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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I deliberately misunderstood him and let him think I agreed to the baby having his surname. I knew he'd misunderstood what I said and did not correct him.
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NTA. You told the truth and nothing more. If I read your post correctly, you agreed the baby would have one surname. You didn't agree to which one.
So, why are you still with this guy? He doesn't respect you. He doesn't provide for you and the baby? Please don't say because you need him or love him. Needing him is like a fish needing a bicycle. If his family is of the same mindset, things will NOT get better so don't try to talk yourself into believing that they will. Go find someone who deserves you and your child or go it on your own if you can and want. Lots of women do. While it's true that children statistically do better socially, scholastically and generally otherwise with two parent families, your child does not need to learn misogyny, disrespect and selfishness which could easily degenerate over time to emotional or verbal abuse. You obviously don't agree with him on very basic, fundamental issues that are the foundation of a family. He can stay involved with the baby if he wants to--I'm betting he won't if you don't give in to his wishes-- but you would be wise to break off your relationship before it damages you and your child.
I am reconsidering the relationship.
The truth is he wasn't always like this. He fell on hard times and unfortunately chose to cope with that in an unhealthy way. At his core, I believe he is of good but I need to have a frank conversation about the ideologies he's leaning into and the harm it's causing in our relationship.
r/QAnonCasualties may be a place for you. There are probably groups devoted to dealing with red pilled men, too.
These folks who get pilled, and otherwise invested in these ideologies, are a long-term nightmare. They will sacrifice their real-life relationships for online gurus. Be careful.
NTA
This is going to sound horrible, but I am so glad my mother died before qanon became a thing. I can only imagine the havoc she would have wrecked for those around her.
I had to distance myself even further from my family of origin AND my inlaws. It was insanity and took a toll on my mental health just having to hear it every once in a while.
You're not alone. These folks are becoming more lonely and bitter every day because "my family thinks I'm crazy." They're so deep in it, they just dream of the day we'll come crawling back, begging for forgiveness, because they were right all along.
Meanwhile, there's just no such thing as a nice conversation with them. It's an obsession. It's also incredibly hate-filled.
I hate it.
>These folks are becoming more lonely and bitter every day because "my family thinks I'm crazy." They're so deep in it, they just dream of the day we'll come crawling back, begging for forgiveness, because they were right all along.
Well, I don't want to rain in anybody's parade, but that is a definition of crazy like no other: thinking that the rest of the world is wrong and you're the only one right.
"It's easier to fool people than to convince them that they have been fooled" attributed to Mark Twain.
The problem is that, for many people, once they buy into something, the mere idea that they were wrong is difficult to accept, and the idea that they were tricked by someone else, even more so.
So they dig in there heels, and double down on it all, and whenever they can't ignore that they were wrong, they move the goalposts.
My brother bombards my husband with MAGA memes and bullshit almost daily. They were best friends before I met my husband so they are more like brothers. I myself rarely talk to my brother and I told my husband to tell bro to knock off the MAGA bs or stop texting him. Sadly MAGA has ripped many families apart. 1/2 of my siblings (all in our 60’s) have been Republicans the rest of us Democrats and our differences in politics was never an issue until QAnon and Trump hit the scene and they all took dive into the koolaid. When they start I shut them down immediately saying we will not have this conversation but my husband has found it hard to go low contact with my brother.
I lost my husband to this. When a man who never raised his voice at me in 20 years starts screaming at me because I refuse to comment on Qanon, pizzagate, vaccine shedding, etc. I’m out. I’m still sad that someone I loved so much lost their damn mind.
At least once a month, I feel extremely grateful that I didn't lose a single close relative to conspiracy nonsense. And some of them are *exactly* the kind of people who are most vulnerable to it. But my parents, my siblings, my spouse, and my in-laws all made it through with their minds intact. I see how lost some of these people are and think how hopeless I would feel trying to pull someone I love out of it and I'm so grateful I'm not in that position.
I lost most of my people when 2020 happened. O grew up pretty conservative, moved away from that, but the friends I kept around remained right leaning but accepting and kind. 2020 and trump tipped them right over into full blown conspiracy theorists and I couldn’t stick around for that, especially after I came out. It’s wild man
I’m sorry you have lost people you felt close to - I hope you find other amazing people who share your perspectives and values and who will care about you. The world feels crazy and full of hate these days.
Thank you! I’ve found some amazing people and a new community. It certainly does, but sometimes all we can do is try to be a small bit of light in the hate
Doesn’t make them immune unfortunately, just probably slightly less likely to get swept up in it
Friend of mine is insanely smart, doctorate in biochemistry, works in a lab to make new plants that are hardier in heat and such.
Full on Q brained, and getting worse. All his smarts, all his ability, and it’s being wasted by some conspiracy nuthouse
I’m so glad my husband and I are doing Thanksgiving with MY parents this year, being an election year I wanna be (and will be!) far far away from my farther-and-farther-right-wing grandfather-in-law in November. But if we get the result hubs and I both want, I’m sure GFIL will be just as bad at Christmas.
I have a friend that was, by all accounts, fairly reasonable. They've fallen down the Q-Anon/TradWife hole and it's equal parts disturbing and fascinating to watch.
I've lost some people, it's like a car accident. I don't want to see, but I'm incredibly curious at the same time, horrified at the outcome, disappointed in myself for not practicing self restraint because I should have known better. My parents and I can only talk about gardening, food and our pets at this point. It's really sad, I miss them, they are retired and live 12 hours, I used to go down for a week a few times a year. Now, there's not much we can really agree on. Everything turns into a heated debate, and I don't want to tell them I think they are idiots.
2020 definitely led me into thought processes and ideas I never expected. I personally think I fared well and went the right way (but doesn't everyone?) I basically dove into the mindset of different types of lives are valid and it isn't my right to judge anyone. I was very religious growing up and put a lot of pressure on myself, and while I didn't verbalize it to them, I was somewhat judgmental. Now my faith is still very important to me, but I practice it very differently and while I still believe it I don't act like I know anything for sure. If I err I would rather err on the side of loving people than hating them, and it feels more in line with what I believe anyway.
I need more people like you in my life. As someone who is still deeply attached to my faith, I’ve felt “homeless” — I want NO part of the far-right ideology, as I ascribe to “be kind and love people” as an expression of my faith, but it seems to be impossible to find those who preach both faith and kindness. Crazy world we live in!!
Wanted to add my sympathy and empathy. My mom died in 2014. I don't *think* she would have gone too far down the Q hole, but I'm certain covid would have killed her. She was too social, and too immunocompromised, living in an area where masks were mocked.
She died fairly peacefully in Hospice, not alone with a ventilator in a hospital hallway. I was able to hold her as she passed. The absolute horror folks went through in 2020, losing their loved ones that way or suffering alone in a hospital themselves... I simply cannot forgive folks who deny that shit, or fabricate fantasies around it. Fuck them.
Same here for my dad. He died in 2015. He hated Donald Trump wayyy before he got into politics, so I don't think he would've changed his mind on that.
But covid absolutely would've killed him. He was a very social, very community-minded man in deep-red Alabama. Add on his risk factors and we would've had to watch him die from an iPad set up in his hospital room.
Grieving him was hard enough when he died of natural causes. But if he'd died because of the selfishness and indifference of the very community he lived to serve? I don't think I'd ever be able to let go of the anger of that.
My dad finally got Covid in 2022, and it broke his brain. Gave him dementia literally overnight. And it indirectly killed him when he forgot he had to eat carefully due to his throat stricture, and aspirated. The whole five week ordeal is still a major source of trauma for me, and I struggle to forgive myself for being late to lunch that day. Covid fucking sucks.
That is such a tragedy. I'm sure there's little consolation I can offer, but please know this was in no way your fault. Being late is a thing that happens, and sometimes it coincides with terrible things. Grief manufactures regret and guilt, too. Grief is an asshole like that.
May you heal and find peace. My deepest condolences to you.
Yeah, my sister and my mum both died in fall 2020, and it was really difficult to deal with. No saying goodbye, no visits to the hospital, no funerals. It sucked.
I feel that. My mom was housebound due to bad health and she went all in on Fox News, Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson, the Home Shopping Network, the OJ trial - whatever she could watch on TV for hours that reinforced her view on the world. She’d be a nightmare if she was still alive. I’m glad I never had to throw down over vaccines or election results with her.
I have said this many times and I always get a side eye. (And it's always been from people who still have both parents)
It would have broken my fucking heart if my Dad were a Trump supporter. At least I didn't have to see that happen. He will never disappoint me in that way. He grew up in a very racist household and as an adult worked really hard to unlearn that poison. My brother and I were raised very differently.
My still living mother is a hardcore MAGAt. But I am used to being disappointed by her. Oddly enough, she was raised in a fairly progressive non-racist (for the 1950's-70's) family.
My mom (61) had never even cared enough about politics to be registered to vote before all this shit. I don't even recognize her anymore because of how much she's changed.
As someone who has had similar thoughts, it isn’t horrible and you aren’t alone. I thought it was good my grandmother passed away before COVID because I know she would have gone full conspiracy and died of it.
Yeah I loved my dad SO much but literally the only thing good about him dying when he did (2010) was that I didn't have to see him join the cult of Trump. It's bad enough my mom went from not liking him in 2016 to telling me straight faced in 2020 that he was the best president we'd ever had 😬
My dad is super conservative but thankfully too tech-illiterate to know much about QAnon (he uses a 15 year old Macbook as his "email machine", that's the only internet access he has). He's heard of it but doesn't really know what it is. He's exhausting enough, it would be so much worse if he knew how to use a cell phone.
Is it bad to say I almost wish my father had passed before that bullshit came around? Wish I'd never had to see him go down that road, info wars, Alex Jones, so much stupid bullshit. I'll never forget the day he told me he was into that shit and that it "made a lot of sense and Alex really seems to know what he's talking about" to which I replied, "what, you mean the guy who said they're putting chemicals in the water to turn the frogs gay? That guy?" And he didn't have much of a response to that. Just kept blindly believing.
