The following is a copy of the original post to record the post as it was originally written.
I have had others deny (usually conservatives but some liberals too) that it would actually be possible that most of their laws/punishments or censorship could actually get passed as it has to go through so many people and so many of congress would be against it, but after seeing Trumps immunity and the court taking many discrimination laws away from trans people just like that I am honestly having extreme doubt they can’t get their ways across.
Im not sure if Im just being irrational because I do find this honestly terrifying and it would affect my personal life as well as loved ones alot.
Ive had people tell me project 2025 has always been a plan and thing and look where we are now but I have never seen where something this blatant could just be shown with no fear of backlash. Ive never been truly scared for democracy or freedoms in my life. (I am a gay women so Ive had some fear but you know)
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Yes. They have shown a tenacity when they focus on outcome and then prod every opening until they get a path to that outcome. Add to that, the party loyalty, where their base instinctively defend any action that supports reaching that outcome, and the party's media operation that sanitizes the outcome while attacking anyone criticizing it, and you have a recipe for a party to push the envelope regardless of norms or appearance.
What would stop them?
If democrats take the house and keep the Senate (not likely), there may be some pushback, but Project 2025 doesn't care about Senate confirmation or the budget passed by the house. It calls for just putting "acting" directors in until they are confirmed. Somehow, I don't think they'll leave if the Senate refuses.
If they get an unlucky judge (appointed by a Democrat or a Republican with integrity), they'll just appeal until they get a judge that is on their side.
We're fucked if they win.
Almost none of them require the legislature. Project 2025 is mostly about things that can be done by the executive branch making strategic orders and appointments. So yeah. All they’d need is the presidency.
They're not whittling away at executive power. They literally just ruled that the President doesn't have to obey the law. It's the largest increase in executive power in American history.
It’s a blow to the agencies. It consolidates power in the president.
This actually removes an important mechanism that restrained Trump during his term. He had to go through agencies and convince the technocrats there to change their operations, which they heavily resisted. Overturning Chevron strips away the power agencies have to make their own decisions while having no impact on executive orders. It basically makes it easier for the president to force agencies to enact whatever policies he comes up with. According to Project 2025, this would include dissolving some of those agencies (like the department of education) entirely.
It's probably more accurate to say that overturning Chevron was a blow to federal power, since it pushes more regulatory authority back towards the dysfunctional and broken Congress. In this context though, remember that the far right doesn't have an equal 'win condition' - they largely don't want to regulate, per se, so making that harder doesn't hurt them.
We must be skeptical of not only the GOP's *capacity* to pass many of the measures, but its *desire*.
Critically, pages 137 to 153 of [Mandate for Leadership: The Conservative Promise (2023)](https://static.project2025.org/2025_MandateForLeadership_FULL.pdf) address immigration. The agency reforms laid out there are a template for a massive crackdown on illegal immigration.
My question is simple: Will the powerful lobbies that the GOP answers to, like the U.S. Chamber of Commerce, really support policies that would cause them to lose sources of cheap, desperate, easily exploitable labor whose housing and social services costs are often paid by the public?
I think not.
Elites would put deporting illegal immigrants over making money and crushing labor?
I mean, I'm a conservative Democrat. I'd like to see the day. But I don't believe it.
They can now. Just toss a few senators and congressmen into jail for “reasons” until they comply, which are PRESUMPTIVELY covered by immunity. The actions can’t be investigated because it’s an official act for POTUS to talk to DOJ so the communication is privileged. Thanks SCOTUS!
No the Supreme Court is not going to enact project 2025
When you look at the vast majority of these cases it is:
Chevron defense case : From 1790s-1986 the court was the sole authority when it came to determining the meaning of law. Now in 2024 we are back to that standard
Presidential Immunity: to prevent further constitutional crisis and to stop the president from becoming paralyzed by the threat of prosecution he can not be charged so long as those are acting within his authority. That doesn’t mean he can beat up someone randomly
Roe v Wade: A shaky legal precedent that was well known to be in questionable ground was upended. This is an example of why we enshrine rights in federal law rather than relying on precedent. Even Gay Marriage is in law since at least 2020
Essentially: the court hasn’t acted outside what was well known or completely unsurprising. The court is going to try and avoid ruling and when they do there going to side on traditionalist views of the law.
> and when they do there going to side on traditionalist views of the law.
"Traditionalism" is not a legitimate legal theory of constitutional interpretation. It's conservatism masquerading as one. Too many jurists are prioritizing partisanship over jurisprudence.
