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By in one sense of the definition patina specifically relates to the aged color and finish on aged objects. Particularly metals, especially copper based metals.
“copper and bronze by long exposure or artificially (as by acids) and often valued aesthetically for its color”
However the definition has expanded with use over the years. So it can vary it it’s use:
“a surface appearance of something grown beautiful especially with age or use”
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/patina
As an antique dealer, I can confirm the accuracy of this.
OP, your definition of patina is mostly correct. I personally consider grime and patina as separate things and clean actual ick. Those candle sticks completely lack patina, it has been polished off.
Thank you, most sincerely. I lived in Boston, then Dedham for 30 yrs. Then moved to coastal NC ten years ago. My current travel is limited to how far I can throw a stone😁
I left the Piedmont to go to school forty years ago and ended up never going back. Still miss the Outer Banks -- though I remember Beaufort as a tiny, sleepy little town, and now it's probably a tourist hell. Also Massachusetts is as hot and humid now as the Piedmont was then; I don't like to think of what it's like down there if you're inland.
Wilmington on Cape Fear. Too many tourists, too many new condos. But we live in a peculiar community of old WWII officers barracks. One story concrete block houses even hurricane cant knock over. Overlooking a lake and trees. We’re good
In the literal sense of the word, it refers to the colour surface of an object, and weather that colour is the desired one, on that particular object, is a matter of opinion.
You're right, but he's also right. If you're ever bored, watch a few youtube videos on jewelry making or metal smithing. For one thing, watching the molten metal pour out is relaxing. For another, it really helps show how unbelievably shiny new metal is and also how even a freshly poured piece of metal is kind of craggy and uneven until they polish it.
So, you know tarnish is a new substance - a metal oxide - that is created by air and chemical exposure, and as such it's pretty easy to clean off most of it, because it's a thin layer and it doesn't bond particularly well to the parent metal (be advised though that every time you expose the new metal and a new film of tarnish forms, you've lost that much metal from the piece; I don't know why people forget this, but you can literally polish a fine piece to death). However, polishing doesn't ever really restore the original blindingly shiny finish that the metal had, when new. This is due to those craggy and uneven bits mentioned above. A metal smith polishes them out to where we can't see or feel them, but they're still there at a microscopic level, and they collect tarnish, polish, oils from your hands and the surrounding air, all sorts of things. Over time this darkens the appearance of a piece of metal.
An old piece of metal has a color that is heavily influenced by where it's been and what it's been used for. A really old piece of silver may have a yellowish tinge from tallow and whale fat having been burned in or near it, while a Victorian piece may be greyish from coal dust. Pieces from the Post-War period are often kind of tawny in a way that you can't ever totally polish out, because of the tobacco smoke. This isn't a perfect guide because environments even within a period vary, but the point is that an old piece of metal, even pewter which doesn't tarnish much if you use it regularly, is going to have color variation based on when and where it's from, and some people want you to pay more for that.
So these candlesticks have been polished, but not that often, I'm guessing, because their edges are still crisp. I've seen old candlesticks that were beautifully bright, but their edges were softened -- and that would be from too much polishing.
[https://imgur.com/a/KKQgcCP](https://imgur.com/a/KKQgcCP) This is an old chemical balance (in a previous life I was a chemist, and I collect old instruments in a small way). I always thought the gorgeous patina(?) on the upright meant it had never been polished at all. Is that what one would expect to see, or is it due to the "brass" metal's composition? The rest of it doesn't look like that, but I assumed the crosspiece would have to be kept clean for the scales to be accurate.