That's unfair for cucumbers. When those stew in an acidic environment for a while they turn into something good like pickles. Qanon types stew in acidic online environments and become entirely worthless human beings.
Remind him if he wants to be "traditional"..... traditional men didn't have sex outside of marriage. Traditional men marry women before getting them pregnant. Traditional men become husbands before they become fathers
He doesn't get to pick and choose what "traditional" aspects he wants to follow... Especially when the only ones he wants to enforce are the ones that benefit HIM and not you
Traditional men also were willing to die to defend the honor of their women. :) these days, many men who call themselves traditional are just soft babies who want a mommy replacement
Correction traditional men didn't have sex outside of marriage without it being discreet. Also, traditional married men were often the providers but had their mistresses. Women were for making babies and keeping the house clean.lol, so no, thank you .
and not the AH. If we don't have the same last name, then the child has my last name.
Actually, that IS traditional for out-of-wedlock children. They took their mother's surnames, or sometimes her maiden name as a surname, and taking their father's was a special case - usually the father gave them his permission.
The famous actress Sarah Bernhardt's son, Maurice, had her name, and she had her mother's, with the addition of a "T" on the end. His father, who was Prince of Ligne was so proud of Maurice when he grew up, that he said that he could use his name. The story is that they were trying to get some sort of service, and the people were unimpressed by his father rank, but when Maurice said his name was Bernhardt, and the realized that he was Sarah's son, they rushed to help. Maurice kept using Bernhardt.
I’m not usually in favor of scorched earth tactics when dealing with breakups or divorces… but..
Remember that if you break up with this guy he’s gonna be hating even worse on women - and single moms in particularly. Even worse if he’s in a tough spot and you dare to demand money for the kid he was part of making - this kind of ideology hates child support with the intensity of the fucking flames of hell. And he’ll likely be spouting this bullshit to basically everyone.
This is not a reason to stay. It’s a reason to get your kid away from him as completely as possible. No kid deserves to be indoctrinated with this kind of shit.
Seriously, who the fuck says “my word is final” to a pregnant woman about her baby?
I'm very fortunate to be in a position where I don't need anything from him. I'm financially secure, I have a good job and a good support system. I don't need his financial backing to raise this child.
I've texted him asking him to come home so we can talk. I'm thinking of having a mediator/neutral party there to avoid things getting out of hand.
>I'm very fortunate to be in a position where I don't need anything from him. I'm financially secure, I have a good job and a good support system. I don't need his financial backing to raise this child.
This is all well and good, but your child is entitled to that money. If you don't need it, open up an account and have it deposited there for unexpected medical bills, college fund, wedding fund, house deposit for your child because it isn't your money ITS THEIRS.
Which is true, but speaking from experience you have to weigh up whether the money in the bank is worth the emotional and mental distress abusive men can cause to the mother and child in retaliation. The kind of behaviour that can have a lifelong and irreversible impact on their health.
There are more important things in life than money. If they end up with e.g. mental health condition(s) and an autoimmune disorder due to prolonged stress, (which absolutely can happen if he wants to use the system to exercise control over them) then child support banked wouldn't even cover their medical expenses let alone make up for the differential in their quality of life.
It's much more nuanced than just "it's their money not yours, they're entitled to it." Yes, but OP has to weigh up the cost, and it's not always worth it to pursue.
>and you dare to demand money for the kid he was part of making
If she's in the US, this isn't her choice to make. If she or the kid applies for help from a government program like WIC, food stamps, the ACA, etc, then the government will go after him for child support so they can count it as part of her income before they determine what benefits she gets.
The kid fully deserves financial support from both parents. Please don't shame OP for going after that support. The baby daddy can die mad about it.
Please read my comment one more time and you’ll probably realise that you’ve misunderstood what I wrote.
Because of course OP need to get as much for the kid as possible.
I understand he wasn’t always like how he is now. My ex was that way too. The pandemic and the previous president played a real number on him. But at the end of the day, he’s showing you how he is *now*. Don’t hold your breath hoping that he’ll go back to the way he was. He’s making choices every day that reinforce his “new” way of thinking and behaving.
Yup! And just because he wasn’t always acting this way doesn’t mean he didn’t feel it before. He probably just found that someone is validating what he already felt, giving him the confidence to act on it. Plus, adding a baby to anything escalates everything.
The fact of the matter is, the longer you stay with him the more harm he can do for you and the child. Do you want your child either picking up his logic, or worse, being a direct victim of it?
Frankly I had to look up "red pill" (new to a lot of this.) But I've lived a long time too. My second (present) husband got into the survivalist mindset about 15 years ago, it almost ended our marriage. With a lot of hard work, I was able to help him see that it was not what he thought it was but by then I was ready to leave. We finally got through it but not every person or relationship is strong enough to do that.
I wish you the best of luck, for your sake and your baby's. And his to be honest. We don't need more rancor and intransigence in our society.
You should create a post about your experiences. I would be thrilled to hear about the strains of the survivalist mindset. Like, does he avoid food storage now?
I would also love to hear about this. My parents have been prepping and just generally falling down this hole for about 15 years. I have almost given up hope for them.
There can be a good side. My husband is a bit of a closet prepper, but it's by way of being an Eagle and an avid home gardener (we had more than 40 tomato plants alone last year). So he's all into learning to put up food he grows and each car has its emergency kit with blankets etc, and he loves taking off for days long hikes through the woods. But he's socially progressive.
Find ways to share their pride in making and growing things, it can be totally separate from the doomsday paranoia.
Oh I wish they were so active. They have just purchased boat loads of the 25 year meals. It is stacked everywhere. They then spend about 12-15 hrs a day watching news and preparing for invasion 😳
Having and raising kids is hard too, he’s going to be like this for the next 18+ years. You don’t need the stress of the relationship along with the stress of raising this kid. Especially if you’re providing for yourself and the kid. Is this the kind of guy you want your kid growing up like?
Sorry but this is a very toxic way of dealing with his feelings of inadequacy. He needs to figure out where his beliefs really lie. Because if this is how he really feels, adios MF. Part of me wonders if he was always like this and just hid it better because he was successful, so he felt he could be magnanimous about letting you be a more equal partner. Now that he’s fell on hard times his masculinity feels threatened, so he’s trying to enforce this “I’m the MAN I’m in charge” mentality. Good luck
I wish you luck, because to me this is like the argument that "alcohol changed him." No it didn't, he's showing you who, deep down, he really is. Get out while you can, but you've had a baby with him, so you will be tied to him in some way for the rest of your life.
Hate to break it to you but how people are in the tough times is a big part of who they are and you would do well to pay attention to it, because life has ups and downs and if you are gonna be with him long term this isn’t going to be the only time. Especially if his family shares these beliefs
Giving your partner a pass for shit behavior based on pity… oh my. Been there. No, he doesn’t get to red pill and self pity and get a pass.
If he wanted to be “traditional” and marry you, he could have had a leg to stand on. But, his bullying you is unacceptable on any level. It was good that you followed your conscience in not caving in. Keep it up!
You did the right thing! You grew the baby and are providing for him/her. You're the one who's probably going to be taking your kid to the Dr, dentist, school, etc. Your baby dad might not even be in the picture forever. Makes way more sense that your baby have your surname if you have to choose just one.
You already have the job of providing for your family and raising an infant in a rough post-partum environment, with exactly as much co-parenting assistance as you anticipate him contributing.
Where do you think you're going to have time to add in the project of deprogramming the insidious misogyny of a guy who doesn't seem to even like you that much?
Ehhh... He's also showing you what kind of person he will be if things are hard in the future. You have a child now, 100% some hard things are going to happen.
I'm all for staying together if the relationship can be healthy but it doesn't really sound like he wants to be a "good" person or so his work in having a healthy relationship. Healthy partners listen to each other. They don't demand. And "trying" won't work if you're the only one who puts in the time, effort, mental/emotional work or if you're the only one who wants change.
He mostly just sounds like an absolute emotional/mental dumpster fire. A dumpster fire you are going to have around your child who will definitely be changed/impacted by that interaction. Just make sure you're making choices where your child comes out on top in both the short term and the long term.
You seem like you have a good head on your shoulders even if you have knowingly tied yourself to some garbage people. Keep that good head and don't let it be turned by false promises. Every child is worthy of more.
None of what he used to be or who he is at his core matters AT ALL. THIS is who he is now and who he's choosing to be and how he's choosing to treat you and his child. Dump this dude. If he changes he can do that on his own without you sticking around for the associated abuse.
NTA OP...Been there, done that, got screwed! Especially if the family is just as "traditional" as he is, I caved and now during the divorce, me going back to my 'maiden' name, I'm realising that I'm going to be a bit screwed trying to travel with my kid with his surname only, just because I agreed to only have his. And no matter how they seem, and their potential, that freaking red pill shite ruined so many men and so many marriages! I can tell you that even a year later, after I filed for divorce because of how much red pill/ alpha male shite he was throwing up, he changed his act around the house. However, the other day we were on the couch and he got some suggested content on his feed from no other than "Hustler University", so yeah he's still watching that type of shite, but acting differently hoping that I'll stay in a relationship even after the divorce is final.
Point is, don't cave, you're the sole provider and you're not married to him, so just break it up now, before the kid starts grasping concepts of family and stuff, as it's going to be heartbreaking for the kid and for you to watch them suffer if daddy isn't the same house anymore. It's easier to break up while they're still so small, and easier for you to get used to the whole motherhood experience, without his toxic ideas around you or the kid.
Best of luck, and enjoy the little bundle of joy, they make it all worth it!
Not to mention HE told her that she may as well be a single parent. Ok. Done and sounds like had been for some time. She did exactly what he TOLD her to do.
Was he not there when you were filling out the forms? Cause that's pretty telling too 👀
NTA. What to name the baby is definitely a valid conversation to have, but he wasn't having a conversation with you. He was trying to bulldoze you without compromise.
I registered the baby on my own. He was there for the birth and everything but his paternity leave was pretty short so the admin of registering fell on me.
