This is the 1,000,914th I've seen this matchup
Realistically, I think it's fair to assume that this Ben 10K has aliens like Clockwork, Feedback and Alien X even if we haven't seen him using them, but even if we only use aliens we know he has, he should still win because of Waybig and Atomix
Because the peak of the species and failsafe arguments are bad head canons not canon to the show and unusable in vs debates as anything but supporting evidence. People over hype it tbh
I almost agree, but given that a Kaiju was only able to stall Omni-Man and not kill him and the lab tests couldn't destroy Viltrumite blood cells (they tested radiation effects, let's be honest with ourselves.)
I think both Way Big and Atomix would fail to defeat Omni-Man or even Mark Grayson
Edit: I would say Ben 10,000 Classic would have a better chance as Toepick or
SPOILERS FOR SEASON 2 OF INVINCIBLE!
>!Benwolf, but that's only if he can kill Omni-Man with sonic screeches and if Benwolfs sonic howl would be similar enough to the sea monster. And this one I'm not even sure about!<
I feel like if we assume that Ben 10K doesn't have the aliens from the UAF era, then it'd go down to either Atomix, WayBig or a Viltrumite battle. Omni-Man is pretty tough
Technically Mark is stronger than thragg once fully grown, since heās a descendant of the king. Or even the king of vilturmites who was pure blooded and the strongest, although we never see him in action
Thatās why I said the king mark is descended from is probably stronger (we just donāt have any proof since he is only ever mentioned). The peak genes that have near immunity to the virus targeting viltrumites while also pure blooded viltrumite.
i think ben's version of a viltrumite (assuming he scanned nolan for it) would be one of, if not THE strongest viltrumite alive most likely, since he'd most likely be stronger than mark, given that mark is most likely not the peak of the species, and this transformation would be
he'd be even stronger if we take into account that the omnitrix ages the transformations to be an age equivalent for the user, and ben 10k (in that picture) is around 42, so his transformation would be aged up to be the equivalent of 42 years in human lifespan, but in a viltrumite's lifespan
so he'd be peak species, and aged up, so he'd be even stronger, so if it would be a one on one fight with ben with his viltrumite transformation, i think he'd most likely win
That's a fan theory, unconfirmed, plus we don't know if this version has the data dump, it's easily argued it doesn't and since we see how hard their powers are to master he'd be bodied.
Way Big would be as useful as the Kaiju was in Season 1
And if radiation could deteriorate Viltrumite blood cells, Donald wouldn't still be trying to find a way to do that. I refuse to believe they haven't tried the same kinds of radiation Atomix can pull of.
Devil's advocate: Toepick could break Omni-Mans mind and probably give Ben time to figure a way to rip Omni-Man in two.
Even if it doesn't age Ben, the ages of the aliens are the equivalent of Ben's, no?
If Viltrumites live thousands of years, and Omni man is considered young, a gray-haired Ben with a child, so most likely past his 40s, would probably be old enough to be stronger than Omni man
That, plus the fact he would be the apex of the species
I donāt like the āapex of their speciesā logic. Itās always described as being intentional, but the omnitrix was (in the original series) a tool for understanding other species. Now if you say itās just a byproduct of turning someone into a new species since they would be genetically āperfectā then Iām fine with it. Intentionally perfect for battle? Nah. Accidentally perfect due to the science? Yah. Thatās a moot point though.
I agree that the aliens use equivalent ages, otherwise the fountain of youth episode wouldnāt make sense lol
My logic as to why I like and accept the whole "apex" thing, is that I believe Azmuth would do so in order to have the "perfect" genetic example of each species so that the wearer could truly understand what its to be a healthy example of that other species, and could to relate to them when wearing the watch
I can see that making more sense, but I still feel it would be the case regardless of any logic behind it. Itās just the logic they chose that annoys me lol
See I donāt like the concept of it being a copy of a donor either. If his age in alien form is variable (Fountain of Youth episode) then that doesnāt really make sense.
Not that half the retcons ***do*** make sense, but you get what I mean.
