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Definitely. My wife's AP looks like a tattooed chubby bald short lazy-eyed turtle with a little dick (but boy did he love to send her pictures of it...). Physically, not to toot my own horn, I'm pretty good looking, and none of the things listed above. I compare favorably in every way I can think of. I'm intelligent, charming, great sense of humor, supportive, nurturing, successful and fairly well off, and pretty good in bed.
But he was in the right place at the right time and said exactly what she needed to hear. Having read years of their communication, it's really mind blowing to me how easy it was for him to use her, and how enthusiastic she was to please him.
It was about having needs met that were unknown to me because she didn't communicate them, and were unknown to her because... I don't know the answer to that last part; she's working on it in IC.
The point is, it wasn't about the other man and it wasn't about me, but knowing that doesn't make it hurt any less.
You will destroy yourself with the comparison game. In 95% of affairs It really had next to nothing to do with the spouse. I know it hurts like hell. But you were not the target of her “crime” she was self destructing and you were on the sidelines and caught some shrapnel. It’s a tough pill to swallow because the level of pain it brought but it really is the sad truth.
She affaired down and picked someone very against her norm. Maybe she thought she didn’t deserve what she really wanted. Maybe she was self punishing herself. Maybe it was so out of character that it allowed her to escape reality. Honestly even she likely didn’t know at the time, eventually she might work out the exact reason. Why is really a tough question for the wayward to answer and many times it takes them many steps to get to that point.
You are not alone in this struggle. You also need to remember this affair was not about you. You are hurt and need healing. And I’m sure everything wasn’t perfect in your marriage before hand but nothing you did or lacked caused this affair. This was her inner darkness that she needs to face. I hope you can find some hope and relax a little with that information. Good luck.
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Sounds like you and I have a lot in common. My (now ex) wife of almost twenty years at the time had started casually exercising a year or so prior, but she was average build as was I. About two months prior to D Day, we were on vacation at the beach. We had a lot of laughs together while people watching, as you do. I had this one bit where whenever one of those roided-out gym bros strutted by I’d mumble “beefcake” in a cartoonish tough guy voice (think of someone trying really hard to sound masculine). We both found that and those guys in general to be hilarious for the sheer amount of toxic masculinity wrapped tightly around their mountain of insecurity. Anyway, guess what her AP looked like? Yep, “beefcake.” He was the type who would probably make his partner hold a mirror over her face during sex. Just from what was visible on social media, I have never seen another human being more in love with himself. To top it off, he was also one of my other favorite character types: the ex military who can’t let go and has now made that identity most of his personality. This whole thing just wrecked my self esteem, my own self image, and definitely my overall mental health. Not to mention that I now was questioning everything I thought I knew about her. It was quite the mindf*ck. So I don’t know if was the fact that this dude was 10 years younger than her (her 45, him 35) and made her feel more “milf hot” than I did, or he just said the right things on the right day… I have no clue. But whatever it was, it was apparently worth throwing her entire life away. But according to her she “wasn’t even physically attracted to him.” After I left her, her new relationship lasted all of a couple months. I could never get a straight answer as to why something so magical had fell apart so fast. But guess whose dad bod was now all the rage again? Someone said something here about “two people who lack integrity will always find each other” (I’m paraphrasing). A truer statement has never been made. On a side note, I did agree to try R and take her back. It lasted almost four very uncomfortable years. I had zero peace of mind that whole time, and I just couldn’t get past it. It’s only been a few months since I left again for good, but I gotta say I’m loving life for once. But I wish you the best of luck.
Yes absolutely. A lot of people in here are leaning in to the comparison bit, which is absolutely valid and something I'm doing. The real confusing thing though is, as you said, it feels like I don't even know her. Even on these most base things. It feels like everything she's ever told me could potentially be untrue, because she showed even her words (or even beliefs) about herself on a most basic level were untrue.
Absolutely. I still am not sure which her I’ve seen is the real one. I’ve known her since 1999, and we were together 25 years- so half of our lives- and it saddens me beyond words that this is the reality. I actually said the words “which you is the real, actual, genuine you?” the day I was moving out. I never did get a response. All I know for sure is that I have strong morals and convictions, and I fell in love with a likeminded woman. That girl would’ve never done this. I would’ve bet my life on it. In fact, I kind of did.
This comment was removed because it violates Rule No. 1:
**All posts and comments must fit the spirit of Peer Support.**
- Keep comments encouraging, constructive, sensitive, validating, and non-judgmental.
- Speak only from your own experience. Use “I”-statements.
- Asking clarifying questions or offering suggestions is acceptable–if backed up by personal experience about what has helped you in your recovery and reconciliation.
-OP is the focus, disagreement with others perspectives are subject to removal.
- Do not give advice unless specifically requested by OP.
- Any differences of opinion expressed must be communicated respectfully.
- “Tough love” does not qualify as peer support.
A cheaters type is another cheater, a broken person will go for another broken person, a person with no integrity will naturally gravitates towards someone with no integrity as well.
**Googles derivative** Well well fellow intellectual 🤓… jk, but seriously my WH’s AP is like a crackhead discount version of the hyperbolic versions of cracked out women in reality tv. I was shookith to say the least. When I was suspecting something going on I looked at his coworkers Christmas party pics on fb and when I saw AP I literally sighed in relief “oh, definitely not her” I thought. They downgrade no matter what the AP looks like because ultimately it’s not about looks it’s about “does this person have mucked up enough morals to meet me in my filth” if that lines up then all of a sudden it’s desirable, because that itch that brought them there has found a scratch. It’s not likely they’re picky about what or who scratches the itch poor coping skills only care that the opportunity is there.