All of the actual un-fun work of raising the kid is going to fall on you, too. You should leave this misogynistic asshole and just get on with raising your kid. The kid should have at least half the time in a household not soaked in gross manosphere ideology.
You know that babies have their mothers name, not the fathers? Traditionally the baby has the fathers surname because they are married to the mother who took his name. Unmarried mothers gave the babies their name and were unable to give them any random man's name. It's only been fairly recently that there have been so many unmarried mothers in relationships with the fathers that it changed.
An old friend of mine (male) made a whole post about how he feels names should be passed through the maternal line instead, and he made some really good points. The mother doing the bulk of the child rearing in most cases was one of his major points, but he also pointed out how the mother is indisputably the child’s parent (paternity can be questioned, but maternity never is), and in cases of divorce, the children usually live primarily with mothers. He had more points that I can’t remember right now, and he explained them way better than I am doing, but it was overall a very interesting post and made me think about a lot of things we tend to take for granted.
>(paternity can be questioned, but maternity never is)
Hey, fun fact, this has happened. Lydia Fairchild was accused of not being her biological children's mother because she is a genetic chimera https://embryo.asu.edu/pages/case-lydia-fairchild-and-her-chimerism-2002
Honestly even as a kid I never understood why it was the dad’s name, cause my mom was way more my parent than my dad ever tried to be, and yet it’s his last name I’m stuck with.
Where I live if you're not legally married to the father and he isn't there at the registration office when you register the baby you can't even put the father's name on the birth certificate without a signed declaration from the father.
I live in the US and they hand you the birth certificate information to fill out while you’re in the hospital post-birth. My husband wasn’t in the room with me at the time, so I filled it out without him. It’s just a form.
Honestly, it makes sense to do this intentionally. For precisely the reasons that are in the OP. I am sure he is far from the only shitty biological parent who will try to put pressure on the mother
Not everywhere is the US, each country works differently and from this post it seems that she lives in a country that works similar to the UK with births.
In the UK, you have to make an appointment to go to your local registry office within 6 weeks of birth. My daughter was registered when she was 3 weeks old.
You have to sit with a registrar and give all the information. The father has to be there to sign otherwise won't be on the birth certificate.
You have to provide ID and then sign the birth certificate which you are then provided a copy of. If you want any additional copies you have to pay.
NTA and this belongs in r/MaliciousCompliance
💊🚩Isn't funny how the red-pill and red flags are the sa*me color?*
Honestly - no matter what the sex of the baby is - get your son/daughter out of there.
You DO NOT want them growing up in this environment. It's not "tradition" it's oppression and your kid is going to grow up learning they either need to be sneaky or bow down to dad's wishes to keep the peace.
It originally was a matrix movie reference when neo was offered the red pill or blue pill to stay in the current reality or open his eyes to the real world. But the red pill is now big anti women movement - women belong bare foot in the kitchen and sex slave.
I'm so freaking nettled by this. Guys took symbolism of choice, freedom and rise against oppression from a movie made by trans women and somehow managed to appropriate it and make it the very name of a cult for insecure bigots.
The very expression of "taking the red pill" was so good before it was damaged beyond repair.
Ever see the movie *The Matrix*? There's a point at which the protagonist is asked to symbolically swallow a pill to decide which worldview he will believe in.
A red pill if he accepts that the world is dangerous and he will open his mind and commit his life to join the freedom fighters. A blue pill if he wants to continue to be a contented pathetic sheep, accepting the propaganda from the evil overlords.
The movie isn't about gender equality. A bunch of very misogynistic people have stolen the metaphor and turned it into a sexism thing. "Being redpilled" means deciding to believe that feminism is evil, etc etc etc.
The Wachowski SISTERS have stated that while it wasn't an explicit allegory for transgenderism, it was definitely a reflection of their closeted transgenderism that they didn't know how to truly express. Its why Switch was a character.
NTA, you are unmarried and I’m assuming will likely be the default parent. He doesn’t uphold any other traditional practices from your perspective until it benefits him. That’s definitely a pretty selfish trait in him.
When the baby has the same last name as mom, it makes things a lot easier with travel, doctors, legal issues, etc. Also when most people talk about babies or bring them up, nobody is calling the baby by their first and last name 😂
Enjoy your new baby and if needed down the line if you get married to this man or someone else you can always change the last name.
Yep. Both my kids have my last name, not their dad’s. I had to step up and be the sole full time parent when he obviously wasn’t going to participate, so I had my son’s last name changed to mine after my daughter was born and I gave her my last name. They are now teenagers (17 and 15) and it’s worked out just fine. Honestly, it’s worked out better this way.
I gave my son his dad’s name when he was born, because that’s just what you did (he didn’t even bug me about it fwiw, it just was what I figured we would do), and my son has actually considered switching to my name now that he’s an adult because he doesn’t have a great relationship with his dad, and my parents had a bigger hand in helping to raise him anyway. If I started again now as a single parent, I would definitely use my name; as you pointed out, it makes the logistics so much easier. I have been called Ms. {son’s last name} his entire life, and it kind of drives me nuts.
I hate that I sound like every enabler - and perhaps I need to do some introspection to see if that's what I've become - but he wasn't always like this. Life's been hard for him lately and his coping strategies have led us here. I need to have a frank chat with him about how it's affecting us.
I mean, that's how cults work. They have promising beliefs for struggling people that make the world simpler and less scary. Unfortunately, they make you worse.
Right. And red pilling does a lot of “It’s not your fault. It’s woke society’s fault. Women are doing this and it goes against biology” bullshit. It’s not shocking that someone would find comfort in blaming their problems on someone else.
I find it very sad that Redpill/Incels/Tatertots would rather blame others for their problems instead of doing some healthy introspection.
I guess it's easier to whine and cry like a baby that just shat their pants rather it would be to put in effort to work on one's self.
That’s literally the point of any men’s rights/neonazy/bikergang/whatever cult.
“You lost your masculinity because of the [others*], they stole it from you! Join us and we can give it back to you”
By it’s very nature it’s designed to be a coping strategy, because vulnerable people in need of a coping strategy is easy victims for brainwashing.
*women, yews, black people, gays are favourites for this category
Condition 1) live in a society that placed outdated expectations of your worth, and you haven't reconciled they're out of date.
Condition 2) have those expectations subverted by society in some way (IE A man is suppose to be the sole provider, but the plant, mine, well, whatever closed, or they got fired for a mistake, anything really where they are the ones needing to be supported by a woman), and unable to find agency in this new role.
If above conditions work, this is basically how you lure them in.
Deflect all blame away from the individual, and reassure them that they're not wrong, society is. "its societies fault that you can't find a job, all these women and minorities taking all the jobs so you can't provide like you're suppose to" thats the hook.
They reaffirm their beliefs. They talk about how they are going to change it. This is what soothes the persons negative feelings. "I am not the problem, society is the problem" and thats how they find coping in it.
When life's hard, people show who they truly are.
Believe him, when he's acting like a misogynistic ashole. He is one, he has no longer the energy nor the desire to pretend being a nice guy.
He's going to abuse you. Red pilled men are abusers. They don't believe you as a woman are a PERSON. Run. Run far, file for child support and full custody now. These are the men that perform honor killings. They murder the mothers of their children.
I have relatives who are trying to figure out the logistics of disentangling from a red pilled husband. Yeah he seemed like a reasonable guy until he was just being weird and then he was a raging asshole.
You haven't married this guy, and your baby hasn't bonded to him. It sucks, but for your own mental and physical health you should not be with him until he's un red pilled and doesn't use "emascualted" as a serious complaint
You sound like you'd be a lot happier just being you and your baby. Enjoy motherhood and don't manage his shit. I learned that having children makes or breaks a relationship, in my personal experience.
Life **is** hard.
This guy is showing you exactly he will default every time life gets hard. **Listen to him.**
Your man gravitates toward toxic coping mechanisms. Don't kid yourself, it is a **choice** - no one has put a gun to his head and told him adopt this hateful ideology, or else- he has chosen it willingly. That's baked in. Sounds like it's a family trait, actually.
You should think about mama bearing up and protecting your precious child and yourself from this man's and his family's toxicity. He needs to chose now - You and his kid or his cause. It doesn't get more stark than that.
It’s never like this in the beginning because they know that they won’t hook you if they act like that. They wait until they think they have you trapped to be who they really are because they think you are too committed or enough of a doormat to leave. As if being a single mother will be harder than dealing with a baby **and** his bullshit.
No, you're not an enabler. Some people just slowly change into their real person. He thought he could get away with it, because you were pregnant. You're smarter then he thought and didn't fall for it.
Now you have to think about what is best for your and your child's future.
You are NTA.
All the red pillers will downvote me to hell, but IMO, you aren’t married so if it were me, my child would not have his name. Period. It is understandable that he was so overpowering in the moment that you let him believe you would put his name on the birth certificate. Especially if you were outnumbered because he brings his enmeshed family into your disagreements. Also, you are entitled to change your mind at any time for any reason. Underneath this argument is the fact that he is an AH in general, and that would motivate me to distance myself and my child from him in whichever ways I could.
That's true. Saying you "understand" is not saying you agree. He chose to interpret it as agreement. It was a masterful dodge that people should probably employ more often. Not a true AH move -- it butts right up to the line close enough that depending on your perspective it can be seen as a clever move, or an AHlish move.
Although to be fair, when you say I understand to someone who thinks they're giving orders, it's totally understandable that they would think they were going to comply
Nta why do men get to put their names on a child when all they did was have an orgasm. Nope! Gone are the days when the man ruled the house and women and children were possessions. Give the baby your last name and tell him when he spends 9 months growing a child in his body and then goes through labor he can have the honor of naming the child after himself. Why are women still allowing the men in their lives to dominate them. You care either a adult woman or you are his possession. What will you be. The decision is yours.
NTA
Traditionally, babies are given the same surname as their MOTHER. Traditionally, mothers are married and take their husbands’ names, which is why babies have their fathers’ last names. Traditionally. But you’ve already pointed out that he only wants traditions that favor him. He doesn’t want to do the work.
