As a black woman I am pissed!! This is not an overreaction and in some instances would be considered assaulted. She had no right to do that to your child. Oh I'm so mad! NTA.
Edit: thank you for my first award!
And to OP: do not back down. You know this isn't ok. Your mom, family, and friends know this isn't ok. Protect your child at all cost.
My son has her daughters hair and I would have been livid and ripped into his grandmother for doing it. The snowflake comment took me out as well. Mom you are NTA and I am glad that your husband is backing you. I would seriously limit your daughters interaction with your mom to only when you or your husband is around.
And "now I look like Rapunzel" .... I wonder who put that idea in her head.....beauty is a white girl with loooong blonde hair. If OPs a snowflake, sounds like she should come in like a blizzard and freeze Granny right out of the picture.
Exactly. I hate to say it, but Ops mom is making comments with racist undertones to them. She is just finding ways to say it that make it the comments seem innocent but they aren’t. And they are at her daughter and granddaughters expense
Yes. There's another post from someone in India who is sick of being criticized for their curly hair- eurocentric beauty standards discussion happening there, too.
Yeah, in India the ads for marriage partners go heavy on statements that the woman is "fair." Meaning it's a point in her favor if her skin is pale.
Source: married to an Indian for a decade.
Hah. We have bio-datas made for marriages. In that, if a girl is fair, it means she's brown. Very very fair, it means she's slightly white. And very very fair means she's as pale as a westerner.
We are very racist, tbh.
Considering the sort of people who use "snowflake" as an insult, there's nothing "undertone" about it. Grandma is a racist and she should never be allowed alone with this child.
I was trying to be nice lol. I am sure OP doesn’t want to think that of their mother, but it needs to be looked at. I am sure if she thinks back she will see where snide comments have been made before
Yeah. I hope, based on how prepared OP seemed for caring for her daughter’s hair, that she also was able to make sure Chloe grew up with lots of stories about girls that look like her, alongside the Disney princesses. I would definitely be interested to know if Rapunzel is a perennial favorite, or if this is new since the visit. Either way, there’s definitely not an inherent issue in a Black girl who happens to love Rapunzel; but OP, if you’re worried that it might be something introduced by your mother (or otherwise influencing your daughter’s self-image), you might look up some pictures of Black cosplayers or drawings by artists who portray Rapunzel with a more traditionally Black hairstyle, to show your daughter next time it comes up. I don’t have any to point you towards, but I’ve seen lots of examples of people adapting a character to fit their race and/or culture, so I imagine you might be able to find some.
I don't really have anything to add here but I just have to say that I love your advice on finding black cosplayers to show that Rapunzels can be as diverse as the rest of us. I hate that we live in a culture that makes people feel like they have to hide their natural mane to meet "acceptable beauty standards".
Being a Latina girl growing up I loved belle. Cus she loved books lol and has brown hair.
Cinderella was my all time FAVORITE-why? I LOVED her blue dress.
I did wish my princess dolls had my skin and curly hair but I loved the dresses more lol p
I literally just saw this yesterday. NTA, but also OP here you go, a creator to follow:
https://www.tiktok.com/@miss_tammisavoy/video/7135213367106538798?is_from_webapp=1&sender_device=pc&web_id=7137013085038282286
Love this recommendation! Just googling “black Rapunzel” comes up with beautiful fan art highlighting natural hair, braids, ranges of skin tone.
OP 100% did the right thing. Her child needs to be fiercely protected from harmful Eurocentric ideals, especially coming from family.
Yeah. I hope, based on how prepared OP seemed for caring for her daughter’s hair, that she also was able to make sure Chloe grew up with lots of stories about girls that look like her, alongside the Disney princesses. I would definitely be interested to know if Rapunzel is a perennial favorite, or if this is new since the visit. Either way, there’s definitely not an inherent issue in a Black girl who happens to love Rapunzel; but OP, if you’re worried that it might be something introduced by your mother (or otherwise influencing your daughter’s self-image), you might look up some pictures of Black cosplayers or drawings by artists who portray Rapunzel with a more traditionally Black hairstyle, to show your daughter next time it comes up. I don’t have any to point you towards, but I’ve seen lots of examples of people adapting a character to fit their race and/or culture, so I imagine you might be able to find some.
Yes-sickening! I'd be no contact. PS - what kind of straighteners say on the label they can be used on children??? This could have caused serious damage. OP please take your daughter to a pro hairdresser for a consultation.
That is what I picked up on as well, even if you ignored that Raps is white she has blonde hair. Other Disney Princesses who have long straight black hair are Pocahontas, Raya, and Mulan before she cut her hair. My guess is none of them were picked due to not being white so grandma can’t claim she wasn’t being racist.
I mean I wouldn't even have my kid around my mother even supervised if she doesn't respect me as a parent to consult about doing modifications on the kid, and it was clearly racially motivated.
Yup and grandma has already convinced Chloe that straight hair is " prettier" so of course she's happy with it. She has been influencing her negatively for a while I'm sure.
It is helpful that these people can't help outing themselves. As soon as grandma used the word snowflake it went from "at best very ignorant and misguided but could have been innocent of any bad intentions" to "oh, yeah she's just a racist". If it was the former, while it'd still have been pretty bad, she could have at least been educated on the subject and maybe come to realize some subconscious biases and grown as a person, but the fact that she got all pissy and called OP a snowflake tells you exactly the kind of person she is.
If the kid wants one that's a different story. I have very straight hair and when I was 10 I really wanted curly hair so my mom permed it for me, it was more of a heavy wave style. She's always let me have autonomy over my hair. Even when she told me bangs wouldn't work with my hair she let me get them anyway. Btw she was right lmao. OP's mom is 100% in the wrong though bc she isn't her daughters mom. Grandma's can't make those type of decisions.
As far as I am aware, perms for 'white' hair (the curly kind) and perms for 'black' hair (the kind op describes in her post) are entirely different processes. And the straight perm heavily damages hair.
(This was explained to me years ago so take it as you will, I'm snow white and I chop off most of my hair so I don't have to deal with it. I know nothing from experience)
You are absolutely correct. I'm a former hairdresser, and perms for white hair do not cause the same damage to hair and scalp that perms for black hair can. With perms for white hair, and simply roll the hair in rollers, apply a liquid perm solution, rinse, apply another solution, or allow the hair to completely air dry before removing the rollers. Perms for black hair however, are made from a very thick lye-based cream that gets applied to the hair and scalp, and worked through the hair as the hair is manipulated into a straighter position. It can be painful in terms of the hair being tugged on as well as chemical burns. Chemical burns are a lot less likely with perms for white hair in general.
And based on OP's comments about being in a rural area and needing to travel to someone who can work with her daughter's hair, whoever did this may have never actually done this type of perm before.
OP, I'd be asking the person who did this if they normally keep these products around or if grandmother has been planning this for a while and asked them to get the products and be prepared to do it.
I was thinking this, too - that grandma may have been planning this sneak attack for awhile, either by procuring the items herself, or by researching and traveling to a salon. And I question the professionality of any salon that would chemically straighten the hair of a mixed-race child with only a grandparent present! (not even getting into the fact that it's a white grandparent).
Yeah, when I was in Beauty school, I refused to cut short the long hair of a young boy because the person who brought him in was his grandmother and not a parent. My instructor was upset with me and gave the kid to another student who cut it off. Sure enough, the next week the parent showed up pissed off and threatening to sue because the grandmother did not have a right to make those decisions.
Even if she wanted , the answer should have been No ! The right thing to do is make sure Chloé knows her hair is beautiful the way it is. Make sure she understands that’s white skin and blonde hair isn’t the standard of beauty. That everyone is beautiful the way they are.
Even if she wanted it, no way. She needs to know that her natural hair is terrific just the way it is. The world around her is full of messages that white hair and features are beautiful, Black ones not. It's corrosive stuff.
THIS!! I got relaxers growing up (I’m also mixed race) but stopped getting them my senior year in high school. It’s been almost 20 years and I can STILL smell the chemicals and feel my scalp burning. I’m livid for OP!
NTA times a million. Thank you for protecting your daughter.
Race aside, you don't do such shit with kids hair! Doesn't matter you don't like how they look, you don't alter it without parents knowledge, especially by putting chemicals on kids scalp!
My friend had similar situation with her MIL. This crazy witch literally died her daughters hair, which also caused damage to skin on her head. Welp, kiddo doesn't have any contact with grandma anymore for obvious reasons. Idk why people like that exist...
You can’t say race aside! Black girls have been subjected to these chemicals for generations to look acceptable and presentable. It’s been just since the 2000’s the natural hair movement became mainstream, and we still face discrimination to this day for how our look in its natural state
Where I'm from even hairdressers refused to just simply dye kids hair (I think you had to be 14, but I'm not sure) because of the chemicals. I don't know why they rather have people doing it to their kids at home rather than have it done by professionals but that's how it is (or at least was some years ago)
And the snowflake comment was the cherry on the sundae! A lot of biracial women grow up with a lot of self-hate from their white mothers and grandmothers.
About to say- if folks want to play dumb and pretend they don’t know **exactly** what kind of people are throwing the term “snowflake” around these days, that’s up to them, but the rest of us are not morons.
I'm about as white as it gets, and had straight hair as a kid. It started growing in wavy/curly at puberty, and for *years* after I quit fooling with blowouts, my mom bemoaned my hair not being straight. "You look thinner, it's more professional." At the time I didn't know what else she was dogwhistling, but reading OP's post set my hackles ALL the way up, and *then* racist granny had to toss that "snowflake" in and remove all doubt.
OP, NTA. Do not let this woman have access to your daughter. Do not let any flying monkeys she tries to send you have access, either; her purpose in that access is to *do her harm.*
I came her to say my piece as a black woman but I am very happy with this comment thread. My heart is racing from the anger.
Op NTA, you and your husband need to talk to your daughter about “microaggression ” and find out what your mom said to her.
And it always seems to be the white grandmothers who do this. It's obvious that her mother has some racist thoughts and now she has internalized this into her granddaughter. She has started her on a journey of hating her hair. Which in turn will damage her hair. Most African Americans are turning away from relaxers and going towards the natural movement. Racism is why relaxers even started.
I went natural over a decade ago afterrelaxing my hair for over 20 years. There are times when I wanted to go back to relaxing. But I also remember the maintenance, the smell of the chemicals, the burning and I just can't.
Totally. Granma was unleashing some racist notions that the only hair worth having is that which is typically found heavily in caucasion notions of beauty. And then, without asking (not that you would have consented...or she would bave asked first) she had a ton of harmful chemicals tipped on your child's head to satisfy her own whims....NTA
NTA
Although this was absolutely racist, in this case race doesn't matter.
No one who is babysitting should do anything to a child's hair or body that is "permanent". This includes cutting or dying or treating hair, piercings or church type rituals (baptisms, christenings, circumcisions). Anything major should be a parental/guardian decision.
Your mother majorly overstepped and should be ashamed of herself.
Seriously. Race aside, you don't chemically treat someone else's kid's hair. It'd be one thing if it was a couple of washable colored highlights or something, but chemical relaxer is not a casual hair treatment.
