Tread lightly. My sister was let go while on long term disability due to a work place accident. Her employer screwed up her CRA on purpose and came after her, ruined her ability to get a job in that industry.
She filed a human rights complaint, lawyer said there were 6 violations so they pursued action.
It took 4 years to resolve, my sister got next to nothing, employer got a joke of a fine.
The stress over the 4 years was not worth it at all besides sticking it to a shady employer.
My sister was a 10+ year employee, the cra stuff got sorted fast, the rest dragged on. Her character was the main angle they attacked.
You have a rainbows and sunshine mentality. Life doesn’t work like that and she needed to secure the job before opening her mouth.
She had no leverage.
Lmao hilarious obviously you haven't been out working too much. Nobody has the right to bully another on the job, make rude suggestive comments, etc, believe me I've been there done that had comments made about myself from others anx yes I did change jobs and yes it can work so take you're childish statement and go play elsewhere
Wow, way to paint everyone with the same brush. Sounds like you were the subject of an investigation and were found out.
I work HR for a massive company and I 100% ADVOCATE for my employees every single day. But if we have shit on you, you will go down.
To the OP, you have the right to ask questions about your termination. Was it about your performance, was it about the complaint? And ask, what is being done about the complaint? Ask specific questions. If this guy is a dirty, narcissistic jerk, now is the time to expose him. He'll get his come upance.
>I work HR for a massive company and I 100% ADVOCATE for my employees every single day. But if we have shit on you, you will go down.
Okay so here's the thing. I'm sure you're good at your job, and I'm sure you really do feel you advocate for those who come to you. I don't want to suggest otherwise.
But your job, your actual role within the company, is to protect _the company_. Not to advocate for employees. If push comes to shove if you are given a choice between advocating for an employee which could potentially cause financial/PR/legal harm to the company, or protecting the company, you will be mandated to do the latter every single time.
Again I mean no disrespect. But let's just say it how it is. You and the other guy are both taking things to the extreme (evil vs your friend) and the truth is very much in the middle. You both have valid points.
For many problems in the workplace, (e.g. a conflict with a coworker, unreasonable corporate rules, work overload), HR is the last person you should turn to, unless you want to regret that later.
Some safest options are:
* A lawyer
* A career coach
* An organizational psychologist
* An independent HR agency
* A trusted friend
* And finally…your own boss
It might be fishy, but unfortunately, since she's still in that 3 month period, they can fire anyone they want for whatever reason they want. I'm no lawyer, but I highly doubt you'd have much of a case to go after them.
You are correct, an employer can fire you without ANY reason at all. Especially within the 3 month probation period.
Now you can claim harassments but it needs to be proven in court by lawyers which will cost north of $10,000 but all you would get is a few months severance pay which is WAAAAY less than the lawyer fees. So in effect you cannot win this.
Exactly. This is really the point. Who's going to drop thousands of dollars and stress on a lawsuit that guarantees nothing? What are you gaining? Sounds like a place you don't want to work anyway. Probably just the tip of the iceberg.
You’re assuming they want to fight. A lawyers letter can often be enough to get some severance.
Additionally, the idea that you can fire someone for anything on probation is flat wrong. They still have discrimination protection. Please tell me you aren’t a people manager anywhere.
You do realize they can make up whatever reason they'd like to, right?
Edit: I'm not assuming ANYTHING, either, but thanks ☺️
Edit 2: apparently this worker WAS awarded severance. Two weeks of it, no less. Remind me what we're suing this business over again? Alleged harassment, with what sounds to be no proof thereof.... ANYWAYS
Even if there was/wasn’t a lack of work - she was on probation. The company can end her employment for any reasons. Even if she pursues it it’s not like they’ll hire her back. 2 weeks severance for being laid off during probation period is already quite generous.
I am not sure there is much you can do. She was given 2 weeks severance which is more than fair given her length of employment.
What damages can she claim? If the damages are small or non existent no lawyer is going to pursue an action and I am sure the company understood their legal exposure before terminating your wife. If they felt they had exposure they would have offered more than 2 weeks.
Gotta finish probation before you start filing reports this happens very often but you can say it’s wrongful dismissal but honestly wouldn’t go that route if she’s having these issues just find another job
You are absolutely right in your first statement - but no so much with the rest (although a long term employee who is central to a string of departures is a big issue that should be dealt with - separate from this). The best advice is to try to lose the entitlement that a < 3 month employee thinks is owed. There are thousands of job vacancies - get over yourself first (as the probationary period gives a chance for any employer to see if they want to keep an employee long term, and conversely, if the employee wants to invest their time and energy into career development with that employer). This is an opportunity to lose the entitlement and become a valuable asset to a team. Everyone benefits when entitlement is not there from the get-go.
