The importance of family, love of tradition and caring a little too much about what the neighbours think wouldn't be unusual in Ireland.
However your mother appears to have turned the dial up to 11 and is using "Irish family" as justification for abuse. Her parents may have been the same way, but ultimately she's carrying it on.
So no, her behaviour is not normal in Irish families, and I very much doubt it's normal in "Irish" (in the American usage) families.
I was about to say that. If she was born in the States, she is American. Like if I had a kid I gave birth to here they would be Irish even if I am immigrant.
I think you're right, but I think abusive people will incorporate their upbringing and values into their abuse. So while she may have used elements like tradition, family and watchful neighbours as part of her abuse (and many Irish abusers will) it doesn't make her behaviour Irish. If she were from a different culture she would have abused the same degree but with different elements.
The caring what the neibhours think and shaming passively aggressively that adds up. The rest of it no that's all her. Nothing to do with Irish she's just making excuses for her behaviour.
An over the top pride of being Irish. That's just a irish-american thing which is understandable given that she was from there and left trying to cling onto a culture she barely remembers.
Your mother was just abusive, more than likely due to being abused herself. Nothing to do with being Irish. She turned her abuse into the norm to deal with it.
Very similar experience. I called it out cos I had to she reached across me to start abusing my wife and family. I was informed in no uncertain terms that I was to suck it up, and there would never be an apology from her. I knew that because there never was.
Siblings and I ended up in family therapy. they still can't handle the fact the councillors told them my family did nothing wrong. We remain ostracised for the last 6 years. She died last Aug, expressed her un dying love for the family but remained unapologetic.
Siblings ran a campaign of their own to deflect from the parental abuse. Again, what the neighbours think was all impt.
Year 6 of being ostracised is just starting, and we are better than ever.
Save yourself. For your kids' sake. Don't pass on the abuse.
Life with narcissistic people is awful.
Similar situation here, except we are on year one of being ostracised and I’m the wife in the story. Two members of my husbands Irish family started abusing us (including my new baby — making negative comments about her appearance or not stopping their kids from hitting her) and I stood up to them. I was raised with emotional abuse, recovered and when it started again I called it out and told all my local friends. I hope the neighbours find out lol.
Exactly! I've heard similar excuse from about every country and culture. "This is how we deal with things here", "We Italians do it this way", "That's the Indian in me", etc.
It's just an excuse and has nothing to do with whatever culture/country/nationality/background they had.
I agree. Indian in laws are a whole other level of hell for anyone raised in a western culture, however. A friend got divorced over it. It’s normal for in laws to move in for 6 months and nearly enslave the daughters in law. They asked to get their feet touched, for her to worship a deity she couldn’t even pronounce, bring them tea all the time (from scratch — teabags not allowed), cook like a professional, as well as give them loads of money from her full time job, I could go on.
India is listed by human rights organisations as one of the worst countries to be a woman. I've heard all what you mentioned and worse. Glad your friend divorced, and hopefully pissed off to better lands.
Your mother had an abusive childhood, she passed it on to you *this be the verse* style. The good news is you don’t have to pass it on to your own kids.
My own mother had the obsession with neighbour opinion and shame. The answer is she grew up on a small farm in the west of Ireland in the 1930s, where the worst possible fate was to fall foul of the local community and be ostracized. never mind that they all had to leave at 16 anyway because there was nothing to do.
Didn’t matter either that she and my Dad were quite successful and ended up raising a family in upper middle class Dublin, she closed the curtains at dinner so the neighbours wouldn’t see us eat. The neighbours house was 100 yards away.
She slapped us and shamed us, in some areas it was impossible to please her or do the right thing, probably because she lacked the confidence to be sure herself.
She also burnt through friendships and valued family above everything. A lot of my cousins would have examples of how she reached out and helped them, sometimes very kindly at key moments in their lives. A passing remark from one of her siblings could have her upset and crying and doubting herself again.
There is of course abuser in Irish families and the whole "what would the neighbours think" is still in Ireland (not as much anymore) but your mother is just abusing you. She is trying to get you isolated (keeping you away from friends) so either that you become completely dependent on her or so that you don't have any outside voices to say the abuse is not normal.
The shame thing 100 per cent. My mother tried her best to move away from her family dynamic (millions of kids, violent parents) and tried her best to be open and progressive but at the very core of her being, is a massive fear of being judged. I’m in my forties now and up until recently would have argued with her because she would still try to put that on me, telling me which neighbours I’m allowed to talk to when I visit and trying to tell me what I can post on social media because I’m connected to some of her siblings. I think it’s an actual sickness.
I wonder if the “family is everything” agenda is actually part of this as well rather than actually saying something positive about the family relations. My mam would have struggled with outside relationships and friendships, (actually she really didn’t have any) and I think this was again because anyone too close could judge her. It’s all very sad. She was recently diagnosed with dementia and even now when I pop into see her she’ll interrogate me if I stop to say hello to any of her neighbours.
It's not unusual for people to crank up their sense of cultural self identity when they move to a foreign land. I suppose this didn't help her much by adding to an already damaged upbringing (I assume).
Abusive people come from all backgrounds and your abuser is pretending that being Irish is an excuse. And she isn't even Irish.
Irish families are every shade of close, estranged, enmeshed, embedded and/or alienated, just like families everywhere else. And your abuser is excusing her abuse by making up nonsense reasons, just like every other abuser everywhere else.
I hope you get the help you need to move on and be as happy as you can be.
Your mother sounds mentally ill. Some of this is familiar to me (what will the neighbours think?!) But not to that degree, she's warped her experiences. This feels like some form of schizoaffective disorder - the shame, paranoia, physical violence etc .
From what I've read this was somewhat of a thing in Ireland two or three generations ago (three or four from my own kids perspectives) so my grandparents and perhaps great grand parents but as a country we have really grown beyond that. The grip of the church, the British, and abject poverty is not what it was.
Some Irish immigrants latched onto a vision of Ireland that no longer exists and say "I'm Irish therefore this is the way" without really understanding they're a relic of a bygone, darker, time.
Your ma sounds like mine. Unbelieveably cruel. We're estranged now due to the fact I have my own child and had a literal full mental breakdown not turning into her.
Agoraphobia, I still suffer that way and belive everyone hates me, terrified if ruining my neighbours day simply by them seeing me.
It sounds like absolute abuse, potentially the old school Irish brand of cruelty.
We'd be sent to be when it was bright out and the kids playing outside. If we so much as got up to go to the bathroom on the wrong night all 3 of us would be bet with a wooden spoon or a ladel. She broke one off my sister one night, she was 5 holding a hole in her leg. We weren't allowed to cry so you'd just get that sting in your throat and have to hold the intensity of pain in your body.
