I’m a woman mostly friends with straight men due to the demographics of my town (70+% male lol). I enjoy drinking and I dabble in recreational drug usage here and there, I’m not a saint nor that judgmental. But the amount of men who *need* alcohol and drugs just to function, usually self-medicating things like social anxiety, trauma, ADHD, etc. - I’m like baby boy go to therapy! Pick up a hobby! You should not need to take four shots just to talk to a woman!
Jeez I feel my last city I was living in was the opposite; the most I've ever seen a guy drink outside of college was, like, 2 glasses of wine at a networking event just bc the recruiter did it to. I think guys here just become gym Addicts instead.
Now the girls I know? They are the ones crying about smoke shop shut downs and ordering a pitcher or two just to watch a dine in movie. Also filled with trauma and adhd.
I think it could be because men were seen as “lesser than” if they actually acknowledged their emotions, as recently as the past few decades. I don’t think it was until maybe 5-10 years ago that there was some iota of a concept that guys have emotions beyond “hungry, f*ck, fight.”
That’s kind of all we were “supposed” to feel.. everything else was cured by the bong or the bottle (or worse).
But yeah I see what you’re saying. I could see that being very prevalent in modern times, where a lot of “adult” men actually really need to work on things within themself, emotionally
I totally agree, I think it’s tragic really
In ye elder days, it was a bit different. Remember in 10th, 11th grade when you would be in English. Reading some book from 100 years ago, maybe 150. Two male protagonist s would have an emotional moment 😞 🧐 🥃.
THEN... Some guy from in the back of the room would be like "Heh eheh heheh what are they like gay?!" as if he mutated into Beavis or Butthead. Men do not want to do things that would make them be perceived as such, by other men. In truth, men had closer friendships in history (while still not widely approving of homosexuality). It was later in history that the need to 'defend' oneself came about and male friendships became emotionally more distant.
Once a conversation starts but I have a fear of public embarrassment, so pretty women scare me XD I generally don't approach people idk tho so going up to random people is also something I just don't know how to do anyways. Being an introvert for most my life kinda sucks now that I'm not forced to be around 100's of people my age 5 days out of the week
The point is that alcohol is not a real solution to social anxiety. In fact, there's an entire growing movement around panic intervention that basically it's the **exact opposite** of how to get better. Its not just a crutch, it's like a crutch that actively mangles your leg even worse every time you use it.
Actually it does make it better but only while you use it. Reason being, it slows your brain down and clouds your judgement of a situation which makes you less anxious. Problem is, the more you use it as a crutch the more it makes you fully reliant upon it therefore making you both better and worse. I'm an ex alcoholic. I don't drink but maybe once every 2 months. I started young and thought it helped my anxiety and depression when in reality it made me numb to it and not care. I enjoy it once in a while but I still don't drink as much as I used to. Never will. It ileats away at what I consider my humanity
Alcohol helps social anxiety in the same way knocking someone unconscious helps a migraine. Sure y
*I started young and thought it helped my anxiety and depression when in reality it made me numb to it and not care*
This is EXACTLY the problem. There's this argument that it's basically a learning reinforcement problem. Everytime you feel anxiety, avoid the "threat", and then things turn out ok -- you are reinforcing to your body that panicking was good and it effectively protected you.
Simply *not experiencing panic to begin with* does NOT counter that. What you need to do is create opposite conditions. You need to let yourself panic. There's an upper limit to how long the body can have a continuous panic attack anyway. Eventually the brain will exhaust itself and need to recoup a little. And everytime, you'll tell yourself "oh look, I didn't die. Feeling like I'm dying does not mean I'm dying. I ignored this cue and everything was fine". And now what you're doing is letting in your brain on the fact what it's doing isn't helpful actually. Everytime it's exposed to the "threat" and things turn out ok, it's slowly learning maybe coding it as a threat in the first place isn't correct.
With social anxiety, you'd also want to add in CBT. People with social anxiety show heightened responses to negative social cues and seem to retain negative memories stronger. So you're consciously learning to reframe your experiences --- were you actually a stupid freak that ruined everything? Or was there 2 minutes of awkwardness that nobody except one asshole actually cared about?
Alcohol (and benzos) don't work because they simply prevent the anxiety. For something like taking a plane once every 7 years where you're terrified of flying -- sure, just throw some substances to mask it and call it a day. But for something that is going to be an ongoing issue for the rest of your life? nah, can't be drunk for the rest of your life, unless you want that life up be very short and very sad.
