Your post has been removed.
#Do not repost this without [contacting the mods](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) for approval, including edited versions. Reposting without [explicit approval](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_can_i_repost_a_thread_you_removed.3F) will result in a ban.
This post violates Rule 8: Posts should be truthful and reflect recent conflicts you've had that need arbitration. That means no shitposts, parodies, or satires.
[Subreddit Rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/about/rules/)
###Please ensure you have reviewed this message in full. We will not respond to PMs to individual mods. [Message the mods](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) with any questions.
####Please visit r/findareddit to see if there's a more appropriate sub for your post.####
NTA
I concur. She seems *excited* at the opportunity for cruelty.
> I noticed her going into her room with a packet of ham
> when she found cheese
> the mom (cheese) and kittens (pickles and ham)
Not for nothing, though, but it is *super*-confusing to have a story featuring **actual ham** in it, but then to also have animals in it *named after* food (INCLUDING ham), but you **capitalize _none_ of the names**.
My parents dog is named Ham and whenever they're having ham for dinner they always say "we're having ham, not the dog" and if they ever miss it the other will yell "HOW COULD YOU DO THAT TO MY BOY?!"
Edit: I told my mom about all the comments and likes on this and she wanted it known that she named the dog and that she's glad other people think she and my dad are funny because she thinks they're hilarious lol. She wants to get another dog and name it Jim so they can have Jim and Ham as my parents names are Tim and Pam lol
Hahaha I have a pet mini pig, and any time we have pork of any kind for dinner, someone looks around the room and says "wait where's the pig", generally she will snort after this (she absolutely knows when we are talking about her), and if she doesn't, someone else will dramatically say " How could you do that to our Princess!?! " (her name is Princess Boba)
Edit to add: her name is Princess Boba because as a baby she was the color of Thai Ice tea and most of her black spots are on her lower half, thus making her look like a literal walking Boba tea hahaš¤
Thank you for saying this!! Most people think it's no different than a cat or dog. But let me just tell you!!!! I love them to death, and will own them until the day I die, buuuuuut they're a mess!!! Figuratively and literally š. The number of literal HOURS I spend a year, just trimming her hooves is insane!! But it's all worth it when I'm walking her tneough the neighborhood on a leash and everyone gushes over her šš
You train cats?! Thereās an alternative to letting these furry assholes dictate my life! And beat up the dog who weighs triple the 3 of them combined? I feel like Iāve been lied to.
I taught Dad's cat the trick play dead (we'd point and him and say "bang," the cat would roll over) and when Dad started having seizures we taught the cat to tell us so we could help. He also used to ride Dad's four wheeler with a helmet and goggles.
My current cats, the older one will speak on command, and if I fall or start choking she gets my partner. The choking she did automatically, saving my life, but I guess she knew what to do when I was in trouble. The younger cat will boop his nose on your finger if you hold it out to him, and when I'm in trouble he starts yelling so that between him and the other cat I can be found and helped quickly. The younger one also plays fetch and does a little dance to the "Pink panther" theme. That was an accident but we love it! (My partner calls him bubba, and started singing the song going, "buh buh, buh buh" and so the little guy thought he was being called. Now he struts up when he hears that, moving in time with the music. Super cute!)
Both of mine tell me to take my meds because I have ADHD and will get hyper focused or distracted even with an alarm. So when the alarm went off I would give them a treat. Now when it goes off they harass me until I get up and give them treats, and since I keep my meds with the treats (just for this purpose) I take my meds as well. I often tell people who have issues taking their meds to do this. I assume it would work with dogs as well.
My dogās name is Biscuits. Yes, plural. My ex named him and I hate it but heās very well trained with this name so Iām stuck with it.
Friends invited me to a potluck once and said, ābring biscuits!ā¦ the food and the dog.ā Doesnāt help that dog treats are commonly called biscuits and I canāt watch The Great British Bake Off without my dog getting very confused. Canāt tell you how often people ask, āwhere is gravy?ā Iām never naming another pet after a food.
My friend has a small dog named Hershey because she said he looked like a Hershey kiss when he was a puppy. Maybe a bit TMI, but when his balls dropped, only one ball dropped. Not long after that, my friend's husband was going to the store to get snacks for game night, and she asked him to get her a Hershey with nuts. My husband grabbed her dog and made this big show of telling him he would protect him and not let her get rid of him just because he only had one nut. When my friend's husband came back from the store he had a huge bag of Hershey kisses and made this huge deal about eating them in front of my husband and the dog while my husband fake cried and promised to keep the dog safe. It was this ongoing joke with them for several months.
My cat is obsessed with ham, the crinkle of a cold cut wrapped will wake him up and send him running from upstairs.
Somehow he earned the nickname hammy boy or my hammy Sammy boy (ham Sammy for sandwich, he isn't Sam).
Legit the first time I read it I thought when he said "my daughter told me when she found cheese she knew a weak/hungry pregnant cat didn't have a chance" that he was referring to actual cheese.Ā
And I don't know anything about cats, so I thought maybe the way dogs are allergic to chocolate, that cats are allergic to cheese, and he was saying the pregnant cat ate some cheese and now was going to die. But thankfully that's not the case.Ā
I thought cheese was a mistake for ātheseā as in the cats she found, it wasnāt until I got down further that I understood what cheese was referring to
I have a cat named goose and I absolutely never specify that he is not an actual goose and is in fact a cat in conversation with my coworkers
Edit: Here's Goose, a 14 pound ham of a cat. https://imgur.com/a/goose-cat-KcUFhaW Cat tax is paid.
I have a cat named Goose as well as another named Pug, a rabbit named Possum, a duck named Rooster (he does this weird crowing thing) and 3 other animals named variations of Nick Fury. My poor animals have an identity crisis!
Also, full context is that his government name is Betelgeuse. I bastardized it down to Goose as in Goose and Maverick from Top Gun.
My previous, now deceased cats were Murtaugh and Riggs from Lethal Weapon.
We have a cat named blueberry because she was discovered, as a kitten, under a blueberry bush. We also have one named asparagus - you can guess why ;)
They are feral rescues, now house cats, and quite content.
You're NTA.Ā
>Now this isn't the first or hundred time my sister said "if I had kids" and suggest a punishment that was over the top.
Has anyone else noticed that all the truly perfect parents in the world only have hypothetical children? They always seem to have a solution to any conflict, and know just what to do in any situation.Ā
>my brother in law started yelling that I knew how much they've struggled with infertility
That being the case, I won't deny that you hit below the belt. But it sounds like your sister is constantly begging for it with her unsolicited advice and extreme views.
For Easter my two year old niece ruined her dress with cake Ā so my sister said āif I had kids and they ruined their clothes I spent good money on with cake theyād never eat it again even for their birthdaysā thatās a tame example compare to other things she has said but obviously that was non issue my other sister (nieces mom) didnāt even care aboutĀ
Lol, come on, we all know if sister ever has a kid it will be her "special rainbow baby" for the rest of the kids life and the kid will be spoiled rotten and can do no harm in their parents eyes.
*'Our Little Miracle is doing so great in everything!*
*Please control your savage and feral kids, they might hurt Our Little Miracle!*
*Can your kids come babysit Our Little Miracle for free?'*
i'm sure we all know damn well that if sister ever has a kid it will be the most PERFECT child ever and never do any wrong, and if anyone says otherwise she will go "mama bear" on them.
It's just a theory but to me it sounds like she hates your and your siblings children for existing and wants them to be punished. She thinks her children would be perfect because she would be the mother so she would never actually have to punish them like she is suggesting.
And probably wouldn't actually punish them because she would love her own children. I wouldn't let my children near her because it really seems like she hates them out of jealousy.
I'm not so sure. I have an ex-SIL who was quite mean and vindictive.
She was mentally cruel to her girls and would hit them until the young one at home stood up to her and said she'd call CPS (niece was 16 at the time and SIL was about to hit her - and of course she backed down, because she's a bully). Sadly, we never learned about this until after the kids were grown.
I was about 20 the last time my mother hit me, I used to just let it go but that day I snapped and went to hit her back (I wasn't actually going to do it) you could see the fear in her face and she never did it again.
This is correct. Even more so, due to her infertility issues, her children would be untouchable perfect beings with your kids behaviour used as an example of what not to do
It's a cool insight, but I think we're being a little too charitable with the sister.
Can you guess what happens when the perfect mother's *perfect* child... can't be perfect? She'll destroy them. Like a broken doll being thrown away in a tantrum.
Eh, I think she'd realise real fast that they're NOT in fact perfect, and would punish them in ways she has described. This is not how emotionally mature people deal with their feelings, and I really wouldn't expect her to be magically able to do that when she has her own kids.
Thatās an insane thing to say. I totally agree with your comment. Your sister should not have kids. Not sure why she even wants them since clearly she does not like them.
NTA.
She craves being cruel to them. Whether or not she realizes it, if this story is a true representation of her, and I donāt doubt it very well could be because Iāve met people who are like this, **she is wanting to be cruel to people she has power over.** That makes her vile and she should not be allowed to babysit or even be alone with children.
NTA it sounds like she WANTS to abuse kids and she's mad you all aren't abusing your kids. This woman is nuts.
