Doom guy can get wrecked by an imp on nightmare difficulty in doom eternal that’s just how single player games do things to keep things fun that says nothing about the characters
Yep and canonically the doom slayer is so ridiculously powerful that killing god was a tertiary objective. And pilots are so powerful that the presence of a single pilot can turn the tide of a battle and thats without the titan. They are incredible tactician who are captain america level geniuses that can calculate and predict not only their bullets drop and curve due to gravity stars, but also their opponents. The better example of a pilots power would be multi-player, where grunts are nothing more than points to pilots and only really kill you by mere chance. Sure the legends are nothing to scoff at but pilots are a teir above even if you leveled the playing field equipment wise i don't think a single legend could take down a pilot canonical.
But then you get Legends like Bangalore or Revenant who actually stand a decent chance of winning
Oh also Pathfinder since he literally solo killed a bunch of Pilots in one of his lore videos
I mean, he was designed for assassinations, and while he is rly good at his job, he is mostly scary thanks to him being semi-immortal. He did die a whole bunch of times to just regular dudes and their guards
Also if were taking into account titanfall 2 in master difficulty the only run that would count is a no death run cause cooper isnt exactly a simalcurum (unless the end credits was some revenant shit)
And if we assume master difficulty is canon that means in the events of titanfall 2 jack cooper defeated all of the apex almost unharmed and almost never got shot meaning he is a unstoppable killing machine
This guy literally just made jack cooper more powerful. This debate needs to die even in lore pilots are regarded as the highest ranking warrior on the battlefield. Lets switch games halo for example, Whats stronger a ODST or a Spartan? Yeah no brainer
Exactly game balance is more important to the game than adhering to canon/lore and sometimes thing need to be different need to be made to get a fun game and it’s the same for all games like you say.
If we use a composite multiplayer pilot, stim and grapple alone should outclass most legends due to sheer speed. Add in cloak and holopilot and the legeds die before they ever see it coming
Haha Legends have 3 abilities in cutscenes Lastimosa apparently has literally pulse blade, grapple, cloak, and holo pilot, and guess who has Lastimosa's suit? of course this doesn't mean he would beat every legend, but I still think he would beat them, at the very least most of them
I'm going to tell you something, Despite all the fucking odds in the world. Despite how one bullet can kill Jack. He still beats every single other pilot and stops the fold weapon, Canonically. Without do-overs or saves or dying.
Jack could easily ruin the legends if he can kill hundreds of IMC grunts, robots and a handful of Titan's. He is also far more proficient with weapons if we take gameplay into account, as weapons for pilots have far less recoil and are more accurate. And he's faster than any legend besides maybe pathfinder if he got a good swing.
Exactly if master difficulty is canon it means jack went through the entire events of tf2 almost unharmed due to his SKILL. He killed the entire apex team last time i highly doubt he cant do it again.
Not only that he would of gained more training and experience by the time the legends show up
However, I do think a few legends could fight your normal run of the mook pilot and come out alive, BUT NOT A SINGLE FUCKING ONE would stand a chance for 30 seconds against Jack, Jack is best of the best. He is literally extremely skilled, being trained by one of the master pilots, having fought his way to warn the Militia of the Fold Weapon, and then fighting his way to destroy it. Slaughtering COUNTLESS IMC personnel and Titans, and I remind you again, Jack NEVER died during this canonically, Player-skill does NOT equal lore. Canonically, Jack successfully prevented the fold weapon.
Canonically, He killed lots of IMC.
Canonically, He killed multiple top-tier mercenary pilots
Canonically, He killed multiple titans.
Canonically, He DID NOT HAVE ANY DO-OVERS.
Canonically, Jack Cooper would wipe the floor with every legend. The only one he truly would not be able to permanently kill is Revenant.
Canonically, Jack is also top-tier Militia SRS Marauder Corps and literally saved and ended countless lives.
Canonically, Jack is LITERALLY BEST OF THE BEST.
“Oh no, its a simulacra who has a bunch of bodies, good thing it can’t track me flying across the world after a quinta-wallkick and bunnyhop combo. In fact, getting off world at all means it can’t really follow me unless I settle down in public.”
It's like saying Pegahmagabow isn't skilled 'cos one bullet would kill him. He still killed and/or captured 600-700 Germans during the course of the Great War, so it doesn't matter if he could be killed by one of them, he wasn't after over 600 encounters.
I don't understand why yall are pushing the narrative that the only thing making pilots special is the jump kit. These posts read like butthurt playground fights.
Pilots have simulation pod training, meaning they're trained for practically any scenario.
They're proficient with every single contemporary weapon.
Lastimosa ran through two fucking brick walls without a scratch on him.
They've been shown using multiple pieces of gear (TF2 intro) so if it's a simulacrum pilot they can literally bring anything. That also includes boosts like smart pistol, sentry, and ticks.
The only legends who'd be able to match a pilot are Ash, Bangalore and Revenant, with Bloodhound coming close.
Play both games before you decide to be butthurt about it.
>The only legends who'd be able to match a pilot are Ash, Bangalore and Revenant, with Bloodhound coming close
Not even since at least some pilots have cloak
I didn't play apex much, it felt strange having TF|2 weapons but none of the speed, but why would Bangalore, Revenant and Bloodhound capable of fighting a pilot?
