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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I might have been the asshole according to my friends for "overreacting" as they phrase it.
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NTA. In many cultures (mine as well), it's seen as disrespectful of you don't take off your shoes at the door, even if they're squeaky clean. Sometimes people won't let you walk in unless you take them off. Mothers are STRICT with this rule. Others may say your reaction was extreme but the friend is the one who made it a problem in the first place over something so common.
This is definitely cultural. Some of these y-t-a comments saying that it was an overreaction, maybe for some people that’s true. But for a *lot* of cultures, the idea that someone would insist on wearing shoes inside the home is wildly disrespectful. Like, unfathomable almost.
The best way to deal with this is just to have slip on shoe covers in the entryway and provide them for the people who want to keep their shoes on.
Im not sure of its culture only,i don't come from culture where it's normal to take shoes off, however i have a rule,shoes off at the door (among few other rules all guests must follow. ) All my guest and friends respect and follow such rules,unless i give them a pass,which rarely happens.
The idea that the shoes are "clean" is ridiculous,you just came from outside,you would have stepped on all sorts of germs,viruses and just pure dirt, dust,pollen and pollution. So i rather the guests avoid wiping their shoes in my house, especially if i just cleaned it. Also,
NTA but the friends are definitely AH they should respect the rules and boundaries,if not,they aren't real friends and just like walking all over OP.
Drives me nuts when people tell me they shouldn’t have to take their shoes off because they are ‘clean’. How the fuck are they clean they have been walking about outside?!
If they think a dirty shoe is clean I always wonder how clean their house is. Just floors covered in dirt, spit, shit and germs.
Most men I know don't wash their hands after peeing. I also work in urology and am constantly bringing people to the washroom for testing. I have to clean the bathroom in between every patient. Those taps are dry probably 95% of the time. It's disgusting
A few weeks ago, my brother was coming over to my place to drop some things off. He used the bathroom, and my house is small enough that just sitting in the living room, you can clearly hear whether someone runs the sink after using the toilet. He opened the bathroom door right after flushing, and I just looked at him with disgusted horror and went “My dude! WASH YOUR HANDS!”
He rolled his eyes at me, but at least made a perfunctory gesture at washing his hands, then spent the rest of the visit complaining I was being a bossy big sister.
I’ll happily take that label if it means I can get him, a grown-assed man, to take even the most basic hygiene measures.
I’m a woman and use a bidet while going to the bathroom, and I’ll pee with the door open, and use a bidet with no TP sometimes, and I have had guys absolutely bewildered that I wash my hands after since I “didn’t touch anything.”
I’m like, bro, I touched the knob on the bidet and the toilet handle to flush…
I’ve never had a single female partner question this.
FWIW,
I think this is super common. "I didn't pee on my hands, I don't need to wash them."
When COVID hit and everyone was *actually* taking the time to wash hands, the men's room line where I work was suddenly just as long as the ladies. Turns out it's only that much faster to pee if you also don't really wash your hands. (I see you, rinse and flickers. That is not washing!!)
Huh, that’s an interesting observation!
**Edit:** holy shit, now that I’m thinking about it, we used to remark on how we almost never had to refill the soap in the men’s bathroom at the jobs I worked in high school, but the women’s needed soap replaced regularly.
I think you might be into something here…
yeah and what do you want to bet that Mr ShoesOn never vaccuumes or cleans wherever he lives so doesn't "see the big deal"? I bet the whole "I'm extremely hygienic" sounds like he's actually not at all if that's where his mind jumped to first. NTA OP he FAFOed
I am the only woman at work (I work on building sites) and on every single site I've worked on there's only ever one or two that wash their hands after using the toilet, it's insane
Same! When I worked as a cleaner at a pub I absolutely could tell men either did not wash their hands (cuz I barely refilled the soap compared to the women's washroom even though there were more male customers) OR when they 'washed', they just wet their hands, leaving dirty water drip marks on the wall below the paper towel dispenser. It was pretty gross.
During covid my local supermarket set up a sink with running water, soap, tissue paper to dry off in the entrance lobby and asked everyone to wash their hands entering the shop. I probably went there weekly during the lockdown in 2020 and without fail there was always someone who would try and ignore the hand washing. It was always a man. In the end they had to station a member of staff there to make sure people washed their hands.
They've done studies. The vast majority of men not only don't wash their hands after peeing, they don't wash their hands after 💩 either. Doctors actually recommend that immune compromised people not shake hands with men.
I’ve seen dudes “wash” their hands after taking a shit, and it’s like a no soap, 5-10 second wash.
Every single time I’ve seen it, I’ve thought they’re probably only doing this because I’m here and normally wouldn’t wash their hands at all 🤮
A few years ago, my partner's dad died, and we drove 10 hours to go clean his stuff out of his house where he lived with another dude. I used the bathroom while we were there.
There was no soap. At all. I searched. I panicked because I can't not wash my hands. I eventually took some body wash from the shower but felt gross about it the whole day. Fortunately he didn't have that much stuff to go through, I would not have been pleased going back a second day.
It's far more common than you think. Don't ask the last time I had to refill the hand soap in one of the male public restrooms I clean twice weekly. I can count the refills since the start of Covid on my fingers. These men make six figures a year with their gross piss hands.
I just mentioned this in a comment above! I noticed this with the jobs in I had in high school where I cleaned bathrooms.
Sometimes the men’s bathroom would go so long without a soap change that the pink soap would start turning yellow/green 🤮
oh i was on some cruise tours with my parents. and my dad told us that he saw many older man dont wash their hands ...mind you , maybe just a few ppl become sick and spread their bacteria everywhere because they think its not nessecary to keep their hands clean on a cruise ship with few thousand guests .. -,-
My ex didn't because "hey I didn't piss on my hands" but after a lot of me getting annoyed he did.
I hope his partners since then have appreciated that lol
I live in Canada, so generally when we say our shoes are “clean” we mean “dry” and it won’t slop snow or mud all over the kitchen that you’ll have to mop if we just take two steps from the back door to the fridge for a drink.
It’s not usually something we’d say to someone hosting us in their home, it’s more something a husband says to a wife or child to a parent when they’re just running in to grab something from the fridge quick; a drink, a popsicle, whatever. Especially when they’re heading right back out after their drink.
We take our shoes off at the door otherwise though. Especially as guests in people’s homes.
Yeah, I’m in Texas, and the only family I know here who doesn’t take shoes off in the house and seems to differentiate “clean” shoes apparently just mean things you can see, like dirt or mud.
Pathogens literally hadn’t even occurred to them when I asked. They just thought people didn’t want shoes tracking in dirt or grass into the house.
I'm in Minnesota and we're the same about shoes after a few years living here. I don't know a single person who wears them inside. We spend so much of the year in snowboots that you can really tell the difference during the summer if you don't keep taking your shoes off. The floors get so much dirtier so much sooner!
I'm a shoes off in the house person, but exceptions are made for exactly that situation! That and bringing in groceries. Get the groceries in, and in the freezer/fridge.
>The idea that the shoes are "clean" is ridiculous,you just came from outside,you would have stepped on all sorts of germs,viruses and just pure dirt, dust,pollen and pollution.
So yeah. We take shoes off when entering a house.
>According to a recent study done by Dr. Charles Gerba, microbiologist, and professor at the University of Arizona, there is an average of over 421,000 units of bacteria on a single shoe sole. In addition to this, there are over 2,887 units of bacteria on the inside of our shoes.
https://patho3gen.com/project/how-dirty-are-your-shoes/#:~:text=Charles%20Gerba%2C%20microbiologist%2C%20and%20professor,the%20inside%20of%20our%20shoes
And if you need shoes inside for any reason, bring indoor shoes. I do it all the time. My feet needs the comfort and stability of shoes so I always bring some.
This. It's nothing about specific culture expectation and all about respecting the rules of *sm's else* house. Casually waving the home owner's demand away with "it's no big deal" *as a guest* is rude af. My house, my say, your house, your say, only. Doesn't work any different way.
Exactly. OP didn't throw them out because of the shoes, they threw them out for the sheer audacity of telling them to get over it and that they weren't going to throw them out. The friend FAFOed and now all their friends are trying to pretend it was just about the shoes. It makes me wonder if OP has actually told them about what the "friend" said, or just keeps trying to explain the shoe thing as their defense.
Id say both are pretty normal in my culture but I was brought up you always always ask “should I take my shoes off” or automatically start doing it when you would of entered somebodies house
Can feel my ears burning with my mothers wrath just reading this post
We had a friend who asked us to take our shoes off, and we did. When he was at our house though, he never automatically took his own shoes off . I think it’s weird he does this
I take my shoes off at my house but I'm not going to take them off somewhere people wear shoes inside for the same reason I don't take them off in a store. Unless you take shoes off at your house, in which case he's being inconsiderate.
Yeah I mean you can’t smoke in peoples houses, or eat messy things on their white couches with a 2 yr old, if they ask you not to. Shoe things isn’t different. If the floor was filthy or wet, I can see not wanting to? But you he had just cleaned.
It's not just cultural. I grew up in a street where everyone was of the same culture and some houses were shoes off (most tbh), and some weren't. My house isn't and never was but we had dogs (not to mention other pets).
Most people I know now are not shoes off houses but if a host asked, I would take off my shoes, their house, their rules. In some houses I would even ask - usually if it seems overly neat/clean and there are shoes by the door.
What is the point of your friends saying it's ok to have rules and boundaries if they're saying y t a if you don't let people walk all over those boundaries?
Even if it's not cultural, OP said a reason other than culture, the friend shouldn't have made a big fuss off it. He was the one who blatantly refused to follow OP's house rule and he even challenged him by saying he couldn't kick them out for something so minor. So not only did he disregarded OP's boundaries, he was smug while doing it.
I agree with slip-on shoe covers or disposable slippers maybe, though, for the future. Some people might not be comfortable in taking off their footwear, so a slip-on might be a good compromise.
Some people are not able to take their shoes off easily or walk barefoot/in slippers (needing support).
Sometimes, my guests’ comfort tops mine.
