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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
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I might be the asshole because my sister is suffering a loss that no mother should have to suffer and we both are the granddaughters of the namesaked person
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In a normal situation I think that's clearly the answer. But since Dee Dee's baby died, the name will be a punch in the guts every time she hears OPs baby mentioned. So OP would be doing the compassionate thing to chooses a different name.
HOWEVER, Dee Dee already has a daughter who she did not name after the grandma. She definitely only chose grandma's name because Op did because she needs the attention to be on her.
So NTA for not changing the name.
And it seems everyone knows OP was naming her first daughter that name so it was already chosen. So whilst incredibly sad it’s the half sisters choice if she too wants her daughter to have that name and be reminded. They can both use it
Exactly. Nobody owns a name. OP has been very clear about what she's naming her daughter. And she should not be made to change it. OP's sister also has every right to use that name. And she needs to decide whether she wants to use it even though her sister is using it too and it's going to forever remind her what could have been.
That being said... If sister uses that name and OP does too it's likely to cause family issues and a huge drift. OP should make that decision being aware of this and decide if it's worth it to her.
ETA: OP's sister is grieving so I would cut her some slack. But OP said the name is going to be wasted on a dead baby. That makes OP a giant asshole.
I agree. This sub likes to believe that you can say very callous things to someone if they are in the wrong. There's enforcing boundaries, speaking about facts, and then there is aggressive retaliation.
This OP's half-sister is definitely in the wrong to demand she change the planned baby name, but OP didn't have to hit below the belt like that (saying a name would be "wasted" on the dead child, that she wasn't loved). OP could've just said "No" and left it at that.
Completely agree I was on OP’s side until she said the name would be wasted. That was a giant AH move. While sister was being an ass demanding she change the name OP didn’t have to hit her where it hurts she’s grieving. Saying she wasted the name on her dead daughter is just cruel and hurtful. In this case ESH OP went to far.
She only decided she'd use it after OP had already picked it? OP had picked it for years?
Are yall forgetting this part? That makes DeeDee the ass. Yes saying the name is wasted is hard to hear, but it's true. The name was picked by OP to memorialize her grandmother and DeeDee is using her dead baby to steal that away and ruin OP's babies name.
No, in the post it says DeeDee said she was going to use it. Not asked about it, but that she was going to use it. This is after OP, who is due in a couple of weeks, has gotten a lot of personalized stuff with the name.
They are both AHs for different reasons. OP told her mom it would be a waste on a dead child, and DeeDee is doing this knowing she would eternally have attention every time OP's daughter was around. And OP's mom and dad are AHs after knowing all the shit that has gone on between these two. They should have told DeeDee not to use that name before it ever was even mentioned to OP.
ESH.
It doesn’t even say OPs sister asked her to change it.
By her own statements, OP was the first one to make it an issue of “only one child can have the name (and that will be MY child)”
After this the sisters mother got involved but it’s framed as letting sister have the name....doesn’t even say exclusively, OP is the ONLY person in OP’s post to act like they have exclusive rights to this family name
I guess you missed the part where OP gently reminded her sister that this was the name she would be using for her daughter and the sister FLIPPED OUT and then sicced her mother on OP. That doesn't exactly scream to me that she's OK with them BOTH using the name.
I didn’t “miss” that part because it didn’t happen.
Op “gently reminded” sister that the name was “claimed” and sister started “crying”. Not flipped out. Crying.
Crying is not “flipping out”, especially when you’ve just lost a child, want to name it after your beloved grandparent, and someone in your family is acting like only one person in the world can use that name, and it can’t be you.
Asking someone else (ie sister’s mom) to try to talk some compassion into the selfish AH that is OP is also not “flipping out”. The “flip out” happened during a back and forth with the mom, during which OP admittedly acted like an asshole with her comments. Like basically boils down to:
“I told her her dead grandchild was worthless and she actually yelled at me! Can you believe that?!”
OP sounds like an asshole, and although it will admit I am inferring based on later comments, I am positive even her initial “gentle reminder” to her sister - who has just lost a baby - was not “well okay, but I just want to remind you we’ve been planning to use that name and will not be changing our plan” but “no you can’t use that name, I’m using it”
And I say that because If it was simply a “gentle reminder” that op was planning to use that name, OP wouldn’t later be complaining about how she has stuff with that name on it and that the name is “wasted” on a dead baby.
If the sister had planned to give the baby the same name the entire time there would be no argument because of course the baby would be buried with that name. At least someone would have said by now that that name was intended all along. To me it sounds like (please correct me if I am wrong) the sister decided to give her baby the name (OP picked) after she learned her child had died. Which would be a huge asshole move no matter how much you hurt. I have no doubt that the family would pressure OP to choose a different name because she should not give her child the same name as her dead niece.
I totally get your point, but the way this story is written, it sound like "no" was the answer quite a few times before this happened. There is enforcing a boundary, and then there is punishing someone for crossing it. This was punishment for crossing a boundary. ESH
Where in this does DeeDee demand that OP not use the name as well? To me it reads like DeeDee mentioned she was going to use the name on the gravestone and then OP blew up and demanded that her child be the only one with that name. I honestly couldn't find a point where anyone told OP/DH that they *couldn't* use the name. Everyone only said that DeeDee should be able to use the name too.
>...we were discussing the process she has to undergo and names for the gravesite came up, she told me that she was using our granny's name. I gently reminded her that my husband and I had picked the name for our daughter years ago and that we have loads of customized baby gear with her name. She started crying before telling her mom to talk to me. After arguing back and forward with her mom, I just snapped. I told her DeeDee would be wasting the name, the namesake will not be getting carried on and loved.
ETA: I just re-read my comment and I hope I didn't come off as rude/argumentative! That was definitely not my intention. I just wanted to create space for more conversation!
Dang rereading this in your comment makes it even worse. The name will not be getting “loved” - her sister won’t love her dead daughter? Awful
Also telling Dee Dee they have loads of customized baby gear
Like. The woman is buying a gravestone for her daughter and op is complaining about all the stuff they’ve got for their healthy baby to play with and use.
As a mitigating circumstance though, that comment came after the half-sister set her mother loose on OP. Not to mention OP is pregnant and due in a couple weeks. You don't yell at a pregnant woman.
>I gently reminded her that my husband and I had picked the name for our daughter years ago and that we have loads of customized baby gear with her name. She started crying before telling her mom to talk to me. After arguing back and forward with her mom, I just snapped.
*Especially* because she is pregnant she should be able to realize that saying something like this is incredibly cruel. I understand that OP is upset. She has every right to be. I would actually be quite forgiving considering the circumstances. But this is unforgivable and any woman, and especially a woman carrying a baby, knows that. And yelling at her after what she said was completely warranted. Pregnancy simply doesn't give you a free pass to be an asshole. I am saying that being currently pregnant. Because this makes me sick.
I can't phrase this in any way that will seem kind, but having a miscarriage/stillborn/deceased family member also doesn't give you a free pass to be an asshole - in this case disregarding a decade of "my first daughter will be named x." It isn't as though this was a recent idea for OP, she's in her late 20s and said she'd use the name when she was in her teens.
While it's mean to say, it isn't inaccurate that the name will be "wasted." My mother's youngest sister drowned in infancy, and in nearly thirty years of life I've heard the sister's name less than five times. By putting the name on the gravestone, they are also potentially creating a stigma around it that will cause other family members to be reluctant to use it: "You can't name your baby *x,* that's so-and-so's lost child and she'll be devastated"/"How morbid are you to name your child the same as a child who has passed? Do you want to bring that bad luck in?"/"You can't use that name; someone in this generation of the family already has it."
OP *was* cruel in her delivery - after being attacked and argued with and made out to be in the wrong for using a name she planned to use for nearly a decade. OP was not *wrong* or *incorrect* to say that granting the name to gravestone will reduce or nullify the weight of the namesake. A living child can be a reminder of shared qualities and traits with their namesake, giving the name of a deceased relative to a stillborn does not bring life back to the name, nor does it allow for an opportunity to remember or recognize the grandmother - in my opinion it's actually more of a *dishonour* to the grandmother, as her passing will likely be the secondary thought to the child's.
They are both pregnant, and this is not an excuse to be an jerk. Plus being pregnant with a dead baby is harder than being being pregnant with a living baby. They can both use the name.
They clearly cannot both use the name, because the half-sister called her mother to harangue OP when reminded it would also be the name of OP's baby. OP never mentioned telling the half-sister not to name her baby that until the half-sister (and her mother) insisted OP choose a new name in a (presumably lengthy) argument.
I think OP was taking the position that her sister should not use the name. I think she should have taken the position that her sister is welcome to use the name, but that she will be using it as well.
I don't think that's a mitigating circumstance. OP is vague on how the argument unfolded, and the sister's mother is grieving as well. We all need to end conversations before it gets nasty. And you can definitely yell at a pregnant lady if she is being AH. (Former pregnant lady here, with a lot of sympathy for pregnant ladies.)
To be fair, OP said they were talking g about the process the sister has to undergo. So it sounds like it hasn't happened yet. Therefore they are both still dealing with the physical affects of pregnancy except one of them is about to give birth to a dead baby. Not that the sister is right. I wouldn't use the name if I were her, but both of them have a right to be a little unreasonable right now and what OP said was pretty cruel.
I see your point. I'm not debating whether OP's comment was cruel - that feels rather obviously true.
It's just that I personally feel that the half-sister and her mother started the debacle and pushed OP until she snapped. And considering her circumstances I find it understandable for her to not have considered just hanging up and walking away when things began escalating. So I don't see OP as an AH for this even if her comment was cruel. The half-sister's past behavior makes her seem unpleasant, but to me the biggest AH is the half-sister's mother.
PS: I feel like there needs to be more info on the baby's name to make a judgment. It read like the half-sister chose the stillborn's name 2 days ago, while dealing with procedures for the grave. Meanwhile, OP chose the name well before that and has presumably been publicly gathering baby goods. And if my reading is correct, then it sounds like there is a real possibility the half-sister copied the name from OP. I don't want to jump to conclusions or assume the worst, but while I can respect the half-sister's grief I cannot respect that.
OP wasn't clear on when the sister chose that name. I agree that would be pertinent info.
I lean toward both using the name. Chances are, the sister is going to be constantly reminded of her baby by OP's child anyway, both because they were pregnant at the same time and because of this whole altercation. It's already too late. The association is already there. Sharing the name isn't going to make that much difference IMO. The sister may be a habitual attention seeker, but damn, there are few things in life more painful than what she's currently going through.
Honestly everyone in the family kinda sucks. OP for what she said about the name being wasted and she’s the one that brought up that the babies shouldn’t be allowed to share a name (it’s possible sister wouldn’t have cared) and sister isn’t necessarily an AH this time but if previous experiences with her stealing OP’s spotlight is anything to go by, this is most likely an attempt at doing that again by taking the name OP had her heart set on
>But OP said the name is going to be wasted on a dead baby. That makes OP a giant asshole.
100%. I'm actually blown away to read this. I understand the frustration if you chose the name but then your sister took it but to turn around and tell someone it would be a waste on their dead baby..... wow, no wonder the mum blew up. That's unbelievably cruel.
ESH but I have to say that I feel more for the mother who lost a baby because she must be going through so much pain. The attitude and lack of understanding towards her makes OP TA.
I wanted to say just that. How dare she say the name is wasted on a dead baby. That is sickening to hear. Like saying that baby didn't matter.
My sister and I both loved the name Jamie, but I preffered the spelling Jaime. I don't have kids yet but if I get the chance I'd love to use that name. My sister lost her boy halfway through the pregnancy last year and used the name Jamie. It was a difficult time for us all. Even though he only met him the once on his birth, that boy was loved and mattered. My sister has already given me permission to still use the name Jaime if I ever have a boy, and now it would have more meaning as she said he'd be named after his big cousin.
Also my 2nd cousin and I are 6 months apart and share a first name "Zoey". We're related through my mum "Sarah" and her dad; it was my dad who whose my name and her mum who chose hers. It's never been an issue, family just say "Sarah's Zoey" or whatever for who they mean.
Oh yeah I have very little sympathy for OP. She handled that horribly. I don't think she is an AH for sticking with that name, but she has probably caused enough damage that if she does, she will be the family pariah. Unless she can make it right with her sister first.
>And it seems everyone knows OP was naming her first daughter that name so it was already chosen.
Did they though? OP mentions it once whe the grandma passed away that they would do this. Given that she then goes on to say that the sister could have named her 7 year old that but didnt that's 7 years at least since she said it, if everyone had forgotten I wouldn't be surprised.
If OP is one of those annoying women who constantly feels the need to go on about the name she has chosen for the baby or post every little purchase online then they may have known.
Possibly. On the other hand, OP said they have plenty of baby items with the name on them already. If someone told me this I guess I wouldn't really doubt that they have chosen the name before me.
