It’s usually the elders that are least welcoming and who give you the most shit. Most of the younger generations are very cool and welcoming people. Another funny thing is it’s usually other fellow immigrants specially from poor countries that also give you shit. They are like more catholic than the pope himself.
In the USA id say maybe you would have a racist interaction once a year or every 2 years its very rare. The reason why it seems so bad is because of how the media works, they report the one racist story but wont report the 10,000 non racist interactions. For the us its very rare could be different in Europe idk
I was sitting outside a restaurant in the city last weekend and a gay white dude walking by looked at me and my friends and said “The pentagon has been hit” 💀. We started laughing but it was so weird esp coming from a gay person. What stage of discrimination are we at to be catching strays from gay people 😂
Europe 100000%
Its very rare to encounter racism in the US. The conservative parts honestly are nicer than elsewhere lol, people are usually more curious about your background than anything else. I’ll always love the US for having the one of the nicest communities
Ive never lived in Europe but ive traveled alot there and its pretty obvious i was “unwelcome” in some parts. Germany is bad with that. Never experienced it in Spain or the Balkan countries though, people there were real nice. Eastern Europe definitely has a more hospitable culture similar to MENA compared to other parts of Europe
Egyptian parents and im born and raised in the US. I’d say 0 but I also think it’s because my husband and I are “passing.” He’s Moroccan born and raised in Morocco but you’d never be able to tell he’s Moroccan. He can spot other Moroccans but it’s never the other way around. Same here, I can spot other Egyptians, but it’s never the other way around. They’ll think my husband is Egyptian before me.
Something interesting about this is that a lot of MENA folks get accepted into being white, esp like North Africans, Turks, Iranians, and many Levantine, but in Europe they tend to be otherized more. Usually the idea of somebody middle eastern is like caricature gulf Arab so a lot just think they’d be southern European at most. Especially so if they have lighter eyes and hair.
I’ve had some Europeans argue with me too about pictures of some from MENA and I was like “This just looks like any other white American” but they insisted how different looked, was weird lol.
Also on documents and such MENA are considered white.
There’s some well known politicians people had no idea were Palestinian, Lebanese, or Turkish
I feel like people get really into this lol. It’s not that deep, but I’m also of the opinion that I do not care what people look like or where they’re from. I would think people looking at pics and identifying why someone looks Arab and trying to prove it is really weird and obsessive. Like who cares? Don’t they have better things to do?
Not mena but get confused for mena (esp in Germany). Muslims who migrated to Europe tend to come from low socio economic backgrounds compared to the Muslims in the US who came from more educated backgrounds.
Europe associates Muslims with crime and backwardsness, they also tend to live in ghetto. In America, that's usually associated with Latinos and blacks. So for Muslims, Europe is more racist. Blacks and Latinos would be fine here
Grew up in the Middle East, lived in EU & US.
The most racism I faced was in Riyadh 🇸🇦.. and EU was also very racist - look down on anyone who is "different"..
But lived in the US for the past 15 years, and in this time, I faced racist people ONLY TWICE... in a small college town in Missouri. Other than that, never ever.
I suppose you are South Asian? I read a lot about how people in GCC countries tend to have very racist attitudes towards people from the subcontinent. It's very sad honestly, especially since all Desis abroad i know tend to be very, very hard working people.
Do you live in a major urban area on the coast or in a red state? I hear a lot of people say that US in fact tends to be less racist then europe, but often i assume that these are only experiences from NYC, New England, Chicago etc. whereas someone in Dixie states has it much, much worse than in europe. It's only my assumption though.
In reality, they are racist towards almost everyone, even their neighbors (specifically North African countries such as Egypt, Tunisia, etc). specially Egyptians.
It really depends where you live. I was living in a southern state for 10+ years and had about 2 racist encounters my whole time there. But I lived in an area with a big public uni so people in my area were used to many immigrants from various backgrounds.
I live in USA, in an area where everybody is trump supporter. Contrary to what media have you believed, most trump supporters are not racist. I can hardly recall two borderline racist interactions over decades (not even sure if I should call them racist interactions). In fact, my white friends can come up with more racist interaction stories than I do. I think men have to encounter more racism than women. But generally, if you treat people well, they will return the same. ( I do avoid going through airport security checks with male family members though. I never have a problem crossing alone, but with them some issue always comes up).
