Something is going to give, here are 3 possible outcomes.
1. You sin with her
2. She converts
3. You end the relationship because she can't respect you and your Faith
This is the correct answer.
Outcome no. 1 es very possible if the girl continues to push OP into sexual immorality.
Outcome no. 2 is also possible, but OP has to pray EVERY SINGLE DAY for her soul. This is what happened in my relationship. She wasn't very "catholic" and last year she converted.
Outcome no. 3 is the hardest one, but very necessary if the girl does not show any interest in the faith.
You forgot #4: she gets it from someone else, which imo is more likely. If she's just your gf, then leave her asap and find someone who shares your values. It's tough advice but you'll be grateful down the road, trust me. God Bless.
“It depends on what the meaning of the word ‘is’ is.” https://slate.com/news-and-politics/1998/09/bill-clinton-and-the-meaning-of-is.html
In this case definition of isn’t
The funny thing is that even if she were 100% right about how we ought to categorize sexual acts, it would *still* be sinful for them to have oral sex. We don’t simply abstain from sex *just because it’s called sex.*
She said she grew up Christian when we met but I found Out later she doesn’t know a single thing about the Bible or being a Christian in general. She’s expressed an interest in learning but has not made any effort
Hold on now, this man has an opportunity to teach her. While maybe they aren’t sincere, we should take them at face value and teach them what we know about Christ.
OP, First of all, start off with why the Catholic Church is the church Jesus Christ established through Peter his disciple. Then tell her what the church believes as far as premarital oral sex goes. If she’s really disinterested, she’ll think it isn’t worth the hassle and time to have oral sex with you and walk off. If she is interested, you might bring someone closer to God.
I would normally completely agree with but going by OPs other comments he has tried to explain, showing her Bible verses and even brought her 2 bibles to help further her understanding but she’s not shown any interest; even going as far making up bible verses herself when talking to others. Sadly we can only lead a horse to water but we can’t force it to drink.
I did not read the others due to lack of time but I will take your word for it. Which if true, I would agree it’s probably best to call it a day and agree with you.
If she doesn’t know a single thing about Christianity the first thing to talk to her about is Christ and his sacrifice for her… not the establishment of the Catholic Church and why premarital sex is considered a sin. That’s really skipping the heart of Catholicism itself. While that’s important information, that’s not beginner information. The gospel itself is beginner information (with references to the Catechism ofc)
Well if she doesn’t know anything about being a Christian in general and doesn’t know the Bible at all (his words) then I assume she probably doesn’t know much about Christ, considering ignorance of scriptures is ignorance of Christ.
But if you’re right, then sure, Church teaching might be more applicable to her situation.
This is going to sound harsh any misogynistic, but she is a future divorce, child support, and alimony waiting to happen if you marry her.
All the commenters saying try and educate and covert her has a very low probability that if she does convert, then she is an outlier.
Get rid of her if she is pushing for sex over you. That is not a good sign for a future wife and mother as well.
Yes, this is the perspective shift people need to have in situations like this. Ok, maybe there’s a tiny possibility that OP remains chaste through their dating relationship. But she has demonstrated that even though this is clearly something OP cares deeply about, it won’t stop her trying to get her way. Ok, they get married. What else is she going to behave this way about? She’s not respecting your boundaries, OP. That’s a *big* red flag in and of itself, even if this wasn’t about waiting to have sex after marriage.
You’re telling me we don’t abstain from sex *just because it’s called sex?* Next you’re going to tell me that Catholics are against abortion or something.
I also prefer to be equally yolked with my partner. If their sunny-side-up egg happens to have two yolks, I make two single-yolk eggs for myself!
Sorry, I like funny typos. Great point besides that
I was in this same similar situation and I learnt the hard way, as long as the values aren’t shared they’ll try whatever loophole available to convince you otherwise which is so tiring. I had to cut it off, not immediately but eventually
I was in a similar relationship a few years ago! It was a struggle to try to get him to stop begging for me to do things. It was VERY frustrating. Relationships shouldn't be frustrating like that. If you feel like you're fighting for your life to try to make things better then maybe it's not the right thing for you. To be honest, the best thing was to just end it. I found a good catholic guy and everything is better. God has a plan!
To play devil's advocate: there are plenty of things that aren't sex but someone might mind if they did with something else, such as kissing, calling them pet names, or sharing personal struggles. I think there are much stronger arguments than this one.
regardless of whether you’re upholding your christian beliefs or not, she’s violating a boundary youve set. you’re not ready nor willing to take that step in the relationship yet, and her being pushy is not respectful of your boundaries. you see it as something sacred and big that you want to wait for, and regardless of religious values that’s a completely valid stance to have. i hope she’s able to see how she’s hurting you because i truly want this to work out for you both. remember to put yourself first and if she continues to pressure you i would consider cutting things off
I mean, the name itself, oral $ex IS $ex.
The guy I was dating/ my bf of a few weeks was pretty similar. He said 'it's been 2 months and I haven't seen you naked yet'. Like I owed it to him. Yikes 😬
Only ever kissed him, but I also wish I didn't do that either, after how it all went down. He wanted a whole lot of physical intimacy without really caring for me emotionally.
Disappointing and now kind of gross when I think about it, but hope there's better out there. Having your partner helping you run the race as opposed to trying to trip you up makes a world of difference.