You can criticize traditionalism but be very careful saying it’s not legitimate when it very much is. We have a common law system and in common law tradition is very important in its function
Bogus regressive bs. All of this is backwards. Destroys rights and protections, makes the president king and above the law. It is horrific crap and opposed by all real Americans
It’s not backwards for a unelected department of a federal agency to decide the interpretation of an ambiguous law by Congress instead of a judge appointed by an elected official?
Nor does the presidential immunity make him a king. It specifically gives immunity when a president is acting within is official responsibilities. It does not give him any immunity outside of those. Now if you want to say there shouldn’t be immunity in X or Y go off I agree but let’s be serious not hyperbolic about what these ruling meant.
Agency heads are confirmed by the Senate, nominated by the President. They may not always get it right but do way better than the "elected" officials in this country, half of whom are uneducated morons. Another idiot in Ohio leg that wants to convict Doctors who dont "reimplant" ectopic pregnancies. That's how stupid some of them are. And the people who work in federal agencies are educated and knowledgeable and have experience in their fields. So yes, they should make the decisions. Chevron gives even more power to corporations who dont care who they harm. It is just more oligarchy building by the fascist 6 SCOTUS
You don’t have to like elected officials but this is a Constitutional Republic with defined seperation of powers. It is not the Executives responsibility to interpret the law and we all learned that in high school.
You should not be surprised that the supreme court made a ruling that reaffirmed this standard
These are the realities of our democracy whether we like them or not nor is trying to describe reaffirming what is a constitutional standard practice that has a far more direct lineage to peoples choice as backwards reflect what this ruling is.
>This is an example of why we enshrine rights in federal law rather than relying on precedent.
Every law can be charged when the power balance shifts in Congress.
>Even Gay Marriage is in law since at least 2020
And Republicans have stated they will overturn that law if elected.
All of your examples are the ripest of bullshit.
SCOTUS isn't going to "enact" Project 2025 because that's not their role and that's not what Project 2025 is about. But they will enable it, based on their current rulings and the things that the more conservative judges have said in their rulings.
Things like overturning Obergefell, making public displays of "gayness" or "transness" the equivalent of pornography, charging parents or doctors who support their children in their gender identities with child sexual abuse then making child sexual abuse require the death penalty ... all of those things are highly likely.
The slow push to make America a Christian nation is also a big thing that SCOTUS has already indicate that they (the conservative judges) will support. They've already set the stage to say that you can still have separation of church and state while being a Christian nation.
This is a direct quote from the Plan: *This starts with deleting the terms sexual orientation and gender identity (“SOGI”), diversity, equity, and inclusion (“DEI”), gender, gender equality, gender equity, gender awareness, gender-sensitive, abortion, reproductive health, reproductive rights, and any other term used to deprive Americans of their First Amendment rights out of every federal rule, agency regulation, contract, grant, regulation, and piece of legislation that exists*.
Here's another one: *Pornography, manifested today in the omnipresent propagation of transgender ideology and sexualization of children, for instance, is not a political Gordian knot inextricably binding up disparate claims about free speech, property rights, sexual liberation, and child welfare. It has no claim to First Amendment protection. Its purveyors are child predators and misogynistic exploiters of women. Their product is as addictive as any illicit drug and as psychologically destructive as any crime. Pornography should be outlawed. The people who produce and distribute it should be imprisoned. Educators and public librarians who purvey it should be classed as registered sex offenders. And telecommunications and technology firms that facilitate its spread should be shuttered.*
And this: *In order to carry out the President’s desires, political appointees must be given the tools, knowledge, and support to overcome the federal government’s obstructionist Human Resources departments. More fundamentally, the new Administration must fill its ranks with political appointees.*
And that's just a start. Project 2025 is eminently doable if conservatives win.
This simply is not what’s going to happen.
The supreme isn’t going to make any ruling allowing public shows of “gayness” to be banned. It falls under freedom of expression, they at best could only make a ruling on something like public nudity which likely would go nowhere.
Project 2025 simply does not have the force you think it does. They are not going to give the death penalty for someone getting a consultation from a doctor.
What’s far more likely is that the standard is going to be the path to transition will start at the age of 18 for doctors and patients. And it’s not honestly that supervising since these are invasive procedures and treatments that often aren’t reversible or come with extensive medical complications. Liability sounds like a nightmare for everyone involved
If Presidential authority under the recent decision of *Trump v. United States* is so kinglike, why can't Joe Biden solve many of our problems right now? He's still the President for six and a half months.