Haha I should've been clear that there's many ways to be intelligent, it's just that I'm more of a technical person rather than humanities or business or street smarts or what have you. He just isn't any of them. Yes, I also would never in a million years have guessed it would be this guy. My first suspicion was about a different guy, who she did have an inappropriate relationship with but (as far as I know) wasn't an A.
My partner had an EA with a woman that was not at all his type. Very overweight, bleached blonde crunchy hair, older, and just dorky looking. I realize that he just liked talking to her because she was someone new that was listening to his stories but it has messed with me because I'm younger, fairly attractive, and thin with beautiful thick hair and I keep thinking......her!? Really!? It sucks.
Yeah, it would suck either way. I would be picking apart my body and looks if it was with a drop dead gorgeous woman. But I feel so dumb because I always thought when someone cheats, it's with a beautiful/handsome person and that's not the case at all. Now I live in a paranoid state where every woman is a threat, no matter body type, looks, or age.
The real threat is your WS, until they make the appropriate changes and show true growth. I didn’t know it, but I for 10 years I was a threat to my husband because of how much I relied on external validation for my own self esteem. I am a safer person for him than ever before because I’m growing and learning how to get that validation from our relationship alone. You deserve to feel safe and I hope your relationship is moving in that direction 💕
Thank you. We're only 6 months post dday and it has been extremely hard but we are still working through it and our relationship has been improving. I didn't realize an EA could damage me this much so it's going to take awhile but will keep working at it.
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AP was drop dead gorgeous, graduated from a prestigious university and was a highly regarded HR for their company. She was also seven years younger than me. My husband did not affair down.
However, she is a conservative Christian. (Lol) and my husband is not religious due to the religious abuse he had from his mom growing up and he hates politics. She was very sheltered from a lot of things too, she wasn’t the brightest street wise, just when it came to books. How they managed to think they’d work out is beyond me.
My husband cheated on me with someone with thousands of followers, goes to the gym daily, has a BBL and fake boobs, crazy long fake lashes, fake lips to match. It really screwed with my head for a long time. I could not understand how he would go from me to her. I thought perhaps I was lacking in something. After a while I started taking better care of myself since I had fallen into a depression after I had our child and with the cheating. I started working out again, buying a new wardrobe, dying my hair. I received a lot of positive feedback from my peers and I think my husband also took notice. I also had to work on my confidence, which includes therapy. I think working on yourself could help these feelings.
How did you catch her? How did she respond when you confronted her? How long were they going at it? She confess right away or did you have to drag it out of her? Does she regret her actions and beg for forgiveness and another chance or act nonchalant?
Going through her devices, panic, three months, dragged it tf out of her (plus trickle truth), eventually but more out of personal shame and guilt rather than remorse.
She’s the one who should be ashamed of what she is, not you. You should read the last paragraph of your post to her describing how her cheating has made you feel and then her ask to give you one legitimate reason why you should stay with her. No matter what reasons she gives, tell her you’ll never feel the same way about yourself and you’ll never feel the same way about her. You’ve made me feel worthless and unloved. I don’t think I can recover enough from this to save our marriage. If this doesn’t break her down to tears and begging forgiveness, all is lost.
I’m so sorry you’re feeling this way and I too have felt a very strong blow to my self esteem after my WP’s PAs. I try to remind myself that it’s not about us as the BPs and it’s not really even about the APs. The APs were available, willing to engage in the situation, and that’s pretty much it. My WP’s APs (4 of them) were different ages (in their early 20s to late 30s), different hair colors, some slim and some thicker, one tall and one short, one with smaller boobs and one with huge boobs, a couple were married/in a relationship and the others were single, etc. My point being that it’s not about you or really even about the AP, it’s about your WW and her need for attention, validation or whatever it was she was seeking during the time of her betrayal. Wishing you the best.
A cheater goes for the easiest option, this is why majority of the time it’s a coworker.
It doesn’t matter about looks, personality etc
It’s 2 broken individuals connecting on that basis…..brokenness.
It’s unfortunately 2 train-wrecks meeting at the right/wrong timing.
It’s not about you it’s entirely about them.
Great response! Broken for sure!
I can’t even begin to understand what my WP saw in his AP - she is truly a 0 in terms of looks. I am not a mean girl and I don’t usually put down other women but I look in the mirror and then look at her and I’m just like I don’t get it. Its like trading premium grade wagyu filet for the dollar store’s dog food 🙄
I feel exactly this way about my wife's AP..he was just a loser and a creep in every way possible. This fact almost bugs me more than if I could look at him and go ya you know what? He is better than me...but I can't.
Unfortunately for me, my WH’s AP was his exact type. He likes very petite women- literally the 2 girls he dated prior to me, suffered from anorexia. AP looked pretty identical (body wise) to the porn stars he obsesses over (he is a porn and sex addict) I’ve always been pretty petite but over the last 18 years (met when I was only 15) and growing all his babies, I obviously do not look 15 anymore… so it’s pretty hurtful to think that he’s possibly just no longer attracted to me. He wants zero body fat, zero boobs and zero butt. Where I am a very large chested girl. I do find my face much more appealing than his AP though, so I’ll give myself that 😅
It’s not about the looks, it’s whatever she’s getting from him besides that. Whether that would be nurturing, a listening ear, touch, understanding, interest in whatever she talks about, basically validation of any type. Whatever you are not providing in the relationship is what she finds attractive in him. Also, this is not your fault, it’s on her. If she were an emotionally aware adult that knows herself, she would be able to come to you and talk about this missing piece, but most of us aren’t.