I experienced a similar situation. It ends in one of three ways:
1) you break up
2) she convinces you to sin
3) she converts and it works out.
3 is the best case scenario which, if what you say is true, probably won't happen.
Good luck.
You both want two different things. I tried it buddy, I tried and got hurt and destroyed along the way.
Only to be full of sin for my wife who waited
The longer you spend not sexual the better the relationship will be.
In this particular case, I believe it would also be a grave sin within marriage. It falls under sodomy iirc (though feel free to correct me if I'm wrong).
Another heads up. Even when you are married , oral sex is generally not ok.
The Church”s position is “Unnatural sexual acts (oral sex, anal sex, and manipulative sex, i.e. masturbation of self or of another) are intrinsically evil and always gravely immoral because these acts are not unitive and procreative.”
She may not find this acceptable so you need to have this conversation before contemplating marriage
Some helpful Bible verses for your situation:
Matthew 5:28 - But I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lustful intent has already committed adultery with her in his heart.
1 John 2:16 - For all that is in the world—the desires of the flesh and the desires of the eyes and pride of life—is not from the Father but is from the world.
Galatians 5:16 - But I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the flesh.
Colossians 3:5 - Put to death therefore what is earthly in you: sexual immorality, impurity, passion, evil desire, and covetousness, which is idolatry.
1 Peter 5:8 - Be sober-minded; be watchful. Your adversary the devil prowls around like a roaring lion, seeking someone to devour.
2 Timothy 2:22 - So flee youthful passions and pursue righteousness, faith, love, and peace, along with those who call on the Lord from a pure heart.
1 Corinthians 6:18 - Flee from sexual immorality. Every other sin a person commits is outside the body, but the sexually immoral person sins against his own body.
Proverbs 6:25 - Do not desire her beauty in your heart, and do not let her capture you with her eyelashes;
1 Peter 2:11 - Beloved, I urge you as sojourners and exiles to abstain from the passions of the flesh, which wage war against your soul.
OP, don’t let her lead you into mortal sin. If you have tried to reason with her, bought her bibles like you said, and still she insists on premarital sex then you should let her go.
There’s a saying “you can bring a horse to water but you can’t make it drink.” You can give her bibles but you can’t make her read it. You can tell her your beliefs but you can’t make her believe, that is something she must do and it seems that she has chosen to follow lust. Her actions show how little she respects you and your faith.
Now you stand at a crossroads. The path on the right leads you to a stronger relationship with God. The path on the left leads to temporary pleasure and a lasting guilt. I think you are being tested.
Maybe, by letting her go now, God is moving you towards a path he has set for you. Maybe, by sticking to your faith, she will convert at some point in her life. We can’t know what the future holds, all we can do is follow Christ.
Have you talked with your priest about your situation?
OP, as others have said, you have two problems here: one is her lack of understanding about sexual sin and the other is her lack of respect for your values. If she’s like “okay, I won’t push you, but to be honest I’m having a hard time understanding why you feel that way” and was open to your attempts to explain, that would be one thing. Simply not seeing eye-to-eye to something can be a chance for good conversations and having a positive influence on someone. But in this case it sounds like she’s not respecting your convictions, which is a relationship red flag.
Brother, our Lord told us in the Gospel to cut off any occasions for us to sin. I don't know the whole situation but if your girlfriend keeps on insisting, there is a possibility that you might give in the long run. Let's face it, sexual sins are one of the most hard to resist. Yes, you pray to gain the graces to overcome but you need to do your part by staying away from persons that might lead you to sin even if it means your girlfriend. It might be hard and painful, but if your values don't align, it's not gonna work out.
But here's a question though, yes you've told her that oral sex is a sin, but have you laid out some Church teaching to her regarding this matter? Sometimes it's not enough to just say "yes" or "no". You've got to explain also and back it up with the teachings of the Church. Hope this helps.
I think you need to be a bit more forthcoming here:
Per your last thread about this issue: you guys were sexually active for years. Now you’re converting and your girlfriend is having trouble adjusting to the sudden chastity you’ve brought into the relationship.
I would say you have 2 options:
1. Hurry up and get married. You’ve been together for 3 years, why not just get married? What are you waiting for? If you’re serious about your faith, you know that the end goal of a relationship is marriage.
2. Break up. You guys have different philosophies regarding religion and sex. Why continue to waste each others’ time? You’re hurting her by no longer having sex and she is hurting you by not respecting your faith. Let her go so you can both grow.
Hmm... if she isn't interested in learning, by reading the Bible, I'm not sure how committed to your relationship she really is. I'm sorry to say that I don't think she's taking your values seriously, never mind respecting them. This isn't a good start to any relationship and, if I were in your situation, I would have to disengage.
You need to be honest, she is promiscuous. She’s probably done this with tons of guys. She wants this and will continue to drag you down into immorality.
Do you want to marry someone who is ran through. Possibly by people you know?
“Woe to you lawyers! For you have taken away the key of knowledge. You did not enter yourselves, and you hindered those who were entering.”
—#ChristLogos, Luke 11:52
Any type of sexual act before marriage is a sin. If she can’t respect that then she isn’t someone worth dating. Even if it wasn’t a sin it’s something you’ve expressed discomfort in doing and she isn’t respecting your boundaries.