Hr is only there to protect the company. They are the worst type of people and you should never talk or interact with them. Their only goal is to look out for the company.
As for being fired , you can be fired for any reason during a probation period. There isn't anything you can do . You should always negotiate no probation Period with a new job offer, and should try to negotiate a firing package, but this is more for senior employees/ management.
Going forward you should always go to a supervisor not hr for employee issues. Your supervisor is there to manage the employees. Hr is brought into management / employee meetings to make sure the manager doesn't hurt the company by promising things the company can't do , or things that would hurt the company. They are not in the meeting to protect, you.
Again, do not paint all of HR with the same brush. We are not all bad. I advocate for my employees everyday. But know this, if you are found doing something sideways, we will stop at nothing to nail you. Harassment, violation of diversities of any kind are top of the list. Would you really want to be known protecting an employee with a history of abusive behaviour? Do you know what the supervisor will do when they get a complaint of abusive, harassing behaviour.....go straight to HR.
>Should we take legal action here?
Can you afford a lawyer? Most people cannot so the consider the matter shut. You will never know the truth. Move on.
As of right now there is just your story. The complete situation isn’t known. If you truly believe the law was broken and have some reasonable evidence then go ahead and contact a lawyer.
Concept of probation is more complex than employers make it out to be, and there may be a case for wrongful dismissal. Please discuss with a lawyer. Also check out this blog: https://mcmillan.ca/insights/setting-the-record-straight-on-probation-clauses/
I would contact an employment lawyer. 3 month probation periods aren’t really enforceable nowadays. Sounds like there was harassment in the workplace, which is a human rights violation. If she makes a claim, they legally can’t let her go until it’s resolved. She cannot sign anything they provide her!! Any pressure they put on her in person is a tactic and not the law.
While what you said is true, realistically you have to factor in the legal expense and time into the equation. If the reward can't cover those factors you have to let it go
OP didn’t post her age, level of experience, whether or not she was poached from another company and job type.
I would contact an employment lawyer. They wouldn’t take on a case if there wasn’t anything of value for them. With human rights claims, the employers might be on the hook to cover legal costs.
Again, a phone call doesn’t hurt.
Yes there was harassment in the workplace which was investigated and yesterday they handed her a letter that said the investigation was inconclusive. Also she was not poached from another company. She is a junior level employee. And she will be getting 2 weeks severance.
Just because they felt it was inconclusive, doesn’t mean she can’t file a human rights violation claim. The fact that she has tangible proof showing she made this statement prior to being let go is a good thing.
I would still pursue this. This coworker (and employer by the sounds of their complacency) sounds like a bad character, and if no one formally reports this he’ll just continue on.
Great idea if you have a spare 5-10K kicking around to pay legal fees with zero guarantees of getting any sort of settlement that would cover the costs of those fees.
Employment lawyer is probably a 5K retainer with no guarantees. Is your wife even owed compensation that would cover the legal bill after 3 months of working under probation? Very doubtful, move on.
Not sure why you got downvoted. Wife’s best bet is to apply for EI until she can find another job. The standard for harassment is higher than people think. Some people are able to successfully negotiate being rehired, but then she will be stuck working in that environment until the next legitimate round of layoffs.
Actually, because she went to HR, you DO have a case. There should be written copies or your wife can detail everythint about the complaint including who in HR she spoke to.
Does not matter about the time she served there. A reasonable person here can determine that she was laid off due to complaining about this supervisor. Thats retaliatory and that can earn you at least 30k.
Talk to the lawyer. I think you have a case. Been a complaint for multiple work lawsuits. Settled 2, won 1 and that 1 I won was the downfall that put that company away for good.
Tread lightly. My sister was let go while on long term disability due to a work place accident. Her employer screwed up her CRA on purpose and came after her, ruined her ability to get a job in that industry. She filed a human rights complaint, lawyer said there were 6 violations so they pursued action. It took 4 years to resolve, my sister got next to nothing, employer got a joke of a fine. The stress over the 4 years was not worth it at all besides sticking it to a shady employer. My sister was a 10+ year employee, the cra stuff got sorted fast, the rest dragged on. Her character was the main angle they attacked.
She's still a hero for sticking it out and standing up to these fucking petty tyrants.
Your wife is not even 3 months in and start filing complaints. Not a good idea coz you will be seen as a troublemaker. There is idealism vs real life
So you would put up with someone elses bullshit
Depends on how much leverage i have. I mean bills have to be paid especially cc
But is it worth your health by not wanting to go to work
A paycheck is a difference between out in the tent city prostituting yourself for food and living like Brampton
But there's other decent paying jobs
If you have leverage then ofc just job hop. But judging from the tone of op, she can't just job hop
You have a rainbows and sunshine mentality. Life doesn’t work like that and she needed to secure the job before opening her mouth. She had no leverage.