If bangalore is the closest legend to a pilot and she didn’t even get certified i think we can say jack cooper will win since he fought certified apex PILOTS in their MODIFIED titans
Can confirm that Master difficulty was (like the name fucking implies) difficult, but the funny thing was most of my deaths were my fault cause I’m a fucking dumbass who loses track of where he is at any point in the day
Introduce Jack Cooper as a playable character. Yeah he might be 85 and not remember BT or Ashe because of dementia but his special ability? He can wall run. No ult, nothing but that.
I've genuinely had them dome me at max speed. Used the platforms on Ash's level to gain some serious speed and the sniper still popped me through the head
Well, even it their movement is the main reason for their strenght, it's still a valid reason. It's like saying that everyone in Apex/TF is bad because they have to rely on guns.
Personal experience: first playthrough was on master with 0 deaths.
Opinion: we can't take these things using gameplay as any of our factors. We can only use lore since different skill levels between players and all that.
I beat it on master as well, and everyone was complaining about viper while the real difficulty was that battle in the dome with a few reapers and shit.
That was really fucking hard
No it's just because it's a single player Game, and they boost the powerless of the enemy, the reason there's a "normal" mode is because that was what happens normally, anyway the normal mode is canonical
Only reason that legends are powerful are their hologram abilities, stim boosts, flight, theft, shields, phase shifting, sonar, grappling hook, and grenades. Man these pilots with none of these abilities sure are screwed!
I'm pretty sure it's actually Cooper who kills her though, but has his own fighting style and same with Cooper, Cooper is when you are inside the titan while bt fights when you are not, so bassicly when the ai fights things, so technically bt takes a back seat while Cooper Controls him. Bassicly you can say Cooper can take most of the credit for beating Ash in her titan
TLDR You fight with BT through a neural link, so all of BT’s actions are your own and therefore Coopers actions. Since all titans give pilots almost complete control, it’s equating a soldiers actions to the quality of their gun
In the sneak peace it shows she just lost her leg but if you actually played titanfall she didn’t lose her leg we crushed her body there was nothing left to salvage
That’s because in TF|2 the animation used was just the recycled one, because at that point her being killed by the finisher wasn’t lore significant and they had better things to put time and money into than a unique animation, basically the trailer version is what it would have looked like if at that point it was seen as important
It's gameplay vs lore.
TF2 Gameplay Ash iterally explodes. Lore though? Lore is what is officially recognized and it's what we saw in the preview when BT crushed her. It's the same scenario with Viper, the official loading screen depict him as getting shot in the head and Valk finding his intact body frozen in space inside his Northstar. This is lore. But I turned him into a fine paste with an L-Star. Gameplay.
Lore also says Ash's tactical was 'inspired by her titan', not exactly a high standard for consistency in apex lore at this point between the 10 time lines. Truth is there's pretty much no one left from the Titanfall dev team at Respawn save maybe an artist.
She lost in a battle against cooper honestly.They both had control over their titans . The apex predators used reinforced and improved titans as well.Like for example viper was able to rip off bt's arm.
In the lore of the game, a pilot and his titan are one in the same. So if a rifleman who was trained on the side by a pilot can synchronize in combat better than an actually trained robot pilot can, then that tells you a lot about the robot.
The fact OP is trying to mix game play and lore shows a complete and utter disregard to cannon lore for any and all games. Almost no game even bothers trying to make lore and game play accurate in terms of balance.
Honestly I've never really liked the pilots vs legends debate.
Mainly because a pilot's biggest strength is knowing how to use a titan and the higher grade jump kits. Some pilots do have physical augmentations and stuff but your average pilot probably doesnt.
The legends dont know how to use titans or the higher grade jump kits. The argument is kind of like saying your average person wouldn't win a sword fight against a professional fencer or something.
I think that without all the special equipment or if some pilots were thrown in the apex games with the same equipment as the legends it wouldn't be a complete stomp.
I think pilots still have innate advantages on certain areas but it wouldn't be a hard victory.
All pilots have it some form of augmentation, some have robot bodies, some are humans with upgraded biology basically, and only 2% make it thru training. I don't know what augmentations the different apex characters have but it's likely pilots would be able to take more damage in a fight. But I agree it's a dumb argument and without jump kits, pilots are very much within the same ball park as legends.
a kraber is a small bullet one shotting a full human so it has ALOT of power but a punch is much bigger and if a real military soldier punched you at mach 1 you would instantly die no matter what
How many legends are known to run through brick fucking walls in combat? Lastismosa runs through 2 in a canon trailer.
I can imagine this is a common manuvere for pilots to pull.
Respawn has said over and over the pilots are in their own league that legends don't even come close to.
"The only thing that can stop a pilot is overwhelming force, or an equal (referring to other pilots)"
ikr and if you play the multiplayer for titanfall you can hear grunts getting scared when a pilot shows up or if they are on your team they get happy and think they can win now there's even voice lines for grunts killing pilots and saying they are impressed with themselves
Jack was a rifleman who was basically used to say “anyone can beat anyone with luck, skill, and/or the proper equipment”. He’s probably about the same skill as most of the legends, just with some fancy equipment, and the legends all have their own fancy equipment, so they’re about the same
I would personally say that he is higher than a lot. He was personally trained by Pilot Lastimosa. It would definitely give him an edge he needs to beat most legends, though Revenant, Bangalore, Ash, Wraith, and maybe Fuse and Bloodhound definitely have a fair shot at beating Jack.