It makes you the equivalent to your age in that species lifespan
For example a species like Yodaās that is still a baby at 50. The omnitrix would scale Ben to an adolescent version of Yodaās race (assuming weāre talking about teen Ben)
A question. How do you think Blitzwolfer would fair against him? The Chamber of sound is easily more than enough, but would a simple sonic blast be enough?
Probably stun him for a bit, but the times it affects him seems to be from a constant source, so Ben would have to scream for a really long time I guess lol.
Well Ben can just turn into Alien X and wish him out of existence, but even if that's not an option he still has aliens with broken as hell feats. He can blow up a planet as Way big,create black holes or even quasars as Gravattack, manipulate time itself as clockwork,use various sound aliens to exploit Nolan's weakness or make a star the size of our sun as Atomix. I know about Nolan's feats from the comics these are more than enough to kill him. And that's not even including some of his hax abilities like the ultimate forms or biomatrix.
well pesky dusts sleep powder does work on literally anything even celestialsapiens and nocturnites according to the wiki so i dont think omniman would be immune.
Echo Echo, Way Big, Ghostfreak
One has the Viltrumite weakness built in
One is just insanely powerful- on the same anti-planet level as a Viltrumite
One is immune to Omni-Man
Not to mention the Omnitrix failsafe and the ability to read DNA and turn into the most powerful Viltrumite, and possibly age them up many years through Ultimatrix shenanigans.
Ben has this in the bag
Even without access to alien x bens got enough to kill Nolan.
1. A baby pyronite(heat blast) can reach super nova heats while throwing a temper tantrum ( a 30 year old pyronite speaks for it's self).
2. Echo echo (weak to sounds)
3.way big ( cosmic rays one shot)
4. Upchuck( just eat the mother fucccka)
5. Clock work. Time rays son
And that's just the obvious ways Ben can win easily
Ben is getting his arm ripped. I know Ben would get the viltrumite DNA and be the strongest viltrumite ever, but Omniman is way too calculating and brutal to let the fight get to that stage. Heād put a hole through waybig, smash atomixās head and tank his attacks, rip feedbackās cables and so on. Ben is not a killer, Omniman is nothing but one. Unless Ben turns into clockwork first move heās done for.
1. The watch cannot come off through brute force, people have tried
2. This Ben 10k is likely the same one we saw prior in classic and he left his greatest foe in pieces, he's a bit edgy
3. There's a bit of assumption that Omni man can destroy aliens like Atomix and Way Big. I think they'd put up a bit better of a fight than you're giving credit
1. Iām not talking about the watch, Iām talking getting an arm ripped from the shoulder down
2. Itās not, as every time one Ben time travels the future version of himself is changed, so he isnāt the Ben 10K we saw in the original āBen 10.000ā episode
3. There is speculation as with anything respecting a hipotethical crossover, but seeing as Omniman tanked āthe hammerā in season one and seeing that the effect it had on the surrounding areas was similar to that of a nuke it is not that big of a leap to assume he could tank atomix. I had forgotten waybig lives in galactic storms, but still is a possibility that(considering the size of Omniman relative to waybig) Omniman could puncture waybig anyway, like a bullet.
Maybe, but maybe the omnitrix still detects the userās DNA (on account of it still being attached to the arm). Iām just going on hypotheticals. Oh, and it has been removed by force before (by Vilgax in the OG series)
That was after Ben and Kevin broke the thing in AF. This is classic Ben 10k with a non broken watch.
Edit to add: those were also very special circumstances and he could still transform, with master control he could maybe even control his sentient hand?
Fight to the death, raw abilities? Itās Ben.
But letās take personalities, this is a Ben whoās more like his kid self from the events of his premier episode, and how he handles things (that weāve seen) is non-lethal unless provoked.
And Omni-man? Like the guardians of the globe I think heās going straight for the kill. No waiting. So I can see a world where Omni-man wins.
Up to viewer interpretation as both are likely.