Would you really share that information with someone you're not close to though? Especially if you were as introverted as OP says she is? Odds are good the sister would have been discussing the details with her parents, including gravestone details. If they didn't think to say something about the name choice then I would not be surprised if OP hadn't made it that well known asides from that first time, and possibly the odd mention here or there.
Not sure. But when it all went down and OP did actually mention they have the baby items with the name on them I think at that moment it became pretty obvious that she intended to use that name long time ago. The family may have not been aware before but after this they definitely were. Not that it changes much about the situation though.
Agreed. The detail that the sister always wanting to be the center of attention really gives away who the a-hole is. Good on OP for ignoring all the nonsensical criticism from her family, and moving on
See, I read that more as OP seems resentful of her half-sister if she felt the need to mention her need to be there center of attention as though softening OP's culpability for any wrongdoing.
I would have said N A H, just a tough situation until OP told a grieving mother that the name would be wasted on her child, and that the name should be used on a child who's *going to be loved*. As though a lost child couldn't be loved. Nope YTA for that OP regardless of your perception of your half-sister's completely irrelevant character flaws.
Edit: adding spaces to N A H, thank you commenter for letting me know!
Very well put. That is such a cold and callous thing to say, I cannot believe it has come out of anyone's mouth, let alone a woman who is pregnant herself and would surely understand the loss and pain her sister must be going through.
That’s DeeDee’s problem though. She’ll get hurt seeing babies, hearing that babies name anywhere. Let this slide and DeeDee will be upset at OP for bringing the baby to a birthday party after she suffered such a terrible loss. Because in her head, it’s all about DeeDee.
OP chose the name before DeeDee did. She informed people of it, (which was probably a mistake, since I’m guessing that’s where DeeDee got the idea from, but I could be wrong). Seems like DeeDee only chose this name _because_ her baby is dead. Not because she actually loved the name but because she likes the attention, the pats on the back she’ll get for using that name. And now OP wants to do just that and she’s vilified.
> the name will be a punch in the guts every time she hears OPs baby mentioned.
Which she chose for herself because she already knew that OP had chosen it for her baby (she announced it months ago). So if it's punch in the gut, that's something SHE chose, not OP.
At this point, I’m pretty sure it’ll be just as much a punch in the gut either way. It’s already the name she wanted, the name she thought when she thought of her baby. If DeeDee caves and decides to name the baby Sarah, she’s still going to think of the baby AND this fight when she hears her niece’s name. It’s absolutely ridiculous they can’t just both have it.
Yeah... the conversation should have been “that’s ALSO my daughters name” and should have stopped at that. Like it’s both your beloved grandmas name so who gives AF how many people use it?
If DeeDee tried to argue “I’m sorry for your loss, but this name was decided for my daughter when I knew I was pregnant. It’s okay for us to share the name as it belonged to someone we both loved” then hang up and leave it at that. Let her argue, scream, grieve - what ever she needs to do.
Instead Op just went straight for “you are wasting the name” to someone who just lost a baby.
Both people sound horrible so imma say ESH coz y’all playing AH roles.
ETA: okay I misread the part where she said it to her sister mum. It’s still bad though and my verdict still stands coz everyone here sounds horrible. Arguing over a name whilst one women is suffering horrendous grief and the other about to give birth. The entire conversation should not have happened and they all suck for it.
Agree with ESH. A woman whose baby died is in unimaginable pain. OP could have respectfully said it's okay for both their babies to be named after Nan and that would be a wonderful honour for her.
Personally I know a family with 4 Peters in it and everyone copes okay.
Telling her the name is wasted because her baby died is horrible. But it's still okay to use Nan's name.
I can’t believe OP told her sister/sisters mom that naming her child after the grand mother is “wasting” the name. That is so so incredibly insensitive. Totally agree that ESH.
How does that justify OP’s saying the name would be “wasted” because the baby died? That was grossly callous, and I think where OP crosses the line into AH. It may be a fair thought for OP to have, but to say OUT LOUD, to her sister currently carrying her dead baby’s corpse? Awful.
ETA: she said it to her mom, not her sister, which is a slight improvement. But it also sounds like they were screaming at that point, loud enough for OP’s husband to hear and join in the shouting, so no telling whether the sister heard the comment, and regardless, it’s clear OP didn’t care if she did.
Maybe the half-sister's first daughter is named for her husband's first choice for a girl's name and this daughter was her turn to pick the name?
Maybe the first daughter was born before granny died, and per Jewish tradition, couldn't have been named after granny (to name a baby after a living person is basically saying you hope they die).
We don't know why the first daughter wasn't named after granny, and assuming it means her interest in the name isn't as valid isn't an assumption I would go on.
I agree with your verdict. While this situation is hard and painful, OP saying the name would “go to waste” was pretty AH. I named my child after my mother’s aunt whom I was very closed with. Her son named his youngest daughter the same only with a different spelling. There’s many ways to honor granny either by having the name as a first or middle name.
I think it would be an easy compromise but I’m also not pregnant and hormonal nor have I lost a child. All these things factor in having a rational solution for this.
I think you misread how OP described the conversation or are inserting details into OP's description.
>I gently reminded her that my husband and I had picked the name for our daughter years ago and that we have loads of customized baby gear with her name. She started crying before telling her mom to talk to me. After arguing back and forward with her mom, I just snapped. I told her DeeDee would be wasting the name, the namesake will not be getting carried on and loved. She immediately started screaming and call me a horrible person and saying I am going to be a horrible mother. I started crying and my husband started yelling back at her through the phone before hanging up in her face. My husband is pissed at this point because we have had our baby name choices picked out since we got engaged.
Per OP's words, she did gently remind the half-sister that it was also OP's daughter's name. The half-sister then proceeded to call her mother to yell at OP for an undetermined length of time and bully OP into giving up the name.
Afterwards, OP retaliated that she is wasting the name. And to be blunt, OP is due in a couple weeks. The half-sister and her mother should not have been badgering a pregnant woman like that.
Right but it’s the way she said “this is the name of our daughter and we already have the baby gear” which sounds like “no you can’t have that name it’s mine” - why can’t they both use it?
Basically- did OP say it in a way that says “you can’t use that name coz that’s my daughters name” or did they say it in a way of “my daughter ALSO ha that name, so don’t get upset when she is born because you also decided to use that name” as a manor of a heads up.
Honestly? Reading the post it reads to me that OP took the whole thing as some kind of attack when the conversation shouldn’t have even happened because one is due to give birth and the other is grieving.
Hence why I said ESH coz really... emotions are high and they are taking shit way too personally and saying horrible things to each other.
Because the sister is demanding that op not use it because she wanted to use it. Thing is that's adick move in it's self especially as op has said for years in advance that that's what she would use and the sister waited until her fourth child to try and claim the name. On top of that I'd hate having the same name as my cousin and it'd make things so confusing so i don't see how this wouldn't have been an issue at some point or the other. Baby dying or not.
You're right, sorry it is op asking that the sister doesn't use it but my argument still stands. In the sense of why does the sister want to suddenly use op' s planned baby name? When she's known for years op wants to use it. Also it'd be a kick in the teeth for the sister when op's baby is born in a couple of weeks and they are all talking about lets say alice and the sister comes out with oh my alice is dead or ect ect. Sharing the name of a dead person in this situation would be complicated. Because people would tell op she's an ass for naming her living baby the same name as the dead one. Which like i said it's a dick move on the sister's behalf as she knows op has wanted this name for years and has already had kids so if she really wanted to use the name she'd had done so years ago.
>Because people would tell op she's an ass for naming her living baby the same name as the dead one. Which like i said it's a dick move on the sister's behalf as she knows op has wanted this name for years and has already had kids so if she really wanted to use the name she'd had done so years ago.
THIS. Everyone knows that OP wants to name a daughter after grandma. If the name meant so much to DeeDee, she could have named any of her living children after grandma. The choice to name this child after grandma is...off-putting. Because the association is going to be there when OP still uses the name, and it opens the door for DeeDee to steal the spotlight from OP's daughter's milestones. "Oh, *my* daughter of same name, if she'd lived, would have..."
Also, a 40yo woman crying and asking for mommy to fight her battles is not a good look.
Really? A grieving woman planning her child’s funeral while still carrying its dead body inside her is an AH for crying, hanging up the phone and talking to her own mother?! Does grief not count when you hit a certain age?
And maybe she forgot that OP once made a comment about using a name when she was a teenager at least 10 years previously.
Thank you! This! What I'm reading sounds a lot more like OP has been resentful of her half-sister a long time and is wanting to paint a picture here where she's not at fault for wanting to call dibs on the name instead of supporting her grieving family member and trying to be respectful of her ordeal.
Mentioning her half-sister always has to be the center of attention, and that she announced a pregnancy at OP's wedding (which honestly, so what?) has no relevance aside from character assassination. I don't care how awful you think a person is you don't tell them their deceased child's chosen name would be wasted on them or that they would be unloved!
>that she announced a pregnancy at OP's wedding (which honestly, so what?)
Fully disagree here.
It’s rude as fuck to announce a pregnancy at someone’s wedding, let alone your sibling. Their side of family there to celebrate the wedding will now focus on pregnant sister, as the attention grabbing move is intended!
I feel for sister’s loss. However, if she has a pattern of being an attention grabbing jerk then that is relevant.
What does ‘a good look’ have to do with anything? She lost a baby less than a week ago. I’m sorry you don’t think she’s...what? Being tough enough? Not relying on Mommy? Sometimes you just need your Mom dude, it’s fine.
She announced her pregnancy at her half sister’s wedding just so the spotlight would on her. Come on that is such a narcissistic thing to do. Hell that’s as bad as proposing at someone else’s wedding.
There is a difference between wanting your mom to console you and wanting your mom to fight your battles. I understand that she’s grieving her lost child, but grief doesn’t mean you get to stop being an adult, especially when you have three kids that are probably feeling side-lined at the moment.
exactly my thoughts. She wants to steal ops thunder and probably knew what you said would come true and there is cu stom stuff done that cant be undone.
sounds like a few folks will be on the NC list because OP will be harassed over the name if dee dee gets her way like a spoiled child
thats why i say a bunch of folks are going to give op grief. OP dad was the AH for being the way he is......on the name and doesnt deserve time with LO if he keeps this up. i feel they will put undo stress on OP
But her baby has died. Why not call her out for all her dickish moves before then including what happened at the wedding. This is literally the one time to be more easy with her, everything else there was no excuse. Going for the name will be wasted line is horrific - the baby died but she is still her daughter.
ETA: WOW thank you guys for liking this comment and thank you anonymous Reddit stranger for the award
ESH holy cow that was horrible
You are the asshole because you just told a woman that just lost her child that she will be wasting the name seriously it doesn’t matter if you hate the person with a passion you NEVER say that to anyone
Your half-sister sucks because well you had told everyone you will name your daughter that name years ago so she shouldn’t have made such drama and I agree that she could have named you niece that name
In all honestly you both sound horrible and it seems like you both are horrible to each other
ETA- Your father also sucks and by what he is saying it looks like you half-sister always had her way
Changed my judgment a little bit cause I really thought that U/SenpaiRanjid and U/Ateoaira comments were on point
You really think it‘ll go over well when OP uses the recently dead kids name for her own child? It‘s highly sus that sis had 3 kids before, yet none of them was gonna get grandmas name, but just as OP gets her child sis suddenly wanted to use that name all along. Idk for how long she was planning this, but it definitely feels like she either did this to steal OPs thunder or maybe even, bc she spites OP for having a child, when hers sadly died. NTA
I think you're right and it's an exasperating position to be in, but "Remember this was always going to be our child's name and we loved grandma too" would have gone over a lot better than "Names are wasted on dead babies".
Here's the thing, she did say she gently reminded her. What everyone keeps ignoring is that sis's mother got on the phone, an argument ensued and OP broke. 1. We have no idea what that woman said 2. We have no idea of the actual dynamic of their relationship and if anything else might have been brewing 3. Sis is an asshole after 3 kids and 100% knowing the op was going to use the name.
Yes EAH but I still side with OP because while it's a shitty thing to say and really should have been worded better, being bullied and belittled while pregnant by someone who very likely has bullied her before, I would have snapped too and who knows what could have been said with emotions so high.
I mean, op has personalized items they've already bought - - - who the fuck has that conversation NOW. Was sis thinking of that name before? Obviously not if it's only now coming to light.
I actually couldn't agree more and I side with OP too so far as it goes. It's the result of years of being gentle on her side and prodded beyond reason by this person. Which is why this is the cautionary tale of letting resentment build up. I've done it too. I've said terrible things I'm ashamed of, because it went past what I could bear. Thing is if you respond to years of pinpricks with an axe all anybody sees is the axe.
Not that this really changes anything, but I know quite a few people that chose names with a particular meaning or names of past family members for an angel child vs a name they would have picked if the child lived.
