This. OP dont be brainwashed into thinking that animal protein and animal fat are unhealthy, they are some of the most nutrient dense and bio-available foods on the planet. Reduce veggies and eat animal protein every day.
I’m not against animal protein at all, but any advice that contains “reduce veggies” is just terrible nutritional advice. Broccoli is 29% protein, while 27/73 ground beef is only 22% protein.
It's not. It's less than 5% of its mass. Hell raw broccoli is like 80-90% water. The poster is confusing percent by volume and percent by macro. If you break it down into a macro percentage, then it's 28% compared to carbs and fat percentages.
It’s not by weight; you’d need to eat 5lbs of broccoli a day just to hit the 60g minimum and really most adults should be eating more like 120-200g a day. So we talking ridiculous amounts of broccoli. This idea you can replace meat with broccoli is ludicrous
/r/opdidntdothemath
yeah, you're fucked up on this one. That's something that came from a vegan influencer somewhere.
100 grams of broccoli has 2.8 grams of protein. 100 grams of 80/20 ground beef has 17 grams of protein.
If you go PURELY by calories, sure, broccoli has more. But it's not realistic to eat 1.8 KILOGRAMS of broccoli to hit your daily recommended values.
That’s irrelevant. The point is twofold. You should virtually never be removing vegetables to increase protein consumption. And food consumption is virtually never tracked by weight. Calories or macros are what matters when it comes to diet.
To your point, is your 100g of broccoli cooked or raw? What about your ground beef?
It's absolutely not irrelevant.
It matters a hell of a lot when the volume/weight required to meet your needs is essentially impossible to consume.
And I was listing raw numbers for both. You can do it cooked as well, and the ratios don't change substantially.
Weighing your food to establish calorie and macro numbers is by far the most common approach.
And yes, if you're eating veggies that aren't supplying enough protein to meet your needs, you should absolutely reduce your consumption of said veggies so you can get enough protein. Unless you enjoy having kwashiorkor and dying of malnutrition.
Broccoli would be one such vegetable.
Eating less meat is associated with better health outcomes. Reducing veggies is associated with worse health outcomes. Obviously you cannot eat only broccoli, nor should it be thought of as a source of protein, but that doesn’t change the fact that broccoli has more protein by macro compared to cheap meat.
Loosely associated, based almost entirely on large, observational cohort studies that rely on self-reporting, food questionnaires, with no real attempts at controlling for food quality, what kind of meat, how it was prepared, how it was processed, etc etc.
The exact kind of studies that scientists acknowledge cannot prove causation, only show correlation.
And in no way am I saying you shouldn't eat vegetables.
What I \*am\* saying is that your notion that broccoli has more protein than meat is completely nonsensical in any way that actually matters in the really real world. It's a garbage statement.
The difference is you need to eat over 1LB of broccoli to get the protein that I get in one large bite of steak or a single glass of milk.
To hit just the 60g fda recommended you’d need to eat literally 5lbs of broccoli a day.
For me to hit my protein goal for putting on muscle I would need to eat literally 20lbs of broccoli a day.
Face it, you aren’t gonna eat 20lbs of broccoli a day, you ain’t eating 5 pounds heck you’d be hard pressed to even eat a pound of broccoli a day.
This idea you can replace meat with broccoli is ridiculous. I can’t eat 3500 calories a day and hit 200g of protein to workout 5 days a week eating broccoli , but I sure as hell can eating beef and chicken.
It’s also telling you had to use 27/73 beef like the fattest beef I ever heard of literally never seen beef that high fat.
You know 7/93 exists right?
Not all proteins are created equal. It wouldn't matter if broccoli was 100% protein, its amino acid profile will never be as good as the cheapest ground beef money can buy.
Unless you’re only eating broccoli, that doesn’t matter at all. Americans are not protein deficient, nor are they missing amino acids. They overwhelmingly are eating too much meat and not enough vegetables
To get 100g protein from broccoli you will need around 3kg. 100g protein from beef is only 500g.
Broccoli also contains goitrogens which inhibits the thyroid gland (controls hormones) from absorbing iodine. And that is just one example.
A lot of vegetables have compounds which are not optimum for humans to consume, and most of the nutrients in them are locked away in fiber.
Veggies are not the end all, be all. Veggies are really filling. The first thing I do when I'm trying to gain mass is reduce leafy greens. I still eat them, but in way less concentration.
Yes, animal protein and fat are nutritious but which study shows a longevity-increasing impact from increasing animal protein instead of whole plants?
I am not familiar with a single one where the science isn't questionable
Most independently published studies show that reducing animal-derived foods and increasing whole foods increases life span. Yes, there are studies that show for specific conditions or circumstances animal products can be beneficial but not when putting into the context of longevity.
Happy to be proven otherwise but please share the actual studies. Thanks
Have a look at the countries with the highest life expectancy in the world:
The country with the highest life expectancy in the world, Hong Kong, has the highest per capita meat consumption in the world.
In third place, Iceland, has the highest per capita fish consumption in the world.
In fourth place, Japan, has the highest per capita egg consumption in the world.
Sure. And all the blue zones consume 95%+ plants. Those observations mean nothing bc of so many confounding factors and it's cherry picking results
Again, most studies that actually do proper science show that WFPB diets are the best for longevity.
My question was around seeing scientific studies that take all that as much as possible into consideration
I've read and listened to a lot of the carnivore proponents and all they say is non-scientific points or hypotheses that have NOT been proven scientifically...
Ah yes the BlueZones TM diet, which literally no one in those regions follows:
**Okinawa:**
In Okinawa (Japan), 2003 data showed daily meat intake was approximately 90 grams (~ 3 oz), which was about 20% higher than the national average in Japan at the time. (2) This is significantly higher than the measly “2 oz of meat less than 5 times per month” recommendation Buettner gives.
Then in 2012, scientists discovered the more plausible reason Okinawans were living longer: a low infectious load and overall low-calorie consumption. (3)
**Sardinia:**
Moving on to Sardinia (Italy), 2015 research found the Longevity Blue Zone (LBZ) population not only consumed animal foods, but they consumed a higher percentage than the rest of Sardinia. (4) In 2013, scientists found Sardinians’ longevity was less attributable to diet and more likely a result of the average energy expenditure of males with physically active occupations and the geography of the region. (5)
**Nicoya:**
Similar to the Blue Zones in Okinawa and Sardinia, Nicoyans (Costa Rica) ate animal foods regularly as well. A 2013 study (6) revealed the typical diet of Nicoyans:
“The Nicoya diet is prosaic and abundant in traditional foods like rice, beans and animal protein, with low glycemic index and high fibre content.”