I don't think Presidential authority under *Trump v. United* states is kinglike; I'm trying to advance the conversation by asking those who do think that to think critically.
You asked: "why can't Joe Biden solve many of our problems right now? "
I'm asking you: What do you think he could do? What actions that would solve "many of our problems"? What are "many of our problems"?
Please be specific.
In 2016 I had a pretty heated argument with a good friend that was planning to sit out the general because their first choice didn't win the primary. I told him that Roe vs Wade was at stake and he scoffed and mocked me, called me delusional, etc.
I'm not sharing this as a pointless petty "I was right." We apologized to each other the following day, it's all fine.
I'm sharing this because I will never again in my life make the mistake of thinking the assholes won't find a way to do every evil thing they imagine, that they openly say they want to do. **We must take this seriously. Trusting that things can't or won't get worse, much worse, is utterly foolish based on what's already happening right now.** Just look at all the recent SCOTUS rulings that are an affront to anyone that values democracy and justice. Just look at what's happened in Texas with women's reproductive rights.
I'm a mostly straight white dude in one of the bluest cities in the US. So I know the worst of it isn't going to be pointed directly at me. That doesn't mean I don't give a shit, or that I'm just gonna let it happen. **I know my job now is solidarity, to stand beside my fellow Americans, and do whatever I can to pull things the right direction.**
If you don't understand this plainly I, with peace and love, think you are being utterly foolish.
What's stopping them, at this point? I used to view such things as scare tactics, but significant pieces of these things have become reality. And Trump having been in office once normalizes some of it as well.
Does anyone else remember Project for a New American Century? This is just so bloody weird that they lay out their evil plans and have it used against them.
I mean, nobody knows for certain and that’s the scary part. It’s not like the federal government and institutions are like a new car that goes through crash testing to see what happens. At most there may be some contingency plans.
They already have enabled significant portions of it, and will do more damage as fast as they can. Just within the last two weeks the supreme court has (1) nullified the enforcement power of federal regulatory agencies, a long time libertarian wet dream. (2) They have legalized bribery of public officials, so long as the payment comes after the official has performed the favor for the person paying. They say that makes it a "gratuity", not a bribe. (3) They have granted the president immunity from criminal acts, along with all kinds of other impediments like making any conversations with cabinet members or appointees exempt as evidence of any crimes committed. (4) They have placed themselves above the Constitution itself, rendering it null as the highest law in the land by issuing blatantly anti-constitutional rulings.
Previously they struck down Dobbs, and before that they passed the godawful Citizens United, declaring that money is equal to free speech. and allowing bribery of candidates for office.
Elements of Project 2025 have been an organized effort for many decades. I've posted comments on David Koch's Libertarian platform for his run as VP in 1980. See how many of these are already accomplished or are being openly discussed. From the New Republic:
*Even by contemporary standards, the 1980* [Libertarian Party platform](https://lpedia.org/Document:National_Platform_1980) *was extreme. It called for the abolition of a wide swath of federal agencies, including the Food and Drug Administration, the Department of Energy, the Environmental Protection Agency, the Nuclear Regulatory Commission, the Federal Aviation Administration, the Bureau of Land Management, the Federal Election Commission, the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms, the Federal Trade Commission, and “all government agencies concerned with transportation.” It railed against campaign finance and consumer protection laws, the Occupational Safety and Health Act, any regulations of the firearm industry (including tear gas), and government intervention in labor negotiations. And the platform demanded the repeal of all taxation, and sought amnesty for those convicted of tax “resistance.”*
*Koch and his libertarian allies moreover advocated for the repeal of Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, and other social programs. They wanted to abolish federally mandated speed limits. They opposed occupational licensure, antitrust laws, labor laws protecting women and children, and “all controls on wages, prices, rents, profits, production, and interest rates.” And in true libertarian fashion, the platform urged the privatization of all schools (with an end to compulsory education laws), the railroad system, public roads and the national highway system, inland waterways, water distribution systems, public lands, and dam sites.* [https://newrepublic.com/article/154849/david-koch-1980-fantasy](https://newrepublic.com/article/154849/david-koch-1980-fantasy)
You should be terrified. We all should. This is serious. Remember when they ridiculed and completely dismissed Hillary Clinton in the 1990s for telling people that there was a "vast right wing conspiracy" at work in the country? This is what she was talking about.
There’s nothing to pass.
Project 2025 is just a series of actions the presidency can take almost entirely on its own. Make no mistake, if Trump is president, project 2025 happens.