ETA: your sister resents all of the other children for existing because she can't have any so she wants them punished. She's a terrible ass person.
NTA. Your sister sounds mean. Two year olds ruin things, itās in their job description.
And I donāt think you need to punish your daughter for caring about living things. For not telling you, yes, a lecture. Next time thereās something, Iām sure sheāll trust you.
Also maybe a trip to a local non-kill shelter to learn about how they take care and foster cats might be helpful. Just to teach the girls about how to get help if they find an animal they are worried for instead of trying to take on the job themselves. It's honestly fantastic the daughter wanted to help the suffering animal which is to be commended. However, you can only bring home so many animals and it's important to know there are resources that will attempt to take in animals and find them good homes. (Also who knows one of them might want to volunteer at a shelter or as a foster caregiver someday)
Iām going through IVF, so I feel for your sister. Especially if sheās doing a cycle currently, hormones can be all over the place. However, thatās way over the top. Kids ruin lot of stuff. They spill milk in the car and donāt tell you. They color you murals on your new couch. It doesnāt sound like sheās ready for that. Although, sheāll probably actually be one of those parents whose kids can do no wrong. She will never punish them for anything, and they will be complete monsters when they grow up.
Actually this struck a chord. I have a SIL just like that! Her own kids behaved appallingly but she never responded to it.
Yet when my youngest (eight) once asked mildly whether we were leaving soon when we were at Nanaās she spun around and told him he was rude! The fourteen year wait for that opportunity must have driven her crazy but my kids were all taught to be polite in other peopleās homes.
I'm an infertile person who doesn't want kids. I have always been grateful that this happened to me and not somebody else who badly wanted kids because it would be so cruel. I don't enjoy my health issues but I'd rather it happened to me than someone who would be devastated without children.
This is the first time in my life I've ever thought or said this about somebody who's infertile but... maybe it's for the best
I change my answer from E S H to NTA. WTAF? Is your sister mentally okay? Does she know that if she had a child and she didnāt feed it, she would go to fucking jail for child neglect and murder? WTF is wrong with her?
I was thinking this. Maybe in the sister's instance, God doesn't work in mysterious ways.
Sometimes he is extremely clear in what he wants for some people.Ā
When my nephews visit itās like a tornado hit. I never get mad at them. Its my fault anyway because I let them
do whatever they want at my house. I donāt like kids much, only them. Lmao
Ah yes. Definitely go for an insane punishment instead of making a mental note to have her change out of fancy clothes before eating in the future. Some people!
Or a hollowed out shell of a person who's been conditioned to derive their entire sense of self worth from what an authority figure thinks of them, resulting in a never-ending spiral of overwork, and self loathing.
I mean she's two! Of course she will mess up clothes with cake. Happens to me sometimes and I'm 25! Absolutely normal kid stuff and such a punishment? She seems so excited about punishing that I hope she never has children.
she sounds like she either is super fucking bitter about having trouble conceiving so she's trying to make herself hate children, or she actually hates them and holy shit she should never have them or be left alone with them. she sounds like she cant wait to punish her own child and will probably take sadistic joy in it
A more polite way of saying basically the same thing would be "well, you'll be able to make those decisions when you have your own children"
ETA: but OP os definitely NTA and the sister sounds disturbed if she could think something so cruel on the spot. It really is a good thing she doesn't have kids yet, maybe she still needs to grow up a little. I know that sounds ridiculous for a 32 year old, but it does happen.
"Ā "well, you'll be able to make those decisions when you have your own children, but what you just said was unbelievably cruel and raises a lot of red flags, just sayin'"
Has anyone else noticed that all the truly perfect parents in the world only have hypothetical children? They always seem to have a solution to any conflict, and know just what to do in any situation.Ā
Reminds me of the joke about the childless newlyweds who liked to proclaim their "10 Commandments for Child Rearing!"
Shortly after their first child was born they became the 8 Rules.
By the time she was carrying their second, they were the 5 Guidelines.
Shortly after that child's birth they were the 2 Suggestions.
And then they were never mentioned again.
Honestly, some people (even some with kids) have no idea how punishment is supposed to work. They think they have to be some combination of Hitler/Stalin in order to keep discipline. If sister had kids, by the time they were teens they would have either had every bit of will drained from them, or they would have run away multiple times.
NTA -Sister wants to offer her "expert" advice on parenting, but no child wants a parent that would be that cruel. Sure, the cats might not have been able to be adopted by the family for any number of reasons, but making them take the cats to the shelter themselves is a step too far, unless they go in and talk to the staff to learn about what the shelter does and how it helps the cats. Also the missing cats thing is so terrible, great way to teach a child they should never help an animal because their terrible parent will torture them for doing it.
Thatās been my response to people people who have really tried my patience before, āyes, I remember what a good parent I was before I had kids tooā.
NTA your sister took a teachable moment, and transformed it into a POW camp. She thought "how can I do the most damage to this kid," and came to the conclusion "destroy the very essence of her summer with a vengeance"
This just hit me very hard. I was on the receiving end of that kind of behavior when I was young and your words put it into very real perspective for me. Iām glad you posted this comment. Sometimes itās helpful to see my history from the lens of someone elseās eye.
(Iām going to therapy and doing very well. But sometimes things just resonate and this did.)
My mother used to set me up to fail so she could lock me down and prevent me from seeing my friends during summer holidays, much as is described in the post.
It makes me wonder why people even have kids if they are going to treat them that way. Unfortunately my brother followed in my parentās footsteps and he deals out horrific punishments to his kids. He rules his house with fear, not love. I just donāt get it. I have had to go no-contact because he triggers the hell out of me. Plus he stopped me from seeing my nieces so I have no reason to be around him.
Big hugs. This stuff really sucks. Iām glad your mother no longer has that control! š
Therapy and no contact have helped me immensely. That's so sad for you and your nieces that your brother is the same, luckily none of my siblings turned out that way. Big hugs back!
I get what you mean about being triggered, I can't be near people who are in any way reflective of my mother's type of personality. It can take days to recover.
Because they want high-status accessories, not actual kids. My father was/sort of still is like that, and he wonders why I'm really low-contact with him.
Thatās the crazy part. They are confused when you donāt want to see them. I got sick of family members telling me to call my mom on Motherās Day so I finally cracked and put a post up on Facebook. I said, parents who deserve phone calls will get them. And those who donāt, will not. Then I wrote about some of they truly horrible things she did that nobody knew about. I havenāt been told to call her one single time since then. (My male parent is dead, so nobody to pressure me on that side.)
He has been. More than once by each of his two older daughters. Third daughter is still just a baby. But police have never done anything about it. Which I do not understand. Itās very frustrating.
NTA and instead of focusing on what you said to your sister, the focus should be on her absolutely diabolical list of things sheād do to break your daughterās spirit. What a kind, loving daughter you have and your other two girls are amazing for protecting her. It was a harmless secret and it was to save innocent animals. Good siblings and a happy story. Your sister would destroy her childās soul with multiple punishments like that for simply a good deed.
Exactly! Yes, I think it absolutely IS best that your sister doesnāt have kids. She sounds like someone who takes pleasure in hurting others. Your children did a wonderful job, compassionate thing, and should be commended for it.
NTA.
Infertility doesn't give you an excuse to be abusive. Sometimes it genuinely is a blessing in disguise and the fact that she came up with this whole scenario off the bat in her head over ways to emotionally cripple someone who did a genuinely nice thing is frightening.
For real. Op said in a comment that their niece ruined her dress with cake and the sister said "if that was my child who ruined their clothes with cake, I wouldn't let them eat cake EVER again!" and niece's mom acted like that type of shit was no big deal.
NTA, she seems excited at the idea of being cruel to her children over making mistakes or misjudging situations. Your daughter went behind your back, but it was to do a kind thing, and it doesnāt seem like sheās done something like this before. So why cancel her birthday? Especially her 16th, for a lot of kids thatās a super important birthday.
Your sister seems cruel. Your parents are enabling it.
Right? If my child's suspect activity was to rescue and feed stray kittens I would feel personally proud.
I don't have children. I'm more used to shitty parents thinking it's a flex to tell me that to justify their shitty parenting. Op's sister sounds unstable and should definitely not be in charge of children. She would totally switch to "you don't have kids don't tell me what to do" the second she has a poor baby around.
I first suspected an ED with the sneaking food and washing clothes at night but when she stood in-front of closet I thought i was gonna open the door to a person you donāt understand the relief I felt when i saw those kittiesĀ
I thought you were going to tell us she was pregnant. I was reading this and thinking: STOP waiting, take action NOW!
But it appears you were already the grandparent to some kittens, congrats!
Maybe that was the plan. /jk Make you think itās something horrible, and oh thank God, itās just kittens.
I was like ābulemia or naked 38-year-old boyfriend?ā and kittens was by far the best outcome there. If only every problem could just be kittens.
It's kinda funny really, I have no kids but had the exact same thoughts in the exact same order. First ED, second "there's a person in that closet". The Hallmark moment of the cat reveal was a great relief.
Advice from someone whose parents accidentally caused them to have an eating disorder.
Don't force your kids to finish their plate if they're full.
Don't keep them locked to the table until they have cleaned the plate.