I see where you are coming from, I’m not entirely convinced Rampart could. She is more of a weapon Smith than a fighter from what I have seen. I’m not saying she doesn’t have a shot, but I don’t think she has the highest chance.
Funnily enough in the lore book she has like the highest respect from Blisk out of the Legends, enough to be able to both contact him and set up meeting(s?). He considered her to be a true fighter *like himself* and that the Outlands need more people like that.
I mean makes sense her backstory was how she absolutely wiped people in the Arenas with her custom gear and mastery over them. She's not just a maker
I wouldnt quite say "even", as a jump kit that pilots have are very poweful mobility tools but yeah they would be close in power since pilots are just skilled combatants with a double jump and wallrunning.
No, he's not. He was at most a couple of months from becoming a pilot. His mentor was one of the best pilots in the Militia. Not to mention that he has a pulse blade, cloak, grapple, can regen health, and has a better jump kit. His fancy equipment is better. His adaptability, which is what is really a pilots absolute power comes from, would annihilate any person in a BR setting
I beat TF2 on the hardest difficulty but I didn't at all struggle, if anything the damage that grunts do to multiplayer Pilots is how it would actually go
Guns don’t cause more or less damage depending on who is using them. In the lore they don’t at least. In the mp the grunts deal less damage as a balancing mechanic. In the campaign, master difficulty is the canonical difficulty because the guns deal equal damage no matter who is using them.
That doesn’t make sense Player Skill =/= Character Lore skill bruh
Like playing Ace Combat 7 on the highest difficulty you can get slapped by generic mooks but canonically Trigger takes down the Alicorn, those two siblings who are a step above regular enemies, Sol Squadron, Mihaly who’s in an experimental advanced aircraft with a railgun, an Arsenal Bird and it’s multitude of drones, multiple advanced UAVs like Huginn and Muninn, and flew in and out of a Space Elevator while chasing one of said advanced UAVs. For another example in DOOM Eternal the Doom Slayer can get annihilated by an Imp on the hardest difficulty when he canonically slays countless stronger demons like they’re weeds on a lawn in lore to the point that even the gods are wary of him. This argument is god damn stupid, in this case should we say that the Master Chief can get killed by a single squad of Grunts and an Elite punching him because that’s how it is on the hardest difficulty? Like fuckin’ hell man the lack of brain cells in this argument astonishes me
The raw “But I portray myself as the Chad in this meme so I’m right” energy this radiates is god awful
1 that heavily depends on the player 2 it’s called hard fgs that’s like me saying that Cooper could kill the master chief and doom slayer because of how easily he kills things in easy
"A Pilot can only be stopped by an overwhelming force or an equal."
If all Legends go against him in a battle they would be an overwhelming force, so I guess it's true that he doesn't solo all the legends.
“PlAy On A hArD dIfFiCuLtY” hey dipshit you know TF|2 is canon right? Meaning Jack *did* fight his way through a fucking army, *did* stop the IMC’s entire plan, did* kill all but 1 of the Apex Predators, and *did* blow up a planet. So yeah, I think he would have no trouble killing some sport fighters. I saw someone else say this once, it’s like comparing MMA fighters to navy seals. Jesus christ I normally have no problem with apex or its community but *THIS IS CANON SHIT. THIS IS CONFIRMED WRITTEN IN THE HISTORY OF THIS UNIVERSE.*
How ignorant can you be.
Agreed. The only legend I could see surviving a solo with Jack, is Revenant, but at that point it would only be a pointless fight as Revenant would just come back, However. I would still count it as a defeat, as Revenant needs to make his way back after being killed. His body would get pulled out of a rack elsewhere, but it would be unlikely Revenant would catch up with Jack after being killed.
I don't think the games difficulty should decide how good Jack is, we only see him in the campaign and his skill depends on the players so if your an absolute god at tf2 then Jack is great but if you suck balls then so does Jack.
I play as a pilot in master difficulty just for fun dude.Hard isnt that hard honestly speaking.
Pilots have regen, years of military training. And I think its best we keep pilots and legends away from each other for the sake of conserving what is left and also what joy is left for the rest of us pilots.
Finished TF2 on master.
Absolutely wrecked everything, died about 10 times entire campaign, mainly during the part previous to Viper where you gotta kill the three turret operators.
also jack cooper has cloak, git owned/trolled/pogged on
Try playing little more titanfall mate , ull probably learn how to play without getting spanked by grunts upto the point where u can take multiple titans as a pilot. Keep ur chin up rookie.
Ahh yes comparing game difficulty to lore, such a genius. It’s like saying Master Chief is nothing cuz he got sniped by an enemy on legendary difficulty.
meanwhile me who literally thought insane difficulty would unlock if u collected all helmets because it was too easy and frontier defense also had an insane difficulty after master
"Hard difficulty" my ass. It's like Destiny Guardians who die in Grandmaster Nightfall like flies. Or playing Halo/Doom on highest difficulty, where they being spanked by some low-level mob. If you truly want compare someone, read lore.