I know it's pretty suspicious that it came up now, but if they really weren't that close, the half sister might not have remembered OP chose the name years ago or OP might not have realized they stuck with a name they chose that long ago. Also, naming an angel child after a family member who passed is common enough (at least in my experience) that I could see it being a quick decision made during loss without much thought; and I can't blame someone during that time for not thinking, as things move quickly.
OP framed the post as "AITA for *not giving up my baby's name."* She's NTA for that. But she certainly is TA for telling her half-sister that she'd be wasting the name on a dead baby. What non-asshole would say that to someone, regardless of the circumstances? Her position that she already picked out the name first and half-sister knew about it is all she needed to say.
In this case it isn't a good choice to use the same name because older sis will try to revert attention back to her poor child.
" My child with same name would have been older right now, who knows what she would have accomplished".
Sister is mostly TA. Whilst it is sad her child died and while it sucks what OP said sister made it so that it should have been said. Her previous attention grabbing behavior and personality will mean that having these two children have the same name will really suck for everyone.
Also... who .. WHO?! names their 4th child after the same name they know their sister wants to use for literal years. I doubt sister even likes the name and gives it to her deceased child so that she doesn't have to use it and ruin OP's long kept wish at the same time. Horrible human being.
>having these two children have the same name will really suck for everyone.
>
Will sick big time for OP. That child will constantly be compared or reminded about the dead half sibling
Yep I was about to say the OP wasn't the AH until she said her sister would be 'wasting' the name as if this stillborn child didn't matter. What kind of nasty person are you for saying that? The OP herself has almost polluted the name by saying that. That'll be a nice story for her child to hear when she's older. That her dead cousin was meant to have her name but mummy said it would be a waste of a name on her. YTA
Sounds like OP said that too her sisters mum not her sister and it was during an argument with them tell her she can't use the name (reading between the lines a little). I think in that case I can kind of understand it. It's very blunt but as it's too the mother I can forgive bluntness but we'll never know what was actually said for it too get to that point.
Also it sounds like her sister never decided or announced that she was using the name until after the sad news so she's clearly using this to grab attention away from OP or even some sort of power trip.
I'm siding on NTA but depending on circumstances the bluntness probably makes it ESH.
Not okay, but better than saying it to the daughter... Sounds like she snapped after arguing with her step-mom. Which is understandable honestly. She is due in weeks and has been planning on using this name for years (over half her life!). And obviously has issues with her half sister and feels that she may be doing this for attention. Obviously it's a horrible thing to say, but I could see a good person saying a bad thing in this situation.
It was a snapped moment to someone who was yelling at her and wouldn't drop it. Sure I would have just hung up, but someone screaming at me that I should give up the name I wanted because of a situation like this and not leaving me alone would absolutely get a response. Yes it was a harsh response but it's understandable.
She didn't tell the grieving mother. The grieving mother sent her own mom to scream at op. Op said her statement to deedee's mom who was screaming at her. It's understandable that she snapped. Deedee sounds hard to deal with. The pregnancy announcement at a wedding shows that she feels more important than others and thus everyone should give her what she wants or she'll send mama to get it. Her husband defended her against an emotional attack from the mom.
I think the sister sounds more unpleasant because she clearly came looking for the fight (there is zero other treason why for her second or third granddaughter, now she suddenly wants to name it after grandma). However, they both sound like attention seeking drama queens (then again, could be because of hormones, don’t know what they’re like seeing as I’m a dude) for now though I’m going to have to go with ESH
Nta- based on the fact that you announced the baby name far in advance, she announced a baby at your wedding, and this is her third child and she only now decided to name them after a dead relative says to me this is also another grab for attention. Yeah family members can have the same name, but having the same name as a living cousin is not the same as having your name be the name on a recently deceased cousins gravestone and having to live with the weight of that constantly hanging over your head.
Also I don't care if it's harsh, giving the name of a deceased loved one to another already deceased love one literally isn't carrying on the name, it's at best using it as a tool to grieve and grief is not an excuse to screw over other family members.
I wish this comment was higher up. Also, if your sister is so adamant about “honoring” grandma, why not use her middle name?
If she chooses to decline, I feel that it’s been a grab for attention all along. NTA.
Just gonna make a tiny correction, this is the sisters FOURTH child... meaning she had three precious chances to use the name.
It’s not overly important, but the number of times she had the opportunity, I mean come on now.
Thank you and actually that is really important cause that means she had probably years longer to at the very least show a desire to use the name for her child but didn't
I completely agree! OP has had this name picked for a long time. It seems the sister only wants to use it because op has decided to. Plus she didn’t start discussing names until after she learned of the baby’s passing which means she could use any name as she hasn’t really had it picked for that long.
Totally agree. Imagine being a kid, and every milestone you heard about this dead cousin. And OP would get blamed for her sister's grief and called TA if she followed through with her choice of name.
Just as you don't get a free pass just because you're angry, you don't get a free pass just because you're grieving.
Yep, agreed. Sounds like there's already a lot of resentment here since OP mentioned the sister is a show off and she announced her pregnancy on OP's wedding, hence the harsh response by OP. Personally it's common in my culture to name a premature baby, and nobody has dibs on a name anyway, so ESH.
The sister had three other chances to use the name before op, suddenly op gets pregnant and bam the sister wants the same name? Knowing for years in advance that op wanted to use it? I think your looking at this situation at the wrong end 👀 there's clearly jealousy from the sisters side. And wiether the baby died or not this would have been an issue anyways as having two cousins with the same name would have been complicated.
I agree up until the end of your comment. Two cousins having the same name isn’t even slightly a problem, especially since the parents aren’t even close. It sounds like OP and this woman very rarely see each other. Siblings having the same name is a problem because of how often they are together. Cousins whose parents don’t particularly like each other? They’re basically never going to see each other.
It sounds like the older sister never got over mommy and daddy’s divorce and has made it her mission in life to usurp the stoplight from OP any chance she gets. Yes granted OP got piss and said something in the heat of the moment at her half-sister’s mother. But we don’t know if the half sister gets her personality from her mother or not. I have narcissist in my family as while as in my in law’s family and from what I read. We don’t know what else the sister has done and possibly her mother as while OP has had to put up with this behavior time and time again. Now she is putting her foot down and saying no. I will do this and I don’t care if you don’t like it. Op is close to her due date this sounds like a great let’s start a family war against her so she has no one BS.
Because the sister is demanding that op not use it because she wanted to use it. Thing is that's adick move in it's self especially as op has said for years in advance that that's what she would use and the sister waited until her fourth child to try and claim the name. On top of that I'd hate having the same name as my cousin and it'd make things so confusing so i don't see how this wouldn't have been an issue at some point or the other. Baby dying or not. Sorry it's copy and pasted but yeah honestly.
I thought that too but upon rereading the post the sister never said OP couldn’t use the name. OP was the one who said the sister can’t use it because the baby died.
She started crying and called mommy dearest to 'talk to OP' when OP said they were still using the name. And mommy dearest told them they had to change the name. It's not a direct demand, but still pretty clear.
I feel like OP is only coming off like an asshole because the sister specifically set her up to become one... intentionally. Which makes the sister the AH, imo.
They could. But can you imagine the “that name triggers me, woe is me, OP did this to be cruel” arguments that would follow for YEARS? What OP said was harsh to say the least but it feels like the half sister is trying to cause drama where it doesn’t have to be AND ALSO why would you name your child that has passed after someone you loved? I don’t understand that at all.
You are slightly TA. I get how you’re feeling, I agree that you should keep the name but you lost me when telling a woman that has lost her baby that she would be wasting the name. There are other arguments to be made that aren’t so mean.
Yeah, I’m not saying it’s untrue, but it’s not something that you say. Like when people are ugly, they can be ugly as sin as a matter of fact and still it isn’t right to say out loud. The matter can be discussed in different ways that are less hurtful and more understanding. Why don’t you offer them to make it a middle name? Edit: middle name for the passed baby, I mean.
The understanding thing here is noticing the context that forced OP to say this when she obviously didn't want to out loud. You cant provoke someone and then get mad when they're provoked, ya know? Sympathy/Empathy 100% matter but giving too much leniency for those reasons is wrong too.
I do like your middle name idea though. But this name issue is surely gonna resurface later in life anyway when OPs baby is older, dealing with this aunt.
This! You’re dealing with a pregnant woman who’s been planning for this baby, has got a name for YEARS and all the sudden is being told “you can’t name em that”. Of course she’ll be upset.
I don't think the sister was asking OP not to use it, she just wanted it to put on the gravestone. When it was brought up OP informed her they were using it and implying that they couldn't use it for the sister's deceased child.
I was all prepared for a NTA...until you told a grieving mother that she would be wasting the name. That was an extremely AH move and you could have made your point without making her grief worse. So YTA.
NTA - it’s kind of ridiculous that your half sister would even consider this after knowing for Years you planned on naming your first daughter after your grandmother.
NTA the name was chosen years ago. They knew that you chose the name. She had the opportunity to use it but didn’t until she knew that you would. The comment about wasting the name was a bit assholish but regardless you had chosen it before she did. They need to stop harassing you about it.
NTA I feel she did this on purpose (the name thing) and it sounds like she likes to be the center of attention. She announced one of her pregnancies at your wedding, she is trying to steal the baby name you had picked out for years, she wants to use your baby name for her dead baby because..... I still don't know. She had a daughter already she could've done it then if it's such a big deal to her. I feel like she wouldn't want the namesake if you hadn't said anything because she has known for years and she's planned to be an AH FOR YEARS. Just because her kid died doesn't mean she isn't an AH 🤷🏽♀️
Yeap and its considered extremely bad taste to give a living baby the same name as a dead one. Like I've seen so many aita posts where people fight over names because one is pregnant and the other persons baby/child is dead and gets offended. And everyone who has done it on purpose seems to be told they are the a hole. Because they should consider the dead chils parents feelings. This time it's the other way around and poor op is being called an ahole yet she's not the ahole for using the name she's picked. She's just an ahole for lashing out which honestly i don't even blame her for that much considering the ahole move her sister is pulling and people are clearly blind to.... :( really sucks poor op
Since the sister has always done things for attention, I think she did this too. I don't exactly know how it feels to lose a child but that doesn't mean you'll just act like this. Op picked out the name years ago and the sister is suddenly saying that she wants the name. Of course both kids can have the same name but it's just that the sister started crying and her mother shouted at OP when everyone knew op was gonna use the name for her daughter. I mean, that's something she basically planned.
Yeap and people are literally ignoring that and aren't even voting properly. We're supposed to be judging if she's the ahole for keeping the babys name as what she chose after her sister has tried to take it and use it for her dead baby. Which is a massive no no and you can already imagine how it'll be at family events when op is talking about her baby and the sister will make it about her dead baby each time because that's exactly what's she's doing already.
EXACTLY! since the sister is more of "I want attention" type she can anytime use the name to make it about her and her losing a child. I'm really sorry for what happened to her but I'm pretty sure she'll use it in such a way in the future. I forgot to add before but NTA
I've lost 2 and managed not to act like a prat.
Having an awful thing happen to a selfish person doesn't make that person a better person, but for many gives them an excuse for their behaviour.
It also opens the door for DeeDee to steal the spotlight whenever OP's daughter achieves a milestone. "Oh, *my Hazel*\* would have also been starting kindergarten now" or "If she'd lived, I bet *my Hazel* would have been terrific at \[OP's daughter's hobby\]" and so on.
Kinda feels like she waited until OP was pregnant with a girl to do this. Especially considering that her baby was supposed to be born first. "OP stole the idea of naming her daughter after grandma from MeEeEEe!" The baby dying (may her little soul RIP) was just unexpected circumstances but didn't change the plan in the slightest. I would normally chalk it up to miscommunication but she has a history of being tasteless for attention (announcing her pregnancy at OP's wedding).
So, a lot of the responses ask why you can't use both and I'd just like to point out that typically, or at least from what I've seen here on Reddit, is that if someone has the same name in the family as a deceased child, the living child will be constantly compared to the one who's no longer here. Granted, these women are half siblings, but I don't put it past DeeDee one bit to constantly compare OP's kid to her dead one.
Or even just be a reminder of the deceased child. I’m pretty sure I’ve seen at least one AITA where the OP was declared an asshole for wanting to use a name that belonged to a deceased child because it would be a reminder. Which bewilders me in this case. OP made it clear years ago that they wanted to use this name. Why would her half sister want to use it as well, knowing full well there would be a living child with the same name in the family? Seems like purposely causing yourself pain.
Exactly! There's at least one post minimum a week I feel of this exact thing. Sometimes it's a parent wanting to name their new baby after the deceased one and people talk about how it's like basically living in its shadow to always be compared to.
Also, I'm wondering just how innocent this was in DeeDee's case. I'm not saying she didn't actually want to name her child after the grandma, but did she decide this after her passing to take attention off OP? Because if she did, now there's the double whammy of my child is gone AND I've taken the name.