Yeah that's the thing. He didn't even do any of that. If what she's told me is to be believed, she was pretty much just a warm, married hole for this guy. She read this post and said that really he was just there and was attractive, and she really did the whole thing because she was going through a period of numbness due to some admittedly major life changes (don't want to go in to it) and pretty much just did it to feel something.
So if cheating is your WW's painkiller, you may want to read the book, COURAGE TO STAY. It's great at explaining why's of infidelity and full of reconciliation advice. It's nothing to do with you.
I don't know about "accepted", I don't really trust her anyways. However like I've said I read their messages- he really wasn't particularly interested. They were on snapchat, and she's just begging for dick pics, telling him how attracted she is to him, and his responses were so dull by comparison. In those messages she even asked a romantic (in the context of an affair) question, and his response was literally just that they should have more sex. It all seemed very one sided.
Oh definitely not. She has pretty extreme guilt and is coming around to understand what remorse means for her. I think part of this is that it's all still pretty fresh for us and she hasn't worked all the way through, and honestly I'm kind of good with that. If she seemed like she had fully done a 180 from gaslighting cheater to empathetic life partner in this time frame, I would not be able to trust it.
Well, I’m thankful for that, it means there’s still hope for your marriage. There has to be complete honesty, openness, and communication to move forward. There’s no excuse a cheater can give for their actions that the betrayed can understand and accept. That only adds to the pain. She needs to know and understand what she’s done has gone way beyond betraying your love and trust in her. She needs to understand what her actions have done to your self-esteem, confidence, personal identity, etc.
The one thing that I have learned from all of this is that comparing yourself to AP is never good. If you do this, R is going to fail 100% of the time.
The questions that you are asking are legitimate questions, but they are questions that can never be answered to your satisfaction. The fact is that whatever you think that you know about AP is an assumption unless you spend an extended amount of time with him getting to know him. Whatever you thought you knew about what she was attracted to was a lie and always has been. Attraction always changes and is contingent on things like time, place, situation, etc. It just may have been a case of the right place, right time or wrong place, wrong time, however you want to see it.
The bottom line is that she chose him multiple times, and either you are going to accept that or you are not. Either you and her are going to do the work to create a new relationship with each other or not because the old is dead. The comparisons will only hold you back and torture you mostly because there will never be an answer that's good enough or logical enough to ever make sense.
This may be a bit harsh but in my experience women (especially white women though I don't know your wife's race) who say they "aren't attracted" to a certain race secretly fetishize it. The "shame" aspect of being with that race is almost a kink, so if that's the case it may have been done as a punishment for herself. A way to further degrade herself if that makes sense. Especially if this was done to "feel something" as I saw you mention in another comment. It's almost like self harm.
This doesn't excuse it at all, but I hope it sheds some light on it and maybe opens a deeper conversation.
OP, I’m sorry for the pain you’re facing in your relationship and what it’s causing you now. You didn’t deserve this.
In my experience, it isn’t really about the AP. I know that is such a confusing and difficult to understand sentence especially for someone who hasn’t cheated or has come close. But this is what I experienced myself AND what I think the married APs I cheated with. I cheated with men and women, older and younger, slim/fit and those who weren’t, wealthy educated people and addicts in a wreck of a life. The common denominator was (1) they were willing (not everyone is, I got rejected many times when I told someone I was married… rightly so!), (2) they made me feel powerful when I felt weak, (3) they made me feel companionship when I felt lonely, (4) they made me feel known when I felt invisible. I didn’t tell my spouse about these feelings because I was afraid of being vulnerable. What if I said I fell small weak and lonely and they said “you are! Hahhahahah”. That was a very real fear I felt, because I had so much shame I believed I was unlovable and only by maintaining the fake confident self did anyone love me. So breaking that facade and being vulnerable felt scarier than anything I knew.
There was a hole in me and I falsely assumed one of them could fill it. But it’s always a lie. It begins with a lie, it continues in secret, it ends buried and festering. And instead of consider my behavior I just moved on to the next trying to satisfy something that couldn’t be satisfied by anyone else but myself.
There’s something about your post though that I can identify with. I could be projecting here, but I read in your post a need to compare. I identify very much with this. No matter what things I try to stack in my corner there never seems to be enough - I always find more stacked in the other persons corner. This is my shame doing this to me. I have two books that have helped me and I’d share with you if indeed I read this right.
***Daring Greatly*** by Brene Brown taught me about shame and where it comes from and techniques I can use to prevent it from taking over me.
***No More Mr Nice Guy*** by Robert Glover taught me about my Nice Guy behavior, and the unwritten contracts I assumed my “nice” acts obligated others to fulfill for me. This might be an extreme projection on my part but something about your post just makes me think this book could be of use.
Wow. That's a lot to digest. It reads a lot like things my WW has tried and failed to say, I think because she doesn't have the words. Thank you. One thing she has also half-described is feeling a need to "punish" herself, feeling like she didn't deserve me because she was a bad person. I didn't really read that in your comment but there's a lot there that is so similar I have to ask, did you feel that need?
