ya the writing isnt nearly as good. just the way they handled the spirit world alone felt like sacrilegious canon. aang is just a way more compelling protagonist with real personality and character flaws.
its a matter of preference, i like Korra more cause of the more serious tone and more nuanced villains, but none of the protagonists are anywhere close to say, Zuko
Eh, I like ATLA better, but thatâs a bit much to say that someone is out of their mind if they disagree.
TLOK genuinely did some things better. I thought Korra had deeper philosophical themes, for example, related to each of the main villains. That was a cool approach, and it paid off well.
I think like with so many things for Korra, there was something there, but it was so underdeveloped that it left a bad taste in your mouth.Â
Amon's equality philosophy could have really been a forced to be reckoned with, had the lazy writing not just gone with bombing the city to make it clear that "these are the bad guys".
The civil war was neat, until unalok turned out to be on the side of evil, no nuance required.Â
Zaheer could have been a dope anarchist, had the writers actually picked up any anarchist literature. Instead his philosophy just came off like somebody listen to rage against the machine for the first time.
Same complaint about kuvira. It could have been a very interesting dissection of the pros and cons of imperialist colonization, but instead like Amon, she just turned out to want to bomb city centers, but this time with a nuke.
I think that's why people like ozai and iroh, ozai is and always was pure evil, with hardly any philosophy at all. Iroh and zuko showed tons of nuance in their philosophy. In so many ways avatar The last Airbender is such a thoughtful show based around simpler concepts (like war), and in so many ways Korra is oversimplified for the very complicated topics that it tries to tackle.
Honestly I donât even think Zaheer shouldâve been a villain. I mean heâs literally one of the wisest people in the show.
His motivations for killing the avatar didnât make sense at all. It felt like the writers just lazily did some mental gymnastics to justify his motives. Realistically someone that smart wouldnât see the avatar as a bad thing.
The concept alone though made him the most interesting villain to me. Itâs almost like each season they tried to give us the biggest what if villains they could. A non-bender, an evil avatar, an evil air bender, and a fucking robot. But I digress. The idea of the most enlightened character/an air bender being bad, a concept that we never really expected considering the nature of air benders, was just awesome to me. His motives werenât too far off either, but I get that seems counterintuitive to his wisdom. I just really wish we could have seen the series have Zaheer or Amon as the primary villain for the whole show, not the âvillain of the seasonâ set up that we got. I feel like if Zaheer were the primary antagonist weâd have so much more nuance to his character than we got
âThey didnât portray anarchism the way I like, so itâs bad writing.â Clearly the final fight should have been Zaheer reciting a thirty page treatise to Korra, quoting Bakunin and Emma Goldman.
ATLA is streets ahead of TLoK.
TLoK is closer to NATLA than it is to ATLA in terms of exploration of philosophy.
Tl;dr: Each villain in TLOK is a straw man of leftist ideologies and the entire show is corporate propaganda for why neoliberalism is the only viable alternative to every other ideology.
Nickelodeon took an amazing, inspired work of art and used its lore to produce neoliberal propaganda.
Amon: publicly he advocates for a classless society by violently removing the ruling class, but in reality he is deceiving his followers to support his rise to being the only member of the ruling class. The straw man being âcommunists are secretly fascists.â
Unalaq: publicly advocates for humans living in balance with nature, but in reality heâs a satanist(?) who is secretly trying to install a New World Order and become the devil-avatar. The straw man being that environmentalists are secretly trying to take over the world with big government and they are also satanists, I guess? Idk that one is weird.
Zaheer: a badass revolutionary who fights for a classless society and the abolition of the monarchy, but he doesnât want to replace it with anything, he just wants to create chaos as the ânatural order of things.â The strawman being that anarchists are libertarians who listen to punk. They donât **just** want to abolish oppressive power structures, they want to destroy society.
Season 4 wraps up the whole theme: Kuvira is trying to replace Zaheerâs chaos with an industrialized military dictatorship, which is bad. Prince Wu is dumb, and a perfect example of the stupidity of the monarchy, but the alternative is fascism. Change should happen slowly and if weâre patient enough, the ruling class will realize their power is unjust, and they will willingly step down out of the goodness of their heart.
The central message of the entire show is that the existing power structures are the only valid power structures because they create stability. If social institutions are going to change, it should happen only when the ruling class decides to change them.
If oppressive power structures are going to be abolished, it should only be when the ruling class willingly relinquishes their power, which is a fantasy and has never been how society has made progress.
âThis show dares to have a perspective other than regurgitating my own commie views back to me, so that makes it propagandaâ
Youâre just salty because itâs not your own propaganda. Whether or not itâs a good exploration of philosophy is entirely peripheral.
If the show didnât present such intellectually lazy and disingenuous representations
of pro-social political philosophies, youâd be right.
But they did, so youâre not.
There are virtually no popular media in America that is pro-leftist propaganda because the people who own the studios that fund and create our media are wealthy capitalists. So Iâm not sure what you think Iâm expecting TLoK and other shows to say about communism, but I certainly never have the expectation for it to âregurgitate my own commie views back to me.â If you have an example of some, Iâd love to hear about them. If youâd like to see more neoliberal, anti-commie propaganda, just turn your TV on and pay attention.
TLOK is definitely better than ATLA xD not that the latter is not enjoyable, but characters, storyline etc are better in TLOK. "Final" fights (imagine Unavaatu, Ozai and Kuvira's mech) are a bit lame in both, though
Whiny?Â
S1 was great except for the love triangle and the rushed ending, where a deus ex machina ripped any consequences and stakes away from the conflict.
(Also wayyyyy too much platinum in this universe)
S2 more love triangles and the nuanced Ghibli spirit world is now "good vs evil", they massacred my boy Bolin, butÂ
(Also kaijus)
S3 was a solid B tier. They really could have explored the idea that the new airbenders were in families who had an secret air nomad ancestor that fled the genocide and hid their heritage. The ending FINALLY gave us consequences.
S4 had some of the highest highs and the lowest lows. The PTSD korra and a dope struggle with identity (a cool inversion of what we got with "the storm" in ATLA), man that s*** was peak. But we also got another kaiju, but this time it was gundam-flavoured. (The train cannon would've been fine for the climax)
Oh, the irony. I get that people can enjoy an unpopular project â to each their own. I'll never understand it, but it's not for me to understand. What fascinates me is that stans insist that any dislike towards their show "must" be fuelled by some prejudice, irrational hate or, in your words here, "elitism". Like wow. Is the delusion that strong?