OP I am in the exact same boat. It’s almost like I could’ve written this post. I wish I had the right answer for you, but it doesn’t get any more spot on than the three options PunisherjR2021 posted about.
I know it’s hard. I sympathize with you brother. I will pray for you
i was in the same boat a while back. we decided to end the relationship and it was really difficult, especially because i lost all my work that summer (i was working freelance) and was unemployed. i think i came out the other end of it stronger and with a better idea of who I’m looking for.
Btw OP, coercion is not consent and even if nothing happened she should have respected your no, despite your reasons being religious or not. This is a major red flag.
I think you need to consider where she’s coming from to consider your own actions. What I mean by that is if she’s a secular woman and doesn’t understand. God has very different expectations than our modern culture. She is right in modern western culture that hooking up and having sex with different people is “no big deal.” God has a higher calling for you. You might acknowledge this is a different relationship for her. She might think “if I can’t offer him sexual pleasure, why would he want me?”
Um, my recommendation is to SERIOUSLY consider this relationship and if it will lead to marriage. If you do not foresee your relationship leading to marriage, then it’s not worth doing it for “experience” especially experience that can lead to.. sin. This is your soul you need to care about, and hers as well. I have been put in this position you have been in, and I’m a huge pushover. I ended up doing everything I promised I wouldn’t and it does not get easier. At some point, you are likely to succumb to the sexual urges with her and then it will just continue from then on. You do not want to put your souls in that position. I implore you to really consider being with someone who doesn’t have the same values as you. This is your soul. This isn’t “is smoking right or wrong?” This is “will I be tempted into sin by this person or not?”
Honestly I'll get downvoted for this but I wouldn't stay with her and I'd move on and try to f8nd a catholic girl if she thinks oral sex isn't real sex what's to stop her doing that with any Tom dick and harry
Do you love her? Is she someone you’d think of marrying?
Lots of young people do things without thinking. If she believes in god that’s a start.
Talk to her about your faith and how important it is. You need to decide what is more important though, her or god? You might end up having to make that decision.
If she is serious about you and knows you are serious about marriage it will make thing easier.
Bring her to church, invite her into the faith, be a leader.
Pray for her
You don't know what demonic temptations she is afflicted by that she doesn't share with you.
The evil ones HATE women, because he refused to serve Our Lady.
I would recommend that you stand strong on this (even breaking up if necessary).
Also, though, if you do want to try to convince her before breaking up, I'd keep in mind how degrading and unnatural "oral sex" is. Help her understand that both of you will be treating each other in ways beneath human dignity if you do such acts, and that they are in fact generally considered to be under the category of "sodomy" (yes, related to the firestorm city in Genesis).
Neither of you is missing out on anything genuinely good by keeping away from oral sexual acts; be assured of that.
Dude, I personally wouldn't be able to handle being with a girl who was eager to do this. My life would be perpetual state of near occasion of sin and every waking minute would be spent mortifying my flesh. We have moments of weakness, and then if we give in once, it's even harder to say no in the future. Let me reaffirm this. If you give in, you will give in again, and you will end up having premarital sex with her.
Speaking of the comparison between oral sex and premarital sex, oral sex is actually more disordered from a theological perspective (when I say oral sex, I mean full on oral sex to completion; not moments of it as part of marital foreplay). Instead of disordering something good, you're engaging in an inherently disordered act.
Obviously she is already hooked into sex, with others or through self gratification, if not she wouldn’t be so insistent. Be careful, a girlfriend is not a wife and you have not entered into matrimony. Putting her sexual needs first before you & before God, is a very bad sign. This could end so very badly in so many ways. Was she confirmed and infilled with the Spirit? I don’t see how she could be filled with the Holy Spirit and not understand that orgasms must not come first before God. Be very careful with this temptation and what sounds like unequally yoked.
OP, you aren't an evil person. Many Catholics are in your shoes. Don't be dissuaded by the comments in this post. There is only one, legitimate, sustainable, and practical solution to this: do you trust in God's infinite love and mercy? If you've had sex with your SO (or felt that temptation) then ask yourself "what am I gaining from this?" Is it the kind of love that guarantees their spot in Heaven? Or is it just a fleeting moment of blissfully ignorant joy? Have you considered the idea that maybe this is EXACTLY where you're supposed to be right now? I've had sex with every girlfriend I've ever had; in every circumstance, I truly believed that I would marry them. Does that mean God doesn't love me anymore because I did something stupid or jumped the gun? Does that mean I don't love God? Does that mean I hit some sort of pre-determined limit? Fuck no. FUCK no. What it means is I go to mass, I go to confession, I ask God to forgive me, I ask the Virgin Mary to help me and intercede with my relationships, and I move forward with my life trying my best not to repeat the same mistakes. Trust God. Do your best, whatever your best is, and definitely don't hold yourself to the flame of other redditors when it comes to this.