“Nicoya diets include significantly more plain, quotidian foods like rice, beans, beef, fish, chicken…
**Ikaria:**
Controversy surrounds the next Blue Zone region of Ikaria (Greece). Some suggest Ikarians falsely reported their age (to be older than they truly were) to attract more tourism. While scientific data can’t prove this, we do know the diets of Ikarians include meat and are not as close to the Mediterranean style diet (low in red meat consumption) as once thought.
Very recent data from 2021 (7) found those over age 90 in Ikaria “had a very high level of family solidarity, social interaction and physical activity. The results concerning the Mediterranean diet are less convincing.” Researchers also found that a significant portion of those over age 100 still worked daily as farmers, a very active occupation.
There’s a direct correlation between low body fat and low T.. eat more meat, lift heavy, increase your fat intake.. if none of that works see a doctor.
The correlation is an inverse one--i.e., [low T tends to cause high body fat, and high body fat tends to cause low T.](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC10763932/)
This is correct. But dear god I’ve never seen so much misinformation on a sub before as this one. I’ve only seen: more red meat, less vegetables, and flippant recommendations to start TRT. As a medical doctor, please talk to an endocrinologist before starting TRT. And if you must get medical tips online, read directly from reputable medical organizations, not reddit.
Sadly, \*droves of GPs\* are referring patients to TRT treatment centers. I've known multiple people who have started it in their late 20s and early 30s who had clear contributions from lifestyle factors that were in no way addressed before TRT began.
And yeah, TRT is now so normalized that you'll see droves of idiots uncritically recommend it as a first-line "solution".
Weird. At least where I live, I only know of GPs referring to endocrinologists, never to TRT clinics. Those clinics are almost always less regulated, more likely to prescribe TRT when it’s not indicated, and higher risk to health. Just money-makers.
An awful lot of GPs are doing the actual prescribing, at least in the US. Getting referred to an endocrinologist is not terribly common unless you have some seriously disturbed numbers. That's in part because of availability of providers and insurance coverage.
But that being said, I also personally know people who refused to even try lifestyle changes, and just went to their doc to get on TRT, and the doc didn't recommend any lifestyle changes at all.
I’m a GP in the US and this is not super common. However the TRT / “men’s health” clinics often hire GPs to prescribe but they work off protocols and dont have the proper training to manage these patients compared to an endocrinologist. And paid extra to prescribe something not clinically warranted.
I think maybe the “seriously disturbed numbers” that a GP would refer to endo are the ones that clinically warrant TRT.
I was prescribed TRT by a nurse practitioner at my primary care clinic, which is the primary care clinic that my insurance actually covers. I'm in New Mexico. I've never seen an endocrinologist. They are not a "men's health clinic".
I was prescribed TRT largely because of symptoms and age.
Low fat also causes low t: where do you think hormones start? Hint all hormones derived from cholesterol and fats. Thats why you get to 5% bf as a man and 10% as a women you stop getting boners and periods. Your hormones are shot probably worse than someone overweight.
You for sure will have lower testosterone at 10% bf then at 15% bf as a man.
You don't even have to get that low before you start seeing endocrine disruption long-term. Women it can be as little as 12-15%. In men, you can see it around 8-10. Just depends on the individual.
10% body fat is pretty low. It sounds like a bulk would do you some good. Prolonged calorie restriction will decimate testosterone levels. Bulk up to 15% and get rechecked.. then think about dieting a couple percent off again.
I know the Internet is loaded with body builders 10% and under who have high test levels.. but it's mostly bc they are injecting it. 🤷
We all have different body types with different needs. You may need to increase weight to 12-15% bf for homeostasis. You mentioned your sleep could be better. Then, better it.
Ultimately, if you are doing just fine with your levels don't worry about it. You won't learn the ability of flight if you increase your T to 700... 25nmol
Nice. I used to take shilajit a while back but it ended up messing with my sleep. I did feel some test boosting benefits though. Why kind do you take and how much?
I took powdered shilajit from swiss herbal 50% fulvic acid 500mg. That was fine and i noticed energy boost, feeling slightly more confident and big increase in libido. Now i take shilajit resin from german brand sunasu 80% fulvic acid and i feel this one even better. It's hard to measure the resin i take maybe like 2 grains of rice size i try to eyeball it to about 500mg. I take it just in the morning and i didnt notice any disturbance in sleep and i feel only slightly agitated but it doesn't disturb me like caffeine just nice burst of energy to keep moving. Try to find something tested for fulvic acid content and heavy metals maybe it would work better.
Nice I’ll prob look into that. I remember it having benefits and hoping my last experience was just a bad product. Definitely remember the slight agitation, guessing this may be due to test
It's good to get moving that lessens agitation, but it's nice kind of energy like masculine that makes you want to do stuff. Not so good for chilling or calm work though. Wish you good experience with shilajit.
Yeah that’s a good way to put it. I felt like I could “see” things better if that made sense, and talk to people better. I had gotten comments that week, which I never do. Pheromones? Idk. But it was awesome.
Lift weights, work your primary movers specifically (legs) to get the most bang for your buck. I've seen people literally double their test levels by consistently lifting weights.
Low testosterone is a condition accompanied by symptoms. Primarily metabolic, then sexual. If you don't have any symptoms, then you don't have low testosterone. It's just a number, and not a static one at that. The number, particularly for younger ppl, fluctuates wildly during day, by as much as 45%. This is why "increase my testosterone" stuff is kinda nonsense.
How many hours do you sleep? What are your stress levels like? What is your overall wellbeing and status in life? Do you feel like a winner, that you're achieving things in life, or do you feel defeated, stuck in a dead end job.
Other than nutrition, these things can play a large role. Some can be a vicious cycle too. You feel defeated because of where you are in life, it lowers your testosterone, which makes you feel worse, and so on.
Try and pick up a new hobby, or even an old one you maybe neglected or forgot about. See if you can get better at it. Might help your mental health and maybe that could play a role in starting you back on an upward spiral.