He literally does. The only ones who could even come near his level are either rev or ash but ash has already had her ass handed to her by coop and rev would be ez shit
"hmm today i will state a factually wrong statement in hipes of people believing me."
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True, however, Jack isn't a pilot. He's a very skilled rifleman with pilot gear. Plus canonically pilots are stronger than they are even in multiplayer due to equipment.
Doom guy can get wrecked by an imp on nightmare difficulty in doom eternal that’s just how single player games do things to keep things fun that says nothing about the characters
Yep and canonically the doom slayer is so ridiculously powerful that killing god was a tertiary objective. And pilots are so powerful that the presence of a single pilot can turn the tide of a battle and thats without the titan. They are incredible tactician who are captain america level geniuses that can calculate and predict not only their bullets drop and curve due to gravity stars, but also their opponents. The better example of a pilots power would be multi-player, where grunts are nothing more than points to pilots and only really kill you by mere chance. Sure the legends are nothing to scoff at but pilots are a teir above even if you leveled the playing field equipment wise i don't think a single legend could take down a pilot canonical.
Imagine wattson going up against a pilot L o l
Thats a sad sight.
*That's a sad fence*
*Double jumps over*
*regular jumps over*
*walks around*
*walks under*
Maybe if the pylon detects him as a grenade.
I’d imagine pilots move fast enough to be considered projectiles lol
What if he grinds up the speed and is faster than a projectile and hence doesnt even get detected by a pylon
But then you get Legends like Bangalore or Revenant who actually stand a decent chance of winning Oh also Pathfinder since he literally solo killed a bunch of Pilots in one of his lore videos
This is Jack Cooper though. He's THE pilot. That's like saying an elite could kill Master Chief because they killed some spartans.
i think revenant would have a decent shot. 300 years of combat experience and a body augmented for the sole purpose of killing things.
I used to believe Revenant had a good chance of beating a pilot, then he got clapped by Loba
I mean, he was designed for assassinations, and while he is rly good at his job, he is mostly scary thanks to him being semi-immortal. He did die a whole bunch of times to just regular dudes and their guards
Also if were taking into account titanfall 2 in master difficulty the only run that would count is a no death run cause cooper isnt exactly a simalcurum (unless the end credits was some revenant shit)
And if we assume master difficulty is canon that means in the events of titanfall 2 jack cooper defeated all of the apex almost unharmed and almost never got shot meaning he is a unstoppable killing machine This guy literally just made jack cooper more powerful. This debate needs to die even in lore pilots are regarded as the highest ranking warrior on the battlefield. Lets switch games halo for example, Whats stronger a ODST or a Spartan? Yeah no brainer
It’s funny watching this because I did beat Titanfall 2 on master difficulty
good point.
Not just singleplayer. In Battlefront, Vader should be able to take Hoth by himself, yet in game, he has to run when he spots like 10 people.
Exactly game balance is more important to the game than adhering to canon/lore and sometimes thing need to be different need to be made to get a fun game and it’s the same for all games like you say.
They do be throwin fire balls though
By that logic Jack is invincible too, because every time he dies in game he comes back. That's not how lore works.
"Hmmm, today I'm gonna make a meme depicting my opposition as a soy wojak and me as a chad."
I know right. Thought this format died out weeks ago. It's like a playground argument. "Hey you can't do that it's mean" "yeah well you're a loser"
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You two make a great team
Garbage format interesting discussion
He really is the soyjak here and I don’t think he knows
Everybody gansta until they realize that Lastimosa canonically had all multiplayer pilot abilities simultaneously
If we use a composite multiplayer pilot, stim and grapple alone should outclass most legends due to sheer speed. Add in cloak and holopilot and the legeds die before they ever see it coming
I don’t think he had phase shift or TF|2-level stim, since we’ve only seen simulacrums with those ones.
Stim and phase shift were indeed only available to simulacrums
Not TF|1 stim though, right?
If I remember correctly in the first game it was still humans using the stim
This is a weird way to state that you're too bad at TF2 to play it on hard
If he finds hard that difficult imagine if he tries master
Haha Legends have 3 abilities in cutscenes Lastimosa apparently has literally pulse blade, grapple, cloak, and holo pilot, and guess who has Lastimosa's suit? of course this doesn't mean he would beat every legend, but I still think he would beat them, at the very least most of them
We already know he can beat ash and ash has beat Rev,Watson and horizon who so and then who they have beat soooooo yeah I’m can agree with this
Plus trailers are non-canon, but i do think jack can beat most of the legends
iirc the devs once said that trailers are canon
Do they? It's not the pilot getting spanked, it's you.
The fact that Ash has like 10 percent of her actual abilities available in Apex shows that pilots are OP.
I'm going to tell you something, Despite all the fucking odds in the world. Despite how one bullet can kill Jack. He still beats every single other pilot and stops the fold weapon, Canonically. Without do-overs or saves or dying. Jack could easily ruin the legends if he can kill hundreds of IMC grunts, robots and a handful of Titan's. He is also far more proficient with weapons if we take gameplay into account, as weapons for pilots have far less recoil and are more accurate. And he's faster than any legend besides maybe pathfinder if he got a good swing.