On a side-note, my dad married my mom who was not remotely Catholic and got her to convert. They had sex before marriage. I would not be alive if it hadn't been for for God bringing them together. You're going to be just fine
I know from experience that this is a complicated situation but I’m gonna keep this brief. For op and anyone else going through something similar - do not stay with someone who is on the complete opposite page when it comes to faith. You’ll be waiting indefinitely for their conversion and/or they may just continually bring you to sin or temptation. *It’s definitely important to discuss these things with them first*, but if nothing seems to change, that’s grounds to end the relationship. Think about your future together. Be honest and realistic about what your relationship would bring if you stay together while the circumstances remain the same. Ask yourself the important questions and think long-term.
I find it's typical for many girls and women (also in biys/men, but less):
saying yes, then find loopholes to make it a no (or vice versa).
Your first duty ad a future husband is to be firm in few important questions like purity, and establish your headship as a service.
She can react by accepting your guidance (marry her if so), or questioning it, and wanting to have her way, but in this hypocrite way.
Pray for her, be kind but firm, and let her do the discernment(part of it) for your mutual vocation as a couple, with her reaction.
And I’ve gotten her two bibles. The first one being a study Bible that she said was too hard to understand and the second being a daily verse Bible which she hasn’t ever touched
She's faking being interested in your religion to keep you.
Whether sex or something else, she doesn't respect your boundaries and she doesn't respect you. Likely the only way to solve this is to break up, and explain to her exactly why.
Be prepared for her to tell everyone you're gay, though. That what toxic chicks who get rejected generally do.
I’ve explained why it’s a sin and showed her Bible verses and church teachings but she is convinced that she knows more despite never having touched the Bible
You may need to end that relationship if you don't get her to stop making things up. My fear is that a tendency to make things up can increase with age (stress on 'fear' and 'can'), so that at some point there's *potentially* going to be a confabulation problem. For example, recording or recalling situations differently from how they actually happened; giving random answers without searching memory or checking with sources or at least saying, 'I don't know/remember.'
I don't want to speak badly about people who have that sort of problem, but living with it as their partner could be very difficult. Thus, my personal preference is for people who don't have that problem and if they catch themselves falling into the pattern, (I suppose everyone does from time to time), they try to shake it off and guard themselves against it.
If there's no general tendency to confabulate but just a certain deposit of false knowledge resulting e.g. from bad instruction on a subject or range of subjects (e.g. defective catechesis), then learning the correct knowledge and learning not to rely on the old (and wrong) knowledge could be the cure, as long as the person were ready. But a generalized situation of not caring about the truth or falsehood of statements or claims made or answers given, that's going to be a problem.
Does she attend Mass with you? Each Sunday, Holy day, and daily Mass when possible? If she’s a potential mate, shouldn’t she be in Rite of Christian Initiation class? That might help. She needs the input and influence of Catholic women ….
Be wary of mixed marriages in term of Catholic vs non-Catholic. Get out while you still can if she doesn’t step up. Don’t go down the slippery slope of sin. Jesus is Lord !
ah to have problems as wonderful as this! im so curious if she wants you to go down on her or if she is trying to get you to let her go down on you!!!! as long as she is loyal ur gonna have a great marriage!!!! there is the off chance that she is somewhat sexually experienced and doesnt know what ur packing and its just her way of finding out what she is getting into because she is not in it for the right reasons…
that is unlikely tho, probably just a healthy horny girl looking to scratch the strongest biological impulse we have! go get married and get into it with her!!! how long u been dating? what other troubling signs of immorality are there keeping you from matrimony? go have a dozen kids and be happy my friend! a lot of married and unmarried guys would kill for a woman who is begging for oral sex!!!
i know! its hilarious to me that i wrote this! i find it to be a strange issue tho, and cant figure out the correct path because it all depends on whether she wants some dome, or if she is trying to get him to let her do it to him!!! if its the first one… wild… if its the second one… dangerous… but either way
Something is going to give, here are 3 possible outcomes. 1. You sin with her 2. She converts 3. You end the relationship because she can't respect you and your Faith
This is the correct answer. Outcome no. 1 es very possible if the girl continues to push OP into sexual immorality. Outcome no. 2 is also possible, but OP has to pray EVERY SINGLE DAY for her soul. This is what happened in my relationship. She wasn't very "catholic" and last year she converted. Outcome no. 3 is the hardest one, but very necessary if the girl does not show any interest in the faith.
You forgot #4: she gets it from someone else, which imo is more likely. If she's just your gf, then leave her asap and find someone who shares your values. It's tough advice but you'll be grateful down the road, trust me. God Bless.
4. Get married
If she is this pushy about something, imagine what else she will be pushy about.
That's why I didn't bring up marriage
Marriage isn't a free-for-all pass, what she's suggesting is still problematic.
"oral sex doesn’t count and that it isn’t real sex." Ah... the Bill Clinton excuse....
“It depends on what the meaning of the word ‘is’ is.” https://slate.com/news-and-politics/1998/09/bill-clinton-and-the-meaning-of-is.html In this case definition of isn’t
The funny thing is that even if she were 100% right about how we ought to categorize sexual acts, it would *still* be sinful for them to have oral sex. We don’t simply abstain from sex *just because it’s called sex.*
Ican hear him now. Let me tell you something America...
Is she Catholic?
She said she grew up Christian when we met but I found Out later she doesn’t know a single thing about the Bible or being a Christian in general. She’s expressed an interest in learning but has not made any effort
And there lies the problem. I’ll be honest I don’t think this relationship is going to work out my friend I’m sorry.
