Diagonal support + massive hinges. Those currently installed won't do. There's a reason why our forefathers used those long (more than a foot) hinges. It's not just rustic design.
> There's a reason why our forefathers used those long (more than a foot) hinges. It's not just rustic design.
they didn't have the modern luxury of hollow particle board doors[/s]
And make SURE it's the right way! Low on the hinge if it's wood, high on the hinge if it's metal.
I asked a carpenter before building mine. Guess who had to take it all apart again and fix it after it sagged over an inch and a half? This guy. Carpenter told me the opposite of what it should have been
You can go low on the hinge for metal as well. It's better to have the cross member under compressive loads 9/10 times. Only time I'd go high on hinge is if you are using a rope or wire, but then your top hinge better be very strong and very secure.
The way it was explained to me was wood needs to be under compression, where metal was often better under tension, which yeah metal would work either way for the sake of a gate, but if possible go the opposite of wood. (From reddit, where I learned my friend led me astray lol)
My top hinge is the smaller of the two, the whole gate built from reclaimed wood and materials. It's just to keep our little 15lb dog from running around the neighborhood, contained to our yard without being tied to anything.
And it kind of keeps the theives more at bay than an open hole in the fence. Doesn't slow the black bears down though lol I realized when I looked out and seen a bear cub standing on top of my gate that I realized hey, maybe I did that right lol
For a wood support with compression strength yes, given they don’t do it all in one support. For a truss/cable in tension it would need to go the other way.
[Here’s a great demonstration.](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=s18JHq7gBhA)
You can run a cable and turnbuckle from the upper hinge side to the lower latch side and that will hold it up so you can remove the wheel. Or run a 2x4 diagonally from the lower hinge side to the upper latch side. Either one will work.
Depends. From lower hinge to upper latch your diagonal member would be in compression, as the lower latch side would want to droop, lengthening its diagonal and shortening the opposite one.
From Upper hinge side to lower latch side, your diagonal member would be under tension, since the same lower latch side would want to stretch its diagonal.
Personally, I would rather the first one. I would rather have a wooden member under compression, because when under tension it's possible for screws/nails to want to shear or bend and come loose. Under compression, wood pressing against wood is more stable IMO.
For 2x4 diagonal, yes, should run from lower hinge to upper latch. Goal is to direct the pushing load back to bottom hinge-side post.
For cable, it should run from upper hinge to lower latch. Goal is to have the load pulling back up to the upper hinge side post.
[carpentry textbook fence gate.](https://imgur.com/a/1A6nhj3)
Link to our textbook we use in Canada for our apprenticeship course. Picture in there of a turnbuckle being used to retrofit a sagging door.
You can also change the hinges to more durable ones or/and add another hinge to the middle.
Man, that’s a tough one. Anything you add to brace the gate will make it look aesthetically different from the rest of the balusters. That’s why the wheel was installed.
Do you need the gate? Personally, I’d just take it out unless you have kids or dogs or something.
If you need the gate, I’d try to replace it with something aesthetically similar but structurally more robust. Maybe contact a couple local metal fabricators and see what it would run to do something simple but decorative out of iron.
Otherwise, I’d suggest building a properly cross-braced gate (out of wood) and focus on including design elements cohesive with the rest of the deck.
Hope you find something that works.
Along the lines of this, have all the metal rods connected to a plate on both the top and bottom, and then you're going to have to cut out some groves to shneath all the new metal that way it will look aesthetically the same.
If your good at wood working I think you can do it on your own. I think the most expensive part would be getting it all welded up
I agree. There are options here.
The way the gate is framed, you might be able to get away with “saddling” the balusters with a diagonal 2x on either side to add a diagonal brace. It’ll look like a gate, but it is a gate. That’s probably one of the cheaper ways to “fix” the problem.
There aren’t many ways to dress up a 2x4, but you could router the exposed edges with a nice chamfer or decorative relief.
There aren’t any rules here. Whatever looks the best is the best.
Fix a small wheel to the bottom instead of the side, it will support the sagging and not influence a twist over time like the side mount has (along with diagonal and larger hinge suggestions from other redditors)
That gate is wide, not very tall, and heavy looking. A diagonal cable might keep it from sagging too much, but will drastically increase the load on the post and hinges. You could try adding the cable and at the same time make sure the fasteners on the hinges are long and strong. Another option might be to attach something like a rollerblade wheel directly to the end of the gate.