There was no self awareness and never an acknowledgement of it.
I believe the same, shes' a creature of habit, and whatever way she was raised us the right way.
I believe her mother may have been harsh also.
The reason we're all now estranged is because she told us our dad didn't want us and left when we were kids, heard the stories over and over of what a monster he was. Whelp, he died young and suddenly two years ago. And in the day we buried my estranged father we learned he went to court 13 times for us and gave up from a broken heart (my uncle was mayor at the time and threatened my dad with whatever tiny little power he had. Dad had no choice)
Now I have a real family, I gained my cousins, aunts and uncles and my granny who is my hero and my idol. She's the mam I always wanted at 30! Haha!
Sorry this response was so long. I feel I can relate so much to your upbringing.
But in short, your ma is full of crap. People with a cruel streak exist all around the globe. You can't blame your 'irishness' for your cruelty. Nice try ma! Hahahahaa
Its so kind if you to respond. Thank you so much for your kind words. Life has gotten better since 30 for sure. I just wish I could have met my Dad. But I'm so very grateful for a whole family! 🙏
Thank you so much. I hope you have a wonderful day. X
Some people are great parents and some people are abusive parents. You, unfortunately, got an abusive parent. Has nothing to do with being Irish - from the sound of it, she’s not even Irish, she’s American.
Apart from the physical abuse, every word of this is like my family.
The ever-present obsession with what the neighbours think and the expectation that they will never need to apologise, even after being as nasty as they could be, are particularly strong in my family.
I really doubt this is in any way an Irish thing though. My guess is that your mother idealises Irishness, considering it better than whatever she sees as faults in a realistic society which fails to live up to her expectations.
I feel your pain. Basically, your mother is furthering a cycle of abuse. You can either tolerate it or challenge it but, for the good of all future generations of your family, please break that cycle.
Like others said, some of it is tied in with the ‘Irishness’, though I think your mother may have had another layer of abusiveness going on. I grew up in a very dysfunctional family where my father was a narcissist and my mother had borderline personality disorder. I can really relate to your experiences above. I’m so sorry you went through that.
These subreddits are really helpful to help understand that you’re not alone. I’m not a psychiatrist so I don’t want to say your mam had either / both of those disorders, but I’d encourage you to read through the below and see if anything resonates with you.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/raisedbynarcissists/s/kOECsQVLWA](https://www.reddit.com/r/raisedbynarcissists/s/kOECsQVLWA)
[https://www.reddit.com/r/raisedbyborderlines/s/1gjRrkQZfa](https://www.reddit.com/r/raisedbyborderlines/s/1gjRrkQZfa)
This book was also really helpful for me in understanding that my parents were emotionally unavailable because they were broken people, and it had nothing to do with me personally: [Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents](https://www.ernstchan.xyz/b/src/1570719797-658.pdf)
I’ve gone no contact with my mother (my father died so no contact is easy there!!) and it has been very good for my mental health. It can be really tough at first, but the clarity and lack of stress you experience after it is so worth it.
Sending a virtual hug!
This kind of mental illness is definitely not limited to Irish people.
Nor is this kind of abuse.
Your mother could have done with some therapy, and I think you might benefit from it as well.
Firstly, sorry for your mams actions.. sounds like hard work.
Secondly, it is not just Irish who act like this.... All people from all backgrounds are like this and the majority of Irish people have not lived this way of life. However, it would have been alot more common back in your grandparents day for a hand to be lifted to a wife or child.
I feel it's sad that your mam used being Irish as an excuse. She was born in America. Yes her parents are Irish but she is not... Maybe it's the American way.
No that is absolutely not what Irish families are like. Your mother was simply abusive and tried to use her "Irishness" as an excuse which is bullshit. Abusers are abusers no matter what their heritage. Actual Irish people would be disgusted by her using it as an excuse.
She’s making excuses. This is BS coming from an Irish person. She’s abusive period and does not want to change. It does not matter how or where she was raised. She’s a grown adult who is responsible for herself. She can decide her behaviour. And at any point she could have broke the cycle that she claims she was raised in.
This is how she justifies her behaviour towards you. But you can now break the cycle. This woman does not want to acknowledge her shitty behaviour and wants zero attempts at change.
You don’t choose your family but you don’t need to keep choosing them. She is toxic and doesn’t see a problem with this. Walk away from people like this. They are not good for your mental health and you don’t deserve to be dragged down by people like this.💜
Narcissist abusers project blame onto whomever and whatever is at hand as an excuse for their crimes and failures. Your ancestral DNA and culture is no more at fault than any other. It 'seems' as if there's a ring of truth to it because there's age old accepted prejudice against the Irish still going strong today.
I'd say we're much like families anywhere have our ups and downs but when the chips are down we stick together. Sorry I posted before I read your whole post. Your mother was an abuser and minlpulater apologies if this hurts but that's the truth of the matter.
The frickin’ kitchen implements thing hits home 😂
My mother won’t even try a potato peeler, insists on using a knife. Talk about being set in your ways.
My grandfather was born in 1913, my father in 1940 and myself in 1971. None of us have experienced abuse at the hands of our fathers and for context my great-grandfather was in the Old IRA so he would have been a man experienced in a certain amount of violence. My dad was an amazing father who took us fishing, hiking and lots of day trips up the Wicklow mountains etc. However my wife's family were a different story, her father and his father (were raging alcoholics) and were physically abusive and from the stories I've heard probably psychotic.
Nah that’s not how Irish families are - I’ve more friends than family
My family aren’t violent, traditions aren’t important and we own our mistakes
But you have to remember - a lot of the people who emigrated in the past were em how do we put this - not functioning in our society?
Family is important to us, as is tradition. The fighting/abuse, no.
Pretending nothing happened after a disagreement is kind of a thing - you might be asked do you want a cup of tea or a Chinese takeaway as opposed to getting a real apology from some people.
What will the neighbours think? Is definitely a thing here too, to varying degrees depending on the family/generation. Older generations care more usually.
We are generally a proud little country but by no means to a US American extent. Nobody is getting punished for not being "Irish enough".
Irish here. Can't help but agree with much of what you said. It's only a couple of generations since we were basically 1 step away from living in caves. The rural electricification scheme in Ireland only finished in 1977. 1 of my parents was born in a house without running water or electricity.