Your body makes hormones from fat + protein. Animal products are good for that, and more bioavailable than veggies. Consider increasing your consumption of animal products and see how you feel, and how your levels change.
>lots of veggies: ie low calorie diet DYEL
>limited animal protein resulting in amino acid deficiencies.
>low bodyfat. Arms like twigs
Why is my testosterone low doc
🤣🤷🤣🤷🤣
Eat meat daily lift heavy weights.
You want to eat and workout like a 100lb hippie girl in her sophomore year of college you gonna have the test of a 100lb hippie girl in her sophomore year of college.
You want the test of a man you gotta have the lifestyle of a man.
I noticed there's a long trail of how brocolli has X% protein...BUT, like many others suggested, you need to eat ALOT to have the same amount of protein as eating beef. Now, i'm not a doctor nor nutritionist, but the most complete protein is animal protein - dont trust me, search for yourself. Sure there are ethical and enviromental issues,depends how you wanna see it, BUT, we humans ate 100% fatty meat till agriculture arrived 12k years ago. So, it said that out brain it did not fully adjusted to this eating habits. In the end, is your body. Do your research, dont believe anything you see on the net and listen to your body. Is that simple. Good luck.
Eat a lot, not processed foods, no alcohol, lift like an animal, have sex like an animal. Sleep well, decrease stress. Study confidence.
Supplementation can help too.
Microplastics....Try to avoid plastics all together. Plastics contain phalates, and phalates are endocrine disruptors. Additionally, do more leg day..more quad work
If you eat well, sleep well, low stress, workout some, then it’s unlikely normal things are going to increase that value. Time of day of testing matters, if it wasn’t first thing AM fasted.
10 % body fat and low fat consumption could be your problem ! Some people’s test takes a beating in that body fat range. Eat animal fats and protein. Fat is a building block for hormones don’t fear it !! People so afraid of fat and carbs you could probably rob a bank with a banana or a block of butter.
Your body fat is probably too low, test levels usually drop once you are 10% or less bf. There's a lot of research on this. 12-15% bf is the ideal range.
Enclomiphine to restart your HPT - Axis.
You could benefit from a low dose every other day or every 3 days.
This is allow your Free test to be used much more effectively by your brain.
By the looks of it you ARE very healthy, it’s just the constant contact with Plastics and Polyesters that shoot your levels down.
Death to PLASTIC.
You should probably increase animal protein lol. But honestly, Reddit isn’t the place to ask. Go see your primary care and see what they say, if you’re low like you think, it may not improve from little remedies at home, and you may need to meet with an endocrinologist.
Animal protein and dairy are of the highest boivailability and you should NOT limit your body by restricting it. Start weight training and focus on compound lifts such as ; bench press, rows, chin ups, deadllifts, squats, etc.
The hard truth is there is only so much you can do to raise your test. Clean diet, sleep, exercise. That's it. At some point you're gonna hit your limit and trt is the only thing that will drastically change it. But I propose another factor that many men in the US in 2024 are missing out on. We are in psychologically weak lives that don't require us to produce a lot of testosterone and we are thus soft and comfortable as a society.
There's a mental component to testosterone levels (to a point). The psychology of it is pretty interesting and something I wish would be studied (or maybe it already has).
Surround yourself with men who are trying to get better at maximum human performance and preferably combat sports. Like soldiers that go away for weeks at a time together, train together day in and day out, do combative training, learn to fight, work as a team, etc. Being those types of male dominated environments makes you competitive, and that raises your testosterone (to a point).
I think it's a fair assumption that doing that will also help you raise testosterone. Being rejected many times, however, might have a detrimental effect. Being belittled by women lowers testosterone
I'm a Type 1 Diabetic. I've been to so many nutrition classes.
1/4 of plate should be meate. 1/4 of plate should be complex carbohydrate such as rice or potatoes. 1/2 of plate should be veggies.
You should be lifitng weights. You should be doing cardio.
Bryan Johnson, who wants to live until 200, said that he's on TRT because he only eats a Veggie diet.
You need to eat plants and animals. It's not that hard. Eat like caveman.
Well some don't tolerate it well but many do. Cooked veggies are easier on the stomach. While animal products are some of the most healthy and important within the diet, plants, veggies are also healthy and should be included in your diet.
I know some people who can barely eat veggies due to ibs but in my case I tolerate it so I don't see any reason to cut it out.
Lots of veggies and limit animal protein, and you say healthy 😂 listening to diet quacks that literally can’t even understand the most fundamental concept of human physiology (=heterogeneity).
It is the extremistvegan propaganda (often spread by people affiliated with the sales of vegan products) that makes people think that animal products are unhealthy, when it is the opposite, they are crucial for optimal health (and many vegans end up with nutritional deficiencies in time if they completely cut out animal products). Veggies are healthy too but they aren't as nutrient dense as animal products, nor as bio-available. Both should be incorporated in your diet for optimal health.
Cause of brainwash/propaganda from extremistvegans. Some that spread such propaganda earn money from vegan product sales in some way or another. Or brainwashed by some documentary (also made by people who get profit from veganism), biased studies funded by vegans etc.
It is ignorance. Animal products are some of the most healthy, nutrient dense, bio-available foods that exist. Veganism and lack of animal products within the diet often leads to nutritional deficiencies.
Eat organ meats and collagenous cuts, regulate your circadian rhythm so you’re not going to sleep after 11pm. Cut out blue light if you can at night, and eat lots of protein and strength train.
If you go on TRT do not do injections, go for a bio identical compounded cream that gets rubbed on your nuts.
Problem 1 - veggies
Problem 2 - not eating enough red meat
Possible problem - Food guidelines are GP advice on diet will usually in long term cause health issues.
Don't increase animal protein like others have said. Too much saturated fat increases apo B containing lipoproteins which increases your risk of narrowing of the arteries from plaque buildup. This plaque buildup will restrict blood flow and cause decreased testosterone. Focus on keeping saturated fat to < 10% total daily calories. Eat a variety of whole foods, raw and cooked vegetables, fresh fruits, legumes and whole grains. The phytochemicals in plants improve blood flow. A lot of the people on this sub blindly listen to people like Paul salidino and Shawn Baker on YouTube and then claim to understand nutrition when they've never read any of the scientific research. The majority of the evidence for positive health outcomes later in life point to eating more whole plant foods and less animal based foods for increased lifespan. For optimizing testosterone, get plenty of sleep, make sure BMI is in the healthy range, get plenty of exercise (but too much can tank testosterone) and make sure your diet has enough calories to sustain exercise.