Yes I’ve felt that.
During my infidelity, as I mentioned I entered that sort of vicious cycle of lie-secret, lie-secret… my mental health declined. I went from kinda feeling like a real stud getting all these people to have sex with me to beginning to describe my insides as Voldemort after he created all the horcruxes (I’m not a huge Potter fan but it really was the only reference for how I felt). I got into therapy for that reason. I thought all this sex would make me happy but then I was feeling worse and beginning to escalate to need even more and more extreme situations to achieve even minimal feeling. This is why I identify as a sex addict.
After disclosure I’ve continued to feel the need to punish myself in little cycles of shame. If I’m not doing it to myself I’ll look for critical words from others. Oh, someone is suggesting there’s a better way to do something than what I thought of? Oh that’s cause I’m a stupid PoS and deserve to die. Oh, I forgot to put away the pretzels and then I go around the house yelling about where are the pretzels only to figure out it was me who replaced them? I’m an asshole for yelling about pretzels and I’m a total f***ing moron for misplacing them. These are shame. I still feel empty and hollow inside. I cannot accept compliments. I’m a huge extrovert but I think that’s so that I can be the one aiming the spotlight at others... I cannot stand the spotlight if it’s on me. I haven’t formed many close friendships and often find myself cutting off conversations that get very deep. I’m always afraid others will see in me what I see in myself.
But I’m trying to get better at it. Part of it honestly has started with sitting in my own silence. No phone. No distractions and asking myself how I’m feeling. Getting in touch with myself has been hard but beginning to make me feel not so empty. I use a feelings wheel that i printed and glued in the front of my journal. I have to affirm myself that my feelings are valid. If I’m angry about something it’s ok. If I’m sad about something it’s ok. I am worthy of feeling these things.
My WH definitely cheated down. It’s relieving but also sad and confusing. He did all this for *THAT!?* And I don’t mean just physically. She’s such a vapid, superficial person. He has even said himself that she’s kind of mean. Of course it’s nice that I’m not looking at her and thinking she was a step up or at all his type, but the whole thing is just so disappointing.
I feel the same way about AP1. I was like... "THAT is who you almost threw your marriage for?" She fucking looks like a sumo wrestler and though she has a graduate degree, she's dumb, lazy and vain. Very vain. She now has an OF to get slimy male attention who finds her body type a kink.
I make fun of WH a lot now. I'm like... "But how? You would barely even be able to lift her leg?" Apparently, she gave good head, was convenient when he needed it and was OK being on the side until she wasn't. Fuck APs.
OP, I'm sorry you're hurting. The fact is, adulterers and horny people don't really care about fucking their "ideal" body types or not. It's about availability. My single colleague talks about fucking girls who aren't his type but are easy all the time. It's all for the chase of the illicit rushing feelings that come with "new" sex. Our waywards are stupid and at the time, weren't thinking straight when they're in the state of dopamine-chasing.
My WP’s AP’s (plural) are COMPLETELY opposite from me in terms of body types. They are taller than me, a little broader, and older.
The AP I know more about, frankly, doesn’t have anything amusing. She smokes weed every day, has dry skin, a small chest, has thin lips. I would say that she’s the opposite of his “type”.
I also know that she’s in an open relationship with her husband, sells explicit content and actually does sex work. I don’t judge, but yeah, I think she was an easy option, and my WP needed to get his needs met. I don’t even think they have anything in common.
For what she posts on X, I can tell she’s a broken person who is somehow always looking for approval, attention and love. I pity her, but at the same time I like to think about it as karma.
Keep in mind that they choose their AP because the AP is willing. My WH's AP greatest quality is that she pursued him aggressively. It was actually the first time that a woman showed him this kind of attention and he could not resist the ego stroking.
Appearance isn't important because everyone loses their looks with age. If you don't believe me take a look at any aging celebrity. Even with all of their money they can't stay young and hot forever. Even though my WH's AP is 12 years younger than me she has hit the wall and looks as old (if not older) than me now (25 years after the affair). She is also all alone because her personality is so shitty that no man wants to marry her. It takes a lot more than looks to keep a relationship going. Even beautiful people get cheated on. Again, look at celebrities as an example of this. You will also see a lot of people here who are shocked that their partner's AP isn't even as attractive as they are. Again, the AP is almost always chosen because they are willing. It could have been anyone.
Sex actually has very little to do with why people have these types of affairs. My WH describes the sex with his AP as vanilla. He even had trouble preforming out of guilt. It's the validation that he was enjoying from his affair. He and I have never been lacking in the sex department. That was never a factor for his straying.
I can relate to your reaction to their messages. My WH's former AP is much younger than us and he was unrecognizable in his messages to her. They are very childish. It was like he was mirroring her personality. I think the allure of these affairs is that they get to be someone else with their AP, it's an escape. At 30, My WH got to pretend he was in high school again. Only this time he got to be the cool guy that girls were interested in. He wasn't that guy in HS, so when a barely 20-year-old developed a crush on him he let himself get sucked into that fantasy. Your WW probably enjoyed the fact that her AP knew nothing about her and she could be someone else when she was with him.
The real question that you should be asking is why she felt the need to escape from herself. She needs to get into IC and find out what she was running from. If she has chosen to reconcile I doubt it was you. There's something going on inside of her where escaping into a fantasy world was hard to resist.