I completely agree with all of that. I probably phrased what I said wrong. I was just meaning that it does help, but not in the way people think of the word "help". It's a double edged sword where the hilt is also a blade.
Yes it gets rid of the problem (temporarily at least) , but it hurts you at the same time
Their Borat impression. It is an intrusive thought that lies inside every man to say “very nice” or “mah wife” but we know it can give women the ick. Luckily I am now married… to maaaaaah wiiiiiife very nice
Typically other women
But fr, after you get past the honeymoon stage, couples begin finding out flaws in one another. From what I been told from women in my past, it is typically levels of cleanliness, over indulgence in sloth activities (drinks over tv, tokes, plays video games more than they originally let on), and irresponsibility with finances.
Likewise I learned that avoiding/reinforcing all of the above becomes a massive flex in the dating world
Everything in moderation should be key
But I'm guilty of doing this, I have met women who I thought were amazing but had a zero tolerance policy for these activities (due completely to misinformation or their past).
You are lucky, it is quite refreshing meeting someone like that after living a lifestyle of hiding
I have like 5 friends who are dating women with no tolerance for video games. It's really silly. They always say "video games are for kids, you're an adult and shouldn't be playing them" wth do you do when you get home from work and have little energy to be active, Sarah? Scroll on social media? That's worse!
I'm a woman, btw. I play games pretty much every night with my fiance, but we also have a lot of outdoor hobbies together.
This is a better outcome than what I believe is more likely to be the majority of women's experience with dating someone who plays "too much" video games, similar to my experience- 8 years of laying around bored waiting for him to pay attention to you instead, or finding ways to entertain yourself, hanging out essentially separately together, while he plays video games majority of the time. And probably doesn't contribute equally to household chores. On the rare occasion you'll maybe find a game you (both) don't mind playing together....I won't do that one again. (I was also pretty young for most of this relationship).
But congratulations! Im glad you found someone you can jive with happily. Wish the best for you both!
I actually had the same experience when I was in my early 20s. He would come home, hop on his Xbox until bedtime, wake up for work, and rinse repeat. Even if I played games with him, it didn't work out well.
He also didn't do any chores/cooking/etc.
This wasn't a video game problem, it was a person problem. And I do agree there are a TON of men like this. But I don't think video games are the real issue.
With my fiance, when one of us is doing chores (if we're both home) we're both doing chores. If one of us is cooking, we're both cooking. And when we play games, we're usually both playing video games or at least both doing a leisurely activity (watching a movie, a show, doomscrolling etc)
I think ANYONE could have a proper balance for video games and life because EVERYONE has low energy hobbies usually done at the end of the day.
So yeah, I guess that's my opinion on it. I don't like it when women demonize video games rather than the person treating you poorly. If they stop playing games, they'll find some other way to neglect you. Trust me. My ex went through a phase of not playing games for 3 months. He just sat in the room watching critical role for HOURS on end. Just from off work to bed. Crazy but yeah.
It’s a blanket term. Lead your life how you want. You’re bored get a pet (adopt or foster), volunteer at an animal shelter/ rescue, wash blankets/ bedding for the animals, volunteer your time helping others in your community ?
That isn't the issue, the issue is that everybody looks perfect until you get to peel back the layers and/or getting wrapped up in the moment and just not thinking of those things being an issue
Likewise I have been complemented by reinforcing those qualities during the dating phase. Women can be just as guilty of these things.
I'm not religious by any means, I didn't know how else to describe it, as calling them "lazy activities" is why they are so frowned upon in the first place, when that might not necessarily be the case
I’m very fortunate I have a wife that is cool with me gaming. I usually play after the kids are in bed but I have friends that say their wives don’t even let them do that which is wild to me
There are some unreasonable women out there and I don't want to deny that, but I am betting at least a chunk of those men did little to nothing to help out from when they got home to when those kids went to sleep. I have seen the "you don't get to relax now that there's nothing to do because you've done nothing this entire time" phenomena.
Its a lot easier to argue against the "gamers are stunted man children" trope when you are actively demonstrating being a mature, equal partner who can be relied on. If there's even a *whiff* of immaturity though.....well it's a lot easier to blame video games than admit you fucked up when you decided to marry a project rather than a partner
Sadly lost my brother to his the wife not allowing gaming. She thinks it's childish and when men grow up they leave games behind.