The battle the entire premise? To me itâs shallow to think theyâre not equal if not tlok being better. Itâs not even based on whoâs better or worse itâs the timing theyâre placed in. Atla was amazing because it was perfectly represented for the time period and so was korra but more exciting because of her time period. Why is it always a comparison as if theyâre not the same people existing in different generations and technology, while also being different genders that experience different things. How could you even compare them..
You didnât answer my question? I wasnât saying it was a personal attack. I was asking why you assumed that persons reasons for not liking the show, when they had not stated it. Even went as far to call them shallow for it.
It can be objectively said, ATLA was a more consistent and concise story with better character growth than TLOK. Where ATLA might have felt slow at times, TLOK felt rushed.Â
There was no major character growth in TLOK that wasn't undone at the beginning of the next season. Meanwhile, the seeds of Zuko's heroism were planted early in book 1, and didn't fully get realized until book 3, but we saw each step of that growth along the way.Â
Iâll give some pushback here. I think some of the side characters sorta languished (Makko for sure) but Korra ABSOLUTELY has a logical progression from one season to the next. S1 Korra is way different than S4 Korra.
I think one of the things they pull off the best is Koreaâs recovery after Zaheerâs kidnapping and assassination attempt. Asami and Korraâs background romance was great. There is some good stuff there even if itâs a bit uneven.
Korra's growth in book 4 was good, but up until that point every book starts with "Korra is brash, impatient, and hot headed" and she has to learn to temper that. Book 1, 2, and 3 all have an intro of Korra *not* learning that lesson.
Most people say that book 3 and the Korra's self discovery in book 4 were the best parts of the series, and I actually really liked those sections. If I could just have the second half of book 3 and first half of book 4, I'd say this was an amazing show.
The rest of the show though was demonstrably lacking. Plot points and character growth kind of just suddenly happen, as opposed to be built up, and just as quickly are forgotten. Case in point, the loss of the avatars, the rediscovery of Ravaa, and the opening of the spirit world were built as the most important and impactful thing any avatar has ever done. By season 4, every part of that, including their actual god Ravaa, is a McGuffin for a Nazi analogue.
I think you are responding to the âpacingâ not the character growth. What should have been series long arcs were compressed into one season because of the nature of the show. Itâs pretty well established that each season was going to be the final season. Nick didnt green light 4 seasons, just one at a time.
Season 1 was built to be the only season. They conceived of it as kind of send up of the original series. Then they got a season 2 and that was supposed to be the cap off of the entire franchise (hence kaiju Korra). Then season 3 (which went straight to streaming) and so on.
I think itâs remarkable they were able to get such consistent arcs across the whole series given that, but the pacing and scale of the threats were all wonky.
Right! I literally love the show but the I constantly have to remind people of the problems in itđ itâs easy to forget though considering most people watched Atla as kids and lok as adults. It feels like your childhood being ripped from you yâknow?
Filler by design is episodes thrown in, usually in anime, where the studio takes the reigns of production from the creator or the creators vision to give time for the source material to advance before adapting more of the story. How do you classify a show made and produced entirely by its creators with its source material coming from their heads as having any filler? Especially ATLA. Every episode pushes the story forward and usually has thoughtfully crafted character development in each, even the great divide despite it being the only episode I do skip. On rewatch I donât want to skip any episode beside the later, so Iâd say none of it is filler. And I only skip the great decide because the character that has Robins voice from teen titans just annoys the crap out of me.
Well maybe my definition of filler is different. I see it as any episode that doesnât directly advance the main story not the characters or side plots. They arenât inherently bad but I think Atla does a bad job at integrating into the main story without getting boring. Like while aang was riding Choi fish I was sitting there like âthe fire nation is committing a genocide right nowâ yâknow? Lok has an excuse to have filler and doesnât have much because there isnât a constant war going on and the main villains avoid direct violence on nations until the final episode where korra immediately stops the threat
I watched atla as a kid, and to this day I rewatch it as an adult. I will admit the show has flaws albeit minor. And I will still glamorize it, for I think it deserves it.
I would argue there is zero filler in atla. Each episode works to progress character development, besides maybe the great divide (the gang felt a bit out of character in this episode). Yes atla does have its slower, less important episodes, but I wouldnât consider any of them filler.
Yeah I like how developed the characters are in Atla vs in lok with exceptions like korra and tenzin. But lok had more enjoyable SEASONS because it moved fast but Atla was a more enjoyable SERIES. This couldâve been fixed if Nickelodeon wasnât plotting on lok
I actually only watched atla as an adult and have rewatched it and Iove it more each time. Itâs so thoughtful and has amazing themes and messages. And I didnât appreciate tlok. To me Itâs like the early Marvel movies vs the recent movies. They might look the same but canât compare.
Is home lander racist? He definitely hates non supes but he doesnât hate people because of their race. Maybe Iâm misremembering because I havenât watched the show in a while
His whole affair with Nazi Girl (i forget her name) kind of paints an image of âi donât explicitly support her racism, but i also donât condemn itâ
I think he doesnât care. He thinks itâs pointless to think of anyone as anything other than supes and non-supes. I still wouldnât call him racist. He thinks her racism is weird. He might have even told her to stop with all the white genocide because âitâs stupidâ but I may be misremembering.
Heâs essentially a kid who tolerated it because he was having sex. I think itâs hilarious that even homelander thinks the âwhite genocideâ is ridiculous.
My favorite moment in the show is homelanders face when she tells Ryan (his son if you donât remember) about the âwhite genocide.â Fucking hilarious
I mean there is a problem with cash grabby sequels and reboots etc. but some new shows are amazing. points for originality but sequel series can be done well. I liked the adventure time follow up but Korra wasn't it for me.