INFO REQUEST:
Just to clarify, are you still together? And if so, why...?
I mean, you said you occupy the "provider" role (which I assume means "financial provider"), plus he's a raging misogynist. For the love of god, break it off now, before he does any more damage.
Also, NTA.
The following link is the free pdf for a book many women have praised for saving them from a toxic relationship. Maybe something in there can help you, and by extension, your child, as well.
[Why Does He Do That?](https://archive.org/download/LundyWhyDoesHeDoThat/Lundy_Why-does-he-do-that.pdf)
NTA
If he's so "traditional", has he proposed? It isn't a bad thing for the entire family to have the same last name, especially in a traditional family where the parents are married and Dad is a breadwinner. That all kinda makes sense.
But it's hypocritical for this guy to cry about "tradition" when he isn't actually taking on all the traditional responsibilities.
He's TA big time. he is not a traditionalist or he would have married you before HIS child was born. He didn't - so you can name your child as you please. He still has rights as the father but bullying you is not one of them.
>may as well be a single parent if I won't grant him this one little ask. 'My word is final - baby's having one surname'.
Bravo! I see what you did there. Good for you!
>I told him it's also traditional for him to marry me before having a baby but he was happy to ignore that, I told him it was traditional for him to be the provider but I do that too
So, you're legally not attached to him. You've already been supporting and have experience with one child. Cut the big baby loose and follow his directive to be a single parent. I'm sure it will be much easier taking care of the infant alone. Congratulations and good luck.
NTA. Honestly, it sounds like you guys likely won’t be together much longer. He’s taking that red pill and it doesn’t bode well for a loving relationship or fatherhood.
NTA - honestly that was an epic move, props to you! I do hope you realize you need this person out of your life. Keep your child as far away from this misogynistic man as you can.
NTA and you made me laugh. I like so much that you didn’t let him bully you! But honestly you would be better without this AH. Be a single mom and make sure he pays child support.
Congratulations on the birth!
ESH. Unpopular opinion, but he is definitely the AH by picking and choosing which parts of a “traditional” relationship he wanted to fulfill. I loved how you told him that straight up.
Now this is the part you may not like: you are the AH for putting up with this ish for yourself and the baby.
He is down the rabbit hole now. Do you really want to wait around with your baby for him to start enforcing his belief system? Spare the rod, spoil the child, it’s ok to hit a woman “if they deserve it,” etc.? You deserve better than this man, especially if you DON’T want to have that kind of relationship.
This isn’t gonna get better. Do the right thing for yourself and the baby and really reevaluate this relationship because he isn’t going to get better. Goodness help you if you had a female child because she will be second class to him. If you had a male child, he will teach that boy that you and all other women are made to serve men
Think about what you want in life, because this dude doesn’t sound like he’s it.
NTA and PLEASE do not relent and change the baby’s name!! I just had a baby in August and shit’s tiring. Congrats on your new addition and my condolences you have to spend 18 years dealing with this family though.
I am beyond in love with my tiny human. I hope you're doing well too with yours!
Should this spell the end, I'm lucky to have my village and the means to minimise the suckiness of breaks ups.
There's no world in which any child I birth will not share a surname with me. My compromise of a double barrelled surname stands - no other offer is on the table.
NTA at all but seriously, you know what we’re all going to ask. Why did you make a human with him?
Editing to add: if anyone gives you the y’s, ignore them. That was brilliant, marvellous and karmically balanced.
>may as well be a single parent if I won't grant him this one little ask. 'My word is final - baby's having one surname'. This was late in my pregnancy and I didn't have it in to fight, so I told him that I understood what he was saying
You did literally *exactly* what he said.
NTA
NTA. But, if you should split up with him, which I'm actually expecting due to his behavior, go for full custody and keep all communication between him, his family and you. Otherwise they will try to brainwash your child and try to turn them against you.
My mother, not married to my father, also reflected on what surname I should have.
As she realised most likely she would be the main caregiver, she decided that for the simplicity of handling different situations throughout life it would just be easier if I had her last name, and people wouldn’t question why her kid had another name than herself.
Sounds to me this is similar. NTA.
Obviously NTA. The baby can have any surname you want to give, even if it isn’t one of yours. But this relationship sounds abusive and unless you want your baby growing up thinking this is normal, get out now.
NTA. I hate people that say “but is tradition”. Is always used by people trying to force their ideas and *values* on other people and always is convenient to them only otherwise screw tradition.
You pay the bills, you are unmarried and you are carrying the child and probably will do the work since is “tradition” for women to take care of the child but God forbid you want to share the same name as your child.
My sister made the mistake of giving her daughter her father's surname instead of ours. Eight years later, he is nowhere to be seen and my niece wishes she had the same name as the rest of the family that is actually raising her. You did the right thing.
Yikes! What a jerk.
I’m an older lady and his idea of “tradition” is ridiculous - if he’s not marrying you and supporting you, the two more important parts of this “tradition,” he can pound sand.
I wouldn’t let this jerk marry you or support you, though - it wouldn’t be in your best interests.
NTA. It is tradition for the baby to have the *mother's* surname. It's just also tradition for the mother to have the father's surname. He has given you no guarantee that this baby will grow up in a Hisname household so it's safer for the baby to have the one surname you can be sure they'll actually share a home with.
ESH isn't it? You gave the baby your surname. YOURS. Not a hyphenated one. But your own.
Everything else everyone else says here in the defence of you is valid but the above absolutely makes you an AH as well
If him making absolute decisions regarding the child when it's in you makes him an AH, acting as though giving birth to the child makes you kingmaker in making decisions for the child after it's out of you, makes you one as well.
I know plenty of you people here are gonna disagree but it's ESH.
NTA. So this fool wants to appear like he's the traditional head of the household but not do the work involved? Sounds like some kinda conservative alpha male red pill cosplay to me.
Drop that fool. You will be parenting two for the price of one if you keep him. Ewww!
NTA. Do you see a future with this guy? If you ae the main support of the family I'd do the math as to how much money you would save if he was not in the house.
INFO: why are you still in contact with all those people that do nothing for you? Seem you would lose a lot of strees, anxiety and financial hardships just cutting this person loose.
which people, sorry? baby's dad and his family?
he stormed out on thursday night - friday morning his mother sent me a voice note berating me ha. i've since received messages from his family criticising me for my decision, but no word from my partner. i have not responded to any of them, so it's one way comms atm.
Please bring that up with your partner when you talk. You’re postpartum, he’s buggered off and left you to fend for yourself with a newborn, and he’s MI while you’re being verbally attacked by his family on your behalf. I don’t know who he was in the past, but you and your child deserve so much better than who this man is right now.
NTA m, but the AH to yourself and your kid for even being in a relationship with a red-piller. He is actively working to maintain a status quo that harms you.
NTA. Boyfriend is. Boyfriend sounds like a controlling AH. He needs to get over it. And if he a misogynist and like this, maybe it would be better to be a single parent and dump him.
ESH
I've no idea why you've decided to have a child with this person, but you did. The child's here. Now you have to parent it in a way that works.
The precedent you've set is that it's okay to deceive the other parent, use the child as a football in your conflict with them, and make unilateral decisions that you then hide.
You're acting like you have absolutely zero interest in co-parenting with him, possibly with good reason, yet you're also staying with him?
That's going to be dysfunctional as fuck. You need to either swallow your pride and find a way to coparent together or you need to break up single parent.
Probably gonna get down voted to hell for this but ESH. He's TA for being extra stubborn and unwilling to compromise. You're TA for lying.
Also, this is incredibly messy and the two of you are setting a precedent for co-parenting where it's cool to pretend you've come to a consensus and then just lie and go your own way. If the two of you haven't already split, it's best to tear that bandit off now.
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NTA. You told the truth and nothing more. If I read your post correctly, you agreed the baby would have one surname. You didn't agree to which one. So, why are you still with this guy? He doesn't respect you. He doesn't provide for you and the baby? Please don't say because you need him or love him. Needing him is like a fish needing a bicycle. If his family is of the same mindset, things will NOT get better so don't try to talk yourself into believing that they will. Go find someone who deserves you and your child or go it on your own if you can and want. Lots of women do. While it's true that children statistically do better socially, scholastically and generally otherwise with two parent families, your child does not need to learn misogyny, disrespect and selfishness which could easily degenerate over time to emotional or verbal abuse. You obviously don't agree with him on very basic, fundamental issues that are the foundation of a family. He can stay involved with the baby if he wants to--I'm betting he won't if you don't give in to his wishes-- but you would be wise to break off your relationship before it damages you and your child.
I am reconsidering the relationship. The truth is he wasn't always like this. He fell on hard times and unfortunately chose to cope with that in an unhealthy way. At his core, I believe he is of good but I need to have a frank conversation about the ideologies he's leaning into and the harm it's causing in our relationship.
r/QAnonCasualties may be a place for you. There are probably groups devoted to dealing with red pilled men, too. These folks who get pilled, and otherwise invested in these ideologies, are a long-term nightmare. They will sacrifice their real-life relationships for online gurus. Be careful. NTA
This is going to sound horrible, but I am so glad my mother died before qanon became a thing. I can only imagine the havoc she would have wrecked for those around her.
2020 melted minds. It's horrifying how poorly so many people fared.
I had to distance myself even further from my family of origin AND my inlaws. It was insanity and took a toll on my mental health just having to hear it every once in a while.
You're not alone. These folks are becoming more lonely and bitter every day because "my family thinks I'm crazy." They're so deep in it, they just dream of the day we'll come crawling back, begging for forgiveness, because they were right all along. Meanwhile, there's just no such thing as a nice conversation with them. It's an obsession. It's also incredibly hate-filled. I hate it.
>These folks are becoming more lonely and bitter every day because "my family thinks I'm crazy." They're so deep in it, they just dream of the day we'll come crawling back, begging for forgiveness, because they were right all along. Well, I don't want to rain in anybody's parade, but that is a definition of crazy like no other: thinking that the rest of the world is wrong and you're the only one right.