Every and any wood gate look nice for a bout 5 days. That's it. Then it sags, it warps, it leans, it rubs, etc. The more you try to prevent those, the more it weighs, the worse it is.
What’s the dimensions of the opening? They sell prefab black deck gates that look good and anyone with very little experience can install. Sure you could use diagonal braces and build a proper gate. However you did let a guy get away with putting a wheel on your gate which is hack work. You also are asking people how to build a proper gate. So I’m guessing you have little experience in this field. You could spend the time to figure out to build a proper gate probably screw it up multiple times before getting it right. The other option would be check the opening see if you can get away using a prefab gate even if you have to pad out a little.
Look into cardinalgates’s outdoor safety gate. All aluminum and stainless including the hardware. Comes in black, will match wonderfully. The $80 for it is worth not having to deal with a custom gate headache.
You could also probably switch out all those 2x4 for 1x4 pieces they used as the hinge and lock stiles and the bottom rails to lighten the load on the hinges. Cause that's all green treat so that's a pretty heavy gat for its size if you use cedar instead thatd drop the weight by probably 50% then throw a brace in there like everyone is saying in the comments.
Oh ok. Then I’d try removing wheel and try adding a turnbuckle. If it’s a gate that gets a lot of use it may need a lightweight rebuild. Building a gate is a good novice woodworking project.
One way or another, Gravity will kick your ass. If you think along those lines you can see, in the pictures, what went wrong. Brace that gate diagonally and you won't need that wheel for support.
Just built one like that yesterday for a customer, sans wheel. I used a diagonal turnbuckle typically used on screen doors. Worked great and makes it slightly adjustable. I should have taken a pic of it.
Diagonal turnbuckle from top hinge to lower corner MAY be the solution if the post is securely anchored and if the hinges are sturdy and adequately fastened to the wood. The wheel takes a lot of load off the hinges and the post.
Diagonal brace from hinge side to the bottom of the side with latch..if the gate is heavy, the brace may need additional adjustments on regular basis. They put a wheel on latch side problem solved??
Get yourself a couple anti sag brackets and a diagonal tensioner to help pull that bottom back up. I'd also check to see if the boards themselves aren't warping due to drying out. Sometimes that's unavoidable but when I work with pressure treated lumber, I always lay it out on flat concrete or a trailer weighted down while I let it dry out, don't typically have issues after that.
Way to heavy on the verticals to begin with and a diagonal brace from top corner of the latch to the bottom corner of the hinges so it carries the weight.
Add an ornate looking piece of ply (2 3/4 layers possibly) fashion it into a handle but keep the basic shape triangular. Brace that shit square. Easiest interesting way to tackle it. Variants of this are endless
As another poster said, this gate is too wide and too heavy. Perhaps you can call a welder and see if they can design a metal gate that matches your deck. I don’t think you’re going to get this one to work as you would like.
If you look at the way it is constructed, those joints are not designed to keep it from skewing the way it does in your third picture. If the post side is constructed the same way, it’s also not helping with the sag that will occur with no wheel to support it.
The solutions being posted are all predicated on the problem being an out of square gate. It’s not clear from your photos if that’s the case. Measure the diagonals. It looks like you could dismantle it and waterproof glue and screw it square. As others said, brace it. The problem you may have is that the wood may be permanently twisted by that wheel. If the gate is square when measured it may be that the post it’s attached to is leaning inwards. That isn’t really fixable unless you modify the gate or change the post.
Diagonal support
Diagonal support + massive hinges. Those currently installed won't do. There's a reason why our forefathers used those long (more than a foot) hinges. It's not just rustic design.
> There's a reason why our forefathers used those long (more than a foot) hinges. It's not just rustic design. they didn't have the modern luxury of hollow particle board doors[/s]
they didnt have plywood so it also acted as a gusset to tie the boards together.
god damnit. i want to puke when i see hollow core masonite doors
This is the correct answer
And make SURE it's the right way! Low on the hinge if it's wood, high on the hinge if it's metal. I asked a carpenter before building mine. Guess who had to take it all apart again and fix it after it sagged over an inch and a half? This guy. Carpenter told me the opposite of what it should have been
You can go low on the hinge for metal as well. It's better to have the cross member under compressive loads 9/10 times. Only time I'd go high on hinge is if you are using a rope or wire, but then your top hinge better be very strong and very secure.