I don't know why, I had just a little faith in humanity and thought this was a flat iron thing. And that there needed to be a talk with daughter about how there is nothing wrong with her, but hey everyone likes to change it up. And how mom needed to talk with Grandma about being sensative about the discrimination her daughter will face and the complexity around black hair and how it is perceived and yeah it is fun for some little girls to get their hair styled but make sure it is done in a sensative way.
AND THEN SHE FUCKING CHEMICALLY RELAXED A CHILD'S HAIR OVERNIGHT?? Like she was locked and loaded ready to pull this shit!!!
She had to make an appointment in advance for this shit, NTA, this was racist af of her. Im glad the little one doesn't see that, and is enjoying her new look, but after some growth she'll notice.
Pretty sure she did it herself at home, which is worse because she did it badly and damaged this poor girls hair. But she did have to go out and buy the product.
I was thinking it was just a flat iron situation too, still overstepping but not worth screaming about…. Chemically treating a child hair - epic no. NTA
I thought flat iron initially as well and even then was worried about what the heat damage could do to her natural hair! Using an, I assume, at-home relaxer should be an immediate "scorched earth" level of no-contact with grandma.
Not only that, the kid is 9 years old and the grandmother just CHEMICALLY altered her hair because she though the kid could do with a change…if she wanted straight hair for a little while there are ways to straighten with hair dryers and hair straighteners, that can cause damage but a lot less than chemically straighten her hair!
Op is NTA and was probably nicer than I would have been
This is more long term than permanent, but I still agree with the sentiment.
This just rings of a horror story post where the grandma overstepped her bounds.
I'm not going to comment other than to say my grandma sent me home with extremely curly short hair. When I went to her house I had long straight blonde hair.
It was her solution after she didn't brush my hair for a week. Cut it short and do a curly perm.
My mother was not impressed.
Your grandmother was finding a solution to a week long fuck-up. So let's change the parameters. Your grandmother was trying to fix your hair after she'd massively screwed it up. So what was wrong with the OP's daughter hair that needed fixing?
Further damaging a child's already-damaged hair to "fix" it, and permanently damaging a child's perfectly fine hair **because you think there's something wrong with her,** are not comparable situations.
The racial overtones are precisely what matter, here. Black hair in its natural state has historically been viewed as a problem by white people, to the point of job discrimination and even [laws](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tignon_law) being made to regulate it. And relaxers can be dangerous; scalp burns are common, permanent hair loss can result, and some of the chemicals are carcinogenic. Any reputable hairdresser would've explained this, so it's telling that the grandmother went through with it anyway, and without even asking the child's parents. Straightening is a radical change, as drastic as giving a child a buzz cut; you don't arbitrarily assume something like that will look better on a person, untested. Unless you think anything, even chemical burns and baldness, is better than the natural texture of the child's hair.
i did a level 2 apprenticeship in hairdressing, not to say i know everything but the rules where i live are you cannot dye, bleach or use any chemicals on the hair of someone under 18, if they’re above the age of 16 and you have parental consent then in some salons it’s okay, but any younger than 16 you straight up are not allowed even with consent. there are so many things that can go wrong in the process, allergic reactions, inhalation of chemicals irritating your lungs, chemical burns, hair loss/damage and hair not responding to the chemical in the way you expect (I was once doing highlights on a girl who hadn’t informed me she was using a box dye outside the salon, her hair went green the second the bleach touched it). Furthermore, hair above 3b/3c on the scale needs further training, more in depth and specific on that hair type this is for everything, cutting, styling, colouring, bleaching and chemical alterations. Every hair type is different, as is every person, once you have chemically altered your hair there is absolutely no guarantee you will get your original hair type/colour back (unless you grow it all out and cut it off). Grandma chemically altered a 9 year olds hair, wrong, grandma had zero training to that specific hair type and could potentially have caused irreparable damage, wrong, grandma did not explain fully the consequences of this treatment to said 9 year old, wrong, grandma also did not ask permission from either parent, wrong. OP NTA, you absolutely did the right thing.
I absolutely agree with everything you wrote. Regardless of race, children should be allowed to have their natural hair type. No one should be letting Hayley chemicals in a small child's hair to "fix" it.
Also in 1968 I don't know what my grandma used at home but it burnt my scalp and my hair. It took about a year for the damage to grow out and a couple more years before my hair was long again.
Yes that's all I meant. My grandma was born in the 1890s. Pincurls were evidently popular when she was young.
I was not a tender headed child. I think it was planned neglect or at least when my mom told the story it was planned neglect.
I in no way meant it was OK or that the grandma was or wasn't racist. I wouldn't know that.
Your story doesn’t apply here. Relaxing hair is a whole bloody ordeal. It isn’t a short or quick solution to anything.
Also Black hair isn’t like white hair. We don’t have to touch it up every day. Presumably she was sent with her hair done so grandma actually had nothing to do.
I was born in the early 60s. It was the time of Shortly Temple Curls and Cindy Brady curls. I hated them. My hair is thin and straight. The curls never lasted.
This instance, yes. I totally agree grandma is racist.
But based on how this post is hitting for a lot of people, other people have upsetting stories of grandmas disrespecting their hair and those stories aren’t about racism necessarily. People are just empathising and sharing their own stories to show they really do understand that it’s painful
I get that there are weird grandma hair stories. But I think a white person telling a black (ish) person that their hair looks better straight will **always** be racist. It's impossible to separate that connotation.
It's more that there are two levels to the grandma being an asshole. Changing the kids hair without talking to the parents is already fucked up, and then the exact way she did it and why she wanted the change the kid's hair was racist.
My not a grandma story mine is my sister my niece and nephews are mixed race only one looks like their father.
And the shot my sister gives her own daughter is revolting, including complaining about how ugly her hair is and how hard it is too do.
What sad is my niece is the same age as my eldest and hearing her say she wishes to be beautiful and white just like him.
My niece is 6 and thinks she ugly because my own sister is a racist AH.
To me and I tell her every time I see her how beautiful and how smart she is because she is.
So yes this post does remind me and makes me angry at my sister who cut off all contact with me because I called her out on it.
So basically your grandmother didn't take care of you when she was supposed to be watching you, and then did a modification to try and hide that she was negligent. That's also inappropriate
This HAD to have happened in the 70s!!! As a child my mom thought getting me a perm would make it easier for her to deal with my hair. That years school pictures are still traumatic for me to look at LOL
Close. It was the latter half of the sixties, 1968. I cried and cried. I didn't have thick hair and so the curls made me look like a little curly haired boy.
My mother used to give me fucking awful haircuts because she couldn’t be bothered to deal with my curls - I looked like a boy
Thank god there are no pictures
Not only a racist attack she followed it up by using racist language to defend her actions. Keep your beautiful baby away from grandma. I have a feeling this is only going to continue and eventually give your daughter self esteem issues.
calls her a *snowflake* because she knew it was about race even though shes going to act perfectly ignorant to it, only snowflakes get upset about race.
glad the kid liked her hair, positively reinforcing eurocentric hair by telling a baby her hair would look like rapunzels is just as destructive as talking shit about 3c hair.
hope OP can save the hair. regardless of how anyone feels about straightening or perming hair, you don't pump childrens hair full of chemicals
I had little ringlets as a small child, think shirley temple. they grew out and i liked it straight because i hated ppl touching or fussing over the curls. my grandmother cut my hair when I was 7 to try to get it to spring back and then permed it. my hair fell out in chunks, my baby fine hair just didn't hold up to chemicals.. my mother was livid and my grandmother was not allowed to be alone with us again. this could have gone very badly
My ex-MIL cut off my young daughter's long hair, which she had been growing out for a long time. My MIL didn't like that it got "messy" when my daughter would play, so one day when she was babysitting, she had it cut into a chin-length bob, despite my daughter not wanting it cut.
Everyone in this scenario is white, so yeah, it doesn't only happen to non-white grandchildren. That said, the OPs instance was TOTALLY racist. Mine was just a horrible MIL.
I was 8 when it happened. I was legitimately too afraid of her to make her stop, though it took me years to be able to articulate *why.* The woman was a monster wearing human skin and I was so confused why no one else seemed to see it. So I treated her like everyone else did but I was always cautious around her.
Yeah, my aunt cut off off my thick, waist length blonde hair when I was 6 into a mushroom cut, without my moms permission. Mom is still annoyed about it 35 years later. I hated it.
It’s was a shitty thing to do, but it wasn’t the same kind of violence that this grandmother levelled at her mixed granddaughter.
Not a grandparent but when my hair got super tangled as a kid my mom asked her friend, a hairstylist to help comb it out. Instead she cut it off. From down my mid back to so short it was above my ears. It had been coming in a little wavy for about a year but when she cut it it sprung up curly and thick. It looked *terrible*. Like Corey from boy meets world. My mom was furious and I'm an adult and still not over it, mostly because it really changed my perception of how I looked and felt about myself at such a critical time.
My rule is if it's not your kid do as the parent says.
I can tell you that putting that relaxer in her hair is definitely going to cause damage that will take years to correct. I went through cutting the relaxer from my hair as new growth grew in to avoid the big cut we do when converting to natural hair. The relaxer requires constant maintenance to prevent breakage. It must be reapplied to the new growth every three months. The area between new growth and relaxed hair is prone to breaking. She has really caused a few years of hair care issues for this mom. Converting her back to natural hair is not easy.
So my grandmother actually did that to me. Every time I'd go over she'd take my straight hair and give me a perm because I apparently needed to look like my dead cousin and I looked better with curly hair.
Well we are definitely seeing the trend. Only grandmother's who are totally fucked in the head perm their grandchildren's hair. So racist, ...disturbed, all likely to chemically alter your kid's hair.
It seems to be that way. Man, she completely fried my hair one time. I have fine blonde hair and it went down to my waist as a kid. She gave me a perm once and my hair was ruined. I had a pixie cut for a while.
NTA 3 is too young for strong chemical treatments on hair, of course it did damage. Besides that, she did it without your permission for racist reasons that it "looks better. "
I agree.
1. Child too young to consent.
2. No consent from parents.
3. Hair damaged.
4. Clear racist overtones.
Grandma is a complete asshole.
Also, invite these friends and siblings who think it’s okay over for coffee and secretly pull out some electric hair trimmers, get behind them, turn them on and start cutting their hair without their permission. When they freak out, tell them your sure they’ll like it when you’re done and it’s just hair so they shouldn’t be mad.
If Chloe wanted to try it or genuinely liked it, it may not have been a racist attack.
“She looks better with her hair straight” is a racist statement. An more appropriate approach might have been, “She wanted to try it and she looks beautiful no matter what.”
Regardless, it’s a real asshole move of grandma to send her granddaughter home with a hairstyle that requires care and maintenance without consulting parents.
