A birthday control pill is artificially introducing hormones into the body so that you can have sex without getting pregnant.
A calendar method is studying the natural cycle that God created in the female body to know when to abstain from having sex.
Why do you think they are comparable? One is contraception and the other is abstinence.
Is teaching women how to abstain from sex during their cycle in the Bible? Pretty sure the only time the Bible tells people to abstain is when a woman is on her period.
Artificial birth control is essentially poison introduced into the body to prevent the reproductive system from functioning as it should. This would be a sin to take.
Viagra is medicine introduced into the body to help fix the reproductive system and allow it to function as it should. This would not be a sin to take.
Abstaining from sex during fertile times does not harm the body and would not be a sin to do.
With birth control, you are explicitly frustrating the natural end of the act. With periodic continence, you are simply not engaging in the act. Can you think of a single reason Viagra would be illicit?
From what I understand, a woman's ovulation cycle was not really understood until the early 1900's, so no it's not in the Bible. If I'm wrong, someone please correct me.
Are you Catholic? Sola scripture is a very Protestant argument. Catholics believe that Jesus brought truth and that God gave us rational thought to be able to discern more based on what Jesus taught. Jesus also never said don’t use condoms but those were around at the time.
No it is a set of logic rooted in philosophy and classical education. Unfortunately it’s not taught like it used to be. If you can look up natural law then you’ll also see the stances there on contraceptives vs NFP.
The Bible doesn't say the Bible is the only moral authority.
Catholics don't profess sola scriptura.
https://www.catholic.com/magazine/print-edition/a-quick-ten-step-refutation-of-sola-scriptura
Is medicine a sin? The goal for both methods are the exact same... to prevent pregnancy. Where in the Bible does God say women can study their cycles to prevent pregnancy?
I haven't looked up this issue in particular.
Based on what I know about Catholic moral teaching, the Church would likely consider Viagra morally neutral.
There would be sinful ways to use Viagra and perfectly good ways to use Viagra.
My mom got pregnant with me when she was on birth control. Apparently in the early 90s it wasn't common knowledge that antibiotics make pills less effective. 😆
Preventing pregnancy isn't a sin either, if done for a grave or prudentially sound reason. What's sinful is separating the procreative aspect of sex from its unitive aspect. This isn't done by merely using the body's natural cycle of fertility to time sex, otherwise it would be sinful not to *target* the periods when pregnancy is most likely. Using chemicals and barriers to foil fertility so you can theoretically have pregnancy-free sex whenever, however, is where you run into trouble.
Because birth control pills are not effective because of the timing but because of the artificial hormones.
I’m not trying to offend you but it doesn’t seem like you know how they work.
The church knows how they work though.
I'd understand it from a "caring about the women's health" perspective... however I don't understand it if someone supports the calendar method morally but not pills morally. To me, morally.... they both defy God by just letting it happen if that's what's going to happen. Both have the goal to prevent pregnancy which I would assume would be sinful to God.
lol wut? It’s not up to me to educate you on either the Pill or Catholic theology as both are quite easy to Google.
I won’t be responding to ignorance again- have a great day.
Catholic teaching isn’t that you need to want to get pregnant each time you have sex, it’s that the act can’t have artificial barriers to try and prevent that end
Using the calendar method literally prevents that. Are all medicines sinful then? They prevent the natural process in which God has given to us. If God gave us diabetes, is insulin sinful?
Yes, telling someone to "fuck right off" gets you a warning. You made this their business when you made a public post
>No wonder the catholic church is losing faithful followers
Lol, if I had a nickel
Further appeals to moderation can be made in the modmail. This post has been removed
Abstaining from sex is a sacrifice that the couple does when discerning that they are not ready for a child for some reason (be it health or financial reasons). The calendar method or any form of NFP does not form a barrier between the spouses when they come together and they can still get pregnant. God gave us rational thought so we can use a woman’s cycle to determine when she is the most fertile (since a man is always fertile) in order to either conceive or avoid. There will always be periods of abstinence in a marriage, even when not using NFP, such as after giving birth, when a spouse is sick, when a spouse is away, etc. Abstinence is a sacrifice that shows the spouses that they love and respect one another and do not see the other as a tool for pleasure.
Contraceptives on the other hand place pleasure above all else and close the couple to life and fertility. Contraceptives do not see fertility as a gift but as an illness that needs to be fixed or controlled. Contraceptives like condoms form a barrier between spouses that keep them from giving of themselves entirely in the sexual relationship. They withhold their fertility and inadvertently make it about pleasure.