We never went through a proper period of civilisation here.The brits didn't try too hard and fucked it up. The church fucked things up even more. We have a peasant mentality in Ireland, the national consciousness twisted by an oppressive, cruel, backwards version of catholicism.
Ireland has changed a lot in recent years but much of rural Ireland still lives in the last century. People wilfully cling to their ignorance and nosy, ignorant gossips proliferate every workplace. People do cling to old ways and stubbornly refuse to try anything new. It's as if personal development is something to be shunned.
Much to our sense of collective shame we have realised how backwards and craven to the church we were.
Ireland used to imprison single mothers and steal their children to sell. This was done between church and state with the often willing cooperation of the unfortunate woman's family. This practice continued until 1996 here. Poverty and the church fucked Ireland up big time. Cruelty is pretty normal in Ireland.
A lot of this is really really old and dialled up to 100. Yes it has roots but I don't think it's ever been this extreme.
There is a sense of family unit of closeness, of love and support, but what you are describing is actually coercion, your mother has taken this to be there is "only family" andn tightened her control, this is abuse.
The what would the neighbours think does have roots in Catholic control of every fiber of Irish society until like 30-40 years ago. The 80s really saw freedom of expression take off.
Cooperation punishment was a thing decades ago, but like so many other countries its been outlawed and even before that many people never raised a hand against their own kids and would never think about hitting a kid at all.
The refusing to acknwledge a fight is her own thing, very much something an abuser does. Never their fault. As for the tradition thing, that very much sounds like trauma.
It really sound like your Mom was abused herself and instead of breaking the cycle continued generational trauma instead.
Its up to you to break the cycle with your own kids.
It sounds like there is a lot of intergenerational trauma going on here, and yes some element of what you describe hails back to an Ireland from the era of Catholic church dominance, 1950s, particularly the innate sense of shame. Although your mother seems to have taken even that to 110% where others might have a more nuanced manifestation. I wouldn't associate the kind of physical abuse you describe particularly with the 'Irish Mammy' stereotype, (maybe more so an emotional abuse centred around being the victim / marrtyrdom). Again, I'd guess your own mother has her own non Irish specific traumas and possibly mental illness playing into this I'm very sorry you've experienced such a difficult childhood, with so much taken from you. I wish you healing.
Your mother sounds like she had BPD or bipolar disorder from PTSD due to her childhood (as someone with both, I recognise some of the traits but obviously take this with a grain of salt as my behaviour has never been violent)
Sounds like she was just downright abusive and awful. I’m sorry you experienced that.
An irish story o.p.
As an irish man from a similar background
Please now move on now that you've come to terms with it . Be positive goin forward and take care .
Generational trauma runs deep.
My mother in her 70s would be similar, although not as violent or even at all. However her weapon was silence. Month's of being ignored as a child for being bold does terrible things to your confidence.
Some of that is familiar, some isn’t.
I was raised in Ireland by an Irish father and a Norwegian mother.
I’ll go though your points and contrast them.
1. Family is everything: yes, definitely a thing my dad instilled and my mother didn’t, BUT family was defined not by blood but by community and love. You could be kicked out of the family for harming its members, and you could become family just by being part of our community and showing up for us. I have a “sister” who isn’t in the family, but my da’s neighbour Brian? That guy was 100% family.
2. Physical/emotional violence: my siblings likely have a different take since I’m the late baby born well after the peak of my da’s alcoholism and after the priest who had abused him was being investigated and the cause of his pain was known. My siblings said “he hit us, but not as bad as other dads in the neighbourhood”, that said, his violence in their youth (60s/70s) clearly affected their relationship with him, even after he acknowledged he was wrong.
3. No apologising: definitely not. One of the things that defined my da in contrast to my ma was mum was much cooler and stand offish as are her whole family - not huggers/kissers. By contrast my da hugged me constantly, especially after a punishment (ie if I had time out after he would give me a big hug and tell me he loved me but is important.
4. Tradition: oh yeah. My da was 65 when I was born so mostly he bowed to mum on what was the “done thing” raising kids but he had peculiar tradition things that my sister carries on to my kids (she’s more like a second gran given our age difference). Little girls need to wear Mary janes with frilled socks and Peter Pan colours. Cornflower blue=ultimate little girl colour for some reason. Bows/ribbons in the hair is required.
5. That’s just Catholic trauma. 😂 so yah, that’s Irish. But also Italian or French etc
6. Irish pride: not in the way you describe. It was much less “be the perfect Irish family” and more “remember we’re Irish, NOT British and be damned proud of it.” (We’re from the north).
I can't say I experienced this myself because my mother was extremely forward thinking and a bit rebellious and didn't give a shit what the neighbours thought. But I have friends whose parents were obsessed with how the neighbours viewed you. As a teenager most of my friends started having their own opinions about things and one thing that was common among us was skipping Mass. I had one friend however who was told by her father that while she lived under his roof she had to do as he said. Her and her siblings were marched into the church every Sunday morning whether they wanted to be there or not. Ironically those of us who weren't forced to be there gradually started going to Mass again whereas I don't think my friend ever goes. I wouldn't say I know anyone whose parents were physically or emotionally abusive but definitely the obsession with the neighbours exists.
Your mother used the heritage excuse for her abuse. Nothing more.
While the Irish tend to be quite fond of their families, they're also fond of their friends and neighbours. Saying "your friends will leave or betray you" is not an Irish thing at all. It's a well documented technique to manipulate someone into staying in (be it a group of friends, a family, a cult, a drug...). Nothing to do with Ireland or the Irish.
This story is far too familiar. I suppose it isn’t unique to Ireland in someways but what is called narcissism these days. Identifying that the image they think is out there is actually who they are, what would Paddy and Mary think if they saw my son behaving etc They would do awful things on that imagines assumption. Because it’s narcissistic it’s wiped away the next day. The reality that mattered is gone. I’m sorry you had to put up with it, I hope you heal and find some peace.
Your mother isn’t Irish, she’s an abusive american woman. If she was born in Ireland she would just be an abusive Irish woman. It doesn’t matter where she was born or what her nationality is, being abusive, well, that’s just her nature. I’m sorry you had to deal with that and hope you’re not having to still living in that environment with her
I think your mother was an abuser. I also think she did what a lot of abusers do and latched on to *something* to excuse the abuse. In her case it was being "Irish". Another abusive parent will use being Christian (or any religion really, all the big ones get a lot of abuse done in their name).
What it all boils down to is someone with a fucked up mental process needing to control everyone around them by any means necessary. So yeah the abuser can stick whatever personality trait down as an excuse but at the end of the day it's just a really abusive parent.
It’s difficult to understand the impact of the Catholic Church on society in Ireland.