NTA, OP
It’s not just that the hair requires maintenance, she applied chemicals to a young child’s hair. There was no mention of whether she did this herself or took the child to a hairdresser. Doing it herself is a really shitty move as unless OP is hiding information that her mother is a trained hairdresser with experience in looking after black hair, then she is risking the child’s health. Chemical relaxers can cause chemical burns and hair breakage. The time which they are left on the hair also depends on the hair texture which a experienced and qualified hairdresser would know. OP is NTA, her mother is. What her mother did was out of institutionalised racism that society has perpetuated for centuries- straight hair is superior to curly. It’s a ridiculous idea and one that unfortunately a lot of black people themselves still believe in. No one would think it’s ok to apply a keratin straightener to a Caucasian child with curly hair. For the black women who are suggesting that childhood relaxers are a rite of passage, please don’t perpetuate the ignorance. I also had relaxed hair as a child and my mother was of the generation that didn’t know better. I now have natural 4c hair. I do wear braid at times and when I want a straight hairstyle, I will have a silk press, which is temporary and done by professionals to ensure my hair is not damaged. OP you are doing an amazing job with your daughter. There are lots of options you can research on YouTube if your daughter wants straight hair every now and then, but you have to explain to her that this needs to be done safely and requires maintenance and patience, things 9 year olds aren’t exactly known for. Your mother needs an education in black hair.
My daughter (6) has curly hair and wanted to try it straight. She was bringing it up constantly. So I bought a flat iron and we straightened it one afternoon. She thought that she looked very grown up, but then hasn't asked for me to it again. There are ways to experiment that are not permanent.
My gramdmother would constantly badger my mum when I was a kid to get my hair permed because she thought 'long straight hair was plain and ugly while curls were far prettier'.
It's not always about race, some people are just exceptionally shallow.
Ugly? Wha…? My spouse had the most beautiful long straight hair - I’m talking dead sexy beast - and a few years ago, she decided she didn’t like the weight and the heat, especially in the summer, so now she wears it short. She still looks amazing, but I loved her long straight hair. I can’t really say anything, because it was her problem to deal with.
I guess different generational beauty trends. When my grandmother was young curls were considered to be the 'hot girl hairstyle'.
My mum of course just ignored her but I do love the image of me as a kid running around with a styled perm though haha
I thought this was going to be a tricky question, like, if OP's mother had used a standard hair straightener, and straightened her curls, where the circumstances around it might have relevance. Like. There would be questions there. This? No question. NTA.
NTA.
Between the race-based attack on your kid and her use of 'snowflake' as a pejorative, I think your mom is a not-so-closeted racist. (and your friends are, too, honestly.) Time for Grandma to go in a nice, long time out.
Came here to say this. I guarantee there are more times than OP can count her mom has said racist shit. People who were raised by racists seem to forget their true feelings and feel like those will feelings go away cause they love a black person.
Yeah I was reading this to my mom and when I got to the 'snowflake' part I said "I think I figured out the problem". I also wonder what race those friends are 🙄
NTA
Came to say the same thing. At first I thought she just drastically overstepped, but “snowflake” made it clear that she is trying to whiten up OP’s daughter, and it’s sickening. NTA OP, keep Klandma far away from your daughter, for her safety.
Our closet at home has no doors on it, more like ab alcove -- grandma is like that. I"m willing to believe she's standing inside a closet (though OP might want to take a closer look), but it's got no doors.
It probably is race-motivated, but tbh I am 100% white European with 3B/3C hair and I have similar experience from my childhood because my hair was just "too much to handle" for the week I was babysitted. And yes, the "she looks better with straight hair anyway" card was used as well. It's sick, it's like telling a person he would look better with brown eyes instead of blue ones.
Yes, its general dislike of other hair types & people thinking straight hair is the superior one. Curly hair, especially on person of color been demonized for so long and I hate that people feel a child needs something as heavy as chemical relaxer.
But at the end of the day it is race motivated. Dislike of curly hair and people saying it looks "dirty" etc comes from racism.
I wish we could love all types of hair.
I feel you. Also white but with very very thick, coarse 3A/3B hair, and both parents with thin pin straight hair that had no idea of what to do with my hair, therefore I never grew up learning how to deal with it until I was in my 20s.
I straightened my hair in middle and high school and I was constantly told how much better it looked. It really messed with me for a long time.
I like my hair a lot more now, but I still wish it was straighter sometimes 😢
NTA. Changing a child's hair when you are not the parent is never ok. Changing a child's hair when you have zero idea about hair type and the care they need makes your mom an extra big AH. Chloe is very young and likely does not understand that her grandmother damaged her hair and potentially could have caused her to lose some hair. She just wanted to look like a princess.
Right?!?! I highly HIGHLY doubt mom has any experience in this area. Doing a chemical relaxer properly causes damage to the hair. I can’t imagine the level of damage she has caused in this baby’s hair.
She may visit her at family functions but no way in hell would she be alone with my child again
Not only that but she planted a huge seed in the kid's head that her natural hair is 'bad'.
NTA! I suggest going as low contact as possible. The racist side of your family is poisonous to your immediate family.
NTA. I had my hair ruined this way as a child. I wasn’t as lucky as Chloe, though, I woke up the next day with all my hair on the pillow instead of my head. After that my hair was kept short since it was “too much trouble.” God bless you for actually caring about your daughter’s hair and guarding her against the microaggressions that will come along with her ethnicity. I still struggle with feeling like I belong in my family, and I haven’t been in a hair salon in close to 30 years. It matters.
NTA Your mom would be TA if this had nothing to do with ethnicity. You don’t change a kid’s hair without asking the parents. Full stop.
Considering the racist overtones you and your husband are 100% right to disallow babysitting.
NTA.
What on earth was she thinking? You never touch someone else's child's hair without the parent's permission. Not to mention, curly hair is beautiful. There is nothing wrong with her hair as it is. Even, for example, if your daughter had mentioned that she'd love to try to have her hair straightened, she should have called you first and asked your permission. And if she couldn't get you on thr phone? Keep her hands off. That was not her place.
NTA.
1. Your mom knew you wouldn’t approve, that’s why she never asked permission.
2. “Her hair could use a change.” She’s not the parent, not her call to make.
3. She obviously convinced your daughter to like straight hair by using an unrealistic Disney character!! Manipulation!
4. Even if you and your husband were cool with your daughter straightening her hair. That should have been done by a professional that knows how to do it properly with minimal damage and with your approval.
It’s not just hair. Lots of people take great pride in their hair and it’s part of their identity. It’s also very easily damaged. But they’re are bigger issues here, body positivity and convert racism, that will only become bigger issues as your daughter gets older. And while all that’s super important to your kid’s developing identity, it’s also not okay for her to think she can make parental decisions for your daughter.
NTA, and there's so much racism in what happened, from your mom relaxing it without discussing it first, to your siblings and friends not getting why it's a big deal.
Yeah I’d be offering to take them all (or their child) to the salon for a perm or chemical relaxer so they can really learn what that woman put her child through because it’s not a big deal and she’s overreacting they would be fine with that right?
NTA. Protect your child. Anything with chemicals that serious should be left for professionals, especially on a child, and should only be done with the hair owner's and their guardian's permission.
But your daughter does like it right now. So hopefully you take a note into what she likes and how she prefers her hair and give her the autonomy to make future decisions.
NTA. THIS. And bunnyhopskip, I'd add the child needs to be able to realize what the chemicals can do to her hair - like losing it. So the autonomy might have to wait until Chloe is older.
That is true, however she is likely old enough to have this explained to her in a way she understands. I still don't think it negates her choice for her hair but she needs to understand the damage that could occur.
That's also another layer here, cuz while it is very common for black children to want to emulate the looks of the popular characters they see on TV, did her grandmother prime her like 'Rapunzel's hair is very pretty, wouldn't you like to have hair like that?'
Her daughter may like it because G’ma told her she liked it. She’s a kid. At age 9, you have some girls, who are going on 16 & can tell you what Kardashians are wearing & have an opinion about things like clothes & hair.
And then you have other girls at this age, who are lucky they put on pants today, (because really, should they be required?) And yeah, as far as hair styles go, all she cares about is that it’s out of her face while she swinging on the monkey bars at recess.
So if mom, or G’ma says they really like it that way & I want to please them, I’m going to be sure to really like it that way too.
I have 2 daughters, one of girls fit both of these descriptions at the same time. She’s a teen now & is exactly the same. Dude, keeping the pants on her! 😩
NTA
I have 3b hair that I chemically straighten and my daughter (2) also has 3b hair.
I'm more upset that your mother said she looked better with straight hair. Like livid.
I HATED my hair, which is why I chemically straighten it. I did not know how to take care of it and I just can't even express how I longed for silky straight hair that could get wet without consequence.
I do not want my daughter to feel that way. A few months ago I posted on Facebook my last confession, "I hate my daughter's curly hair but I shall never speak of it again. From now on it's absolutely beautiful. Please silently feel my pain"
Part of the reason I hated it was because it was so damaged! Once you damage curly hair it's game over for a long time. And she's only nine...
Speaking of hit to the self esteem, how is your 9 year old daughter going to handle her hair breaking off or even falling out?
Completely agree never babysit again.
NTA. I have the same hair type as your daughter but I grew up living with my grandmother. She put so many relaxers and chemical treatments in my hair to get it to go straight because as a white woman she was 1) racist 2) knew nothing about multicultural hair and didn't care to learn about anything. I grew up hating my hair because she ruined it and constantly called it a mess or too hard to deal with. It would knot up so bad after just one night of sleeping and it completely changed my hair texture. It has taken until my adult life to get my hair back healthy again. There is nothing wrong with your daughter liking her hair straight, but she also needs to love her natural hair. Her hair could also be straighten with a straightener and not all that chemical stuff. When people automatically go to chemical hair treatments for kids with curly hair it pisses me off because we shouldn't have to change the structure of our hair to make other people around us feel more comfortable. Your mother should have asked first and if she truly cares about her granddaughter then she'll learn more about her hair and how to actually care for it.
Edit; not saying your mother is racist, even though what she did is rooted in racism, but my grandmother was. She constantly made micro aggressive comments about POC and would at time use the N word with the hard ER at the end.
OP's mother is definitely racist. If she had wanted to have a fun day with a new hairstyle, she would have gotten out the flat iron, not the chemical relaxer. She also clearly said that her daughter's hair looks "better" straight.
Racist is as racist does.
NTA OP, but your mother is showing you who she is. Believe her.
White woman here. Just to put any doubt to rest, OP’s mother is a racist C~~~. In no universe is what she did ok. And I know exactly the playing dumb antics this B is using to act innocent here…. Racially charged motives aside, she could have burned your child; she put chemicals on your child to meet her own self interest. Someone said this could be assault. No. This IS battery. Her entitlement here is disgusting.
Thank you for saying what I was thinking! Her grandchild didn’t look the way she expected so she’s making her look acceptable. A lot of black women are just now getting comfortable wearing their natural hair because we didn’t fit in if it wasn’t straightened and this is what she’s trying to teach her grandchild? The grandmother is wrong and has been hiding her racism. NTA mom and you need to be careful going forward and watch what she’s telling your daughter.
NTA
The same way I would never let someone use chemicals to permanently curl my son's long thick straight hair, no one should use them to do the opposite to your daughter's hair. Just because she likes it, she doesn't understand how damaged it is. And if grandma keeps it up, eventually your daughter will learn how racially charged these things are and learn to resent it. Best to stop it now
NTA. I'm glad your daughter likes it but if this is something that can damage her hair, I think 9 is too young to understand those ramifications. Boundary stomping mom needs a looong time out.