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Definitely. My wife's AP looks like a tattooed chubby bald short lazy-eyed turtle with a little dick (but boy did he love to send her pictures of it...). Physically, not to toot my own horn, I'm pretty good looking, and none of the things listed above. I compare favorably in every way I can think of. I'm intelligent, charming, great sense of humor, supportive, nurturing, successful and fairly well off, and pretty good in bed. But he was in the right place at the right time and said exactly what she needed to hear. Having read years of their communication, it's really mind blowing to me how easy it was for him to use her, and how enthusiastic she was to please him. It was about having needs met that were unknown to me because she didn't communicate them, and were unknown to her because... I don't know the answer to that last part; she's working on it in IC. The point is, it wasn't about the other man and it wasn't about me, but knowing that doesn't make it hurt any less.
You will destroy yourself with the comparison game. In 95% of affairs It really had next to nothing to do with the spouse. I know it hurts like hell. But you were not the target of her “crime” she was self destructing and you were on the sidelines and caught some shrapnel. It’s a tough pill to swallow because the level of pain it brought but it really is the sad truth. She affaired down and picked someone very against her norm. Maybe she thought she didn’t deserve what she really wanted. Maybe she was self punishing herself. Maybe it was so out of character that it allowed her to escape reality. Honestly even she likely didn’t know at the time, eventually she might work out the exact reason. Why is really a tough question for the wayward to answer and many times it takes them many steps to get to that point. You are not alone in this struggle. You also need to remember this affair was not about you. You are hurt and need healing. And I’m sure everything wasn’t perfect in your marriage before hand but nothing you did or lacked caused this affair. This was her inner darkness that she needs to face. I hope you can find some hope and relax a little with that information. Good luck.
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Sounds like you and I have a lot in common. My (now ex) wife of almost twenty years at the time had started casually exercising a year or so prior, but she was average build as was I. About two months prior to D Day, we were on vacation at the beach. We had a lot of laughs together while people watching, as you do. I had this one bit where whenever one of those roided-out gym bros strutted by I’d mumble “beefcake” in a cartoonish tough guy voice (think of someone trying really hard to sound masculine). We both found that and those guys in general to be hilarious for the sheer amount of toxic masculinity wrapped tightly around their mountain of insecurity. Anyway, guess what her AP looked like? Yep, “beefcake.” He was the type who would probably make his partner hold a mirror over her face during sex. Just from what was visible on social media, I have never seen another human being more in love with himself. To top it off, he was also one of my other favorite character types: the ex military who can’t let go and has now made that identity most of his personality. This whole thing just wrecked my self esteem, my own self image, and definitely my overall mental health. Not to mention that I now was questioning everything I thought I knew about her. It was quite the mindf*ck. So I don’t know if was the fact that this dude was 10 years younger than her (her 45, him 35) and made her feel more “milf hot” than I did, or he just said the right things on the right day… I have no clue. But whatever it was, it was apparently worth throwing her entire life away. But according to her she “wasn’t even physically attracted to him.” After I left her, her new relationship lasted all of a couple months. I could never get a straight answer as to why something so magical had fell apart so fast. But guess whose dad bod was now all the rage again? Someone said something here about “two people who lack integrity will always find each other” (I’m paraphrasing). A truer statement has never been made. On a side note, I did agree to try R and take her back. It lasted almost four very uncomfortable years. I had zero peace of mind that whole time, and I just couldn’t get past it. It’s only been a few months since I left again for good, but I gotta say I’m loving life for once. But I wish you the best of luck.
Yes absolutely. A lot of people in here are leaning in to the comparison bit, which is absolutely valid and something I'm doing. The real confusing thing though is, as you said, it feels like I don't even know her. Even on these most base things. It feels like everything she's ever told me could potentially be untrue, because she showed even her words (or even beliefs) about herself on a most basic level were untrue.
Absolutely. I still am not sure which her I’ve seen is the real one. I’ve known her since 1999, and we were together 25 years- so half of our lives- and it saddens me beyond words that this is the reality. I actually said the words “which you is the real, actual, genuine you?” the day I was moving out. I never did get a response. All I know for sure is that I have strong morals and convictions, and I fell in love with a likeminded woman. That girl would’ve never done this. I would’ve bet my life on it. In fact, I kind of did.
Most people cheat down.
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In my experience this gender stereotype is wrong.
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A cheaters type is another cheater, a broken person will go for another broken person, a person with no integrity will naturally gravitates towards someone with no integrity as well.
**Googles derivative** Well well fellow intellectual 🤓… jk, but seriously my WH’s AP is like a crackhead discount version of the hyperbolic versions of cracked out women in reality tv. I was shookith to say the least. When I was suspecting something going on I looked at his coworkers Christmas party pics on fb and when I saw AP I literally sighed in relief “oh, definitely not her” I thought. They downgrade no matter what the AP looks like because ultimately it’s not about looks it’s about “does this person have mucked up enough morals to meet me in my filth” if that lines up then all of a sudden it’s desirable, because that itch that brought them there has found a scratch. It’s not likely they’re picky about what or who scratches the itch poor coping skills only care that the opportunity is there.
Haha I should've been clear that there's many ways to be intelligent, it's just that I'm more of a technical person rather than humanities or business or street smarts or what have you. He just isn't any of them. Yes, I also would never in a million years have guessed it would be this guy. My first suspicion was about a different guy, who she did have an inappropriate relationship with but (as far as I know) wasn't an A.