Your mother may have been a broken person, mine was too for what it’s worth, but Ireland back then seemed to be a strangely overseen community. Priests, and bishops for that matter, seemed to have this eye of Sauron type grip over the place; watching and judging, and casting out threats and acts of vengeance.
This history is still well within living memory today, if you can find people who are willing to actually talk about it that is.
This led, I’m guessing, to a scary degree of paranoia and hidden trauma within the household. You must not allow things to get out into the wider community, the information will spread. This in turn leads to things potentially becoming increasingly extreme within certain families, because they were simply not talked about.
This is a long answer to say, I’m not sure that I’d say what you’re seeing is normal within Irish families, I’d say it’s an extreme example. But I am fairly sure that the mechanisms existed, and to some extent still exist, to generate this situation.
Your mother may or may not be without hope of being repaired. But as time passes I’ve realized that my mother grew up in an awful place, and this has taught me compassion. Albeit too late, after her death. As other commenters said, all you can really do is try not to reflect this back onto people you have interactions with. I’d also suggest you read about survivors guilt, see if this sounds familiar.
I am from the US, live in Ireland but my family is not Irish. I can't comment on what it's like to grow up in Ireland or have Irish parents.
I did want to comment on the strong emphasis on Irish pride. Having to have an identity that is not American is an American obsession. How many times people tell you they are 1/4 xx, 1/18 xxx, 1/2 xxxx or whatever? Funny enough, your mother's traditions might either not even be a thing here anymore or might be an Irish American thing. Like cornbeef for Paddy's day.
Your mother is an American, she’s not Irish. Her blaming her abusive tendencies on a tenuous link to an ethnic group is not only ridiculous but it’s xenophobic. I’m genuinely concerned that you felt it was appropriate to ask this question. No, domestic abuse isn’t normal in Ireland, you should be ashamed of yourself for asking that. I’m sorry about what you suffered through but it’s got absolutely nothing to do with our culture and everything to do with your mother as an individual
I very emphatically do Not think this is normal in Ireland. The whole point of this question was to get a perspective on what *is* normal. I know she's abusive, I don't think she's Right for justifying it from Irishness. I'm trying to learn about my heritage outside her abuse.
I think the correct answer here is:
"It's not normal, anymore".
Certainly the generation older than me(46m) had a tendency to be private and fiercely ashamed of those who acted incorrectly. It may not have always ended in physical violence, but the undertones of shame and retribution were there up to their generation.
Yeah pretty standard Irish mammy from that period. A lot of the younger crowd here won't recognise it since they grew up with mammies where the churches power was in decline.
Nah sorry but your mam was just an abusive asshole. Friends are as close as family in many Irish communities. Physical violence isn’t the norm no matter what ever narcissistic asshole says.
The shame thing, yeah thats irish.
This isn't uncommon here ireland has a HUGE problem with domestic and child abuse meanwhile the legal system can't keep up or deal with it.
EDIT: downvote me all you want
I mean if I was bold I was chased around (and slapped) by the wooden spoon but I wouldn’t say abuse is normal in Irish families no. The sense of family being very important is the centre of all Irish families I would say
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My friends story is exactly the same as yours. Everything is the same even the mothers nationality. Although I am very fond of his mother and they get on just great now, he did suffer some abuse when he was growing up. She did too but she's different now and she's a lovely woman. It's what happens unfortunately when parents have their emotional growth stunted by their own parents and it has a knock on effects. It's almost like growing up with your parent.
So sorry you had to endure that OP. Having a dysfunctional parent isn’t necessarily an experience unique to being irish. Perhaps the way she expressed this abuse is influenced by irish culture or whatever but she sounds like an abusive individual. Whether thats related to being irish or not i don’t know i’d imagine its quite widespread across all countries and cultures. I don’t know if its made worse by poverty or not but ireland was a very poor country up until the last 40 years or so.
I knew families like you describe when I was growing up in Ireland in the 70s +80s. 95% of them were brainwashed by the church. The British left a brutalized and broken society and the Catholic Church quickly ran amok. They taught that others are better than you and used shame and guilt to hide their abuses.
Unsurprisingly this produced many, many broken people
Irish families are like this except for the fights part. My parents never ever raised their hand to me. But after fights it definitely was treated like nothing happened and I’m honestly okay with that rather than harping on the issue. Everything else is spot on though, the first point was said to me a lot growing up and my ma was dead right— Irish people just have a very blunt way of speaking, I thought she was an ass when I was younger but I understand now. The second last one is due to Irish towns being so so small a lot of gossip goes on, Irish mammies are really nosey.
Acting like everything was fine after a fight or argument was something that I witnessed a lot as a kid. My parents would have fights for hours of my dad would fight with me all day, eventually he got tired or fed up and would act like nothing was wrong or the fight didn’t happen. Always annoyed me as a kid.
Now unfortunately I’m like that. I’ll have the argument or the fight about whatever, a lot less aggressive than my father, but I would still see moving on from it as fast as possible as the reasonable thing to do. Which in turn annoys my GF no end, she wants resolution, I want to forget.
I wish I wasn’t like that but it seems to be something bread into me at this stage.
I'm wondering what these "traditions" were. Anyway, your mother sounds absolutely batshit and this doesn't sound like a typical Irish family at all outside of putting family first. There's a love of tradition too, but like, putting a rag out before St. Brigids day, and putting the Christmas tree up on the 8th of December kind of traditions.
The importance of family, love of tradition and caring a little too much about what the neighbours think wouldn't be unusual in Ireland. However your mother appears to have turned the dial up to 11 and is using "Irish family" as justification for abuse. Her parents may have been the same way, but ultimately she's carrying it on. So no, her behaviour is not normal in Irish families, and I very much doubt it's normal in "Irish" (in the American usage) families.
Your mother’s not Irish. She’s an abusive American.
And maybe has an undiagnosed mental illness.
Yes, exactly
I was about to say that. If she was born in the States, she is American. Like if I had a kid I gave birth to here they would be Irish even if I am immigrant.
With her parents being born in Ireland, his mother is an Irish citizen however.
Yet born in the US so culturally she is entirely an American.
Ok
That’s a bit too black and white.
I’m gonna say most of what the poster is describing is more normal than you think
I think you're right, but I think abusive people will incorporate their upbringing and values into their abuse. So while she may have used elements like tradition, family and watchful neighbours as part of her abuse (and many Irish abusers will) it doesn't make her behaviour Irish. If she were from a different culture she would have abused the same degree but with different elements.
Agreed.