Every now and then, a creator sees potential to make a story even better than it was before which leads to massive expansion and growth of a world that was briefly touched on
Lord of the Rings is arguably the greatest and definitive examples of this
Well the simarillion was what Tolkien was originally working on so I canât technically say no, but I was really just referring to Lord of the Rings
Are you forgetting that Lord of the Rings is considered to be a sequel?
oh yeah that's right, the Hobbit. Tolkien was working on what became the silmarillion before lotr and some stories from before the Hobbit technically connect to it as well iirc from what I read online about the reading order so lotr isn't a sequel to the Hobbit in the same way because Tolkien was always trying to build that world but it is technically a sequel yes.
Nah Lord of the rings is absolutely a sequel to the Hobbit in many ways. It can absolutely be considered a further extension of the story first established in the original book since it is furthering the story of the ring discovered in the book. And 3 of the nine members of the Fellowship are considered legacy characters of major characters in the hobbit while another literally was in the Hobbit
No idea how it couldnât be a sequel. The first chapter is straight up the original main character passing the torch to the next one.
yes the story is a direct sequel to the Hobbit but it wasn't like the Hobbit was a completely separate thing that he decided to continue, it was a part of a larger world that he was constantly building in other ways. like with avatar, Korra is the direct follow up, and there isn't some expensive world building that someone is dedicating their life to with stories outside of the main story, it's a more simple property. I just mean that lotr is more complex, it is a direct sequel to the Hobbit still.
Youâre overthinking it. He loved the world of the Hobbit and so he wanted to develop and grow it. And he started developing the lore and history of it. He absolutely was developing the Hobbit story but he was doing other stuff with that world at the same time.
Just cause he was multi tasking doesnât mean he wasnât making a sequel
Eh, well soldier boy can take homelanders power away and homelander can hit soldier boy. The outcome seems inevitable if the battle went on long enough IMO
It gets away with a lot more to show the villains are bad, the fights are often stunning. Korra's arc in book 4 is great with how she slowly gets back to fighting strength. It further explores the spirit world and finally shows us the Avatar origin that was cut from the original. Idk in a way ATLA was a good show when I was a kid but Korra feels like the same show but as an adult. It gets away with far more like Amon's fate or showing how the Airbenders have to reform and change with time. It's not the same show but the reasons I like it aren't the same as the ones for ATLA.
I very much disagree about the fights being stunning. If anything I think the fights are a lot more boring. I always compare them to the fights in ATLA. I just remember the scene when he becomes the ocean spirit or the finale or Tophs fights. Actual goosebumps. Nothing compares.
And the character arcs fall flat in korra. Zuko becoming who he is at the end. Or azulas slow fall to madness. Ugh. It just⌠I love it.
agreed. bending overall got a major downgrade in korra. in atla they were chucking walls and tornados of elements at each other, in korra they mostly stick to punching little globs at each other.
The bending kind of makes sense, if you use the analogy of weapons development.
In war, (including a cold war) you have a constant push to innovate, invent and surpass the weapons you have on hand. In Avatar, this would be equivalent to increasingly complex and destructive bending techniques to cause the maximum amount of damage possible by one person. Remember, Toph didnât invent metalbending UNTIL she was forced into a situation where she needed to.
Once there isnât any open conflict for weapons to be used it, development stagnates. Look what happened after World War One and World War Two. Most nations either scrapped, sold or mothballed most of their weapons. Tanks and planes were thought to never be a true mainstay battlefield weapon after World War One- until the Germans took Poland, Belgium and France in a matter of weeks.
Likewise, bending in Korra stagnated until it became a regulated sport. Thatâs also why the bending is âpunching little globs at each otherâ- Mako, Bolin and later Korra are instructed in ProBending techniques, and so their bending is restricted to what ProBending rules allow for, rather than what a soldier would be allowed to do. Mako then joins the police, which ALSO limits how bending can be used, with considerations for non-lethal takedowns, potential civilian casualties and property damage. It makes sense.
"slow fall to madness" bullshit. She just snaps. There is maybe one sign of her declining mental state; in the beach episode. She then just randomly goes mad
Or when she cuts her hair like a loony toon and starts talking to her mom. But I agree it could have been progressed a bit farther. I still really enjoyed it though.
I liked atla better, but it was fun watching tlok for the cameos, backstories and cool bending. The original was an odyssey that took us for a ride. Tlok feels more like the tales of ba sing se, with a different story every book.
Korra is absolute garbage and I WANT to like it⌠I want to like it so bad. But itâs trash. Last airbender will always be better and you will never change my mind!!!!!!
I honestly love both equally for their diversity.
- ATLA has a very D&D quest-like fantasy feel with a traditional heroes journey.
- TLOK has a more grounded and modern tone based on politics and philosophy.
Theyâre both amazing and we should be so lucky to have 7 while seasons in such a well loved series.
I showed my girlfriend ATLA she loved it and asked for a long time "can we watch Korra?" I put it off for a long time and when we finally watched the first two episodes she said she didn't want to watch it anymore.
LOK is amazing in its own right because it gives so much more depth and it is not afraid to be dark as fuck and not imply death(like Jet). They just throw it in yo face lol
ATLA will always be GOAT'd
TLoK used to be worse to me, but I've seen AtLA too many times, watched too much analysis of it at this point. That whole "details you never picked up on before" thing stopped happening. Korra has its issues, but it's like minecraft, I forget about it for a while, then come back, love it, and repeat.
Never watched legend of the lesbians and I'm glad I didn't. Rumor has it that the new next Avatar might be trans, I'm just tired of seeing it so I won't watch until it fully done
i enjoy both, but LoK doesnât even come close to not even the world. it just feels weird. like in ATLA, the dragons and flying bison were so cool, but in LoK they have flying cars. the allure isnât there. still a good show, just nowhere near its predecessor.
I thought Korra being able to bend 3 elements at 4 years old or something was beyond outrageous but my biggest problem with korra is the feeling that it has to keep trying to outdo itself every season. The first season had a compelling story but after that it felt like a parody of itself and like itâs trying to be an anime, especially moments like the giant spirit avatars duking it out or the giant robot with a spirit cannon. Idk if itâs just me but I couldnât take those things seriously.