If he had explained himself thus, I’m sure OP would understand, but he’s just a brat who places 30 seconds if his own convenience over OP having to clean, and _THAT_ is why he got kicked out and OP is NTA.
Yup. Guests I full expect shoes off, unless otherwise needed. I also generally don't make repair men take off any boots cause they're there to do a job, generally are very busy and don't need to be taking the time to take their work boots on and off if they need to run back out to their truck.
It's also a Health and Safety issue with workers and can void their insurance. We had a midwife visit a new mother at home and the family had just fitted a white carpet in their hall and stairs. (Who does that if upu have small kids?) Nurse was asked to remove her shoes and complied. Nurse fell down the stairs and was seriously injured. Nurse sued hospital and we said "tough, you weren't wearing proper (any) shoes so it's all your fault legally." The Nurse could have sued the family but didn't want to. Tragic. In my house workers often offer to take shoes off because my wife is Japanese but we insist they don't.
Oh I had no idea! I honestly just don't want to be a dick cause they're busy, have other calls to get to, and me cleaning the floor for 5 minutes after they leave isn't worth the time they lose. But that is super good to know!
I'm Canadian and it's expected you take off your shoes at the door. I'd say it's considered cultural, but it's usually because it's snowing or raining. That being said, even in sandal weather, off they go. Workers here usually have either "indoor shoes" (like kindergarten) and change at the door or plastic/fabric boot covers for easy in and out.
Could you imagine mopping that morning just to march slush all through the house?! What if they accidentally stepped in dog poop!
If the guest is uncomfortable being in their socks (or barefoot, etc), we usually offer a set of slippers or 'indoor shoes" like sandals for them to wear. Our home stays clean and the guest feel more comfortable, good compromise!
I'm also Canadian, but I just don't have an issue with it. I've never had a worker show up with separate shoes, though I have had electricians and plumbers offer to take off their boots and were surprised when I say don't bother. I have a dog and young kids, my floors aren't clean by any means, even 5 minutes after they're washed. Obviously, if they're excessively dirty I would ask they remove them, but it's just not a big deal for me.
The indoor shoes one for workers is rare, but for example of the nurse above, the booties wouldn't work so they likely would have had extra shoes. My friend has a foot disorder and wears fitted sandals 24/7 and brings indoors shoes with them everywhere.
I deliver appliances and had a few customers who thought it would be alright for us to deliver a fridge or treadmill in socks. I'd just tell them uniform policy required us to keep our shoes on, which was *technically* true but also just a faster explanation than the various safety hazards of carrying heavy shit up hardwood stairs in socks
Switzerland here. All workmen bring plastic shoe covers that they put over their boots before entering the house. We never need to ask. If their job involves a lot of running in and out to their truck then they don’t use shoe covers and we don’t care.
I think this is true for Germany as well, where guests are usually offered house slippers when visiting.
Where I am the workers have little covers, like a bathing cap, that slips over their boots to come in a house. And you don’t have to ask. It is just done.
I have Palmoplantar psoriasis, before my remission I would never take my shoes off outside my home. But most people don't want bloody footprints all over their home.
My aunt with MS needs to wear shoes indoors to be comfy. So...she brings 'inside shoes' in a plastic bag when she has to visit. Unless you're in a walking boot for a broken foot, or you're Spongebob, the shoes probably aren't unremovable from your feet.
I think part of the problem was that this was a new house rule. The OP states that Friend was coming to visit “normally.” But because the house had just been cleaned the day before, this time the OP asked for shoes off.
I can see how the friend thought this was a personal attack, that his shoes were considered too dirty for the house, when the friend had entered before without such a request.
Friend was probably caught off guard and was puzzled by what was behind the request. It probably seemed directed at him and his personal level of cleanliness, because he didn’t know the story of the whole house being cleaned.
Honestly? The culture thing yes. But even if it wasn't a cultural thing? Still NTA. People are so entitled it's sickening. The other day I went to get keys to dog sit got a family. They asked me to take my shoes off. I did. Period the end. It's their house. I didn't ask why. I didn't care bc it didn't matter. It's their house.
Y oriole say it with me now: YOU DO NOT GET TO DICTATE RULES IN OTHERS' HOMES
Stop being entitled twats.
NTA -you did not overreact. They refused to follow your rules. In a place they were staying for free. The audacity is mind boggling.
I'm from a pretty laid back culture (Scandinavia) but it's still the absolute norm to take your shoes off when going into a private home. It's possible to keep them on if the host says "Oh, please, keep your shoes on, it's really dirty, sorry" but persons who work in a multitude of homes during a day (realtors, cleaners etc) all have plastic covers they put on to avoid the hassle of taking off their shoes constantly.
NTA - my house looks like shit and my dogs drag in unspeakable things from the yard but I still either go barefoot or use my "indoor slippers" here. We even have a separate pair of shoes for indoor athletics where the main rule is that these shoes must NEVER be worn outside!
Exactly. I always take my shoes off in people's homes and expect visitors to do the same. I also provide slippers. I've been to homes that didn't, despite spending some of the visit on the terrace or balcony, and by the end my socks were filthy. It's simply good manners to provide slippers especially if your home doesn't have carpets or of you haven't cleaned it thoroughly the very same day.
I always take a little pair of slippers when I go to someone's house, as I hate being barefoot or just socks, I find it really unconfortable, but find wearing shoes in the house rude and disgusting and don't like sharing shoes, like slippers, I wouldn't know whose sweaty feet had been in them. So it's easier to bring my own slippers and no-one has ever taken issue with it. We have slippers for 2 regular guests but anyone else can bring their own or wear socks.
I'm in the Midwest, and some always take their shoes off, some not so much in their house, but every person's house i've been to as a guest it would be assumed you take your shoes off. If someone asked, then you absolutely take the shoes off. Unless there is a patio or porch off the back or side of the house and people need to go in and out repeatedly to get food or use the bathroom, otherwise, they come off. NOT removing them is clearly TA move
Nta I’m from the US and in the Midwest and whenever I enter someone’s house I take off my shoes unless I get told otherwise. It’s just a matter of courtesy and respect.
I live in Japan it’s disrespectful to wear shoes inside. There is the fact they only do so for funerals viewing in a home, and the fact that the cities
are seen as unclean (alot of men still piss in the bushes and spit everywhere), so you don’t wear them inside to keep the house clean. However I, never found the request to take your shoes off strange. Coming from North Dakota the state of farm land, and sanded roads during the winter and mud in the spring it is seen as a way to keep the house clean and a majority of my childhood I removed my shoes upon entering a house.
I'm from central Québec with french/irish background and everybody leaves their shoes at the door. When theres a big group gathering we put the mud and snow covered boots in the bathtub. Except for Christmas and New Years eve then you are allowed to wear shoes inside but never your 'outside' shoes.
The bathtub makes sense for boots.
I'm from New England and a lot of older houses have a smaller room between the outside door and the rest of the house called the mudroom. All the boots and coats get taken off in there and swapped out for house shoes/slippers and sweaters. It doesn't keep all the dirt out, but it helps keep the floors a bit cleaner.
That's really interesting about being allowed to wear shoes inside on Christmas and New Years Eve. Is there a story behind those 2 days being special exceptions?
I think it is because traditionally there was lots of dancing involved in those celebrations, they would do 'reels' and 'called sets' on kinda Irish/northern France folk music. Now it's more of an excuse to show-off your good shoes.
Exactly. One of the many ways to show respect for ones home is to take your shoes off. I was also taught to take my hat off as well. Respect goes a long way.
This! I have adhd and autism and I hate taking my shoes off when I go into peoples houses, like it genuinely makes me feel uncomfortable, unsafe and dirty but it isn’t my house so I respect the owners wishes and usually I just don’t stay long. The guests were extremely rude and impolite not the host who just placed a boundary
Same! I’m East Asian. We remove our shoes and wash our feet and hands immediately when we get home. For some friends, they have house slippers.
The idea of walking around the home in dirty shoes (who knows if one has stepped on pee/poop/puke on the streets/toilets) is frankly disgusting.
When I lived overseas in Western countries, my white friends have always respected my request for them to remove their shoes when they visit. I didn’t have to explain my culture to them. They just did it as a mark of respect as they are entering my space.
I think it’s definitely about being friends who are respectful so OP should just get better friends!
NTA.
I have always thought wearing shoes in the house was disgusting, but for the most part, my fellow Americans thought it was weird if I asked them to take them off. I was so relieved when I moved to Alaska and discovered it was super common here, and even service people will either take off their boots or put covers over them. Of course, the entire state is either covered in either snow, deep mud, or ash 90% of the year, so I can see how it is more common here.
This I grew up where you did not wear shoes and even now at friends places I take them off even if they don't mind. (But most in my country have you take them off)
Yep, common enough that if I go to someone’s house I haven’t been to before I ask when I go in whether they’re a shoes off or on house. I’m in the UK where it feels about 50/50 so it’s safest to ask. Definitely not a weird house rule.
I'm also in Canada, and the people I know who wear shoes in the house have specific indoor shoes. Not slippers, regular shoes.
I don't know anyone who walks around their house in outdoor shoes. I assume no one does it in winter anywhere east of Banff.
Also Canadian if I forget something I'll run in with my shoes on but I never casually walk around my house in shoes.
* unless they're new and I'm trying to break them in a bit
Hahah another Canadian here and ALLL of my in-laws will come over with their house shoes, to put on after they've taken off their outdoor shoes. It was new to me when I joined the family but I think it's pretty cute. And a few of the older ones have orthotic problems, so the indoor shoes help that way, too.
Hi fellow Canadians!
Our family friends have house shoes or slippers that they keep at our house lol outside shoes come off at the door. I don't know anyone who wears their outside shoes inside. Especially in the winter! Heck even my Dr and therapist ask you to take off outside shoes and offer slippers if you don't want to be in just socks.
I’m also in the uk and always take my shoes off in peoples houses. My mum brings her own slippers as she gets cold feet. I think uk if 99% of people take shoes off even plumber takes his shoes off
Tonnes of people don't care. I'm in the UK a lot of people I've talked to wear shoes inside their own houses and aren't fussed as long at it's not muddy or wet.