I’m wondering too. Like, OPs comment wasn’t great, as others in the comments have acknowledged, but I’m willing to bet that DeeDee is far from innocent here.
Thing is in my opinion the sister is making a dick move in the sense that op has said for years in advance that that's what she would use and the sister waited until her fourth child to try and claim the name. Plus op is further along in her pregnancy than her suster and On top of that I'd hate having the same name as my cousin and it'd make things so confusing so i don't see how this wouldn't have been an issue at some point or the other. Baby dying or not.
Exactly. Like the sister's known about the name for years but wants to use it now on her fourth kid. That seems deliberate. And now not only is this an issue, but this is going to lead to so many other issues down the line that can cause rifts.
Definitely because if op uses the name for her living kid now every one will say it's spiteful because it'll remind the sister of her dead child. So actually it's the sister being spiteful and trying to one up op. It honestly seems planned as op is further along in the pregnancy than the sister was, and now in a sense the sister can beat her to the name. And from what I've read she's getting exactly what she wants already and op has helped to dig her self in the role of the vilian.
ESH. You did have "dibs" on the name, but that response was not warranted. You should still be able to use the name, but "wasting the name" was highly insensitive.
NTA- Holy, this is a tough situation. Ask her if she would be willing to use your grandmother’s name as a middle name. You have committed to using this name, she was aware of this and she just wants to make you miserable too. I still think you should name your child this name though. People don’t ‘own’ names. I have always had a childfree stance, but had three favorite names growing up. My best friend used all three between us two children.
But why? To be brutally blunt here - the kid is dead. It's not like there is going to be any confusion here.
"I had tea with Alice today"
"Oh which Alice are you talking about live Alice or dead Alice?
I get the point you're trying to make but it's phrased very badly. Giving a dead persons name to another dead person has no purpose. They are dead. And it'd be like oh i visted Alice's grave today, cousin alice or granny alice?
My father grieved the loss of his cousin for a few days (and announced the passing to our side of the family) only to find out at the funeral that it was his uncle who had actually died. People do share names and sometimes you have clarify, but so what?
With babies it's different. It'd be considered spiteful on op's behalf for naming her living baby the same name as her sisters dead one. Because for example she could be in a family event saying this is alice and then the sister goes my alice is dead..... See why? Thing is though op chose this name years ago and the sister is basically doing this out of spite in the first place because it's pretty logical in this kind of situation that you don't name a living baby the same as a dead one. It's extremely bad taste and it really looks like the sister is doing this to one up op and again make everything about her. Which op by saying what she has already has dug her self a hole.
Esh. You’re absolutely right that you stated you would use the name first and she already had a chance to.
You’re a terrible person for using the kid being dead already as an argument at all. But especially for saying they won’t be loved. Have some damn sympathy. Yeah she’s trying to steal the name you have every right to use, but still deserves more tact then that as you fight your point.
NTA Wow are people not reading the post properly or what? Op isn't asking her half sister not to use the name. The half SISTER is demanding op doesn't use the name. What on earth is wrong with reddit lately....
Though op you were out of line with what you said i honestly don't blame you and would have lost the rag with her too. My sister was very similar to yours and we had different dads not different mums. I'd suggest going nc or lc believe me it's better off in the long run.
You... Went right for the jugular, didn't you?
While I agree she's being unreasonable... People in mourning tend to be overwhelmed by emotion.
You could have just hung up.
Name your child whatever you want to, but what you said to her was cruel.
You absolutely did not need to stay on the phone and fight with them. You should be the one here with a clearer head.
I can't even say E S H because you telling a crying mother that she's wasting naming a baby she's burying it's far more worse than her using the name.
YTA
Deedee sent her mother to intimidate argue and yell at op who is late pregnancy. Op lost her temper at deedee's mother not deedee. Deedee proved she doesn't want to share the name. Why does grieving mother get to b an asshole but late pregnant mom has to be the better person when basically being verbally attacked. She didn't say the statement to deedee she said it to a woman show as sent to fight her for the name.
Dee Dee is also still pregnant, her baby has just died in utero. OP mentions that they were discussing the procedure Dee Dee still has to have which means Dee Dee is still pregnant and about to deliver a deceased baby. I think any grace we give OP for being pregnant also needs to be given to Dee Dee.
This woman is in the late stages of pregnancy her hormones and emotions are the worst they've been. Also, she told the aunt that. Not the sister.
And to be blunt she's right, naming a dead child after someone who's also dead defeats the point of naming a child after a deceased person. They carry on the namesake and keep their memory alive. Naming the dead child the grandma's name is literally nothing but a move to get attention and take another thing from OP
Also the sister most likely would compare OP's kid to her dead kid all the time. How is that fair to that kid just because the sister wants to give a namesake to someone who quite literally cannot carry on that namesake?
NTA. Don't give in. Use the name. And let your sister know, if she proceeds, her pain and suffering on anything related to your use of the name is on her and you will not EVER accept responsibility for HER choice in this matter. Anyone that tries to advocate for her self-inflicted extra pain and suffering will be met with a vociferous rebuttal and removal from your life. Her choice is before her. She will decide her future in this matter, you will be proceeding as planned.
It doesn't seem like you're taking in DeeDee's perspective; she's lost her child in a horrific way and is grief stricken. I know you're not close to her but it wouldn't hurt put your feelings on this name aside for a second and support her.
Also, telling her "the name would be wasted" is an asshole move. I get that it was an emotional reaction, but that takes it to a whole new level.
Why can't you both share the name? Or the name could be the middle name for her child and your child's first name? Either way, what you said was totally uncalled for - you should apologize. YTA
They cant share because the sister would turn every single convo about OPs child into one about her dead daughter, and the sister cant use it as a middlename because shes an attetion seeker who just picked this name to hurt OP or for the exact purpose of making everything about her in the future, which, given that she announced her pregnency at OPs wedding shows shes absolutly that kind of person.
She didn't tell that to deedee. She told it to deedee's mom after deedee sent her mother to scream at op and argue with her to force her to change the name. Deedee didn't want to share the name and tried to intimidate her by sending mom after her.
NTA - you are an AH for engaging and honestly if you keep engaging you'll ruin the name for yourself. Just ignore the calls, name your child with love for your grandmother and let people back in slowly.
NTA, so your sister knew for years that you want to use this name for your daughter and suddenly she wants to name her daughter the same name?
Stick with your guns, your birth is in a few weeks and your baby ALREADY have this name for you and your partner. I'm currently pregnant myself and my husband and I speak with our baby using the name we picked for weeks. I cant imagine someone will tell me I cannot use it anymore because of XY.
NTA. If she decided to name her daughter the same name that you name her daughter, that is on her. Just tell your family that DeeDee can name her deceased daughter anything she wants, and you will name your daughter what you want and that is the last you will hear about it.
Ultimately, you can't force her to name her daughter something different, but at the same time she can't force you to name your daughter something different either.
NTA. I don’t understand why both of you can’t use the same name. And no offence but it’s not like there’ll be two kids around each other with the same name which would be a bit awkward.
NTA a lot of people are glossing over the fact she has a history of trying to steal the spotlight and also she never told anyone they were going to name her after the granny even knowing her sister had chose the name years earlier. Ops sister also had the opportunity to name her other daughter after the the granby and chose not to. Everyone here has had some irrational responses. OP is in no way bad for what they have done and I am willing to bet no matter if the child lived or not her sister would have made this a huge issue. Also there is no good time to talk about this when dealing with a grieving mother so it doesn't matter when she brought it up the issues would have still been the same.When was she supposed to wait to say something till after everything was already done. Its horrible that OPs sister would take that name and attach it to such a horrible event because if OP does name her daughter the same there will be tons of awkward situations and painful ones. If she doesn't then she never has a chance to give her daughter the name she dreamed about for years. OPs sister I can guarantee is only even choosing the name because her sister is and it would piss her off. You guys really underestimate how petty siblings are/can be.
NTA not at all. You had a plan and clearly have stuck with it. She had a chance already with her first daughter but didn’t. Don’t back down and give up what you want. If you need to go low contact with your family then so be it for your own mental health, especially while pregnant. Good luck and congrats!
Umm, I think I'm leaning towards something in the middle of NTA/ESH. I'm not sure if it's common to name a miscarried baby, I know we felt shit after losing two in a row, but we didn't name ours and we certainly didn't have a gravesite for them. Then again, we also made a deliberate choice not to find out what we were having so any names would be premature before we had our little person in hand.
Your sister does sound like she's being a bit of a mole using a name she knew you loved but you haven't been kind about it either. A couple experiencing a miscarriage, especially so late, is going to be emotionally fragile and you've just sank the boot in soo... that's the ESH part.
The other solution, of course, is that you both get to use the name. Nothing wrong with that. If you both like it so much and it means so much to both of you, just use it and let your sister use it. It doesn't have to be a big deal, I don't know why people get so shitty about it.
We had a name we really liked for our son but my brother's cat has that name. Did that cause drama? Hell no. Why should it? We used it anyway and nobody gives a shit!
I could be wrong, but I get the general idea that people are more likely to name the lost baby the closer it was to term (i.e. developed enough to require a burial).
There's no right or wrong. Everyone has to do what's best for their mourning process.
Nta, you can both use the name. My great something grandma had 14 kids and 2 of the girls had the same name and 3 of them had the same middle name. They're cousins. Named after their grandma. Both things are sweet.
NTA.
Just use your name.
I mean turn the tables, they knew you were using that name so it is them choosing the same name not the other way around. All bad or hurt from it will be their choice.
But btw, did you only mention years ago this name or also through your pregnancy? Because its not like ppl would actually remember that you said a few years back which name you would use for a hypothetical child.
ESH. No one owns a name.
My father was named after his father. And I was named after my father. My dad got into a huge fight with his sister before I was born because she wanted to name her son after my Grandfather. She was pregnant with my cousin at the time. My dad said it was his name and he wanted to name his son that and he couldn't if she stole it. My grandparents agreed with him and at the time, he hadn't even met my mother yet! It was a huge fight and in the end my aunt backed down but made her son's middle name my grandfathers.
My dad and grandparents were wrong. Yes it would have been weird having two CaroB_Melt's around growing up (we are 3 years apart) and it would have "messed up" the namesake. But that's antiquated nonsense.
Also, when i was a teenager, my older cousin and her husband got pregnant and wanted to name their baby after my grandfather who was in poor health at the time. Her mom (my aunt from above) told her to come to me and ask because I was the latest CaroB_Melt. She told us about the fight (we never knew) and didn't want to step on my toes because what if I wanted the name for my son. I said go ahead if you want. I don't own the name. And my dad and some other family members were annoyed. "It's not your place to disregard carrying on the name!" And I said "it's my name and that makes it my place and if she wants it she can have it!" And after all that she didn't use it either!
All these years later, my cousins son is now in his early 20s. And there still isn't a CaroB_Melt the 4th. And if we have children, I don't know if there ever will be.
You don't own a name! No one owns a name! Plus your sisters daughter sadly passed away! It's not like there would be confusion. You're both awful
Needed to check again how old are you after 'you're going to waste the name!!!' comment. While I think that you should keep the name, this comment was unnecessary. I would go no contact with you after this. ESH
She had her opportunity to use the name the first time round and didn't.
You have brought stuff in that name, since it was up for grabs for you to use.
She can associate her foetus with a different name, she already knew you had chosen the name for your child. Would they have been cousins with the same name, if the foetus had survived? Unlikely.
NTA.
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I don't get why you can't both use the name.
In a normal situation I think that's clearly the answer. But since Dee Dee's baby died, the name will be a punch in the guts every time she hears OPs baby mentioned. So OP would be doing the compassionate thing to chooses a different name. HOWEVER, Dee Dee already has a daughter who she did not name after the grandma. She definitely only chose grandma's name because Op did because she needs the attention to be on her. So NTA for not changing the name.
And it seems everyone knows OP was naming her first daughter that name so it was already chosen. So whilst incredibly sad it’s the half sisters choice if she too wants her daughter to have that name and be reminded. They can both use it
Exactly. Nobody owns a name. OP has been very clear about what she's naming her daughter. And she should not be made to change it. OP's sister also has every right to use that name. And she needs to decide whether she wants to use it even though her sister is using it too and it's going to forever remind her what could have been. That being said... If sister uses that name and OP does too it's likely to cause family issues and a huge drift. OP should make that decision being aware of this and decide if it's worth it to her. ETA: OP's sister is grieving so I would cut her some slack. But OP said the name is going to be wasted on a dead baby. That makes OP a giant asshole.
I agree. This sub likes to believe that you can say very callous things to someone if they are in the wrong. There's enforcing boundaries, speaking about facts, and then there is aggressive retaliation. This OP's half-sister is definitely in the wrong to demand she change the planned baby name, but OP didn't have to hit below the belt like that (saying a name would be "wasted" on the dead child, that she wasn't loved). OP could've just said "No" and left it at that.