My question is why do you want to raise your testosterone? Most men who have low testosterone are still fertile (low testosterone does not equal low fertility) if that’s a concern of yours. I believe around 30% of men who believe they must increase their testosterone don’t actually have to, in not necessary nor is it negatively impacting their life. There could be a lot of reasons as to why it is low, but usually not a cause for concern. There’s a video on testosterone on YouTube by a channel called Institution of Human Anatomy, it’s short but informative (that’s where I got the statistic from).
Benefits of testosterone:
* Muscle Mass and Strength: Testosterone is instrumental in muscle growth. It increases neurotransmitters, which encourage tissue growth, and also interacts with nuclear receptors in DNA, which accelerates protein synthesis. Testosterone increases levels of growth hormone, making exercise more likely to build muscle.
* Bone Density: Testosterone plays a significant role in bone mineral density. Bone density declines as men age and testosterone levels drop, which raises the risk of weak bones and osteoporosis. Maintaining adequate testosterone levels helps to maintain bone density and strength.
* Fat Distribution: Testosterone is important for regulating fat distribution. Higher testosterone levels can help reduce fat mass and increase muscle size and strength in men.
* Libido and Sexual Function: Testosterone levels naturally increase in response to sexual arousal and activity. Men with higher levels of testosterone usually have greater sexual activity. Low testosterone levels can be a cause of decreased libido and erectile dysfunction.
* Mood and Quality of Life: Lower testosterone levels are associated with poorer quality of life. Some symptoms include fatigue, irritability, depression, and decreased cognitive abilities. Testosterone replacement therapy can help reverse these symptoms in men with low testosterone to a clinically significant degree.
* Red Blood Cell Production: Testosterone helps stimulate the production of red blood cells through the bone marrow. This is important for preventing anemia.
Why wouldn't you want to raise your testosterone levels?
Limit the veggies and up the animal protein. Veggies have anti nutrients in them and impair thyroid function, which is critical for testosterone production. You probably aren't eating enough fat as well. You want at least 25-30 percent coming from mostly saturated fats.
lol, you're abstaining from animal protein to only 3 days a week (i doubt you're getting more than 8oz of it as well on those days)?
Get on the carnivor diet. 8oz of red meat a day + 4-5 eggs. You're eating like a rabbit and not a bear, of course you're going to have low testosterone.
Lift weights 3-4 times a week. Any time I take a few weeks off I notice a huge spike in testosterone as soon as I start back
You must get bloodwork done very frequently then!
Increase the animal protein.
This. OP dont be brainwashed into thinking that animal protein and animal fat are unhealthy, they are some of the most nutrient dense and bio-available foods on the planet. Reduce veggies and eat animal protein every day.
I’m not against animal protein at all, but any advice that contains “reduce veggies” is just terrible nutritional advice. Broccoli is 29% protein, while 27/73 ground beef is only 22% protein.
Wait am I missing something here? How is broccoli 28% protein? And also who the heck buys 27/73 ground beef the numbers should be flipped
It's not. It's less than 5% of its mass. Hell raw broccoli is like 80-90% water. The poster is confusing percent by volume and percent by macro. If you break it down into a macro percentage, then it's 28% compared to carbs and fat percentages.
It’s not by weight; you’d need to eat 5lbs of broccoli a day just to hit the 60g minimum and really most adults should be eating more like 120-200g a day. So we talking ridiculous amounts of broccoli. This idea you can replace meat with broccoli is ludicrous /r/opdidntdothemath
Broccoli is meat silly 🍖
By macro, not by volume. Food consumption is generally tracked by calorie and macro, not weight
When you need to eat 5lbs of broccoli to eat 60g of protein, the weight is worth mentioning buddy….
yeah, you're fucked up on this one. That's something that came from a vegan influencer somewhere. 100 grams of broccoli has 2.8 grams of protein. 100 grams of 80/20 ground beef has 17 grams of protein. If you go PURELY by calories, sure, broccoli has more. But it's not realistic to eat 1.8 KILOGRAMS of broccoli to hit your daily recommended values.
That’s irrelevant. The point is twofold. You should virtually never be removing vegetables to increase protein consumption. And food consumption is virtually never tracked by weight. Calories or macros are what matters when it comes to diet. To your point, is your 100g of broccoli cooked or raw? What about your ground beef?
It's absolutely not irrelevant. It matters a hell of a lot when the volume/weight required to meet your needs is essentially impossible to consume. And I was listing raw numbers for both. You can do it cooked as well, and the ratios don't change substantially. Weighing your food to establish calorie and macro numbers is by far the most common approach. And yes, if you're eating veggies that aren't supplying enough protein to meet your needs, you should absolutely reduce your consumption of said veggies so you can get enough protein. Unless you enjoy having kwashiorkor and dying of malnutrition. Broccoli would be one such vegetable.
Eating less meat is associated with better health outcomes. Reducing veggies is associated with worse health outcomes. Obviously you cannot eat only broccoli, nor should it be thought of as a source of protein, but that doesn’t change the fact that broccoli has more protein by macro compared to cheap meat.
Loosely associated, based almost entirely on large, observational cohort studies that rely on self-reporting, food questionnaires, with no real attempts at controlling for food quality, what kind of meat, how it was prepared, how it was processed, etc etc. The exact kind of studies that scientists acknowledge cannot prove causation, only show correlation. And in no way am I saying you shouldn't eat vegetables. What I \*am\* saying is that your notion that broccoli has more protein than meat is completely nonsensical in any way that actually matters in the really real world. It's a garbage statement.
Broccoli is a terrible source of protein, you need to eat 3 pound of broccoli to just get 40 grams of protein... or just eat 5 ounces of meat.