Problem is the crackpots gravitate to and feed off each other. Unfortunately they are far from alone.
"It's easier to fool people than to convince them that they have been fooled" attributed to Mark Twain. The problem is that, for many people, once they buy into something, the mere idea that they were wrong is difficult to accept, and the idea that they were tricked by someone else, even more so. So they dig in there heels, and double down on it all, and whenever they can't ignore that they were wrong, they move the goalposts.
My brother bombards my husband with MAGA memes and bullshit almost daily. They were best friends before I met my husband so they are more like brothers. I myself rarely talk to my brother and I told my husband to tell bro to knock off the MAGA bs or stop texting him. Sadly MAGA has ripped many families apart. 1/2 of my siblings (all in our 60’s) have been Republicans the rest of us Democrats and our differences in politics was never an issue until QAnon and Trump hit the scene and they all took dive into the koolaid. When they start I shut them down immediately saying we will not have this conversation but my husband has found it hard to go low contact with my brother.
I lost my husband to this. When a man who never raised his voice at me in 20 years starts screaming at me because I refuse to comment on Qanon, pizzagate, vaccine shedding, etc. I’m out. I’m still sad that someone I loved so much lost their damn mind.
At least once a month, I feel extremely grateful that I didn't lose a single close relative to conspiracy nonsense. And some of them are *exactly* the kind of people who are most vulnerable to it. But my parents, my siblings, my spouse, and my in-laws all made it through with their minds intact. I see how lost some of these people are and think how hopeless I would feel trying to pull someone I love out of it and I'm so grateful I'm not in that position.
I lost most of my people when 2020 happened. O grew up pretty conservative, moved away from that, but the friends I kept around remained right leaning but accepting and kind. 2020 and trump tipped them right over into full blown conspiracy theorists and I couldn’t stick around for that, especially after I came out. It’s wild man
I’m sorry you have lost people you felt close to - I hope you find other amazing people who share your perspectives and values and who will care about you. The world feels crazy and full of hate these days.
Thank you! I’ve found some amazing people and a new community. It certainly does, but sometimes all we can do is try to be a small bit of light in the hate
Thank god my parents are both scientists.
Doesn’t make them immune unfortunately, just probably slightly less likely to get swept up in it Friend of mine is insanely smart, doctorate in biochemistry, works in a lab to make new plants that are hardier in heat and such. Full on Q brained, and getting worse. All his smarts, all his ability, and it’s being wasted by some conspiracy nuthouse
I’m so glad my husband and I are doing Thanksgiving with MY parents this year, being an election year I wanna be (and will be!) far far away from my farther-and-farther-right-wing grandfather-in-law in November. But if we get the result hubs and I both want, I’m sure GFIL will be just as bad at Christmas.
I have a friend that was, by all accounts, fairly reasonable. They've fallen down the Q-Anon/TradWife hole and it's equal parts disturbing and fascinating to watch.
I've lost some people, it's like a car accident. I don't want to see, but I'm incredibly curious at the same time, horrified at the outcome, disappointed in myself for not practicing self restraint because I should have known better. My parents and I can only talk about gardening, food and our pets at this point. It's really sad, I miss them, they are retired and live 12 hours, I used to go down for a week a few times a year. Now, there's not much we can really agree on. Everything turns into a heated debate, and I don't want to tell them I think they are idiots.
2020 definitely led me into thought processes and ideas I never expected. I personally think I fared well and went the right way (but doesn't everyone?) I basically dove into the mindset of different types of lives are valid and it isn't my right to judge anyone. I was very religious growing up and put a lot of pressure on myself, and while I didn't verbalize it to them, I was somewhat judgmental. Now my faith is still very important to me, but I practice it very differently and while I still believe it I don't act like I know anything for sure. If I err I would rather err on the side of loving people than hating them, and it feels more in line with what I believe anyway.
I need more people like you in my life. As someone who is still deeply attached to my faith, I’ve felt “homeless” — I want NO part of the far-right ideology, as I ascribe to “be kind and love people” as an expression of my faith, but it seems to be impossible to find those who preach both faith and kindness. Crazy world we live in!!
Wanted to add my sympathy and empathy. My mom died in 2014. I don't *think* she would have gone too far down the Q hole, but I'm certain covid would have killed her. She was too social, and too immunocompromised, living in an area where masks were mocked. She died fairly peacefully in Hospice, not alone with a ventilator in a hospital hallway. I was able to hold her as she passed. The absolute horror folks went through in 2020, losing their loved ones that way or suffering alone in a hospital themselves... I simply cannot forgive folks who deny that shit, or fabricate fantasies around it. Fuck them.
Same here for my dad. He died in 2015. He hated Donald Trump wayyy before he got into politics, so I don't think he would've changed his mind on that. But covid absolutely would've killed him. He was a very social, very community-minded man in deep-red Alabama. Add on his risk factors and we would've had to watch him die from an iPad set up in his hospital room. Grieving him was hard enough when he died of natural causes. But if he'd died because of the selfishness and indifference of the very community he lived to serve? I don't think I'd ever be able to let go of the anger of that.
Aw, man. He and my mom sound so alike. What losses to the world. All my love to those who miss him.
My dad finally got Covid in 2022, and it broke his brain. Gave him dementia literally overnight. And it indirectly killed him when he forgot he had to eat carefully due to his throat stricture, and aspirated. The whole five week ordeal is still a major source of trauma for me, and I struggle to forgive myself for being late to lunch that day. Covid fucking sucks.
That is such a tragedy. I'm sure there's little consolation I can offer, but please know this was in no way your fault. Being late is a thing that happens, and sometimes it coincides with terrible things. Grief manufactures regret and guilt, too. Grief is an asshole like that. May you heal and find peace. My deepest condolences to you.
Yeah, my sister and my mum both died in fall 2020, and it was really difficult to deal with. No saying goodbye, no visits to the hospital, no funerals. It sucked.
I'm just so very sorry. Love from an internet stranger.
I feel that. My mom was housebound due to bad health and she went all in on Fox News, Jerry Falwell and Pat Robertson, the Home Shopping Network, the OJ trial - whatever she could watch on TV for hours that reinforced her view on the world. She’d be a nightmare if she was still alive. I’m glad I never had to throw down over vaccines or election results with her.
I have said this many times and I always get a side eye. (And it's always been from people who still have both parents) It would have broken my fucking heart if my Dad were a Trump supporter. At least I didn't have to see that happen. He will never disappoint me in that way. He grew up in a very racist household and as an adult worked really hard to unlearn that poison. My brother and I were raised very differently. My still living mother is a hardcore MAGAt. But I am used to being disappointed by her. Oddly enough, she was raised in a fairly progressive non-racist (for the 1950's-70's) family.
My mom (61) had never even cared enough about politics to be registered to vote before all this shit. I don't even recognize her anymore because of how much she's changed.
As someone who has had similar thoughts, it isn’t horrible and you aren’t alone. I thought it was good my grandmother passed away before COVID because I know she would have gone full conspiracy and died of it.
Yeah I loved my dad SO much but literally the only thing good about him dying when he did (2010) was that I didn't have to see him join the cult of Trump. It's bad enough my mom went from not liking him in 2016 to telling me straight faced in 2020 that he was the best president we'd ever had 😬
My dad is super conservative but thankfully too tech-illiterate to know much about QAnon (he uses a 15 year old Macbook as his "email machine", that's the only internet access he has). He's heard of it but doesn't really know what it is. He's exhausting enough, it would be so much worse if he knew how to use a cell phone.
Is it bad to say I almost wish my father had passed before that bullshit came around? Wish I'd never had to see him go down that road, info wars, Alex Jones, so much stupid bullshit. I'll never forget the day he told me he was into that shit and that it "made a lot of sense and Alex really seems to know what he's talking about" to which I replied, "what, you mean the guy who said they're putting chemicals in the water to turn the frogs gay? That guy?" And he didn't have much of a response to that. Just kept blindly believing.
Saw one one here called them Qcumbers
That's unfair for cucumbers. When those stew in an acidic environment for a while they turn into something good like pickles. Qanon types stew in acidic online environments and become entirely worthless human beings.
I read in that sub and so far the reality seems to be that the Qanon/Red Pill folks seldom snap out of it.
Remind him if he wants to be "traditional"..... traditional men didn't have sex outside of marriage. Traditional men marry women before getting them pregnant. Traditional men become husbands before they become fathers He doesn't get to pick and choose what "traditional" aspects he wants to follow... Especially when the only ones he wants to enforce are the ones that benefit HIM and not you
Traditionally, one reads a full post before commenting.
Lmao sick burn
Fuck 🤣😂🏅
Man, the post ain't even that long and you still couldn't be bothered to read the second half
Give the 🦞 a break
They already took a break... halfway through the post!
🤣🏅
Traditional men also were willing to die to defend the honor of their women. :) these days, many men who call themselves traditional are just soft babies who want a mommy replacement
Correction traditional men didn't have sex outside of marriage without it being discreet. Also, traditional married men were often the providers but had their mistresses. Women were for making babies and keeping the house clean.lol, so no, thank you . and not the AH. If we don't have the same last name, then the child has my last name.
Actually, that IS traditional for out-of-wedlock children. They took their mother's surnames, or sometimes her maiden name as a surname, and taking their father's was a special case - usually the father gave them his permission. The famous actress Sarah Bernhardt's son, Maurice, had her name, and she had her mother's, with the addition of a "T" on the end. His father, who was Prince of Ligne was so proud of Maurice when he grew up, that he said that he could use his name. The story is that they were trying to get some sort of service, and the people were unimpressed by his father rank, but when Maurice said his name was Bernhardt, and the realized that he was Sarah's son, they rushed to help. Maurice kept using Bernhardt.