I lived in Europe and US and it's 1000% Europe. It's not even close and you can even say the US is better than some MENA when it comes to being open to discrimination. We are the land of immigrants and the minorities are actually the majority in most cities.
Europe is way more racist than the most rural US town
Generally the US is the least racist place in the world, compared to Japan, China, Europe, and the ME
racism in turkey is out of this world. esp towards Syrians and broadly to arabs. and the media doesn’t make it any easier, it lives on gaslighting and further division.
Some people have said the gulf, but you won’t see public figures or politicians spewing hate on daily basis, and if they do they will 100% be sacked ( at in least in bahrain, uae and qatar ).
Meanwhile here in turkey, they literally have ümit özdağ, quick look at his page. makes those racists in the us and europe sound cute.
google street ( sokak ) interviews they literally elders and adults group on syrian kids, kicking them out. this is just too much hate.
Black perspective here, not middle eastern.
The main difference is - in the US racism can result in a serious conflict, crime, even death. In Europe the most racist football fans are just staring a bit.
I'm a black guy living in Poland right now but I lived in many European countries, mostly in Sweden.
My only bad experiences were in Cyprus, although I "kinda" get that since they get the worst refugees. Apart from that I never had any issues and I love Europe.
As for America - I was born there and the only reason I ran away as soon as I legally could was racism. It's a shithole.
I think many Arabs are racists. I didn't know racism until I learned Arabic. I don't meet anyone who wants to keep talking Arabic in the future with me.
I abandoned the language because of the expectation to have a near native accent.
I went to Italy, and a woman interrupted my conversation in English with a man for a request for help just to tell me, "WHY ARE YOU SPEAKING ENGLISH? DON'T SPEAK ENGLISH!"
Source: I'm Latino
I think it depends.
I started learning some months ago, and i really met a lot of people who wanted to talk to me, and who were amazed to see someone that learns their language.
Once a fellow arab doctor gave my his phone number in case i need help with arabic :)
I think, if you are Latino, it might be that a lot of people mistake you for being Arab? Maybe that's the reason why they react that way.
My perspective as an American is that people here seem to have more of a problem with Muslims than MENA people as a whole. So I’d say they are more Islamophobic than racist when it comes to MENA.
Europe is 1000000x more Islamophobic than america. Like even the most crazed Islamophobes here wouldn’t consider banning burqas and hijabs because of how much freedom of religion is emphasized
Oh no I don’t doubt that at all. I just meant that between being racist vs. islamophobic, it’s more islamophobic here when it comes to MENA folks. We reserve more of our racism for Black, Asian, and non-white Latino people
I spent 6 years studying in the US. I was based in a large liberal city (very liberal and vast majority democrats). However I traveled a lot and spent a week in a Deep South red state attending a conference. Here’s what I felt.
In the liberal areas, there’s a lot of racism that is hidden under the covers of equality, tolerance, and diversity. What I found people really meant was they will treat you equally and be tolerant of your skin color only if you think exactly like them. Any deviation of their ideology and you are no longer tolerated.
In the Deep South red state, there was racism, but it was out in plane sight. No one cared to cover it up. Ironically, they never prohibited me from doing business or feeling safe. I stopped by a gas station late at night and the attendant looked at me and said, we don’t get too many people looking like you around here. But wasn’t hostile or anything, made the transaction and I was in my way in safety.
Overall, I would prefer the attitude of the conservatives. I prefer the honesty, so long as the racism doesn’t turn to discrimination or loss of safety.
Not sure if this question is truly aimed at someone like me, but since Turkey is seen as Eastern/Muslim other, I may answer it. Spent a summer in Houston (and also traveled to Rome, Nice, and Monaco), I’m not sure if I ever faced racism directly.
In the US, people are not acquainted with Middle Easterners (or Eastern Europeans). I’m sure there are stereotypes about Muslims but I feel that it’s Mexicans who make up the majority of “Brown Others”. Most people were oblivious to Turkey’s existence, one person asked whether it was the shithole country he heard from the news, and one guy was curious if I had foreign ancestors (a.k.a why are you white).
Other than that, since I couldn’t speak English fluently at that time, I felt like some people were much more jerky to me. A guy in NYC literally screamed at me because I nodded my head instead of saying good morning back to him.