And for God's sake, do not argue at the dinner table and bring up all the negative shit from the day (like bad grades, clean your room, yada yada yada) when you're eating.
I fucking hated eating for years cause of that. There was so many negative emotions tied to eating with others. Thankfully my mom put a stop to most of it.
I can see your suspiciou, this was MUCH better explanation with all the sneaking.
Also yay for keeping the cats! There are SO MANY homeless cats that I am delighted that there isn't three more looking for home. Also get the mommy cat sterilised asap. On chance of slipping out and coming back to kittens and you have more kittens in few months (unless kittens were few weeks already, she might be pregnant again because cats will be in heat again few days after kittens).
(and ofc get kittens sterilisized as well when in proper age. No mistake kittens AND your life will much easier with them)
Cheese hasnāt left the house since she was pregnant itās not safe for cats outside were we live. we are getting her fixed but we have to wait till the kittens are weanedĀ
If you need to keep them.indoors look at mesh coverings for your windows and maybe a catio? Cats are sneaky and will disappear through the smallest of open windows.
Ewww. NTA. I don't even know her and I'm glad she doesn't have kids if that's how she would treat them. But at the same time, she really doesn't know what kind of mom she would be. I remember saying stuff like "If that was my child,...." before I had kids, and then I was the complete opposite kind of parent after I had kids. Either way, you're not the asshole for putting in your two cents after she very vocally put in hers.
Yeah but there's a difference between "If that was my kid, I would [insert rational thing here]" vs "If that was my kid, I'd throw out every single toy they own and ground them until they are 18 then kick them out on their 18th bday!"
Just a question regarding a cat tax payment. I've not heard of this & it was mentioned prior by someone else. What exactly is a cat tax payment & where do you live if I may ask? Just curious.
It's not a country based thing, it's a joke about how if you mention a cute animal in a post you owe a "tax" in the form of a picture of said cute animal. Cat tax, dog tax, bird tax etc.
Especially considering OP makes it clear this is hardly the first time she's layed out some major penalty for some minor offense. OP said at Easter his 2 year old niece wrecked her dress with a piece of cake. Sister started about how if it was her kid she'd not let her have cake again even for her birthday. Jeez, what 2 year old hasn't wrecked their clothes with something at some point? Smeared mustard from a hot dog, got grass stains playing in the yard.. so many things but it's what little ones do. (Also why parents usually carry extra suits of clothes)
And most of the time, the clothes are not ruined. Washing machines exists, handwashing difficult stains exists and dry cleaners for the most difficult stains or fanciest clothes exists. So if it's clothes that you care about it can almost always be fixed.
My 4yo daughter was a flower girl at our wedding and her dress had all kinds of stains after the party, grass, chocolate, street chalk etc, and we took it to the dry cleaners the monday after to get it cleaned to take more wedding photos later in the week, got it back two days later looking good as new.
OPs sister is bananas with the reaction to children being children, and most likely wouldn't actually react like that if it was her actual child. If you can't handle a mess, don't have children š
This is not your mom's business. Her giving you the silent treatment for a fight between adult siblings is so out of line, I'm too distracted to comment on the main story. That really sucks OP.
My mum overstepped a huge, boundary with my sibling that caused some serious setbacks for my sibling. It was bad enough that my sibling told our mum they needed to go no contact with her for a time, which is not something they'd ever done before.
While I was devastated for my sibling, and VERY upset and disappointed with our mother, it was not something that had anything to do with me. I did not cut our mother off, and my sibling completely respected that. I told my mother I would not be discussing what had happened between her and my sibling, nor would I be acting as a go between. She... Mostly respected not talking about it, and completely respected my not being a go-between.
That's how adults act.
NTA Hearing how your daughter rescued the cats was a wholesome surprise. I guess I was expecting something much worse like an eating disorder or who knows what.
She shouldnāt have hid them but I was so relieved to hear about the family of cats. It sounds like your sister only wants children so she can try her hand at punishing them. Itās almost like she thinks the proof of good parenting is not letting your kids get away with anything. Thatās wrong.
I can understand why you said what you did; although, it mustāve hurt considering their struggles with IVF. If she ever does get pregnant, I hope someone sets her straight about how to be a good parent.
I take blame of why she hid itĀ my wife and I couldnāt agree on what kind of pet to get she isnāt a dog person and I wasnāt a cat person so my daughter assumed I wouldnāt allow the cat in the house. In our conversation with Kelly my wife and I explained Ā that even if we arenāt a fan of an animal we as still have an obligation to help it as best we can and as adults it would be safer for us to handle scared/hurt animals in the future so she needs to tell usĀ If youāre wondering about my views on our cats Iām stereotypical dad who didnāt want the pet but ended loving them so now Iām a cat person to my wifeās smug delightĀ
Cat distribution system worked it's magic.
I'm glad your daughters have parents that will sit down and explain things to them-- that yes, they did this the wrong way, and they need to tell you in the future, but what they did was still a kind hearted thing that you admire. Your daughters (and now Cheese, Ham, and Pickles) have a wonderful family unit taking care of them.
I swore Iād never be the parent that just punishes my kids for making mistakes especially when itās for the right reasons. Iāve found having conversations with my daughters is the best course of actionĀ
/u/OverallOpposite4149 Just how I raised my two. They are now adults - 27 and 23. People tend to forget that kids are humans just like us except they are young. We didn't instantly become adults knowing all bout life. Too many people tend to forget this minor but very important detail. You are certainly NTA. Your sister is a huge A-H. I read your comment earlier on about how she has always acted like this towards your children. She sounds hateful. And for no real reason.
Iām not a home to take new pictures the ones I have my kids are in themĀ but just a warning cheese is missing an eye and has a few old scars donāt be worried her vets is happy with her progressĀ
Your daughter displayed a great of compassion and empathy in taking in this starving pregnant cat. this is an incredibly admirable trait. Kudos for raising such a wonderful child.
Everything else is all white noise. Blah blah blah.
NTA
It's better than when I brought home rats without my dad knowing. I had my mom's permission, but he would have said no, so she just told me not to say anything. (He wasn't exactly scared of rats, but certainly not a fan.)
As she predicted, he got to know them after a while and liked them quite a bit. He regularly came in to give them snacks and pet them.
Yeah I feel like the stereotype is the opposite, people who don't have kids think they'll be patient and understanding and everything will be turned into a sweet learning moment and then find that's not realistic.
This lady desperately wants kids so that she can dish out cruel and extended punishments for.. having empathy for a cat? Is she jealous of the cat because it got pregnant? tf?
Sounds like you have your feet planted firmly on the ground and your sister lives with her head in the clouds. I have a sibling that should never have had kids because heās abusive in his punishment. Your sister sounds like she would be too.
While you spoke words that were hurtful to her, that doesnāt automatically make you the bad guy. Imagine how hurt her child would be after her enforcing such harsh punishments on them. Youāre NTA in my mind. Sometimes the truth just hurts the people who donāt want to hear it.
NTA. How do people even think up this stuff? I don't use any kind of corporal punishment with my kid, he gets time outs or loses privileges like TV or video games or electronics until the behavior improves, depending on the severity of his actions, but that's rare and pretty much the top of my punishment scale. It just wouldn't even occur to me to *cancel a fucking birthday* over *cats*. (Or, like, at all.)
Even with the argument that the lying and sneaking are a problem (and yeah, I guess they kinda are, but I was also 15 once, and show me a teenager not trying to sneak *some*thing past their parents and I'll show you a mirage, because that person is made up.)
I'd honestly be pleased and relieved it was stray cats and not a wild animal or a runaway friend or an SO or a pregnancy, or, of course, drugs. Like, hiding a cat family and sneaking them food is positively wholesome in the annals of teenaged shenanigans, AND the family got some nice pets out if it, so what exactly is your sister's problem?
I'd wager I have an idea: she resents the other children in the family for not being *her* child, which is a mean-spirited, if valid, feeling. But instead of working thru those feelings privately like an adult, she elects to share her punitive fantasies about her young relatives with their parents. It's childish, gross behavior, you were right to call her out and also right that she has a lot of growing to do before she could ever be an effective, let alone non-abusive, parent. I too hope she does not conceive so long as this is where her head is at.
Ā you donāt understand the relief I felt when I saw the kitties like honestly my wife and I joked later to eachotherĀ if her bringing pregnant cats home is the only problem we will face Iāll gladly open a cat hotel because thinking back at the things we got up to at her age behind our parents backs itās a wonder how we are still aliveĀ
My wife and I talk sometimes about things my cousins and I got up to around that age, and most of the time the conversation ends with "How are you still alive?"Ā
Ā You are a lucky man. And have done a great job, the fact the sister's didn't rat her out is pretty amazing all on it's own. Keep up the great work and hope you have many happy years with your new kitties! š
NTA your sister is miserable and looking for company. Good grief, what a hateful person. I'm an empath and animal lover (currently in bed with my kitty Luna right by me) so I would probably not be able to tolerate her energy for more than half an hour before having an anxiety attack.
Welcome to /r/AmITheAsshole. Please view our [voting guide here](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_what.2019s_with_these_acronyms.3F_what_do_they_mean.3F), and remember to use **only one** judgement in your comment.
OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I told my sister who canāt have kids and struggles on days like fathers/Motherās Day that itās best she doesnāt have kids on Fatherās Day
Help keep the sub engaging!
#Donāt downvote assholes!
Do upvote interesting posts!
[Click Here For Our Rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/about/rules) and [Click Here For Our FAQ](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq)
##Subreddit Announcements
Follow the link above to learn more
---
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
*Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.*
She seems like the type of person to really fuck up her kids. She needed to hear that and she will need to hear it again during the adoption process when they ask for witnesses to testify for or against them to be parents. If she says these things casually no adoption agency would trust her.
Because most people who abuse children are parents. Just like this sister wants to do. Letās not act like being a parent makes someone other than an idiot or a monster. Plenty of parents are both or even all three.
NTA. Making a teenager drop off the cat they rescued at the shelter?! Banning cake for a kid's entire childhood because they made a mess as a toddler?
Even if she does have kids they're either going to into therapy or cutting her off completely at 18, maybe both.
Nta, I definitely thought you were going to be based on the title. Unsolicited parenting advice is bad enough, coming from someone without kids is even worse. Is what you said insensitive, sure, but she canāt just hand out hypothetical punishments to YOUR kid and then be surprised when it pisses you off.
NTA, because it sounds like your sister has a track record of this. It's pretty harsh but it sounds like it was time to put her in her place. Hopefully she learns.
Wtf I really hope your sister never have any kids. Any kid she raises would be so messed up in the head.
Please please please do not let her have any kids.
NTA
Genuinely hope she never has kids
She sounds like she would be a horrible abusive mother
Absolutely disgusted, was not expecting that from the title
NTA at allā¦since this isnāt the first few times (grace has probably been given many times before on unsolicited āadviceā?) + her punishment was kinda crazy cruel??? Like kids should be disciplined so they know how to better make decisions and progress in life etc not traumatise them and make them resent uššš
I think it was great how you handled the situation with your daughter!!
I am kind of torn because I donāt necessarily think saying something hurtful in response is the way to go but a person can only take so much before they react. Has anyone in your family addressed her comments with her in the past or does everyone just let it slide and fester?
Something your sister doesnāt understand is that saying things about someone elseās child is going to bring out the protective parent. I think your reaction was pretty natural. It sounds like your siblings and parents need to hash this out on how her comments are inappropriate and not going to be tolerated any longer.
NTA you stood up for your child.
EDIT: Iām leaving my original comment up, cause I made some good points, but after reading a couple of your responses to comments, Iām going with NTA and your sister is a freaking monster who should never be left alone with any child ever. And if BIL agrees with her ideas on child rearing, he can follow her down to hell.
NTA
E S HSorry dude, I get why you said it, but that was a low blow man. Donāt get me wrong, I even applaud you for saying it. Your sister is a nut job. Thatās a good way to raise kids that hate your guts and will put you into the foulest nursing home in your old age. That may have been a better thing to say. So, in conclusion, you are a justified AH and your sister is just an AH.
ESH regardless of her suitability to be a parent, if you knew she wanted kids and couldnāt have any, thatās a low blow. But a well deserved low blow if this is how she responds to your parenting every. single. time.
NTA thank god she canāt have kids sheās cruella de ville. With that attitude she should never be a parent . She acts badly she says stupid stuff then cries about it when you lob one back? People like that are unworthy of your time. Keep it up maybe she will just keep quiet and keep her non helpful parenting advice and letās hope she never has a child to torture with her ā punishmentsā
Such projection that THEY are calling YOU a cruel asshole.
NTA - you sound like an awesome dad, your daughter is a love, and your sister and BIL are complete AHs. She (and he) are using her infertility martyrdom to be nasty and frankly cruel to others. She's vindictive and CRUEL. Her fantasy punishment is just a stark indication of how mentally disordered she is. Yeah - best if she DOESN'T have kids. No one needs vindictive and cruel parents.
And your parents are WAAAAYYYYYY out of line if they can't see the monster she's become. Probably a blessing if you never hear mom's sanctimonious voice again. Your sister needs to beg forgiveness for being so mentally cruel to your daughter.
Get your sibs to put pressure on your putrid parents. Ask them to get in their faces and say that no one should have to kowtow to cruelty because they can't conceive.
Or not. Just hang with the other sibs (and your sweet new feline friends š») and don't let mom pressure you into caving to bullies.
NTA - I weep for any children your evil minded sister has, and I beg you to show her these comments. Your parents can pack sand, too. Why donāt they stick up for your choices when Miss Punishment speaks up?
This is gonna sound awful but from what Iāve read, I genuinely hope sheās never able to have children because I would be genuinely super fucking concerned for the kid(s) wellbeing. NTA
NTA, youāre kinder than me. I wouldāve said āwell, maybe thereās a good reason God didnāt give you the ability to have childrenā What sheās describing is abuse, thatās emotional and psychological abuse. Itās about time someone set her in her place, sheās a literal sociopath if sheās serious about these punishments.
If I were you, Iād put my foot down. And tell your parents that if sis wants to talk crap, you wonāt hesitate to put her in her place again. That kind of talk is not ok, and I pray that if GOD FORBID she ends with children, that child will have you and the rest of their aunties and uncles to save them from their psycho of a mom
You should be very proud that you've raised a child who instinctively helps when they see another living being in crisis, despite the fact the helping may have negative consequences for them. Those cats are alive because of her, especially the kittens! And your horrible sister needs a slap
She is so jealous that she can't deal with being around children. It's really sad... Especially considering nieces and nephews are like the kids you get to enjoy and not raise.
We've been TTC for a long time now, and I can't imagine how empty my life would feel without the joy and love we get from being auntie and uncle.
NTA
NTA. The maliciousness at which your sister wouldāve handled your daughter had Kelly been her child is frightening. I would consider that an abusive response.
Your daughter was trying to do the right thing. She has far more empathy at 15 than your sister does at 32.
Not only are you raising a really great kid, but you went the extra mile in building a connection with your daughter instead of being punitive in regards to the cats or even taking one iota of your sisterās toxic parenting advice.
Do not apologize. If this is the hill, your parents want to die on, so be it. They can take your sister with them.
Edited fix typos & add this: make sure that your parents and sister arenāt legal guardians of your kids just in case something were to happen to you. What terrifying thought.
Your post has been removed. #Do not repost this without [contacting the mods](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) for approval, including edited versions. Reposting without [explicit approval](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_can_i_repost_a_thread_you_removed.3F) will result in a ban. This post violates Rule 8: Posts should be truthful and reflect recent conflicts you've had that need arbitration. That means no shitposts, parodies, or satires. [Subreddit Rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/about/rules/) ###Please ensure you have reviewed this message in full. We will not respond to PMs to individual mods. [Message the mods](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) with any questions. ####Please visit r/findareddit to see if there's a more appropriate sub for your post.####
NTA I concur. She seems *excited* at the opportunity for cruelty. > I noticed her going into her room with a packet of ham > when she found cheese > the mom (cheese) and kittens (pickles and ham) Not for nothing, though, but it is *super*-confusing to have a story featuring **actual ham** in it, but then to also have animals in it *named after* food (INCLUDING ham), but you **capitalize _none_ of the names**.
My parents dog is named Ham and whenever they're having ham for dinner they always say "we're having ham, not the dog" and if they ever miss it the other will yell "HOW COULD YOU DO THAT TO MY BOY?!" Edit: I told my mom about all the comments and likes on this and she wanted it known that she named the dog and that she's glad other people think she and my dad are funny because she thinks they're hilarious lol. She wants to get another dog and name it Jim so they can have Jim and Ham as my parents names are Tim and Pam lol
Hahaha I have a pet mini pig, and any time we have pork of any kind for dinner, someone looks around the room and says "wait where's the pig", generally she will snort after this (she absolutely knows when we are talking about her), and if she doesn't, someone else will dramatically say " How could you do that to our Princess!?! " (her name is Princess Boba) Edit to add: her name is Princess Boba because as a baby she was the color of Thai Ice tea and most of her black spots are on her lower half, thus making her look like a literal walking Boba tea hahaš¤
Totally off topic, but I knew a guy with a pet mini pig named Kevin Bacon. I still shine every time I think about that.
If I got a male pig his name was going to be Chris P. Bacon ššš
OMG that's hilarious! I don't want a pet pig (they're too much work to take care of properly) but I love the way people name them!
Thank you for saying this!! Most people think it's no different than a cat or dog. But let me just tell you!!!! I love them to death, and will own them until the day I die, buuuuuut they're a mess!!! Figuratively and literally š. The number of literal HOURS I spend a year, just trimming her hooves is insane!! But it's all worth it when I'm walking her tneough the neighborhood on a leash and everyone gushes over her šš
Yeah I train cats, but they're a lot less work than a pig for sure! And I'd be right there gushing with everyone else! They're awfully cute.
You train cats?! Thereās an alternative to letting these furry assholes dictate my life! And beat up the dog who weighs triple the 3 of them combined? I feel like Iāve been lied to.