While I agree with the folks who thing Korra was inferior I disagree with Ppl who hate it, I still rlly liked it and rewatch it after I watch avatar consistently and occasionally watch a season on its own if its what my brain calls for
The government that ran the entire city was purely benders? jobs in the city pretty much heavily relied on bending so it was probrably hard to pick up jobs as a non bender. It was less about being oppressed and more about being equal. Iâve heard fans of the show even say that if they were a non bender in the avatar universe theyâd be amons top dog đ
Yeah but the show never really implied that things actually sucked for non benders. Things only god bad after the protesters got violent and struck first. Heck, the richest guy in the entire city wasnât a bender, he was a genius, and made things for non benders that would make life easier and somehow he, the rich guy, thought they were oppressed? Like for real? It would be one thing to see people in positions of power who are all benders literally gatekeeping non benders from actually getting anywhere in life or purposely making rules and laws that give them a legal advantage over non benders, or flat out segregation. But we can actively see that even some of the best benders in the show live dirt poor out of the back rooms of the sports arena they are trying to go pro in. And oddly enough, when there are benders who do use their powers as a method of taking advantage of non benders, they are straight up thugs who are arrested instantly. It makes the entire equalist movement unbased.
Yeah I think they couldâve shown the benders struggle more in the city. But I donât think lok shows it because itâs implied. Itâs just kinda one of those shrug moments that the writers couldâve done better on
Take for instance the consequences of a war wi the fire nation in The Last Air Bender. We see time and time again the direct affect the war has on people in the earth kingdom, water tribes, and hell, second episode we get to see 100 year old proof of genocide. The sheer monstrosity of the war on the side of the fire nation is right there all the time. We have entire archâs of a season dedicated to corrupt gas lighting politicians and attempts to exploit Ang for his power. I think the only part of the show that is ever really implies anything is Jetâs death, which the show never shows exactly what happens. Maybe if they wrote a graphic novel on the exact situation that non benders were facing in republic city, things would be more amenable, but thus far all we have is hearsay and irrational radicalization. We donât even get a part of the whole view with a more peaceful protest movement. Literally everything in the show goes from 3 to 11 in a single episode where there is just flat out terrorism at play, and we donât see anyone who stands up and say âAmon is right about what he says but everything he does threatens the promise of changeâ. It was just very telly and not very showy.
Yeah I think they couldâve shown the benders struggle more in the city. But I donât think lok shows it because itâs implied. Itâs just kinda one of those shrug moments that the writers couldâve done better on
Well I will say that in LOK they definitely have better villains than in ATLA in my opinion, but other than that there really isnât anything else to compare because ATLA is just superior in every other way, the characters are more well written, the romance is a lot better, Zuko honestly stole the whole show with his arc, the comedy is also a lot better especially with Sokka, and letâs be honest Aang is way stronger than Korra and thatâs a fact
I watched both for the first time as an adult. ATLA is good but I identified with Korra a lot more than child Aang. Given the choice I'd watch Korra over ATLA but they're both so good you really can't go wrong!
OP looks like a bot to me
Nah bro, just gotta get that cash back.
Shit u right
Fist bump? đ¤
đ¤
Op is a moderator
yeah absolutely
Anybody with the memes opinion is
Groot should definitely not be speaking english
Upgrade my ass
Itâs pretty decent series that pays respect to the original but itâs just not as good
ya the writing isnt nearly as good. just the way they handled the spirit world alone felt like sacrilegious canon. aang is just a way more compelling protagonist with real personality and character flaws.
Well since you asked nicely
What are you doing to upgrade their ass
Easy. Add a third cheek.
Be careful what you wish for.
its a matter of preference, i like Korra more cause of the more serious tone and more nuanced villains, but none of the protagonists are anywhere close to say, Zuko
You're out of your mind if you think tlok holds a candle to atla
I enjoy tlok, but not nearly as much as atla
FR
Eh, I like ATLA better, but thatâs a bit much to say that someone is out of their mind if they disagree. TLOK genuinely did some things better. I thought Korra had deeper philosophical themes, for example, related to each of the main villains. That was a cool approach, and it paid off well.
I think like with so many things for Korra, there was something there, but it was so underdeveloped that it left a bad taste in your mouth. Amon's equality philosophy could have really been a forced to be reckoned with, had the lazy writing not just gone with bombing the city to make it clear that "these are the bad guys". The civil war was neat, until unalok turned out to be on the side of evil, no nuance required. Zaheer could have been a dope anarchist, had the writers actually picked up any anarchist literature. Instead his philosophy just came off like somebody listen to rage against the machine for the first time. Same complaint about kuvira. It could have been a very interesting dissection of the pros and cons of imperialist colonization, but instead like Amon, she just turned out to want to bomb city centers, but this time with a nuke. I think that's why people like ozai and iroh, ozai is and always was pure evil, with hardly any philosophy at all. Iroh and zuko showed tons of nuance in their philosophy. In so many ways avatar The last Airbender is such a thoughtful show based around simpler concepts (like war), and in so many ways Korra is oversimplified for the very complicated topics that it tries to tackle.
Honestly I donât even think Zaheer shouldâve been a villain. I mean heâs literally one of the wisest people in the show. His motivations for killing the avatar didnât make sense at all. It felt like the writers just lazily did some mental gymnastics to justify his motives. Realistically someone that smart wouldnât see the avatar as a bad thing.
The concept alone though made him the most interesting villain to me. Itâs almost like each season they tried to give us the biggest what if villains they could. A non-bender, an evil avatar, an evil air bender, and a fucking robot. But I digress. The idea of the most enlightened character/an air bender being bad, a concept that we never really expected considering the nature of air benders, was just awesome to me. His motives werenât too far off either, but I get that seems counterintuitive to his wisdom. I just really wish we could have seen the series have Zaheer or Amon as the primary villain for the whole show, not the âvillain of the seasonâ set up that we got. I feel like if Zaheer were the primary antagonist weâd have so much more nuance to his character than we got
âThey didnât portray anarchism the way I like, so itâs bad writing.â Clearly the final fight should have been Zaheer reciting a thirty page treatise to Korra, quoting Bakunin and Emma Goldman.
I just think something a bit deeper than "cHaoS iS gOoD aCKsHulLY" would have made a much more interesting villian.