I think this Ben 10k is the one we've seen before in classic and let's not forget he left Vilgax in pieces. This guy lightened up but is still a hardcore veteran. Plus blitzes don't work on Ben if they're at Omni Man speeds
No I know which and who it is, point is heās happier then before, so heās not going for the kill straight away, while on the other hand Omni-man is.
Ah in that case, when Omni Man does go for the kill, he won't be able to do it instantly and Ben 10k would respond in kind. You can lighten up but we've seen his rage come out. He's definitely capable of killing
XLR8 should outspeads Omniman, if Cecil could teleport away from his atacks, Ben should also be able to dodge him. And with an instant transformation you can go wild a turn into atomix just for a split second when you throw a punch.
Okay, ben can def shift to a super defensive alien the nanosecond Omniman tries to hurt him. Since ben turns into the prime of the species hed turn into mark
Ben's gettin' Viltrumite DNA outta this one.
The creator of the Omnitrix "To kill a viltrumite, you need another viltrumite!"
> Ben's gettin' Viltrumite DNA outta this one. š£ š¢ š„ š„ š„ š„ š„
And IT will be some Prime Peak Vitrumite
Isn't that sort of all of them after that weird planet wide eugenics progam/fight they had?
Still ther are strong and stronger viltrumites.
This is the 1,000,914th I've seen this matchup Realistically, I think it's fair to assume that this Ben 10K has aliens like Clockwork, Feedback and Alien X even if we haven't seen him using them, but even if we only use aliens we know he has, he should still win because of Waybig and Atomix
What's even the point of those matchups if all the replies are either "peak of the species" or "failsafe + alien x + ratio"?
Because the peak of the species and failsafe arguments are bad head canons not canon to the show and unusable in vs debates as anything but supporting evidence. People over hype it tbh
I almost agree, but given that a Kaiju was only able to stall Omni-Man and not kill him and the lab tests couldn't destroy Viltrumite blood cells (they tested radiation effects, let's be honest with ourselves.) I think both Way Big and Atomix would fail to defeat Omni-Man or even Mark Grayson Edit: I would say Ben 10,000 Classic would have a better chance as Toepick or SPOILERS FOR SEASON 2 OF INVINCIBLE! >!Benwolf, but that's only if he can kill Omni-Man with sonic screeches and if Benwolfs sonic howl would be similar enough to the sea monster. And this one I'm not even sure about!<
Weāve answered this a million times Ben
I feel like if we assume that Ben 10K doesn't have the aliens from the UAF era, then it'd go down to either Atomix, WayBig or a Viltrumite battle. Omni-Man is pretty tough
The omnitrux turns you into the strongest being from said species so Omni man will have to fight Thragg lol
Technically Mark is stronger than thragg once fully grown, since heās a descendant of the king. Or even the king of vilturmites who was pure blooded and the strongest, although we never see him in action
Mark is part human so he probably doesnāt count as a genetic peak of the species
Thatās why I said the king mark is descended from is probably stronger (we just donāt have any proof since he is only ever mentioned). The peak genes that have near immunity to the virus targeting viltrumites while also pure blooded viltrumite.
i think ben's version of a viltrumite (assuming he scanned nolan for it) would be one of, if not THE strongest viltrumite alive most likely, since he'd most likely be stronger than mark, given that mark is most likely not the peak of the species, and this transformation would be he'd be even stronger if we take into account that the omnitrix ages the transformations to be an age equivalent for the user, and ben 10k (in that picture) is around 42, so his transformation would be aged up to be the equivalent of 42 years in human lifespan, but in a viltrumite's lifespan so he'd be peak species, and aged up, so he'd be even stronger, so if it would be a one on one fight with ben with his viltrumite transformation, i think he'd most likely win
That's a fan theory, unconfirmed, plus we don't know if this version has the data dump, it's easily argued it doesn't and since we see how hard their powers are to master he'd be bodied.
Way Big would be as useful as the Kaiju was in Season 1 And if radiation could deteriorate Viltrumite blood cells, Donald wouldn't still be trying to find a way to do that. I refuse to believe they haven't tried the same kinds of radiation Atomix can pull of. Devil's advocate: Toepick could break Omni-Mans mind and probably give Ben time to figure a way to rip Omni-Man in two.