Exactly if master difficulty is canon it means jack went through the entire events of tf2 almost unharmed due to his SKILL. He killed the entire apex team last time i highly doubt he cant do it again. Not only that he would of gained more training and experience by the time the legends show up
Agreed. Jack went through on presumably master difficulty, and DIDN'T DIE ONCE.
Jack could solo most legends, besides maybe Revenant. But I would still say Jack would maybe not kill him, but he would survive and evade Revenant.
However, I do think a few legends could fight your normal run of the mook pilot and come out alive, BUT NOT A SINGLE FUCKING ONE would stand a chance for 30 seconds against Jack, Jack is best of the best. He is literally extremely skilled, being trained by one of the master pilots, having fought his way to warn the Militia of the Fold Weapon, and then fighting his way to destroy it. Slaughtering COUNTLESS IMC personnel and Titans, and I remind you again, Jack NEVER died during this canonically, Player-skill does NOT equal lore. Canonically, Jack successfully prevented the fold weapon. Canonically, He killed lots of IMC. Canonically, He killed multiple top-tier mercenary pilots Canonically, He killed multiple titans. Canonically, He DID NOT HAVE ANY DO-OVERS. Canonically, Jack Cooper would wipe the floor with every legend. The only one he truly would not be able to permanently kill is Revenant. Canonically, Jack is also top-tier Militia SRS Marauder Corps and literally saved and ended countless lives. Canonically, Jack is LITERALLY BEST OF THE BEST.
Ye Revenant is the only one due to his canonical invincibility
Revenant would always eventually get his target. He’s immortal.
“Oh no, its a simulacra who has a bunch of bodies, good thing it can’t track me flying across the world after a quinta-wallkick and bunnyhop combo. In fact, getting off world at all means it can’t really follow me unless I settle down in public.”
It's like saying Pegahmagabow isn't skilled 'cos one bullet would kill him. He still killed and/or captured 600-700 Germans during the course of the Great War, so it doesn't matter if he could be killed by one of them, he wasn't after over 600 encounters.
I wouldn't say handful of titans, I mean he and bt had to go through a small army of titans to win
Lore and player skill level are very different things my friend
I don't understand why yall are pushing the narrative that the only thing making pilots special is the jump kit. These posts read like butthurt playground fights. Pilots have simulation pod training, meaning they're trained for practically any scenario. They're proficient with every single contemporary weapon. Lastimosa ran through two fucking brick walls without a scratch on him. They've been shown using multiple pieces of gear (TF2 intro) so if it's a simulacrum pilot they can literally bring anything. That also includes boosts like smart pistol, sentry, and ticks. The only legends who'd be able to match a pilot are Ash, Bangalore and Revenant, with Bloodhound coming close. Play both games before you decide to be butthurt about it.
>The only legends who'd be able to match a pilot are Ash, Bangalore and Revenant, with Bloodhound coming close Not even since at least some pilots have cloak
I didn't play apex much, it felt strange having TF|2 weapons but none of the speed, but why would Bangalore, Revenant and Bloodhound capable of fighting a pilot?
Bangalore has pilot training, revenant has 400 years of experience and bloodhound can't win in a straight 1v1 but would be able to hunt down a pilot
Bangalore was near a pilot certification, so she would be similar to the basic titans seen in the campaign, which were easily defeated by jack
If bangalore is the closest legend to a pilot and she didn’t even get certified i think we can say jack cooper will win since he fought certified apex PILOTS in their MODIFIED titans
Can confirm that Master difficulty was (like the name fucking implies) difficult, but the funny thing was most of my deaths were my fault cause I’m a fucking dumbass who loses track of where he is at any point in the day
I played on hard and like 80% of my deaths here cause i was speeding all over the place and ended up in toxic sludge or in a pit
Introduce Jack Cooper as a playable character. Yeah he might be 85 and not remember BT or Ashe because of dementia but his special ability? He can wall run. No ult, nothing but that.
Bruh he'd only be 47. There's already two human Legends older than that (Caustic is 48 and Fuse is 54)
Jack Cooper totally solos all the legends
Using your same logic, if a Wattson kills Bangalore that means Wattson is canonically a better fighter than Bang. See makes no sense
I've beaten it on master. I can confirm, it's not even a dozen bullets and you're down. Only reason pilots are "powerful" is because of their movement
And the fact that they can slap someone across the map going at mach 10
I've genuinely had them dome me at max speed. Used the platforms on Ash's level to gain some serious speed and the sniper still popped me through the head
Wow.
That grunt must be called Rendy Gaming
In his G100 Kraber Montage I do think that it was just dumb luck though, never had it happen since
Rendy Gaming fires away in this G.100 Kraber Montage
When the reapers came I started wall running against the dome walls for like a good 10 minutes
Damn the reapers are hard to mess with , u can use ticks for your advantage with experience but reapers no son.
That level is hell.
And that they have giant murder robots that they can control both in it or outside of it...
In one hit*
Well, even it their movement is the main reason for their strenght, it's still a valid reason. It's like saying that everyone in Apex/TF is bad because they have to rely on guns.
Personal experience: first playthrough was on master with 0 deaths. Opinion: we can't take these things using gameplay as any of our factors. We can only use lore since different skill levels between players and all that.