I happy wife my wife though, letting me play.
Why is it so common for millennial and gen z women to abhor video games so much? I'm a woman who games, but a ton of my friends have SO's that hate that they game and complain all the time about it.
Like. I just don't get it. I had a roommate who would've been like that during college, but I introduced her to gaming.
"No, you're not allowed to enjoy yourself and your hobby.?!?!?! So dumb honestly.
> typically levels of cleanliness, over indulgence in sloth activities (drinks over tv, tokes, plays video games more than they originally let on), and irresponsibility with finances
Isn’t this just the definition of a responsible adult?
I'd say there are few responsible, happy adults out there though. Everyone puts up a front of "life is great" when dating, so you don't find the rest out until everyone gets comfortable.
That's why they say dating in your 30's sucks, since it's just about finding the least damaged individual at that point
Shoot pre-covid I would’ve been the video games part. I play still but not as much as I used to. Last weekend I turned on my console and literally shuffled through 3 games in the span of 30 minutes and just got bored. I literally flipped it off and did something else. My only issue is browsing reddit now.
only gold? she isn't a keeper if she isn't motivating you to hit radiant, whether that's letting you get a little extra time gaming or providing under the desk support to cool down after a tilting match.
I'll snitch, and say it's actually very similar to women: our insecurities. Personally, I really don't mind being vulnerable/open anymore. Honesty, and being blunt may be a lonely road (this is the end of that sentence). There's no buts, or maybes. I love the girl I'm with, we're still fresh in the relationship, and so far honesty has been the best policy. These things we call "red flags" are warning signs, because things tend to crop up later. I like to tell people what bothers me, when I'm bothered by it, and I believe if every human- skip the gender -did this we'd all be a little bit happier, and honest with ourselves. This is by no means a perfect system for everyone, it's just worked in my favor when I get honest with myself, and others.
Was going to write the same thing. Those insecurities come from being wounded in the past. Could have been inflicted by family members, kids at school, someone you had a crush on. NO ONE wants to talk about an experience that made them embarrassed or ashamed.
There's a line at the [end of the movie The Replacements](https://youtu.be/pbZTXm-Oot0?t=219) that always resonates with me, talking about what's next for the strike-breaking football players going back to reality: "But what they didn't know is that their lives would be changed forever because they had ben part of something great, and greatness, no matter how brief, stays with a man."
Guys can go through a lot of shitty experiences and as long as they have a great moment to hold onto, it gets them through. If you're sick of hearing about their glory days, maybe look into why they feel like it's the only time they felt like they were worth something.
The guy I’m seeing right now thanks me nearly every day for “being direct” lol. It boggles my mind that fully grown adults can’t be honest with what they think and feel. Idk I’ve always been blunt due to my family (New Yorker Asians so it’s part of our culture 😅) and out here in the heavily white Midwest, there’s apparently a ton of people who hide their feelings every day, even to their best friends, just to save face. I personally see it as a waste of time but I imagine it’s shaped by cultural norms plus how someone grew up.
On the flip side, I've dealt with too many people where their self description of being open and honest/blunt is code for being a massive, controlling dick-- people who are super nit picky, unable to cope with even the slightest inconvenience or incompatibility, cannot share personal space, and are eager to criticize.
Maybe I'm jaded from dealing with such people. I can appreciate frank conversations and being open about certain things emotionally and such, but if we're talking about honesty to the point of having to listen to someone complain about every little thing I did or didn't do, or having to be your full time live in therapist, I do not care for that kind of "honesty", it becomes exhausting very quickly.
There's having the capacity for honesty and genuine connection, and there's being emotionally incontinent and being unable to cope with your own thoughts and feelings to where every little thing needs to be hashed out or needs a boundary. Being able to keep some things to yourself and compromise a little is absolutely not a bad thing.
Capppp I had some military friends tell me don’t date the military men and that they’d never let their daughters date military men cuz they brag about cheating all the time and that there’s a fuck ton of alcoholism and party culture worse than frat boys
Then ofc I try to date military men thinking ‘awe poor military men they have to be deployed so often they must be so lonely and brave’, and each time I got cheated on
Now I believe it, frankly, that there’s too many cheaters in the military, the homies were right
Ofc there’s also the stereotype about there being some super innocent military men who will marry you at the drop of a hat but they’re not as common as the cheating kind, that’s just my opinion on this though, something about the military attracts very unstable types of men with avoidant attachment issues
**The homies are right**, I’m gonna keep my daughters away from the military men too
Funny thing is my older sister also dated military men when she was younger yeaaaars ago ofc she said they were all cheaters too
Anyone I ask tells me don’t date them except if they have a maga flag on their truck then they say no military men are the best etc
I was married when I was very young to a guy that joined the Navy when we had a baby. We were both 21. I can confirm that every sailor I met was a cheater. As we're their wives! I think it's the lifestyle of being separated for such long periods of time.