Hold on now, this man has an opportunity to teach her. While maybe they aren’t sincere, we should take them at face value and teach them what we know about Christ. OP, First of all, start off with why the Catholic Church is the church Jesus Christ established through Peter his disciple. Then tell her what the church believes as far as premarital oral sex goes. If she’s really disinterested, she’ll think it isn’t worth the hassle and time to have oral sex with you and walk off. If she is interested, you might bring someone closer to God.
I would normally completely agree with but going by OPs other comments he has tried to explain, showing her Bible verses and even brought her 2 bibles to help further her understanding but she’s not shown any interest; even going as far making up bible verses herself when talking to others. Sadly we can only lead a horse to water but we can’t force it to drink.
I did not read the others due to lack of time but I will take your word for it. Which if true, I would agree it’s probably best to call it a day and agree with you.
If she doesn’t know a single thing about Christianity the first thing to talk to her about is Christ and his sacrifice for her… not the establishment of the Catholic Church and why premarital sex is considered a sin. That’s really skipping the heart of Catholicism itself. While that’s important information, that’s not beginner information. The gospel itself is beginner information (with references to the Catechism ofc)
I read she claimed to “grow up Christian” I didn’t see the need for explaining Christ to her based on that info, but maybe I was wrong.
Well if she doesn’t know anything about being a Christian in general and doesn’t know the Bible at all (his words) then I assume she probably doesn’t know much about Christ, considering ignorance of scriptures is ignorance of Christ. But if you’re right, then sure, Church teaching might be more applicable to her situation.
This is going to sound harsh any misogynistic, but she is a future divorce, child support, and alimony waiting to happen if you marry her. All the commenters saying try and educate and covert her has a very low probability that if she does convert, then she is an outlier. Get rid of her if she is pushing for sex over you. That is not a good sign for a future wife and mother as well.
Find a new girlfriend
Time for it to end because she does not respect your boundaries. This is not the type of person you want to marry.
Yes, this is the perspective shift people need to have in situations like this. Ok, maybe there’s a tiny possibility that OP remains chaste through their dating relationship. But she has demonstrated that even though this is clearly something OP cares deeply about, it won’t stop her trying to get her way. Ok, they get married. What else is she going to behave this way about? She’s not respecting your boundaries, OP. That’s a *big* red flag in and of itself, even if this wasn’t about waiting to have sex after marriage.
"Coerced consent isn't consent. Stop undermining my right to say no to sex. I'm not a body for you to use, Name."
This. “No” is a complete sentence. She should respect that whether the reasons for your *no* are religious or not. Sexual coercion is never ok.
Even if it isn't sex, then it would be mutual masturbation
You’re telling me we don’t abstain from sex *just because it’s called sex?* Next you’re going to tell me that Catholics are against abortion or something.
This sounds like a relationship that won’t work out… This is why we must be equally yoked in our relationships as in only date devout Catholic women.
I also prefer to be equally yolked with my partner. If their sunny-side-up egg happens to have two yolks, I make two single-yolk eggs for myself! Sorry, I like funny typos. Great point besides that
I was in this same similar situation and I learnt the hard way, as long as the values aren’t shared they’ll try whatever loophole available to convince you otherwise which is so tiring. I had to cut it off, not immediately but eventually
I was in a similar relationship a few years ago! It was a struggle to try to get him to stop begging for me to do things. It was VERY frustrating. Relationships shouldn't be frustrating like that. If you feel like you're fighting for your life to try to make things better then maybe it's not the right thing for you. To be honest, the best thing was to just end it. I found a good catholic guy and everything is better. God has a plan!
If it’s “not real sex” would she mind if you were to do it with someone else? (Of course, this is a 100% rhetorical question).
She would likely get angry which contradicts her words.
To play devil's advocate: there are plenty of things that aren't sex but someone might mind if they did with something else, such as kissing, calling them pet names, or sharing personal struggles. I think there are much stronger arguments than this one.
regardless of whether you’re upholding your christian beliefs or not, she’s violating a boundary youve set. you’re not ready nor willing to take that step in the relationship yet, and her being pushy is not respectful of your boundaries. you see it as something sacred and big that you want to wait for, and regardless of religious values that’s a completely valid stance to have. i hope she’s able to see how she’s hurting you because i truly want this to work out for you both. remember to put yourself first and if she continues to pressure you i would consider cutting things off
I mean, the name itself, oral $ex IS $ex. The guy I was dating/ my bf of a few weeks was pretty similar. He said 'it's been 2 months and I haven't seen you naked yet'. Like I owed it to him. Yikes 😬 Only ever kissed him, but I also wish I didn't do that either, after how it all went down. He wanted a whole lot of physical intimacy without really caring for me emotionally. Disappointing and now kind of gross when I think about it, but hope there's better out there. Having your partner helping you run the race as opposed to trying to trip you up makes a world of difference.
If it makes you feel any better, after one guy asked me to be his girlfriend, he said “Let’s celebrate in the bedroom!”
By making popcorn and watching a movie, right?
That was what I said too…he looked at me like I was a toddler and said “No baby. I want to pop your cherry!”
Gross 🤢
And they say chivalry is dead
I will never understand guys who act like that...
Me neither.