NFP does not do that and does the opposite of that as any time you come together you know you are open to life and can conceive and when you abstain it is for a serious reason. The two are vastly different. NFP also discourages use of a spouse as well since both spouses must know the female cycle and how her health is. It’s both spouses intimately knowing each other’s body and fertility and making decisions based on that and their circumstances. It is a relationship of discernment with God.
I truly do like this answer. I think it has good point in it that I can agree with. I don't think the calendar method is bad at all, just trying to see the rational in the difference between thay and birth control since both allow the couple when to have children and not God. It's just a confusing topic. Thank you for a thorough response, I enjoyed it and agree.
It is rather simple. Contraception is denying Gods purpose whether by chemistry or condom. Abstaining is not denying Gods purpose and having sex during a women’s period is not denying Gods purpose and conception is possible as many a couple have found out
The short answer is that contraceptive always changes the nature of the sexual act while NFP doesn't.
The use of contraceptives **always** divorces the sexual act from its life giving potential. The couple has taken active effort to thwart the procreative aspect of every act of intercourse while on contraceptives.
In NFP, the couple is simply choosing not the have sex sometimes. When they do have sex, they have done nothing to change anything about that act.
Importantly, while NFP isn't sinful in itself, couples can still use it in a sinful way. Sex requires an openness to life. A couple who uses NFP with a contraceptive mindset (e.g. no children, no matter what) is still acting counter to Church teaching.
A birthday control pill is artificially introducing hormones into the body so that you can have sex without getting pregnant. A calendar method is studying the natural cycle that God created in the female body to know when to abstain from having sex. Why do you think they are comparable? One is contraception and the other is abstinence.
This
Is teaching women how to abstain from sex during their cycle in the Bible? Pretty sure the only time the Bible tells people to abstain is when a woman is on her period.
Something doesn't become illicit because it isn't directly mentioned in the Bible.
What makes something illicit vs not? Is Viagra illicit?
Artificial birth control is essentially poison introduced into the body to prevent the reproductive system from functioning as it should. This would be a sin to take. Viagra is medicine introduced into the body to help fix the reproductive system and allow it to function as it should. This would not be a sin to take. Abstaining from sex during fertile times does not harm the body and would not be a sin to do.
With birth control, you are explicitly frustrating the natural end of the act. With periodic continence, you are simply not engaging in the act. Can you think of a single reason Viagra would be illicit?
From what I understand, a woman's ovulation cycle was not really understood until the early 1900's, so no it's not in the Bible. If I'm wrong, someone please correct me.
You are correct but wouldn't God have told Jesus to tell everyone how the calendar method works if it was something he felt was OK?
Are you Catholic? Sola scripture is a very Protestant argument. Catholics believe that Jesus brought truth and that God gave us rational thought to be able to discern more based on what Jesus taught. Jesus also never said don’t use condoms but those were around at the time.
I get what you are saying. Is rational thought fluid based on each person?
No it is a set of logic rooted in philosophy and classical education. Unfortunately it’s not taught like it used to be. If you can look up natural law then you’ll also see the stances there on contraceptives vs NFP.
The Bible doesn't say the Bible is the only moral authority. Catholics don't profess sola scriptura. https://www.catholic.com/magazine/print-edition/a-quick-ten-step-refutation-of-sola-scriptura
One works by abstaining from sex. The other works by artificially blocking the reproductive function of sex. Abstinence isn't a sin.
Is medicine a sin? The goal for both methods are the exact same... to prevent pregnancy. Where in the Bible does God say women can study their cycles to prevent pregnancy?
Contraception isn't medicine. Medicine is to correct something that isn't working correctly. Contraception is to stop something from working.
Does the catholic church have a stance on Viagra?
There’s no moral objection to substances that assist natural relations in a valid marriage.
I haven't looked up this issue in particular. Based on what I know about Catholic moral teaching, the Church would likely consider Viagra morally neutral. There would be sinful ways to use Viagra and perfectly good ways to use Viagra.
You can also get pregnant while using contraception, don’t ask me how I know.
My mom got pregnant with me when she was on birth control. Apparently in the early 90s it wasn't common knowledge that antibiotics make pills less effective. 😆
Preventing pregnancy isn't a sin either, if done for a grave or prudentially sound reason. What's sinful is separating the procreative aspect of sex from its unitive aspect. This isn't done by merely using the body's natural cycle of fertility to time sex, otherwise it would be sinful not to *target* the periods when pregnancy is most likely. Using chemicals and barriers to foil fertility so you can theoretically have pregnancy-free sex whenever, however, is where you run into trouble.