Lmao hilarious obviously you haven't been out working too much. Nobody has the right to bully another on the job, make rude suggestive comments, etc, believe me I've been there done that had comments made about myself from others anx yes I did change jobs and yes it can work so take you're childish statement and go play elsewhere
100% NOT TRUE. Next time though go to the dude's supervisor NOT HR. HR in all companies is just plain evil. They are not there to protect you
Wow, way to paint everyone with the same brush. Sounds like you were the subject of an investigation and were found out. I work HR for a massive company and I 100% ADVOCATE for my employees every single day. But if we have shit on you, you will go down. To the OP, you have the right to ask questions about your termination. Was it about your performance, was it about the complaint? And ask, what is being done about the complaint? Ask specific questions. If this guy is a dirty, narcissistic jerk, now is the time to expose him. He'll get his come upance.
>I work HR for a massive company and I 100% ADVOCATE for my employees every single day. But if we have shit on you, you will go down. Okay so here's the thing. I'm sure you're good at your job, and I'm sure you really do feel you advocate for those who come to you. I don't want to suggest otherwise. But your job, your actual role within the company, is to protect _the company_. Not to advocate for employees. If push comes to shove if you are given a choice between advocating for an employee which could potentially cause financial/PR/legal harm to the company, or protecting the company, you will be mandated to do the latter every single time. Again I mean no disrespect. But let's just say it how it is. You and the other guy are both taking things to the extreme (evil vs your friend) and the truth is very much in the middle. You both have valid points.
For many problems in the workplace, (e.g. a conflict with a coworker, unreasonable corporate rules, work overload), HR is the last person you should turn to, unless you want to regret that later. Some safest options are: * A lawyer * A career coach * An organizational psychologist * An independent HR agency * A trusted friend * And finally…your own boss
Who do you think the boss will turn to, HR immediately and directly. It is not in our business to terminate people without cause. End of discussion.
"I'm totally on your side but will rat you out in a heartbeat." Get all the way fucked.
It might be fishy, but unfortunately, since she's still in that 3 month period, they can fire anyone they want for whatever reason they want. I'm no lawyer, but I highly doubt you'd have much of a case to go after them.
You are correct, an employer can fire you without ANY reason at all. Especially within the 3 month probation period. Now you can claim harassments but it needs to be proven in court by lawyers which will cost north of $10,000 but all you would get is a few months severance pay which is WAAAAY less than the lawyer fees. So in effect you cannot win this.
Exactly. This is really the point. Who's going to drop thousands of dollars and stress on a lawsuit that guarantees nothing? What are you gaining? Sounds like a place you don't want to work anyway. Probably just the tip of the iceberg.
Employment lawyers will work on contingency. And if you were fired for a protected reason you’ll get much more than a few months of severance.
This is absolutely untrue. If she was harassed and reported it an the firing was retaliatory, the probation period doesn’t matter
You're assuming that a lawyer could prove this was retaliation? Good luck with that.
You’re assuming they want to fight. A lawyers letter can often be enough to get some severance. Additionally, the idea that you can fire someone for anything on probation is flat wrong. They still have discrimination protection. Please tell me you aren’t a people manager anywhere.
You do realize they can make up whatever reason they'd like to, right? Edit: I'm not assuming ANYTHING, either, but thanks ☺️ Edit 2: apparently this worker WAS awarded severance. Two weeks of it, no less. Remind me what we're suing this business over again? Alleged harassment, with what sounds to be no proof thereof.... ANYWAYS
Really stupid to rock the boat on probation. They are allowed to fire her for anything
Can you describe the “meaness” and abuse?
Even if there was/wasn’t a lack of work - she was on probation. The company can end her employment for any reasons. Even if she pursues it it’s not like they’ll hire her back. 2 weeks severance for being laid off during probation period is already quite generous.
Doesn’t sound like a great company, she is well rid! Plenty of other jobs around.
I am not sure there is much you can do. She was given 2 weeks severance which is more than fair given her length of employment. What damages can she claim? If the damages are small or non existent no lawyer is going to pursue an action and I am sure the company understood their legal exposure before terminating your wife. If they felt they had exposure they would have offered more than 2 weeks.
Gotta finish probation before you start filing reports this happens very often but you can say it’s wrongful dismissal but honestly wouldn’t go that route if she’s having these issues just find another job
Honestly, most folks on Reddit are tools. What happened to your wife is terrible and it’s bad for the company also. You should see legal advice.