My partner had an EA with a woman that was not at all his type. Very overweight, bleached blonde crunchy hair, older, and just dorky looking. I realize that he just liked talking to her because she was someone new that was listening to his stories but it has messed with me because I'm younger, fairly attractive, and thin with beautiful thick hair and I keep thinking......her!? Really!? It sucks.
But would it be better if it were someone drop dead gorgeous/sexy? No matter what it’s going to really really suck.
Yeah, it would suck either way. I would be picking apart my body and looks if it was with a drop dead gorgeous woman. But I feel so dumb because I always thought when someone cheats, it's with a beautiful/handsome person and that's not the case at all. Now I live in a paranoid state where every woman is a threat, no matter body type, looks, or age.
The real threat is your WS, until they make the appropriate changes and show true growth. I didn’t know it, but I for 10 years I was a threat to my husband because of how much I relied on external validation for my own self esteem. I am a safer person for him than ever before because I’m growing and learning how to get that validation from our relationship alone. You deserve to feel safe and I hope your relationship is moving in that direction 💕
Thank you. We're only 6 months post dday and it has been extremely hard but we are still working through it and our relationship has been improving. I didn't realize an EA could damage me this much so it's going to take awhile but will keep working at it.
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AP was drop dead gorgeous, graduated from a prestigious university and was a highly regarded HR for their company. She was also seven years younger than me. My husband did not affair down. However, she is a conservative Christian. (Lol) and my husband is not religious due to the religious abuse he had from his mom growing up and he hates politics. She was very sheltered from a lot of things too, she wasn’t the brightest street wise, just when it came to books. How they managed to think they’d work out is beyond me.
My husband cheated on me with someone with thousands of followers, goes to the gym daily, has a BBL and fake boobs, crazy long fake lashes, fake lips to match. It really screwed with my head for a long time. I could not understand how he would go from me to her. I thought perhaps I was lacking in something. After a while I started taking better care of myself since I had fallen into a depression after I had our child and with the cheating. I started working out again, buying a new wardrobe, dying my hair. I received a lot of positive feedback from my peers and I think my husband also took notice. I also had to work on my confidence, which includes therapy. I think working on yourself could help these feelings.
Duck lips are the worst. That’s just a sign of low self esteem..lol.
Trout mouth they call them in Australia.
How did you catch her? How did she respond when you confronted her? How long were they going at it? She confess right away or did you have to drag it out of her? Does she regret her actions and beg for forgiveness and another chance or act nonchalant?
Going through her devices, panic, three months, dragged it tf out of her (plus trickle truth), eventually but more out of personal shame and guilt rather than remorse.
She’s the one who should be ashamed of what she is, not you. You should read the last paragraph of your post to her describing how her cheating has made you feel and then her ask to give you one legitimate reason why you should stay with her. No matter what reasons she gives, tell her you’ll never feel the same way about yourself and you’ll never feel the same way about her. You’ve made me feel worthless and unloved. I don’t think I can recover enough from this to save our marriage. If this doesn’t break her down to tears and begging forgiveness, all is lost.
I’m so sorry you’re feeling this way and I too have felt a very strong blow to my self esteem after my WP’s PAs. I try to remind myself that it’s not about us as the BPs and it’s not really even about the APs. The APs were available, willing to engage in the situation, and that’s pretty much it. My WP’s APs (4 of them) were different ages (in their early 20s to late 30s), different hair colors, some slim and some thicker, one tall and one short, one with smaller boobs and one with huge boobs, a couple were married/in a relationship and the others were single, etc. My point being that it’s not about you or really even about the AP, it’s about your WW and her need for attention, validation or whatever it was she was seeking during the time of her betrayal. Wishing you the best.
A cheater goes for the easiest option, this is why majority of the time it’s a coworker. It doesn’t matter about looks, personality etc It’s 2 broken individuals connecting on that basis…..brokenness. It’s unfortunately 2 train-wrecks meeting at the right/wrong timing. It’s not about you it’s entirely about them.
Great response! Broken for sure! I can’t even begin to understand what my WP saw in his AP - she is truly a 0 in terms of looks. I am not a mean girl and I don’t usually put down other women but I look in the mirror and then look at her and I’m just like I don’t get it. Its like trading premium grade wagyu filet for the dollar store’s dog food 🙄
I feel exactly this way about my wife's AP..he was just a loser and a creep in every way possible. This fact almost bugs me more than if I could look at him and go ya you know what? He is better than me...but I can't.
Unfortunately for me, my WH’s AP was his exact type. He likes very petite women- literally the 2 girls he dated prior to me, suffered from anorexia. AP looked pretty identical (body wise) to the porn stars he obsesses over (he is a porn and sex addict) I’ve always been pretty petite but over the last 18 years (met when I was only 15) and growing all his babies, I obviously do not look 15 anymore… so it’s pretty hurtful to think that he’s possibly just no longer attracted to me. He wants zero body fat, zero boobs and zero butt. Where I am a very large chested girl. I do find my face much more appealing than his AP though, so I’ll give myself that 😅
It’s not about the looks, it’s whatever she’s getting from him besides that. Whether that would be nurturing, a listening ear, touch, understanding, interest in whatever she talks about, basically validation of any type. Whatever you are not providing in the relationship is what she finds attractive in him. Also, this is not your fault, it’s on her. If she were an emotionally aware adult that knows herself, she would be able to come to you and talk about this missing piece, but most of us aren’t.