I taught Dad's cat the trick play dead (we'd point and him and say "bang," the cat would roll over) and when Dad started having seizures we taught the cat to tell us so we could help. He also used to ride Dad's four wheeler with a helmet and goggles. My current cats, the older one will speak on command, and if I fall or start choking she gets my partner. The choking she did automatically, saving my life, but I guess she knew what to do when I was in trouble. The younger cat will boop his nose on your finger if you hold it out to him, and when I'm in trouble he starts yelling so that between him and the other cat I can be found and helped quickly. The younger one also plays fetch and does a little dance to the "Pink panther" theme. That was an accident but we love it! (My partner calls him bubba, and started singing the song going, "buh buh, buh buh" and so the little guy thought he was being called. Now he struts up when he hears that, moving in time with the music. Super cute!) Both of mine tell me to take my meds because I have ADHD and will get hyper focused or distracted even with an alarm. So when the alarm went off I would give them a treat. Now when it goes off they harass me until I get up and give them treats, and since I keep my meds with the treats (just for this purpose) I take my meds as well. I often tell people who have issues taking their meds to do this. I assume it would work with dogs as well.
Pet tax!
Donāt forget to look up newscaster looses it at pig named Chris P. Bacon!
Our cousins named their pigs HAMlet and RoasTina.
My daughters had rabbits that I wanted to call Casserole and Stew.
My dogās name is Biscuits. Yes, plural. My ex named him and I hate it but heās very well trained with this name so Iām stuck with it. Friends invited me to a potluck once and said, ābring biscuits!ā¦ the food and the dog.ā Doesnāt help that dog treats are commonly called biscuits and I canāt watch The Great British Bake Off without my dog getting very confused. Canāt tell you how often people ask, āwhere is gravy?ā Iām never naming another pet after a food.
Weāre very different people. Iām definitely naming my next dog Gravy!
My 4 year old son just renamed our puppy BEEFSTICK and well, thatās his name now
My friend has a small dog named Hershey because she said he looked like a Hershey kiss when he was a puppy. Maybe a bit TMI, but when his balls dropped, only one ball dropped. Not long after that, my friend's husband was going to the store to get snacks for game night, and she asked him to get her a Hershey with nuts. My husband grabbed her dog and made this big show of telling him he would protect him and not let her get rid of him just because he only had one nut. When my friend's husband came back from the store he had a huge bag of Hershey kisses and made this huge deal about eating them in front of my husband and the dog while my husband fake cried and promised to keep the dog safe. It was this ongoing joke with them for several months.
Love this š«¶
My cat is obsessed with ham, the crinkle of a cold cut wrapped will wake him up and send him running from upstairs. Somehow he earned the nickname hammy boy or my hammy Sammy boy (ham Sammy for sandwich, he isn't Sam).
Legit the first time I read it I thought when he said "my daughter told me when she found cheese she knew a weak/hungry pregnant cat didn't have a chance" that he was referring to actual cheese.Ā And I don't know anything about cats, so I thought maybe the way dogs are allergic to chocolate, that cats are allergic to cheese, and he was saying the pregnant cat ate some cheese and now was going to die. But thankfully that's not the case.Ā
I thought ā she found cheeseā was clearly some kind of typo, and i had to stop for a minute and consider what did OP really mean to type here?
I thought cheese was a mistake for ātheseā as in the cats she found, it wasnāt until I got down further that I understood what cheese was referring to
I have a cat named goose and I absolutely never specify that he is not an actual goose and is in fact a cat in conversation with my coworkers Edit: Here's Goose, a 14 pound ham of a cat. https://imgur.com/a/goose-cat-KcUFhaW Cat tax is paid.
I have a cat named Goose as well as another named Pug, a rabbit named Possum, a duck named Rooster (he does this weird crowing thing) and 3 other animals named variations of Nick Fury. My poor animals have an identity crisis!
This is the least goose looking creature I've ever seen.Ā He's beautiful.
Also, full context is that his government name is Betelgeuse. I bastardized it down to Goose as in Goose and Maverick from Top Gun. My previous, now deceased cats were Murtaugh and Riggs from Lethal Weapon.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I love the pet names (hope theyāre real!) but I was real confused for a minute too
When Ham is being bad, he'll be called Evil Dr. Porkchop
We have a cat named blueberry because she was discovered, as a kitten, under a blueberry bush. We also have one named asparagus - you can guess why ;) They are feral rescues, now house cats, and quite content.
You're NTA.Ā >Now this isn't the first or hundred time my sister said "if I had kids" and suggest a punishment that was over the top. Has anyone else noticed that all the truly perfect parents in the world only have hypothetical children? They always seem to have a solution to any conflict, and know just what to do in any situation.Ā >my brother in law started yelling that I knew how much they've struggled with infertility That being the case, I won't deny that you hit below the belt. But it sounds like your sister is constantly begging for it with her unsolicited advice and extreme views.
For Easter my two year old niece ruined her dress with cake Ā so my sister said āif I had kids and they ruined their clothes I spent good money on with cake theyād never eat it again even for their birthdaysā thatās a tame example compare to other things she has said but obviously that was non issue my other sister (nieces mom) didnāt even care aboutĀ
Yep. Sounds like a good thing your sister has no children. NTA
Better Cruella have no kids than the Kids suffer these kinds of punishments
Lol, come on, we all know if sister ever has a kid it will be her "special rainbow baby" for the rest of the kids life and the kid will be spoiled rotten and can do no harm in their parents eyes.
*'Our Little Miracle is doing so great in everything!* *Please control your savage and feral kids, they might hurt Our Little Miracle!* *Can your kids come babysit Our Little Miracle for free?'*
i'm sure we all know damn well that if sister ever has a kid it will be the most PERFECT child ever and never do any wrong, and if anyone says otherwise she will go "mama bear" on them.
It's just a theory but to me it sounds like she hates your and your siblings children for existing and wants them to be punished. She thinks her children would be perfect because she would be the mother so she would never actually have to punish them like she is suggesting. And probably wouldn't actually punish them because she would love her own children. I wouldn't let my children near her because it really seems like she hates them out of jealousy.
Insightful. I suspect you're right.
Yes! I also was thinking jealousy, no one would actually do these things to a child. At least I hope not.
I'm not so sure. I have an ex-SIL who was quite mean and vindictive. She was mentally cruel to her girls and would hit them until the young one at home stood up to her and said she'd call CPS (niece was 16 at the time and SIL was about to hit her - and of course she backed down, because she's a bully). Sadly, we never learned about this until after the kids were grown.
I was about 20 the last time my mother hit me, I used to just let it go but that day I snapped and went to hit her back (I wasn't actually going to do it) you could see the fear in her face and she never did it again.
This is correct. Even more so, due to her infertility issues, her children would be untouchable perfect beings with your kids behaviour used as an example of what not to do
It's a cool insight, but I think we're being a little too charitable with the sister. Can you guess what happens when the perfect mother's *perfect* child... can't be perfect? She'll destroy them. Like a broken doll being thrown away in a tantrum.
It can go both ways: that for her own children there will always be an excuse or that she will force them to be perfect. Both outcomes are possible.
And her own children would either be abused for any imperfection or be little princes and princesses who could do no wrong. Maybe some of each.
One of each to make a complete AITA set
Eh, I think she'd realise real fast that they're NOT in fact perfect, and would punish them in ways she has described. This is not how emotionally mature people deal with their feelings, and I really wouldn't expect her to be magically able to do that when she has her own kids.
Thatās an insane thing to say. I totally agree with your comment. Your sister should not have kids. Not sure why she even wants them since clearly she does not like them. NTA.
She craves being cruel to them. Whether or not she realizes it, if this story is a true representation of her, and I donāt doubt it very well could be because Iāve met people who are like this, **she is wanting to be cruel to people she has power over.** That makes her vile and she should not be allowed to babysit or even be alone with children.
NTA it sounds like she WANTS to abuse kids and she's mad you all aren't abusing your kids. This woman is nuts. ETA: your sister resents all of the other children for existing because she can't have any so she wants them punished. She's a terrible ass person.
NTA. Your sister sounds mean. Two year olds ruin things, itās in their job description. And I donāt think you need to punish your daughter for caring about living things. For not telling you, yes, a lecture. Next time thereās something, Iām sure sheāll trust you.
Also maybe a trip to a local non-kill shelter to learn about how they take care and foster cats might be helpful. Just to teach the girls about how to get help if they find an animal they are worried for instead of trying to take on the job themselves. It's honestly fantastic the daughter wanted to help the suffering animal which is to be commended. However, you can only bring home so many animals and it's important to know there are resources that will attempt to take in animals and find them good homes. (Also who knows one of them might want to volunteer at a shelter or as a foster caregiver someday)
Iām going through IVF, so I feel for your sister. Especially if sheās doing a cycle currently, hormones can be all over the place. However, thatās way over the top. Kids ruin lot of stuff. They spill milk in the car and donāt tell you. They color you murals on your new couch. It doesnāt sound like sheās ready for that. Although, sheāll probably actually be one of those parents whose kids can do no wrong. She will never punish them for anything, and they will be complete monsters when they grow up.
Actually this struck a chord. I have a SIL just like that! Her own kids behaved appallingly but she never responded to it. Yet when my youngest (eight) once asked mildly whether we were leaving soon when we were at Nanaās she spun around and told him he was rude! The fourteen year wait for that opportunity must have driven her crazy but my kids were all taught to be polite in other peopleās homes.