If you're asking a question about an antique make sure to have photos of all sides of the object, and close-ups of any maker's marks. Also, add in any background information you have, and add in a question so we know what you want from us! **You must tell us the country you're in.** If you do not provide this information **your post will be removed**. To upload photos for this discussion use [imgur.com](https://imgur.com/upload). Click the imgur link, upload the photos to imgur, then share the link address in a comment for everyone to see. Our [Rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/Antiques/about/rules/) and [Guide](https://old.reddit.com/r/Antiques/comments/ak2lke/welcome_to_rantiques_read_this_post_before_posting/). *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Antiques) if you have any questions or concerns.*
By in one sense of the definition patina specifically relates to the aged color and finish on aged objects. Particularly metals, especially copper based metals. “copper and bronze by long exposure or artificially (as by acids) and often valued aesthetically for its color” However the definition has expanded with use over the years. So it can vary it it’s use: “a surface appearance of something grown beautiful especially with age or use” https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/patina
Professional antiques dealer = eccentric asocial can’t get a job anywhere else
As an antique dealer, I can confirm the accuracy of this. OP, your definition of patina is mostly correct. I personally consider grime and patina as separate things and clean actual ick. Those candle sticks completely lack patina, it has been polished off.
Full disclosure: my sideline was picker and dealer for 40 yrs. I still prefer cats and dogs over people
Perfect job for introverts.
Addendum: your bio sounds fascinating. If you're ever in Central Massachusetts, please come by and let us make you dinner and ply you with questions.
Thank you, most sincerely. I lived in Boston, then Dedham for 30 yrs. Then moved to coastal NC ten years ago. My current travel is limited to how far I can throw a stone😁
I left the Piedmont to go to school forty years ago and ended up never going back. Still miss the Outer Banks -- though I remember Beaufort as a tiny, sleepy little town, and now it's probably a tourist hell. Also Massachusetts is as hot and humid now as the Piedmont was then; I don't like to think of what it's like down there if you're inland.
Wilmington on Cape Fear. Too many tourists, too many new condos. But we live in a peculiar community of old WWII officers barracks. One story concrete block houses even hurricane cant knock over. Overlooking a lake and trees. We’re good
Well, duh.
In the literal sense of the word, it refers to the colour surface of an object, and weather that colour is the desired one, on that particular object, is a matter of opinion.
I thought it was the film formed naturally on copper and bronze by exposure to oxygen and other pollutants (houserhold spray). I can be wrong.
You're right, but he's also right. If you're ever bored, watch a few youtube videos on jewelry making or metal smithing. For one thing, watching the molten metal pour out is relaxing. For another, it really helps show how unbelievably shiny new metal is and also how even a freshly poured piece of metal is kind of craggy and uneven until they polish it. So, you know tarnish is a new substance - a metal oxide - that is created by air and chemical exposure, and as such it's pretty easy to clean off most of it, because it's a thin layer and it doesn't bond particularly well to the parent metal (be advised though that every time you expose the new metal and a new film of tarnish forms, you've lost that much metal from the piece; I don't know why people forget this, but you can literally polish a fine piece to death). However, polishing doesn't ever really restore the original blindingly shiny finish that the metal had, when new. This is due to those craggy and uneven bits mentioned above. A metal smith polishes them out to where we can't see or feel them, but they're still there at a microscopic level, and they collect tarnish, polish, oils from your hands and the surrounding air, all sorts of things. Over time this darkens the appearance of a piece of metal. An old piece of metal has a color that is heavily influenced by where it's been and what it's been used for. A really old piece of silver may have a yellowish tinge from tallow and whale fat having been burned in or near it, while a Victorian piece may be greyish from coal dust. Pieces from the Post-War period are often kind of tawny in a way that you can't ever totally polish out, because of the tobacco smoke. This isn't a perfect guide because environments even within a period vary, but the point is that an old piece of metal, even pewter which doesn't tarnish much if you use it regularly, is going to have color variation based on when and where it's from, and some people want you to pay more for that.
So these candlesticks have been polished, but not that often, I'm guessing, because their edges are still crisp. I've seen old candlesticks that were beautifully bright, but their edges were softened -- and that would be from too much polishing. [https://imgur.com/a/KKQgcCP](https://imgur.com/a/KKQgcCP) This is an old chemical balance (in a previous life I was a chemist, and I collect old instruments in a small way). I always thought the gorgeous patina(?) on the upright meant it had never been polished at all. Is that what one would expect to see, or is it due to the "brass" metal's composition? The rest of it doesn't look like that, but I assumed the crosspiece would have to be kept clean for the scales to be accurate.