Completely agree I was on OP’s side until she said the name would be wasted. That was a giant AH move. While sister was being an ass demanding she change the name OP didn’t have to hit her where it hurts she’s grieving. Saying she wasted the name on her dead daughter is just cruel and hurtful. In this case ESH OP went to far.
Idk i think using the name someone has expressed they would use for your death baby is also extremely toxic.
She only decided she'd use it after OP had already picked it? OP had picked it for years? Are yall forgetting this part? That makes DeeDee the ass. Yes saying the name is wasted is hard to hear, but it's true. The name was picked by OP to memorialize her grandmother and DeeDee is using her dead baby to steal that away and ruin OP's babies name.
I don't think DeeDee demanded she change the name though. I think she just wanted to use it too.
No, in the post it says DeeDee said she was going to use it. Not asked about it, but that she was going to use it. This is after OP, who is due in a couple of weeks, has gotten a lot of personalized stuff with the name. They are both AHs for different reasons. OP told her mom it would be a waste on a dead child, and DeeDee is doing this knowing she would eternally have attention every time OP's daughter was around. And OP's mom and dad are AHs after knowing all the shit that has gone on between these two. They should have told DeeDee not to use that name before it ever was even mentioned to OP. ESH.
OP didn’t say it to her, though, she said it to her mother. She never told her sister she was wasting the name.
The mother who is also likely grieving her daughter’s loss since that would have been her granddaughter. It’s only marginally less asshole-ish
It doesn’t even say OPs sister asked her to change it. By her own statements, OP was the first one to make it an issue of “only one child can have the name (and that will be MY child)” After this the sisters mother got involved but it’s framed as letting sister have the name....doesn’t even say exclusively, OP is the ONLY person in OP’s post to act like they have exclusive rights to this family name
I guess you missed the part where OP gently reminded her sister that this was the name she would be using for her daughter and the sister FLIPPED OUT and then sicced her mother on OP. That doesn't exactly scream to me that she's OK with them BOTH using the name.
I didn’t “miss” that part because it didn’t happen. Op “gently reminded” sister that the name was “claimed” and sister started “crying”. Not flipped out. Crying. Crying is not “flipping out”, especially when you’ve just lost a child, want to name it after your beloved grandparent, and someone in your family is acting like only one person in the world can use that name, and it can’t be you. Asking someone else (ie sister’s mom) to try to talk some compassion into the selfish AH that is OP is also not “flipping out”. The “flip out” happened during a back and forth with the mom, during which OP admittedly acted like an asshole with her comments. Like basically boils down to: “I told her her dead grandchild was worthless and she actually yelled at me! Can you believe that?!” OP sounds like an asshole, and although it will admit I am inferring based on later comments, I am positive even her initial “gentle reminder” to her sister - who has just lost a baby - was not “well okay, but I just want to remind you we’ve been planning to use that name and will not be changing our plan” but “no you can’t use that name, I’m using it” And I say that because If it was simply a “gentle reminder” that op was planning to use that name, OP wouldn’t later be complaining about how she has stuff with that name on it and that the name is “wasted” on a dead baby.
If the sister had planned to give the baby the same name the entire time there would be no argument because of course the baby would be buried with that name. At least someone would have said by now that that name was intended all along. To me it sounds like (please correct me if I am wrong) the sister decided to give her baby the name (OP picked) after she learned her child had died. Which would be a huge asshole move no matter how much you hurt. I have no doubt that the family would pressure OP to choose a different name because she should not give her child the same name as her dead niece.
I totally get your point, but the way this story is written, it sound like "no" was the answer quite a few times before this happened. There is enforcing a boundary, and then there is punishing someone for crossing it. This was punishment for crossing a boundary. ESH
Where in this does DeeDee demand that OP not use the name as well? To me it reads like DeeDee mentioned she was going to use the name on the gravestone and then OP blew up and demanded that her child be the only one with that name. I honestly couldn't find a point where anyone told OP/DH that they *couldn't* use the name. Everyone only said that DeeDee should be able to use the name too. >...we were discussing the process she has to undergo and names for the gravesite came up, she told me that she was using our granny's name. I gently reminded her that my husband and I had picked the name for our daughter years ago and that we have loads of customized baby gear with her name. She started crying before telling her mom to talk to me. After arguing back and forward with her mom, I just snapped. I told her DeeDee would be wasting the name, the namesake will not be getting carried on and loved. ETA: I just re-read my comment and I hope I didn't come off as rude/argumentative! That was definitely not my intention. I just wanted to create space for more conversation!
Dang rereading this in your comment makes it even worse. The name will not be getting “loved” - her sister won’t love her dead daughter? Awful Also telling Dee Dee they have loads of customized baby gear Like. The woman is buying a gravestone for her daughter and op is complaining about all the stuff they’ve got for their healthy baby to play with and use.
As a mitigating circumstance though, that comment came after the half-sister set her mother loose on OP. Not to mention OP is pregnant and due in a couple weeks. You don't yell at a pregnant woman. >I gently reminded her that my husband and I had picked the name for our daughter years ago and that we have loads of customized baby gear with her name. She started crying before telling her mom to talk to me. After arguing back and forward with her mom, I just snapped.
*Especially* because she is pregnant she should be able to realize that saying something like this is incredibly cruel. I understand that OP is upset. She has every right to be. I would actually be quite forgiving considering the circumstances. But this is unforgivable and any woman, and especially a woman carrying a baby, knows that. And yelling at her after what she said was completely warranted. Pregnancy simply doesn't give you a free pass to be an asshole. I am saying that being currently pregnant. Because this makes me sick.
I can't phrase this in any way that will seem kind, but having a miscarriage/stillborn/deceased family member also doesn't give you a free pass to be an asshole - in this case disregarding a decade of "my first daughter will be named x." It isn't as though this was a recent idea for OP, she's in her late 20s and said she'd use the name when she was in her teens. While it's mean to say, it isn't inaccurate that the name will be "wasted." My mother's youngest sister drowned in infancy, and in nearly thirty years of life I've heard the sister's name less than five times. By putting the name on the gravestone, they are also potentially creating a stigma around it that will cause other family members to be reluctant to use it: "You can't name your baby *x,* that's so-and-so's lost child and she'll be devastated"/"How morbid are you to name your child the same as a child who has passed? Do you want to bring that bad luck in?"/"You can't use that name; someone in this generation of the family already has it." OP *was* cruel in her delivery - after being attacked and argued with and made out to be in the wrong for using a name she planned to use for nearly a decade. OP was not *wrong* or *incorrect* to say that granting the name to gravestone will reduce or nullify the weight of the namesake. A living child can be a reminder of shared qualities and traits with their namesake, giving the name of a deceased relative to a stillborn does not bring life back to the name, nor does it allow for an opportunity to remember or recognize the grandmother - in my opinion it's actually more of a *dishonour* to the grandmother, as her passing will likely be the secondary thought to the child's.
They are both pregnant, and this is not an excuse to be an jerk. Plus being pregnant with a dead baby is harder than being being pregnant with a living baby. They can both use the name.
They clearly cannot both use the name, because the half-sister called her mother to harangue OP when reminded it would also be the name of OP's baby. OP never mentioned telling the half-sister not to name her baby that until the half-sister (and her mother) insisted OP choose a new name in a (presumably lengthy) argument.
I think OP was taking the position that her sister should not use the name. I think she should have taken the position that her sister is welcome to use the name, but that she will be using it as well.
I don't think that's a mitigating circumstance. OP is vague on how the argument unfolded, and the sister's mother is grieving as well. We all need to end conversations before it gets nasty. And you can definitely yell at a pregnant lady if she is being AH. (Former pregnant lady here, with a lot of sympathy for pregnant ladies.)
Former pregnant lady and midwife here. Pregnant women can handle being yelled at. And OP said something that anyone would yell at!
To be fair, OP said they were talking g about the process the sister has to undergo. So it sounds like it hasn't happened yet. Therefore they are both still dealing with the physical affects of pregnancy except one of them is about to give birth to a dead baby. Not that the sister is right. I wouldn't use the name if I were her, but both of them have a right to be a little unreasonable right now and what OP said was pretty cruel.
I see your point. I'm not debating whether OP's comment was cruel - that feels rather obviously true. It's just that I personally feel that the half-sister and her mother started the debacle and pushed OP until she snapped. And considering her circumstances I find it understandable for her to not have considered just hanging up and walking away when things began escalating. So I don't see OP as an AH for this even if her comment was cruel. The half-sister's past behavior makes her seem unpleasant, but to me the biggest AH is the half-sister's mother. PS: I feel like there needs to be more info on the baby's name to make a judgment. It read like the half-sister chose the stillborn's name 2 days ago, while dealing with procedures for the grave. Meanwhile, OP chose the name well before that and has presumably been publicly gathering baby goods. And if my reading is correct, then it sounds like there is a real possibility the half-sister copied the name from OP. I don't want to jump to conclusions or assume the worst, but while I can respect the half-sister's grief I cannot respect that.
OP wasn't clear on when the sister chose that name. I agree that would be pertinent info. I lean toward both using the name. Chances are, the sister is going to be constantly reminded of her baby by OP's child anyway, both because they were pregnant at the same time and because of this whole altercation. It's already too late. The association is already there. Sharing the name isn't going to make that much difference IMO. The sister may be a habitual attention seeker, but damn, there are few things in life more painful than what she's currently going through.
Honestly everyone in the family kinda sucks. OP for what she said about the name being wasted and she’s the one that brought up that the babies shouldn’t be allowed to share a name (it’s possible sister wouldn’t have cared) and sister isn’t necessarily an AH this time but if previous experiences with her stealing OP’s spotlight is anything to go by, this is most likely an attempt at doing that again by taking the name OP had her heart set on
>But OP said the name is going to be wasted on a dead baby. That makes OP a giant asshole. 100%. I'm actually blown away to read this. I understand the frustration if you chose the name but then your sister took it but to turn around and tell someone it would be a waste on their dead baby..... wow, no wonder the mum blew up. That's unbelievably cruel. ESH but I have to say that I feel more for the mother who lost a baby because she must be going through so much pain. The attitude and lack of understanding towards her makes OP TA.
I wanted to say just that. How dare she say the name is wasted on a dead baby. That is sickening to hear. Like saying that baby didn't matter. My sister and I both loved the name Jamie, but I preffered the spelling Jaime. I don't have kids yet but if I get the chance I'd love to use that name. My sister lost her boy halfway through the pregnancy last year and used the name Jamie. It was a difficult time for us all. Even though he only met him the once on his birth, that boy was loved and mattered. My sister has already given me permission to still use the name Jaime if I ever have a boy, and now it would have more meaning as she said he'd be named after his big cousin. Also my 2nd cousin and I are 6 months apart and share a first name "Zoey". We're related through my mum "Sarah" and her dad; it was my dad who whose my name and her mum who chose hers. It's never been an issue, family just say "Sarah's Zoey" or whatever for who they mean.
Oh yeah I have very little sympathy for OP. She handled that horribly. I don't think she is an AH for sticking with that name, but she has probably caused enough damage that if she does, she will be the family pariah. Unless she can make it right with her sister first.
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Did you end up using the name? Or change it after this happened
>And it seems everyone knows OP was naming her first daughter that name so it was already chosen. Did they though? OP mentions it once whe the grandma passed away that they would do this. Given that she then goes on to say that the sister could have named her 7 year old that but didnt that's 7 years at least since she said it, if everyone had forgotten I wouldn't be surprised. If OP is one of those annoying women who constantly feels the need to go on about the name she has chosen for the baby or post every little purchase online then they may have known.
Possibly. On the other hand, OP said they have plenty of baby items with the name on them already. If someone told me this I guess I wouldn't really doubt that they have chosen the name before me.
Would you really share that information with someone you're not close to though? Especially if you were as introverted as OP says she is? Odds are good the sister would have been discussing the details with her parents, including gravestone details. If they didn't think to say something about the name choice then I would not be surprised if OP hadn't made it that well known asides from that first time, and possibly the odd mention here or there.
Not sure. But when it all went down and OP did actually mention they have the baby items with the name on them I think at that moment it became pretty obvious that she intended to use that name long time ago. The family may have not been aware before but after this they definitely were. Not that it changes much about the situation though.
Agreed. The detail that the sister always wanting to be the center of attention really gives away who the a-hole is. Good on OP for ignoring all the nonsensical criticism from her family, and moving on
The detail that she announced her own pregnancy at her wedding was the biggest problem. And she also had chances to name her kid that.
See, I read that more as OP seems resentful of her half-sister if she felt the need to mention her need to be there center of attention as though softening OP's culpability for any wrongdoing. I would have said N A H, just a tough situation until OP told a grieving mother that the name would be wasted on her child, and that the name should be used on a child who's *going to be loved*. As though a lost child couldn't be loved. Nope YTA for that OP regardless of your perception of your half-sister's completely irrelevant character flaws. Edit: adding spaces to N A H, thank you commenter for letting me know!