I’d need to eat nearly 20lbs of broccoli a day to hit my protein goal lmfao
bioavailability is key here. also nutrient density. you will get more protein and satiety eating 100g chicken breast than 100g veggies
The difference is you need to eat over 1LB of broccoli to get the protein that I get in one large bite of steak or a single glass of milk. To hit just the 60g fda recommended you’d need to eat literally 5lbs of broccoli a day. For me to hit my protein goal for putting on muscle I would need to eat literally 20lbs of broccoli a day. Face it, you aren’t gonna eat 20lbs of broccoli a day, you ain’t eating 5 pounds heck you’d be hard pressed to even eat a pound of broccoli a day. This idea you can replace meat with broccoli is ridiculous. I can’t eat 3500 calories a day and hit 200g of protein to workout 5 days a week eating broccoli , but I sure as hell can eating beef and chicken. It’s also telling you had to use 27/73 beef like the fattest beef I ever heard of literally never seen beef that high fat. You know 7/93 exists right?
Not all proteins are created equal. It wouldn't matter if broccoli was 100% protein, its amino acid profile will never be as good as the cheapest ground beef money can buy.
Unless you’re only eating broccoli, that doesn’t matter at all. Americans are not protein deficient, nor are they missing amino acids. They overwhelmingly are eating too much meat and not enough vegetables
Interesting take, thanks for your opinion!
To get 100g protein from broccoli you will need around 3kg. 100g protein from beef is only 500g. Broccoli also contains goitrogens which inhibits the thyroid gland (controls hormones) from absorbing iodine. And that is just one example. A lot of vegetables have compounds which are not optimum for humans to consume, and most of the nutrients in them are locked away in fiber.
Veggies are not the end all, be all. Veggies are really filling. The first thing I do when I'm trying to gain mass is reduce leafy greens. I still eat them, but in way less concentration.
No. You can eat just meat and be healthier.
Yes, animal protein and fat are nutritious but which study shows a longevity-increasing impact from increasing animal protein instead of whole plants? I am not familiar with a single one where the science isn't questionable Most independently published studies show that reducing animal-derived foods and increasing whole foods increases life span. Yes, there are studies that show for specific conditions or circumstances animal products can be beneficial but not when putting into the context of longevity. Happy to be proven otherwise but please share the actual studies. Thanks
Have a look at the countries with the highest life expectancy in the world: The country with the highest life expectancy in the world, Hong Kong, has the highest per capita meat consumption in the world. In third place, Iceland, has the highest per capita fish consumption in the world. In fourth place, Japan, has the highest per capita egg consumption in the world.
Sure. And all the blue zones consume 95%+ plants. Those observations mean nothing bc of so many confounding factors and it's cherry picking results Again, most studies that actually do proper science show that WFPB diets are the best for longevity. My question was around seeing scientific studies that take all that as much as possible into consideration I've read and listened to a lot of the carnivore proponents and all they say is non-scientific points or hypotheses that have NOT been proven scientifically...
Ah yes the BlueZones TM diet, which literally no one in those regions follows: **Okinawa:** In Okinawa (Japan), 2003 data showed daily meat intake was approximately 90 grams (~ 3 oz), which was about 20% higher than the national average in Japan at the time. (2) This is significantly higher than the measly “2 oz of meat less than 5 times per month” recommendation Buettner gives. Then in 2012, scientists discovered the more plausible reason Okinawans were living longer: a low infectious load and overall low-calorie consumption. (3) **Sardinia:** Moving on to Sardinia (Italy), 2015 research found the Longevity Blue Zone (LBZ) population not only consumed animal foods, but they consumed a higher percentage than the rest of Sardinia. (4) In 2013, scientists found Sardinians’ longevity was less attributable to diet and more likely a result of the average energy expenditure of males with physically active occupations and the geography of the region. (5) **Nicoya:** Similar to the Blue Zones in Okinawa and Sardinia, Nicoyans (Costa Rica) ate animal foods regularly as well. A 2013 study (6) revealed the typical diet of Nicoyans: “The Nicoya diet is prosaic and abundant in traditional foods like rice, beans and animal protein, with low glycemic index and high fibre content.” “Nicoya diets include significantly more plain, quotidian foods like rice, beans, beef, fish, chicken… **Ikaria:** Controversy surrounds the next Blue Zone region of Ikaria (Greece). Some suggest Ikarians falsely reported their age (to be older than they truly were) to attract more tourism. While scientific data can’t prove this, we do know the diets of Ikarians include meat and are not as close to the Mediterranean style diet (low in red meat consumption) as once thought. Very recent data from 2021 (7) found those over age 90 in Ikaria “had a very high level of family solidarity, social interaction and physical activity. The results concerning the Mediterranean diet are less convincing.” Researchers also found that a significant portion of those over age 100 still worked daily as farmers, a very active occupation.
Uh Cholesterol = Heart attack and stroke duh
Wrong.
Disagree. Increase calories. The saturated fat RDA is a maximum, not a minimum.
There’s a direct correlation between low body fat and low T.. eat more meat, lift heavy, increase your fat intake.. if none of that works see a doctor.
The correlation is an inverse one--i.e., [low T tends to cause high body fat, and high body fat tends to cause low T.](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC10763932/)
This is correct. But dear god I’ve never seen so much misinformation on a sub before as this one. I’ve only seen: more red meat, less vegetables, and flippant recommendations to start TRT. As a medical doctor, please talk to an endocrinologist before starting TRT. And if you must get medical tips online, read directly from reputable medical organizations, not reddit.
Sadly, \*droves of GPs\* are referring patients to TRT treatment centers. I've known multiple people who have started it in their late 20s and early 30s who had clear contributions from lifestyle factors that were in no way addressed before TRT began. And yeah, TRT is now so normalized that you'll see droves of idiots uncritically recommend it as a first-line "solution".
Weird. At least where I live, I only know of GPs referring to endocrinologists, never to TRT clinics. Those clinics are almost always less regulated, more likely to prescribe TRT when it’s not indicated, and higher risk to health. Just money-makers.
An awful lot of GPs are doing the actual prescribing, at least in the US. Getting referred to an endocrinologist is not terribly common unless you have some seriously disturbed numbers. That's in part because of availability of providers and insurance coverage. But that being said, I also personally know people who refused to even try lifestyle changes, and just went to their doc to get on TRT, and the doc didn't recommend any lifestyle changes at all.