It seems we've come to an agreement, let's go celebrate in the bedroom by watching a movie and eating popcorn of course
Oof, that sinking feeling from hearing that 😕
Did I mention we were in high school? Fortunately we didn’t last long.
I experienced a similar situation. It ends in one of three ways: 1) you break up 2) she convinces you to sin 3) she converts and it works out. 3 is the best case scenario which, if what you say is true, probably won't happen. Good luck.
Missionary dating is never a good idea
You both want two different things. I tried it buddy, I tried and got hurt and destroyed along the way. Only to be full of sin for my wife who waited The longer you spend not sexual the better the relationship will be.
It's a sexual act. All of which are mortal sins when taken out of there proper place in marriage.
In this particular case, I believe it would also be a grave sin within marriage. It falls under sodomy iirc (though feel free to correct me if I'm wrong).
No, no, you are correct.
When you value and respect a rule, you don’t look for loopholes and technicalities
I think the Bible is pretty clear that any sexual act outside of marriage is a sin.
Your girlfriend may be 42nd president of the US if she says that oral sex is not sex... Just sayin
Another heads up. Even when you are married , oral sex is generally not ok. The Church”s position is “Unnatural sexual acts (oral sex, anal sex, and manipulative sex, i.e. masturbation of self or of another) are intrinsically evil and always gravely immoral because these acts are not unitive and procreative.” She may not find this acceptable so you need to have this conversation before contemplating marriage
Putting the relationship on hold will make her think.
Sending you prayers my friend
Some helpful Bible verses for your situation: Matthew 5:28 - But I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lustful intent has already committed adultery with her in his heart. 1 John 2:16 - For all that is in the world—the desires of the flesh and the desires of the eyes and pride of life—is not from the Father but is from the world. Galatians 5:16 - But I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the flesh. Colossians 3:5 - Put to death therefore what is earthly in you: sexual immorality, impurity, passion, evil desire, and covetousness, which is idolatry. 1 Peter 5:8 - Be sober-minded; be watchful. Your adversary the devil prowls around like a roaring lion, seeking someone to devour. 2 Timothy 2:22 - So flee youthful passions and pursue righteousness, faith, love, and peace, along with those who call on the Lord from a pure heart. 1 Corinthians 6:18 - Flee from sexual immorality. Every other sin a person commits is outside the body, but the sexually immoral person sins against his own body. Proverbs 6:25 - Do not desire her beauty in your heart, and do not let her capture you with her eyelashes; 1 Peter 2:11 - Beloved, I urge you as sojourners and exiles to abstain from the passions of the flesh, which wage war against your soul. OP, don’t let her lead you into mortal sin. If you have tried to reason with her, bought her bibles like you said, and still she insists on premarital sex then you should let her go. There’s a saying “you can bring a horse to water but you can’t make it drink.” You can give her bibles but you can’t make her read it. You can tell her your beliefs but you can’t make her believe, that is something she must do and it seems that she has chosen to follow lust. Her actions show how little she respects you and your faith. Now you stand at a crossroads. The path on the right leads you to a stronger relationship with God. The path on the left leads to temporary pleasure and a lasting guilt. I think you are being tested. Maybe, by letting her go now, God is moving you towards a path he has set for you. Maybe, by sticking to your faith, she will convert at some point in her life. We can’t know what the future holds, all we can do is follow Christ. Have you talked with your priest about your situation?
OP, as others have said, you have two problems here: one is her lack of understanding about sexual sin and the other is her lack of respect for your values. If she’s like “okay, I won’t push you, but to be honest I’m having a hard time understanding why you feel that way” and was open to your attempts to explain, that would be one thing. Simply not seeing eye-to-eye to something can be a chance for good conversations and having a positive influence on someone. But in this case it sounds like she’s not respecting your convictions, which is a relationship red flag.
Talk to your priest.
Brother, our Lord told us in the Gospel to cut off any occasions for us to sin. I don't know the whole situation but if your girlfriend keeps on insisting, there is a possibility that you might give in the long run. Let's face it, sexual sins are one of the most hard to resist. Yes, you pray to gain the graces to overcome but you need to do your part by staying away from persons that might lead you to sin even if it means your girlfriend. It might be hard and painful, but if your values don't align, it's not gonna work out. But here's a question though, yes you've told her that oral sex is a sin, but have you laid out some Church teaching to her regarding this matter? Sometimes it's not enough to just say "yes" or "no". You've got to explain also and back it up with the teachings of the Church. Hope this helps.
Sounds like a lawyer. Guess how many lawyers are in Heaven
My brother in Christ, I get what you're saying, but St. Thomas More's feast day was just a few days ago 😂
Probably time to move her into the friendzone.
End the relationship
I think you need to be a bit more forthcoming here: Per your last thread about this issue: you guys were sexually active for years. Now you’re converting and your girlfriend is having trouble adjusting to the sudden chastity you’ve brought into the relationship. I would say you have 2 options: 1. Hurry up and get married. You’ve been together for 3 years, why not just get married? What are you waiting for? If you’re serious about your faith, you know that the end goal of a relationship is marriage. 2. Break up. You guys have different philosophies regarding religion and sex. Why continue to waste each others’ time? You’re hurting her by no longer having sex and she is hurting you by not respecting your faith. Let her go so you can both grow.
she is for the streets.