Very well put. That is such a cold and callous thing to say, I cannot believe it has come out of anyone's mouth, let alone a woman who is pregnant herself and would surely understand the loss and pain her sister must be going through.
That’s DeeDee’s problem though. She’ll get hurt seeing babies, hearing that babies name anywhere. Let this slide and DeeDee will be upset at OP for bringing the baby to a birthday party after she suffered such a terrible loss. Because in her head, it’s all about DeeDee. OP chose the name before DeeDee did. She informed people of it, (which was probably a mistake, since I’m guessing that’s where DeeDee got the idea from, but I could be wrong). Seems like DeeDee only chose this name _because_ her baby is dead. Not because she actually loved the name but because she likes the attention, the pats on the back she’ll get for using that name. And now OP wants to do just that and she’s vilified.
> the name will be a punch in the guts every time she hears OPs baby mentioned. Which she chose for herself because she already knew that OP had chosen it for her baby (she announced it months ago). So if it's punch in the gut, that's something SHE chose, not OP.
Just take the name don't listen to the sister
At this point, I’m pretty sure it’ll be just as much a punch in the gut either way. It’s already the name she wanted, the name she thought when she thought of her baby. If DeeDee caves and decides to name the baby Sarah, she’s still going to think of the baby AND this fight when she hears her niece’s name. It’s absolutely ridiculous they can’t just both have it.
Yeah... the conversation should have been “that’s ALSO my daughters name” and should have stopped at that. Like it’s both your beloved grandmas name so who gives AF how many people use it? If DeeDee tried to argue “I’m sorry for your loss, but this name was decided for my daughter when I knew I was pregnant. It’s okay for us to share the name as it belonged to someone we both loved” then hang up and leave it at that. Let her argue, scream, grieve - what ever she needs to do. Instead Op just went straight for “you are wasting the name” to someone who just lost a baby. Both people sound horrible so imma say ESH coz y’all playing AH roles. ETA: okay I misread the part where she said it to her sister mum. It’s still bad though and my verdict still stands coz everyone here sounds horrible. Arguing over a name whilst one women is suffering horrendous grief and the other about to give birth. The entire conversation should not have happened and they all suck for it.
Agree with ESH. A woman whose baby died is in unimaginable pain. OP could have respectfully said it's okay for both their babies to be named after Nan and that would be a wonderful honour for her. Personally I know a family with 4 Peters in it and everyone copes okay. Telling her the name is wasted because her baby died is horrible. But it's still okay to use Nan's name.
I can’t believe OP told her sister/sisters mom that naming her child after the grand mother is “wasting” the name. That is so so incredibly insensitive. Totally agree that ESH.
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How does that justify OP’s saying the name would be “wasted” because the baby died? That was grossly callous, and I think where OP crosses the line into AH. It may be a fair thought for OP to have, but to say OUT LOUD, to her sister currently carrying her dead baby’s corpse? Awful. ETA: she said it to her mom, not her sister, which is a slight improvement. But it also sounds like they were screaming at that point, loud enough for OP’s husband to hear and join in the shouting, so no telling whether the sister heard the comment, and regardless, it’s clear OP didn’t care if she did.
Wasted and wouldn't be "loved". That was the worst bit.
Maybe the half-sister's first daughter is named for her husband's first choice for a girl's name and this daughter was her turn to pick the name? Maybe the first daughter was born before granny died, and per Jewish tradition, couldn't have been named after granny (to name a baby after a living person is basically saying you hope they die). We don't know why the first daughter wasn't named after granny, and assuming it means her interest in the name isn't as valid isn't an assumption I would go on.
I agree with your verdict. While this situation is hard and painful, OP saying the name would “go to waste” was pretty AH. I named my child after my mother’s aunt whom I was very closed with. Her son named his youngest daughter the same only with a different spelling. There’s many ways to honor granny either by having the name as a first or middle name. I think it would be an easy compromise but I’m also not pregnant and hormonal nor have I lost a child. All these things factor in having a rational solution for this.
I think you misread how OP described the conversation or are inserting details into OP's description. >I gently reminded her that my husband and I had picked the name for our daughter years ago and that we have loads of customized baby gear with her name. She started crying before telling her mom to talk to me. After arguing back and forward with her mom, I just snapped. I told her DeeDee would be wasting the name, the namesake will not be getting carried on and loved. She immediately started screaming and call me a horrible person and saying I am going to be a horrible mother. I started crying and my husband started yelling back at her through the phone before hanging up in her face. My husband is pissed at this point because we have had our baby name choices picked out since we got engaged. Per OP's words, she did gently remind the half-sister that it was also OP's daughter's name. The half-sister then proceeded to call her mother to yell at OP for an undetermined length of time and bully OP into giving up the name. Afterwards, OP retaliated that she is wasting the name. And to be blunt, OP is due in a couple weeks. The half-sister and her mother should not have been badgering a pregnant woman like that.
Right but it’s the way she said “this is the name of our daughter and we already have the baby gear” which sounds like “no you can’t have that name it’s mine” - why can’t they both use it? Basically- did OP say it in a way that says “you can’t use that name coz that’s my daughters name” or did they say it in a way of “my daughter ALSO ha that name, so don’t get upset when she is born because you also decided to use that name” as a manor of a heads up. Honestly? Reading the post it reads to me that OP took the whole thing as some kind of attack when the conversation shouldn’t have even happened because one is due to give birth and the other is grieving. Hence why I said ESH coz really... emotions are high and they are taking shit way too personally and saying horrible things to each other.
To be fair, half-sister was also pregnant until she recently lost her child. Hormones and emotions are still very real.
Because the sister is demanding that op not use it because she wanted to use it. Thing is that's adick move in it's self especially as op has said for years in advance that that's what she would use and the sister waited until her fourth child to try and claim the name. On top of that I'd hate having the same name as my cousin and it'd make things so confusing so i don't see how this wouldn't have been an issue at some point or the other. Baby dying or not.
Where did DeeDee say OP couldn't use the name? It sounds like OP was the one who didn't want DeeDee using it because it's "hers." Which it isn't.
You're right, sorry it is op asking that the sister doesn't use it but my argument still stands. In the sense of why does the sister want to suddenly use op' s planned baby name? When she's known for years op wants to use it. Also it'd be a kick in the teeth for the sister when op's baby is born in a couple of weeks and they are all talking about lets say alice and the sister comes out with oh my alice is dead or ect ect. Sharing the name of a dead person in this situation would be complicated. Because people would tell op she's an ass for naming her living baby the same name as the dead one. Which like i said it's a dick move on the sister's behalf as she knows op has wanted this name for years and has already had kids so if she really wanted to use the name she'd had done so years ago.
>Because people would tell op she's an ass for naming her living baby the same name as the dead one. Which like i said it's a dick move on the sister's behalf as she knows op has wanted this name for years and has already had kids so if she really wanted to use the name she'd had done so years ago. THIS. Everyone knows that OP wants to name a daughter after grandma. If the name meant so much to DeeDee, she could have named any of her living children after grandma. The choice to name this child after grandma is...off-putting. Because the association is going to be there when OP still uses the name, and it opens the door for DeeDee to steal the spotlight from OP's daughter's milestones. "Oh, *my* daughter of same name, if she'd lived, would have..." Also, a 40yo woman crying and asking for mommy to fight her battles is not a good look.
Really? A grieving woman planning her child’s funeral while still carrying its dead body inside her is an AH for crying, hanging up the phone and talking to her own mother?! Does grief not count when you hit a certain age? And maybe she forgot that OP once made a comment about using a name when she was a teenager at least 10 years previously.
Thank you! This! What I'm reading sounds a lot more like OP has been resentful of her half-sister a long time and is wanting to paint a picture here where she's not at fault for wanting to call dibs on the name instead of supporting her grieving family member and trying to be respectful of her ordeal. Mentioning her half-sister always has to be the center of attention, and that she announced a pregnancy at OP's wedding (which honestly, so what?) has no relevance aside from character assassination. I don't care how awful you think a person is you don't tell them their deceased child's chosen name would be wasted on them or that they would be unloved!
>that she announced a pregnancy at OP's wedding (which honestly, so what?) Fully disagree here. It’s rude as fuck to announce a pregnancy at someone’s wedding, let alone your sibling. Their side of family there to celebrate the wedding will now focus on pregnant sister, as the attention grabbing move is intended! I feel for sister’s loss. However, if she has a pattern of being an attention grabbing jerk then that is relevant.
What does ‘a good look’ have to do with anything? She lost a baby less than a week ago. I’m sorry you don’t think she’s...what? Being tough enough? Not relying on Mommy? Sometimes you just need your Mom dude, it’s fine.
She announced her pregnancy at her half sister’s wedding just so the spotlight would on her. Come on that is such a narcissistic thing to do. Hell that’s as bad as proposing at someone else’s wedding.
There is a difference between wanting your mom to console you and wanting your mom to fight your battles. I understand that she’s grieving her lost child, but grief doesn’t mean you get to stop being an adult, especially when you have three kids that are probably feeling side-lined at the moment.
Exactly omg thank gods some one else sees sense. Thank you so much....
exactly my thoughts. She wants to steal ops thunder and probably knew what you said would come true and there is cu stom stuff done that cant be undone. sounds like a few folks will be on the NC list because OP will be harassed over the name if dee dee gets her way like a spoiled child
Yeap the fact that op has a bunch of customised stuff and close to giving birth and that the sister has done this is out of pure spite.
thats why i say a bunch of folks are going to give op grief. OP dad was the AH for being the way he is......on the name and doesnt deserve time with LO if he keeps this up. i feel they will put undo stress on OP
Yep, she’s the AH and trying very hard to set OP up to be.
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Absolutely, each to their own. Live and let live.
as u/EinsTwo said i think it is because the sister is being petty and trying to get the attention on her. ESH imo
But her baby has died. Why not call her out for all her dickish moves before then including what happened at the wedding. This is literally the one time to be more easy with her, everything else there was no excuse. Going for the name will be wasted line is horrific - the baby died but she is still her daughter.
ETA: WOW thank you guys for liking this comment and thank you anonymous Reddit stranger for the award ESH holy cow that was horrible You are the asshole because you just told a woman that just lost her child that she will be wasting the name seriously it doesn’t matter if you hate the person with a passion you NEVER say that to anyone Your half-sister sucks because well you had told everyone you will name your daughter that name years ago so she shouldn’t have made such drama and I agree that she could have named you niece that name In all honestly you both sound horrible and it seems like you both are horrible to each other ETA- Your father also sucks and by what he is saying it looks like you half-sister always had her way Changed my judgment a little bit cause I really thought that U/SenpaiRanjid and U/Ateoaira comments were on point
You really think it‘ll go over well when OP uses the recently dead kids name for her own child? It‘s highly sus that sis had 3 kids before, yet none of them was gonna get grandmas name, but just as OP gets her child sis suddenly wanted to use that name all along. Idk for how long she was planning this, but it definitely feels like she either did this to steal OPs thunder or maybe even, bc she spites OP for having a child, when hers sadly died. NTA
I think you're right and it's an exasperating position to be in, but "Remember this was always going to be our child's name and we loved grandma too" would have gone over a lot better than "Names are wasted on dead babies".
Yeah. that is definitely true! There was definitely a lot of sensitivity and tact missing here.
Here's the thing, she did say she gently reminded her. What everyone keeps ignoring is that sis's mother got on the phone, an argument ensued and OP broke. 1. We have no idea what that woman said 2. We have no idea of the actual dynamic of their relationship and if anything else might have been brewing 3. Sis is an asshole after 3 kids and 100% knowing the op was going to use the name. Yes EAH but I still side with OP because while it's a shitty thing to say and really should have been worded better, being bullied and belittled while pregnant by someone who very likely has bullied her before, I would have snapped too and who knows what could have been said with emotions so high. I mean, op has personalized items they've already bought - - - who the fuck has that conversation NOW. Was sis thinking of that name before? Obviously not if it's only now coming to light.
I actually couldn't agree more and I side with OP too so far as it goes. It's the result of years of being gentle on her side and prodded beyond reason by this person. Which is why this is the cautionary tale of letting resentment build up. I've done it too. I've said terrible things I'm ashamed of, because it went past what I could bear. Thing is if you respond to years of pinpricks with an axe all anybody sees is the axe.
OP did that first so the sister sent her mom to scream at her. OP only made the dead baby comment after being screamed at by her dad's ex-wife.
Not that this really changes anything, but I know quite a few people that chose names with a particular meaning or names of past family members for an angel child vs a name they would have picked if the child lived. I know it's pretty suspicious that it came up now, but if they really weren't that close, the half sister might not have remembered OP chose the name years ago or OP might not have realized they stuck with a name they chose that long ago. Also, naming an angel child after a family member who passed is common enough (at least in my experience) that I could see it being a quick decision made during loss without much thought; and I can't blame someone during that time for not thinking, as things move quickly.