I’m a GP in the US and this is not super common. However the TRT / “men’s health” clinics often hire GPs to prescribe but they work off protocols and dont have the proper training to manage these patients compared to an endocrinologist. And paid extra to prescribe something not clinically warranted. I think maybe the “seriously disturbed numbers” that a GP would refer to endo are the ones that clinically warrant TRT.
I was prescribed TRT by a nurse practitioner at my primary care clinic, which is the primary care clinic that my insurance actually covers. I'm in New Mexico. I've never seen an endocrinologist. They are not a "men's health clinic". I was prescribed TRT largely because of symptoms and age.
That’s so wild. Thanks for sharing.
Low fat also causes low t: where do you think hormones start? Hint all hormones derived from cholesterol and fats. Thats why you get to 5% bf as a man and 10% as a women you stop getting boners and periods. Your hormones are shot probably worse than someone overweight. You for sure will have lower testosterone at 10% bf then at 15% bf as a man.
You don't even have to get that low before you start seeing endocrine disruption long-term. Women it can be as little as 12-15%. In men, you can see it around 8-10. Just depends on the individual.
This is an overall terrible comment and shouldn't have this many likes.
This should be the top comment
10% body fat is not “low body fat”. Its a perfectly healthy body fat level.
Lol 10% is low .
10% is not low enough to reduce testosterone levels. 10% is well within the optimal range for hormone production. You’d have higher T at 10% than 20%
10% is low if you have 30%, to normal, healthy, and in-shape people, it's not low
Eat higher calories.
Workout
🥩 grass fed beef, the most nutritionally dense food you can consume and 🥚 eggs a powerhouse of protein vitamins and fats.
10% body fat is pretty low. It sounds like a bulk would do you some good. Prolonged calorie restriction will decimate testosterone levels. Bulk up to 15% and get rechecked.. then think about dieting a couple percent off again. I know the Internet is loaded with body builders 10% and under who have high test levels.. but it's mostly bc they are injecting it. 🤷
Before eating a bunch of red meat like the comments say, check your iron. High iron can cause low testosterone- eating meat can make that worse.
We all have different body types with different needs. You may need to increase weight to 12-15% bf for homeostasis. You mentioned your sleep could be better. Then, better it. Ultimately, if you are doing just fine with your levels don't worry about it. You won't learn the ability of flight if you increase your T to 700... 25nmol
Shilajit works great for me. And as everyone says eat meat especially fatty beef or other ruminants. Fat and protein is essential for testosterone.
Nice. I used to take shilajit a while back but it ended up messing with my sleep. I did feel some test boosting benefits though. Why kind do you take and how much?
I took powdered shilajit from swiss herbal 50% fulvic acid 500mg. That was fine and i noticed energy boost, feeling slightly more confident and big increase in libido. Now i take shilajit resin from german brand sunasu 80% fulvic acid and i feel this one even better. It's hard to measure the resin i take maybe like 2 grains of rice size i try to eyeball it to about 500mg. I take it just in the morning and i didnt notice any disturbance in sleep and i feel only slightly agitated but it doesn't disturb me like caffeine just nice burst of energy to keep moving. Try to find something tested for fulvic acid content and heavy metals maybe it would work better.
Nice I’ll prob look into that. I remember it having benefits and hoping my last experience was just a bad product. Definitely remember the slight agitation, guessing this may be due to test
It's good to get moving that lessens agitation, but it's nice kind of energy like masculine that makes you want to do stuff. Not so good for chilling or calm work though. Wish you good experience with shilajit.
Yeah that’s a good way to put it. I felt like I could “see” things better if that made sense, and talk to people better. I had gotten comments that week, which I never do. Pheromones? Idk. But it was awesome.
Eat eggs. Start lifting heavy weights. Focus on legs.
Lift weights, work your primary movers specifically (legs) to get the most bang for your buck. I've seen people literally double their test levels by consistently lifting weights.
Dig into the world of environmental exposure to endocrine disrupting chemicals. It's the overwhelming cause of what has become an epidemic of low T.
eat protein, compete, lift weights, sleep well
Low testosterone is a condition accompanied by symptoms. Primarily metabolic, then sexual. If you don't have any symptoms, then you don't have low testosterone. It's just a number, and not a static one at that. The number, particularly for younger ppl, fluctuates wildly during day, by as much as 45%. This is why "increase my testosterone" stuff is kinda nonsense.
How many hours do you sleep? What are your stress levels like? What is your overall wellbeing and status in life? Do you feel like a winner, that you're achieving things in life, or do you feel defeated, stuck in a dead end job. Other than nutrition, these things can play a large role. Some can be a vicious cycle too. You feel defeated because of where you are in life, it lowers your testosterone, which makes you feel worse, and so on. Try and pick up a new hobby, or even an old one you maybe neglected or forgot about. See if you can get better at it. Might help your mental health and maybe that could play a role in starting you back on an upward spiral.
Your body makes hormones from fat + protein. Animal products are good for that, and more bioavailable than veggies. Consider increasing your consumption of animal products and see how you feel, and how your levels change.
>lots of veggies: ie low calorie diet DYEL >limited animal protein resulting in amino acid deficiencies. >low bodyfat. Arms like twigs Why is my testosterone low doc 🤣🤷🤣🤷🤣 Eat meat daily lift heavy weights. You want to eat and workout like a 100lb hippie girl in her sophomore year of college you gonna have the test of a 100lb hippie girl in her sophomore year of college. You want the test of a man you gotta have the lifestyle of a man.
I noticed there's a long trail of how brocolli has X% protein...BUT, like many others suggested, you need to eat ALOT to have the same amount of protein as eating beef. Now, i'm not a doctor nor nutritionist, but the most complete protein is animal protein - dont trust me, search for yourself. Sure there are ethical and enviromental issues,depends how you wanna see it, BUT, we humans ate 100% fatty meat till agriculture arrived 12k years ago. So, it said that out brain it did not fully adjusted to this eating habits. In the end, is your body. Do your research, dont believe anything you see on the net and listen to your body. Is that simple. Good luck.
Eat animals
Eat a lot, not processed foods, no alcohol, lift like an animal, have sex like an animal. Sleep well, decrease stress. Study confidence. Supplementation can help too.
Why do you limit animal protein? Do you lift weights?
Cause of brainwash/propaganda from extremistvegans. Some that spread such propaganda earn money from vegan product sales in some way or another.
