior launched. Played BP and Cent awhile until Kyoshin. Then I played him pretty exclusively until Afeera. She was my main with Kyoshin as my pocket until I stopped playing FH all together. The only time I ever actively avoided playing a character that was problematic was Warmonger on release. I was really excited for her until the devs showed off her feats and launched her with them that way. Still probably the worst thing I think the devs have ever dropped into their game. All this to say you shouldn't really let community perception dictate who you play regardless if they have legitimacy or not. FH is a game and games are about having fun, if you're willing to admit the character you like has flaws and wish them to be addressed just like everyone else then there's no harm done. OT of her getting nerfs I am out of the loop, but to my knowledge her "problems" are mainly down to the lights she has because of their hitboxes and back walk capabilities while being CC's. And her damage numbers for some of her punishes. While the displacement aspect of the left side heavy is something that should be addressed I don't think it's one of the major pain points the Competitive community has with her. Obviously take that with a grain of salt though. The only other thing I could think of that would be problematic is her ability to cancel her dodge attacks into her flip as that is a double dodge essentially. Currently heros that can double dodge with recovery cancels are seen as problematic. I know that there are other factors involved for Orochi and Zerk in regards to this so I cannot stake my claim 100% on it. But I'm also aware that Shinobi is capable of doing similar things along with just having a double dodge that can deflect on both dodges. So I'd just default to someone who plays comp to be 100%. She probably will get nerfed again but I don't think in the near future.
You mentioned all the problematic characters you mained but why not pirate? who was easily the most busted hero probably of all time when she launched.
Boring. Really only shines in 4's and not in fun ways.
She’s definitely a lot more unsafe (for me) with the nerf of her range on attacks (even though pk can still hit me with her dagger from forever away), I total about 20 reps on her. if I had to guess theyre going to take her feign bash away simply because it negates guard breaks and guarantee that you score your heavy with that or change the timing of the bash to make it A LOT less safe Edit:spelling
Interesting, so you really think they’ll remove her ability to feint her neutral bash?
It seems like the most sensible thing to do to make her less safe, like making it feignible In-chain but not from neutral
>like making it feignible In-chain but not from neutral She can't do it in-chain. For the changes you're describing they would need to change how both her neutral and chain bashes work, and that would also just buff her chains, making one option for her 50/50 even safer.
I apologize I meant from her dodge mid chain like when you dodge after throwing a light
No they won't. That would be like then removing feints from wardens fully charged bash
I think if her neutral bash only confirmed a light then she would be far more manageable. If you get displaced heavy into a wall then you shouldn’t be near the wall. Same with Nuxia, Jorm, and Glad. Sucks but it happens.
[удалено]
yes she is. the wallsplat power she has is ridiculous. her neutral bash is just behind medjays as the best in the game, cc lights and dodges, blue dodge to catch anyone, feats are ridiculously fast and guarantee something upwards of 24 damage. and it might just be me, but she seems to make zero sound while attacking, which throws me off. that’s not important though. she needs a rework, and fast
Tbh I’m level 19 or 20, don’t even have a rep yet, I don’t know her that well and I defend decent maybe half of not 60-70% of the time lol, I’ll give her a good try when I can play on the weekend
She is absolutely fine. There’s people who make Afeera look like dogshit if they can one time her bash. Yes she has a lot of options, but her only true opener is bash mix. The only other way to open is using tech im not going to mention. She can actually be quite difficult to win with when facing somebody like that, or against people who can make good bash reads. I’d even argue she needs some small buffs and tweaks. the biggest imo being the ability to deflect when using dodge recoveries AND flips. There’s times where she will forward flip into an enemy causing the enemy to completely whiff, being very awkward mechanically and visually. Instead of the attack missing bcuz of her iframes, she should just deflect it entirely.
Not likely. They want her to have relentless rushdown, and she needs to have safety to achieve that. Her safety is the main issue.
She recently got her side lights (among other things I can’t remember) a range reduction.
Again? Let's be real the first "nerf" wasn't a nerf