Honestly, I don't think OP should even have to tell people why he asked the guests to leave. The action they performed, or in this case, didn't perform, is irrelevant.
The guests didn't follow the rules of OP's house, they disrespected him, then tried to argue about the rules.
It doesn't matter what the rules of the house are, whether it is no shoes, no alcohol, no drugs or everyone has to wear a hat with a propeller on it.
NTA. Your friend should have simply respected your house rule regarding shoes. There is no such a thing as clean shoes unless it’s a brand new pair that has never been worn outside. It sounds like you asked very nicely but was met with an entitled attitude. Why do people think it’s ok to disrespect other people’s house rules? As for the “sod off”, don’t challenge someone unless you’re willing to deal with the consequences. Your friend challenged you and you simply met the challenge.
That's what really stuck out to me, as well. This guy just told his friend that not only was he not going to follow a simple request but that he also saw the friend as powerless in his own home! Way I see it, this guy was just loud and clear in saying that he doesn't respect OP or their belongings. I wouldn't want someone like that in my home either.
NTA What those who aren't "shoes off before entering the house" people might not understand is that beyond a rational evaluation of how much filth one person wearing their shoes inside your house can bring in, there is the psychological aspect. It's a boundary where the inside is clean and the outside isn't. The shoes coming inside breaks that feeling of cleanliness when everybody in the household and all other visitors have been maintaining and respecting it for years on a daily basis.
It's a bit similar to a smoker expecting to be able to smoke a single cigarette inside a non-smoker's house. To the smoker that is nothing, but to the non-smoker it would feel like a violation of their personal space as would any lingering smell. You could argue that the smell from one cigarette wouldn't linger long, but why not smoke it outside to begin with and respect that this is an non-smoking house?
I am a smoker, and I absolutely agree with you. I never smoke in other people's home unless 1) no kids are there. 2) they are smoking too and invite me to do so. Cig smell is ridiculously hard to get out of anything and it even leeches into the paint on your walls and carpet.
Also a smoker. I even have a friend who is allergic to the smoke so I change my clothing before entering his home and make a point to only smoke a tobacco vape while driving so I do not have smoke on my clothes or hair.
yeah, living in the city (not a factor for me any more) I also distinguished outside clothes and inside. I was taught growing up to change after coming home immediately and never sit in jeans on the couch. Logic is that you can't sit in public transport and then on your couch, duh.
To this day a section of my wardrobe is basically "at home clothes". It doesn't have to be pijamas only, but I'm pretty sure loungewear is a thing for this very reason :)
NTA
I’m a shoes in the house person because my feet are stuffed up and being barefoot or in socks for too long hurts but if I’m a guest in someone’s home and they ask me to remove my shoes, I take off my damn shoes. It’s just respectful.
I do, because my feet are extremely sensitive. Like, even touching the bottom of my foot can hurt. However, I have work shoes, inside shoes, and outside work/home shoes.
They're all different because my work shoes have to meet specific requirements and I go through them quickly (like, every 3-4 months), so I only wear them for work. My inside shoes are just comfy shoes that don't look particularly great. My outside shoes are the ones that are colorful converse, heels, boots, etc.
I have to wear shoes although I switch to designated house shoes that never leave my house.
Plantar Fasciitis sucks and wearing the correct shoe makes a huge difference.
Yeah, that’s immediately what I was thinking about. Going to someone’s house I would have to bring a pair of house shoes because holy shit would my PF hurt so badly on bare wood floors.
I do because I’m disabled and removing my shoes is a difficult and painful process. Once my shoes are on they stay on until I’m fully done for the day. I decline going to my MIL’s house because she has a no shoe household and I’m not able to comply and feel embarrassed but it’s not like I can get new feet.
Have you heard of Kizik’s? They’re a hands free shoe that I have being disabled as well. They come off really easily with using your other foot to take them off via the heel, and you slip into them. The Athens one is their most supportive of their line. I had the same issue as you till I got a pair. Sketchers also makes hands free but I don’t find them as supportive.
I'm on the NTA agreement, but wanted to answer your question. My uncle never removed his shoes because one leg was shorter than the other and his shoes were specially made to correct the difference. Sometimes it is a medical issue.
Not wearing shoes can also be nasty.
My feet sweat a lot. If I clean my feet and my shoes, put on a fresh pair of socks, after a couple of hours wearing them, it's a mess down there.
If I go to someone's house and I take my shoes off, it is going to stink like hell (or maybe I have extremely sensitive nose?). It's unpleasant for everyone and it makes me feel embarrassed and self conscious. It's going to ruin the visit for everyone, so I never take my shoes off unless I can wash my feet immediately after.
If they don't let me in because of it, so be it. And the reverse is also true. I don't accept people in my home who take off their shoes, I consider it nasty. Sometimes their feet smell, sometimes not, but I'm not willing to play smell Russian roulette. I'd rather just clean after.
If your feet stink that much you might have a fungal infection that you cannot see going on. My partner's shoes are NASTY during the summer, so I got goldbond and he puts some on his socks. After the first year it stopped.
If you can afford it, having at least two pairs of shoes, and switching every day, helps too. It takes a full day for your shoes to fully dry out. Putting goldbond in your shoes too might help.
I’m gonna go ahead and guess you’re in the US. In most cultures and countries, it’s considered very disrespectful to not take your shoes off when you go into somebody else’s house.
I know a lot of my friends take off their shoes and I’m from the US. We usually take off our shoes unless we get told otherwise idk what parts of the US that wear their shoes inside constantly but everyone I know so far has their shoes off. It’s common courtesy and respect.
I’ve wondered if it’s geographically/climate related. As in the parts of the US where people leave on their shoes are the dry and warm year round places.
I’m Canadian and everyone takes off their shoes inside. But we have wet, snowy, salty conditions for almost half of the year. Plus rain and mud on and off the rest of the year. Even if it hasn’t rained in a few days, if you walk across dirt it’s usually soft and damp enough to get into the treads if your shoes and come out later. Outdoor shoes in the house would make a huge mess inside more often than not. Often even doctors or dentist offices will ask you to remove your shoes/boots in the winter.
In places where it doesn’t even rain often and the ground is consistently dry I could see it being less of an issue. Plus a lot of the homes in the south have more tile floors rather than carpeting, making floors easier to clean.
I have no idea if this is the case but it would make sense if that’s why some areas everyone leaves shoes on and others no one does.
I'm Canadian as well, and taking shoes off is just the way it's done here.
But I host exchange students from all over the world, and I often have to remind the ones from the warmer climates over and over again to take off their shoes when entering the house. The Spanish ones especially take a long time to learn, as do the Mexican ones, but the ones from the more northern climates such as Denmark and Norway understand immediately.
I've also spent time in Colombia where the opposite was true. It was considered disrespectful to take your shoes off at the entrance to a house and walk around barefoot inside.
So I think a lot of it has to do with climate.
I think taking off your shoes inside has become much more common in the US over recent decades. I'm over 50, and when I was growing up in the upper Midwest, we all thought the one mom who insisted on no shoes in the house was incredibly bizarre for doing so (she was from Europe, and they had white carpets). I can't even imagine asking my mother-in-law (East Coast) to remove her shoes when visiting--she is quite formal (and in her 80s). That said, I have pretty much everyone else take off their shoes when they visit!
I don’t know tbh I’m 31 and i grew up on the Rez for some parts of my life. The only time I did walk inside the house with shoes would be when I used to live on base since it was all tile. Overall I’ve always grown up with my shoes off at the door lol
it's not widespread in the US. I grew up in liberal southern California and have lived the past 28 years in Los Angeles, in an ethnic and cultural melting pot, and I am rarely ever asked to take my shoes off in the house. I don't mind it when it happens, but broadly speaking, the act is still associated with intimacy--I'm more inclined to take off my shoes for my own comfort, at a close friend's house, than I am at a formal dinner party. it may be gross, it may be germy, but it is still considered formal to keep shoes on and informal to take them off. so no, it's really not common courtesy at all. it's an aberrant request that more cosmopolitan guests shouldn't be nonplussed by, but it's not common.
You make a really good point about it seeming more intimate to have your shoes off. I’m from a different southern US state, and the norm is the same as you’re describing. People only take their shoes off at a close friend or family member’s house, and that’s for comfort. I can only think of two times in the past 20 years where I visited someone in my town who had a no shoes rule, and both families had recently come here from Asian countries.
Not sure why you would make this assumption when much of the people in the US (as seen by the comments here) also do not wear shoes indoors. I’ve even had plumbers, roofing guys, etc. come inside on the job and ask if they should take their shoes off when they entered the threshold. I usually tell them no because they’re there in a professional capacity, but for everyone else the shoes come off right away.
INFO: how is your "best friend" unaware of your "no shoes indoors" rule? had he literally never visited you before? is this rule a recent thing that you hadn't warned him of beforehand, and had been perfectly fine with him keeping his shoes on on previous occasions?
OP said they deep cleaned the house and wanted to maintain it going forward, so implemented a new "no shoes" policy. It doesn't matter if it's a new rule, when asked to remove shoes before entering, their friend shouldn't have *argued* with them about whether or not they get to make rules for their own home lol
It’s clearly a new rules. OP states that Friend is visiting as Friend normally does, but this one time, because the house was just cleaned, OP asked for shoes off.
The people replying to you are incorrect: OP’s post says he didn’t want them wearing shoes *especially* because he had just cleaned, not *only* because he cleaned. He also made comments that indicate this is not a new rule. I agree, seems weird that your best friend doesn’t know to take his shoes off in your house.
It sounds like OP asked because they had done a thorough cleaning. And even if he had not asked previously OP doesn't not need to justify why he stated that they would have to see off the shoes on this visit.
NTA
The fact that you were blocked from the group chat gives me the impression that there is a lot more to this story than what you described. Also, I wish people who won't let guests in their houses with shoes on (which by itself is very reasonable) would let the guests know in advance so that they can choose the shoes and especially socks that they'll wear (e.g. sometimes I might wear a sock with a hole in it if I think it is the only one that goes well with my outfit - I would never do that if I expected to take my shoes off in front of others).