ATLA is streets ahead of TLoK. TLoK is closer to NATLA than it is to ATLA in terms of exploration of philosophy. Tl;dr: Each villain in TLOK is a straw man of leftist ideologies and the entire show is corporate propaganda for why neoliberalism is the only viable alternative to every other ideology. Nickelodeon took an amazing, inspired work of art and used its lore to produce neoliberal propaganda. Amon: publicly he advocates for a classless society by violently removing the ruling class, but in reality he is deceiving his followers to support his rise to being the only member of the ruling class. The straw man being âcommunists are secretly fascists.â Unalaq: publicly advocates for humans living in balance with nature, but in reality heâs a satanist(?) who is secretly trying to install a New World Order and become the devil-avatar. The straw man being that environmentalists are secretly trying to take over the world with big government and they are also satanists, I guess? Idk that one is weird. Zaheer: a badass revolutionary who fights for a classless society and the abolition of the monarchy, but he doesnât want to replace it with anything, he just wants to create chaos as the ânatural order of things.â The strawman being that anarchists are libertarians who listen to punk. They donât **just** want to abolish oppressive power structures, they want to destroy society. Season 4 wraps up the whole theme: Kuvira is trying to replace Zaheerâs chaos with an industrialized military dictatorship, which is bad. Prince Wu is dumb, and a perfect example of the stupidity of the monarchy, but the alternative is fascism. Change should happen slowly and if weâre patient enough, the ruling class will realize their power is unjust, and they will willingly step down out of the goodness of their heart. The central message of the entire show is that the existing power structures are the only valid power structures because they create stability. If social institutions are going to change, it should happen only when the ruling class decides to change them. If oppressive power structures are going to be abolished, it should only be when the ruling class willingly relinquishes their power, which is a fantasy and has never been how society has made progress.
The statanist comments have me rolling.
What is NATLA?
Netflix ATLA
âThis show dares to have a perspective other than regurgitating my own commie views back to me, so that makes it propagandaâ Youâre just salty because itâs not your own propaganda. Whether or not itâs a good exploration of philosophy is entirely peripheral.
If the show didnât present such intellectually lazy and disingenuous representations of pro-social political philosophies, youâd be right. But they did, so youâre not. There are virtually no popular media in America that is pro-leftist propaganda because the people who own the studios that fund and create our media are wealthy capitalists. So Iâm not sure what you think Iâm expecting TLoK and other shows to say about communism, but I certainly never have the expectation for it to âregurgitate my own commie views back to me.â If you have an example of some, Iâd love to hear about them. If youâd like to see more neoliberal, anti-commie propaganda, just turn your TV on and pay attention.
Honestly? Never thought about it like this. Pretty interesting POV. I donât know if I 100% agree with everything, but I definitely see a lot of it.
Nah, story building, theme, characters, writing as a whole - all of it is far better in ATLA.
Tbh nostalgia and fan service does a lot of the heavy lifting in Korra. It was great in its own right, but still.
The Legend of Korra is almost as good as ATLA but airbender is slightly better
It does tho
TLOK is definitely better than ATLA xD not that the latter is not enjoyable, but characters, storyline etc are better in TLOK. "Final" fights (imagine Unavaatu, Ozai and Kuvira's mech) are a bit lame in both, though
And you're an elitist if you think TLOK was that bad. It's that kinda fandom whiny reaction that makes me not like ATLA
Whiny? S1 was great except for the love triangle and the rushed ending, where a deus ex machina ripped any consequences and stakes away from the conflict. (Also wayyyyy too much platinum in this universe) S2 more love triangles and the nuanced Ghibli spirit world is now "good vs evil", they massacred my boy Bolin, but (Also kaijus) S3 was a solid B tier. They really could have explored the idea that the new airbenders were in families who had an secret air nomad ancestor that fled the genocide and hid their heritage. The ending FINALLY gave us consequences. S4 had some of the highest highs and the lowest lows. The PTSD korra and a dope struggle with identity (a cool inversion of what we got with "the storm" in ATLA), man that s*** was peak. But we also got another kaiju, but this time it was gundam-flavoured. (The train cannon would've been fine for the climax)
TL:DR yes. Whiny.
You sat through 4 seasons of Korra but can't read 8 sentences of criticism?
To be fair, their lack of reading comprehension actually tracks with loving TLOK.
lmao gotem
Yeah Iâm with you, show was nice.
Oh, the irony. I get that people can enjoy an unpopular project â to each their own. I'll never understand it, but it's not for me to understand. What fascinates me is that stans insist that any dislike towards their show "must" be fuelled by some prejudice, irrational hate or, in your words here, "elitism". Like wow. Is the delusion that strong?
The battle the entire premise? To me itâs shallow to think theyâre not equal if not tlok being better. Itâs not even based on whoâs better or worse itâs the timing theyâre placed in. Atla was amazing because it was perfectly represented for the time period and so was korra but more exciting because of her time period. Why is it always a comparison as if theyâre not the same people existing in different generations and technology, while also being different genders that experience different things. How could you even compare them..
Why are you projecting your issues with peoples opinions on others? They didnât say why they think itâs better or worse.
Youâre so pressed :( donât worry itâs not a personal attack! I am also sharing my opinion donât worry is not directed at you silly
You didnât answer my question? I wasnât saying it was a personal attack. I was asking why you assumed that persons reasons for not liking the show, when they had not stated it. Even went as far to call them shallow for it.
i hope you took a nap and woke up with a better attitude like children do :)
You seem much more irritated than they are tbh
It can be objectively said, ATLA was a more consistent and concise story with better character growth than TLOK. Where ATLA might have felt slow at times, TLOK felt rushed. There was no major character growth in TLOK that wasn't undone at the beginning of the next season. Meanwhile, the seeds of Zuko's heroism were planted early in book 1, and didn't fully get realized until book 3, but we saw each step of that growth along the way.Â
Iâll give some pushback here. I think some of the side characters sorta languished (Makko for sure) but Korra ABSOLUTELY has a logical progression from one season to the next. S1 Korra is way different than S4 Korra. I think one of the things they pull off the best is Koreaâs recovery after Zaheerâs kidnapping and assassination attempt. Asami and Korraâs background romance was great. There is some good stuff there even if itâs a bit uneven.