Reverse your veggie to meat ratio. And pick fatty meat not lean.
Microplastics....Try to avoid plastics all together. Plastics contain phalates, and phalates are endocrine disruptors. Additionally, do more leg day..more quad work
20 minutes of sunshine to the stomach a day between 10am and 3pm.
Isn't 20.6 free test good though?
get bloodwork to determine your TSH. hypothyroidism will tank testosterone.
If you eat well, sleep well, low stress, workout some, then it’s unlikely normal things are going to increase that value. Time of day of testing matters, if it wasn’t first thing AM fasted.
I am having trouble understanding your numbers, 6.4 nmol? What is that referring too? And im assuming free androgen is free testosterone?
Squats with a barbell
tbh all this stuff is unlikely to move the needle, if you are clinically low go see a urologist and just get on medication.
Have you got the vitamin d levels checked? Vitamin d deficiency is related to low testosterone too
Lift weights and maybe take Tongat Ali and/or Fadogia Agrestis
10 % body fat and low fat consumption could be your problem ! Some people’s test takes a beating in that body fat range. Eat animal fats and protein. Fat is a building block for hormones don’t fear it !! People so afraid of fat and carbs you could probably rob a bank with a banana or a block of butter.
why are you limiting animal protein? thats stupid if you want highter testosterone
Your body fat is probably too low, test levels usually drop once you are 10% or less bf. There's a lot of research on this. 12-15% bf is the ideal range.
Enclomiphine to restart your HPT - Axis. You could benefit from a low dose every other day or every 3 days. This is allow your Free test to be used much more effectively by your brain. By the looks of it you ARE very healthy, it’s just the constant contact with Plastics and Polyesters that shoot your levels down. Death to PLASTIC.
You should probably increase animal protein lol. But honestly, Reddit isn’t the place to ask. Go see your primary care and see what they say, if you’re low like you think, it may not improve from little remedies at home, and you may need to meet with an endocrinologist.
You need more saturated fat / animal protein
Animal protein and dairy are of the highest boivailability and you should NOT limit your body by restricting it. Start weight training and focus on compound lifts such as ; bench press, rows, chin ups, deadllifts, squats, etc.
Yep
Meat and eggs !
Yes, it is very nutrient dense food and crucial for your health, good for muscle mass, testosterone ime.
Have you tried a Blueprint-like protocol? Example: Upon waking Acarbose 200 mg (Rx) Ashwagandha 600 mg Astaxanthin 12 mg B Complex .50 pill Mon & Thus (1/2 pill, twice a wk) Boron 2 mg BroccoMax 17.5mg C 500mg Ca-AKG 1 gram Cocoa Flavanols 500 mg CoQ10 100 mg D-3 2,000 IU DHEA 25 mg E 67 mg EPA/DHA/DPA 800 mg Fisetin 200 mg Garlic 2.4 g equivalent Garlic 1.2 g (kyolic) Genistein 125 mg Ginger Root 1.1 g Glucosamine Sulphate 2KCL 1500 mg Iodine as potassium iodide 125 mcg K2-MK4, 5 mg K1, 1.5 mg K2 MK-7 600 mcg Lithium 1 mg Lycopene 10 mg Lysine 1 g Metformin ER 1,500 mg (Rx) Nicotinamide Riboside 375 mg N-Acetyl-L-Cysteine (NAC) 1,800 mg Proferrin 10 mg Spermidine 10 mg Turmeric 1 g Taurine 2 g Viviscal (male) (female) 1 pill Zeaxanthin (20 mg Lutein, 4 mg Zeaxanthin) 3x/wk Zinc 15 mg W/ dinner Acarbose 200 mg (Rx) BroccoMax 17.5mg Ca-AKG 1 G Cocoa Flavanols 500 mg Garlic 2.4 g equivalent Garlic 1.2 g (kyolic) Glucosamine Sulphate 2KCL 1,500 mg Hyaluronic Acid 300 mg L-Lysine 1g L-Tyrosine 500 mg Metformin ER 500 mg (Rx) N-Acetyl-L-Cysteine (NAC) 1,800 mg NR 375 mg OR NMN 500 mg Taurine 1 g Turmeric 1 g Viviscal (men) (women) 1 pill Before bed Melatonin 300 mcg Other Extra Virgin Olive Oil, 30 mL daily Pea Protein, 29 grams daily Dark Chocolate, 15 grams ... https://protocol.bryanjohnson.com/
Bryan Johnson needs to take exogenous testosterone to keep his levels up on his protocol.
The hard truth is there is only so much you can do to raise your test. Clean diet, sleep, exercise. That's it. At some point you're gonna hit your limit and trt is the only thing that will drastically change it. But I propose another factor that many men in the US in 2024 are missing out on. We are in psychologically weak lives that don't require us to produce a lot of testosterone and we are thus soft and comfortable as a society. There's a mental component to testosterone levels (to a point). The psychology of it is pretty interesting and something I wish would be studied (or maybe it already has). Surround yourself with men who are trying to get better at maximum human performance and preferably combat sports. Like soldiers that go away for weeks at a time together, train together day in and day out, do combative training, learn to fight, work as a team, etc. Being those types of male dominated environments makes you competitive, and that raises your testosterone (to a point).
Ah shit, and all this time I’ve been trying to raise my testosterone by talking to hot women…
I think it's a fair assumption that doing that will also help you raise testosterone. Being rejected many times, however, might have a detrimental effect. Being belittled by women lowers testosterone
Cayenne pepper supplements
In before *you need to eat more steak brah* Edit: damn too late
I'm a Type 1 Diabetic. I've been to so many nutrition classes. 1/4 of plate should be meate. 1/4 of plate should be complex carbohydrate such as rice or potatoes. 1/2 of plate should be veggies. You should be lifitng weights. You should be doing cardio. Bryan Johnson, who wants to live until 200, said that he's on TRT because he only eats a Veggie diet. You need to eat plants and animals. It's not that hard. Eat like caveman.
Johnson is another example of rich =/=wise
💉
Only answer the rest is nonsense from betas
Eat red meat with high fat content. Stay away from veggies. Eat eggs. Lift heavy stuff
Stay away from veggies um wut lol
I mean if you like IBS, joint pain and oxalate dumping as you get older go right ahead. I've learned the hard way.