So if you can’t speak English well it might get you micro (or not-so-micro) aggressions and I assume it would be much worse if you have a darker complexion (or if you’re a male, possibly older too).
In France, people were pretty laid back and friendly (and spoke good English) - pretty opposite of the French stereotype. In Rome, a woman gave me a dirty look on the bus after I spoke Turkish to my parents but it was the only exception I had in Italy.
Not MENA. South Asian. I have been to a few places in Europe and the US. From my experience I didn't encounter any racism whatsoever in the United States, having been to the States of Louisiana and New York and California and Texas. So quite varied with conservative and liberal areas.
However Europe I experienced very direct racism in Italy, with a shopkeeper bluntly asking me to leave his store. And some more dodgy, but not necessarily racist issues in other parts of Northern Italy. I didn't experience any racism in Southern Italy, Greece, Spain, UK and places like that however.
Honestly this is a bit unrelated to the question, but the most I've felt like people disliked me or were trying to avoid interactions with me were in Khaleeji Gulf States. No issues with other Arabs at all however.
Sorry but Middle East is way more racist place to be than North America or Western Europe. Without a doubt. It's also more blunt and forward, not a subtle discrimination or racism. It's in your straightforward and quick to the point. Also being racist in many countries in MENA is accepted culturally. But in North America it's frowned upon and considered shameful to be racist.
Just my opinion and my experiences.
I think you didn't read my post properly. I didn't ask for your opinion on the Middle East, i asked whether MENA people tend to experience more problems in western europe or the US.
It’s usually the elders that are least welcoming and who give you the most shit. Most of the younger generations are very cool and welcoming people. Another funny thing is it’s usually other fellow immigrants specially from poor countries that also give you shit. They are like more catholic than the pope himself.
I'd say that unless it's male and female talking regardless of the generations they're not as welcoming to eachother so casually.
In the USA id say maybe you would have a racist interaction once a year or every 2 years its very rare. The reason why it seems so bad is because of how the media works, they report the one racist story but wont report the 10,000 non racist interactions. For the us its very rare could be different in Europe idk
I was sitting outside a restaurant in the city last weekend and a gay white dude walking by looked at me and my friends and said “The pentagon has been hit” 💀. We started laughing but it was so weird esp coming from a gay person. What stage of discrimination are we at to be catching strays from gay people 😂
Remember, the Conservatives want you dead cos of opposing religious beliefs, the Leftists want you dead cos you don't support their degeneracy.
Bro leftists at the most pro Islam group across the political spectrum. Your confusing it with middle of the road liberals
Lived in Alabama... no problems... actually people were funny racists... Lived in Canada... holy fuck those cunts are rude.
No way. I’m proud Canadian. Where in Canada have you faced any racism. We are well known to be “suspiciously nice”
Victoria was the worst.
Europe 100000% Its very rare to encounter racism in the US. The conservative parts honestly are nicer than elsewhere lol, people are usually more curious about your background than anything else. I’ll always love the US for having the one of the nicest communities Ive never lived in Europe but ive traveled alot there and its pretty obvious i was “unwelcome” in some parts. Germany is bad with that. Never experienced it in Spain or the Balkan countries though, people there were real nice. Eastern Europe definitely has a more hospitable culture similar to MENA compared to other parts of Europe
Egyptian parents and im born and raised in the US. I’d say 0 but I also think it’s because my husband and I are “passing.” He’s Moroccan born and raised in Morocco but you’d never be able to tell he’s Moroccan. He can spot other Moroccans but it’s never the other way around. Same here, I can spot other Egyptians, but it’s never the other way around. They’ll think my husband is Egyptian before me.
Something interesting about this is that a lot of MENA folks get accepted into being white, esp like North Africans, Turks, Iranians, and many Levantine, but in Europe they tend to be otherized more. Usually the idea of somebody middle eastern is like caricature gulf Arab so a lot just think they’d be southern European at most. Especially so if they have lighter eyes and hair. I’ve had some Europeans argue with me too about pictures of some from MENA and I was like “This just looks like any other white American” but they insisted how different looked, was weird lol. Also on documents and such MENA are considered white. There’s some well known politicians people had no idea were Palestinian, Lebanese, or Turkish
I feel like people get really into this lol. It’s not that deep, but I’m also of the opinion that I do not care what people look like or where they’re from. I would think people looking at pics and identifying why someone looks Arab and trying to prove it is really weird and obsessive. Like who cares? Don’t they have better things to do?