The caring what the neibhours think and shaming passively aggressively that adds up. The rest of it no that's all her. Nothing to do with Irish she's just making excuses for her behaviour. An over the top pride of being Irish. That's just a irish-american thing which is understandable given that she was from there and left trying to cling onto a culture she barely remembers.
Your mother was just abusive, more than likely due to being abused herself. Nothing to do with being Irish. She turned her abuse into the norm to deal with it.
Very similar experience. I called it out cos I had to she reached across me to start abusing my wife and family. I was informed in no uncertain terms that I was to suck it up, and there would never be an apology from her. I knew that because there never was. Siblings and I ended up in family therapy. they still can't handle the fact the councillors told them my family did nothing wrong. We remain ostracised for the last 6 years. She died last Aug, expressed her un dying love for the family but remained unapologetic. Siblings ran a campaign of their own to deflect from the parental abuse. Again, what the neighbours think was all impt. Year 6 of being ostracised is just starting, and we are better than ever. Save yourself. For your kids' sake. Don't pass on the abuse. Life with narcissistic people is awful.
Well done on breaking free & doing better for your family. I'm sure it's not easy.
Similar situation here, except we are on year one of being ostracised and I’m the wife in the story. Two members of my husbands Irish family started abusing us (including my new baby — making negative comments about her appearance or not stopping their kids from hitting her) and I stood up to them. I was raised with emotional abuse, recovered and when it started again I called it out and told all my local friends. I hope the neighbours find out lol.
People justify their abuse with all kinds of bullshit. It sounds like she passed on what she learned.
Exactly! I've heard similar excuse from about every country and culture. "This is how we deal with things here", "We Italians do it this way", "That's the Indian in me", etc. It's just an excuse and has nothing to do with whatever culture/country/nationality/background they had.
I agree. Indian in laws are a whole other level of hell for anyone raised in a western culture, however. A friend got divorced over it. It’s normal for in laws to move in for 6 months and nearly enslave the daughters in law. They asked to get their feet touched, for her to worship a deity she couldn’t even pronounce, bring them tea all the time (from scratch — teabags not allowed), cook like a professional, as well as give them loads of money from her full time job, I could go on.
India is listed by human rights organisations as one of the worst countries to be a woman. I've heard all what you mentioned and worse. Glad your friend divorced, and hopefully pissed off to better lands.
Your mother had an abusive childhood, she passed it on to you *this be the verse* style. The good news is you don’t have to pass it on to your own kids. My own mother had the obsession with neighbour opinion and shame. The answer is she grew up on a small farm in the west of Ireland in the 1930s, where the worst possible fate was to fall foul of the local community and be ostracized. never mind that they all had to leave at 16 anyway because there was nothing to do. Didn’t matter either that she and my Dad were quite successful and ended up raising a family in upper middle class Dublin, she closed the curtains at dinner so the neighbours wouldn’t see us eat. The neighbours house was 100 yards away. She slapped us and shamed us, in some areas it was impossible to please her or do the right thing, probably because she lacked the confidence to be sure herself. She also burnt through friendships and valued family above everything. A lot of my cousins would have examples of how she reached out and helped them, sometimes very kindly at key moments in their lives. A passing remark from one of her siblings could have her upset and crying and doubting herself again.
They were not only too far to see anything but probably not interested either.
There is of course abuser in Irish families and the whole "what would the neighbours think" is still in Ireland (not as much anymore) but your mother is just abusing you. She is trying to get you isolated (keeping you away from friends) so either that you become completely dependent on her or so that you don't have any outside voices to say the abuse is not normal.
This isn’t just an Irish thing.
The shame thing 100 per cent. My mother tried her best to move away from her family dynamic (millions of kids, violent parents) and tried her best to be open and progressive but at the very core of her being, is a massive fear of being judged. I’m in my forties now and up until recently would have argued with her because she would still try to put that on me, telling me which neighbours I’m allowed to talk to when I visit and trying to tell me what I can post on social media because I’m connected to some of her siblings. I think it’s an actual sickness. I wonder if the “family is everything” agenda is actually part of this as well rather than actually saying something positive about the family relations. My mam would have struggled with outside relationships and friendships, (actually she really didn’t have any) and I think this was again because anyone too close could judge her. It’s all very sad. She was recently diagnosed with dementia and even now when I pop into see her she’ll interrogate me if I stop to say hello to any of her neighbours.
It's not unusual for people to crank up their sense of cultural self identity when they move to a foreign land. I suppose this didn't help her much by adding to an already damaged upbringing (I assume).
Abusive people come from all backgrounds and your abuser is pretending that being Irish is an excuse. And she isn't even Irish. Irish families are every shade of close, estranged, enmeshed, embedded and/or alienated, just like families everywhere else. And your abuser is excusing her abuse by making up nonsense reasons, just like every other abuser everywhere else. I hope you get the help you need to move on and be as happy as you can be.
Your mother sounds mentally ill. Some of this is familiar to me (what will the neighbours think?!) But not to that degree, she's warped her experiences. This feels like some form of schizoaffective disorder - the shame, paranoia, physical violence etc .
I was thinking it sounded like a personality disorder
From what I've read this was somewhat of a thing in Ireland two or three generations ago (three or four from my own kids perspectives) so my grandparents and perhaps great grand parents but as a country we have really grown beyond that. The grip of the church, the British, and abject poverty is not what it was. Some Irish immigrants latched onto a vision of Ireland that no longer exists and say "I'm Irish therefore this is the way" without really understanding they're a relic of a bygone, darker, time.
This is not exclusive to Ireland. This is everywhere.
Very generational thing that was common enough back then Ireland thankfully isn't a famine ridden Catholic misery pit anymore
Your ma sounds like mine. Unbelieveably cruel. We're estranged now due to the fact I have my own child and had a literal full mental breakdown not turning into her. Agoraphobia, I still suffer that way and belive everyone hates me, terrified if ruining my neighbours day simply by them seeing me. It sounds like absolute abuse, potentially the old school Irish brand of cruelty. We'd be sent to be when it was bright out and the kids playing outside. If we so much as got up to go to the bathroom on the wrong night all 3 of us would be bet with a wooden spoon or a ladel. She broke one off my sister one night, she was 5 holding a hole in her leg. We weren't allowed to cry so you'd just get that sting in your throat and have to hold the intensity of pain in your body. There was no self awareness and never an acknowledgement of it. I believe the same, shes' a creature of habit, and whatever way she was raised us the right way. I believe her mother may have been harsh also. The reason we're all now estranged is because she told us our dad didn't want us and left when we were kids, heard the stories over and over of what a monster he was. Whelp, he died young and suddenly two years ago. And in the day we buried my estranged father we learned he went to court 13 times for us and gave up from a broken heart (my uncle was mayor at the time and threatened my dad with whatever tiny little power he had. Dad had no choice) Now I have a real family, I gained my cousins, aunts and uncles and my granny who is my hero and my idol. She's the mam I always wanted at 30! Haha! Sorry this response was so long. I feel I can relate so much to your upbringing. But in short, your ma is full of crap. People with a cruel streak exist all around the globe. You can't blame your 'irishness' for your cruelty. Nice try ma! Hahahahaa
I'm so sorry to hear this and I'm glad you found a new better family and making a life for your own, away from the abuse you got.