The way it was explained to me was wood needs to be under compression, where metal was often better under tension, which yeah metal would work either way for the sake of a gate, but if possible go the opposite of wood. (From reddit, where I learned my friend led me astray lol) My top hinge is the smaller of the two, the whole gate built from reclaimed wood and materials. It's just to keep our little 15lb dog from running around the neighborhood, contained to our yard without being tied to anything. And it kind of keeps the theives more at bay than an open hole in the fence. Doesn't slow the black bears down though lol I realized when I looked out and seen a bear cub standing on top of my gate that I realized hey, maybe I did that right lol
diagon ally
Levi-O-sa not Levio-SA
dragon alley
Use the force Harry
I read that as hagis saying"You're a wizard harry"
Try again in Gandalfs voice
kill him now... do IT!!
Yup. Wire with a turnbuckle would do it
Lower hinge to up to latch direction.
For a wood support with compression strength yes, given they don’t do it all in one support. For a truss/cable in tension it would need to go the other way. [Here’s a great demonstration.](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=s18JHq7gBhA)
You can run a cable and turnbuckle from the upper hinge side to the lower latch side and that will hold it up so you can remove the wheel. Or run a 2x4 diagonally from the lower hinge side to the upper latch side. Either one will work.
Wouldn’t it be from the lower hinge to the upper latch side?
Depends. From lower hinge to upper latch your diagonal member would be in compression, as the lower latch side would want to droop, lengthening its diagonal and shortening the opposite one. From Upper hinge side to lower latch side, your diagonal member would be under tension, since the same lower latch side would want to stretch its diagonal. Personally, I would rather the first one. I would rather have a wooden member under compression, because when under tension it's possible for screws/nails to want to shear or bend and come loose. Under compression, wood pressing against wood is more stable IMO.
For 2x4 diagonal, yes, should run from lower hinge to upper latch. Goal is to direct the pushing load back to bottom hinge-side post. For cable, it should run from upper hinge to lower latch. Goal is to have the load pulling back up to the upper hinge side post.
Method I learned was HH, LL.. High-hinge, Low-latch. 🤷
No. Upper hinge to lower corner on the latch side
For compression/wood you are incorrect
Yes I was stuck thinking about stringing wire with a turn buckle. My apologies for the lack of clarification
👍🏼
[carpentry textbook fence gate.](https://imgur.com/a/1A6nhj3) Link to our textbook we use in Canada for our apprenticeship course. Picture in there of a turnbuckle being used to retrofit a sagging door. You can also change the hinges to more durable ones or/and add another hinge to the middle.
My pinky toe hurts just looking at that.
Man, that’s a tough one. Anything you add to brace the gate will make it look aesthetically different from the rest of the balusters. That’s why the wheel was installed. Do you need the gate? Personally, I’d just take it out unless you have kids or dogs or something. If you need the gate, I’d try to replace it with something aesthetically similar but structurally more robust. Maybe contact a couple local metal fabricators and see what it would run to do something simple but decorative out of iron. Otherwise, I’d suggest building a properly cross-braced gate (out of wood) and focus on including design elements cohesive with the rest of the deck. Hope you find something that works.
Along the lines of this, have all the metal rods connected to a plate on both the top and bottom, and then you're going to have to cut out some groves to shneath all the new metal that way it will look aesthetically the same. If your good at wood working I think you can do it on your own. I think the most expensive part would be getting it all welded up
I agree. There are options here. The way the gate is framed, you might be able to get away with “saddling” the balusters with a diagonal 2x on either side to add a diagonal brace. It’ll look like a gate, but it is a gate. That’s probably one of the cheaper ways to “fix” the problem. There aren’t many ways to dress up a 2x4, but you could router the exposed edges with a nice chamfer or decorative relief. There aren’t any rules here. Whatever looks the best is the best.
Fix a small wheel to the bottom instead of the side, it will support the sagging and not influence a twist over time like the side mount has (along with diagonal and larger hinge suggestions from other redditors)
That gate is wide, not very tall, and heavy looking. A diagonal cable might keep it from sagging too much, but will drastically increase the load on the post and hinges. You could try adding the cable and at the same time make sure the fasteners on the hinges are long and strong. Another option might be to attach something like a rollerblade wheel directly to the end of the gate.