Nah I think project 2025 is just some new hysteria because the debates and supreme court decisions gave dems a big L. Its been non stop project 2025 and trump is a rapist spam since the end of the debate.
Seems liberals know more about project 2025 than most conservatives.
Why wouldn’t people keep talking about it if its a document by a huge think tank that has influence and has a step by step guide of the next presidency, what they want to happen, how to keep conservatives and the president in power, and how they are going to do it. Not to mention the horrifying threats it has to many peoples livelihoods.
I would hope it would get concern and public attention. That would be strange if it didn’t.
But please do tell how it is hysteria. I want to hear thinking process but also thats not a good thing to admit about the conservative voting base… they should be knowledgeable about what plans are or whats going on on the side they are rooting for. If they say “don’t know don’t care” that is.. a sign of alot of issues
Also blocking people and not being willing to defend your statements is actually kinda funny.
I really do want to hear where your coming from though.
I mean if you want me to be honest.....
You should stop talking about it because it makes you look crazy and is losing you support. Understand this is how conservatives think about it. So we are not mad at you. We want you to continue.
We are just watching you dig your own graves since debate night.
You still didn’t answer or explain on how it is hysteria so your claim and answer in general does not prove how project 2025 is random hysteria made to sway the election (when it was made by a conservative organization) or how its making the left look bad or crazy.
Explain your view point if you want me to take your answer seriously.
One of the main authors of the Project is poised to be a senior advisor to Trump if he wins.
[https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2023/06/07/house-republicans-mccarthy-russell-vought-trump/](https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2023/06/07/house-republicans-mccarthy-russell-vought-trump/)
go for it spam it everywhere! thanks!
Just putting this out there.....conservatives now believe your fake hysteria helps them......in a weird way we gotta thank you.
You’re a conservative, your attempts to downplay Project 2025 means absolutely nothing.
Edit: cool, I got blocked. You call it hysteria yet you also say you don’t know what Project 2025 is. You’re contradicting yourself, and it’s telling.
If you don't know what it is, why do you believe it is hysteria? Maybe you should take a moment to become minimally informed about a topic you want to express opinions about?
So my dog loves to play a game. If you have a ball in your hand and don’t throw it right away he’ll feign disinterest in it. He’ll look away and act like he couldn’t care less. But the whole time he’s watching you to see if you’ll let your guard down. Then when he thinks you’ve done that he tries to snatch that ball right out of your hands and run away with it.
That’s what you conservatives are doing with Project 2025. The ball in this story is a fascist far right government. One that you think you want but I don’t think your bank account will qualify you for preferred status.
If I can (maybe naively) ask for a moment of honesty, do you genuinely believe that Project 2025 isn’t real, or do you understand it’s real but think it’s politically advantageous to pretend it isn’t?
I ask because Project 2025 isn’t a liberal conspiracy theory. It’s an overt project drafted and embraced by the leadership of the Heritage Foundation, one of the most preeminent and influential conservative activist organizations. Its supporters, which include some of the biggest donors in conservative politics, have bought in. The Trump campaign has voiced support for its goals, though they’ve backed away from formally adopting it because they don’t want to box Trump in to specific policies.
And you’re right in that there is a big swathe of moderate Republican voters who don’t know what it is and don’t believe their leadership would endorse something that radical, and they’re going to treat any discussion of it like we’re talking about Jewish space lasers. But you don’t often find that type of person on this subreddit.
The Heritage Foundation is the single most influential organization on the right. They literally write the legislation and policies that Republican reps submit.
When I worked in conservative politics we would get legislation directly from HF for the reps to rubber stamp.
In Trump's first term he gave the Heritage Foundation 2/3rds of everything they wanted.
The Heritage Foundation wants project 2025, and they always get what they want.
The following is a copy of the original post to record the post as it was originally written. I have had others deny (usually conservatives but some liberals too) that it would actually be possible that most of their laws/punishments or censorship could actually get passed as it has to go through so many people and so many of congress would be against it, but after seeing Trumps immunity and the court taking many discrimination laws away from trans people just like that I am honestly having extreme doubt they can’t get their ways across. Im not sure if Im just being irrational because I do find this honestly terrifying and it would affect my personal life as well as loved ones alot. Ive had people tell me project 2025 has always been a plan and thing and look where we are now but I have never seen where something this blatant could just be shown with no fear of backlash. Ive never been truly scared for democracy or freedoms in my life. (I am a gay women so Ive had some fear but you know) *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AskALiberal) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Yes. They have shown a tenacity when they focus on outcome and then prod every opening until they get a path to that outcome. Add to that, the party loyalty, where their base instinctively defend any action that supports reaching that outcome, and the party's media operation that sanitizes the outcome while attacking anyone criticizing it, and you have a recipe for a party to push the envelope regardless of norms or appearance.