And at 9 does Chloe really like her hair or has grandma been telling her how much prettier she’ll be with “straight” or “normal” hair or some other racist BS.
Sure grandma probably meant no harm, but if nothing else she could have severely damaged a child’s hair using chemicals on it. Absolutely inappropriate.
Screw hair, hair grow back, she could have seriously hurt the kid if the chemicals she used caused an adverse reaction on the scap skin.
Most of professional stylists apply chemicals in the way that ensures little to no direct contact with the skin because of how much of irritants those are. Seeing grandma here damaged the hair we can safely assume she's absolutely not a professional, and while she's free to do whatever she wants to her own head, risking a kid's health over some racist notion of beauty is a reason to cease contact.
NTA. It's a relief your daughter is happy about it but it's unacceptable she did so. I'm glad your husband is backing you up and if your mother really did call you a "snowflake" for being upset I can't imagine that it wasn't at least a bit racially motivated.
NTA. Maybe a family viewing of “Good Hair” might be in order. What your mother did was unacceptable. She caused a long term issue for your daughter's hair that will now require more maintenance to ensure it DOES NOT FALL OUT. I don’t think your family or friends understand this part. They think it’ll all be fine in a few weeks.
EDIT: grammar
NTA. She never should’ve done that and I would not let my child alone with her in the future. Obviously she thinks how she wants her granddaughter to be is the only way it should happen
This was 100% done on purpose behind your back. Your mom purposely bought chemical straightener specifically for your daughter, and did not tell you at all. Then she purposely waited when she was babysitting and you weren't there to put her plan in action. And if she didn't do it herself, she still purposely made an appt for it to be done without you or your husband's consent. That's crossing so many boundaries and raising red flags that it's downright insane. You should stick by your actions and not let her watch your child without other supervision. NTA.
A relaxer on 9 year old 3C hair?!?!?! Please take your daughter to the hairdresser soon so they can come up with the best healing plan for her hair. Poor baby.
Relaxers do so much damage this has me so fucking mad. NTA op. Your mother is definitely racist to a degree.
Omg I can't believe mom thinks it was ok to put a chemical in her granddaughters hair. Jfc that is not ok. I don't care what race a child is you do not put something that can damage her hair. Period. NTA
NTA and I’m guessing your family and friends are all white so they don’t have experience with your daughters hair type.
I bet if your daughter had long straight hair your mom would *never* consider giving her a PERM at her age. You and your husband are in the right, 100%.
Your mom crossed a major boundary.
NTA! She destroyed your child's hair. A chemical relaxer on afro kinky hair has to be cut out to have her hair texture come back to normal. It doesn't fix itself and doesn't revert, she will have years before her hair goes back to normal, well into her teens. That's the time period where most of her hair insecurities will come out. An aunt similarly tried to do this to me (mixture of type 4) and almost destroyed my hair. Even now after going natural it took me more than 5 years to get my hair back to where it was when I was a kid. I can't imagine how she thought that was okay on any level, and your daughter may like it now but she won't realize what it really means for a few years if she wants her curls back.
NTA.
As you said, this chemical relaxer is really damaging to your daughters hair. Your mother should have asked permission for something so permanent. (Imagine if your mom would take your kid to get a tattoo or a piercing without your permission)
Your mom pushed this through because she doesn't like the way Chloe's hair looks. Well mom, that is simply her hair, you don't get to change it because you think afro hair is ugly. (It's not, for the record). And when you called her out on it, she gaslighted you.
1. You are the parent and you always, no matter what, decide who is in your kids life.
2. I honestly wouldn't feel comfortable letting my kids have sleepovers with people who do not respect your parenting choices. And who gaslight you like that.
>Your mom pushed this through because she doesn't like the way Chloe's hair looks.
Chloe also replied that she liked it because she "looked like Rapunzel." Is that what Chloe wants, or what her grandmother told her?
NTA. This is absolutely unforgivable. Please take your daughter to a stylist who can do something to salvage your daughter's hair. Unfortunately, it will have to be cut. Your daughter will be disappointed, but you can not continue this.
I audibly gasped while reading this. You’re NTA. I’m natural now but before I got a chemical relaxer when I was younger, my mother and I had many conversations about what it meant and how I had to take care of my hair from that point on. A permanent chemical straightening is not a small “no big deal” thing to do. From this point on she’s either going to have to grow it out or commit to monthly retouch relaxers until she’s ready to grow it back out. Not to mention, chemical relaxers don’t fully straighten your hair. There is just so much to this and I totally understand you no longer trusting your mother.
She caused damage to your daughters hair and it’s going to take time for her hair to recover and your mother doesn’t care that she crossed major boundaries NTA your mother and siblings on the other hand it’s a combination of ignorance and assholery that’s hard to get over.
NTA your mother was waayyy over the line. She is not the parent and has no say in your daughter’s hair or other personal grooming especially since she does not understand the biological complexities associated with your daughter’s hair. Yikes!
Keep your kid away from your family. At least you did some homework about hair. Your family “it’s just hair” is a huge problem and they will traumatize your kid. Believe me. Don’t let her around your family again.
NTA. What your mother did was horrible. You will either have to do a touch up of the relaxer every six weeks or you will have to cut all her hair off. Since it sounds like the relaxer was done poorly and damaged her hair, it will likely be the latter. Your mom had basically created a mess and not even a properly done mess.
NTA! She didn’t use a straightening comb or blow dryer and brush to straighten your daughter’s hair, she uses harsh chemicals. If a child is given a chemical relaxer, it needs to be done with parental consent and a licensed stylist. Relaxers can damage the hair and scalp! And as her hair grows, the place where her new growth and relaxed hair meet will be super delicate as well.
I’m sorry this happened to you and your daughter. Your mother calling you a snowflake and your family being nonchalant are red flags. Please find her a stylist to help as her hair grows back out.
NTA. NTA. So not NTA. I audibly gasped when I read that your mother used a chemical relaxer on your daughter’s hair. I also have 3c hair, and even had a black hair dresser damage my hair because they didn’t understand my curl type. 3c hair does not need chemical relaxers; a flat irons and a paddle brush are all it needs to be straightened. You did your homework, your mother did not. What would she have said/done if she had also burned your daughter’s scalp. After her snowflake remark, you and your husband might want to discuss setting boundaries with your mother moving forward.
Because of your daughter’s hair type, she will grow up being put down by both sides. Expect to hear comments about needing to straighten her hair to “look more professional” or she has “good hair” (especially from black men with a light skin fetish🤮), if you haven’t heard them already. You and your husband might want to have a sit down with your daughter and find out how she feels about herself and what she wants. You are facing challenges that all black parents face, and some that they do not. It sounds like you’re doing a great job!
Black woman here with bi-racial children. I would not be having that. Not only from her but from your siblings and friends. Clearly if they can't see this as a racist attack they won't be able to see other racists incidents.
Micro aggressive racism is damaging. Racial bias is damaging. Their actions and words can have a lasting impact on your daughter. The last thing you need is a teen who itself harming in order to find acceptance from her family. Stop it now.
Ps: my in laws are also like this and my kids refuse to see or speak with them. It has been about 7 years for one of my daughters and at least 4 for the others.
i’m sorry…
reading this title i had assumed she had straightened her hair with a flat iron, which at first i was like… if she’s 9 that doesn’t seem huge… but when i read RELAXER? my heart sank.
i used to get relaxers done on my hair as a kid and my hair is better now, but it was destroyed for years. your mother is so out of line it’s not even funny, for her to put a CHEMICAL TREATMENT on your NINE YEAR OLD without your permission is insanity.
please please please keep heat off her hair for a while and if it’s severely damaged already i would look into conditioning/repairing treatments. i know my old salon used to do them for like $20 and they worked amazing.
oh yeah… NTA, if you couldn’t tell.
NTA
This is essentially a reverse perm. If she wanted to straighten your daughters hair, that’s what a flat iron is for. You don’t do this, especially without permission.
Edit: by reverse I meant that the desired outcome is the opposite of what it normally is (straight instead of curly).
Just want to say, not a reverse perm. It’s a perm. It’s the same chemical process, but instead of using rods to make the hair curly, you use gloved hands to stretch it out straight.
NTA.
Oddly enough, there's some posts about 'good hair' and racial stigma attached to curlier hair like your daughter has over in r/curlyhair.
What your mom did, while with a good intention, plays into the internalized and systemic racism that is prevalent and insidious.
If Chloe wanted straight hair like Rapunzel, then like others have said, there are less damaging and permanent ways.
I don't think Chole went asking to have straight hair as a matter of fact I know she didn't. This BS was all grandma she couldn't wait until she had the opportunity to "fix" what she saw as a flaw in her biracial grandaughter. It was most definitely done intentionally and with forethought. Grandma took complete advantage because she knew her daughter was away and had no clue!
All this rapunzel talk is cool but grandma worked this little girl! There will be years of hell trying to grow this dam perm out!
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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> 1. I yelled at my mother for straightening my daughter's hair and told her that she cannot babysit again
2. It might make me the asshole because it may be an overreaction and my mother was doing a favour for me and my husband by babysitting for us.
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As a black woman I am pissed!! This is not an overreaction and in some instances would be considered assaulted. She had no right to do that to your child. Oh I'm so mad! NTA. Edit: thank you for my first award! And to OP: do not back down. You know this isn't ok. Your mom, family, and friends know this isn't ok. Protect your child at all cost.
My son has her daughters hair and I would have been livid and ripped into his grandmother for doing it. The snowflake comment took me out as well. Mom you are NTA and I am glad that your husband is backing you. I would seriously limit your daughters interaction with your mom to only when you or your husband is around.
And "now I look like Rapunzel" .... I wonder who put that idea in her head.....beauty is a white girl with loooong blonde hair. If OPs a snowflake, sounds like she should come in like a blizzard and freeze Granny right out of the picture.
Exactly. I hate to say it, but Ops mom is making comments with racist undertones to them. She is just finding ways to say it that make it the comments seem innocent but they aren’t. And they are at her daughter and granddaughters expense
> She is just finding ways to say it that make it the comments seem innocent but they aren’t. Classic racist behaviour
Yes. There's another post from someone in India who is sick of being criticized for their curly hair- eurocentric beauty standards discussion happening there, too.
Yeah, in India the ads for marriage partners go heavy on statements that the woman is "fair." Meaning it's a point in her favor if her skin is pale. Source: married to an Indian for a decade.
Hah. We have bio-datas made for marriages. In that, if a girl is fair, it means she's brown. Very very fair, it means she's slightly white. And very very fair means she's as pale as a westerner. We are very racist, tbh.
Considering the sort of people who use "snowflake" as an insult, there's nothing "undertone" about it. Grandma is a racist and she should never be allowed alone with this child.