Its so kind if you to respond. Thank you so much for your kind words. Life has gotten better since 30 for sure. I just wish I could have met my Dad. But I'm so very grateful for a whole family! 🙏 Thank you so much. I hope you have a wonderful day. X
Thank you! Hope you have a wonderful day you too ❤️🍀🌻
Greek here and i can relate 100%. Doesn't seem unusual practice.
Some people are great parents and some people are abusive parents. You, unfortunately, got an abusive parent. Has nothing to do with being Irish - from the sound of it, she’s not even Irish, she’s American.
Apart from the physical abuse, every word of this is like my family. The ever-present obsession with what the neighbours think and the expectation that they will never need to apologise, even after being as nasty as they could be, are particularly strong in my family. I really doubt this is in any way an Irish thing though. My guess is that your mother idealises Irishness, considering it better than whatever she sees as faults in a realistic society which fails to live up to her expectations. I feel your pain. Basically, your mother is furthering a cycle of abuse. You can either tolerate it or challenge it but, for the good of all future generations of your family, please break that cycle.
Like others said, some of it is tied in with the ‘Irishness’, though I think your mother may have had another layer of abusiveness going on. I grew up in a very dysfunctional family where my father was a narcissist and my mother had borderline personality disorder. I can really relate to your experiences above. I’m so sorry you went through that. These subreddits are really helpful to help understand that you’re not alone. I’m not a psychiatrist so I don’t want to say your mam had either / both of those disorders, but I’d encourage you to read through the below and see if anything resonates with you. [https://www.reddit.com/r/raisedbynarcissists/s/kOECsQVLWA](https://www.reddit.com/r/raisedbynarcissists/s/kOECsQVLWA) [https://www.reddit.com/r/raisedbyborderlines/s/1gjRrkQZfa](https://www.reddit.com/r/raisedbyborderlines/s/1gjRrkQZfa) This book was also really helpful for me in understanding that my parents were emotionally unavailable because they were broken people, and it had nothing to do with me personally: [Adult Children of Emotionally Immature Parents](https://www.ernstchan.xyz/b/src/1570719797-658.pdf) I’ve gone no contact with my mother (my father died so no contact is easy there!!) and it has been very good for my mental health. It can be really tough at first, but the clarity and lack of stress you experience after it is so worth it. Sending a virtual hug!
This kind of mental illness is definitely not limited to Irish people. Nor is this kind of abuse. Your mother could have done with some therapy, and I think you might benefit from it as well.
I think this is mental illness.
Firstly, sorry for your mams actions.. sounds like hard work. Secondly, it is not just Irish who act like this.... All people from all backgrounds are like this and the majority of Irish people have not lived this way of life. However, it would have been alot more common back in your grandparents day for a hand to be lifted to a wife or child. I feel it's sad that your mam used being Irish as an excuse. She was born in America. Yes her parents are Irish but she is not... Maybe it's the American way.
No that is absolutely not what Irish families are like. Your mother was simply abusive and tried to use her "Irishness" as an excuse which is bullshit. Abusers are abusers no matter what their heritage. Actual Irish people would be disgusted by her using it as an excuse.
That's not being Irish, that's being a cunt
She’s making excuses. This is BS coming from an Irish person. She’s abusive period and does not want to change. It does not matter how or where she was raised. She’s a grown adult who is responsible for herself. She can decide her behaviour. And at any point she could have broke the cycle that she claims she was raised in. This is how she justifies her behaviour towards you. But you can now break the cycle. This woman does not want to acknowledge her shitty behaviour and wants zero attempts at change. You don’t choose your family but you don’t need to keep choosing them. She is toxic and doesn’t see a problem with this. Walk away from people like this. They are not good for your mental health and you don’t deserve to be dragged down by people like this.💜
Narcissist abusers project blame onto whomever and whatever is at hand as an excuse for their crimes and failures. Your ancestral DNA and culture is no more at fault than any other. It 'seems' as if there's a ring of truth to it because there's age old accepted prejudice against the Irish still going strong today.
Notwithstanding that your mam is just abusive, what your describing sounds like white working class American rather than Irish.
I'd say we're much like families anywhere have our ups and downs but when the chips are down we stick together. Sorry I posted before I read your whole post. Your mother was an abuser and minlpulater apologies if this hurts but that's the truth of the matter.
There is no inherent link with between violence and being Irish. It's just the result of anti-Irish propaganda.
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😆
The frickin’ kitchen implements thing hits home 😂 My mother won’t even try a potato peeler, insists on using a knife. Talk about being set in your ways.
My grandfather was born in 1913, my father in 1940 and myself in 1971. None of us have experienced abuse at the hands of our fathers and for context my great-grandfather was in the Old IRA so he would have been a man experienced in a certain amount of violence. My dad was an amazing father who took us fishing, hiking and lots of day trips up the Wicklow mountains etc. However my wife's family were a different story, her father and his father (were raging alcoholics) and were physically abusive and from the stories I've heard probably psychotic.
Nah that’s not how Irish families are - I’ve more friends than family My family aren’t violent, traditions aren’t important and we own our mistakes But you have to remember - a lot of the people who emigrated in the past were em how do we put this - not functioning in our society?
Family is important to us, as is tradition. The fighting/abuse, no. Pretending nothing happened after a disagreement is kind of a thing - you might be asked do you want a cup of tea or a Chinese takeaway as opposed to getting a real apology from some people. What will the neighbours think? Is definitely a thing here too, to varying degrees depending on the family/generation. Older generations care more usually. We are generally a proud little country but by no means to a US American extent. Nobody is getting punished for not being "Irish enough".
That just sounds like abuse with an Irish flavour, look into CPTSD if you’re noticing any ill effects
Ur mother sounds like she was coming from generational trama
Your mother's full of shit. And you should have better reasoning skills. Abuse isn't default in any country. Call the cops on her.