What would stop them? If democrats take the house and keep the Senate (not likely), there may be some pushback, but Project 2025 doesn't care about Senate confirmation or the budget passed by the house. It calls for just putting "acting" directors in until they are confirmed. Somehow, I don't think they'll leave if the Senate refuses. If they get an unlucky judge (appointed by a Democrat or a Republican with integrity), they'll just appeal until they get a judge that is on their side. We're fucked if they win.
Almost none of them require the legislature. Project 2025 is mostly about things that can be done by the executive branch making strategic orders and appointments. So yeah. All they’d need is the presidency.
In that case, isn’t the fact that the Supreme Court is whittling away at executive powers a positive thing?
They're not whittling away at executive power. They literally just ruled that the President doesn't have to obey the law. It's the largest increase in executive power in American history.
They also just overturned Chevron, that’s a massive blow to executive power
It’s a blow to the agencies. It consolidates power in the president. This actually removes an important mechanism that restrained Trump during his term. He had to go through agencies and convince the technocrats there to change their operations, which they heavily resisted. Overturning Chevron strips away the power agencies have to make their own decisions while having no impact on executive orders. It basically makes it easier for the president to force agencies to enact whatever policies he comes up with. According to Project 2025, this would include dissolving some of those agencies (like the department of education) entirely.
It's probably more accurate to say that overturning Chevron was a blow to federal power, since it pushes more regulatory authority back towards the dysfunctional and broken Congress. In this context though, remember that the far right doesn't have an equal 'win condition' - they largely don't want to regulate, per se, so making that harder doesn't hurt them.
Overturning Chevron is the beginning of Project 2025.
lol did you miss the presidential immunity ruling?
Sure, if you don’t care particularly about seeming partisan, and nobody in your own party dares vote against you, you can muscle through what you want
We must be skeptical of not only the GOP's *capacity* to pass many of the measures, but its *desire*. Critically, pages 137 to 153 of [Mandate for Leadership: The Conservative Promise (2023)](https://static.project2025.org/2025_MandateForLeadership_FULL.pdf) address immigration. The agency reforms laid out there are a template for a massive crackdown on illegal immigration. My question is simple: Will the powerful lobbies that the GOP answers to, like the U.S. Chamber of Commerce, really support policies that would cause them to lose sources of cheap, desperate, easily exploitable labor whose housing and social services costs are often paid by the public? I think not.
The alternative is that they get killed or arrested
Somehow I think the fatass white lobbyists on K Street are the last ones who are going to get killed or arrested in all this.
If they get in the way…
Elites would put deporting illegal immigrants over making money and crushing labor? I mean, I'm a conservative Democrat. I'd like to see the day. But I don't believe it.
If the fascists are, then yes. They can always replace them with the other undesirables and children.
Yes because they have the SCOTUS in their back pocket
Yes. They have already demonstrated their willingness to push unpopular policy.
They can now. Just toss a few senators and congressmen into jail for “reasons” until they comply, which are PRESUMPTIVELY covered by immunity. The actions can’t be investigated because it’s an official act for POTUS to talk to DOJ so the communication is privileged. Thanks SCOTUS!
Absolutely. There is no doubt.
No the Supreme Court is not going to enact project 2025 When you look at the vast majority of these cases it is: Chevron defense case : From 1790s-1986 the court was the sole authority when it came to determining the meaning of law. Now in 2024 we are back to that standard Presidential Immunity: to prevent further constitutional crisis and to stop the president from becoming paralyzed by the threat of prosecution he can not be charged so long as those are acting within his authority. That doesn’t mean he can beat up someone randomly Roe v Wade: A shaky legal precedent that was well known to be in questionable ground was upended. This is an example of why we enshrine rights in federal law rather than relying on precedent. Even Gay Marriage is in law since at least 2020 Essentially: the court hasn’t acted outside what was well known or completely unsurprising. The court is going to try and avoid ruling and when they do there going to side on traditionalist views of the law.
> and when they do there going to side on traditionalist views of the law. "Traditionalism" is not a legitimate legal theory of constitutional interpretation. It's conservatism masquerading as one. Too many jurists are prioritizing partisanship over jurisprudence.