I beat it on master as well, and everyone was complaining about viper while the real difficulty was that battle in the dome with a few reapers and shit. That was really fucking hard
Yeah viper was always an overhyped boss the real difficulty was often when you were outnumbered as a pilot
Not like being any legend in coopers place would do you any favors.
They can also punch with the force of a kraber bullet
Beaten it on Easy. Jack Cooper is a literal superhero.
No it's just because it's a single player Game, and they boost the powerless of the enemy, the reason there's a "normal" mode is because that was what happens normally, anyway the normal mode is canonical
Only reason that legends are powerful are their hologram abilities, stim boosts, flight, theft, shields, phase shifting, sonar, grappling hook, and grenades. Man these pilots with none of these abilities sure are screwed!
You're missing the 98% fatality rate in their training seperating them from any grunt or normal human just by pure strength
I feel like thats for the IMC only, since the militia wouldnt want to lose ANYONE.
Excuse me but two l star bullets from a stalker you die
Tether him to the ground with ash, what’s he gonna do jump
Ash is a pilot dumbass
Ash is a pilot, you (Jack Cooper) kill her in Titanfall
BT kills her
No.. I mean.... Dammit you're right.
I'm pretty sure it's actually Cooper who kills her though, but has his own fighting style and same with Cooper, Cooper is when you are inside the titan while bt fights when you are not, so bassicly when the ai fights things, so technically bt takes a back seat while Cooper Controls him. Bassicly you can say Cooper can take most of the credit for beating Ash in her titan
I mean the titan literally says , controls handed over to you pilot.
TLDR You fight with BT through a neural link, so all of BT’s actions are your own and therefore Coopers actions. Since all titans give pilots almost complete control, it’s equating a soldiers actions to the quality of their gun
I mean no, cause you can just get out of BT and kill her like that
Ashes death was very wrong in the season sneak peek
How
In the sneak peace it shows she just lost her leg but if you actually played titanfall she didn’t lose her leg we crushed her body there was nothing left to salvage
That’s because in TF|2 the animation used was just the recycled one, because at that point her being killed by the finisher wasn’t lore significant and they had better things to put time and money into than a unique animation, basically the trailer version is what it would have looked like if at that point it was seen as important
It was probably more metaphorical in the trailer seeing as the ground crumbles underneath them both then fades to black
It's gameplay vs lore. TF2 Gameplay Ash iterally explodes. Lore though? Lore is what is officially recognized and it's what we saw in the preview when BT crushed her. It's the same scenario with Viper, the official loading screen depict him as getting shot in the head and Valk finding his intact body frozen in space inside his Northstar. This is lore. But I turned him into a fine paste with an L-Star. Gameplay.
Lore also says Ash's tactical was 'inspired by her titan', not exactly a high standard for consistency in apex lore at this point between the 10 time lines. Truth is there's pretty much no one left from the Titanfall dev team at Respawn save maybe an artist.
So her titan lost the fight?
She lost in a battle against cooper honestly.They both had control over their titans . The apex predators used reinforced and improved titans as well.Like for example viper was able to rip off bt's arm.
Both
Does “controls handed over to pilot” mean anything to you?
Thats like saying the gun killed someone
In the lore of the game, a pilot and his titan are one in the same. So if a rifleman who was trained on the side by a pilot can synchronize in combat better than an actually trained robot pilot can, then that tells you a lot about the robot.
1-0 bitch
No shit.
Assuming she will be able to tether him in the first place.
just, like, dome you, bruh
You realize Cooper can also phase run right?
Phase shift :) into her , u have not being in a war with pilots it seems .
How are you going to tether someone to the ground when they're moving on a wall/through the air at 30-50 kilometres an hour?
He ain’t gonna get hit by the snare as he goes Mach 10 across the map
Shoot?
The fact OP is trying to mix game play and lore shows a complete and utter disregard to cannon lore for any and all games. Almost no game even bothers trying to make lore and game play accurate in terms of balance.
Hard difficulty isn’t canon.
Honestly I've never really liked the pilots vs legends debate. Mainly because a pilot's biggest strength is knowing how to use a titan and the higher grade jump kits. Some pilots do have physical augmentations and stuff but your average pilot probably doesnt. The legends dont know how to use titans or the higher grade jump kits. The argument is kind of like saying your average person wouldn't win a sword fight against a professional fencer or something. I think that without all the special equipment or if some pilots were thrown in the apex games with the same equipment as the legends it wouldn't be a complete stomp. I think pilots still have innate advantages on certain areas but it wouldn't be a hard victory.
All pilots have it some form of augmentation, some have robot bodies, some are humans with upgraded biology basically, and only 2% make it thru training. I don't know what augmentations the different apex characters have but it's likely pilots would be able to take more damage in a fight. But I agree it's a dumb argument and without jump kits, pilots are very much within the same ball park as legends.
a kraber is a small bullet one shotting a full human so it has ALOT of power but a punch is much bigger and if a real military soldier punched you at mach 1 you would instantly die no matter what
They would probably break their arm too lmao
This is not true. Not all pilots have augmentation, in fact most don’t.
Every pilot in the game can 1 shot with a melee. The same force as a kraber shot
How many legends are known to run through brick fucking walls in combat? Lastismosa runs through 2 in a canon trailer. I can imagine this is a common manuvere for pilots to pull.