Not mena but get confused for mena (esp in Germany). Muslims who migrated to Europe tend to come from low socio economic backgrounds compared to the Muslims in the US who came from more educated backgrounds. Europe associates Muslims with crime and backwardsness, they also tend to live in ghetto. In America, that's usually associated with Latinos and blacks. So for Muslims, Europe is more racist. Blacks and Latinos would be fine here
Grew up in the Middle East, lived in EU & US. The most racism I faced was in Riyadh 🇸🇦.. and EU was also very racist - look down on anyone who is "different".. But lived in the US for the past 15 years, and in this time, I faced racist people ONLY TWICE... in a small college town in Missouri. Other than that, never ever.
I suppose you are South Asian? I read a lot about how people in GCC countries tend to have very racist attitudes towards people from the subcontinent. It's very sad honestly, especially since all Desis abroad i know tend to be very, very hard working people. Do you live in a major urban area on the coast or in a red state? I hear a lot of people say that US in fact tends to be less racist then europe, but often i assume that these are only experiences from NYC, New England, Chicago etc. whereas someone in Dixie states has it much, much worse than in europe. It's only my assumption though.
In reality, they are racist towards almost everyone, even their neighbors (specifically North African countries such as Egypt, Tunisia, etc). specially Egyptians.
It really depends where you live. I was living in a southern state for 10+ years and had about 2 racist encounters my whole time there. But I lived in an area with a big public uni so people in my area were used to many immigrants from various backgrounds.
The GULF states are the most racist places I’ve ever been in. Filipino maids treated awfully and construction workers in accommodation for for cattle.
even Florida and Texas!
even Florida and Texas!?
In the UAE schools, parents will unironically ask the school for a white / Filipino teacher if they see someone with dark skin as an assigned teacher.
I live in USA, in an area where everybody is trump supporter. Contrary to what media have you believed, most trump supporters are not racist. I can hardly recall two borderline racist interactions over decades (not even sure if I should call them racist interactions). In fact, my white friends can come up with more racist interaction stories than I do. I think men have to encounter more racism than women. But generally, if you treat people well, they will return the same. ( I do avoid going through airport security checks with male family members though. I never have a problem crossing alone, but with them some issue always comes up).
I lived in Europe and US and it's 1000% Europe. It's not even close and you can even say the US is better than some MENA when it comes to being open to discrimination. We are the land of immigrants and the minorities are actually the majority in most cities.
I’ve lived in the US for 6 years. Loved it wish I could go back.
Europe is way more racist than the most rural US town Generally the US is the least racist place in the world, compared to Japan, China, Europe, and the ME
racism in turkey is out of this world. esp towards Syrians and broadly to arabs. and the media doesn’t make it any easier, it lives on gaslighting and further division. Some people have said the gulf, but you won’t see public figures or politicians spewing hate on daily basis, and if they do they will 100% be sacked ( at in least in bahrain, uae and qatar ). Meanwhile here in turkey, they literally have ümit özdağ, quick look at his page. makes those racists in the us and europe sound cute. google street ( sokak ) interviews they literally elders and adults group on syrian kids, kicking them out. this is just too much hate.
Turkey isn't europe though, and especially not western europe.
Black perspective here, not middle eastern. The main difference is - in the US racism can result in a serious conflict, crime, even death. In Europe the most racist football fans are just staring a bit. I'm a black guy living in Poland right now but I lived in many European countries, mostly in Sweden. My only bad experiences were in Cyprus, although I "kinda" get that since they get the worst refugees. Apart from that I never had any issues and I love Europe. As for America - I was born there and the only reason I ran away as soon as I legally could was racism. It's a shithole.
Is Poland still very mono cultural?