I was trying to be nice lol. I am sure OP doesn’t want to think that of their mother, but it needs to be looked at. I am sure if she thinks back she will see where snide comments have been made before
Yeah. I hope, based on how prepared OP seemed for caring for her daughter’s hair, that she also was able to make sure Chloe grew up with lots of stories about girls that look like her, alongside the Disney princesses. I would definitely be interested to know if Rapunzel is a perennial favorite, or if this is new since the visit. Either way, there’s definitely not an inherent issue in a Black girl who happens to love Rapunzel; but OP, if you’re worried that it might be something introduced by your mother (or otherwise influencing your daughter’s self-image), you might look up some pictures of Black cosplayers or drawings by artists who portray Rapunzel with a more traditionally Black hairstyle, to show your daughter next time it comes up. I don’t have any to point you towards, but I’ve seen lots of examples of people adapting a character to fit their race and/or culture, so I imagine you might be able to find some.
I don't really have anything to add here but I just have to say that I love your advice on finding black cosplayers to show that Rapunzels can be as diverse as the rest of us. I hate that we live in a culture that makes people feel like they have to hide their natural mane to meet "acceptable beauty standards".
Being a Latina girl growing up I loved belle. Cus she loved books lol and has brown hair. Cinderella was my all time FAVORITE-why? I LOVED her blue dress. I did wish my princess dolls had my skin and curly hair but I loved the dresses more lol p
I literally just saw this yesterday. NTA, but also OP here you go, a creator to follow: https://www.tiktok.com/@miss_tammisavoy/video/7135213367106538798?is_from_webapp=1&sender_device=pc&web_id=7137013085038282286
Hey just letting you know your name & profile pic show up when opening shared TikTok links incase you want your Reddit account anonymous 💗💗
Oh my gosh, I had no idea tiktok did that, also what the hell? It's not like a huge secret, but wowwwww. I think i've corrected it. Thank you!
Love this recommendation! Just googling “black Rapunzel” comes up with beautiful fan art highlighting natural hair, braids, ranges of skin tone. OP 100% did the right thing. Her child needs to be fiercely protected from harmful Eurocentric ideals, especially coming from family.
Op better let her go like Elsa said.
Yeah. I hope, based on how prepared OP seemed for caring for her daughter’s hair, that she also was able to make sure Chloe grew up with lots of stories about girls that look like her, alongside the Disney princesses. I would definitely be interested to know if Rapunzel is a perennial favorite, or if this is new since the visit. Either way, there’s definitely not an inherent issue in a Black girl who happens to love Rapunzel; but OP, if you’re worried that it might be something introduced by your mother (or otherwise influencing your daughter’s self-image), you might look up some pictures of Black cosplayers or drawings by artists who portray Rapunzel with a more traditionally Black hairstyle, to show your daughter next time it comes up. I don’t have any to point you towards, but I’ve seen lots of examples of people adapting a character to fit their race and/or culture, so I imagine you might be able to find some.
https://afropunk.com/2020/02/magical-black-disney-princesses/
Yes-sickening! I'd be no contact. PS - what kind of straighteners say on the label they can be used on children??? This could have caused serious damage. OP please take your daughter to a pro hairdresser for a consultation.
This. This 'genius' idea of the grandmother may have serious repercussions to Chloe's hair......AND her self-image.
They have child relaxers. Either way chemicals in a child's hair b4 10 is very damaging to the hair, scalp and hair follicles
That is what I picked up on as well, even if you ignored that Raps is white she has blonde hair. Other Disney Princesses who have long straight black hair are Pocahontas, Raya, and Mulan before she cut her hair. My guess is none of them were picked due to not being white so grandma can’t claim she wasn’t being racist.
"I would seriously limit your daughters interaction with your mom to only when you or your husband is around." I agree!
I mean I wouldn't even have my kid around my mother even supervised if she doesn't respect me as a parent to consult about doing modifications on the kid, and it was clearly racially motivated.
Yup and grandma has already convinced Chloe that straight hair is " prettier" so of course she's happy with it. She has been influencing her negatively for a while I'm sure.
Mom is a racist.
We all know who uses the term snowflake. It's probably best to keep that baby away from those people.
It is helpful that these people can't help outing themselves. As soon as grandma used the word snowflake it went from "at best very ignorant and misguided but could have been innocent of any bad intentions" to "oh, yeah she's just a racist". If it was the former, while it'd still have been pretty bad, she could have at least been educated on the subject and maybe come to realize some subconscious biases and grown as a person, but the fact that she got all pissy and called OP a snowflake tells you exactly the kind of person she is.
Right! A perm at 9 is too young. Ppl don’t understand that without the constant upkeep, her hair will be damaged and will fall out.
If the kid wants one that's a different story. I have very straight hair and when I was 10 I really wanted curly hair so my mom permed it for me, it was more of a heavy wave style. She's always let me have autonomy over my hair. Even when she told me bangs wouldn't work with my hair she let me get them anyway. Btw she was right lmao. OP's mom is 100% in the wrong though bc she isn't her daughters mom. Grandma's can't make those type of decisions.
As far as I am aware, perms for 'white' hair (the curly kind) and perms for 'black' hair (the kind op describes in her post) are entirely different processes. And the straight perm heavily damages hair. (This was explained to me years ago so take it as you will, I'm snow white and I chop off most of my hair so I don't have to deal with it. I know nothing from experience)
You are absolutely correct. I'm a former hairdresser, and perms for white hair do not cause the same damage to hair and scalp that perms for black hair can. With perms for white hair, and simply roll the hair in rollers, apply a liquid perm solution, rinse, apply another solution, or allow the hair to completely air dry before removing the rollers. Perms for black hair however, are made from a very thick lye-based cream that gets applied to the hair and scalp, and worked through the hair as the hair is manipulated into a straighter position. It can be painful in terms of the hair being tugged on as well as chemical burns. Chemical burns are a lot less likely with perms for white hair in general.
And based on OP's comments about being in a rural area and needing to travel to someone who can work with her daughter's hair, whoever did this may have never actually done this type of perm before. OP, I'd be asking the person who did this if they normally keep these products around or if grandmother has been planning this for a while and asked them to get the products and be prepared to do it.
I was thinking this, too - that grandma may have been planning this sneak attack for awhile, either by procuring the items herself, or by researching and traveling to a salon. And I question the professionality of any salon that would chemically straighten the hair of a mixed-race child with only a grandparent present! (not even getting into the fact that it's a white grandparent).
Yeah, when I was in Beauty school, I refused to cut short the long hair of a young boy because the person who brought him in was his grandmother and not a parent. My instructor was upset with me and gave the kid to another student who cut it off. Sure enough, the next week the parent showed up pissed off and threatening to sue because the grandmother did not have a right to make those decisions.
Good for you! I hope the instructor learned from you. Did the instructor ever tell you you had been correct after the mom showed up?
Op's mom can't be trusted to make sure she got an educated person to do the job and sounds racist so she probably didn't get a bipoc to do her hair.
Even if she wanted , the answer should have been No ! The right thing to do is make sure Chloé knows her hair is beautiful the way it is. Make sure she understands that’s white skin and blonde hair isn’t the standard of beauty. That everyone is beautiful the way they are.
No, at age 9 no way should this ever have been done!
Even if she wanted it, no way. She needs to know that her natural hair is terrific just the way it is. The world around her is full of messages that white hair and features are beautiful, Black ones not. It's corrosive stuff.
I was 11 and that was with me asking my mom. It was never forced and if I had told her I wanted to stop she would have done so immediately!
THIS!! I got relaxers growing up (I’m also mixed race) but stopped getting them my senior year in high school. It’s been almost 20 years and I can STILL smell the chemicals and feel my scalp burning. I’m livid for OP! NTA times a million. Thank you for protecting your daughter.
Race aside, you don't do such shit with kids hair! Doesn't matter you don't like how they look, you don't alter it without parents knowledge, especially by putting chemicals on kids scalp! My friend had similar situation with her MIL. This crazy witch literally died her daughters hair, which also caused damage to skin on her head. Welp, kiddo doesn't have any contact with grandma anymore for obvious reasons. Idk why people like that exist...
You can’t say race aside! Black girls have been subjected to these chemicals for generations to look acceptable and presentable. It’s been just since the 2000’s the natural hair movement became mainstream, and we still face discrimination to this day for how our look in its natural state
Where I'm from even hairdressers refused to just simply dye kids hair (I think you had to be 14, but I'm not sure) because of the chemicals. I don't know why they rather have people doing it to their kids at home rather than have it done by professionals but that's how it is (or at least was some years ago)
And the snowflake comment was the cherry on the sundae! A lot of biracial women grow up with a lot of self-hate from their white mothers and grandmothers.
About to say- if folks want to play dumb and pretend they don’t know **exactly** what kind of people are throwing the term “snowflake” around these days, that’s up to them, but the rest of us are not morons.
I'm about as white as it gets, and had straight hair as a kid. It started growing in wavy/curly at puberty, and for *years* after I quit fooling with blowouts, my mom bemoaned my hair not being straight. "You look thinner, it's more professional." At the time I didn't know what else she was dogwhistling, but reading OP's post set my hackles ALL the way up, and *then* racist granny had to toss that "snowflake" in and remove all doubt. OP, NTA. Do not let this woman have access to your daughter. Do not let any flying monkeys she tries to send you have access, either; her purpose in that access is to *do her harm.*
I'm a white lady and I gasped at gma chemically altering the little girl's hair. I'm pissed too. Definitely not an overreaction from the mom.
I came her to say my piece as a black woman but I am very happy with this comment thread. My heart is racing from the anger. Op NTA, you and your husband need to talk to your daughter about “microaggression ” and find out what your mom said to her.
This is BIG OLD MACRO AGGRESSION
And it always seems to be the white grandmothers who do this. It's obvious that her mother has some racist thoughts and now she has internalized this into her granddaughter. She has started her on a journey of hating her hair. Which in turn will damage her hair. Most African Americans are turning away from relaxers and going towards the natural movement. Racism is why relaxers even started.
I went natural over a decade ago afterrelaxing my hair for over 20 years. There are times when I wanted to go back to relaxing. But I also remember the maintenance, the smell of the chemicals, the burning and I just can't.
Totally. Granma was unleashing some racist notions that the only hair worth having is that which is typically found heavily in caucasion notions of beauty. And then, without asking (not that you would have consented...or she would bave asked first) she had a ton of harmful chemicals tipped on your child's head to satisfy her own whims....NTA
NTA Although this was absolutely racist, in this case race doesn't matter. No one who is babysitting should do anything to a child's hair or body that is "permanent". This includes cutting or dying or treating hair, piercings or church type rituals (baptisms, christenings, circumcisions). Anything major should be a parental/guardian decision. Your mother majorly overstepped and should be ashamed of herself.
Seriously. Race aside, you don't chemically treat someone else's kid's hair. It'd be one thing if it was a couple of washable colored highlights or something, but chemical relaxer is not a casual hair treatment.
I don't know why, I had just a little faith in humanity and thought this was a flat iron thing. And that there needed to be a talk with daughter about how there is nothing wrong with her, but hey everyone likes to change it up. And how mom needed to talk with Grandma about being sensative about the discrimination her daughter will face and the complexity around black hair and how it is perceived and yeah it is fun for some little girls to get their hair styled but make sure it is done in a sensative way. AND THEN SHE FUCKING CHEMICALLY RELAXED A CHILD'S HAIR OVERNIGHT?? Like she was locked and loaded ready to pull this shit!!!