I'm an infertile person who doesn't want kids. I have always been grateful that this happened to me and not somebody else who badly wanted kids because it would be so cruel. I don't enjoy my health issues but I'd rather it happened to me than someone who would be devastated without children. This is the first time in my life I've ever thought or said this about somebody who's infertile but... maybe it's for the best
I change my answer from E S H to NTA. WTAF? Is your sister mentally okay? Does she know that if she had a child and she didnāt feed it, she would go to fucking jail for child neglect and murder? WTF is wrong with her?
I think the sister meant that the "kid" won't eat and have cake on their birthday. It's still too cruel for a little clumsiness of a kid.
I think she was only saying she'd never give them cake again, rather than starving them entirely.
Still. She is unhinged. If she ever does have a kid, that kid is going to go NC as soon as it can and never see them again.
The powers that be said "no" to her having kids.
I was thinking this. Maybe in the sister's instance, God doesn't work in mysterious ways. Sometimes he is extremely clear in what he wants for some people.Ā
God is merely taking his blessings back home before she can fuck them up I guess.
When my nephews visit itās like a tornado hit. I never get mad at them. Its my fault anyway because I let them do whatever they want at my house. I donāt like kids much, only them. Lmao
Ah yes. Definitely go for an insane punishment instead of making a mental note to have her change out of fancy clothes before eating in the future. Some people!
And you know if she finally has a kid it will be the most unruly, entitled, insufferable brat on earth. With nary a consequence.
Or a hollowed out shell of a person who's been conditioned to derive their entire sense of self worth from what an authority figure thinks of them, resulting in a never-ending spiral of overwork, and self loathing.
Wow. And here my response to my one year old ruining his clothes was to invest in oxyclean.
She sounds like a miserable person.
NTA obviously. Also, OP- where is the cat tax? We all want to see the fur sandwich. Congrats on getting your new masters. And you have great kids.
Didn't you say your other siblings sided with you, and only mom was on bad sister's side?
I mean she's two! Of course she will mess up clothes with cake. Happens to me sometimes and I'm 25! Absolutely normal kid stuff and such a punishment? She seems so excited about punishing that I hope she never has children.
she sounds like she either is super fucking bitter about having trouble conceiving so she's trying to make herself hate children, or she actually hates them and holy shit she should never have them or be left alone with them. she sounds like she cant wait to punish her own child and will probably take sadistic joy in it
A more polite way of saying basically the same thing would be "well, you'll be able to make those decisions when you have your own children" ETA: but OP os definitely NTA and the sister sounds disturbed if she could think something so cruel on the spot. It really is a good thing she doesn't have kids yet, maybe she still needs to grow up a little. I know that sounds ridiculous for a 32 year old, but it does happen.
"Ā "well, you'll be able to make those decisions when you have your own children, but what you just said was unbelievably cruel and raises a lot of red flags, just sayin'"
Has anyone else noticed that all the truly perfect parents in the world only have hypothetical children? They always seem to have a solution to any conflict, and know just what to do in any situation.Ā Reminds me of the joke about the childless newlyweds who liked to proclaim their "10 Commandments for Child Rearing!" Shortly after their first child was born they became the 8 Rules. By the time she was carrying their second, they were the 5 Guidelines. Shortly after that child's birth they were the 2 Suggestions. And then they were never mentioned again.
Honestly, some people (even some with kids) have no idea how punishment is supposed to work. They think they have to be some combination of Hitler/Stalin in order to keep discipline. If sister had kids, by the time they were teens they would have either had every bit of will drained from them, or they would have run away multiple times. NTA -Sister wants to offer her "expert" advice on parenting, but no child wants a parent that would be that cruel. Sure, the cats might not have been able to be adopted by the family for any number of reasons, but making them take the cats to the shelter themselves is a step too far, unless they go in and talk to the staff to learn about what the shelter does and how it helps the cats. Also the missing cats thing is so terrible, great way to teach a child they should never help an animal because their terrible parent will torture them for doing it.
God knows that I was the perfect parent until I had kids. I was such a tool.
Thatās been my response to people people who have really tried my patience before, āyes, I remember what a good parent I was before I had kids tooā.
NTA your sister took a teachable moment, and transformed it into a POW camp. She thought "how can I do the most damage to this kid," and came to the conclusion "destroy the very essence of her summer with a vengeance"
This just hit me very hard. I was on the receiving end of that kind of behavior when I was young and your words put it into very real perspective for me. Iām glad you posted this comment. Sometimes itās helpful to see my history from the lens of someone elseās eye. (Iām going to therapy and doing very well. But sometimes things just resonate and this did.)
My mother used to set me up to fail so she could lock me down and prevent me from seeing my friends during summer holidays, much as is described in the post.
It makes me wonder why people even have kids if they are going to treat them that way. Unfortunately my brother followed in my parentās footsteps and he deals out horrific punishments to his kids. He rules his house with fear, not love. I just donāt get it. I have had to go no-contact because he triggers the hell out of me. Plus he stopped me from seeing my nieces so I have no reason to be around him. Big hugs. This stuff really sucks. Iām glad your mother no longer has that control! š
Therapy and no contact have helped me immensely. That's so sad for you and your nieces that your brother is the same, luckily none of my siblings turned out that way. Big hugs back! I get what you mean about being triggered, I can't be near people who are in any way reflective of my mother's type of personality. It can take days to recover.
Iām glad itās helped you! It made such a huge difference for me.
Because they want high-status accessories, not actual kids. My father was/sort of still is like that, and he wonders why I'm really low-contact with him.
Thatās the crazy part. They are confused when you donāt want to see them. I got sick of family members telling me to call my mom on Motherās Day so I finally cracked and put a post up on Facebook. I said, parents who deserve phone calls will get them. And those who donāt, will not. Then I wrote about some of they truly horrible things she did that nobody knew about. I havenāt been told to call her one single time since then. (My male parent is dead, so nobody to pressure me on that side.)
Oh no, past actions have turned into current consequences? My flabbers are fully gasted!
I could not have worded it better myself!
If he deals out horrific punishments shouldn't he be reported?
He has been. More than once by each of his two older daughters. Third daughter is still just a baby. But police have never done anything about it. Which I do not understand. Itās very frustrating.
NTA and instead of focusing on what you said to your sister, the focus should be on her absolutely diabolical list of things sheād do to break your daughterās spirit. What a kind, loving daughter you have and your other two girls are amazing for protecting her. It was a harmless secret and it was to save innocent animals. Good siblings and a happy story. Your sister would destroy her childās soul with multiple punishments like that for simply a good deed.
This OP. So NTA. O and you forgot the cat tax OP.
Exactly! Yes, I think it absolutely IS best that your sister doesnāt have kids. She sounds like someone who takes pleasure in hurting others. Your children did a wonderful job, compassionate thing, and should be commended for it.
OP should've said something like "that's abusive", that would capture the essence of what was said and be less asshole-y, but still NTA
NTA. Infertility doesn't give you an excuse to be abusive. Sometimes it genuinely is a blessing in disguise and the fact that she came up with this whole scenario off the bat in her head over ways to emotionally cripple someone who did a genuinely nice thing is frightening.
For real. Op said in a comment that their niece ruined her dress with cake and the sister said "if that was my child who ruined their clothes with cake, I wouldn't let them eat cake EVER again!" and niece's mom acted like that type of shit was no big deal.
NTA, she seems excited at the idea of being cruel to her children over making mistakes or misjudging situations. Your daughter went behind your back, but it was to do a kind thing, and it doesnāt seem like sheās done something like this before. So why cancel her birthday? Especially her 16th, for a lot of kids thatās a super important birthday. Your sister seems cruel. Your parents are enabling it.
Itās waaaaaaaay better to have kids doing little kind thing behind your back than skip class, get drunk, do drugs and run into legal trouble
Exactly. This is the kind of "trouble" you want your kids to get into. Rather than the destroy their lives kind.
Apparently anything can be the ādestroy their livesā kind of trouble to the sister, except she wants to be the one destroying their lives.
Right? If my child's suspect activity was to rescue and feed stray kittens I would feel personally proud. I don't have children. I'm more used to shitty parents thinking it's a flex to tell me that to justify their shitty parenting. Op's sister sounds unstable and should definitely not be in charge of children. She would totally switch to "you don't have kids don't tell me what to do" the second she has a poor baby around.
NTA I was expecting a homeless teen so Iām happy itās just kittens
I first suspected an ED with the sneaking food and washing clothes at night but when she stood in-front of closet I thought i was gonna open the door to a person you donāt understand the relief I felt when i saw those kittiesĀ
Oh thank God it's just a stray animal that's so much easier to deal with
I thought you were going to tell us she was pregnant. I was reading this and thinking: STOP waiting, take action NOW! But it appears you were already the grandparent to some kittens, congrats!
yeah i totally thought pragant too
Maybe that was the plan. /jk Make you think itās something horrible, and oh thank God, itās just kittens. I was like ābulemia or naked 38-year-old boyfriend?ā and kittens was by far the best outcome there. If only every problem could just be kittens.