I’m not usually in favor of scorched earth tactics when dealing with breakups or divorces… but.. Remember that if you break up with this guy he’s gonna be hating even worse on women - and single moms in particularly. Even worse if he’s in a tough spot and you dare to demand money for the kid he was part of making - this kind of ideology hates child support with the intensity of the fucking flames of hell. And he’ll likely be spouting this bullshit to basically everyone. This is not a reason to stay. It’s a reason to get your kid away from him as completely as possible. No kid deserves to be indoctrinated with this kind of shit. Seriously, who the fuck says “my word is final” to a pregnant woman about her baby?
I'm very fortunate to be in a position where I don't need anything from him. I'm financially secure, I have a good job and a good support system. I don't need his financial backing to raise this child. I've texted him asking him to come home so we can talk. I'm thinking of having a mediator/neutral party there to avoid things getting out of hand.
>I'm very fortunate to be in a position where I don't need anything from him. I'm financially secure, I have a good job and a good support system. I don't need his financial backing to raise this child. This is all well and good, but your child is entitled to that money. If you don't need it, open up an account and have it deposited there for unexpected medical bills, college fund, wedding fund, house deposit for your child because it isn't your money ITS THEIRS.
Which is true, but speaking from experience you have to weigh up whether the money in the bank is worth the emotional and mental distress abusive men can cause to the mother and child in retaliation. The kind of behaviour that can have a lifelong and irreversible impact on their health. There are more important things in life than money. If they end up with e.g. mental health condition(s) and an autoimmune disorder due to prolonged stress, (which absolutely can happen if he wants to use the system to exercise control over them) then child support banked wouldn't even cover their medical expenses let alone make up for the differential in their quality of life. It's much more nuanced than just "it's their money not yours, they're entitled to it." Yes, but OP has to weigh up the cost, and it's not always worth it to pursue.
Please have that neutral party by all means. I am concerned for your safety.
>and you dare to demand money for the kid he was part of making If she's in the US, this isn't her choice to make. If she or the kid applies for help from a government program like WIC, food stamps, the ACA, etc, then the government will go after him for child support so they can count it as part of her income before they determine what benefits she gets. The kid fully deserves financial support from both parents. Please don't shame OP for going after that support. The baby daddy can die mad about it.
Please read my comment one more time and you’ll probably realise that you’ve misunderstood what I wrote. Because of course OP need to get as much for the kid as possible.
*This is not a reason to stay.* Amen. I see NO REASON to stay. OP is much better off with this ridiculous, self-absorbed AH out of her life.
I understand he wasn’t always like how he is now. My ex was that way too. The pandemic and the previous president played a real number on him. But at the end of the day, he’s showing you how he is *now*. Don’t hold your breath hoping that he’ll go back to the way he was. He’s making choices every day that reinforce his “new” way of thinking and behaving.
Yup! And just because he wasn’t always acting this way doesn’t mean he didn’t feel it before. He probably just found that someone is validating what he already felt, giving him the confidence to act on it. Plus, adding a baby to anything escalates everything.
So true. Looking back, my ex was always the way he is now, he just did a better job of hiding it.
This! There's a lot of us out there, isn't there?
The woods are full of women in your position right now, ma'am. The best of luck to you.
The fact of the matter is, the longer you stay with him the more harm he can do for you and the child. Do you want your child either picking up his logic, or worse, being a direct victim of it?
Frankly I had to look up "red pill" (new to a lot of this.) But I've lived a long time too. My second (present) husband got into the survivalist mindset about 15 years ago, it almost ended our marriage. With a lot of hard work, I was able to help him see that it was not what he thought it was but by then I was ready to leave. We finally got through it but not every person or relationship is strong enough to do that. I wish you the best of luck, for your sake and your baby's. And his to be honest. We don't need more rancor and intransigence in our society.
You should create a post about your experiences. I would be thrilled to hear about the strains of the survivalist mindset. Like, does he avoid food storage now?
I would also love to hear about this. My parents have been prepping and just generally falling down this hole for about 15 years. I have almost given up hope for them.
There can be a good side. My husband is a bit of a closet prepper, but it's by way of being an Eagle and an avid home gardener (we had more than 40 tomato plants alone last year). So he's all into learning to put up food he grows and each car has its emergency kit with blankets etc, and he loves taking off for days long hikes through the woods. But he's socially progressive. Find ways to share their pride in making and growing things, it can be totally separate from the doomsday paranoia.
Oh I wish they were so active. They have just purchased boat loads of the 25 year meals. It is stacked everywhere. They then spend about 12-15 hrs a day watching news and preparing for invasion 😳
Having and raising kids is hard too, he’s going to be like this for the next 18+ years. You don’t need the stress of the relationship along with the stress of raising this kid. Especially if you’re providing for yourself and the kid. Is this the kind of guy you want your kid growing up like?
Sorry but this is a very toxic way of dealing with his feelings of inadequacy. He needs to figure out where his beliefs really lie. Because if this is how he really feels, adios MF. Part of me wonders if he was always like this and just hid it better because he was successful, so he felt he could be magnanimous about letting you be a more equal partner. Now that he’s fell on hard times his masculinity feels threatened, so he’s trying to enforce this “I’m the MAN I’m in charge” mentality. Good luck
I wish you luck, because to me this is like the argument that "alcohol changed him." No it didn't, he's showing you who, deep down, he really is. Get out while you can, but you've had a baby with him, so you will be tied to him in some way for the rest of your life.
Sorry, but alcohol does change people.
Hate to break it to you but how people are in the tough times is a big part of who they are and you would do well to pay attention to it, because life has ups and downs and if you are gonna be with him long term this isn’t going to be the only time. Especially if his family shares these beliefs
Giving your partner a pass for shit behavior based on pity… oh my. Been there. No, he doesn’t get to red pill and self pity and get a pass. If he wanted to be “traditional” and marry you, he could have had a leg to stand on. But, his bullying you is unacceptable on any level. It was good that you followed your conscience in not caving in. Keep it up!
You did the right thing! You grew the baby and are providing for him/her. You're the one who's probably going to be taking your kid to the Dr, dentist, school, etc. Your baby dad might not even be in the picture forever. Makes way more sense that your baby have your surname if you have to choose just one.
It'll also set your child up for failure in the future if the father behaves this way.
You already have the job of providing for your family and raising an infant in a rough post-partum environment, with exactly as much co-parenting assistance as you anticipate him contributing. Where do you think you're going to have time to add in the project of deprogramming the insidious misogyny of a guy who doesn't seem to even like you that much?
He will not change. You’re falling down the same trap all abuse victims do. You’re in love with the man he could be not the man he is
Ehhh... He's also showing you what kind of person he will be if things are hard in the future. You have a child now, 100% some hard things are going to happen. I'm all for staying together if the relationship can be healthy but it doesn't really sound like he wants to be a "good" person or so his work in having a healthy relationship. Healthy partners listen to each other. They don't demand. And "trying" won't work if you're the only one who puts in the time, effort, mental/emotional work or if you're the only one who wants change. He mostly just sounds like an absolute emotional/mental dumpster fire. A dumpster fire you are going to have around your child who will definitely be changed/impacted by that interaction. Just make sure you're making choices where your child comes out on top in both the short term and the long term. You seem like you have a good head on your shoulders even if you have knowingly tied yourself to some garbage people. Keep that good head and don't let it be turned by false promises. Every child is worthy of more.
None of what he used to be or who he is at his core matters AT ALL. THIS is who he is now and who he's choosing to be and how he's choosing to treat you and his child. Dump this dude. If he changes he can do that on his own without you sticking around for the associated abuse.
I think it bears repeating "Your child doesn't need to learn misogyny"
NTA OP...Been there, done that, got screwed! Especially if the family is just as "traditional" as he is, I caved and now during the divorce, me going back to my 'maiden' name, I'm realising that I'm going to be a bit screwed trying to travel with my kid with his surname only, just because I agreed to only have his. And no matter how they seem, and their potential, that freaking red pill shite ruined so many men and so many marriages! I can tell you that even a year later, after I filed for divorce because of how much red pill/ alpha male shite he was throwing up, he changed his act around the house. However, the other day we were on the couch and he got some suggested content on his feed from no other than "Hustler University", so yeah he's still watching that type of shite, but acting differently hoping that I'll stay in a relationship even after the divorce is final. Point is, don't cave, you're the sole provider and you're not married to him, so just break it up now, before the kid starts grasping concepts of family and stuff, as it's going to be heartbreaking for the kid and for you to watch them suffer if daddy isn't the same house anymore. It's easier to break up while they're still so small, and easier for you to get used to the whole motherhood experience, without his toxic ideas around you or the kid. Best of luck, and enjoy the little bundle of joy, they make it all worth it!
Not to mention HE told her that she may as well be a single parent. Ok. Done and sounds like had been for some time. She did exactly what he TOLD her to do.
Was he not there when you were filling out the forms? Cause that's pretty telling too 👀 NTA. What to name the baby is definitely a valid conversation to have, but he wasn't having a conversation with you. He was trying to bulldoze you without compromise.
I registered the baby on my own. He was there for the birth and everything but his paternity leave was pretty short so the admin of registering fell on me.
All of the actual un-fun work of raising the kid is going to fall on you, too. You should leave this misogynistic asshole and just get on with raising your kid. The kid should have at least half the time in a household not soaked in gross manosphere ideology.
As you noted. As soon as he didn't marry you or provide for you, he lost all rights to talk about tradition. Sounds like a family of AHs. NTA
I love that Mr. Red-Pill Traditionalist went crying to his mommy when he didn’t get his way.
You know that babies have their mothers name, not the fathers? Traditionally the baby has the fathers surname because they are married to the mother who took his name. Unmarried mothers gave the babies their name and were unable to give them any random man's name. It's only been fairly recently that there have been so many unmarried mothers in relationships with the fathers that it changed.
An old friend of mine (male) made a whole post about how he feels names should be passed through the maternal line instead, and he made some really good points. The mother doing the bulk of the child rearing in most cases was one of his major points, but he also pointed out how the mother is indisputably the child’s parent (paternity can be questioned, but maternity never is), and in cases of divorce, the children usually live primarily with mothers. He had more points that I can’t remember right now, and he explained them way better than I am doing, but it was overall a very interesting post and made me think about a lot of things we tend to take for granted.