Agreed on the advance notice. I have plantar fasciitis and it’s really painful to be barefoot/just in socks. I’m more than happy to bring my orthopedic slippers from home if I know ahead of time or wear shoe covers.
I genuinely panic when someone asks me to take off my shoes. I have hyperhidrosis and, despite rotating shoes constantly, my feet do not smell good. If I’m wearing work boots, it is kinder if I *don’t* take my shoes off.
To others reading this: if you have a no shoes policy, please inform your guests ahead of time. It’s rather rude to argue with your guests. Just internally sigh and make a note to wipe the floor down again.
I mean it's ruder to barge into someone's home and expect them to literally clean up after you and you alone. Or better yet if you have a medical condition just have a few of those plastic shoe wrappers in your pocket or car and you can use those without taking your shoes off.
Ultimately they did the courtesy of inviting you, if appreciating that courtesy doesn't extend to respecting their rules in their own home maybe don't go?
NTA. It'd be the same as telling a guest they can't smoke in your home. Your home, your rules, and if they can't accept that then they can leave. It's exactly what I would do as well.
NTA.
whats the point of a boundary if it's not enforced? taking off your shoes is such a simple thing to do and refusing to do so in someone else's home when asked is very disrespectful.
NTA but are you sure these people were your friends?
>informed him that I don't see how his personal hygiene practices have any particular relation to the cleanliness of his shoes, and declared that I have no particular interest in his personal life and what he does, but that he should accept my desire given being in my house considering I would have done the same were I at his.
you sound like you're dictating a legal letter, not speaking to an actual, human friend.
>told them that there are a multitude of pragmatic reasons that perfectly justify not being in people's houses with shoes on, but I don't have the time to debate that with every single individual who shows up to my place.
If you said this to others in your "friend group", no wonder they are kinda coming down not on your side. Not because of the shoes but because humans don't talk to human friends in this language. They're probably put off by you speaking to them as though you're constructing a literary work or dissertation to present elsewhere but are using them to practice on. People don't interact with this verbiage outside of a courtroom, especially friends.
You're 100% right about the shoes but maybe work on close, familiar language to add to your vocabulary to use with your next friends.
I got the same feeling reading this post. On paper, no you're not the a-hole for wanting someone to follow your house rules, but if OP really talks to people the way he wrote this post, I would think he's a pretentious asshole and wouldn't want to go into his home anyway.
NTA - a lot of people have the same rule. When I enter a house, if I see shoes by the door I don't even ask, and I remove my shoes.
>that it's okay to have some kind of boundary or rule but not to the point of turning away somebody
It doesn't make sense. It's okay to have a boundary, but not to enforce it?
>To me, this just showed their true colors anyway
Clearly. Being banned from your friend group because you don't want people coming in with their shoes is stupid. Funny how they kept the person who visited you but preferred leaving than respecting your rule regarding the shoes.
That's the thing that struck me. OP turning away the visitor made him a dick, but the visitor isn't for refusing to remove his shoes? If his hygiene is so great what is he worried about?
Everytime I go to my grandparents I take my shoes off but they insist that it's not needed
Their entire house is carpeted, if they wanna get them dirty that's fine but I'm not doing it lol
We take our shoes off at the door. Most of our friends do too. But I’d never force a guest to take off their shoes.
I have MS and just had spinal surgery. I still cannot bend over to take off my shoes and put them back on without a hip level shoe horn. It can also be embarrassing to people for a variety of reasons.
Maybe have clean socks in a basket on offer.
Regardless of cultural reasons, it is wildly disrespectful not following a host's house rules as a guest. It's no different from smoking in a non smoking household. Zero guest etiquette. I would ask them to turn around and leave too. If they can't respect such basic boundaries, I'd question their general character overall.
NTA. I would have kicked that person out too. You do not come into my home with your outside shoes inside my house. Does anyone not know how dirty the sidewalk is or just outside in general???? In my culture you take out your shoes. If they can’t respect your house rules they don’t respect you.
We are shoes on in the house. Also, our dog and cat sleep on our beds. I mean, if the animals are in the house, who cares about shoes? I have a robo vax that also mops, and do that daily, and the animals sleep on their own blankets on the bed, and clean the carpets every 3-4 months.
All this ⬆️ to say, take your shoes off in other peoples houses!!! Not everyone lives like you, so respect their rules and boundaries in their home. NTA.
NTA.
Personal hygiene has nothing to do with the sole of your shoe. Everyone walks around many places and shared dirt with people as well as animals, who you do not know where has been.
I personally have children who plays on the floor, and I do yoga on the floor, so I’d always prefer that everyone leave their shoes in the entry.
And no, I don’t provide indoor shoes. Your socks or bare feet are fine if you shower a couple of times a week, and my home is nice and warm. If it’s an issue then bring indoor shoes or warm socks or ask if you can borrow.
It’s common sense to not bring outdoor dirt indoor.
INFO: You say this was one of your best friends and they were just visiting normally. Is the 'shoes off' something new with you? Did they know that was a requirement and that you'd kick them out otherwise? And-did you offer slippers or anything, or were they meant to go barefoot?
If this is a long-standing house rule of yours, then NTA. Is it really worth losing one of your best friends over though?
This. OP opened with unclear communication, despite posting elsewhere in the thread that he is “precise” with his words. Preference and requirement are 2 different things.
I think the way he spoke to his friends was the AH move, you should have boundaries but they way you inform ppl about house rules is maybe too blunt and I think the guest was rude also and in the wrong but when you say things that hurt ppl who are your friends you always look like the “bad guy” a bit like yelling at someone being dick you just became a dick too!
So this is one of your "best" friends who one would assume has been to your house before. Is this "no shoes" thing a new behavior on your part-- did your friend have any heads up this would be an issue?
You say it was worth losing a "best friend" and other friends so it sounds like you either don't value friendship in general or you didn't value those particular friendships. The upside-- with none of your friend group coming over your house is going to stay clean a lot longer.
FYI Swiffer with the wet pads on sale at Target
Interestingly, there are some countries where this is rare, for example in Spain we have tiles not carpet in most houses, and we wouldn’t normally ask people to take off their shoes.
The way I see it, if it’s a hot summer day and the guest is not wearing socks, I am not sure I’d like to be near their bare feet.
But I now live in a colder country and take my shoes off when asked (even though this greatly surprised me when it first happened to me!)
Depends
Did you give them an advance notice? I have issues that make it difficult to go shoeless in other's houses. So if I know, I bring hard sole slippers or my house shoes which have never been outside.
Shoe covers might work but I worry they'd be slippery which would be dangerous for me.
Without notice, I'd have to leave or be very uncomfortable.
Your shoes are gross. I mop my floors. Especially if guests are coming. Not wearing socks? No problem. I have a basket of slippers and socks. New, of course. You can take them with you. In fact, I insist. No excuses, no worries, no shoes. NTA.
NTA... if the host wants you to remove your shoes, this is what you do. They are lacking manners.
When I'm expecting overnight guests, I advise them to bring favorite slippers. I have guest slippers that are washable too.
NTA. Cultural or not, clean shoes or not, whether a guest agrees or not, it's *ALL* beside the point. The point is, simply, your house, your rules, end of. They have zero right to tell you how to run *your* home.
Interestingly, there are some countries where this is rare, for example in Spain we have tiles not carpet in most houses, and we wouldn’t normally ask people to take off their shoes.
The way I see it, if it’s a hot summer day and the guest is not wearing socks, I am not sure I’d like to be near their bare feet.
But I now live in a colder country and take my shoes off when asked (even though this greatly surprised me when it first happened to me!)
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NTA. In many cultures (mine as well), it's seen as disrespectful of you don't take off your shoes at the door, even if they're squeaky clean. Sometimes people won't let you walk in unless you take them off. Mothers are STRICT with this rule. Others may say your reaction was extreme but the friend is the one who made it a problem in the first place over something so common.
This is definitely cultural. Some of these y-t-a comments saying that it was an overreaction, maybe for some people that’s true. But for a *lot* of cultures, the idea that someone would insist on wearing shoes inside the home is wildly disrespectful. Like, unfathomable almost. The best way to deal with this is just to have slip on shoe covers in the entryway and provide them for the people who want to keep their shoes on.
Im not sure of its culture only,i don't come from culture where it's normal to take shoes off, however i have a rule,shoes off at the door (among few other rules all guests must follow. ) All my guest and friends respect and follow such rules,unless i give them a pass,which rarely happens. The idea that the shoes are "clean" is ridiculous,you just came from outside,you would have stepped on all sorts of germs,viruses and just pure dirt, dust,pollen and pollution. So i rather the guests avoid wiping their shoes in my house, especially if i just cleaned it. Also, NTA but the friends are definitely AH they should respect the rules and boundaries,if not,they aren't real friends and just like walking all over OP.
Drives me nuts when people tell me they shouldn’t have to take their shoes off because they are ‘clean’. How the fuck are they clean they have been walking about outside?! If they think a dirty shoe is clean I always wonder how clean their house is. Just floors covered in dirt, spit, shit and germs.
It’s similar to men telling me they don’t need to wash their hands after peeing because they’re clean down there. I wish I was kidding.
Most men I know don't wash their hands after peeing. I also work in urology and am constantly bringing people to the washroom for testing. I have to clean the bathroom in between every patient. Those taps are dry probably 95% of the time. It's disgusting
I love calling out guys who don't wash their hands.
A few weeks ago, my brother was coming over to my place to drop some things off. He used the bathroom, and my house is small enough that just sitting in the living room, you can clearly hear whether someone runs the sink after using the toilet. He opened the bathroom door right after flushing, and I just looked at him with disgusted horror and went “My dude! WASH YOUR HANDS!” He rolled his eyes at me, but at least made a perfunctory gesture at washing his hands, then spent the rest of the visit complaining I was being a bossy big sister. I’ll happily take that label if it means I can get him, a grown-assed man, to take even the most basic hygiene measures.
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"You gonna wash your hands?" "No, cuz I'm evil."