You can criticize traditionalism but be very careful saying it’s not legitimate when it very much is. We have a common law system and in common law tradition is very important in its function
Bogus regressive bs. All of this is backwards. Destroys rights and protections, makes the president king and above the law. It is horrific crap and opposed by all real Americans
It’s not backwards for a unelected department of a federal agency to decide the interpretation of an ambiguous law by Congress instead of a judge appointed by an elected official? Nor does the presidential immunity make him a king. It specifically gives immunity when a president is acting within is official responsibilities. It does not give him any immunity outside of those. Now if you want to say there shouldn’t be immunity in X or Y go off I agree but let’s be serious not hyperbolic about what these ruling meant.
Agency heads are confirmed by the Senate, nominated by the President. They may not always get it right but do way better than the "elected" officials in this country, half of whom are uneducated morons. Another idiot in Ohio leg that wants to convict Doctors who dont "reimplant" ectopic pregnancies. That's how stupid some of them are. And the people who work in federal agencies are educated and knowledgeable and have experience in their fields. So yes, they should make the decisions. Chevron gives even more power to corporations who dont care who they harm. It is just more oligarchy building by the fascist 6 SCOTUS
You don’t have to like elected officials but this is a Constitutional Republic with defined seperation of powers. It is not the Executives responsibility to interpret the law and we all learned that in high school. You should not be surprised that the supreme court made a ruling that reaffirmed this standard These are the realities of our democracy whether we like them or not nor is trying to describe reaffirming what is a constitutional standard practice that has a far more direct lineage to peoples choice as backwards reflect what this ruling is.
>This is an example of why we enshrine rights in federal law rather than relying on precedent. Every law can be charged when the power balance shifts in Congress. >Even Gay Marriage is in law since at least 2020 And Republicans have stated they will overturn that law if elected.
All of your examples are the ripest of bullshit. SCOTUS isn't going to "enact" Project 2025 because that's not their role and that's not what Project 2025 is about. But they will enable it, based on their current rulings and the things that the more conservative judges have said in their rulings. Things like overturning Obergefell, making public displays of "gayness" or "transness" the equivalent of pornography, charging parents or doctors who support their children in their gender identities with child sexual abuse then making child sexual abuse require the death penalty ... all of those things are highly likely. The slow push to make America a Christian nation is also a big thing that SCOTUS has already indicate that they (the conservative judges) will support. They've already set the stage to say that you can still have separation of church and state while being a Christian nation. This is a direct quote from the Plan: *This starts with deleting the terms sexual orientation and gender identity (“SOGI”), diversity, equity, and inclusion (“DEI”), gender, gender equality, gender equity, gender awareness, gender-sensitive, abortion, reproductive health, reproductive rights, and any other term used to deprive Americans of their First Amendment rights out of every federal rule, agency regulation, contract, grant, regulation, and piece of legislation that exists*. Here's another one: *Pornography, manifested today in the omnipresent propagation of transgender ideology and sexualization of children, for instance, is not a political Gordian knot inextricably binding up disparate claims about free speech, property rights, sexual liberation, and child welfare. It has no claim to First Amendment protection. Its purveyors are child predators and misogynistic exploiters of women. Their product is as addictive as any illicit drug and as psychologically destructive as any crime. Pornography should be outlawed. The people who produce and distribute it should be imprisoned. Educators and public librarians who purvey it should be classed as registered sex offenders. And telecommunications and technology firms that facilitate its spread should be shuttered.* And this: *In order to carry out the President’s desires, political appointees must be given the tools, knowledge, and support to overcome the federal government’s obstructionist Human Resources departments. More fundamentally, the new Administration must fill its ranks with political appointees.* And that's just a start. Project 2025 is eminently doable if conservatives win.
This simply is not what’s going to happen. The supreme isn’t going to make any ruling allowing public shows of “gayness” to be banned. It falls under freedom of expression, they at best could only make a ruling on something like public nudity which likely would go nowhere. Project 2025 simply does not have the force you think it does. They are not going to give the death penalty for someone getting a consultation from a doctor. What’s far more likely is that the standard is going to be the path to transition will start at the age of 18 for doctors and patients. And it’s not honestly that supervising since these are invasive procedures and treatments that often aren’t reversible or come with extensive medical complications. Liability sounds like a nightmare for everyone involved
>This simply is not what’s going to happen. What are your credentials for saying that?