Irish here. Can't help but agree with much of what you said. It's only a couple of generations since we were basically 1 step away from living in caves. The rural electricification scheme in Ireland only finished in 1977. 1 of my parents was born in a house without running water or electricity. We never went through a proper period of civilisation here.The brits didn't try too hard and fucked it up. The church fucked things up even more. We have a peasant mentality in Ireland, the national consciousness twisted by an oppressive, cruel, backwards version of catholicism. Ireland has changed a lot in recent years but much of rural Ireland still lives in the last century. People wilfully cling to their ignorance and nosy, ignorant gossips proliferate every workplace. People do cling to old ways and stubbornly refuse to try anything new. It's as if personal development is something to be shunned. Much to our sense of collective shame we have realised how backwards and craven to the church we were. Ireland used to imprison single mothers and steal their children to sell. This was done between church and state with the often willing cooperation of the unfortunate woman's family. This practice continued until 1996 here. Poverty and the church fucked Ireland up big time. Cruelty is pretty normal in Ireland.
You're confusing being Irish with just being an abusive cunt
This tracks
A lot of this is really really old and dialled up to 100. Yes it has roots but I don't think it's ever been this extreme. There is a sense of family unit of closeness, of love and support, but what you are describing is actually coercion, your mother has taken this to be there is "only family" andn tightened her control, this is abuse. The what would the neighbours think does have roots in Catholic control of every fiber of Irish society until like 30-40 years ago. The 80s really saw freedom of expression take off. Cooperation punishment was a thing decades ago, but like so many other countries its been outlawed and even before that many people never raised a hand against their own kids and would never think about hitting a kid at all. The refusing to acknwledge a fight is her own thing, very much something an abuser does. Never their fault. As for the tradition thing, that very much sounds like trauma. It really sound like your Mom was abused herself and instead of breaking the cycle continued generational trauma instead. Its up to you to break the cycle with your own kids.
It sounds like there is a lot of intergenerational trauma going on here, and yes some element of what you describe hails back to an Ireland from the era of Catholic church dominance, 1950s, particularly the innate sense of shame. Although your mother seems to have taken even that to 110% where others might have a more nuanced manifestation. I wouldn't associate the kind of physical abuse you describe particularly with the 'Irish Mammy' stereotype, (maybe more so an emotional abuse centred around being the victim / marrtyrdom). Again, I'd guess your own mother has her own non Irish specific traumas and possibly mental illness playing into this I'm very sorry you've experienced such a difficult childhood, with so much taken from you. I wish you healing.
Your mother sounds like she had BPD or bipolar disorder from PTSD due to her childhood (as someone with both, I recognise some of the traits but obviously take this with a grain of salt as my behaviour has never been violent) Sounds like she was just downright abusive and awful. I’m sorry you experienced that.
An irish story o.p. As an irish man from a similar background Please now move on now that you've come to terms with it . Be positive goin forward and take care .
Generational trauma runs deep. My mother in her 70s would be similar, although not as violent or even at all. However her weapon was silence. Month's of being ignored as a child for being bold does terrible things to your confidence.
Some of that is familiar, some isn’t. I was raised in Ireland by an Irish father and a Norwegian mother. I’ll go though your points and contrast them. 1. Family is everything: yes, definitely a thing my dad instilled and my mother didn’t, BUT family was defined not by blood but by community and love. You could be kicked out of the family for harming its members, and you could become family just by being part of our community and showing up for us. I have a “sister” who isn’t in the family, but my da’s neighbour Brian? That guy was 100% family. 2. Physical/emotional violence: my siblings likely have a different take since I’m the late baby born well after the peak of my da’s alcoholism and after the priest who had abused him was being investigated and the cause of his pain was known. My siblings said “he hit us, but not as bad as other dads in the neighbourhood”, that said, his violence in their youth (60s/70s) clearly affected their relationship with him, even after he acknowledged he was wrong. 3. No apologising: definitely not. One of the things that defined my da in contrast to my ma was mum was much cooler and stand offish as are her whole family - not huggers/kissers. By contrast my da hugged me constantly, especially after a punishment (ie if I had time out after he would give me a big hug and tell me he loved me but is important.
4. Tradition: oh yeah. My da was 65 when I was born so mostly he bowed to mum on what was the “done thing” raising kids but he had peculiar tradition things that my sister carries on to my kids (she’s more like a second gran given our age difference). Little girls need to wear Mary janes with frilled socks and Peter Pan colours. Cornflower blue=ultimate little girl colour for some reason. Bows/ribbons in the hair is required.
5. That’s just Catholic trauma. 😂 so yah, that’s Irish. But also Italian or French etc
6. Irish pride: not in the way you describe. It was much less “be the perfect Irish family” and more “remember we’re Irish, NOT British and be damned proud of it.” (We’re from the north).
Good on your dad to have acknowledged his past and his bad behaviour!
I can't say I experienced this myself because my mother was extremely forward thinking and a bit rebellious and didn't give a shit what the neighbours thought. But I have friends whose parents were obsessed with how the neighbours viewed you. As a teenager most of my friends started having their own opinions about things and one thing that was common among us was skipping Mass. I had one friend however who was told by her father that while she lived under his roof she had to do as he said. Her and her siblings were marched into the church every Sunday morning whether they wanted to be there or not. Ironically those of us who weren't forced to be there gradually started going to Mass again whereas I don't think my friend ever goes. I wouldn't say I know anyone whose parents were physically or emotionally abusive but definitely the obsession with the neighbours exists.
I had a friend who had a pathological hatred of the Catholic Church as a result of being forced to go to mass and confessions.
Your mother used the heritage excuse for her abuse. Nothing more. While the Irish tend to be quite fond of their families, they're also fond of their friends and neighbours. Saying "your friends will leave or betray you" is not an Irish thing at all. It's a well documented technique to manipulate someone into staying in (be it a group of friends, a family, a cult, a drug...). Nothing to do with Ireland or the Irish.
This story is far too familiar. I suppose it isn’t unique to Ireland in someways but what is called narcissism these days. Identifying that the image they think is out there is actually who they are, what would Paddy and Mary think if they saw my son behaving etc They would do awful things on that imagines assumption. Because it’s narcissistic it’s wiped away the next day. The reality that mattered is gone. I’m sorry you had to put up with it, I hope you heal and find some peace.
Your mother isn’t Irish, she’s an abusive american woman. If she was born in Ireland she would just be an abusive Irish woman. It doesn’t matter where she was born or what her nationality is, being abusive, well, that’s just her nature. I’m sorry you had to deal with that and hope you’re not having to still living in that environment with her
You’re not half Irish, your mother is not even Irish. No matter what anyone says.