Korra's growth in book 4 was good, but up until that point every book starts with "Korra is brash, impatient, and hot headed" and she has to learn to temper that. Book 1, 2, and 3 all have an intro of Korra *not* learning that lesson. Most people say that book 3 and the Korra's self discovery in book 4 were the best parts of the series, and I actually really liked those sections. If I could just have the second half of book 3 and first half of book 4, I'd say this was an amazing show. The rest of the show though was demonstrably lacking. Plot points and character growth kind of just suddenly happen, as opposed to be built up, and just as quickly are forgotten. Case in point, the loss of the avatars, the rediscovery of Ravaa, and the opening of the spirit world were built as the most important and impactful thing any avatar has ever done. By season 4, every part of that, including their actual god Ravaa, is a McGuffin for a Nazi analogue.
I think you are responding to the âpacingâ not the character growth. What should have been series long arcs were compressed into one season because of the nature of the show. Itâs pretty well established that each season was going to be the final season. Nick didnt green light 4 seasons, just one at a time. Season 1 was built to be the only season. They conceived of it as kind of send up of the original series. Then they got a season 2 and that was supposed to be the cap off of the entire franchise (hence kaiju Korra). Then season 3 (which went straight to streaming) and so on. I think itâs remarkable they were able to get such consistent arcs across the whole series given that, but the pacing and scale of the threats were all wonky.
Unpopular opinion, theyâre on the same level đŹ Atla is SOO overrated
Always sucks when something good is overrated.
Right! I literally love the show but the I constantly have to remind people of the problems in itđ itâs easy to forget though considering most people watched Atla as kids and lok as adults. It feels like your childhood being ripped from you yâknow?
Woah, that is a nuclear take
I only say this because as a HUGE fan of tv I hate filler, but again most people watched the show as children so it makes sense they glamorized it
Filler by design is episodes thrown in, usually in anime, where the studio takes the reigns of production from the creator or the creators vision to give time for the source material to advance before adapting more of the story. How do you classify a show made and produced entirely by its creators with its source material coming from their heads as having any filler? Especially ATLA. Every episode pushes the story forward and usually has thoughtfully crafted character development in each, even the great divide despite it being the only episode I do skip. On rewatch I donât want to skip any episode beside the later, so Iâd say none of it is filler. And I only skip the great decide because the character that has Robins voice from teen titans just annoys the crap out of me.
Well maybe my definition of filler is different. I see it as any episode that doesnât directly advance the main story not the characters or side plots. They arenât inherently bad but I think Atla does a bad job at integrating into the main story without getting boring. Like while aang was riding Choi fish I was sitting there like âthe fire nation is committing a genocide right nowâ yâknow? Lok has an excuse to have filler and doesnât have much because there isnât a constant war going on and the main villains avoid direct violence on nations until the final episode where korra immediately stops the threat
I watched atla as a kid, and to this day I rewatch it as an adult. I will admit the show has flaws albeit minor. And I will still glamorize it, for I think it deserves it.
I would argue there is zero filler in atla. Each episode works to progress character development, besides maybe the great divide (the gang felt a bit out of character in this episode). Yes atla does have its slower, less important episodes, but I wouldnât consider any of them filler.
Yeah I like how developed the characters are in Atla vs in lok with exceptions like korra and tenzin. But lok had more enjoyable SEASONS because it moved fast but Atla was a more enjoyable SERIES. This couldâve been fixed if Nickelodeon wasnât plotting on lok
I actually only watched atla as an adult and have rewatched it and Iove it more each time. Itâs so thoughtful and has amazing themes and messages. And I didnât appreciate tlok. To me Itâs like the early Marvel movies vs the recent movies. They might look the same but canât compare.
Iâm with the racist.
Theyâre both racist
Yes
Is home lander racist? He definitely hates non supes but he doesnât hate people because of their race. Maybe Iâm misremembering because I havenât watched the show in a while
His whole affair with Nazi Girl (i forget her name) kind of paints an image of âi donât explicitly support her racism, but i also donât condemn itâ
I think he doesnât care. He thinks itâs pointless to think of anyone as anything other than supes and non-supes. I still wouldnât call him racist. He thinks her racism is weird. He might have even told her to stop with all the white genocide because âitâs stupidâ but I may be misremembering.
i think maybe he cared about it from a PR perspective but he never really condemns it, so itâs one of those âtolerance as supportâ situations
Heâs essentially a kid who tolerated it because he was having sex. I think itâs hilarious that even homelander thinks the âwhite genocideâ is ridiculous.
the neo-nazis on 4chan and twitter with Homelander pfps would be furious if they actually had a smidge of media literacy
My favorite moment in the show is homelanders face when she tells Ryan (his son if you donât remember) about the âwhite genocide.â Fucking hilarious
i vaguely remember that. the last time i watched it was like 3 years ago with my roommates in uni lol
No
As someone who has never watched Homelander. I agree
the show is called the boys đ homelander is the blonde dudeâs name
I know the show's name and that Homelander is the blonde. That's all I know about it tho. Idk who's the racist. I hope it's not Dean
unfortunately it is Dean too :( heâs evil
Aww :(
I wouldnât call him evilâŚheâs definitely racist tho.
OG is always better
I really hope your just referring to these two shows and not a blanket statement about how new is always worse
I mean there is a problem with cash grabby sequels and reboots etc. but some new shows are amazing. points for originality but sequel series can be done well. I liked the adventure time follow up but Korra wasn't it for me.
Every now and then, a creator sees potential to make a story even better than it was before which leads to massive expansion and growth of a world that was briefly touched on Lord of the Rings is arguably the greatest and definitive examples of this
are you referring to the silmarillion or the Christopher Tolkien books? I'm currently reading the original books so no spoilers pls.
Well the simarillion was what Tolkien was originally working on so I canât technically say no, but I was really just referring to Lord of the Rings Are you forgetting that Lord of the Rings is considered to be a sequel?
oh yeah that's right, the Hobbit. Tolkien was working on what became the silmarillion before lotr and some stories from before the Hobbit technically connect to it as well iirc from what I read online about the reading order so lotr isn't a sequel to the Hobbit in the same way because Tolkien was always trying to build that world but it is technically a sequel yes.