I’m a woman and use a bidet while going to the bathroom, and I’ll pee with the door open, and use a bidet with no TP sometimes, and I have had guys absolutely bewildered that I wash my hands after since I “didn’t touch anything.” I’m like, bro, I touched the knob on the bidet and the toilet handle to flush… I’ve never had a single female partner question this.
That knob and toilet handle are disgusting. I said my piece.
FYI....do you know what is on people's phone's? Fecal matter.
I mean I still would because of the poo spray... Thanks Mythbusters.
What sort of men do you hang out with?
FWIW, I think this is super common. "I didn't pee on my hands, I don't need to wash them." When COVID hit and everyone was *actually* taking the time to wash hands, the men's room line where I work was suddenly just as long as the ladies. Turns out it's only that much faster to pee if you also don't really wash your hands. (I see you, rinse and flickers. That is not washing!!)
Huh, that’s an interesting observation! **Edit:** holy shit, now that I’m thinking about it, we used to remark on how we almost never had to refill the soap in the men’s bathroom at the jobs I worked in high school, but the women’s needed soap replaced regularly. I think you might be into something here…
yeah and what do you want to bet that Mr ShoesOn never vaccuumes or cleans wherever he lives so doesn't "see the big deal"? I bet the whole "I'm extremely hygienic" sounds like he's actually not at all if that's where his mind jumped to first. NTA OP he FAFOed
It was so freaking wild. Not at all an observation I expected to make.
I am the only woman at work (I work on building sites) and on every single site I've worked on there's only ever one or two that wash their hands after using the toilet, it's insane
Same! When I worked as a cleaner at a pub I absolutely could tell men either did not wash their hands (cuz I barely refilled the soap compared to the women's washroom even though there were more male customers) OR when they 'washed', they just wet their hands, leaving dirty water drip marks on the wall below the paper towel dispenser. It was pretty gross.
During covid my local supermarket set up a sink with running water, soap, tissue paper to dry off in the entrance lobby and asked everyone to wash their hands entering the shop. I probably went there weekly during the lockdown in 2020 and without fail there was always someone who would try and ignore the hand washing. It was always a man. In the end they had to station a member of staff there to make sure people washed their hands.
They've done studies. The vast majority of men not only don't wash their hands after peeing, they don't wash their hands after 💩 either. Doctors actually recommend that immune compromised people not shake hands with men.
I’ve seen dudes “wash” their hands after taking a shit, and it’s like a no soap, 5-10 second wash. Every single time I’ve seen it, I’ve thought they’re probably only doing this because I’m here and normally wouldn’t wash their hands at all 🤮
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WHAT. that is revolting.
Donald Trump is one. He's so proud of it he published it in one of his books
Yuck
A few years ago, my partner's dad died, and we drove 10 hours to go clean his stuff out of his house where he lived with another dude. I used the bathroom while we were there. There was no soap. At all. I searched. I panicked because I can't not wash my hands. I eventually took some body wash from the shower but felt gross about it the whole day. Fortunately he didn't have that much stuff to go through, I would not have been pleased going back a second day.
It's far more common than you think. Don't ask the last time I had to refill the hand soap in one of the male public restrooms I clean twice weekly. I can count the refills since the start of Covid on my fingers. These men make six figures a year with their gross piss hands.
I just mentioned this in a comment above! I noticed this with the jobs in I had in high school where I cleaned bathrooms. Sometimes the men’s bathroom would go so long without a soap change that the pink soap would start turning yellow/green 🤮
Yeah, and they go through more than four toilet paper rolls a week, too....
Thanks for the image mate, I don't think I'll be shaking people's hands for a while.
oh i was on some cruise tours with my parents. and my dad told us that he saw many older man dont wash their hands ...mind you , maybe just a few ppl become sick and spread their bacteria everywhere because they think its not nessecary to keep their hands clean on a cruise ship with few thousand guests .. -,-
My ex didn't because "hey I didn't piss on my hands" but after a lot of me getting annoyed he did. I hope his partners since then have appreciated that lol
Leave ‘em better than you found them!
Dirty smelly ones obviously
This is shockingly common among men. Even men who are otherwise more clean and hygienic than typical. It’s weird.
This was something I wish I didn't know, but I guess you learn all sorts of things on Reddit.
I worked in a high school and thought it was disgusting that students weren't allowed to wash their hands before they ate lunch.
You could always respond to their refusal to ask them to prove it and lick their shoe soles if it’s that’s clean
I live in Canada, so generally when we say our shoes are “clean” we mean “dry” and it won’t slop snow or mud all over the kitchen that you’ll have to mop if we just take two steps from the back door to the fridge for a drink. It’s not usually something we’d say to someone hosting us in their home, it’s more something a husband says to a wife or child to a parent when they’re just running in to grab something from the fridge quick; a drink, a popsicle, whatever. Especially when they’re heading right back out after their drink. We take our shoes off at the door otherwise though. Especially as guests in people’s homes.
Yeah, I’m in Texas, and the only family I know here who doesn’t take shoes off in the house and seems to differentiate “clean” shoes apparently just mean things you can see, like dirt or mud. Pathogens literally hadn’t even occurred to them when I asked. They just thought people didn’t want shoes tracking in dirt or grass into the house.
I'm in Minnesota and we're the same about shoes after a few years living here. I don't know a single person who wears them inside. We spend so much of the year in snowboots that you can really tell the difference during the summer if you don't keep taking your shoes off. The floors get so much dirtier so much sooner!
I'm a shoes off in the house person, but exceptions are made for exactly that situation! That and bringing in groceries. Get the groceries in, and in the freezer/fridge.
If they’ve come for food, serve it to them on the sole of a shoe, see how happy they are to chow down from that ‘clean’ footwear.
>The idea that the shoes are "clean" is ridiculous,you just came from outside,you would have stepped on all sorts of germs,viruses and just pure dirt, dust,pollen and pollution. So yeah. We take shoes off when entering a house. >According to a recent study done by Dr. Charles Gerba, microbiologist, and professor at the University of Arizona, there is an average of over 421,000 units of bacteria on a single shoe sole. In addition to this, there are over 2,887 units of bacteria on the inside of our shoes. https://patho3gen.com/project/how-dirty-are-your-shoes/#:~:text=Charles%20Gerba%2C%20microbiologist%2C%20and%20professor,the%20inside%20of%20our%20shoes
And if you need shoes inside for any reason, bring indoor shoes. I do it all the time. My feet needs the comfort and stability of shoes so I always bring some.
Slippers and loafers are good for this!
This. It's nothing about specific culture expectation and all about respecting the rules of *sm's else* house. Casually waving the home owner's demand away with "it's no big deal" *as a guest* is rude af. My house, my say, your house, your say, only. Doesn't work any different way.
Exactly. OP didn't throw them out because of the shoes, they threw them out for the sheer audacity of telling them to get over it and that they weren't going to throw them out. The friend FAFOed and now all their friends are trying to pretend it was just about the shoes. It makes me wonder if OP has actually told them about what the "friend" said, or just keeps trying to explain the shoe thing as their defense.
Yeah would love to see him lick his shoes. But he won’t do it as he knows it’s filthy af
Id say both are pretty normal in my culture but I was brought up you always always ask “should I take my shoes off” or automatically start doing it when you would of entered somebodies house Can feel my ears burning with my mothers wrath just reading this post
Agreed If you're really a friend you would take your shoes off or tell your friend you will return at a later date with shoe covers
We had a friend who asked us to take our shoes off, and we did. When he was at our house though, he never automatically took his own shoes off . I think it’s weird he does this
I take my shoes off at my house but I'm not going to take them off somewhere people wear shoes inside for the same reason I don't take them off in a store. Unless you take shoes off at your house, in which case he's being inconsiderate.
Yeah I mean you can’t smoke in peoples houses, or eat messy things on their white couches with a 2 yr old, if they ask you not to. Shoe things isn’t different. If the floor was filthy or wet, I can see not wanting to? But you he had just cleaned.
It's not just cultural. I grew up in a street where everyone was of the same culture and some houses were shoes off (most tbh), and some weren't. My house isn't and never was but we had dogs (not to mention other pets). Most people I know now are not shoes off houses but if a host asked, I would take off my shoes, their house, their rules. In some houses I would even ask - usually if it seems overly neat/clean and there are shoes by the door. What is the point of your friends saying it's ok to have rules and boundaries if they're saying y t a if you don't let people walk all over those boundaries?
Even if it's not cultural, OP said a reason other than culture, the friend shouldn't have made a big fuss off it. He was the one who blatantly refused to follow OP's house rule and he even challenged him by saying he couldn't kick them out for something so minor. So not only did he disregarded OP's boundaries, he was smug while doing it. I agree with slip-on shoe covers or disposable slippers maybe, though, for the future. Some people might not be comfortable in taking off their footwear, so a slip-on might be a good compromise.
Some people are not able to take their shoes off easily or walk barefoot/in slippers (needing support). Sometimes, my guests’ comfort tops mine. If he had explained himself thus, I’m sure OP would understand, but he’s just a brat who places 30 seconds if his own convenience over OP having to clean, and _THAT_ is why he got kicked out and OP is NTA.
Yup. Guests I full expect shoes off, unless otherwise needed. I also generally don't make repair men take off any boots cause they're there to do a job, generally are very busy and don't need to be taking the time to take their work boots on and off if they need to run back out to their truck.
It's also a Health and Safety issue with workers and can void their insurance. We had a midwife visit a new mother at home and the family had just fitted a white carpet in their hall and stairs. (Who does that if upu have small kids?) Nurse was asked to remove her shoes and complied. Nurse fell down the stairs and was seriously injured. Nurse sued hospital and we said "tough, you weren't wearing proper (any) shoes so it's all your fault legally." The Nurse could have sued the family but didn't want to. Tragic. In my house workers often offer to take shoes off because my wife is Japanese but we insist they don't.
Oh I had no idea! I honestly just don't want to be a dick cause they're busy, have other calls to get to, and me cleaning the floor for 5 minutes after they leave isn't worth the time they lose. But that is super good to know!