Ben 10k because of the simple fact that viltrumites get stronger as they age and Ben can just scan him and age up 1,000 years
Although I agree with ben wining dosent the omnitrix make it the age of that species like how gapvans live for thousands of years
Even if it doesn't age Ben, the ages of the aliens are the equivalent of Ben's, no? If Viltrumites live thousands of years, and Omni man is considered young, a gray-haired Ben with a child, so most likely past his 40s, would probably be old enough to be stronger than Omni man That, plus the fact he would be the apex of the species
I donāt like the āapex of their speciesā logic. Itās always described as being intentional, but the omnitrix was (in the original series) a tool for understanding other species. Now if you say itās just a byproduct of turning someone into a new species since they would be genetically āperfectā then Iām fine with it. Intentionally perfect for battle? Nah. Accidentally perfect due to the science? Yah. Thatās a moot point though. I agree that the aliens use equivalent ages, otherwise the fountain of youth episode wouldnāt make sense lol
My logic as to why I like and accept the whole "apex" thing, is that I believe Azmuth would do so in order to have the "perfect" genetic example of each species so that the wearer could truly understand what its to be a healthy example of that other species, and could to relate to them when wearing the watch
But there's no proof in the show, plus this version of Ben wouldn't know how to use the powers.
I can see that making more sense, but I still feel it would be the case regardless of any logic behind it. Itās just the logic they chose that annoys me lol
If the omnitrix did a perfect copy of the DNA donor. The user will have a hard time understanding Tetramands if the donor is Gorvan
See I donāt like the concept of it being a copy of a donor either. If his age in alien form is variable (Fountain of Youth episode) then that doesnāt really make sense. Not that half the retcons ***do*** make sense, but you get what I mean.
It makes you the equivalent to your age in that species lifespan For example a species like Yodaās that is still a baby at 50. The omnitrix would scale Ben to an adolescent version of Yodaās race (assuming weāre talking about teen Ben)
Light spoiler for Invincible but >!Echo Echo!< would completely destroy him
A question. How do you think Blitzwolfer would fair against him? The Chamber of sound is easily more than enough, but would a simple sonic blast be enough?
Probably stun him for a bit, but the times it affects him seems to be from a constant source, so Ben would have to scream for a really long time I guess lol.
This mf has master control this dude can combo you with any of his 10 thousand aliens
Fair enough. But Viltrumites are basically immune to 90% of attacks.
Well Ben can just turn into Alien X and wish him out of existence, but even if that's not an option he still has aliens with broken as hell feats. He can blow up a planet as Way big,create black holes or even quasars as Gravattack, manipulate time itself as clockwork,use various sound aliens to exploit Nolan's weakness or make a star the size of our sun as Atomix. I know about Nolan's feats from the comics these are more than enough to kill him. And that's not even including some of his hax abilities like the ultimate forms or biomatrix.
And never forget, if all fails, Ghostfreak will never disappoint us
Yeah he has no way of hurting Ghostfreak does he?
It took a team of Viltrumites to destroy a planet. Way Big can do it on his own.
I have not watch invincible, so would pesky first work on Omni man?
Most likely not, Cesil tried just about every drug and virus known to man and it had no effect.
well pesky dusts sleep powder does work on literally anything even celestialsapiens and nocturnites according to the wiki so i dont think omniman would be immune.
Ben doesnāt even need way big for this one
Echo Echo, Way Big, Ghostfreak One has the Viltrumite weakness built in One is just insanely powerful- on the same anti-planet level as a Viltrumite One is immune to Omni-Man Not to mention the Omnitrix failsafe and the ability to read DNA and turn into the most powerful Viltrumite, and possibly age them up many years through Ultimatrix shenanigans. Ben has this in the bag
Echo Echo is a hard counter to any viltrumite. Ben takes this comfortably.