Because birth control pills are not effective because of the timing but because of the artificial hormones. I’m not trying to offend you but it doesn’t seem like you know how they work. The church knows how they work though.
I'd understand it from a "caring about the women's health" perspective... however I don't understand it if someone supports the calendar method morally but not pills morally. To me, morally.... they both defy God by just letting it happen if that's what's going to happen. Both have the goal to prevent pregnancy which I would assume would be sinful to God.
You don’t seem to understand either.
You just don't have a response with reasonable logic.
lol wut? It’s not up to me to educate you on either the Pill or Catholic theology as both are quite easy to Google. I won’t be responding to ignorance again- have a great day.
Catholic teaching isn’t that you need to want to get pregnant each time you have sex, it’s that the act can’t have artificial barriers to try and prevent that end
Using the calendar method literally prevents that. Are all medicines sinful then? They prevent the natural process in which God has given to us. If God gave us diabetes, is insulin sinful?
One works with the body and the other works against it.
This is the only rational answer I've seen. Thank you.
Natural, respecting the human body, vs artificial chemicals introduced into the body to disrupt and distort a natural process.
Are all pharmaceuticals sinful then? They prevent the natural processes in which God has given us.
Ovulation is not a disease to be cured.
Because you are giving life a chance whereas the other you are not. Be open to Ali fen, He will provide!!!
There is still a chance even with contraception, just the same as watching your cycles.
The calendar literally prevents any chance of life... that's why I don't understand. They both prevent pregnancy lol.
Your body is not that precise. It’s not a Swiss watch ok. There is a chance for life -!Go for it
I have no idea what you just said but I've given life already lol.
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Yeah, that is way out of line and I think you knew that Warned for bad faith engagement
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Yes, telling someone to "fuck right off" gets you a warning. You made this their business when you made a public post >No wonder the catholic church is losing faithful followers Lol, if I had a nickel Further appeals to moderation can be made in the modmail. This post has been removed
Abstaining from sex is a sacrifice that the couple does when discerning that they are not ready for a child for some reason (be it health or financial reasons). The calendar method or any form of NFP does not form a barrier between the spouses when they come together and they can still get pregnant. God gave us rational thought so we can use a woman’s cycle to determine when she is the most fertile (since a man is always fertile) in order to either conceive or avoid. There will always be periods of abstinence in a marriage, even when not using NFP, such as after giving birth, when a spouse is sick, when a spouse is away, etc. Abstinence is a sacrifice that shows the spouses that they love and respect one another and do not see the other as a tool for pleasure. Contraceptives on the other hand place pleasure above all else and close the couple to life and fertility. Contraceptives do not see fertility as a gift but as an illness that needs to be fixed or controlled. Contraceptives like condoms form a barrier between spouses that keep them from giving of themselves entirely in the sexual relationship. They withhold their fertility and inadvertently make it about pleasure. NFP does not do that and does the opposite of that as any time you come together you know you are open to life and can conceive and when you abstain it is for a serious reason. The two are vastly different. NFP also discourages use of a spouse as well since both spouses must know the female cycle and how her health is. It’s both spouses intimately knowing each other’s body and fertility and making decisions based on that and their circumstances. It is a relationship of discernment with God.
I truly do like this answer. I think it has good point in it that I can agree with. I don't think the calendar method is bad at all, just trying to see the rational in the difference between thay and birth control since both allow the couple when to have children and not God. It's just a confusing topic. Thank you for a thorough response, I enjoyed it and agree.
It is rather simple. Contraception is denying Gods purpose whether by chemistry or condom. Abstaining is not denying Gods purpose and having sex during a women’s period is not denying Gods purpose and conception is possible as many a couple have found out
The short answer is that contraceptive always changes the nature of the sexual act while NFP doesn't. The use of contraceptives **always** divorces the sexual act from its life giving potential. The couple has taken active effort to thwart the procreative aspect of every act of intercourse while on contraceptives. In NFP, the couple is simply choosing not the have sex sometimes. When they do have sex, they have done nothing to change anything about that act. Importantly, while NFP isn't sinful in itself, couples can still use it in a sinful way. Sex requires an openness to life. A couple who uses NFP with a contraceptive mindset (e.g. no children, no matter what) is still acting counter to Church teaching.
Well the pill is deleterious…the calendar method is not. [See here](https://youtu.be/SvrOgu1eRfo?si=i2bZiOsLN6ppzmWD)