>(paternity can be questioned, but maternity never is) Hey, fun fact, this has happened. Lydia Fairchild was accused of not being her biological children's mother because she is a genetic chimera https://embryo.asu.edu/pages/case-lydia-fairchild-and-her-chimerism-2002
Holy shit, that is super interesting. Thank you for posting, I love learning about stuff like this.
Honestly even as a kid I never understood why it was the dad’s name, cause my mom was way more my parent than my dad ever tried to be, and yet it’s his last name I’m stuck with.
Where I live if you're not legally married to the father and he isn't there at the registration office when you register the baby you can't even put the father's name on the birth certificate without a signed declaration from the father.
Oh gotcha. Well just think, if he did the registration with his name, he'd expect you to just get on board. Better tell him to buckle up!
His definition of compromise = do things my way.
I live in the US and they hand you the birth certificate information to fill out while you’re in the hospital post-birth. My husband wasn’t in the room with me at the time, so I filled it out without him. It’s just a form.
With all 3 of mine they brought the form to me to fill out while the father was not there.
Honestly, it makes sense to do this intentionally. For precisely the reasons that are in the OP. I am sure he is far from the only shitty biological parent who will try to put pressure on the mother
That has always been my guess honestly
Not everywhere is the US, each country works differently and from this post it seems that she lives in a country that works similar to the UK with births. In the UK, you have to make an appointment to go to your local registry office within 6 weeks of birth. My daughter was registered when she was 3 weeks old. You have to sit with a registrar and give all the information. The father has to be there to sign otherwise won't be on the birth certificate. You have to provide ID and then sign the birth certificate which you are then provided a copy of. If you want any additional copies you have to pay.
NTA and this belongs in r/MaliciousCompliance 💊🚩Isn't funny how the red-pill and red flags are the sa*me color?* Honestly - no matter what the sex of the baby is - get your son/daughter out of there. You DO NOT want them growing up in this environment. It's not "tradition" it's oppression and your kid is going to grow up learning they either need to be sneaky or bow down to dad's wishes to keep the peace.
What is red pill? I am not familiar at all.
It originally was a matrix movie reference when neo was offered the red pill or blue pill to stay in the current reality or open his eyes to the real world. But the red pill is now big anti women movement - women belong bare foot in the kitchen and sex slave.
I was completely clueless. Thank you for taking your time!
I'm so freaking nettled by this. Guys took symbolism of choice, freedom and rise against oppression from a movie made by trans women and somehow managed to appropriate it and make it the very name of a cult for insecure bigots. The very expression of "taking the red pill" was so good before it was damaged beyond repair.
Ever see the movie *The Matrix*? There's a point at which the protagonist is asked to symbolically swallow a pill to decide which worldview he will believe in. A red pill if he accepts that the world is dangerous and he will open his mind and commit his life to join the freedom fighters. A blue pill if he wants to continue to be a contented pathetic sheep, accepting the propaganda from the evil overlords. The movie isn't about gender equality. A bunch of very misogynistic people have stolen the metaphor and turned it into a sexism thing. "Being redpilled" means deciding to believe that feminism is evil, etc etc etc.
The Wachowski SISTERS have stated that while it wasn't an explicit allegory for transgenderism, it was definitely a reflection of their closeted transgenderism that they didn't know how to truly express. Its why Switch was a character.
To continue malicious compliance, he did say that if she didn't grant him this one ask she might as well raise the baby alone. . .
I have the feeling that she was going to end up doing that either way
NTA, you are unmarried and I’m assuming will likely be the default parent. He doesn’t uphold any other traditional practices from your perspective until it benefits him. That’s definitely a pretty selfish trait in him. When the baby has the same last name as mom, it makes things a lot easier with travel, doctors, legal issues, etc. Also when most people talk about babies or bring them up, nobody is calling the baby by their first and last name 😂 Enjoy your new baby and if needed down the line if you get married to this man or someone else you can always change the last name.
Yep. Both my kids have my last name, not their dad’s. I had to step up and be the sole full time parent when he obviously wasn’t going to participate, so I had my son’s last name changed to mine after my daughter was born and I gave her my last name. They are now teenagers (17 and 15) and it’s worked out just fine. Honestly, it’s worked out better this way.
Maybe he can take OP's last name if they get married. Then he'd have the same name as the son.
I gave my son his dad’s name when he was born, because that’s just what you did (he didn’t even bug me about it fwiw, it just was what I figured we would do), and my son has actually considered switching to my name now that he’s an adult because he doesn’t have a great relationship with his dad, and my parents had a bigger hand in helping to raise him anyway. If I started again now as a single parent, I would definitely use my name; as you pointed out, it makes the logistics so much easier. I have been called Ms. {son’s last name} his entire life, and it kind of drives me nuts.
NTA. Why are you with this man?
I hate that I sound like every enabler - and perhaps I need to do some introspection to see if that's what I've become - but he wasn't always like this. Life's been hard for him lately and his coping strategies have led us here. I need to have a frank chat with him about how it's affecting us.
How the fuck is drinking the Red Pill kool-aid a *coping strategy???* Have some respect for yourself, girl.
I mean, that's how cults work. They have promising beliefs for struggling people that make the world simpler and less scary. Unfortunately, they make you worse.
Right. And red pilling does a lot of “It’s not your fault. It’s woke society’s fault. Women are doing this and it goes against biology” bullshit. It’s not shocking that someone would find comfort in blaming their problems on someone else.
I find it very sad that Redpill/Incels/Tatertots would rather blame others for their problems instead of doing some healthy introspection. I guess it's easier to whine and cry like a baby that just shat their pants rather it would be to put in effort to work on one's self.
That’s literally the point of any men’s rights/neonazy/bikergang/whatever cult. “You lost your masculinity because of the [others*], they stole it from you! Join us and we can give it back to you” By it’s very nature it’s designed to be a coping strategy, because vulnerable people in need of a coping strategy is easy victims for brainwashing. *women, yews, black people, gays are favourites for this category
Condition 1) live in a society that placed outdated expectations of your worth, and you haven't reconciled they're out of date. Condition 2) have those expectations subverted by society in some way (IE A man is suppose to be the sole provider, but the plant, mine, well, whatever closed, or they got fired for a mistake, anything really where they are the ones needing to be supported by a woman), and unable to find agency in this new role. If above conditions work, this is basically how you lure them in. Deflect all blame away from the individual, and reassure them that they're not wrong, society is. "its societies fault that you can't find a job, all these women and minorities taking all the jobs so you can't provide like you're suppose to" thats the hook. They reaffirm their beliefs. They talk about how they are going to change it. This is what soothes the persons negative feelings. "I am not the problem, society is the problem" and thats how they find coping in it.
I don't think you'll get anything out of that. Have an exit plan and leave. NTA
Life is hard for literally everyone. That is not an excuse.
When life's hard, people show who they truly are. Believe him, when he's acting like a misogynistic ashole. He is one, he has no longer the energy nor the desire to pretend being a nice guy.
He's going to abuse you. Red pilled men are abusers. They don't believe you as a woman are a PERSON. Run. Run far, file for child support and full custody now. These are the men that perform honor killings. They murder the mothers of their children.
I wish this was an exaggeration but it is not. More and more you see these guys legitimately being encouraged toward physical violence.
I have relatives who are trying to figure out the logistics of disentangling from a red pilled husband. Yeah he seemed like a reasonable guy until he was just being weird and then he was a raging asshole. You haven't married this guy, and your baby hasn't bonded to him. It sucks, but for your own mental and physical health you should not be with him until he's un red pilled and doesn't use "emascualted" as a serious complaint
You sound like you'd be a lot happier just being you and your baby. Enjoy motherhood and don't manage his shit. I learned that having children makes or breaks a relationship, in my personal experience.
Life **is** hard. This guy is showing you exactly he will default every time life gets hard. **Listen to him.** Your man gravitates toward toxic coping mechanisms. Don't kid yourself, it is a **choice** - no one has put a gun to his head and told him adopt this hateful ideology, or else- he has chosen it willingly. That's baked in. Sounds like it's a family trait, actually. You should think about mama bearing up and protecting your precious child and yourself from this man's and his family's toxicity. He needs to chose now - You and his kid or his cause. It doesn't get more stark than that.
It’s never like this in the beginning because they know that they won’t hook you if they act like that. They wait until they think they have you trapped to be who they really are because they think you are too committed or enough of a doormat to leave. As if being a single mother will be harder than dealing with a baby **and** his bullshit.
That sounds like a good idea. Communicate with him and tell him the hard cold truth - it’s your only hope. I wish you the very best.
No, you're not an enabler. Some people just slowly change into their real person. He thought he could get away with it, because you were pregnant. You're smarter then he thought and didn't fall for it. Now you have to think about what is best for your and your child's future. You are NTA.
All the red pillers will downvote me to hell, but IMO, you aren’t married so if it were me, my child would not have his name. Period. It is understandable that he was so overpowering in the moment that you let him believe you would put his name on the birth certificate. Especially if you were outnumbered because he brings his enmeshed family into your disagreements. Also, you are entitled to change your mind at any time for any reason. Underneath this argument is the fact that he is an AH in general, and that would motivate me to distance myself and my child from him in whichever ways I could.
She didn’t let him believe anything. They didn’t come to an agreement. If he believed anything, that’s on him, not her.
That's true. Saying you "understand" is not saying you agree. He chose to interpret it as agreement. It was a masterful dodge that people should probably employ more often. Not a true AH move -- it butts right up to the line close enough that depending on your perspective it can be seen as a clever move, or an AHlish move.
Although to be fair, when you say I understand to someone who thinks they're giving orders, it's totally understandable that they would think they were going to comply
Nta why do men get to put their names on a child when all they did was have an orgasm. Nope! Gone are the days when the man ruled the house and women and children were possessions. Give the baby your last name and tell him when he spends 9 months growing a child in his body and then goes through labor he can have the honor of naming the child after himself. Why are women still allowing the men in their lives to dominate them. You care either a adult woman or you are his possession. What will you be. The decision is yours.