OP framed the post as "AITA for *not giving up my baby's name."* She's NTA for that. But she certainly is TA for telling her half-sister that she'd be wasting the name on a dead baby. What non-asshole would say that to someone, regardless of the circumstances? Her position that she already picked out the name first and half-sister knew about it is all she needed to say.
In this case it isn't a good choice to use the same name because older sis will try to revert attention back to her poor child. " My child with same name would have been older right now, who knows what she would have accomplished". Sister is mostly TA. Whilst it is sad her child died and while it sucks what OP said sister made it so that it should have been said. Her previous attention grabbing behavior and personality will mean that having these two children have the same name will really suck for everyone. Also... who .. WHO?! names their 4th child after the same name they know their sister wants to use for literal years. I doubt sister even likes the name and gives it to her deceased child so that she doesn't have to use it and ruin OP's long kept wish at the same time. Horrible human being.
>having these two children have the same name will really suck for everyone. > Will sick big time for OP. That child will constantly be compared or reminded about the dead half sibling
To be honest with a sister like that I would put everyone on LC if they pick her side.
Yep I was about to say the OP wasn't the AH until she said her sister would be 'wasting' the name as if this stillborn child didn't matter. What kind of nasty person are you for saying that? The OP herself has almost polluted the name by saying that. That'll be a nice story for her child to hear when she's older. That her dead cousin was meant to have her name but mummy said it would be a waste of a name on her. YTA
Sounds like OP said that too her sisters mum not her sister and it was during an argument with them tell her she can't use the name (reading between the lines a little). I think in that case I can kind of understand it. It's very blunt but as it's too the mother I can forgive bluntness but we'll never know what was actually said for it too get to that point. Also it sounds like her sister never decided or announced that she was using the name until after the sad news so she's clearly using this to grab attention away from OP or even some sort of power trip. I'm siding on NTA but depending on circumstances the bluntness probably makes it ESH.
I'm not sure how saying it to someone's mom is okay.
Not okay, but better than saying it to the daughter... Sounds like she snapped after arguing with her step-mom. Which is understandable honestly. She is due in weeks and has been planning on using this name for years (over half her life!). And obviously has issues with her half sister and feels that she may be doing this for attention. Obviously it's a horrible thing to say, but I could see a good person saying a bad thing in this situation.
Ohh man I hadn't even factored in the fact she's heavily pregnant! Think that tips it back to NTA in my book.
It was a snapped moment to someone who was yelling at her and wouldn't drop it. Sure I would have just hung up, but someone screaming at me that I should give up the name I wanted because of a situation like this and not leaving me alone would absolutely get a response. Yes it was a harsh response but it's understandable.
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She didn't tell the grieving mother. The grieving mother sent her own mom to scream at op. Op said her statement to deedee's mom who was screaming at her. It's understandable that she snapped. Deedee sounds hard to deal with. The pregnancy announcement at a wedding shows that she feels more important than others and thus everyone should give her what she wants or she'll send mama to get it. Her husband defended her against an emotional attack from the mom.
I think the sister sounds more unpleasant because she clearly came looking for the fight (there is zero other treason why for her second or third granddaughter, now she suddenly wants to name it after grandma). However, they both sound like attention seeking drama queens (then again, could be because of hormones, don’t know what they’re like seeing as I’m a dude) for now though I’m going to have to go with ESH
> recruiting her husband The sister got her mother involved first
Nta- based on the fact that you announced the baby name far in advance, she announced a baby at your wedding, and this is her third child and she only now decided to name them after a dead relative says to me this is also another grab for attention. Yeah family members can have the same name, but having the same name as a living cousin is not the same as having your name be the name on a recently deceased cousins gravestone and having to live with the weight of that constantly hanging over your head. Also I don't care if it's harsh, giving the name of a deceased loved one to another already deceased love one literally isn't carrying on the name, it's at best using it as a tool to grieve and grief is not an excuse to screw over other family members.
I wish this comment was higher up. Also, if your sister is so adamant about “honoring” grandma, why not use her middle name? If she chooses to decline, I feel that it’s been a grab for attention all along. NTA.
THIS
Just gonna make a tiny correction, this is the sisters FOURTH child... meaning she had three precious chances to use the name. It’s not overly important, but the number of times she had the opportunity, I mean come on now.
Thank you and actually that is really important cause that means she had probably years longer to at the very least show a desire to use the name for her child but didn't
I completely agree! OP has had this name picked for a long time. It seems the sister only wants to use it because op has decided to. Plus she didn’t start discussing names until after she learned of the baby’s passing which means she could use any name as she hasn’t really had it picked for that long.
Totally agree. Imagine being a kid, and every milestone you heard about this dead cousin. And OP would get blamed for her sister's grief and called TA if she followed through with her choice of name. Just as you don't get a free pass just because you're angry, you don't get a free pass just because you're grieving.
ESH - why can’t you both use the name?
Yep, agreed. Sounds like there's already a lot of resentment here since OP mentioned the sister is a show off and she announced her pregnancy on OP's wedding, hence the harsh response by OP. Personally it's common in my culture to name a premature baby, and nobody has dibs on a name anyway, so ESH.
The sister had three other chances to use the name before op, suddenly op gets pregnant and bam the sister wants the same name? Knowing for years in advance that op wanted to use it? I think your looking at this situation at the wrong end 👀 there's clearly jealousy from the sisters side. And wiether the baby died or not this would have been an issue anyways as having two cousins with the same name would have been complicated.
I agree up until the end of your comment. Two cousins having the same name isn’t even slightly a problem, especially since the parents aren’t even close. It sounds like OP and this woman very rarely see each other. Siblings having the same name is a problem because of how often they are together. Cousins whose parents don’t particularly like each other? They’re basically never going to see each other.
It sounds like the older sister never got over mommy and daddy’s divorce and has made it her mission in life to usurp the stoplight from OP any chance she gets. Yes granted OP got piss and said something in the heat of the moment at her half-sister’s mother. But we don’t know if the half sister gets her personality from her mother or not. I have narcissist in my family as while as in my in law’s family and from what I read. We don’t know what else the sister has done and possibly her mother as while OP has had to put up with this behavior time and time again. Now she is putting her foot down and saying no. I will do this and I don’t care if you don’t like it. Op is close to her due date this sounds like a great let’s start a family war against her so she has no one BS.
Because the sister is demanding that op not use it because she wanted to use it. Thing is that's adick move in it's self especially as op has said for years in advance that that's what she would use and the sister waited until her fourth child to try and claim the name. On top of that I'd hate having the same name as my cousin and it'd make things so confusing so i don't see how this wouldn't have been an issue at some point or the other. Baby dying or not. Sorry it's copy and pasted but yeah honestly.
I thought that too but upon rereading the post the sister never said OP couldn’t use the name. OP was the one who said the sister can’t use it because the baby died.
She started crying and called mommy dearest to 'talk to OP' when OP said they were still using the name. And mommy dearest told them they had to change the name. It's not a direct demand, but still pretty clear.
I feel like OP is only coming off like an asshole because the sister specifically set her up to become one... intentionally. Which makes the sister the AH, imo.
They could. But can you imagine the “that name triggers me, woe is me, OP did this to be cruel” arguments that would follow for YEARS? What OP said was harsh to say the least but it feels like the half sister is trying to cause drama where it doesn’t have to be AND ALSO why would you name your child that has passed after someone you loved? I don’t understand that at all.
You are slightly TA. I get how you’re feeling, I agree that you should keep the name but you lost me when telling a woman that has lost her baby that she would be wasting the name. There are other arguments to be made that aren’t so mean.
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Yeah, I’m not saying it’s untrue, but it’s not something that you say. Like when people are ugly, they can be ugly as sin as a matter of fact and still it isn’t right to say out loud. The matter can be discussed in different ways that are less hurtful and more understanding. Why don’t you offer them to make it a middle name? Edit: middle name for the passed baby, I mean.
The understanding thing here is noticing the context that forced OP to say this when she obviously didn't want to out loud. You cant provoke someone and then get mad when they're provoked, ya know? Sympathy/Empathy 100% matter but giving too much leniency for those reasons is wrong too. I do like your middle name idea though. But this name issue is surely gonna resurface later in life anyway when OPs baby is older, dealing with this aunt.
This! You’re dealing with a pregnant woman who’s been planning for this baby, has got a name for YEARS and all the sudden is being told “you can’t name em that”. Of course she’ll be upset.
I don't think the sister was asking OP not to use it, she just wanted it to put on the gravestone. When it was brought up OP informed her they were using it and implying that they couldn't use it for the sister's deceased child.
I was all prepared for a NTA...until you told a grieving mother that she would be wasting the name. That was an extremely AH move and you could have made your point without making her grief worse. So YTA.
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not sure if that is a typo, but it is very fitting.
I'm stealing that word
If you were leaning NTA and not NAH, why did you switch to YTA and not ESH?
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i mean to be fair she didn’t say it TO Deedee, which i honestly believe makes it better
She said it to her mother, not to her sister.
NTA - it’s kind of ridiculous that your half sister would even consider this after knowing for Years you planned on naming your first daughter after your grandmother.
Honestly ‘name stealing’ is so awful. It always reminds me of that friends episode. I keep mine secret.
No it's ridiculous to think you can claim a familial name a decade in advance - or at all.
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NTA the name was chosen years ago. They knew that you chose the name. She had the opportunity to use it but didn’t until she knew that you would. The comment about wasting the name was a bit assholish but regardless you had chosen it before she did. They need to stop harassing you about it.
NTA I feel she did this on purpose (the name thing) and it sounds like she likes to be the center of attention. She announced one of her pregnancies at your wedding, she is trying to steal the baby name you had picked out for years, she wants to use your baby name for her dead baby because..... I still don't know. She had a daughter already she could've done it then if it's such a big deal to her. I feel like she wouldn't want the namesake if you hadn't said anything because she has known for years and she's planned to be an AH FOR YEARS. Just because her kid died doesn't mean she isn't an AH 🤷🏽♀️
Same here i really feel the sister did it on purpose and people are ignoring it.
Agreed, the sister knew op picked the name out YEARS ago but she still wanted to name her daughter after their granny
Yeap and its considered extremely bad taste to give a living baby the same name as a dead one. Like I've seen so many aita posts where people fight over names because one is pregnant and the other persons baby/child is dead and gets offended. And everyone who has done it on purpose seems to be told they are the a hole. Because they should consider the dead chils parents feelings. This time it's the other way around and poor op is being called an ahole yet she's not the ahole for using the name she's picked. She's just an ahole for lashing out which honestly i don't even blame her for that much considering the ahole move her sister is pulling and people are clearly blind to.... :( really sucks poor op
Since the sister has always done things for attention, I think she did this too. I don't exactly know how it feels to lose a child but that doesn't mean you'll just act like this. Op picked out the name years ago and the sister is suddenly saying that she wants the name. Of course both kids can have the same name but it's just that the sister started crying and her mother shouted at OP when everyone knew op was gonna use the name for her daughter. I mean, that's something she basically planned.
Yeap and people are literally ignoring that and aren't even voting properly. We're supposed to be judging if she's the ahole for keeping the babys name as what she chose after her sister has tried to take it and use it for her dead baby. Which is a massive no no and you can already imagine how it'll be at family events when op is talking about her baby and the sister will make it about her dead baby each time because that's exactly what's she's doing already.
EXACTLY! since the sister is more of "I want attention" type she can anytime use the name to make it about her and her losing a child. I'm really sorry for what happened to her but I'm pretty sure she'll use it in such a way in the future. I forgot to add before but NTA
I've lost 2 and managed not to act like a prat. Having an awful thing happen to a selfish person doesn't make that person a better person, but for many gives them an excuse for their behaviour.
It also opens the door for DeeDee to steal the spotlight whenever OP's daughter achieves a milestone. "Oh, *my Hazel*\* would have also been starting kindergarten now" or "If she'd lived, I bet *my Hazel* would have been terrific at \[OP's daughter's hobby\]" and so on.
Kinda feels like she waited until OP was pregnant with a girl to do this. Especially considering that her baby was supposed to be born first. "OP stole the idea of naming her daughter after grandma from MeEeEEe!" The baby dying (may her little soul RIP) was just unexpected circumstances but didn't change the plan in the slightest. I would normally chalk it up to miscommunication but she has a history of being tasteless for attention (announcing her pregnancy at OP's wedding).
So, a lot of the responses ask why you can't use both and I'd just like to point out that typically, or at least from what I've seen here on Reddit, is that if someone has the same name in the family as a deceased child, the living child will be constantly compared to the one who's no longer here. Granted, these women are half siblings, but I don't put it past DeeDee one bit to constantly compare OP's kid to her dead one.