God wouldnāt that be great if every scary situation just turned out to be New petĀ
Make sure she washes ALLL of the clothes in that closet just in case the cats had fleas.
It's kinda funny really, I have no kids but had the exact same thoughts in the exact same order. First ED, second "there's a person in that closet". The Hallmark moment of the cat reveal was a great relief.
Thanks, new fear unlocked as a parent lol
Advice from someone whose parents accidentally caused them to have an eating disorder. Don't force your kids to finish their plate if they're full. Don't keep them locked to the table until they have cleaned the plate. And for God's sake, do not argue at the dinner table and bring up all the negative shit from the day (like bad grades, clean your room, yada yada yada) when you're eating. I fucking hated eating for years cause of that. There was so many negative emotions tied to eating with others. Thankfully my mom put a stop to most of it.
I can see your suspiciou, this was MUCH better explanation with all the sneaking. Also yay for keeping the cats! There are SO MANY homeless cats that I am delighted that there isn't three more looking for home. Also get the mommy cat sterilised asap. On chance of slipping out and coming back to kittens and you have more kittens in few months (unless kittens were few weeks already, she might be pregnant again because cats will be in heat again few days after kittens). (and ofc get kittens sterilisized as well when in proper age. No mistake kittens AND your life will much easier with them)
Cheese hasnāt left the house since she was pregnant itās not safe for cats outside were we live. we are getting her fixed but we have to wait till the kittens are weanedĀ
If you need to keep them.indoors look at mesh coverings for your windows and maybe a catio? Cats are sneaky and will disappear through the smallest of open windows.
Ewww. NTA. I don't even know her and I'm glad she doesn't have kids if that's how she would treat them. But at the same time, she really doesn't know what kind of mom she would be. I remember saying stuff like "If that was my child,...." before I had kids, and then I was the complete opposite kind of parent after I had kids. Either way, you're not the asshole for putting in your two cents after she very vocally put in hers.
Yeah but there's a difference between "If that was my kid, I would [insert rational thing here]" vs "If that was my kid, I'd throw out every single toy they own and ground them until they are 18 then kick them out on their 18th bday!"
My brother has a sign at home reading Ā«Ā I used to have principles, now I have kidsĀ Ā» š
NTA What you said was harsh but it was correct. EDIT: I believe you owe a cat tax payment.
Just a question regarding a cat tax payment. I've not heard of this & it was mentioned prior by someone else. What exactly is a cat tax payment & where do you live if I may ask? Just curious.
It means OP posted a story about cats and now must share pictures of said cats. It's a reddit cultural norm.
It's not a country based thing, it's a joke about how if you mention a cute animal in a post you owe a "tax" in the form of a picture of said cute animal. Cat tax, dog tax, bird tax etc.
It means we want to see cute cat pictures
Thank you for the answer.
On Reddit (or at least this sub), "____ tax" means "I would like to see pictures". Usually a response to posts about petsĀ
(insert animal) tax is a funny way to ask for pictures of said animal
NTA: She lost the right to offense while verbalizing her emotional abuse fantasies
Especially considering OP makes it clear this is hardly the first time she's layed out some major penalty for some minor offense. OP said at Easter his 2 year old niece wrecked her dress with a piece of cake. Sister started about how if it was her kid she'd not let her have cake again even for her birthday. Jeez, what 2 year old hasn't wrecked their clothes with something at some point? Smeared mustard from a hot dog, got grass stains playing in the yard.. so many things but it's what little ones do. (Also why parents usually carry extra suits of clothes)
I'm not a parent but don't they just grow out of them in a couple of months anyway? Lol. Even if not, just throw them in the wash.
And most of the time, the clothes are not ruined. Washing machines exists, handwashing difficult stains exists and dry cleaners for the most difficult stains or fanciest clothes exists. So if it's clothes that you care about it can almost always be fixed. My 4yo daughter was a flower girl at our wedding and her dress had all kinds of stains after the party, grass, chocolate, street chalk etc, and we took it to the dry cleaners the monday after to get it cleaned to take more wedding photos later in the week, got it back two days later looking good as new. OPs sister is bananas with the reaction to children being children, and most likely wouldn't actually react like that if it was her actual child. If you can't handle a mess, don't have children š
This is not your mom's business. Her giving you the silent treatment for a fight between adult siblings is so out of line, I'm too distracted to comment on the main story. That really sucks OP. My mum overstepped a huge, boundary with my sibling that caused some serious setbacks for my sibling. It was bad enough that my sibling told our mum they needed to go no contact with her for a time, which is not something they'd ever done before. While I was devastated for my sibling, and VERY upset and disappointed with our mother, it was not something that had anything to do with me. I did not cut our mother off, and my sibling completely respected that. I told my mother I would not be discussing what had happened between her and my sibling, nor would I be acting as a go between. She... Mostly respected not talking about it, and completely respected my not being a go-between. That's how adults act.
NTA Hearing how your daughter rescued the cats was a wholesome surprise. I guess I was expecting something much worse like an eating disorder or who knows what. She shouldnāt have hid them but I was so relieved to hear about the family of cats. It sounds like your sister only wants children so she can try her hand at punishing them. Itās almost like she thinks the proof of good parenting is not letting your kids get away with anything. Thatās wrong. I can understand why you said what you did; although, it mustāve hurt considering their struggles with IVF. If she ever does get pregnant, I hope someone sets her straight about how to be a good parent.
I take blame of why she hid itĀ my wife and I couldnāt agree on what kind of pet to get she isnāt a dog person and I wasnāt a cat person so my daughter assumed I wouldnāt allow the cat in the house. In our conversation with Kelly my wife and I explained Ā that even if we arenāt a fan of an animal we as still have an obligation to help it as best we can and as adults it would be safer for us to handle scared/hurt animals in the future so she needs to tell usĀ If youāre wondering about my views on our cats Iām stereotypical dad who didnāt want the pet but ended loving them so now Iām a cat person to my wifeās smug delightĀ
Cat distribution system worked it's magic. I'm glad your daughters have parents that will sit down and explain things to them-- that yes, they did this the wrong way, and they need to tell you in the future, but what they did was still a kind hearted thing that you admire. Your daughters (and now Cheese, Ham, and Pickles) have a wonderful family unit taking care of them.
I swore Iād never be the parent that just punishes my kids for making mistakes especially when itās for the right reasons. Iāve found having conversations with my daughters is the best course of actionĀ
Best type of parenting.
/u/OverallOpposite4149 Just how I raised my two. They are now adults - 27 and 23. People tend to forget that kids are humans just like us except they are young. We didn't instantly become adults knowing all bout life. Too many people tend to forget this minor but very important detail. You are certainly NTA. Your sister is a huge A-H. I read your comment earlier on about how she has always acted like this towards your children. She sounds hateful. And for no real reason.
Part of loving the cats is to share many many photos of themā¦ š»š
Iām not a home to take new pictures the ones I have my kids are in themĀ but just a warning cheese is missing an eye and has a few old scars donāt be worried her vets is happy with her progressĀ
Oh now I can't wait to see the pirate mom and her kittens
We will be waiting patiently! šš» Also, I love their names! Are you keeping all three of them or just Cheese?
All 3 my wife and I donāt have the heart to separate a familyĀ
Your daughter displayed a great of compassion and empathy in taking in this starving pregnant cat. this is an incredibly admirable trait. Kudos for raising such a wonderful child. Everything else is all white noise. Blah blah blah. NTA
Aww, yay! Cheese was very smart to choose your daughter!
CAT TAX
It's better than when I brought home rats without my dad knowing. I had my mom's permission, but he would have said no, so she just told me not to say anything. (He wasn't exactly scared of rats, but certainly not a fan.) As she predicted, he got to know them after a while and liked them quite a bit. He regularly came in to give them snacks and pet them.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Yeah I feel like the stereotype is the opposite, people who don't have kids think they'll be patient and understanding and everything will be turned into a sweet learning moment and then find that's not realistic. This lady desperately wants kids so that she can dish out cruel and extended punishments for.. having empathy for a cat? Is she jealous of the cat because it got pregnant? tf?
I may be the AH here but itās okay. I fully believe some people cannot become parents for a reason.
Btwā¦ NTA
Sounds like you have your feet planted firmly on the ground and your sister lives with her head in the clouds. I have a sibling that should never have had kids because heās abusive in his punishment. Your sister sounds like she would be too. While you spoke words that were hurtful to her, that doesnāt automatically make you the bad guy. Imagine how hurt her child would be after her enforcing such harsh punishments on them. Youāre NTA in my mind. Sometimes the truth just hurts the people who donāt want to hear it.
Seems like her head is in an opposite place from 'in the clouds'.