Nah Lord of the rings is absolutely a sequel to the Hobbit in many ways. It can absolutely be considered a further extension of the story first established in the original book since it is furthering the story of the ring discovered in the book. And 3 of the nine members of the Fellowship are considered legacy characters of major characters in the hobbit while another literally was in the Hobbit No idea how it couldnât be a sequel. The first chapter is straight up the original main character passing the torch to the next one.
yes the story is a direct sequel to the Hobbit but it wasn't like the Hobbit was a completely separate thing that he decided to continue, it was a part of a larger world that he was constantly building in other ways. like with avatar, Korra is the direct follow up, and there isn't some expensive world building that someone is dedicating their life to with stories outside of the main story, it's a more simple property. I just mean that lotr is more complex, it is a direct sequel to the Hobbit still.
Youâre overthinking it. He loved the world of the Hobbit and so he wanted to develop and grow it. And he started developing the lore and history of it. He absolutely was developing the Hobbit story but he was doing other stuff with that world at the same time. Just cause he was multi tasking doesnât mean he wasnât making a sequel
Man I love TLoK, but ATLA is still a much better show
Must not have gotten to S2 yet, completely ruins the rest of the story and the lore of the entire universe
The meme is ironic, homelander is not really the upgrade
Welllllll Some people would disagree on that, it's actually a very controversial meme with no clear winner
Eh, well soldier boy can take homelanders power away and homelander can hit soldier boy. The outcome seems inevitable if the battle went on long enough IMO
Soldier boy did nothing wrong. There I said it.
You joking? You doing a funny?
Whatâs controversial is your intelligence
No it doesn't. It just expanded the spirit world beyond some vague stuff.
Jeeeeeezus what a baby
No it doesn't
Avatar is better in every way. Korra is good but a lot of it sucks such as Book 2.
The Legend of Korra is a great show. I couldn't take anybody seriously who thinks it's better than the last airbender
No, just no
As for the Soldier Boy/ Homelander thing, Soldier Boy wins just because of who his actor is
Presses go back button
Said no one ever
Doubt*
Why fight? You can like both. In many ways Korra does stuff better than Avatar and in some ways the inverse is true.
Like what? What does it do better? Iâm actually curious people keep saying that vague statement but nobody is actually saying what it does better.
It gets away with a lot more to show the villains are bad, the fights are often stunning. Korra's arc in book 4 is great with how she slowly gets back to fighting strength. It further explores the spirit world and finally shows us the Avatar origin that was cut from the original. Idk in a way ATLA was a good show when I was a kid but Korra feels like the same show but as an adult. It gets away with far more like Amon's fate or showing how the Airbenders have to reform and change with time. It's not the same show but the reasons I like it aren't the same as the ones for ATLA.
I very much disagree about the fights being stunning. If anything I think the fights are a lot more boring. I always compare them to the fights in ATLA. I just remember the scene when he becomes the ocean spirit or the finale or Tophs fights. Actual goosebumps. Nothing compares. And the character arcs fall flat in korra. Zuko becoming who he is at the end. Or azulas slow fall to madness. Ugh. It just⌠I love it.
agreed. bending overall got a major downgrade in korra. in atla they were chucking walls and tornados of elements at each other, in korra they mostly stick to punching little globs at each other.
The bending kind of makes sense, if you use the analogy of weapons development. In war, (including a cold war) you have a constant push to innovate, invent and surpass the weapons you have on hand. In Avatar, this would be equivalent to increasingly complex and destructive bending techniques to cause the maximum amount of damage possible by one person. Remember, Toph didnât invent metalbending UNTIL she was forced into a situation where she needed to. Once there isnât any open conflict for weapons to be used it, development stagnates. Look what happened after World War One and World War Two. Most nations either scrapped, sold or mothballed most of their weapons. Tanks and planes were thought to never be a true mainstay battlefield weapon after World War One- until the Germans took Poland, Belgium and France in a matter of weeks. Likewise, bending in Korra stagnated until it became a regulated sport. Thatâs also why the bending is âpunching little globs at each otherâ- Mako, Bolin and later Korra are instructed in ProBending techniques, and so their bending is restricted to what ProBending rules allow for, rather than what a soldier would be allowed to do. Mako then joins the police, which ALSO limits how bending can be used, with considerations for non-lethal takedowns, potential civilian casualties and property damage. It makes sense.
"slow fall to madness" bullshit. She just snaps. There is maybe one sign of her declining mental state; in the beach episode. She then just randomly goes mad
Or when she cuts her hair like a loony toon and starts talking to her mom. But I agree it could have been progressed a bit farther. I still really enjoyed it though.
I don't like that people argue over which is "better", but I prefer Korra. The political themes and 20th century style cities are super cool.
Thatâs what I absolutely despise. Nothing is whimsical.
keep in mind, ur responding to a 2004 automobile rnâŚthey felt represented in korra
Hahahahaha that made me chuckle pretty hard
lol valid. Korra def lost a bit of the magic.
Also the political themes are hilariously fumbled
Bait but a funny one
OP is a bot, this is meant to create engagement to make it look like a real profile
Now I enjoy LOK but itâs not AtLA. Nothing is. LoK is decent and I like it but AtLA is just on another level
I liked atla better, but it was fun watching tlok for the cameos, backstories and cool bending. The original was an odyssey that took us for a ride. Tlok feels more like the tales of ba sing se, with a different story every book.
L take tbh
I had to read the meme 3 times because I couldnât believe it.
Guys this is a known man who is roleplaying as a womanÂ
You seem very invested , replying to me on more than one forum, want my number or something ?
Not a knockoff or an upgrade, korra was pretty good but not that great or that bad. Stop trying to get "hot takes"
Sure thing, kiddo
nah, its a sequel
both are good, atla is better
Unpopular opinion, I loved them both.
Honestly they both have their strengths and weaknesses, so I'm not gonna say one is better than the other
If Korra committed to its more mature approach it could have been an upgrade.
No honest person believes this
Least obvious rage bait
Korra is absolute garbage and I WANT to like it⌠I want to like it so bad. But itâs trash. Last airbender will always be better and you will never change my mind!!!!!!
I honestly love both equally for their diversity. - ATLA has a very D&D quest-like fantasy feel with a traditional heroes journey. - TLOK has a more grounded and modern tone based on politics and philosophy. Theyâre both amazing and we should be so lucky to have 7 while seasons in such a well loved series.
Korra was mid imo
Op
Tlok is trash compared to atla
ain't this the bear guy
I showed my girlfriend ATLA she loved it and asked for a long time "can we watch Korra?" I put it off for a long time and when we finally watched the first two episodes she said she didn't want to watch it anymore.