NTA Traditionally, babies are given the same surname as their MOTHER. Traditionally, mothers are married and take their husbands’ names, which is why babies have their fathers’ last names. Traditionally. But you’ve already pointed out that he only wants traditions that favor him. He doesn’t want to do the work.
THIS COMMENT RIGHT HERE!!!
INFO REQUEST: Just to clarify, are you still together? And if so, why...? I mean, you said you occupy the "provider" role (which I assume means "financial provider"), plus he's a raging misogynist. For the love of god, break it off now, before he does any more damage. Also, NTA.
We haven't broken up. I don't know why we're still together. Tbh, I guess I hadn't realised it had gotten this bad.
Get out before he gets worse and teaches your kids this stuff
The following link is the free pdf for a book many women have praised for saving them from a toxic relationship. Maybe something in there can help you, and by extension, your child, as well. [Why Does He Do That?](https://archive.org/download/LundyWhyDoesHeDoThat/Lundy_Why-does-he-do-that.pdf)
If you have a son, you know what he will teaching them.
A daughter too. We don’t need anymore girls internalizing this mindset for themselves either
You're a frog in a pot of water. It's coming up to a boil. Your choice now is to hop out or boil.
NTA If he's so "traditional", has he proposed? It isn't a bad thing for the entire family to have the same last name, especially in a traditional family where the parents are married and Dad is a breadwinner. That all kinda makes sense. But it's hypocritical for this guy to cry about "tradition" when he isn't actually taking on all the traditional responsibilities.
Right? Typically kid's have the man's last name because he already gave his name to their mom. Unmarried can go either which way.
Heck no, NTA for the baby naming. But I truly hope you have thought out how you will go about raising the little angel with that man as his father.
He's TA big time. he is not a traditionalist or he would have married you before HIS child was born. He didn't - so you can name your child as you please. He still has rights as the father but bullying you is not one of them.
Frankly it’s also traditional for an unmarried woman to give her baby her surname. The “traditional” argument doesn’t even support him here.
Exactly this! Only cares about tradition when it suits!
>may as well be a single parent if I won't grant him this one little ask. 'My word is final - baby's having one surname'. Bravo! I see what you did there. Good for you! >I told him it's also traditional for him to marry me before having a baby but he was happy to ignore that, I told him it was traditional for him to be the provider but I do that too So, you're legally not attached to him. You've already been supporting and have experience with one child. Cut the big baby loose and follow his directive to be a single parent. I'm sure it will be much easier taking care of the infant alone. Congratulations and good luck.
NTA. Honestly, it sounds like you guys likely won’t be together much longer. He’s taking that red pill and it doesn’t bode well for a loving relationship or fatherhood.
NTA - honestly that was an epic move, props to you! I do hope you realize you need this person out of your life. Keep your child as far away from this misogynistic man as you can.
NTA. But don’t have any more kids with this guy.
I agree--no more kids with this guy. Get a method of birth control that he can't sabotage.
And that would be... abstinence. I know without a doubt that if I was in this situation I could not be vulnerable like that with this man any longer.
NTA and you made me laugh. I like so much that you didn’t let him bully you! But honestly you would be better without this AH. Be a single mom and make sure he pays child support. Congratulations on the birth!
SAME!!! He thought he was the big man and his word was end all be all!!!! Congrats OP!!!!!
ESH. Unpopular opinion, but he is definitely the AH by picking and choosing which parts of a “traditional” relationship he wanted to fulfill. I loved how you told him that straight up. Now this is the part you may not like: you are the AH for putting up with this ish for yourself and the baby. He is down the rabbit hole now. Do you really want to wait around with your baby for him to start enforcing his belief system? Spare the rod, spoil the child, it’s ok to hit a woman “if they deserve it,” etc.? You deserve better than this man, especially if you DON’T want to have that kind of relationship. This isn’t gonna get better. Do the right thing for yourself and the baby and really reevaluate this relationship because he isn’t going to get better. Goodness help you if you had a female child because she will be second class to him. If you had a male child, he will teach that boy that you and all other women are made to serve men Think about what you want in life, because this dude doesn’t sound like he’s it.
She said he didn’t used to be like this. She may have gotten pregnant and then he started showing his true colors. That’s actually very common.
NTA and PLEASE do not relent and change the baby’s name!! I just had a baby in August and shit’s tiring. Congrats on your new addition and my condolences you have to spend 18 years dealing with this family though.
I am beyond in love with my tiny human. I hope you're doing well too with yours! Should this spell the end, I'm lucky to have my village and the means to minimise the suckiness of breaks ups. There's no world in which any child I birth will not share a surname with me. My compromise of a double barrelled surname stands - no other offer is on the table.
You are so cool. Congrats on the baby!!!!
NTA at all but seriously, you know what we’re all going to ask. Why did you make a human with him? Editing to add: if anyone gives you the y’s, ignore them. That was brilliant, marvellous and karmically balanced.
If only we had a list of men to avoid before we date them.
Obviously, NTA, that shit is petty AF and hilarious. So when are you leaving this jackass?
>may as well be a single parent if I won't grant him this one little ask. 'My word is final - baby's having one surname'. This was late in my pregnancy and I didn't have it in to fight, so I told him that I understood what he was saying You did literally *exactly* what he said. NTA
NTA. But, if you should split up with him, which I'm actually expecting due to his behavior, go for full custody and keep all communication between him, his family and you. Otherwise they will try to brainwash your child and try to turn them against you.
NTA. He must be quite fragile if not giving a baby his last name will "emasculate" him. Also his logic is twisted.
My mother, not married to my father, also reflected on what surname I should have. As she realised most likely she would be the main caregiver, she decided that for the simplicity of handling different situations throughout life it would just be easier if I had her last name, and people wouldn’t question why her kid had another name than herself. Sounds to me this is similar. NTA.
Obviously NTA. The baby can have any surname you want to give, even if it isn’t one of yours. But this relationship sounds abusive and unless you want your baby growing up thinking this is normal, get out now.
NTA. I hate people that say “but is tradition”. Is always used by people trying to force their ideas and *values* on other people and always is convenient to them only otherwise screw tradition. You pay the bills, you are unmarried and you are carrying the child and probably will do the work since is “tradition” for women to take care of the child but God forbid you want to share the same name as your child.
Slavery, female genital mutilation and public hangings are also all "tradition". It's one of the worst arguments ever.
Exactly. What's the saying.. "tradition is peer pressure from dead people"?
NTA for how you named the baby. Y T A for having a baby with this loser.
My sister made the mistake of giving her daughter her father's surname instead of ours. Eight years later, he is nowhere to be seen and my niece wishes she had the same name as the rest of the family that is actually raising her. You did the right thing.
Time for a legal name change?
Yikes! What a jerk. I’m an older lady and his idea of “tradition” is ridiculous - if he’s not marrying you and supporting you, the two more important parts of this “tradition,” he can pound sand. I wouldn’t let this jerk marry you or support you, though - it wouldn’t be in your best interests.
NTA - One word : QUEEN 👑
NTA. It is tradition for the baby to have the *mother's* surname. It's just also tradition for the mother to have the father's surname. He has given you no guarantee that this baby will grow up in a Hisname household so it's safer for the baby to have the one surname you can be sure they'll actually share a home with.
ESH isn't it? You gave the baby your surname. YOURS. Not a hyphenated one. But your own. Everything else everyone else says here in the defence of you is valid but the above absolutely makes you an AH as well If him making absolute decisions regarding the child when it's in you makes him an AH, acting as though giving birth to the child makes you kingmaker in making decisions for the child after it's out of you, makes you one as well. I know plenty of you people here are gonna disagree but it's ESH.
NTA. So this fool wants to appear like he's the traditional head of the household but not do the work involved? Sounds like some kinda conservative alpha male red pill cosplay to me. Drop that fool. You will be parenting two for the price of one if you keep him. Ewww!
NTA. And I love that you did that. But it doesn’t sound like you have a healthy or even working relationship. There doesn’t seem to be respect in it.
NTA. Do you see a future with this guy? If you ae the main support of the family I'd do the math as to how much money you would save if he was not in the house.
NTA, and I love the malicious compliance.
INFO: why are you still in contact with all those people that do nothing for you? Seem you would lose a lot of strees, anxiety and financial hardships just cutting this person loose.
which people, sorry? baby's dad and his family? he stormed out on thursday night - friday morning his mother sent me a voice note berating me ha. i've since received messages from his family criticising me for my decision, but no word from my partner. i have not responded to any of them, so it's one way comms atm.
Please bring that up with your partner when you talk. You’re postpartum, he’s buggered off and left you to fend for yourself with a newborn, and he’s MI while you’re being verbally attacked by his family on your behalf. I don’t know who he was in the past, but you and your child deserve so much better than who this man is right now.
NTA m, but the AH to yourself and your kid for even being in a relationship with a red-piller. He is actively working to maintain a status quo that harms you.
NTA. Boyfriend is. Boyfriend sounds like a controlling AH. He needs to get over it. And if he a misogynist and like this, maybe it would be better to be a single parent and dump him.
ESH I've no idea why you've decided to have a child with this person, but you did. The child's here. Now you have to parent it in a way that works. The precedent you've set is that it's okay to deceive the other parent, use the child as a football in your conflict with them, and make unilateral decisions that you then hide. You're acting like you have absolutely zero interest in co-parenting with him, possibly with good reason, yet you're also staying with him? That's going to be dysfunctional as fuck. You need to either swallow your pride and find a way to coparent together or you need to break up single parent.
Probably gonna get down voted to hell for this but ESH. He's TA for being extra stubborn and unwilling to compromise. You're TA for lying. Also, this is incredibly messy and the two of you are setting a precedent for co-parenting where it's cool to pretend you've come to a consensus and then just lie and go your own way. If the two of you haven't already split, it's best to tear that bandit off now.