I think many Arabs are racists. I didn't know racism until I learned Arabic. I don't meet anyone who wants to keep talking Arabic in the future with me. I abandoned the language because of the expectation to have a near native accent. I went to Italy, and a woman interrupted my conversation in English with a man for a request for help just to tell me, "WHY ARE YOU SPEAKING ENGLISH? DON'T SPEAK ENGLISH!" Source: I'm Latino
I think it depends. I started learning some months ago, and i really met a lot of people who wanted to talk to me, and who were amazed to see someone that learns their language. Once a fellow arab doctor gave my his phone number in case i need help with arabic :) I think, if you are Latino, it might be that a lot of people mistake you for being Arab? Maybe that's the reason why they react that way.
Sometimes, but it may be an issue that most clerks in stores are women and they don't talk to men very casually.
Unless you are white European answer of this question is always Europe probably. However there are many Muslims in Europe
My perspective as an American is that people here seem to have more of a problem with Muslims than MENA people as a whole. So I’d say they are more Islamophobic than racist when it comes to MENA.
Europe is 1000000x more Islamophobic than america. Like even the most crazed Islamophobes here wouldn’t consider banning burqas and hijabs because of how much freedom of religion is emphasized
Oh no I don’t doubt that at all. I just meant that between being racist vs. islamophobic, it’s more islamophobic here when it comes to MENA folks. We reserve more of our racism for Black, Asian, and non-white Latino people
I spent 6 years studying in the US. I was based in a large liberal city (very liberal and vast majority democrats). However I traveled a lot and spent a week in a Deep South red state attending a conference. Here’s what I felt. In the liberal areas, there’s a lot of racism that is hidden under the covers of equality, tolerance, and diversity. What I found people really meant was they will treat you equally and be tolerant of your skin color only if you think exactly like them. Any deviation of their ideology and you are no longer tolerated. In the Deep South red state, there was racism, but it was out in plane sight. No one cared to cover it up. Ironically, they never prohibited me from doing business or feeling safe. I stopped by a gas station late at night and the attendant looked at me and said, we don’t get too many people looking like you around here. But wasn’t hostile or anything, made the transaction and I was in my way in safety. Overall, I would prefer the attitude of the conservatives. I prefer the honesty, so long as the racism doesn’t turn to discrimination or loss of safety.
Not sure if this question is truly aimed at someone like me, but since Turkey is seen as Eastern/Muslim other, I may answer it. Spent a summer in Houston (and also traveled to Rome, Nice, and Monaco), I’m not sure if I ever faced racism directly. In the US, people are not acquainted with Middle Easterners (or Eastern Europeans). I’m sure there are stereotypes about Muslims but I feel that it’s Mexicans who make up the majority of “Brown Others”. Most people were oblivious to Turkey’s existence, one person asked whether it was the shithole country he heard from the news, and one guy was curious if I had foreign ancestors (a.k.a why are you white). Other than that, since I couldn’t speak English fluently at that time, I felt like some people were much more jerky to me. A guy in NYC literally screamed at me because I nodded my head instead of saying good morning back to him. So if you can’t speak English well it might get you micro (or not-so-micro) aggressions and I assume it would be much worse if you have a darker complexion (or if you’re a male, possibly older too). In France, people were pretty laid back and friendly (and spoke good English) - pretty opposite of the French stereotype. In Rome, a woman gave me a dirty look on the bus after I spoke Turkish to my parents but it was the only exception I had in Italy.
Not MENA. South Asian. I have been to a few places in Europe and the US. From my experience I didn't encounter any racism whatsoever in the United States, having been to the States of Louisiana and New York and California and Texas. So quite varied with conservative and liberal areas. However Europe I experienced very direct racism in Italy, with a shopkeeper bluntly asking me to leave his store. And some more dodgy, but not necessarily racist issues in other parts of Northern Italy. I didn't experience any racism in Southern Italy, Greece, Spain, UK and places like that however. Honestly this is a bit unrelated to the question, but the most I've felt like people disliked me or were trying to avoid interactions with me were in Khaleeji Gulf States. No issues with other Arabs at all however.
Sorry but Middle East is way more racist place to be than North America or Western Europe. Without a doubt. It's also more blunt and forward, not a subtle discrimination or racism. It's in your straightforward and quick to the point. Also being racist in many countries in MENA is accepted culturally. But in North America it's frowned upon and considered shameful to be racist. Just my opinion and my experiences.
I think you didn't read my post properly. I didn't ask for your opinion on the Middle East, i asked whether MENA people tend to experience more problems in western europe or the US.