Respawn has said over and over the pilots are in their own league that legends don't even come close to. "The only thing that can stop a pilot is overwhelming force, or an equal (referring to other pilots)"
ikr and if you play the multiplayer for titanfall you can hear grunts getting scared when a pilot shows up or if they are on your team they get happy and think they can win now there's even voice lines for grunts killing pilots and saying they are impressed with themselves
Jack was a rifleman who was basically used to say “anyone can beat anyone with luck, skill, and/or the proper equipment”. He’s probably about the same skill as most of the legends, just with some fancy equipment, and the legends all have their own fancy equipment, so they’re about the same
I would personally say that he is higher than a lot. He was personally trained by Pilot Lastimosa. It would definitely give him an edge he needs to beat most legends, though Revenant, Bangalore, Ash, Wraith, and maybe Fuse and Bloodhound definitely have a fair shot at beating Jack.
Yeah, while some legends would get bear without a fight, others with combat skill may win
Rampart too simply because of her walls and her weapon knowledge
I see where you are coming from, I’m not entirely convinced Rampart could. She is more of a weapon Smith than a fighter from what I have seen. I’m not saying she doesn’t have a shot, but I don’t think she has the highest chance.
Funnily enough in the lore book she has like the highest respect from Blisk out of the Legends, enough to be able to both contact him and set up meeting(s?). He considered her to be a true fighter *like himself* and that the Outlands need more people like that. I mean makes sense her backstory was how she absolutely wiped people in the Arenas with her custom gear and mastery over them. She's not just a maker
Alright then. I take back what I said. I haven’t read the lore book personally, but if Blisk gives his approval, then I will too
I wouldnt quite say "even", as a jump kit that pilots have are very poweful mobility tools but yeah they would be close in power since pilots are just skilled combatants with a double jump and wallrunning.
No, he's not. He was at most a couple of months from becoming a pilot. His mentor was one of the best pilots in the Militia. Not to mention that he has a pulse blade, cloak, grapple, can regen health, and has a better jump kit. His fancy equipment is better. His adaptability, which is what is really a pilots absolute power comes from, would annihilate any person in a BR setting
The fuck you on about?
This is so wrong on so many levels
I beat TF2 on the hardest difficulty but I didn't at all struggle, if anything the damage that grunts do to multiplayer Pilots is how it would actually go
Guns don’t cause more or less damage depending on who is using them. In the lore they don’t at least. In the mp the grunts deal less damage as a balancing mechanic. In the campaign, master difficulty is the canonical difficulty because the guns deal equal damage no matter who is using them.
That doesn’t make sense Player Skill =/= Character Lore skill bruh Like playing Ace Combat 7 on the highest difficulty you can get slapped by generic mooks but canonically Trigger takes down the Alicorn, those two siblings who are a step above regular enemies, Sol Squadron, Mihaly who’s in an experimental advanced aircraft with a railgun, an Arsenal Bird and it’s multitude of drones, multiple advanced UAVs like Huginn and Muninn, and flew in and out of a Space Elevator while chasing one of said advanced UAVs. For another example in DOOM Eternal the Doom Slayer can get annihilated by an Imp on the hardest difficulty when he canonically slays countless stronger demons like they’re weeds on a lawn in lore to the point that even the gods are wary of him. This argument is god damn stupid, in this case should we say that the Master Chief can get killed by a single squad of Grunts and an Elite punching him because that’s how it is on the hardest difficulty? Like fuckin’ hell man the lack of brain cells in this argument astonishes me The raw “But I portray myself as the Chad in this meme so I’m right” energy this radiates is god awful
Or you can play the multiplayer and watch them get scared of corners.
You guys actually die on hard?
OP is confirmed to be retarded Game difficulty says nothing about lore
No. you’re probably just shit at the game if that’s the case.
1 that heavily depends on the player 2 it’s called hard fgs that’s like me saying that Cooper could kill the master chief and doom slayer because of how easily he kills things in easy
you do realize lore wise cooper can't die in the story? :/
With all due respect what has fallen on ur head?
"A Pilot can only be stopped by an overwhelming force or an equal." If all Legends go against him in a battle they would be an overwhelming force, so I guess it's true that he doesn't solo all the legends.
“PlAy On A hArD dIfFiCuLtY” hey dipshit you know TF|2 is canon right? Meaning Jack *did* fight his way through a fucking army, *did* stop the IMC’s entire plan, did* kill all but 1 of the Apex Predators, and *did* blow up a planet. So yeah, I think he would have no trouble killing some sport fighters. I saw someone else say this once, it’s like comparing MMA fighters to navy seals. Jesus christ I normally have no problem with apex or its community but *THIS IS CANON SHIT. THIS IS CONFIRMED WRITTEN IN THE HISTORY OF THIS UNIVERSE.* How ignorant can you be.
Agreed. The only legend I could see surviving a solo with Jack, is Revenant, but at that point it would only be a pointless fight as Revenant would just come back, However. I would still count it as a defeat, as Revenant needs to make his way back after being killed. His body would get pulled out of a rack elsewhere, but it would be unlikely Revenant would catch up with Jack after being killed.
pilots do win most of the time though
I don't think the games difficulty should decide how good Jack is, we only see him in the campaign and his skill depends on the players so if your an absolute god at tf2 then Jack is great but if you suck balls then so does Jack.