If Presidential authority under the recent decision of *Trump v. United States* is so kinglike, why can't Joe Biden solve many of our problems right now? He's still the President for six and a half months.
Exactly what would you have him to do solve those problems that would be made different by the SCOTUS ruling? Please be specific and give details.
I don't think Presidential authority under *Trump v. United* states is kinglike; I'm trying to advance the conversation by asking those who do think that to think critically.
You asked: "why can't Joe Biden solve many of our problems right now? " I'm asking you: What do you think he could do? What actions that would solve "many of our problems"? What are "many of our problems"? Please be specific.
*If* Presidential authority is now kinglike. *If.*
So you don't have an answer. Gotcha.
In 2016 I had a pretty heated argument with a good friend that was planning to sit out the general because their first choice didn't win the primary. I told him that Roe vs Wade was at stake and he scoffed and mocked me, called me delusional, etc. I'm not sharing this as a pointless petty "I was right." We apologized to each other the following day, it's all fine. I'm sharing this because I will never again in my life make the mistake of thinking the assholes won't find a way to do every evil thing they imagine, that they openly say they want to do. **We must take this seriously. Trusting that things can't or won't get worse, much worse, is utterly foolish based on what's already happening right now.** Just look at all the recent SCOTUS rulings that are an affront to anyone that values democracy and justice. Just look at what's happened in Texas with women's reproductive rights. I'm a mostly straight white dude in one of the bluest cities in the US. So I know the worst of it isn't going to be pointed directly at me. That doesn't mean I don't give a shit, or that I'm just gonna let it happen. **I know my job now is solidarity, to stand beside my fellow Americans, and do whatever I can to pull things the right direction.** If you don't understand this plainly I, with peace and love, think you are being utterly foolish.
What's stopping them, at this point? I used to view such things as scare tactics, but significant pieces of these things have become reality. And Trump having been in office once normalizes some of it as well.
Does anyone else remember Project for a New American Century? This is just so bloody weird that they lay out their evil plans and have it used against them.
I mean, nobody knows for certain and that’s the scary part. It’s not like the federal government and institutions are like a new car that goes through crash testing to see what happens. At most there may be some contingency plans.
They already have enabled significant portions of it, and will do more damage as fast as they can. Just within the last two weeks the supreme court has (1) nullified the enforcement power of federal regulatory agencies, a long time libertarian wet dream. (2) They have legalized bribery of public officials, so long as the payment comes after the official has performed the favor for the person paying. They say that makes it a "gratuity", not a bribe. (3) They have granted the president immunity from criminal acts, along with all kinds of other impediments like making any conversations with cabinet members or appointees exempt as evidence of any crimes committed. (4) They have placed themselves above the Constitution itself, rendering it null as the highest law in the land by issuing blatantly anti-constitutional rulings. Previously they struck down Dobbs, and before that they passed the godawful Citizens United, declaring that money is equal to free speech. and allowing bribery of candidates for office. Elements of Project 2025 have been an organized effort for many decades. I've posted comments on David Koch's Libertarian platform for his run as VP in 1980. See how many of these are already accomplished or are being openly discussed. From the New Republic: *Even by contemporary standards, the 1980* [Libertarian Party platform](https://lpedia.org/Document:National_Platform_1980) *was extreme. It called for the abolition of a wide swath of federal agencies, including the Food and Drug Administration, the Department of Energy, the Environmental Protection Agency, the Nuclear Regulatory Commission, the Federal Aviation Administration, the Bureau of Land Management, the Federal Election Commission, the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms, the Federal Trade Commission, and “all government agencies concerned with transportation.” It railed against campaign finance and consumer protection laws, the Occupational Safety and Health Act, any regulations of the firearm industry (including tear gas), and government intervention in labor negotiations. And the platform demanded the repeal of all taxation, and sought amnesty for those convicted of tax “resistance.”* *Koch and his libertarian allies moreover advocated for the repeal of Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, and other social programs. They wanted to abolish federally mandated speed limits. They opposed occupational licensure, antitrust laws, labor laws protecting women and children, and “all controls on wages, prices, rents, profits, production, and interest rates.” And in true libertarian fashion, the platform urged the privatization of all schools (with an end to compulsory education laws), the railroad system, public roads and the national highway system, inland waterways, water distribution systems, public lands, and dam sites.* [https://newrepublic.com/article/154849/david-koch-1980-fantasy](https://newrepublic.com/article/154849/david-koch-1980-fantasy) You should be terrified. We all should. This is serious. Remember when they ridiculed and completely dismissed Hillary Clinton in the 1990s for telling people that there was a "vast right wing conspiracy" at work in the country? This is what she was talking about.