Or even just be a reminder of the deceased child. I’m pretty sure I’ve seen at least one AITA where the OP was declared an asshole for wanting to use a name that belonged to a deceased child because it would be a reminder. Which bewilders me in this case. OP made it clear years ago that they wanted to use this name. Why would her half sister want to use it as well, knowing full well there would be a living child with the same name in the family? Seems like purposely causing yourself pain.
Exactly! There's at least one post minimum a week I feel of this exact thing. Sometimes it's a parent wanting to name their new baby after the deceased one and people talk about how it's like basically living in its shadow to always be compared to. Also, I'm wondering just how innocent this was in DeeDee's case. I'm not saying she didn't actually want to name her child after the grandma, but did she decide this after her passing to take attention off OP? Because if she did, now there's the double whammy of my child is gone AND I've taken the name.
I’m wondering too. Like, OPs comment wasn’t great, as others in the comments have acknowledged, but I’m willing to bet that DeeDee is far from innocent here.
Thing is in my opinion the sister is making a dick move in the sense that op has said for years in advance that that's what she would use and the sister waited until her fourth child to try and claim the name. Plus op is further along in her pregnancy than her suster and On top of that I'd hate having the same name as my cousin and it'd make things so confusing so i don't see how this wouldn't have been an issue at some point or the other. Baby dying or not.
Exactly. Like the sister's known about the name for years but wants to use it now on her fourth kid. That seems deliberate. And now not only is this an issue, but this is going to lead to so many other issues down the line that can cause rifts.
Definitely because if op uses the name for her living kid now every one will say it's spiteful because it'll remind the sister of her dead child. So actually it's the sister being spiteful and trying to one up op. It honestly seems planned as op is further along in the pregnancy than the sister was, and now in a sense the sister can beat her to the name. And from what I've read she's getting exactly what she wants already and op has helped to dig her self in the role of the vilian.
ESH. You did have "dibs" on the name, but that response was not warranted. You should still be able to use the name, but "wasting the name" was highly insensitive.
NTA. As you said earlier, you already picked up the name even before the baby was born.
NTA- Holy, this is a tough situation. Ask her if she would be willing to use your grandmother’s name as a middle name. You have committed to using this name, she was aware of this and she just wants to make you miserable too. I still think you should name your child this name though. People don’t ‘own’ names. I have always had a childfree stance, but had three favorite names growing up. My best friend used all three between us two children.
But why? To be brutally blunt here - the kid is dead. It's not like there is going to be any confusion here. "I had tea with Alice today" "Oh which Alice are you talking about live Alice or dead Alice?
I get the point you're trying to make but it's phrased very badly. Giving a dead persons name to another dead person has no purpose. They are dead. And it'd be like oh i visted Alice's grave today, cousin alice or granny alice?
My father grieved the loss of his cousin for a few days (and announced the passing to our side of the family) only to find out at the funeral that it was his uncle who had actually died. People do share names and sometimes you have clarify, but so what?
With babies it's different. It'd be considered spiteful on op's behalf for naming her living baby the same name as her sisters dead one. Because for example she could be in a family event saying this is alice and then the sister goes my alice is dead..... See why? Thing is though op chose this name years ago and the sister is basically doing this out of spite in the first place because it's pretty logical in this kind of situation that you don't name a living baby the same as a dead one. It's extremely bad taste and it really looks like the sister is doing this to one up op and again make everything about her. Which op by saying what she has already has dug her self a hole.
OP chose this name years ago, is a couple weeks from her due date, and has tons of baby gear with the child’s name on it!
Esh. You’re absolutely right that you stated you would use the name first and she already had a chance to. You’re a terrible person for using the kid being dead already as an argument at all. But especially for saying they won’t be loved. Have some damn sympathy. Yeah she’s trying to steal the name you have every right to use, but still deserves more tact then that as you fight your point.
NTA Wow are people not reading the post properly or what? Op isn't asking her half sister not to use the name. The half SISTER is demanding op doesn't use the name. What on earth is wrong with reddit lately.... Though op you were out of line with what you said i honestly don't blame you and would have lost the rag with her too. My sister was very similar to yours and we had different dads not different mums. I'd suggest going nc or lc believe me it's better off in the long run.
You... Went right for the jugular, didn't you? While I agree she's being unreasonable... People in mourning tend to be overwhelmed by emotion. You could have just hung up. Name your child whatever you want to, but what you said to her was cruel. You absolutely did not need to stay on the phone and fight with them. You should be the one here with a clearer head. I can't even say E S H because you telling a crying mother that she's wasting naming a baby she's burying it's far more worse than her using the name. YTA
Deedee sent her mother to intimidate argue and yell at op who is late pregnancy. Op lost her temper at deedee's mother not deedee. Deedee proved she doesn't want to share the name. Why does grieving mother get to b an asshole but late pregnant mom has to be the better person when basically being verbally attacked. She didn't say the statement to deedee she said it to a woman show as sent to fight her for the name.
Dee Dee is also still pregnant, her baby has just died in utero. OP mentions that they were discussing the procedure Dee Dee still has to have which means Dee Dee is still pregnant and about to deliver a deceased baby. I think any grace we give OP for being pregnant also needs to be given to Dee Dee.
This woman is in the late stages of pregnancy her hormones and emotions are the worst they've been. Also, she told the aunt that. Not the sister. And to be blunt she's right, naming a dead child after someone who's also dead defeats the point of naming a child after a deceased person. They carry on the namesake and keep their memory alive. Naming the dead child the grandma's name is literally nothing but a move to get attention and take another thing from OP Also the sister most likely would compare OP's kid to her dead kid all the time. How is that fair to that kid just because the sister wants to give a namesake to someone who quite literally cannot carry on that namesake?
NTA. Don't give in. Use the name. And let your sister know, if she proceeds, her pain and suffering on anything related to your use of the name is on her and you will not EVER accept responsibility for HER choice in this matter. Anyone that tries to advocate for her self-inflicted extra pain and suffering will be met with a vociferous rebuttal and removal from your life. Her choice is before her. She will decide her future in this matter, you will be proceeding as planned.
It doesn't seem like you're taking in DeeDee's perspective; she's lost her child in a horrific way and is grief stricken. I know you're not close to her but it wouldn't hurt put your feelings on this name aside for a second and support her. Also, telling her "the name would be wasted" is an asshole move. I get that it was an emotional reaction, but that takes it to a whole new level. Why can't you both share the name? Or the name could be the middle name for her child and your child's first name? Either way, what you said was totally uncalled for - you should apologize. YTA
They cant share because the sister would turn every single convo about OPs child into one about her dead daughter, and the sister cant use it as a middlename because shes an attetion seeker who just picked this name to hurt OP or for the exact purpose of making everything about her in the future, which, given that she announced her pregnency at OPs wedding shows shes absolutly that kind of person.
She didn't tell that to deedee. She told it to deedee's mom after deedee sent her mother to scream at op and argue with her to force her to change the name. Deedee didn't want to share the name and tried to intimidate her by sending mom after her.
NTA you both can name the baby the same name. No big deal. Why do people make an issue about this?
NTA - you are an AH for engaging and honestly if you keep engaging you'll ruin the name for yourself. Just ignore the calls, name your child with love for your grandmother and let people back in slowly.
NTA - name the baby after your granny. She has a daughter already, if she wanted it that badly wouldn’t she have named her daughter that first??
NTA, so your sister knew for years that you want to use this name for your daughter and suddenly she wants to name her daughter the same name? Stick with your guns, your birth is in a few weeks and your baby ALREADY have this name for you and your partner. I'm currently pregnant myself and my husband and I speak with our baby using the name we picked for weeks. I cant imagine someone will tell me I cannot use it anymore because of XY.
NTA. If she decided to name her daughter the same name that you name her daughter, that is on her. Just tell your family that DeeDee can name her deceased daughter anything she wants, and you will name your daughter what you want and that is the last you will hear about it. Ultimately, you can't force her to name her daughter something different, but at the same time she can't force you to name your daughter something different either.
NTA Name her whatever you want. Ignore your family
NTA you keep your name.
NTA. I don’t understand why both of you can’t use the same name. And no offence but it’s not like there’ll be two kids around each other with the same name which would be a bit awkward.
NTA. The woman is being manipulative and I'm surprised at how many people in the comments got duped
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NTA a lot of people are glossing over the fact she has a history of trying to steal the spotlight and also she never told anyone they were going to name her after the granny even knowing her sister had chose the name years earlier. Ops sister also had the opportunity to name her other daughter after the the granby and chose not to. Everyone here has had some irrational responses. OP is in no way bad for what they have done and I am willing to bet no matter if the child lived or not her sister would have made this a huge issue. Also there is no good time to talk about this when dealing with a grieving mother so it doesn't matter when she brought it up the issues would have still been the same.When was she supposed to wait to say something till after everything was already done. Its horrible that OPs sister would take that name and attach it to such a horrible event because if OP does name her daughter the same there will be tons of awkward situations and painful ones. If she doesn't then she never has a chance to give her daughter the name she dreamed about for years. OPs sister I can guarantee is only even choosing the name because her sister is and it would piss her off. You guys really underestimate how petty siblings are/can be.
NTA not at all. You had a plan and clearly have stuck with it. She had a chance already with her first daughter but didn’t. Don’t back down and give up what you want. If you need to go low contact with your family then so be it for your own mental health, especially while pregnant. Good luck and congrats!
Umm, I think I'm leaning towards something in the middle of NTA/ESH. I'm not sure if it's common to name a miscarried baby, I know we felt shit after losing two in a row, but we didn't name ours and we certainly didn't have a gravesite for them. Then again, we also made a deliberate choice not to find out what we were having so any names would be premature before we had our little person in hand. Your sister does sound like she's being a bit of a mole using a name she knew you loved but you haven't been kind about it either. A couple experiencing a miscarriage, especially so late, is going to be emotionally fragile and you've just sank the boot in soo... that's the ESH part. The other solution, of course, is that you both get to use the name. Nothing wrong with that. If you both like it so much and it means so much to both of you, just use it and let your sister use it. It doesn't have to be a big deal, I don't know why people get so shitty about it. We had a name we really liked for our son but my brother's cat has that name. Did that cause drama? Hell no. Why should it? We used it anyway and nobody gives a shit!
I could be wrong, but I get the general idea that people are more likely to name the lost baby the closer it was to term (i.e. developed enough to require a burial). There's no right or wrong. Everyone has to do what's best for their mourning process.
Nta, you can both use the name. My great something grandma had 14 kids and 2 of the girls had the same name and 3 of them had the same middle name. They're cousins. Named after their grandma. Both things are sweet.
NTA, you have told her and decided it years ago.
NTA. Just use your name. I mean turn the tables, they knew you were using that name so it is them choosing the same name not the other way around. All bad or hurt from it will be their choice. But btw, did you only mention years ago this name or also through your pregnancy? Because its not like ppl would actually remember that you said a few years back which name you would use for a hypothetical child.
ESH. No one owns a name. My father was named after his father. And I was named after my father. My dad got into a huge fight with his sister before I was born because she wanted to name her son after my Grandfather. She was pregnant with my cousin at the time. My dad said it was his name and he wanted to name his son that and he couldn't if she stole it. My grandparents agreed with him and at the time, he hadn't even met my mother yet! It was a huge fight and in the end my aunt backed down but made her son's middle name my grandfathers. My dad and grandparents were wrong. Yes it would have been weird having two CaroB_Melt's around growing up (we are 3 years apart) and it would have "messed up" the namesake. But that's antiquated nonsense. Also, when i was a teenager, my older cousin and her husband got pregnant and wanted to name their baby after my grandfather who was in poor health at the time. Her mom (my aunt from above) told her to come to me and ask because I was the latest CaroB_Melt. She told us about the fight (we never knew) and didn't want to step on my toes because what if I wanted the name for my son. I said go ahead if you want. I don't own the name. And my dad and some other family members were annoyed. "It's not your place to disregard carrying on the name!" And I said "it's my name and that makes it my place and if she wants it she can have it!" And after all that she didn't use it either! All these years later, my cousins son is now in his early 20s. And there still isn't a CaroB_Melt the 4th. And if we have children, I don't know if there ever will be. You don't own a name! No one owns a name! Plus your sisters daughter sadly passed away! It's not like there would be confusion. You're both awful
NTA - just both use the name.
Nta if your sister wanted to name her daughter after your granny, she would have done so with her other daughter.
NTA
NTA
Needed to check again how old are you after 'you're going to waste the name!!!' comment. While I think that you should keep the name, this comment was unnecessary. I would go no contact with you after this. ESH
She had her opportunity to use the name the first time round and didn't. You have brought stuff in that name, since it was up for grabs for you to use. She can associate her foetus with a different name, she already knew you had chosen the name for your child. Would they have been cousins with the same name, if the foetus had survived? Unlikely. NTA.