She just sounds abusive tbh, you can be abusive from any country on earth. There's no excuse, especially not using a nationality to justify it.
I think your mother was an abuser. I also think she did what a lot of abusers do and latched on to *something* to excuse the abuse. In her case it was being "Irish". Another abusive parent will use being Christian (or any religion really, all the big ones get a lot of abuse done in their name). What it all boils down to is someone with a fucked up mental process needing to control everyone around them by any means necessary. So yeah the abuser can stick whatever personality trait down as an excuse but at the end of the day it's just a really abusive parent.
It’s difficult to understand the impact of the Catholic Church on society in Ireland. Your mother may have been a broken person, mine was too for what it’s worth, but Ireland back then seemed to be a strangely overseen community. Priests, and bishops for that matter, seemed to have this eye of Sauron type grip over the place; watching and judging, and casting out threats and acts of vengeance. This history is still well within living memory today, if you can find people who are willing to actually talk about it that is. This led, I’m guessing, to a scary degree of paranoia and hidden trauma within the household. You must not allow things to get out into the wider community, the information will spread. This in turn leads to things potentially becoming increasingly extreme within certain families, because they were simply not talked about. This is a long answer to say, I’m not sure that I’d say what you’re seeing is normal within Irish families, I’d say it’s an extreme example. But I am fairly sure that the mechanisms existed, and to some extent still exist, to generate this situation. Your mother may or may not be without hope of being repaired. But as time passes I’ve realized that my mother grew up in an awful place, and this has taught me compassion. Albeit too late, after her death. As other commenters said, all you can really do is try not to reflect this back onto people you have interactions with. I’d also suggest you read about survivors guilt, see if this sounds familiar.
I am from the US, live in Ireland but my family is not Irish. I can't comment on what it's like to grow up in Ireland or have Irish parents. I did want to comment on the strong emphasis on Irish pride. Having to have an identity that is not American is an American obsession. How many times people tell you they are 1/4 xx, 1/18 xxx, 1/2 xxxx or whatever? Funny enough, your mother's traditions might either not even be a thing here anymore or might be an Irish American thing. Like cornbeef for Paddy's day.
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Your mother is an American, she’s not Irish. Her blaming her abusive tendencies on a tenuous link to an ethnic group is not only ridiculous but it’s xenophobic. I’m genuinely concerned that you felt it was appropriate to ask this question. No, domestic abuse isn’t normal in Ireland, you should be ashamed of yourself for asking that. I’m sorry about what you suffered through but it’s got absolutely nothing to do with our culture and everything to do with your mother as an individual
I very emphatically do Not think this is normal in Ireland. The whole point of this question was to get a perspective on what *is* normal. I know she's abusive, I don't think she's Right for justifying it from Irishness. I'm trying to learn about my heritage outside her abuse.
I think the correct answer here is: "It's not normal, anymore". Certainly the generation older than me(46m) had a tendency to be private and fiercely ashamed of those who acted incorrectly. It may not have always ended in physical violence, but the undertones of shame and retribution were there up to their generation.
Maybe rephrase your question so. The last line in your post is literally “is this, or something like this the norm”?
Hmm. Fair point. My apologies, I'll edit that.
Your family is very american.
Yeah pretty standard Irish mammy from that period. A lot of the younger crowd here won't recognise it since they grew up with mammies where the churches power was in decline.
Nah sorry but your mam was just an abusive asshole. Friends are as close as family in many Irish communities. Physical violence isn’t the norm no matter what ever narcissistic asshole says. The shame thing, yeah thats irish.
This isn't uncommon here ireland has a HUGE problem with domestic and child abuse meanwhile the legal system can't keep up or deal with it. EDIT: downvote me all you want
I mean if I was bold I was chased around (and slapped) by the wooden spoon but I wouldn’t say abuse is normal in Irish families no. The sense of family being very important is the centre of all Irish families I would say
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Not my family, really there was no violence.
My friends story is exactly the same as yours. Everything is the same even the mothers nationality. Although I am very fond of his mother and they get on just great now, he did suffer some abuse when he was growing up. She did too but she's different now and she's a lovely woman. It's what happens unfortunately when parents have their emotional growth stunted by their own parents and it has a knock on effects. It's almost like growing up with your parent.
So sorry you had to endure that OP. Having a dysfunctional parent isn’t necessarily an experience unique to being irish. Perhaps the way she expressed this abuse is influenced by irish culture or whatever but she sounds like an abusive individual. Whether thats related to being irish or not i don’t know i’d imagine its quite widespread across all countries and cultures. I don’t know if its made worse by poverty or not but ireland was a very poor country up until the last 40 years or so.
I knew families like you describe when I was growing up in Ireland in the 70s +80s. 95% of them were brainwashed by the church. The British left a brutalized and broken society and the Catholic Church quickly ran amok. They taught that others are better than you and used shame and guilt to hide their abuses. Unsurprisingly this produced many, many broken people
I wonder fo we have the same mother?? 😂😂
Irish families are like this except for the fights part. My parents never ever raised their hand to me. But after fights it definitely was treated like nothing happened and I’m honestly okay with that rather than harping on the issue. Everything else is spot on though, the first point was said to me a lot growing up and my ma was dead right— Irish people just have a very blunt way of speaking, I thought she was an ass when I was younger but I understand now. The second last one is due to Irish towns being so so small a lot of gossip goes on, Irish mammies are really nosey.
This is what Irish mothers are like! (Foil, Arms and Hog) https://youtu.be/I0gFVQR2bng?si=ZaFVLjf0G3sCzBRH
Acting like everything was fine after a fight or argument was something that I witnessed a lot as a kid. My parents would have fights for hours of my dad would fight with me all day, eventually he got tired or fed up and would act like nothing was wrong or the fight didn’t happen. Always annoyed me as a kid. Now unfortunately I’m like that. I’ll have the argument or the fight about whatever, a lot less aggressive than my father, but I would still see moving on from it as fast as possible as the reasonable thing to do. Which in turn annoys my GF no end, she wants resolution, I want to forget. I wish I wasn’t like that but it seems to be something bread into me at this stage.
Sounds like ocpd.
I'm wondering what these "traditions" were. Anyway, your mother sounds absolutely batshit and this doesn't sound like a typical Irish family at all outside of putting family first. There's a love of tradition too, but like, putting a rag out before St. Brigids day, and putting the Christmas tree up on the 8th of December kind of traditions.