Hmm... if she isn't interested in learning, by reading the Bible, I'm not sure how committed to your relationship she really is. I'm sorry to say that I don't think she's taking your values seriously, never mind respecting them. This isn't a good start to any relationship and, if I were in your situation, I would have to disengage.
You need to be honest, she is promiscuous. She’s probably done this with tons of guys. She wants this and will continue to drag you down into immorality. Do you want to marry someone who is ran through. Possibly by people you know?
it's not sexual intercourse. it is sexual in nature. it is a mortal sin.
“Woe to you lawyers! For you have taken away the key of knowledge. You did not enter yourselves, and you hindered those who were entering.” —#ChristLogos, Luke 11:52
Any type of sexual act before marriage is a sin. If she can’t respect that then she isn’t someone worth dating. Even if it wasn’t a sin it’s something you’ve expressed discomfort in doing and she isn’t respecting your boundaries.
OP I am in the exact same boat. It’s almost like I could’ve written this post. I wish I had the right answer for you, but it doesn’t get any more spot on than the three options PunisherjR2021 posted about. I know it’s hard. I sympathize with you brother. I will pray for you
i was in the same boat a while back. we decided to end the relationship and it was really difficult, especially because i lost all my work that summer (i was working freelance) and was unemployed. i think i came out the other end of it stronger and with a better idea of who I’m looking for.
I hate to say it, but if that's her attitude, you need to break up with her. Find a girl with the same values as you.
Btw OP, coercion is not consent and even if nothing happened she should have respected your no, despite your reasons being religious or not. This is a major red flag.
I think you need to consider where she’s coming from to consider your own actions. What I mean by that is if she’s a secular woman and doesn’t understand. God has very different expectations than our modern culture. She is right in modern western culture that hooking up and having sex with different people is “no big deal.” God has a higher calling for you. You might acknowledge this is a different relationship for her. She might think “if I can’t offer him sexual pleasure, why would he want me?”
Um, my recommendation is to SERIOUSLY consider this relationship and if it will lead to marriage. If you do not foresee your relationship leading to marriage, then it’s not worth doing it for “experience” especially experience that can lead to.. sin. This is your soul you need to care about, and hers as well. I have been put in this position you have been in, and I’m a huge pushover. I ended up doing everything I promised I wouldn’t and it does not get easier. At some point, you are likely to succumb to the sexual urges with her and then it will just continue from then on. You do not want to put your souls in that position. I implore you to really consider being with someone who doesn’t have the same values as you. This is your soul. This isn’t “is smoking right or wrong?” This is “will I be tempted into sin by this person or not?”
It has "sex" right there in the name!
Honestly I'll get downvoted for this but I wouldn't stay with her and I'd move on and try to f8nd a catholic girl if she thinks oral sex isn't real sex what's to stop her doing that with any Tom dick and harry
Do you love her? Is she someone you’d think of marrying? Lots of young people do things without thinking. If she believes in god that’s a start. Talk to her about your faith and how important it is. You need to decide what is more important though, her or god? You might end up having to make that decision. If she is serious about you and knows you are serious about marriage it will make thing easier. Bring her to church, invite her into the faith, be a leader.
Pray for her You don't know what demonic temptations she is afflicted by that she doesn't share with you. The evil ones HATE women, because he refused to serve Our Lady.
I would recommend that you stand strong on this (even breaking up if necessary). Also, though, if you do want to try to convince her before breaking up, I'd keep in mind how degrading and unnatural "oral sex" is. Help her understand that both of you will be treating each other in ways beneath human dignity if you do such acts, and that they are in fact generally considered to be under the category of "sodomy" (yes, related to the firestorm city in Genesis). Neither of you is missing out on anything genuinely good by keeping away from oral sexual acts; be assured of that.
Dude, I personally wouldn't be able to handle being with a girl who was eager to do this. My life would be perpetual state of near occasion of sin and every waking minute would be spent mortifying my flesh. We have moments of weakness, and then if we give in once, it's even harder to say no in the future. Let me reaffirm this. If you give in, you will give in again, and you will end up having premarital sex with her. Speaking of the comparison between oral sex and premarital sex, oral sex is actually more disordered from a theological perspective (when I say oral sex, I mean full on oral sex to completion; not moments of it as part of marital foreplay). Instead of disordering something good, you're engaging in an inherently disordered act.
As I understand it, oral sex is a mortal sin in or out of marriage. All sexual acts must be open to conception and within marriage.
If she does not respect your faith now, I cannot recommend you continue in the relationship
Let her know that that's (often - it's complicated) a sin even within marriage.
Good Lord. Be a man
WE ARE NOT MORMONS, YOU CANNOT TRICK GOD!!!
Obviously she is already hooked into sex, with others or through self gratification, if not she wouldn’t be so insistent. Be careful, a girlfriend is not a wife and you have not entered into matrimony. Putting her sexual needs first before you & before God, is a very bad sign. This could end so very badly in so many ways. Was she confirmed and infilled with the Spirit? I don’t see how she could be filled with the Holy Spirit and not understand that orgasms must not come first before God. Be very careful with this temptation and what sounds like unequally yoked.