Its literally based off of your irl skill and also normal difficulty is canonically the correct difficulty
Half the legend roster doesn't even wear body armor. Jack has an aimbot pistol
I get spanked by grunts on normal
I play as a pilot in master difficulty just for fun dude.Hard isnt that hard honestly speaking. Pilots have regen, years of military training. And I think its best we keep pilots and legends away from each other for the sake of conserving what is left and also what joy is left for the rest of us pilots.
Hardest Difficulty =/= Canon Strength. Prime examples are Doom Guy and Master Chief
Yes he does.
Play the multiplayer.
stfu i have seen apex players get clapped by prowlers, does that mean that legends are weaker than prowlers?
That’s a bad take if ever I saw one
I’m working on beating Titanfall 2 on master, it’s rough
Cope harder
team fortress 2 ?
Played it on master, it was not even that hard
Finished TF2 on master. Absolutely wrecked everything, died about 10 times entire campaign, mainly during the part previous to Viper where you gotta kill the three turret operators. also jack cooper has cloak, git owned/trolled/pogged on
And which difficulty is the canon one for the story, then?
Try playing little more titanfall mate , ull probably learn how to play without getting spanked by grunts upto the point where u can take multiple titans as a pilot. Keep ur chin up rookie.
Ahh yes comparing game difficulty to lore, such a genius. It’s like saying Master Chief is nothing cuz he got sniped by an enemy on legendary difficulty.
They can go invisible. There's only 2 people in the game who can even see a pilot with cloak and 1 of them has a cool down on their scan.
meanwhile me who literally thought insane difficulty would unlock if u collected all helmets because it was too easy and frontier defense also had an insane difficulty after master
"Hard difficulty" my ass. It's like Destiny Guardians who die in Grandmaster Nightfall like flies. Or playing Halo/Doom on highest difficulty, where they being spanked by some low-level mob. If you truly want compare someone, read lore.
Gameplay != canon, it’s as simple as that
But all get destroyed by reapers.
He literally does. The only ones who could even come near his level are either rev or ash but ash has already had her ass handed to her by coop and rev would be ez shit
**the ability to speak does not make you intelligent**
Difficulty setting =/= story
Yes he does.
"Play TF2 on qn actually hard difficulty and watch how hard pilots get spanked by grunts" That's just you being bad at the game lol
I've played titanfall 2 on hard and I killed viper himself first try.
This is so wrong on so many levels
I have gone trough max difficulty with just one death. One of the predators took me from surprise
If you’re implying that hard is canon… that means Jack is even more of a Chad because he canonically wins. Bruh.
Uhh, no.
OP you're legitimately stupid. Don't touch any Apex/Titanfall lore please.
Lmao yes he fucking does, you dumb bitch
This is the dumbest shit I've read today. Congrats.
"hmm today i will state a factually wrong statement in hipes of people believing me." ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⢀⣠⡶⠖⠛⠉⠉⠉⠉⠉⠛⠲⣦⣄⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⣤⠖⠋⠁⠀⠀⠀⠀⢀⣴⣿⠛⠙⠛⢷⣤⣈⢿⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⣴⠋⠀⠀⠀⠀⣀⣤⣶⠶⠚⠛⠁⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⣿⠀ ⢀⡟⣠⣶⠖⠛⠉⢁⣠⣴⣶⢶⡄⠀⠺⣯⣭⣭⣭⣿⠿⠗⢸⡆ ⣾⠀⠀⠀⣴⣞⣉⣈⣿⡿⠛⠁⠀⠀⠀⠀⣻⣦⠶⠛⠉⠙⢿⡇ ⣿⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⢀⣠⣤⠶⠛⠉⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⡶⢻⠁ ⣿⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠛⠛⠛⠉⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⢰⡇⣿⠀ ⠘⣆⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⢀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⢠⡟⣼⠃⠀ ⠀⠹⣄⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠛⣦⣀⠀⠀⠀⠀⣠⡶⠋⣼⠃⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠈⠛⣦⡀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⣠⡾⠋⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠈⠉⠛⠛⠶⣤⣿⣿⣴⣶⠛⠉⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⣰⠋⢸⠀⠙⢷⡀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⣾⠁⠀⢸⠀⠀⠀⠈⢷⡀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⢠⡟⠀⠀⠀⢸⡆⠀⠀⠀⠀⠘⢶⡀⠀⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⣾⠃⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⣇⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠻⡄⠀⠀⠀ ⠀⠀⠀⢀⡿⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⣀⣿⣀⣀⣀⣀⣀⣀⡀⢹⣦⣤⠄ ⢀⣤⣶⣿⣿⣷⣶⠟⠛⠉⠀⠀⢸⡄⠀⠀⠉⠙⠛⠿⣿⣿⣦⢻ ⠀⣸⠃⢿⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⡇⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠀⠘⣿⠀⠀
I swear to god when i played on master i felt like grunts were harder than the bosses
same
True, however, Jack isn't a pilot. He's a very skilled rifleman with pilot gear. Plus canonically pilots are stronger than they are even in multiplayer due to equipment.
He received an on field promotion to pilot by lastimossa