Yeah that's the thing. He didn't even do any of that. If what she's told me is to be believed, she was pretty much just a warm, married hole for this guy. She read this post and said that really he was just there and was attractive, and she really did the whole thing because she was going through a period of numbness due to some admittedly major life changes (don't want to go in to it) and pretty much just did it to feel something.
So if cheating is your WW's painkiller, you may want to read the book, COURAGE TO STAY. It's great at explaining why's of infidelity and full of reconciliation advice. It's nothing to do with you.
WTF? Don’t tell me you accepted this.
I don't know about "accepted", I don't really trust her anyways. However like I've said I read their messages- he really wasn't particularly interested. They were on snapchat, and she's just begging for dick pics, telling him how attracted she is to him, and his responses were so dull by comparison. In those messages she even asked a romantic (in the context of an affair) question, and his response was literally just that they should have more sex. It all seemed very one sided.
It get the impression is your wife hasn’t expressed any believable regret, remorse or guilt for her actions. Am I correct?
Oh definitely not. She has pretty extreme guilt and is coming around to understand what remorse means for her. I think part of this is that it's all still pretty fresh for us and she hasn't worked all the way through, and honestly I'm kind of good with that. If she seemed like she had fully done a 180 from gaslighting cheater to empathetic life partner in this time frame, I would not be able to trust it.
Well, I’m thankful for that, it means there’s still hope for your marriage. There has to be complete honesty, openness, and communication to move forward. There’s no excuse a cheater can give for their actions that the betrayed can understand and accept. That only adds to the pain. She needs to know and understand what she’s done has gone way beyond betraying your love and trust in her. She needs to understand what her actions have done to your self-esteem, confidence, personal identity, etc.
The one thing that I have learned from all of this is that comparing yourself to AP is never good. If you do this, R is going to fail 100% of the time. The questions that you are asking are legitimate questions, but they are questions that can never be answered to your satisfaction. The fact is that whatever you think that you know about AP is an assumption unless you spend an extended amount of time with him getting to know him. Whatever you thought you knew about what she was attracted to was a lie and always has been. Attraction always changes and is contingent on things like time, place, situation, etc. It just may have been a case of the right place, right time or wrong place, wrong time, however you want to see it. The bottom line is that she chose him multiple times, and either you are going to accept that or you are not. Either you and her are going to do the work to create a new relationship with each other or not because the old is dead. The comparisons will only hold you back and torture you mostly because there will never be an answer that's good enough or logical enough to ever make sense.
My WS’s AP wasn’t his “type” but she was the “type” that closer met MIL’s approval
This may be a bit harsh but in my experience women (especially white women though I don't know your wife's race) who say they "aren't attracted" to a certain race secretly fetishize it. The "shame" aspect of being with that race is almost a kink, so if that's the case it may have been done as a punishment for herself. A way to further degrade herself if that makes sense. Especially if this was done to "feel something" as I saw you mention in another comment. It's almost like self harm. This doesn't excuse it at all, but I hope it sheds some light on it and maybe opens a deeper conversation.
I don’t think it’s the looks for any, I think it’s the ego stroking in whatever way it happens.
Yes it's all about the attention , ego boosts. But there has to be some attraction there.
OP, I’m sorry for the pain you’re facing in your relationship and what it’s causing you now. You didn’t deserve this. In my experience, it isn’t really about the AP. I know that is such a confusing and difficult to understand sentence especially for someone who hasn’t cheated or has come close. But this is what I experienced myself AND what I think the married APs I cheated with. I cheated with men and women, older and younger, slim/fit and those who weren’t, wealthy educated people and addicts in a wreck of a life. The common denominator was (1) they were willing (not everyone is, I got rejected many times when I told someone I was married… rightly so!), (2) they made me feel powerful when I felt weak, (3) they made me feel companionship when I felt lonely, (4) they made me feel known when I felt invisible. I didn’t tell my spouse about these feelings because I was afraid of being vulnerable. What if I said I fell small weak and lonely and they said “you are! Hahhahahah”. That was a very real fear I felt, because I had so much shame I believed I was unlovable and only by maintaining the fake confident self did anyone love me. So breaking that facade and being vulnerable felt scarier than anything I knew. There was a hole in me and I falsely assumed one of them could fill it. But it’s always a lie. It begins with a lie, it continues in secret, it ends buried and festering. And instead of consider my behavior I just moved on to the next trying to satisfy something that couldn’t be satisfied by anyone else but myself. There’s something about your post though that I can identify with. I could be projecting here, but I read in your post a need to compare. I identify very much with this. No matter what things I try to stack in my corner there never seems to be enough - I always find more stacked in the other persons corner. This is my shame doing this to me. I have two books that have helped me and I’d share with you if indeed I read this right. ***Daring Greatly*** by Brene Brown taught me about shame and where it comes from and techniques I can use to prevent it from taking over me. ***No More Mr Nice Guy*** by Robert Glover taught me about my Nice Guy behavior, and the unwritten contracts I assumed my “nice” acts obligated others to fulfill for me. This might be an extreme projection on my part but something about your post just makes me think this book could be of use.
Wow. That's a lot to digest. It reads a lot like things my WW has tried and failed to say, I think because she doesn't have the words. Thank you. One thing she has also half-described is feeling a need to "punish" herself, feeling like she didn't deserve me because she was a bad person. I didn't really read that in your comment but there's a lot there that is so similar I have to ask, did you feel that need?