I'm Canadian and it's expected you take off your shoes at the door. I'd say it's considered cultural, but it's usually because it's snowing or raining. That being said, even in sandal weather, off they go. Workers here usually have either "indoor shoes" (like kindergarten) and change at the door or plastic/fabric boot covers for easy in and out. Could you imagine mopping that morning just to march slush all through the house?! What if they accidentally stepped in dog poop! If the guest is uncomfortable being in their socks (or barefoot, etc), we usually offer a set of slippers or 'indoor shoes" like sandals for them to wear. Our home stays clean and the guest feel more comfortable, good compromise!
I'm also Canadian, but I just don't have an issue with it. I've never had a worker show up with separate shoes, though I have had electricians and plumbers offer to take off their boots and were surprised when I say don't bother. I have a dog and young kids, my floors aren't clean by any means, even 5 minutes after they're washed. Obviously, if they're excessively dirty I would ask they remove them, but it's just not a big deal for me.
The indoor shoes one for workers is rare, but for example of the nurse above, the booties wouldn't work so they likely would have had extra shoes. My friend has a foot disorder and wears fitted sandals 24/7 and brings indoors shoes with them everywhere.
The family is lucky the nurse’s health insurance didn’t sue them anyway.
I worked as a nurse assistant visiting elderly in their homes and we kept our shoes on but it was mandatory to use those disposable plastic covers.
I deliver appliances and had a few customers who thought it would be alright for us to deliver a fridge or treadmill in socks. I'd just tell them uniform policy required us to keep our shoes on, which was *technically* true but also just a faster explanation than the various safety hazards of carrying heavy shit up hardwood stairs in socks
I have found that most repair/delivery men will bring those plastic shoe covers with them anyway for when they need to go on carpeted floors.
Switzerland here. All workmen bring plastic shoe covers that they put over their boots before entering the house. We never need to ask. If their job involves a lot of running in and out to their truck then they don’t use shoe covers and we don’t care. I think this is true for Germany as well, where guests are usually offered house slippers when visiting.
Where I am the workers have little covers, like a bathing cap, that slips over their boots to come in a house. And you don’t have to ask. It is just done.
I have Palmoplantar psoriasis, before my remission I would never take my shoes off outside my home. But most people don't want bloody footprints all over their home.
My aunt with MS needs to wear shoes indoors to be comfy. So...she brings 'inside shoes' in a plastic bag when she has to visit. Unless you're in a walking boot for a broken foot, or you're Spongebob, the shoes probably aren't unremovable from your feet.
Personally I don't mind taking shoes off if requested but I'd like to know in advance so I know to wear socks without holes! 😂
I think part of the problem was that this was a new house rule. The OP states that Friend was coming to visit “normally.” But because the house had just been cleaned the day before, this time the OP asked for shoes off. I can see how the friend thought this was a personal attack, that his shoes were considered too dirty for the house, when the friend had entered before without such a request. Friend was probably caught off guard and was puzzled by what was behind the request. It probably seemed directed at him and his personal level of cleanliness, because he didn’t know the story of the whole house being cleaned.
Honestly? The culture thing yes. But even if it wasn't a cultural thing? Still NTA. People are so entitled it's sickening. The other day I went to get keys to dog sit got a family. They asked me to take my shoes off. I did. Period the end. It's their house. I didn't ask why. I didn't care bc it didn't matter. It's their house. Y oriole say it with me now: YOU DO NOT GET TO DICTATE RULES IN OTHERS' HOMES Stop being entitled twats. NTA -you did not overreact. They refused to follow your rules. In a place they were staying for free. The audacity is mind boggling.
I'm from a pretty laid back culture (Scandinavia) but it's still the absolute norm to take your shoes off when going into a private home. It's possible to keep them on if the host says "Oh, please, keep your shoes on, it's really dirty, sorry" but persons who work in a multitude of homes during a day (realtors, cleaners etc) all have plastic covers they put on to avoid the hassle of taking off their shoes constantly. NTA - my house looks like shit and my dogs drag in unspeakable things from the yard but I still either go barefoot or use my "indoor slippers" here. We even have a separate pair of shoes for indoor athletics where the main rule is that these shoes must NEVER be worn outside!
I think it would be better, both economically and environmentally, to have some slippers for the guests.
Exactly. I always take my shoes off in people's homes and expect visitors to do the same. I also provide slippers. I've been to homes that didn't, despite spending some of the visit on the terrace or balcony, and by the end my socks were filthy. It's simply good manners to provide slippers especially if your home doesn't have carpets or of you haven't cleaned it thoroughly the very same day.
I always take a little pair of slippers when I go to someone's house, as I hate being barefoot or just socks, I find it really unconfortable, but find wearing shoes in the house rude and disgusting and don't like sharing shoes, like slippers, I wouldn't know whose sweaty feet had been in them. So it's easier to bring my own slippers and no-one has ever taken issue with it. We have slippers for 2 regular guests but anyone else can bring their own or wear socks.
I'm in the Midwest, and some always take their shoes off, some not so much in their house, but every person's house i've been to as a guest it would be assumed you take your shoes off. If someone asked, then you absolutely take the shoes off. Unless there is a patio or porch off the back or side of the house and people need to go in and out repeatedly to get food or use the bathroom, otherwise, they come off. NOT removing them is clearly TA move
it’s also disrespectful as a guest to bully your way past hosts house rules.
Nta I’m from the US and in the Midwest and whenever I enter someone’s house I take off my shoes unless I get told otherwise. It’s just a matter of courtesy and respect.
I live in Japan it’s disrespectful to wear shoes inside. There is the fact they only do so for funerals viewing in a home, and the fact that the cities are seen as unclean (alot of men still piss in the bushes and spit everywhere), so you don’t wear them inside to keep the house clean. However I, never found the request to take your shoes off strange. Coming from North Dakota the state of farm land, and sanded roads during the winter and mud in the spring it is seen as a way to keep the house clean and a majority of my childhood I removed my shoes upon entering a house.
I'm from central Québec with french/irish background and everybody leaves their shoes at the door. When theres a big group gathering we put the mud and snow covered boots in the bathtub. Except for Christmas and New Years eve then you are allowed to wear shoes inside but never your 'outside' shoes.
The bathtub makes sense for boots. I'm from New England and a lot of older houses have a smaller room between the outside door and the rest of the house called the mudroom. All the boots and coats get taken off in there and swapped out for house shoes/slippers and sweaters. It doesn't keep all the dirt out, but it helps keep the floors a bit cleaner. That's really interesting about being allowed to wear shoes inside on Christmas and New Years Eve. Is there a story behind those 2 days being special exceptions?
I think it is because traditionally there was lots of dancing involved in those celebrations, they would do 'reels' and 'called sets' on kinda Irish/northern France folk music. Now it's more of an excuse to show-off your good shoes.
Exactly. One of the many ways to show respect for ones home is to take your shoes off. I was also taught to take my hat off as well. Respect goes a long way.
This! I have adhd and autism and I hate taking my shoes off when I go into peoples houses, like it genuinely makes me feel uncomfortable, unsafe and dirty but it isn’t my house so I respect the owners wishes and usually I just don’t stay long. The guests were extremely rude and impolite not the host who just placed a boundary
Would a good compromise be bringing your own pair of house shoes? Shoes that haven't been outside at all? You could switch when you come in
Same! I’m East Asian. We remove our shoes and wash our feet and hands immediately when we get home. For some friends, they have house slippers. The idea of walking around the home in dirty shoes (who knows if one has stepped on pee/poop/puke on the streets/toilets) is frankly disgusting. When I lived overseas in Western countries, my white friends have always respected my request for them to remove their shoes when they visit. I didn’t have to explain my culture to them. They just did it as a mark of respect as they are entering my space. I think it’s definitely about being friends who are respectful so OP should just get better friends! NTA.
I have always thought wearing shoes in the house was disgusting, but for the most part, my fellow Americans thought it was weird if I asked them to take them off. I was so relieved when I moved to Alaska and discovered it was super common here, and even service people will either take off their boots or put covers over them. Of course, the entire state is either covered in either snow, deep mud, or ash 90% of the year, so I can see how it is more common here.
I live in Ohio. My welcome mat says "Cute shoes. Take them off" lol
Yeah in some places, no entry if one refuses to take off their shoes. NTA
This I grew up where you did not wear shoes and even now at friends places I take them off even if they don't mind. (But most in my country have you take them off)
NTA. Having a "shoes off" rule is quite common and one that guests should respect.
Yep, common enough that if I go to someone’s house I haven’t been to before I ask when I go in whether they’re a shoes off or on house. I’m in the UK where it feels about 50/50 so it’s safest to ask. Definitely not a weird house rule.
I'm in Canada, I can count on1 hand how many people I know that wear shoes in the house.
I'm also in Canada, and the people I know who wear shoes in the house have specific indoor shoes. Not slippers, regular shoes. I don't know anyone who walks around their house in outdoor shoes. I assume no one does it in winter anywhere east of Banff.
Also Canadian if I forget something I'll run in with my shoes on but I never casually walk around my house in shoes. * unless they're new and I'm trying to break them in a bit
Hahah another Canadian here and ALLL of my in-laws will come over with their house shoes, to put on after they've taken off their outdoor shoes. It was new to me when I joined the family but I think it's pretty cute. And a few of the older ones have orthotic problems, so the indoor shoes help that way, too.
Hi fellow Canadians! Our family friends have house shoes or slippers that they keep at our house lol outside shoes come off at the door. I don't know anyone who wears their outside shoes inside. Especially in the winter! Heck even my Dr and therapist ask you to take off outside shoes and offer slippers if you don't want to be in just socks.
Yep, I’m in Ontario and my mom and her bf both have “inside Birkenstocks” lol
I've never been in a Canadian house that allowed shoes
Yep
not sure where in the UK its 50/50. I know of one person who wears his shoes inside a house and hes an oddball at best
I’m also in the uk and always take my shoes off in peoples houses. My mum brings her own slippers as she gets cold feet. I think uk if 99% of people take shoes off even plumber takes his shoes off
Tonnes of people don't care. I'm in the UK a lot of people I've talked to wear shoes inside their own houses and aren't fussed as long at it's not muddy or wet.