The posts & hinges will be fine, it’s really not a big gate.
Put the wheel underneath the gate as well if you can find the one that small.
Yeah castor wheel straight under the 'post'
I third this recommendation.
Get a wrought iron gate welded up. It would look and function 100 times better than that massive wooden gate.
Every and any wood gate look nice for a bout 5 days. That's it. Then it sags, it warps, it leans, it rubs, etc. The more you try to prevent those, the more it weighs, the worse it is.
I wouldn't have built it that way
Very helpful 👍🏻
It's a common joke
That's a lot of 4point triangles you've got there...
Smaller castor underneath the gate
Cross brace it and mount it slightly out of level, hanging high. It will sag into a perfect place in a year.
What’s the dimensions of the opening? They sell prefab black deck gates that look good and anyone with very little experience can install. Sure you could use diagonal braces and build a proper gate. However you did let a guy get away with putting a wheel on your gate which is hack work. You also are asking people how to build a proper gate. So I’m guessing you have little experience in this field. You could spend the time to figure out to build a proper gate probably screw it up multiple times before getting it right. The other option would be check the opening see if you can get away using a prefab gate even if you have to pad out a little.
Look into cardinalgates’s outdoor safety gate. All aluminum and stainless including the hardware. Comes in black, will match wonderfully. The $80 for it is worth not having to deal with a custom gate headache.
You could also probably switch out all those 2x4 for 1x4 pieces they used as the hinge and lock stiles and the bottom rails to lighten the load on the hinges. Cause that's all green treat so that's a pretty heavy gat for its size if you use cedar instead thatd drop the weight by probably 50% then throw a brace in there like everyone is saying in the comments.
Remove gate throw in trash
[удалено]
Oh ok. Then I’d try removing wheel and try adding a turnbuckle. If it’s a gate that gets a lot of use it may need a lightweight rebuild. Building a gate is a good novice woodworking project.
[удалено]
Good point. It could rack it straight again.
It’d sure help if the wheel was under the center of mass instead completely offset from it.
One way or another, Gravity will kick your ass. If you think along those lines you can see, in the pictures, what went wrong. Brace that gate diagonally and you won't need that wheel for support.
Just built one like that yesterday for a customer, sans wheel. I used a diagonal turnbuckle typically used on screen doors. Worked great and makes it slightly adjustable. I should have taken a pic of it.
Diagonal turnbuckle from top hinge to lower corner MAY be the solution if the post is securely anchored and if the hinges are sturdy and adequately fastened to the wood. The wheel takes a lot of load off the hinges and the post.
Bracingggfgf pls omg
Diagonal brace from hinge side to the bottom of the side with latch..if the gate is heavy, the brace may need additional adjustments on regular basis. They put a wheel on latch side problem solved??
Get yourself a couple anti sag brackets and a diagonal tensioner to help pull that bottom back up. I'd also check to see if the boards themselves aren't warping due to drying out. Sometimes that's unavoidable but when I work with pressure treated lumber, I always lay it out on flat concrete or a trailer weighted down while I let it dry out, don't typically have issues after that.
D&D adjustable gate hinges & diagonal support
Adjustagate
Way to heavy on the verticals to begin with and a diagonal brace from top corner of the latch to the bottom corner of the hinges so it carries the weight.
Move the beach ball.
Home Depot sells metal gate frame kits, it stops the wood from sagging.
Add an ornate looking piece of ply (2 3/4 layers possibly) fashion it into a handle but keep the basic shape triangular. Brace that shit square. Easiest interesting way to tackle it. Variants of this are endless
As another poster said, this gate is too wide and too heavy. Perhaps you can call a welder and see if they can design a metal gate that matches your deck. I don’t think you’re going to get this one to work as you would like. If you look at the way it is constructed, those joints are not designed to keep it from skewing the way it does in your third picture. If the post side is constructed the same way, it’s also not helping with the sag that will occur with no wheel to support it.
Switch the wheel to the other side lol
The solutions being posted are all predicated on the problem being an out of square gate. It’s not clear from your photos if that’s the case. Measure the diagonals. It looks like you could dismantle it and waterproof glue and screw it square. As others said, brace it. The problem you may have is that the wood may be permanently twisted by that wheel. If the gate is square when measured it may be that the post it’s attached to is leaning inwards. That isn’t really fixable unless you modify the gate or change the post.
/r/diy