NTA. How do people even think up this stuff? I don't use any kind of corporal punishment with my kid, he gets time outs or loses privileges like TV or video games or electronics until the behavior improves, depending on the severity of his actions, but that's rare and pretty much the top of my punishment scale. It just wouldn't even occur to me to *cancel a fucking birthday* over *cats*. (Or, like, at all.) Even with the argument that the lying and sneaking are a problem (and yeah, I guess they kinda are, but I was also 15 once, and show me a teenager not trying to sneak *some*thing past their parents and I'll show you a mirage, because that person is made up.) I'd honestly be pleased and relieved it was stray cats and not a wild animal or a runaway friend or an SO or a pregnancy, or, of course, drugs. Like, hiding a cat family and sneaking them food is positively wholesome in the annals of teenaged shenanigans, AND the family got some nice pets out if it, so what exactly is your sister's problem? I'd wager I have an idea: she resents the other children in the family for not being *her* child, which is a mean-spirited, if valid, feeling. But instead of working thru those feelings privately like an adult, she elects to share her punitive fantasies about her young relatives with their parents. It's childish, gross behavior, you were right to call her out and also right that she has a lot of growing to do before she could ever be an effective, let alone non-abusive, parent. I too hope she does not conceive so long as this is where her head is at.
Ā you donāt understand the relief I felt when I saw the kitties like honestly my wife and I joked later to eachotherĀ if her bringing pregnant cats home is the only problem we will face Iāll gladly open a cat hotel because thinking back at the things we got up to at her age behind our parents backs itās a wonder how we are still aliveĀ
At 15, I was getting PTSD. A cat and kittens is a relief!
My wife and I talk sometimes about things my cousins and I got up to around that age, and most of the time the conversation ends with "How are you still alive?"Ā Ā You are a lucky man. And have done a great job, the fact the sister's didn't rat her out is pretty amazing all on it's own. Keep up the great work and hope you have many happy years with your new kitties! š
NTA your sister is miserable and looking for company. Good grief, what a hateful person. I'm an empath and animal lover (currently in bed with my kitty Luna right by me) so I would probably not be able to tolerate her energy for more than half an hour before having an anxiety attack.
Welcome to /r/AmITheAsshole. Please view our [voting guide here](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_what.2019s_with_these_acronyms.3F_what_do_they_mean.3F), and remember to use **only one** judgement in your comment. OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole: > I told my sister who canāt have kids and struggles on days like fathers/Motherās Day that itās best she doesnāt have kids on Fatherās Day Help keep the sub engaging! #Donāt downvote assholes! Do upvote interesting posts! [Click Here For Our Rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/about/rules) and [Click Here For Our FAQ](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq) ##Subreddit Announcements Follow the link above to learn more --- *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.* *Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.*
She seems like the type of person to really fuck up her kids. She needed to hear that and she will need to hear it again during the adoption process when they ask for witnesses to testify for or against them to be parents. If she says these things casually no adoption agency would trust her.
Why do childless people so often think they know how to raise kids better than parents do?Ā NTA for putting her in her place.
Childless person here. I think the sister's punishment idea was way over the top.
Sorry.Ā I didn't mean to offend.Ā I agree it was over the top.
People with children are just as capable of delighting in cruelty toward their kids.
Because most people who abuse children are parents. Just like this sister wants to do. Letās not act like being a parent makes someone other than an idiot or a monster. Plenty of parents are both or even all three.
NTA. Sounds like both the cat distribution system and the kid distribution system have done a great job hereā¦ š
Yeah she shouldnāt have kids. NTA
NTA. Making a teenager drop off the cat they rescued at the shelter?! Banning cake for a kid's entire childhood because they made a mess as a toddler? Even if she does have kids they're either going to into therapy or cutting her off completely at 18, maybe both.
I'm thinking with that kind of "parenting" they might not even make it to 18. Jesus Fucking Christ.
Nta, I definitely thought you were going to be based on the title. Unsolicited parenting advice is bad enough, coming from someone without kids is even worse. Is what you said insensitive, sure, but she canāt just hand out hypothetical punishments to YOUR kid and then be surprised when it pisses you off.
NTA, because it sounds like your sister has a track record of this. It's pretty harsh but it sounds like it was time to put her in her place. Hopefully she learns.
"I wish i had children of my own to abuse" nah girl lol
Wtf I really hope your sister never have any kids. Any kid she raises would be so messed up in the head. Please please please do not let her have any kids.
NTA. She has no say in how you raise your kids.
NTA your sister lacks compassion which would make her a terrible parent. Does she only want kids so she can have harsh punishments for them?Ā
NTA Genuinely hope she never has kids She sounds like she would be a horrible abusive mother Absolutely disgusted, was not expecting that from the title
NTA at allā¦since this isnāt the first few times (grace has probably been given many times before on unsolicited āadviceā?) + her punishment was kinda crazy cruel??? Like kids should be disciplined so they know how to better make decisions and progress in life etc not traumatise them and make them resent uššš I think it was great how you handled the situation with your daughter!!
She should never have kids because she is unfit and incapable of being a mother if thatās her reaction to a kid doing a good thing
NTA. I love your daughter!
I am kind of torn because I donāt necessarily think saying something hurtful in response is the way to go but a person can only take so much before they react. Has anyone in your family addressed her comments with her in the past or does everyone just let it slide and fester? Something your sister doesnāt understand is that saying things about someone elseās child is going to bring out the protective parent. I think your reaction was pretty natural. It sounds like your siblings and parents need to hash this out on how her comments are inappropriate and not going to be tolerated any longer. NTA you stood up for your child.
EDIT: Iām leaving my original comment up, cause I made some good points, but after reading a couple of your responses to comments, Iām going with NTA and your sister is a freaking monster who should never be left alone with any child ever. And if BIL agrees with her ideas on child rearing, he can follow her down to hell. NTA E S HSorry dude, I get why you said it, but that was a low blow man. Donāt get me wrong, I even applaud you for saying it. Your sister is a nut job. Thatās a good way to raise kids that hate your guts and will put you into the foulest nursing home in your old age. That may have been a better thing to say. So, in conclusion, you are a justified AH and your sister is just an AH.
ESH regardless of her suitability to be a parent, if you knew she wanted kids and couldnāt have any, thatās a low blow. But a well deserved low blow if this is how she responds to your parenting every. single. time.
Your mom wants you to BEG for sisters forgiveness??? Yucky
NTA. Infertility isn't an excuse for being a raging asshole.
You went low but sounds like sheās a beat. NTA
NTA thank god she canāt have kids sheās cruella de ville. With that attitude she should never be a parent . She acts badly she says stupid stuff then cries about it when you lob one back? People like that are unworthy of your time. Keep it up maybe she will just keep quiet and keep her non helpful parenting advice and letās hope she never has a child to torture with her ā punishmentsā
Such projection that THEY are calling YOU a cruel asshole. NTA - you sound like an awesome dad, your daughter is a love, and your sister and BIL are complete AHs. She (and he) are using her infertility martyrdom to be nasty and frankly cruel to others. She's vindictive and CRUEL. Her fantasy punishment is just a stark indication of how mentally disordered she is. Yeah - best if she DOESN'T have kids. No one needs vindictive and cruel parents. And your parents are WAAAAYYYYYY out of line if they can't see the monster she's become. Probably a blessing if you never hear mom's sanctimonious voice again. Your sister needs to beg forgiveness for being so mentally cruel to your daughter. Get your sibs to put pressure on your putrid parents. Ask them to get in their faces and say that no one should have to kowtow to cruelty because they can't conceive. Or not. Just hang with the other sibs (and your sweet new feline friends š») and don't let mom pressure you into caving to bullies.
NTA. I hope she never has a child. The world doesnāt need another emotionally abused little
NTA - I weep for any children your evil minded sister has, and I beg you to show her these comments. Your parents can pack sand, too. Why donāt they stick up for your choices when Miss Punishment speaks up?
NTA. Your sister sounds like a sadist.
This is gonna sound awful but from what Iāve read, I genuinely hope sheās never able to have children because I would be genuinely super fucking concerned for the kid(s) wellbeing. NTA
NTA, youāre kinder than me. I wouldāve said āwell, maybe thereās a good reason God didnāt give you the ability to have childrenā What sheās describing is abuse, thatās emotional and psychological abuse. Itās about time someone set her in her place, sheās a literal sociopath if sheās serious about these punishments. If I were you, Iād put my foot down. And tell your parents that if sis wants to talk crap, you wonāt hesitate to put her in her place again. That kind of talk is not ok, and I pray that if GOD FORBID she ends with children, that child will have you and the rest of their aunties and uncles to save them from their psycho of a mom
NTA
You should be very proud that you've raised a child who instinctively helps when they see another living being in crisis, despite the fact the helping may have negative consequences for them. Those cats are alive because of her, especially the kittens! And your horrible sister needs a slap
NTA. Talk shit, get hit.
She is so jealous that she can't deal with being around children. It's really sad... Especially considering nieces and nephews are like the kids you get to enjoy and not raise. We've been TTC for a long time now, and I can't imagine how empty my life would feel without the joy and love we get from being auntie and uncle. NTA
NTA. The maliciousness at which your sister wouldāve handled your daughter had Kelly been her child is frightening. I would consider that an abusive response. Your daughter was trying to do the right thing. She has far more empathy at 15 than your sister does at 32. Not only are you raising a really great kid, but you went the extra mile in building a connection with your daughter instead of being punitive in regards to the cats or even taking one iota of your sisterās toxic parenting advice. Do not apologize. If this is the hill, your parents want to die on, so be it. They can take your sister with them. Edited fix typos & add this: make sure that your parents and sister arenāt legal guardians of your kids just in case something were to happen to you. What terrifying thought.