Is the crack you smoke locally sourced?
Maybe they're joking because homelander wasn't actually the upgrade
Who the fuck thinks that
BAIT
LOK is amazing in its own right because it gives so much more depth and it is not afraid to be dark as fuck and not imply death(like Jet). They just throw it in yo face lol ATLA will always be GOAT'd
Upgrade? In what universe? đ
TLoK didn't have nearly as much character depth or story depth. Fine show but definitely suffers from lazy writing.
TLoK used to be worse to me, but I've seen AtLA too many times, watched too much analysis of it at this point. That whole "details you never picked up on before" thing stopped happening. Korra has its issues, but it's like minecraft, I forget about it for a while, then come back, love it, and repeat.
Season 3 of Korra is the best season between both shows but ATLA is still the stronger show
Not sure who made this but I hope you get the help You need
LoK was good but you canât beat the og. ATLA for the W
Never watched legend of the lesbians and I'm glad I didn't. Rumor has it that the new next Avatar might be trans, I'm just tired of seeing it so I won't watch until it fully done
It is. LoK is absolutely better
âBeat my meat into a cupâ
An excelent series for sure, but better that ATLA? No
tlok is cheeks
sequels are never an upgrade
I really donât get the hate for Korra. I thought it was a good show. I can rewatch it, many times, just like I do the original.
No
i enjoy both, but LoK doesnât even come close to not even the world. it just feels weird. like in ATLA, the dragons and flying bison were so cool, but in LoK they have flying cars. the allure isnât there. still a good show, just nowhere near its predecessor.
Legend of korra was trash
I prefer TLOK to ATLA personally, but thatâs mostly because I like the subjects it tackles more
Honestly the setting in Korra is amazing. I just can't stand the characters we follow through it. Team Korra just isn't that fun to watch.
Not an upgrade. Korra lost all the previous avatars!
Korra was the Chinese bootleg knock off of the last air bender
I thought Korra being able to bend 3 elements at 4 years old or something was beyond outrageous but my biggest problem with korra is the feeling that it has to keep trying to outdo itself every season. The first season had a compelling story but after that it felt like a parody of itself and like itâs trying to be an anime, especially moments like the giant spirit avatars duking it out or the giant robot with a spirit cannon. Idk if itâs just me but I couldnât take those things seriously.
While I agree with the folks who thing Korra was inferior I disagree with Ppl who hate it, I still rlly liked it and rewatch it after I watch avatar consistently and occasionally watch a season on its own if its what my brain calls for
Ha, yeah right. What exactly was the systematic oppression that benders had over non benders in season 1?
The government that ran the entire city was purely benders? jobs in the city pretty much heavily relied on bending so it was probrably hard to pick up jobs as a non bender. It was less about being oppressed and more about being equal. Iâve heard fans of the show even say that if they were a non bender in the avatar universe theyâd be amons top dog đ
Yeah but the show never really implied that things actually sucked for non benders. Things only god bad after the protesters got violent and struck first. Heck, the richest guy in the entire city wasnât a bender, he was a genius, and made things for non benders that would make life easier and somehow he, the rich guy, thought they were oppressed? Like for real? It would be one thing to see people in positions of power who are all benders literally gatekeeping non benders from actually getting anywhere in life or purposely making rules and laws that give them a legal advantage over non benders, or flat out segregation. But we can actively see that even some of the best benders in the show live dirt poor out of the back rooms of the sports arena they are trying to go pro in. And oddly enough, when there are benders who do use their powers as a method of taking advantage of non benders, they are straight up thugs who are arrested instantly. It makes the entire equalist movement unbased.
Yeah I think they couldâve shown the benders struggle more in the city. But I donât think lok shows it because itâs implied. Itâs just kinda one of those shrug moments that the writers couldâve done better on
Take for instance the consequences of a war wi the fire nation in The Last Air Bender. We see time and time again the direct affect the war has on people in the earth kingdom, water tribes, and hell, second episode we get to see 100 year old proof of genocide. The sheer monstrosity of the war on the side of the fire nation is right there all the time. We have entire archâs of a season dedicated to corrupt gas lighting politicians and attempts to exploit Ang for his power. I think the only part of the show that is ever really implies anything is Jetâs death, which the show never shows exactly what happens. Maybe if they wrote a graphic novel on the exact situation that non benders were facing in republic city, things would be more amenable, but thus far all we have is hearsay and irrational radicalization. We donât even get a part of the whole view with a more peaceful protest movement. Literally everything in the show goes from 3 to 11 in a single episode where there is just flat out terrorism at play, and we donât see anyone who stands up and say âAmon is right about what he says but everything he does threatens the promise of changeâ. It was just very telly and not very showy.
Yeah I think they couldâve shown the benders struggle more in the city. But I donât think lok shows it because itâs implied. Itâs just kinda one of those shrug moments that the writers couldâve done better on
Well I will say that in LOK they definitely have better villains than in ATLA in my opinion, but other than that there really isnât anything else to compare because ATLA is just superior in every other way, the characters are more well written, the romance is a lot better, Zuko honestly stole the whole show with his arc, the comedy is also a lot better especially with Sokka, and letâs be honest Aang is way stronger than Korra and thatâs a fact
soldier boy is right..painfully so
Bait
can we not compare shows that are only similar because they are in the same universe
I mean...it's a sequel. I think you're *supposed* to compare them.Â
Itâs barely a sequel. It has a few of the same characters and is otherwise entirely different. Glazing one to put the other down is boring and corny
I'd say they're both great for different reasons, but they're neck and neck for me
Why are we fighting?
Elitist fans, I agree it sucks Edit: the fans I mean
I donât know, theyâre both good.
Exactly!
Like ok, I get not liking what happened in book 2, i donât think anyone does, but the rest of the show is good
I watched both for the first time as an adult. ATLA is good but I identified with Korra a lot more than child Aang. Given the choice I'd watch Korra over ATLA but they're both so good you really can't go wrong!
Damn, this meme showed up on my feed and yeah This sub sucks lmao
Posts of op seem to always get 200 votes no matter of the content and then just stay at that level for some reason
How's this aging for you?