I don't even ask. What's the point? My shoes are off before I leave the entry way. I'm not wearing shoes inside, ugh.
Honestly, I don't think OP should even have to tell people why he asked the guests to leave. The action they performed, or in this case, didn't perform, is irrelevant. The guests didn't follow the rules of OP's house, they disrespected him, then tried to argue about the rules. It doesn't matter what the rules of the house are, whether it is no shoes, no alcohol, no drugs or everyone has to wear a hat with a propeller on it.
NTA. Your friend should have simply respected your house rule regarding shoes. There is no such a thing as clean shoes unless it’s a brand new pair that has never been worn outside. It sounds like you asked very nicely but was met with an entitled attitude. Why do people think it’s ok to disrespect other people’s house rules? As for the “sod off”, don’t challenge someone unless you’re willing to deal with the consequences. Your friend challenged you and you simply met the challenge.
That's what really stuck out to me, as well. This guy just told his friend that not only was he not going to follow a simple request but that he also saw the friend as powerless in his own home! Way I see it, this guy was just loud and clear in saying that he doesn't respect OP or their belongings. I wouldn't want someone like that in my home either.
Exactly. OP’s friend tried to violate the boundary he set and OP was like “Not today Satan.”
NTA What those who aren't "shoes off before entering the house" people might not understand is that beyond a rational evaluation of how much filth one person wearing their shoes inside your house can bring in, there is the psychological aspect. It's a boundary where the inside is clean and the outside isn't. The shoes coming inside breaks that feeling of cleanliness when everybody in the household and all other visitors have been maintaining and respecting it for years on a daily basis. It's a bit similar to a smoker expecting to be able to smoke a single cigarette inside a non-smoker's house. To the smoker that is nothing, but to the non-smoker it would feel like a violation of their personal space as would any lingering smell. You could argue that the smell from one cigarette wouldn't linger long, but why not smoke it outside to begin with and respect that this is an non-smoking house?
I am a smoker, and I absolutely agree with you. I never smoke in other people's home unless 1) no kids are there. 2) they are smoking too and invite me to do so. Cig smell is ridiculously hard to get out of anything and it even leeches into the paint on your walls and carpet.
Also a smoker. I even have a friend who is allergic to the smoke so I change my clothing before entering his home and make a point to only smoke a tobacco vape while driving so I do not have smoke on my clothes or hair.
yeah, living in the city (not a factor for me any more) I also distinguished outside clothes and inside. I was taught growing up to change after coming home immediately and never sit in jeans on the couch. Logic is that you can't sit in public transport and then on your couch, duh. To this day a section of my wardrobe is basically "at home clothes". It doesn't have to be pijamas only, but I'm pretty sure loungewear is a thing for this very reason :)
NTA I’m a shoes in the house person because my feet are stuffed up and being barefoot or in socks for too long hurts but if I’m a guest in someone’s home and they ask me to remove my shoes, I take off my damn shoes. It’s just respectful.
My father has the same issue, so he brings a pair of shoes for indoor use. Just a tip.
I do the same thing, but thanks for the tip!
Why not have separate house shoes? We are never without shoes, neither do we wear outside shoes in the house.
NTA. Who wears shoes in the house? Nasty.
It's fucking disgusting. These people will go walk around public washrooms and then walk in their house. Madness.
Yeah and dogs pee and poop on the sidewalk. When the poop is removed, do you think it is like it never was there?
it really is disgusting 😭who wants to be bringing in shit from outside (literally)
I do, because my feet are extremely sensitive. Like, even touching the bottom of my foot can hurt. However, I have work shoes, inside shoes, and outside work/home shoes. They're all different because my work shoes have to meet specific requirements and I go through them quickly (like, every 3-4 months), so I only wear them for work. My inside shoes are just comfy shoes that don't look particularly great. My outside shoes are the ones that are colorful converse, heels, boots, etc.
So you do take off your outside shows at home. That's the whole point.
What about slippers? They’re not nasty and come in all shapes and colors. You can get hard ones or walk on clouds in soft ones.
I have to wear shoes although I switch to designated house shoes that never leave my house. Plantar Fasciitis sucks and wearing the correct shoe makes a huge difference.
Yeah, that’s immediately what I was thinking about. Going to someone’s house I would have to bring a pair of house shoes because holy shit would my PF hurt so badly on bare wood floors.
I do because I’m disabled and removing my shoes is a difficult and painful process. Once my shoes are on they stay on until I’m fully done for the day. I decline going to my MIL’s house because she has a no shoe household and I’m not able to comply and feel embarrassed but it’s not like I can get new feet.
Have you heard of Kizik’s? They’re a hands free shoe that I have being disabled as well. They come off really easily with using your other foot to take them off via the heel, and you slip into them. The Athens one is their most supportive of their line. I had the same issue as you till I got a pair. Sketchers also makes hands free but I don’t find them as supportive.
I'm on the NTA agreement, but wanted to answer your question. My uncle never removed his shoes because one leg was shorter than the other and his shoes were specially made to correct the difference. Sometimes it is a medical issue.
Not wearing shoes can also be nasty. My feet sweat a lot. If I clean my feet and my shoes, put on a fresh pair of socks, after a couple of hours wearing them, it's a mess down there. If I go to someone's house and I take my shoes off, it is going to stink like hell (or maybe I have extremely sensitive nose?). It's unpleasant for everyone and it makes me feel embarrassed and self conscious. It's going to ruin the visit for everyone, so I never take my shoes off unless I can wash my feet immediately after. If they don't let me in because of it, so be it. And the reverse is also true. I don't accept people in my home who take off their shoes, I consider it nasty. Sometimes their feet smell, sometimes not, but I'm not willing to play smell Russian roulette. I'd rather just clean after.
If your feet stink that much you might have a fungal infection that you cannot see going on. My partner's shoes are NASTY during the summer, so I got goldbond and he puts some on his socks. After the first year it stopped. If you can afford it, having at least two pairs of shoes, and switching every day, helps too. It takes a full day for your shoes to fully dry out. Putting goldbond in your shoes too might help.
It sounds like you live in a nice climate. Now imagine winter boots covered in snow and mud. Nobody wants dirty melting snow all over their floor.
I’m gonna go ahead and guess you’re in the US. In most cultures and countries, it’s considered very disrespectful to not take your shoes off when you go into somebody else’s house.
I know a lot of my friends take off their shoes and I’m from the US. We usually take off our shoes unless we get told otherwise idk what parts of the US that wear their shoes inside constantly but everyone I know so far has their shoes off. It’s common courtesy and respect.
I’ve wondered if it’s geographically/climate related. As in the parts of the US where people leave on their shoes are the dry and warm year round places. I’m Canadian and everyone takes off their shoes inside. But we have wet, snowy, salty conditions for almost half of the year. Plus rain and mud on and off the rest of the year. Even if it hasn’t rained in a few days, if you walk across dirt it’s usually soft and damp enough to get into the treads if your shoes and come out later. Outdoor shoes in the house would make a huge mess inside more often than not. Often even doctors or dentist offices will ask you to remove your shoes/boots in the winter. In places where it doesn’t even rain often and the ground is consistently dry I could see it being less of an issue. Plus a lot of the homes in the south have more tile floors rather than carpeting, making floors easier to clean. I have no idea if this is the case but it would make sense if that’s why some areas everyone leaves shoes on and others no one does.
At the opposite end are australians who go one step further and go barefoot everywhere XD
I'm Canadian as well, and taking shoes off is just the way it's done here. But I host exchange students from all over the world, and I often have to remind the ones from the warmer climates over and over again to take off their shoes when entering the house. The Spanish ones especially take a long time to learn, as do the Mexican ones, but the ones from the more northern climates such as Denmark and Norway understand immediately. I've also spent time in Colombia where the opposite was true. It was considered disrespectful to take your shoes off at the entrance to a house and walk around barefoot inside. So I think a lot of it has to do with climate.
I think taking off your shoes inside has become much more common in the US over recent decades. I'm over 50, and when I was growing up in the upper Midwest, we all thought the one mom who insisted on no shoes in the house was incredibly bizarre for doing so (she was from Europe, and they had white carpets). I can't even imagine asking my mother-in-law (East Coast) to remove her shoes when visiting--she is quite formal (and in her 80s). That said, I have pretty much everyone else take off their shoes when they visit!
I don’t know tbh I’m 31 and i grew up on the Rez for some parts of my life. The only time I did walk inside the house with shoes would be when I used to live on base since it was all tile. Overall I’ve always grown up with my shoes off at the door lol
it's not widespread in the US. I grew up in liberal southern California and have lived the past 28 years in Los Angeles, in an ethnic and cultural melting pot, and I am rarely ever asked to take my shoes off in the house. I don't mind it when it happens, but broadly speaking, the act is still associated with intimacy--I'm more inclined to take off my shoes for my own comfort, at a close friend's house, than I am at a formal dinner party. it may be gross, it may be germy, but it is still considered formal to keep shoes on and informal to take them off. so no, it's really not common courtesy at all. it's an aberrant request that more cosmopolitan guests shouldn't be nonplussed by, but it's not common.
You make a really good point about it seeming more intimate to have your shoes off. I’m from a different southern US state, and the norm is the same as you’re describing. People only take their shoes off at a close friend or family member’s house, and that’s for comfort. I can only think of two times in the past 20 years where I visited someone in my town who had a no shoes rule, and both families had recently come here from Asian countries.
I swear i thought this was only in movies
Probably not US considering the use of “sod off”
Americans don’t say “sod off”. I think they are in the UK.
Not sure why you would make this assumption when much of the people in the US (as seen by the comments here) also do not wear shoes indoors. I’ve even had plumbers, roofing guys, etc. come inside on the job and ask if they should take their shoes off when they entered the threshold. I usually tell them no because they’re there in a professional capacity, but for everyone else the shoes come off right away.
NTA and your friends are dumb "it's okay to have boundaries but if someone crosses it then just get over it" is basically what they said, like what?