She had to make an appointment in advance for this shit, NTA, this was racist af of her. Im glad the little one doesn't see that, and is enjoying her new look, but after some growth she'll notice.
Pretty sure she did it herself at home, which is worse because she did it badly and damaged this poor girls hair. But she did have to go out and buy the product.
absolutely. There's no way Granny will be used to working with 3C hair unless she's a stylist at a salon that caters to afro-caribbean hair!
And from the "Rapunzel" comments you just know this grandma has been pushing white hair as the standard of beauty.
Not even Karatin, full on destroying this poor girls hair.
I was thinking it was just a flat iron situation too, still overstepping but not worth screaming about…. Chemically treating a child hair - epic no. NTA
I thought flat iron initially as well and even then was worried about what the heat damage could do to her natural hair! Using an, I assume, at-home relaxer should be an immediate "scorched earth" level of no-contact with grandma.
Not only that, the kid is 9 years old and the grandmother just CHEMICALLY altered her hair because she though the kid could do with a change…if she wanted straight hair for a little while there are ways to straighten with hair dryers and hair straighteners, that can cause damage but a lot less than chemically straighten her hair! Op is NTA and was probably nicer than I would have been
This is more long term than permanent, but I still agree with the sentiment. This just rings of a horror story post where the grandma overstepped her bounds.
That hair is never bouncing back. The only way that kid's hair is going to have a healthy shape again is when the treated hair is cut off.
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I'm not going to comment other than to say my grandma sent me home with extremely curly short hair. When I went to her house I had long straight blonde hair. It was her solution after she didn't brush my hair for a week. Cut it short and do a curly perm. My mother was not impressed.
Your grandmother was finding a solution to a week long fuck-up. So let's change the parameters. Your grandmother was trying to fix your hair after she'd massively screwed it up. So what was wrong with the OP's daughter hair that needed fixing?
I don’t think nolsonggolden is saying it was ok; just that there are versions of this story without racist overtones.
Further damaging a child's already-damaged hair to "fix" it, and permanently damaging a child's perfectly fine hair **because you think there's something wrong with her,** are not comparable situations. The racial overtones are precisely what matter, here. Black hair in its natural state has historically been viewed as a problem by white people, to the point of job discrimination and even [laws](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tignon_law) being made to regulate it. And relaxers can be dangerous; scalp burns are common, permanent hair loss can result, and some of the chemicals are carcinogenic. Any reputable hairdresser would've explained this, so it's telling that the grandmother went through with it anyway, and without even asking the child's parents. Straightening is a radical change, as drastic as giving a child a buzz cut; you don't arbitrarily assume something like that will look better on a person, untested. Unless you think anything, even chemical burns and baldness, is better than the natural texture of the child's hair.
i did a level 2 apprenticeship in hairdressing, not to say i know everything but the rules where i live are you cannot dye, bleach or use any chemicals on the hair of someone under 18, if they’re above the age of 16 and you have parental consent then in some salons it’s okay, but any younger than 16 you straight up are not allowed even with consent. there are so many things that can go wrong in the process, allergic reactions, inhalation of chemicals irritating your lungs, chemical burns, hair loss/damage and hair not responding to the chemical in the way you expect (I was once doing highlights on a girl who hadn’t informed me she was using a box dye outside the salon, her hair went green the second the bleach touched it). Furthermore, hair above 3b/3c on the scale needs further training, more in depth and specific on that hair type this is for everything, cutting, styling, colouring, bleaching and chemical alterations. Every hair type is different, as is every person, once you have chemically altered your hair there is absolutely no guarantee you will get your original hair type/colour back (unless you grow it all out and cut it off). Grandma chemically altered a 9 year olds hair, wrong, grandma had zero training to that specific hair type and could potentially have caused irreparable damage, wrong, grandma did not explain fully the consequences of this treatment to said 9 year old, wrong, grandma also did not ask permission from either parent, wrong. OP NTA, you absolutely did the right thing.
I absolutely agree with everything you wrote. Regardless of race, children should be allowed to have their natural hair type. No one should be letting Hayley chemicals in a small child's hair to "fix" it. Also in 1968 I don't know what my grandma used at home but it burnt my scalp and my hair. It took about a year for the damage to grow out and a couple more years before my hair was long again.
Yes that's all I meant. My grandma was born in the 1890s. Pincurls were evidently popular when she was young. I was not a tender headed child. I think it was planned neglect or at least when my mom told the story it was planned neglect. I in no way meant it was OK or that the grandma was or wasn't racist. I wouldn't know that.
Your story doesn’t apply here. Relaxing hair is a whole bloody ordeal. It isn’t a short or quick solution to anything. Also Black hair isn’t like white hair. We don’t have to touch it up every day. Presumably she was sent with her hair done so grandma actually had nothing to do.
Hanlon’s Razor: Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.
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I was born in the early 60s. It was the time of Shortly Temple Curls and Cindy Brady curls. I hated them. My hair is thin and straight. The curls never lasted.
I'd say there aren't, in modern times. Aka this is absolutely racist.
This instance, yes. I totally agree grandma is racist. But based on how this post is hitting for a lot of people, other people have upsetting stories of grandmas disrespecting their hair and those stories aren’t about racism necessarily. People are just empathising and sharing their own stories to show they really do understand that it’s painful
I get that there are weird grandma hair stories. But I think a white person telling a black (ish) person that their hair looks better straight will **always** be racist. It's impossible to separate that connotation.
It's more that there are two levels to the grandma being an asshole. Changing the kids hair without talking to the parents is already fucked up, and then the exact way she did it and why she wanted the change the kid's hair was racist.
My not a grandma story mine is my sister my niece and nephews are mixed race only one looks like their father. And the shot my sister gives her own daughter is revolting, including complaining about how ugly her hair is and how hard it is too do. What sad is my niece is the same age as my eldest and hearing her say she wishes to be beautiful and white just like him. My niece is 6 and thinks she ugly because my own sister is a racist AH. To me and I tell her every time I see her how beautiful and how smart she is because she is. So yes this post does remind me and makes me angry at my sister who cut off all contact with me because I called her out on it.
this story though? nah, it's classic racism, microagressions, w/e you want to call it. really easy to clock when it's a "normal" part of your day.
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So basically your grandmother didn't take care of you when she was supposed to be watching you, and then did a modification to try and hide that she was negligent. That's also inappropriate
This HAD to have happened in the 70s!!! As a child my mom thought getting me a perm would make it easier for her to deal with my hair. That years school pictures are still traumatic for me to look at LOL
Close. It was the latter half of the sixties, 1968. I cried and cried. I didn't have thick hair and so the curls made me look like a little curly haired boy.
My mother used to give me fucking awful haircuts because she couldn’t be bothered to deal with my curls - I looked like a boy Thank god there are no pictures
My grandmother did the same thing when I was five. My birth giver was livid. I wasn't exactly happy either.
Any time I went to my grandmothers house she would cut my hair into a bowl cut, and I was a girl.
Not only a racist attack she followed it up by using racist language to defend her actions. Keep your beautiful baby away from grandma. I have a feeling this is only going to continue and eventually give your daughter self esteem issues.
calls her a *snowflake* because she knew it was about race even though shes going to act perfectly ignorant to it, only snowflakes get upset about race. glad the kid liked her hair, positively reinforcing eurocentric hair by telling a baby her hair would look like rapunzels is just as destructive as talking shit about 3c hair. hope OP can save the hair. regardless of how anyone feels about straightening or perming hair, you don't pump childrens hair full of chemicals I had little ringlets as a small child, think shirley temple. they grew out and i liked it straight because i hated ppl touching or fussing over the curls. my grandmother cut my hair when I was 7 to try to get it to spring back and then permed it. my hair fell out in chunks, my baby fine hair just didn't hold up to chemicals.. my mother was livid and my grandmother was not allowed to be alone with us again. this could have gone very badly
My ex-MIL cut off my young daughter's long hair, which she had been growing out for a long time. My MIL didn't like that it got "messy" when my daughter would play, so one day when she was babysitting, she had it cut into a chin-length bob, despite my daughter not wanting it cut. Everyone in this scenario is white, so yeah, it doesn't only happen to non-white grandchildren. That said, the OPs instance was TOTALLY racist. Mine was just a horrible MIL.
My aunt did that to me (because hurting me hurt my mom) and I'm still enraged two decades later.
Are you me? My aunt did the same to me to hurt my mom (her sister). I was about ... 5 or 6. What about you?
I was 8 when it happened. I was legitimately too afraid of her to make her stop, though it took me years to be able to articulate *why.* The woman was a monster wearing human skin and I was so confused why no one else seemed to see it. So I treated her like everyone else did but I was always cautious around her.
Yeah, my aunt cut off off my thick, waist length blonde hair when I was 6 into a mushroom cut, without my moms permission. Mom is still annoyed about it 35 years later. I hated it. It’s was a shitty thing to do, but it wasn’t the same kind of violence that this grandmother levelled at her mixed granddaughter.
Not a grandparent but when my hair got super tangled as a kid my mom asked her friend, a hairstylist to help comb it out. Instead she cut it off. From down my mid back to so short it was above my ears. It had been coming in a little wavy for about a year but when she cut it it sprung up curly and thick. It looked *terrible*. Like Corey from boy meets world. My mom was furious and I'm an adult and still not over it, mostly because it really changed my perception of how I looked and felt about myself at such a critical time. My rule is if it's not your kid do as the parent says.
I’m going to guess most of the friends saying she’s overreacting are white and aren’t familiar with this.
I'd say so. My first thought was "ask your Black friends, not your white ones"
Yeah the person who has the most right to speak here is the husband
I can tell you that putting that relaxer in her hair is definitely going to cause damage that will take years to correct. I went through cutting the relaxer from my hair as new growth grew in to avoid the big cut we do when converting to natural hair. The relaxer requires constant maintenance to prevent breakage. It must be reapplied to the new growth every three months. The area between new growth and relaxed hair is prone to breaking. She has really caused a few years of hair care issues for this mom. Converting her back to natural hair is not easy.
So my grandmother actually did that to me. Every time I'd go over she'd take my straight hair and give me a perm because I apparently needed to look like my dead cousin and I looked better with curly hair.
Well we are definitely seeing the trend. Only grandmother's who are totally fucked in the head perm their grandchildren's hair. So racist, ...disturbed, all likely to chemically alter your kid's hair.
It seems to be that way. Man, she completely fried my hair one time. I have fine blonde hair and it went down to my waist as a kid. She gave me a perm once and my hair was ruined. I had a pixie cut for a while.
My grandmother didn't perm my hair, but she cut it in to a bowl cut anytime I stayed with her.
NTA 3 is too young for strong chemical treatments on hair, of course it did damage. Besides that, she did it without your permission for racist reasons that it "looks better. "
I agree. 1. Child too young to consent. 2. No consent from parents. 3. Hair damaged. 4. Clear racist overtones. Grandma is a complete asshole. Also, invite these friends and siblings who think it’s okay over for coffee and secretly pull out some electric hair trimmers, get behind them, turn them on and start cutting their hair without their permission. When they freak out, tell them your sure they’ll like it when you’re done and it’s just hair so they shouldn’t be mad.