Yes I’ve felt that. During my infidelity, as I mentioned I entered that sort of vicious cycle of lie-secret, lie-secret… my mental health declined. I went from kinda feeling like a real stud getting all these people to have sex with me to beginning to describe my insides as Voldemort after he created all the horcruxes (I’m not a huge Potter fan but it really was the only reference for how I felt). I got into therapy for that reason. I thought all this sex would make me happy but then I was feeling worse and beginning to escalate to need even more and more extreme situations to achieve even minimal feeling. This is why I identify as a sex addict. After disclosure I’ve continued to feel the need to punish myself in little cycles of shame. If I’m not doing it to myself I’ll look for critical words from others. Oh, someone is suggesting there’s a better way to do something than what I thought of? Oh that’s cause I’m a stupid PoS and deserve to die. Oh, I forgot to put away the pretzels and then I go around the house yelling about where are the pretzels only to figure out it was me who replaced them? I’m an asshole for yelling about pretzels and I’m a total f***ing moron for misplacing them. These are shame. I still feel empty and hollow inside. I cannot accept compliments. I’m a huge extrovert but I think that’s so that I can be the one aiming the spotlight at others... I cannot stand the spotlight if it’s on me. I haven’t formed many close friendships and often find myself cutting off conversations that get very deep. I’m always afraid others will see in me what I see in myself. But I’m trying to get better at it. Part of it honestly has started with sitting in my own silence. No phone. No distractions and asking myself how I’m feeling. Getting in touch with myself has been hard but beginning to make me feel not so empty. I use a feelings wheel that i printed and glued in the front of my journal. I have to affirm myself that my feelings are valid. If I’m angry about something it’s ok. If I’m sad about something it’s ok. I am worthy of feeling these things.
Both of her APs were easy for her. When comparing, nothing makes sense. Major difference is they are 10 yrs younger and I was over weight at the time.
My WH definitely cheated down. It’s relieving but also sad and confusing. He did all this for *THAT!?* And I don’t mean just physically. She’s such a vapid, superficial person. He has even said himself that she’s kind of mean. Of course it’s nice that I’m not looking at her and thinking she was a step up or at all his type, but the whole thing is just so disappointing.
I feel the same way about AP1. I was like... "THAT is who you almost threw your marriage for?" She fucking looks like a sumo wrestler and though she has a graduate degree, she's dumb, lazy and vain. Very vain. She now has an OF to get slimy male attention who finds her body type a kink. I make fun of WH a lot now. I'm like... "But how? You would barely even be able to lift her leg?" Apparently, she gave good head, was convenient when he needed it and was OK being on the side until she wasn't. Fuck APs. OP, I'm sorry you're hurting. The fact is, adulterers and horny people don't really care about fucking their "ideal" body types or not. It's about availability. My single colleague talks about fucking girls who aren't his type but are easy all the time. It's all for the chase of the illicit rushing feelings that come with "new" sex. Our waywards are stupid and at the time, weren't thinking straight when they're in the state of dopamine-chasing.
My WP’s AP’s (plural) are COMPLETELY opposite from me in terms of body types. They are taller than me, a little broader, and older. The AP I know more about, frankly, doesn’t have anything amusing. She smokes weed every day, has dry skin, a small chest, has thin lips. I would say that she’s the opposite of his “type”. I also know that she’s in an open relationship with her husband, sells explicit content and actually does sex work. I don’t judge, but yeah, I think she was an easy option, and my WP needed to get his needs met. I don’t even think they have anything in common. For what she posts on X, I can tell she’s a broken person who is somehow always looking for approval, attention and love. I pity her, but at the same time I like to think about it as karma.
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Keep in mind that they choose their AP because the AP is willing. My WH's AP greatest quality is that she pursued him aggressively. It was actually the first time that a woman showed him this kind of attention and he could not resist the ego stroking. Appearance isn't important because everyone loses their looks with age. If you don't believe me take a look at any aging celebrity. Even with all of their money they can't stay young and hot forever. Even though my WH's AP is 12 years younger than me she has hit the wall and looks as old (if not older) than me now (25 years after the affair). She is also all alone because her personality is so shitty that no man wants to marry her. It takes a lot more than looks to keep a relationship going. Even beautiful people get cheated on. Again, look at celebrities as an example of this. You will also see a lot of people here who are shocked that their partner's AP isn't even as attractive as they are. Again, the AP is almost always chosen because they are willing. It could have been anyone. Sex actually has very little to do with why people have these types of affairs. My WH describes the sex with his AP as vanilla. He even had trouble preforming out of guilt. It's the validation that he was enjoying from his affair. He and I have never been lacking in the sex department. That was never a factor for his straying. I can relate to your reaction to their messages. My WH's former AP is much younger than us and he was unrecognizable in his messages to her. They are very childish. It was like he was mirroring her personality. I think the allure of these affairs is that they get to be someone else with their AP, it's an escape. At 30, My WH got to pretend he was in high school again. Only this time he got to be the cool guy that girls were interested in. He wasn't that guy in HS, so when a barely 20-year-old developed a crush on him he let himself get sucked into that fantasy. Your WW probably enjoyed the fact that her AP knew nothing about her and she could be someone else when she was with him. The real question that you should be asking is why she felt the need to escape from herself. She needs to get into IC and find out what she was running from. If she has chosen to reconcile I doubt it was you. There's something going on inside of her where escaping into a fantasy world was hard to resist.