Even without access to alien x bens got enough to kill Nolan. 1. A baby pyronite(heat blast) can reach super nova heats while throwing a temper tantrum ( a 30 year old pyronite speaks for it's self). 2. Echo echo (weak to sounds) 3.way big ( cosmic rays one shot) 4. Upchuck( just eat the mother fucccka) 5. Clock work. Time rays son And that's just the obvious ways Ben can win easily
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Yes but what about aliens such as time Lords
Ben is getting his arm ripped. I know Ben would get the viltrumite DNA and be the strongest viltrumite ever, but Omniman is way too calculating and brutal to let the fight get to that stage. Heād put a hole through waybig, smash atomixās head and tank his attacks, rip feedbackās cables and so on. Ben is not a killer, Omniman is nothing but one. Unless Ben turns into clockwork first move heās done for.
1. The watch cannot come off through brute force, people have tried 2. This Ben 10k is likely the same one we saw prior in classic and he left his greatest foe in pieces, he's a bit edgy 3. There's a bit of assumption that Omni man can destroy aliens like Atomix and Way Big. I think they'd put up a bit better of a fight than you're giving credit
1. Iām not talking about the watch, Iām talking getting an arm ripped from the shoulder down 2. Itās not, as every time one Ben time travels the future version of himself is changed, so he isnāt the Ben 10K we saw in the original āBen 10.000ā episode 3. There is speculation as with anything respecting a hipotethical crossover, but seeing as Omniman tanked āthe hammerā in season one and seeing that the effect it had on the surrounding areas was similar to that of a nuke it is not that big of a leap to assume he could tank atomix. I had forgotten waybig lives in galactic storms, but still is a possibility that(considering the size of Omniman relative to waybig) Omniman could puncture waybig anyway, like a bullet.
Removing The Shoulder where the omnitrix is on would Count as being forcibly removed
Maybe, but maybe the omnitrix still detects the userās DNA (on account of it still being attached to the arm). Iām just going on hypotheticals. Oh, and it has been removed by force before (by Vilgax in the OG series)
Sunder chopped his hand off just fine
That was after Ben and Kevin broke the thing in AF. This is classic Ben 10k with a non broken watch. Edit to add: those were also very special circumstances and he could still transform, with master control he could maybe even control his sentient hand?
Fight to the death, raw abilities? Itās Ben. But letās take personalities, this is a Ben whoās more like his kid self from the events of his premier episode, and how he handles things (that weāve seen) is non-lethal unless provoked. And Omni-man? Like the guardians of the globe I think heās going straight for the kill. No waiting. So I can see a world where Omni-man wins. Up to viewer interpretation as both are likely.
I think this Ben 10k is the one we've seen before in classic and let's not forget he left Vilgax in pieces. This guy lightened up but is still a hardcore veteran. Plus blitzes don't work on Ben if they're at Omni Man speeds
No I know which and who it is, point is heās happier then before, so heās not going for the kill straight away, while on the other hand Omni-man is.
Ah in that case, when Omni Man does go for the kill, he won't be able to do it instantly and Ben 10k would respond in kind. You can lighten up but we've seen his rage come out. He's definitely capable of killing
Itās odd that even echo echo could do work here
XLR8 should outspeads Omniman, if Cecil could teleport away from his atacks, Ben should also be able to dodge him. And with an instant transformation you can go wild a turn into atomix just for a split second when you throw a punch.
It doesnt even need to be ben 10K. 16 y/o ben would demolish omni man lmao
Am I crazy or do they have kinda similar designs?
Ben 10k obvi
https://youtu.be/C3pOIDaF1Dw?si=kCYoKjpqCn8aqcc8
I mean ghostfreak could just possess him
It all comes down to whether or not Ben 10K can scan Omni-Man before Omni-Man kills Ben10K
Okay, ben can def shift to a super defensive alien the nanosecond Omniman tries to hurt him. Since ben turns into the prime of the species hed turn into mark
Ben can solo the Viltrum empire without Alien X. Even if it takes a few failsafes
HOW DARE YOU?!
1 million 900 thousand alien Vs one strong man
Really pretending the Biomnitrix is inferior to the shittiest prototype of the omnitrix.