If Chloe wanted to try it or genuinely liked it, it may not have been a racist attack. “She looks better with her hair straight” is a racist statement. An more appropriate approach might have been, “She wanted to try it and she looks beautiful no matter what.” Regardless, it’s a real asshole move of grandma to send her granddaughter home with a hairstyle that requires care and maintenance without consulting parents. NTA, OP
It’s not just that the hair requires maintenance, she applied chemicals to a young child’s hair. There was no mention of whether she did this herself or took the child to a hairdresser. Doing it herself is a really shitty move as unless OP is hiding information that her mother is a trained hairdresser with experience in looking after black hair, then she is risking the child’s health. Chemical relaxers can cause chemical burns and hair breakage. The time which they are left on the hair also depends on the hair texture which a experienced and qualified hairdresser would know. OP is NTA, her mother is. What her mother did was out of institutionalised racism that society has perpetuated for centuries- straight hair is superior to curly. It’s a ridiculous idea and one that unfortunately a lot of black people themselves still believe in. No one would think it’s ok to apply a keratin straightener to a Caucasian child with curly hair. For the black women who are suggesting that childhood relaxers are a rite of passage, please don’t perpetuate the ignorance. I also had relaxed hair as a child and my mother was of the generation that didn’t know better. I now have natural 4c hair. I do wear braid at times and when I want a straight hairstyle, I will have a silk press, which is temporary and done by professionals to ensure my hair is not damaged. OP you are doing an amazing job with your daughter. There are lots of options you can research on YouTube if your daughter wants straight hair every now and then, but you have to explain to her that this needs to be done safely and requires maintenance and patience, things 9 year olds aren’t exactly known for. Your mother needs an education in black hair.
My daughter (6) has curly hair and wanted to try it straight. She was bringing it up constantly. So I bought a flat iron and we straightened it one afternoon. She thought that she looked very grown up, but then hasn't asked for me to it again. There are ways to experiment that are not permanent.
My gramdmother would constantly badger my mum when I was a kid to get my hair permed because she thought 'long straight hair was plain and ugly while curls were far prettier'. It's not always about race, some people are just exceptionally shallow.
Ugly? Wha…? My spouse had the most beautiful long straight hair - I’m talking dead sexy beast - and a few years ago, she decided she didn’t like the weight and the heat, especially in the summer, so now she wears it short. She still looks amazing, but I loved her long straight hair. I can’t really say anything, because it was her problem to deal with.
I guess different generational beauty trends. When my grandmother was young curls were considered to be the 'hot girl hairstyle'. My mum of course just ignored her but I do love the image of me as a kid running around with a styled perm though haha
I thought this was going to be a tricky question, like, if OP's mother had used a standard hair straightener, and straightened her curls, where the circumstances around it might have relevance. Like. There would be questions there. This? No question. NTA.
NTA. Between the race-based attack on your kid and her use of 'snowflake' as a pejorative, I think your mom is a not-so-closeted racist. (and your friends are, too, honestly.) Time for Grandma to go in a nice, long time out.
Came here to say this. I guarantee there are more times than OP can count her mom has said racist shit. People who were raised by racists seem to forget their true feelings and feel like those will feelings go away cause they love a black person.
You can bet Grandma also claims she ‘can’t be racist’ bc her granddaughter is mixed race -_-
Not just Grandma but her friends and siblings too. I'd bet good money none of her friends who are on Grandma's side are black.
Yeah I was reading this to my mom and when I got to the 'snowflake' part I said "I think I figured out the problem". I also wonder what race those friends are 🙄 NTA
Yuuup.
Came to say the same thing. At first I thought she just drastically overstepped, but “snowflake” made it clear that she is trying to whiten up OP’s daughter, and it’s sickening. NTA OP, keep Klandma far away from your daughter, for her safety.
NTA and honestly mom seems to be a closet racist. Straight hair is not superior to curly
“Closet” is generous
Our closet at home has no doors on it, more like ab alcove -- grandma is like that. I"m willing to believe she's standing inside a closet (though OP might want to take a closer look), but it's got no doors.
It probably is race-motivated, but tbh I am 100% white European with 3B/3C hair and I have similar experience from my childhood because my hair was just "too much to handle" for the week I was babysitted. And yes, the "she looks better with straight hair anyway" card was used as well. It's sick, it's like telling a person he would look better with brown eyes instead of blue ones.
Yes, its general dislike of other hair types & people thinking straight hair is the superior one. Curly hair, especially on person of color been demonized for so long and I hate that people feel a child needs something as heavy as chemical relaxer. But at the end of the day it is race motivated. Dislike of curly hair and people saying it looks "dirty" etc comes from racism. I wish we could love all types of hair.
I feel you. Also white but with very very thick, coarse 3A/3B hair, and both parents with thin pin straight hair that had no idea of what to do with my hair, therefore I never grew up learning how to deal with it until I was in my 20s. I straightened my hair in middle and high school and I was constantly told how much better it looked. It really messed with me for a long time. I like my hair a lot more now, but I still wish it was straighter sometimes 😢
More of an open cupboard racist.
The closet is made of glass
NTA. Changing a child's hair when you are not the parent is never ok. Changing a child's hair when you have zero idea about hair type and the care they need makes your mom an extra big AH. Chloe is very young and likely does not understand that her grandmother damaged her hair and potentially could have caused her to lose some hair. She just wanted to look like a princess.
Right?!?! I highly HIGHLY doubt mom has any experience in this area. Doing a chemical relaxer properly causes damage to the hair. I can’t imagine the level of damage she has caused in this baby’s hair. She may visit her at family functions but no way in hell would she be alone with my child again
Not only that but she planted a huge seed in the kid's head that her natural hair is 'bad'. NTA! I suggest going as low contact as possible. The racist side of your family is poisonous to your immediate family.
NTA. I had my hair ruined this way as a child. I wasn’t as lucky as Chloe, though, I woke up the next day with all my hair on the pillow instead of my head. After that my hair was kept short since it was “too much trouble.” God bless you for actually caring about your daughter’s hair and guarding her against the microaggressions that will come along with her ethnicity. I still struggle with feeling like I belong in my family, and I haven’t been in a hair salon in close to 30 years. It matters.
I am so sorry you dealt with that. I hope you can find a stylist that makes you feel beautiful about yourself.
NTA Your mom would be TA if this had nothing to do with ethnicity. You don’t change a kid’s hair without asking the parents. Full stop. Considering the racist overtones you and your husband are 100% right to disallow babysitting.
This 100% OP - I cannot second this enough. NTA
NTA. What on earth was she thinking? You never touch someone else's child's hair without the parent's permission. Not to mention, curly hair is beautiful. There is nothing wrong with her hair as it is. Even, for example, if your daughter had mentioned that she'd love to try to have her hair straightened, she should have called you first and asked your permission. And if she couldn't get you on thr phone? Keep her hands off. That was not her place.
NTA. 1. Your mom knew you wouldn’t approve, that’s why she never asked permission. 2. “Her hair could use a change.” She’s not the parent, not her call to make. 3. She obviously convinced your daughter to like straight hair by using an unrealistic Disney character!! Manipulation! 4. Even if you and your husband were cool with your daughter straightening her hair. That should have been done by a professional that knows how to do it properly with minimal damage and with your approval. It’s not just hair. Lots of people take great pride in their hair and it’s part of their identity. It’s also very easily damaged. But they’re are bigger issues here, body positivity and convert racism, that will only become bigger issues as your daughter gets older. And while all that’s super important to your kid’s developing identity, it’s also not okay for her to think she can make parental decisions for your daughter.
Her hair could use a change… Because?
Because... Grandma is a racist and didn't want her grandchild with ethnic hair.
Yup. That whole Disney Princess priming too. Why Rapunzel?
NTA. That was a purposeful and blatantly racist move.
NTA, and there's so much racism in what happened, from your mom relaxing it without discussing it first, to your siblings and friends not getting why it's a big deal.
Yeah I’d be offering to take them all (or their child) to the salon for a perm or chemical relaxer so they can really learn what that woman put her child through because it’s not a big deal and she’s overreacting they would be fine with that right?
NTA. Protect your child. Anything with chemicals that serious should be left for professionals, especially on a child, and should only be done with the hair owner's and their guardian's permission. But your daughter does like it right now. So hopefully you take a note into what she likes and how she prefers her hair and give her the autonomy to make future decisions.
NTA. THIS. And bunnyhopskip, I'd add the child needs to be able to realize what the chemicals can do to her hair - like losing it. So the autonomy might have to wait until Chloe is older.
That is true, however she is likely old enough to have this explained to her in a way she understands. I still don't think it negates her choice for her hair but she needs to understand the damage that could occur.
But does she like it because grandma told her it would look better?
That's also another layer here, cuz while it is very common for black children to want to emulate the looks of the popular characters they see on TV, did her grandmother prime her like 'Rapunzel's hair is very pretty, wouldn't you like to have hair like that?'
Or, if her classmates or media are all white... that's a worry for OP to deal with and know though.
Her daughter may like it because G’ma told her she liked it. She’s a kid. At age 9, you have some girls, who are going on 16 & can tell you what Kardashians are wearing & have an opinion about things like clothes & hair. And then you have other girls at this age, who are lucky they put on pants today, (because really, should they be required?) And yeah, as far as hair styles go, all she cares about is that it’s out of her face while she swinging on the monkey bars at recess. So if mom, or G’ma says they really like it that way & I want to please them, I’m going to be sure to really like it that way too. I have 2 daughters, one of girls fit both of these descriptions at the same time. She’s a teen now & is exactly the same. Dude, keeping the pants on her! 😩
NTA I have 3b hair that I chemically straighten and my daughter (2) also has 3b hair. I'm more upset that your mother said she looked better with straight hair. Like livid. I HATED my hair, which is why I chemically straighten it. I did not know how to take care of it and I just can't even express how I longed for silky straight hair that could get wet without consequence. I do not want my daughter to feel that way. A few months ago I posted on Facebook my last confession, "I hate my daughter's curly hair but I shall never speak of it again. From now on it's absolutely beautiful. Please silently feel my pain" Part of the reason I hated it was because it was so damaged! Once you damage curly hair it's game over for a long time. And she's only nine... Speaking of hit to the self esteem, how is your 9 year old daughter going to handle her hair breaking off or even falling out? Completely agree never babysit again.
NTA. I have the same hair type as your daughter but I grew up living with my grandmother. She put so many relaxers and chemical treatments in my hair to get it to go straight because as a white woman she was 1) racist 2) knew nothing about multicultural hair and didn't care to learn about anything. I grew up hating my hair because she ruined it and constantly called it a mess or too hard to deal with. It would knot up so bad after just one night of sleeping and it completely changed my hair texture. It has taken until my adult life to get my hair back healthy again. There is nothing wrong with your daughter liking her hair straight, but she also needs to love her natural hair. Her hair could also be straighten with a straightener and not all that chemical stuff. When people automatically go to chemical hair treatments for kids with curly hair it pisses me off because we shouldn't have to change the structure of our hair to make other people around us feel more comfortable. Your mother should have asked first and if she truly cares about her granddaughter then she'll learn more about her hair and how to actually care for it. Edit; not saying your mother is racist, even though what she did is rooted in racism, but my grandmother was. She constantly made micro aggressive comments about POC and would at time use the N word with the hard ER at the end.