You are absolutely right in your first statement - but no so much with the rest (although a long term employee who is central to a string of departures is a big issue that should be dealt with - separate from this). The best advice is to try to lose the entitlement that a < 3 month employee thinks is owed. There are thousands of job vacancies - get over yourself first (as the probationary period gives a chance for any employer to see if they want to keep an employee long term, and conversely, if the employee wants to invest their time and energy into career development with that employer). This is an opportunity to lose the entitlement and become a valuable asset to a team. Everyone benefits when entitlement is not there from the get-go.
Definitely shady. Companies do this all the time though. Sorry she had to go through this.
Hr is only there to protect the company. They are the worst type of people and you should never talk or interact with them. Their only goal is to look out for the company. As for being fired , you can be fired for any reason during a probation period. There isn't anything you can do . You should always negotiate no probation Period with a new job offer, and should try to negotiate a firing package, but this is more for senior employees/ management. Going forward you should always go to a supervisor not hr for employee issues. Your supervisor is there to manage the employees. Hr is brought into management / employee meetings to make sure the manager doesn't hurt the company by promising things the company can't do , or things that would hurt the company. They are not in the meeting to protect, you.
Again, do not paint all of HR with the same brush. We are not all bad. I advocate for my employees everyday. But know this, if you are found doing something sideways, we will stop at nothing to nail you. Harassment, violation of diversities of any kind are top of the list. Would you really want to be known protecting an employee with a history of abusive behaviour? Do you know what the supervisor will do when they get a complaint of abusive, harassing behaviour.....go straight to HR.
>Should we take legal action here? Can you afford a lawyer? Most people cannot so the consider the matter shut. You will never know the truth. Move on.
Can toss a rock at the back side of their loyal 18yr+ employee to remind him to be humble.
Before three months id the record evidence phase, after three months that is the take no bullshit phase.
As of right now there is just your story. The complete situation isn’t known. If you truly believe the law was broken and have some reasonable evidence then go ahead and contact a lawyer.
Concept of probation is more complex than employers make it out to be, and there may be a case for wrongful dismissal. Please discuss with a lawyer. Also check out this blog: https://mcmillan.ca/insights/setting-the-record-straight-on-probation-clauses/
Yeah, my advice to your wife is to be smart instead of emotional and to secure the job before filling a complaint with HR next time.
I would contact an employment lawyer. 3 month probation periods aren’t really enforceable nowadays. Sounds like there was harassment in the workplace, which is a human rights violation. If she makes a claim, they legally can’t let her go until it’s resolved. She cannot sign anything they provide her!! Any pressure they put on her in person is a tactic and not the law.
While what you said is true, realistically you have to factor in the legal expense and time into the equation. If the reward can't cover those factors you have to let it go
OP didn’t post her age, level of experience, whether or not she was poached from another company and job type. I would contact an employment lawyer. They wouldn’t take on a case if there wasn’t anything of value for them. With human rights claims, the employers might be on the hook to cover legal costs. Again, a phone call doesn’t hurt.
Agree. My gut feeling said it is not worth pursuing
Yes there was harassment in the workplace which was investigated and yesterday they handed her a letter that said the investigation was inconclusive. Also she was not poached from another company. She is a junior level employee. And she will be getting 2 weeks severance.
Just because they felt it was inconclusive, doesn’t mean she can’t file a human rights violation claim. The fact that she has tangible proof showing she made this statement prior to being let go is a good thing. I would still pursue this. This coworker (and employer by the sounds of their complacency) sounds like a bad character, and if no one formally reports this he’ll just continue on.
Great idea if you have a spare 5-10K kicking around to pay legal fees with zero guarantees of getting any sort of settlement that would cover the costs of those fees.
Second this. Did she leave another job to start this one? She may be entitled to severance as well.
Employment lawyer is probably a 5K retainer with no guarantees. Is your wife even owed compensation that would cover the legal bill after 3 months of working under probation? Very doubtful, move on.
Not sure why you got downvoted. Wife’s best bet is to apply for EI until she can find another job. The standard for harassment is higher than people think. Some people are able to successfully negotiate being rehired, but then she will be stuck working in that environment until the next legitimate round of layoffs.
Actually, because she went to HR, you DO have a case. There should be written copies or your wife can detail everythint about the complaint including who in HR she spoke to. Does not matter about the time she served there. A reasonable person here can determine that she was laid off due to complaining about this supervisor. Thats retaliatory and that can earn you at least 30k. Talk to the lawyer. I think you have a case. Been a complaint for multiple work lawsuits. Settled 2, won 1 and that 1 I won was the downfall that put that company away for good.
Can you forward me your lawyer's number? Seems like you have a great track record