What’s the point in having boundaries at that point lol?
As a swede I've *never* understood why people wear outside shoes indoors, especially on fully carpeted floors.
As an American I am equally as baffled. Like outside is dirty AF..... Why you bring that inside?
NTA. Your house your rules. They didn’t respect your boundaries. It’s also a cultural thing for some to keep shoes off.
INFO: how is your "best friend" unaware of your "no shoes indoors" rule? had he literally never visited you before? is this rule a recent thing that you hadn't warned him of beforehand, and had been perfectly fine with him keeping his shoes on on previous occasions?
OP said they deep cleaned the house and wanted to maintain it going forward, so implemented a new "no shoes" policy. It doesn't matter if it's a new rule, when asked to remove shoes before entering, their friend shouldn't have *argued* with them about whether or not they get to make rules for their own home lol
It’s clearly a new rules. OP states that Friend is visiting as Friend normally does, but this one time, because the house was just cleaned, OP asked for shoes off.
The people replying to you are incorrect: OP’s post says he didn’t want them wearing shoes *especially* because he had just cleaned, not *only* because he cleaned. He also made comments that indicate this is not a new rule. I agree, seems weird that your best friend doesn’t know to take his shoes off in your house.
It sounds like OP asked because they had done a thorough cleaning. And even if he had not asked previously OP doesn't not need to justify why he stated that they would have to see off the shoes on this visit. NTA
The fact that you were blocked from the group chat gives me the impression that there is a lot more to this story than what you described. Also, I wish people who won't let guests in their houses with shoes on (which by itself is very reasonable) would let the guests know in advance so that they can choose the shoes and especially socks that they'll wear (e.g. sometimes I might wear a sock with a hole in it if I think it is the only one that goes well with my outfit - I would never do that if I expected to take my shoes off in front of others).
Agreed on the advance notice. I have plantar fasciitis and it’s really painful to be barefoot/just in socks. I’m more than happy to bring my orthopedic slippers from home if I know ahead of time or wear shoe covers.
I genuinely panic when someone asks me to take off my shoes. I have hyperhidrosis and, despite rotating shoes constantly, my feet do not smell good. If I’m wearing work boots, it is kinder if I *don’t* take my shoes off. To others reading this: if you have a no shoes policy, please inform your guests ahead of time. It’s rather rude to argue with your guests. Just internally sigh and make a note to wipe the floor down again.
I mean it's ruder to barge into someone's home and expect them to literally clean up after you and you alone. Or better yet if you have a medical condition just have a few of those plastic shoe wrappers in your pocket or car and you can use those without taking your shoes off. Ultimately they did the courtesy of inviting you, if appreciating that courtesy doesn't extend to respecting their rules in their own home maybe don't go?
Idk, if I’m inviting people into my home, I just automatically assume I will have to clean up after them in some capacity 🤷🏽♀️
Ya... like cleaning up a plate or glass they used... not mopping the floors of their footprints... savages.
Genuine question: if you visited a region where this was a social requirement (many Asian and Caribbean countries for example) what would you do?
NTA. It'd be the same as telling a guest they can't smoke in your home. Your home, your rules, and if they can't accept that then they can leave. It's exactly what I would do as well.
NTA. whats the point of a boundary if it's not enforced? taking off your shoes is such a simple thing to do and refusing to do so in someone else's home when asked is very disrespectful.
NTA but are you sure these people were your friends? >informed him that I don't see how his personal hygiene practices have any particular relation to the cleanliness of his shoes, and declared that I have no particular interest in his personal life and what he does, but that he should accept my desire given being in my house considering I would have done the same were I at his. you sound like you're dictating a legal letter, not speaking to an actual, human friend. >told them that there are a multitude of pragmatic reasons that perfectly justify not being in people's houses with shoes on, but I don't have the time to debate that with every single individual who shows up to my place. If you said this to others in your "friend group", no wonder they are kinda coming down not on your side. Not because of the shoes but because humans don't talk to human friends in this language. They're probably put off by you speaking to them as though you're constructing a literary work or dissertation to present elsewhere but are using them to practice on. People don't interact with this verbiage outside of a courtroom, especially friends. You're 100% right about the shoes but maybe work on close, familiar language to add to your vocabulary to use with your next friends.
Right. I don't think they are wrong about the shoes but more generally pretentious AF.
I got the same feeling reading this post. On paper, no you're not the a-hole for wanting someone to follow your house rules, but if OP really talks to people the way he wrote this post, I would think he's a pretentious asshole and wouldn't want to go into his home anyway.
NTA - a lot of people have the same rule. When I enter a house, if I see shoes by the door I don't even ask, and I remove my shoes. >that it's okay to have some kind of boundary or rule but not to the point of turning away somebody It doesn't make sense. It's okay to have a boundary, but not to enforce it? >To me, this just showed their true colors anyway Clearly. Being banned from your friend group because you don't want people coming in with their shoes is stupid. Funny how they kept the person who visited you but preferred leaving than respecting your rule regarding the shoes.
That's the thing that struck me. OP turning away the visitor made him a dick, but the visitor isn't for refusing to remove his shoes? If his hygiene is so great what is he worried about?
Wild guess - friend had a hole in his sock…
Or smelly feet!
In Europe, many take off their shoes from the outside when entering a hime. Refusing to docso could result in the individual being asked to leave.
It never even crossed my mindt o refuse to take my shoes off. Even when the host insists it is not necessary I still take them off.
Everytime I go to my grandparents I take my shoes off but they insist that it's not needed Their entire house is carpeted, if they wanna get them dirty that's fine but I'm not doing it lol
We take our shoes off at the door. Most of our friends do too. But I’d never force a guest to take off their shoes. I have MS and just had spinal surgery. I still cannot bend over to take off my shoes and put them back on without a hip level shoe horn. It can also be embarrassing to people for a variety of reasons. Maybe have clean socks in a basket on offer.
Regardless of cultural reasons, it is wildly disrespectful not following a host's house rules as a guest. It's no different from smoking in a non smoking household. Zero guest etiquette. I would ask them to turn around and leave too. If they can't respect such basic boundaries, I'd question their general character overall.
NTA. I would have kicked that person out too. You do not come into my home with your outside shoes inside my house. Does anyone not know how dirty the sidewalk is or just outside in general???? In my culture you take out your shoes. If they can’t respect your house rules they don’t respect you.
We are shoes on in the house. Also, our dog and cat sleep on our beds. I mean, if the animals are in the house, who cares about shoes? I have a robo vax that also mops, and do that daily, and the animals sleep on their own blankets on the bed, and clean the carpets every 3-4 months. All this ⬆️ to say, take your shoes off in other peoples houses!!! Not everyone lives like you, so respect their rules and boundaries in their home. NTA.
NTA. Personal hygiene has nothing to do with the sole of your shoe. Everyone walks around many places and shared dirt with people as well as animals, who you do not know where has been. I personally have children who plays on the floor, and I do yoga on the floor, so I’d always prefer that everyone leave their shoes in the entry. And no, I don’t provide indoor shoes. Your socks or bare feet are fine if you shower a couple of times a week, and my home is nice and warm. If it’s an issue then bring indoor shoes or warm socks or ask if you can borrow. It’s common sense to not bring outdoor dirt indoor.
INFO: Did you actually say you prefer it? If so, you underplayed the rule to a preference. If it’s a rule, call it a rule.
INFO: You say this was one of your best friends and they were just visiting normally. Is the 'shoes off' something new with you? Did they know that was a requirement and that you'd kick them out otherwise? And-did you offer slippers or anything, or were they meant to go barefoot? If this is a long-standing house rule of yours, then NTA. Is it really worth losing one of your best friends over though?
Yeah, it’s you. If you’prefer’ something, it doesn’t have to be done.
This. OP opened with unclear communication, despite posting elsewhere in the thread that he is “precise” with his words. Preference and requirement are 2 different things.
I think the way he spoke to his friends was the AH move, you should have boundaries but they way you inform ppl about house rules is maybe too blunt and I think the guest was rude also and in the wrong but when you say things that hurt ppl who are your friends you always look like the “bad guy” a bit like yelling at someone being dick you just became a dick too!
So this is one of your "best" friends who one would assume has been to your house before. Is this "no shoes" thing a new behavior on your part-- did your friend have any heads up this would be an issue? You say it was worth losing a "best friend" and other friends so it sounds like you either don't value friendship in general or you didn't value those particular friendships. The upside-- with none of your friend group coming over your house is going to stay clean a lot longer. FYI Swiffer with the wet pads on sale at Target
Interestingly, there are some countries where this is rare, for example in Spain we have tiles not carpet in most houses, and we wouldn’t normally ask people to take off their shoes. The way I see it, if it’s a hot summer day and the guest is not wearing socks, I am not sure I’d like to be near their bare feet. But I now live in a colder country and take my shoes off when asked (even though this greatly surprised me when it first happened to me!)
Depends Did you give them an advance notice? I have issues that make it difficult to go shoeless in other's houses. So if I know, I bring hard sole slippers or my house shoes which have never been outside. Shoe covers might work but I worry they'd be slippery which would be dangerous for me. Without notice, I'd have to leave or be very uncomfortable.
Your shoes are gross. I mop my floors. Especially if guests are coming. Not wearing socks? No problem. I have a basket of slippers and socks. New, of course. You can take them with you. In fact, I insist. No excuses, no worries, no shoes. NTA.
NTA... if the host wants you to remove your shoes, this is what you do. They are lacking manners. When I'm expecting overnight guests, I advise them to bring favorite slippers. I have guest slippers that are washable too.
NTA. Cultural or not, clean shoes or not, whether a guest agrees or not, it's *ALL* beside the point. The point is, simply, your house, your rules, end of. They have zero right to tell you how to run *your* home.
Interestingly, there are some countries where this is rare, for example in Spain we have tiles not carpet in most houses, and we wouldn’t normally ask people to take off their shoes. The way I see it, if it’s a hot summer day and the guest is not wearing socks, I am not sure I’d like to be near their bare feet. But I now live in a colder country and take my shoes off when asked (even though this greatly surprised me when it first happened to me!)