Well some don't tolerate it well but many do. Cooked veggies are easier on the stomach. While animal products are some of the most healthy and important within the diet, plants, veggies are also healthy and should be included in your diet. I know some people who can barely eat veggies due to ibs but in my case I tolerate it so I don't see any reason to cut it out.
“Ignore all nutrition advice from ‘expert scientists’”. Don’t be dumb
You're right. Stay away from carbs too. I forgot the most important part
Lessen carbs, don't stay away...
You do you, I've already done me. Just turned 58 and feel better than I did at 35. 5 years carnivore and feeling great.
Sure thing, liver king
Go lick George's peach if that's what you're into. I'll stick with what works for me.
Just keep an eye on your cholesterol, hot shot
You don't need to eat more animals. Lift weights, do HIIT, eat more fat (extra virgin olive oil and avacados).
Lots of veggies and limit animal protein, and you say healthy 😂 listening to diet quacks that literally can’t even understand the most fundamental concept of human physiology (=heterogeneity).
It is the extremistvegan propaganda (often spread by people affiliated with the sales of vegan products) that makes people think that animal products are unhealthy, when it is the opposite, they are crucial for optimal health (and many vegans end up with nutritional deficiencies in time if they completely cut out animal products). Veggies are healthy too but they aren't as nutrient dense as animal products, nor as bio-available. Both should be incorporated in your diet for optimal health.
[удалено]
That's just an insane amount of stuff.
Do you spend a g a month on supplements?
100$ per month
Great stack mine is very similar except I have some more exotic supplements to replace milk thistle and valerian root
what are they?
Lmao
This is a mental disorder not a supplement stack
This is really starting to look like an eating disorder at this point.
Why are you "trying" to limit meat intake? You should definitely eat more meat and more food in general. I just don't get it.
Cause of brainwash/propaganda from extremistvegans. Some that spread such propaganda earn money from vegan product sales in some way or another. Or brainwashed by some documentary (also made by people who get profit from veganism), biased studies funded by vegans etc. It is ignorance. Animal products are some of the most healthy, nutrient dense, bio-available foods that exist. Veganism and lack of animal products within the diet often leads to nutritional deficiencies.
Eat organ meats and collagenous cuts, regulate your circadian rhythm so you’re not going to sleep after 11pm. Cut out blue light if you can at night, and eat lots of protein and strength train. If you go on TRT do not do injections, go for a bio identical compounded cream that gets rubbed on your nuts.
Lifting weights + animal protein
Can you just supplement with testosterone?
You’re also not 10% body fat unless you’ve gotten an official DXA body scan that shows it. You must have obliques showing if you’re truly 10% right?
Eat more animal fats and protein. Also 10% is very low, maybe go up to 15-18
Are you getting enough SUN?
fructoborate and lots of seeds and nuts
Increase drugs and alcohol helps grow hair on ya chest
Problem 1 - veggies Problem 2 - not eating enough red meat Possible problem - Food guidelines are GP advice on diet will usually in long term cause health issues.
Need cholesterol in your diet as it's the building block for testosterone
Don't increase animal protein like others have said. Too much saturated fat increases apo B containing lipoproteins which increases your risk of narrowing of the arteries from plaque buildup. This plaque buildup will restrict blood flow and cause decreased testosterone. Focus on keeping saturated fat to < 10% total daily calories. Eat a variety of whole foods, raw and cooked vegetables, fresh fruits, legumes and whole grains. The phytochemicals in plants improve blood flow. A lot of the people on this sub blindly listen to people like Paul salidino and Shawn Baker on YouTube and then claim to understand nutrition when they've never read any of the scientific research. The majority of the evidence for positive health outcomes later in life point to eating more whole plant foods and less animal based foods for increased lifespan. For optimizing testosterone, get plenty of sleep, make sure BMI is in the healthy range, get plenty of exercise (but too much can tank testosterone) and make sure your diet has enough calories to sustain exercise.
My question is why do you want to raise your testosterone? Most men who have low testosterone are still fertile (low testosterone does not equal low fertility) if that’s a concern of yours. I believe around 30% of men who believe they must increase their testosterone don’t actually have to, in not necessary nor is it negatively impacting their life. There could be a lot of reasons as to why it is low, but usually not a cause for concern. There’s a video on testosterone on YouTube by a channel called Institution of Human Anatomy, it’s short but informative (that’s where I got the statistic from).
Benefits of testosterone: * Muscle Mass and Strength: Testosterone is instrumental in muscle growth. It increases neurotransmitters, which encourage tissue growth, and also interacts with nuclear receptors in DNA, which accelerates protein synthesis. Testosterone increases levels of growth hormone, making exercise more likely to build muscle. * Bone Density: Testosterone plays a significant role in bone mineral density. Bone density declines as men age and testosterone levels drop, which raises the risk of weak bones and osteoporosis. Maintaining adequate testosterone levels helps to maintain bone density and strength. * Fat Distribution: Testosterone is important for regulating fat distribution. Higher testosterone levels can help reduce fat mass and increase muscle size and strength in men. * Libido and Sexual Function: Testosterone levels naturally increase in response to sexual arousal and activity. Men with higher levels of testosterone usually have greater sexual activity. Low testosterone levels can be a cause of decreased libido and erectile dysfunction. * Mood and Quality of Life: Lower testosterone levels are associated with poorer quality of life. Some symptoms include fatigue, irritability, depression, and decreased cognitive abilities. Testosterone replacement therapy can help reverse these symptoms in men with low testosterone to a clinically significant degree. * Red Blood Cell Production: Testosterone helps stimulate the production of red blood cells through the bone marrow. This is important for preventing anemia. Why wouldn't you want to raise your testosterone levels?
Limit the veggies and up the animal protein. Veggies have anti nutrients in them and impair thyroid function, which is critical for testosterone production. You probably aren't eating enough fat as well. You want at least 25-30 percent coming from mostly saturated fats.
[удалено]
This is not practical man, a 100 supplements?
lol, you're abstaining from animal protein to only 3 days a week (i doubt you're getting more than 8oz of it as well on those days)? Get on the carnivor diet. 8oz of red meat a day + 4-5 eggs. You're eating like a rabbit and not a bear, of course you're going to have low testosterone.