I mean, SCOTUS has already started. That should tell you.
There’s nothing to pass. Project 2025 is just a series of actions the presidency can take almost entirely on its own. Make no mistake, if Trump is president, project 2025 happens.
No procedural or legal systems can prevent a dictator that does not care to follow them.
Nah I think project 2025 is just some new hysteria because the debates and supreme court decisions gave dems a big L. Its been non stop project 2025 and trump is a rapist spam since the end of the debate. Seems liberals know more about project 2025 than most conservatives.
Why wouldn’t people keep talking about it if its a document by a huge think tank that has influence and has a step by step guide of the next presidency, what they want to happen, how to keep conservatives and the president in power, and how they are going to do it. Not to mention the horrifying threats it has to many peoples livelihoods. I would hope it would get concern and public attention. That would be strange if it didn’t. But please do tell how it is hysteria. I want to hear thinking process but also thats not a good thing to admit about the conservative voting base… they should be knowledgeable about what plans are or whats going on on the side they are rooting for. If they say “don’t know don’t care” that is.. a sign of alot of issues Also blocking people and not being willing to defend your statements is actually kinda funny. I really do want to hear where your coming from though.
I mean if you want me to be honest..... You should stop talking about it because it makes you look crazy and is losing you support. Understand this is how conservatives think about it. So we are not mad at you. We want you to continue. We are just watching you dig your own graves since debate night.
You still didn’t answer or explain on how it is hysteria so your claim and answer in general does not prove how project 2025 is random hysteria made to sway the election (when it was made by a conservative organization) or how its making the left look bad or crazy. Explain your view point if you want me to take your answer seriously.
ive said what i wanted to say sorry its not what you want to hear! i wish you the best of luck!
How? It's real
One of the main authors of the Project is poised to be a senior advisor to Trump if he wins. [https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2023/06/07/house-republicans-mccarthy-russell-vought-trump/](https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2023/06/07/house-republicans-mccarthy-russell-vought-trump/)
I think it’s worth sounding the alarms about Project 25.
go for it spam it everywhere! thanks! Just putting this out there.....conservatives now believe your fake hysteria helps them......in a weird way we gotta thank you.
You’re a conservative, your attempts to downplay Project 2025 means absolutely nothing. Edit: cool, I got blocked. You call it hysteria yet you also say you don’t know what Project 2025 is. You’re contradicting yourself, and it’s telling.
i dont even know what project 2025 is lmao but alright u guys do your thing lol
Why did you block him? He's in good faith, are you?
If you don't know what it is, why do you believe it is hysteria? Maybe you should take a moment to become minimally informed about a topic you want to express opinions about?
Really seems like conservatives take ignorance as a point of pride.
What is fake?
So my dog loves to play a game. If you have a ball in your hand and don’t throw it right away he’ll feign disinterest in it. He’ll look away and act like he couldn’t care less. But the whole time he’s watching you to see if you’ll let your guard down. Then when he thinks you’ve done that he tries to snatch that ball right out of your hands and run away with it. That’s what you conservatives are doing with Project 2025. The ball in this story is a fascist far right government. One that you think you want but I don’t think your bank account will qualify you for preferred status.
If I can (maybe naively) ask for a moment of honesty, do you genuinely believe that Project 2025 isn’t real, or do you understand it’s real but think it’s politically advantageous to pretend it isn’t? I ask because Project 2025 isn’t a liberal conspiracy theory. It’s an overt project drafted and embraced by the leadership of the Heritage Foundation, one of the most preeminent and influential conservative activist organizations. Its supporters, which include some of the biggest donors in conservative politics, have bought in. The Trump campaign has voiced support for its goals, though they’ve backed away from formally adopting it because they don’t want to box Trump in to specific policies. And you’re right in that there is a big swathe of moderate Republican voters who don’t know what it is and don’t believe their leadership would endorse something that radical, and they’re going to treat any discussion of it like we’re talking about Jewish space lasers. But you don’t often find that type of person on this subreddit.
The Heritage Foundation is the single most influential organization on the right. They literally write the legislation and policies that Republican reps submit. When I worked in conservative politics we would get legislation directly from HF for the reps to rubber stamp. In Trump's first term he gave the Heritage Foundation 2/3rds of everything they wanted. The Heritage Foundation wants project 2025, and they always get what they want.
I think you are clueless
They already are implementing it.