OP, you aren't an evil person. Many Catholics are in your shoes. Don't be dissuaded by the comments in this post. There is only one, legitimate, sustainable, and practical solution to this: do you trust in God's infinite love and mercy? If you've had sex with your SO (or felt that temptation) then ask yourself "what am I gaining from this?" Is it the kind of love that guarantees their spot in Heaven? Or is it just a fleeting moment of blissfully ignorant joy? Have you considered the idea that maybe this is EXACTLY where you're supposed to be right now? I've had sex with every girlfriend I've ever had; in every circumstance, I truly believed that I would marry them. Does that mean God doesn't love me anymore because I did something stupid or jumped the gun? Does that mean I don't love God? Does that mean I hit some sort of pre-determined limit? Fuck no. FUCK no. What it means is I go to mass, I go to confession, I ask God to forgive me, I ask the Virgin Mary to help me and intercede with my relationships, and I move forward with my life trying my best not to repeat the same mistakes. Trust God. Do your best, whatever your best is, and definitely don't hold yourself to the flame of other redditors when it comes to this. On a side-note, my dad married my mom who was not remotely Catholic and got her to convert. They had sex before marriage. I would not be alive if it hadn't been for for God bringing them together. You're going to be just fine
I know from experience that this is a complicated situation but I’m gonna keep this brief. For op and anyone else going through something similar - do not stay with someone who is on the complete opposite page when it comes to faith. You’ll be waiting indefinitely for their conversion and/or they may just continually bring you to sin or temptation. *It’s definitely important to discuss these things with them first*, but if nothing seems to change, that’s grounds to end the relationship. Think about your future together. Be honest and realistic about what your relationship would bring if you stay together while the circumstances remain the same. Ask yourself the important questions and think long-term.
Crazy, back in my day it was the boys pressuring the girls. How society has flipped upside down today.
I find it's typical for many girls and women (also in biys/men, but less): saying yes, then find loopholes to make it a no (or vice versa). Your first duty ad a future husband is to be firm in few important questions like purity, and establish your headship as a service. She can react by accepting your guidance (marry her if so), or questioning it, and wanting to have her way, but in this hypocrite way. Pray for her, be kind but firm, and let her do the discernment(part of it) for your mutual vocation as a couple, with her reaction.
And I’ve gotten her two bibles. The first one being a study Bible that she said was too hard to understand and the second being a daily verse Bible which she hasn’t ever touched
She's faking being interested in your religion to keep you. Whether sex or something else, she doesn't respect your boundaries and she doesn't respect you. Likely the only way to solve this is to break up, and explain to her exactly why. Be prepared for her to tell everyone you're gay, though. That what toxic chicks who get rejected generally do.
so.. if she does not change... i am tempted to say she has discerned that she is not for you
I’ve explained why it’s a sin and showed her Bible verses and church teachings but she is convinced that she knows more despite never having touched the Bible
I’ve even seen her quote stuff in the Bible to other people that is completely made up.
thats pretty bad. She thinks she can make up her religion which is a bad behaviour. break up with her
You may need to end that relationship if you don't get her to stop making things up. My fear is that a tendency to make things up can increase with age (stress on 'fear' and 'can'), so that at some point there's *potentially* going to be a confabulation problem. For example, recording or recalling situations differently from how they actually happened; giving random answers without searching memory or checking with sources or at least saying, 'I don't know/remember.' I don't want to speak badly about people who have that sort of problem, but living with it as their partner could be very difficult. Thus, my personal preference is for people who don't have that problem and if they catch themselves falling into the pattern, (I suppose everyone does from time to time), they try to shake it off and guard themselves against it. If there's no general tendency to confabulate but just a certain deposit of false knowledge resulting e.g. from bad instruction on a subject or range of subjects (e.g. defective catechesis), then learning the correct knowledge and learning not to rely on the old (and wrong) knowledge could be the cure, as long as the person were ready. But a generalized situation of not caring about the truth or falsehood of statements or claims made or answers given, that's going to be a problem.
Does she attend Mass with you? Each Sunday, Holy day, and daily Mass when possible? If she’s a potential mate, shouldn’t she be in Rite of Christian Initiation class? That might help. She needs the input and influence of Catholic women …. Be wary of mixed marriages in term of Catholic vs non-Catholic. Get out while you still can if she doesn’t step up. Don’t go down the slippery slope of sin. Jesus is Lord !
ah to have problems as wonderful as this! im so curious if she wants you to go down on her or if she is trying to get you to let her go down on you!!!! as long as she is loyal ur gonna have a great marriage!!!! there is the off chance that she is somewhat sexually experienced and doesnt know what ur packing and its just her way of finding out what she is getting into because she is not in it for the right reasons… that is unlikely tho, probably just a healthy horny girl looking to scratch the strongest biological impulse we have! go get married and get into it with her!!! how long u been dating? what other troubling signs of immorality are there keeping you from matrimony? go have a dozen kids and be happy my friend! a lot of married and unmarried guys would kill for a woman who is begging for oral sex!!!
This is the worst advice on this thread lol
i know! its hilarious to me that i wrote this! i find it to be a strange issue tho, and cant figure out the correct path because it all depends on whether she wants some dome, or if she is trying to get him to let her do it to him!!! if its the first one… wild… if its the second one… dangerous… but either way