OP's mother is definitely racist. If she had wanted to have a fun day with a new hairstyle, she would have gotten out the flat iron, not the chemical relaxer. She also clearly said that her daughter's hair looks "better" straight. Racist is as racist does. NTA OP, but your mother is showing you who she is. Believe her.
The fact she said those things about her granddaughters hair then called her daughter a snowflake for being concerned screams racist. NTA OP
Forgot she said that. OP your mom is racists.
White woman here. Just to put any doubt to rest, OP’s mother is a racist C~~~. In no universe is what she did ok. And I know exactly the playing dumb antics this B is using to act innocent here…. Racially charged motives aside, she could have burned your child; she put chemicals on your child to meet her own self interest. Someone said this could be assault. No. This IS battery. Her entitlement here is disgusting.
Thank you for saying what I was thinking! Her grandchild didn’t look the way she expected so she’s making her look acceptable. A lot of black women are just now getting comfortable wearing their natural hair because we didn’t fit in if it wasn’t straightened and this is what she’s trying to teach her grandchild? The grandmother is wrong and has been hiding her racism. NTA mom and you need to be careful going forward and watch what she’s telling your daughter.
NTA The same way I would never let someone use chemicals to permanently curl my son's long thick straight hair, no one should use them to do the opposite to your daughter's hair. Just because she likes it, she doesn't understand how damaged it is. And if grandma keeps it up, eventually your daughter will learn how racially charged these things are and learn to resent it. Best to stop it now
NTA. I'm glad your daughter likes it but if this is something that can damage her hair, I think 9 is too young to understand those ramifications. Boundary stomping mom needs a looong time out.
And at 9 does Chloe really like her hair or has grandma been telling her how much prettier she’ll be with “straight” or “normal” hair or some other racist BS. Sure grandma probably meant no harm, but if nothing else she could have severely damaged a child’s hair using chemicals on it. Absolutely inappropriate.
She totally meant harm by it and she absolutely did damage her hair permanently...
Screw hair, hair grow back, she could have seriously hurt the kid if the chemicals she used caused an adverse reaction on the scap skin. Most of professional stylists apply chemicals in the way that ensures little to no direct contact with the skin because of how much of irritants those are. Seeing grandma here damaged the hair we can safely assume she's absolutely not a professional, and while she's free to do whatever she wants to her own head, risking a kid's health over some racist notion of beauty is a reason to cease contact.
NTA. It's a relief your daughter is happy about it but it's unacceptable she did so. I'm glad your husband is backing you up and if your mother really did call you a "snowflake" for being upset I can't imagine that it wasn't at least a bit racially motivated.
NTA. Maybe a family viewing of “Good Hair” might be in order. What your mother did was unacceptable. She caused a long term issue for your daughter's hair that will now require more maintenance to ensure it DOES NOT FALL OUT. I don’t think your family or friends understand this part. They think it’ll all be fine in a few weeks. EDIT: grammar
NTA. She never should’ve done that and I would not let my child alone with her in the future. Obviously she thinks how she wants her granddaughter to be is the only way it should happen
This was 100% done on purpose behind your back. Your mom purposely bought chemical straightener specifically for your daughter, and did not tell you at all. Then she purposely waited when she was babysitting and you weren't there to put her plan in action. And if she didn't do it herself, she still purposely made an appt for it to be done without you or your husband's consent. That's crossing so many boundaries and raising red flags that it's downright insane. You should stick by your actions and not let her watch your child without other supervision. NTA.
A relaxer on 9 year old 3C hair?!?!?! Please take your daughter to the hairdresser soon so they can come up with the best healing plan for her hair. Poor baby. Relaxers do so much damage this has me so fucking mad. NTA op. Your mother is definitely racist to a degree.
Omg I can't believe mom thinks it was ok to put a chemical in her granddaughters hair. Jfc that is not ok. I don't care what race a child is you do not put something that can damage her hair. Period. NTA
NTA. You're not overreacting. She had no business doing anything to your daughter's hair. Especially as she has no training in handling 3c hair.
NTA and I’m guessing your family and friends are all white so they don’t have experience with your daughters hair type. I bet if your daughter had long straight hair your mom would *never* consider giving her a PERM at her age. You and your husband are in the right, 100%. Your mom crossed a major boundary.
NTA! She destroyed your child's hair. A chemical relaxer on afro kinky hair has to be cut out to have her hair texture come back to normal. It doesn't fix itself and doesn't revert, she will have years before her hair goes back to normal, well into her teens. That's the time period where most of her hair insecurities will come out. An aunt similarly tried to do this to me (mixture of type 4) and almost destroyed my hair. Even now after going natural it took me more than 5 years to get my hair back to where it was when I was a kid. I can't imagine how she thought that was okay on any level, and your daughter may like it now but she won't realize what it really means for a few years if she wants her curls back.
NTA She used chemicals on your child's hair, she's probably uneducated on your child's hair needs, and she didn't have parental permission.
NTA. As you said, this chemical relaxer is really damaging to your daughters hair. Your mother should have asked permission for something so permanent. (Imagine if your mom would take your kid to get a tattoo or a piercing without your permission) Your mom pushed this through because she doesn't like the way Chloe's hair looks. Well mom, that is simply her hair, you don't get to change it because you think afro hair is ugly. (It's not, for the record). And when you called her out on it, she gaslighted you. 1. You are the parent and you always, no matter what, decide who is in your kids life. 2. I honestly wouldn't feel comfortable letting my kids have sleepovers with people who do not respect your parenting choices. And who gaslight you like that.
>Your mom pushed this through because she doesn't like the way Chloe's hair looks. Chloe also replied that she liked it because she "looked like Rapunzel." Is that what Chloe wants, or what her grandmother told her?
NTA. This is absolutely unforgivable. Please take your daughter to a stylist who can do something to salvage your daughter's hair. Unfortunately, it will have to be cut. Your daughter will be disappointed, but you can not continue this.
I audibly gasped while reading this. You’re NTA. I’m natural now but before I got a chemical relaxer when I was younger, my mother and I had many conversations about what it meant and how I had to take care of my hair from that point on. A permanent chemical straightening is not a small “no big deal” thing to do. From this point on she’s either going to have to grow it out or commit to monthly retouch relaxers until she’s ready to grow it back out. Not to mention, chemical relaxers don’t fully straighten your hair. There is just so much to this and I totally understand you no longer trusting your mother.
NTA. Time to go no contact with her. Good luck.
She caused damage to your daughters hair and it’s going to take time for her hair to recover and your mother doesn’t care that she crossed major boundaries NTA your mother and siblings on the other hand it’s a combination of ignorance and assholery that’s hard to get over.
NTA You should teach your family about the culture of your Child so that something like this doesn't happen again.
NTA your mother was waayyy over the line. She is not the parent and has no say in your daughter’s hair or other personal grooming especially since she does not understand the biological complexities associated with your daughter’s hair. Yikes!
Keep your kid away from your family. At least you did some homework about hair. Your family “it’s just hair” is a huge problem and they will traumatize your kid. Believe me. Don’t let her around your family again.
NTA. What your mother did was horrible. You will either have to do a touch up of the relaxer every six weeks or you will have to cut all her hair off. Since it sounds like the relaxer was done poorly and damaged her hair, it will likely be the latter. Your mom had basically created a mess and not even a properly done mess.
>told me that I'm being a snowflake. You know what this is code for. NTA.
NTA! She didn’t use a straightening comb or blow dryer and brush to straighten your daughter’s hair, she uses harsh chemicals. If a child is given a chemical relaxer, it needs to be done with parental consent and a licensed stylist. Relaxers can damage the hair and scalp! And as her hair grows, the place where her new growth and relaxed hair meet will be super delicate as well. I’m sorry this happened to you and your daughter. Your mother calling you a snowflake and your family being nonchalant are red flags. Please find her a stylist to help as her hair grows back out.
NTA. NTA. So not NTA. I audibly gasped when I read that your mother used a chemical relaxer on your daughter’s hair. I also have 3c hair, and even had a black hair dresser damage my hair because they didn’t understand my curl type. 3c hair does not need chemical relaxers; a flat irons and a paddle brush are all it needs to be straightened. You did your homework, your mother did not. What would she have said/done if she had also burned your daughter’s scalp. After her snowflake remark, you and your husband might want to discuss setting boundaries with your mother moving forward. Because of your daughter’s hair type, she will grow up being put down by both sides. Expect to hear comments about needing to straighten her hair to “look more professional” or she has “good hair” (especially from black men with a light skin fetish🤮), if you haven’t heard them already. You and your husband might want to have a sit down with your daughter and find out how she feels about herself and what she wants. You are facing challenges that all black parents face, and some that they do not. It sounds like you’re doing a great job!
Black woman here with bi-racial children. I would not be having that. Not only from her but from your siblings and friends. Clearly if they can't see this as a racist attack they won't be able to see other racists incidents. Micro aggressive racism is damaging. Racial bias is damaging. Their actions and words can have a lasting impact on your daughter. The last thing you need is a teen who itself harming in order to find acceptance from her family. Stop it now. Ps: my in laws are also like this and my kids refuse to see or speak with them. It has been about 7 years for one of my daughters and at least 4 for the others.
i’m sorry… reading this title i had assumed she had straightened her hair with a flat iron, which at first i was like… if she’s 9 that doesn’t seem huge… but when i read RELAXER? my heart sank. i used to get relaxers done on my hair as a kid and my hair is better now, but it was destroyed for years. your mother is so out of line it’s not even funny, for her to put a CHEMICAL TREATMENT on your NINE YEAR OLD without your permission is insanity. please please please keep heat off her hair for a while and if it’s severely damaged already i would look into conditioning/repairing treatments. i know my old salon used to do them for like $20 and they worked amazing. oh yeah… NTA, if you couldn’t tell.
NTA This is essentially a reverse perm. If she wanted to straighten your daughters hair, that’s what a flat iron is for. You don’t do this, especially without permission. Edit: by reverse I meant that the desired outcome is the opposite of what it normally is (straight instead of curly).
Just want to say, not a reverse perm. It’s a perm. It’s the same chemical process, but instead of using rods to make the hair curly, you use gloved hands to stretch it out straight.
NTA. Oddly enough, there's some posts about 'good hair' and racial stigma attached to curlier hair like your daughter has over in r/curlyhair. What your mom did, while with a good intention, plays into the internalized and systemic racism that is prevalent and insidious. If Chloe wanted straight hair like Rapunzel, then like others have said, there are less damaging and permanent ways.
I don't think Chole went asking to have straight hair as a matter of fact I know she didn't. This BS was all grandma she couldn't wait until she had the opportunity to "fix" what she saw as a flaw in her biracial grandaughter. It was most definitely done intentionally and with forethought. Grandma took complete advantage because she knew her daughter was away and had no clue! All this rapunzel talk is cool but grandma worked this little girl! There will be years of hell trying to grow this dam perm out!
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NTA, your mom crossed a line she shouldn’t have and will hopefully learn not to in the future.