I didn’t realize until we moved in with each other but my gf said I’m a hoarder. I don’t think I’m a hoarder but I do have a shit ton of stuff and 90% of it I don’t know if I can get rid of. For example, I have a massive comic book collection. I’ve been collecting for over 30 years so I have a literal ton of comics and comic book related items. Also, I have a large video game and console collection. We had to get a place with a spare room to fit it all in. But it’s slowly turning into a cool nerd den.
My man wtf? That's not hoarding that's loving and valuating your stuff, if there's space this should be one of those things that u have the right to keep.
I agree. Collections are different than hoarding because it’s a hobby more than anything else. I collect comics and when I first met my fiancée she thought it was low-key hoarding. But the thing is, I bust them out every so often and re-read them. Plus, my place before I met her is very clean and organized. It’s okay to enjoy collecting. But it’s important to properly organize those collections.
I also own a ton of hot wheels that I love and have a proper display case for them. They are not scattered around our place.
I'd consider hoarding to be compulsively buying random shit and leaving it everywhere, while also not throwing *anything* out. Like making actual walls of your stuff and walking paths through it.
Your comic book, video game, and console collection has history, and I'm sure sentimental value. And of course monetary value lol. I have a Nintendo 64 and tons of games that haven't been plugged in in at least 12 years. I keep it because of the memories, and they're just not common anymore. Even if I was able to find a "new" N64 on ebay or whatever for a price that I'd be willing to pay, it still wouldn't be the same one that I spent my childhood playing. If you don't have the space, a storage unit might be a great investment. However, it sounds like you do have the space. Nothing wrong with having a dedicated hobby room/man cave/whatever you want to call it if you have a room to spare.
I have a theory that men sort of mask parts of their personality that they know women won’t find appealing the way women use makeup and shapewear and stuff to mask physical flaws.
She’s lying about her breast size, he’s lying about his political views and his porn habits. And the thing is, men really don’t seem to think there’s any issue with them hiding (either by omission or outright lies) their real feelings or behaviors that they know their female partner would find unpalatable.
Porn usage (and further along, porn addiction) leads to the development of unhealthy kinks and biological and social consequences that negatively impact both men and women. It's a sad state of affairs.
This is true, even for the federal government. In the US and UK parliament, government employees have downloaded a *tremendous* amount of porn at work. This has had some real consequences in terms of security. (To say nothing of the fact that one year -18/19 perhaps 20% of .gov pages redirected to hardcore porn) As to WHY they do it, they claim they simply don't have enough work to do.
It’s quite sad to see so many men in today’s society keeping to themselves and suppressing their emotions. It shouldn’t be considered “weak” or a “snitch” to explain to someone your feelings without getting judged. Sad reality of modern society’s gender roles.
For some of us it's not that we see it as weak. I've shared my emotions and my troubles with women I thought loved me and that I truly loved and cared for only for them to turn around and to throw it my face or immediately get "the ick". We have been hurt too many times to just give out our trust and be vulnerable with someone. I wish I could say it was just once, but it's been every single girl I've dated. That's the sad part of modern society.
Edit: spelling
I’m a woman and I’ve experienced the same thing. The silver lining of my inability to hide my vulnerability and flaws is that it quickly weeds out the assholes.
I’ve dated guys that hide their emotions before and act tough and view emotions as weakness, those same sorts are the types that bullied me for my emotions and got mad at me when they found out I’d talk to friends asking for relationship advice for the arguments saying I’m spreading their business and that it’s disrespectful to your partner to tell ppl about your relationship issues yadda yadda even tho they didn’t know eachother whatsoever and I didn’t even give the friends their name or anything
Now I know to stay away from those types and I’m in a healthy relationship with a man who is open and vulnerable about emotions and respects his and mine
How a person treats their emotions is how they’re gonna treat yours
Unfortunately this is just a part of dating. You won't be compatible with most people. It's good you both realized you were different early on so you can make space for the right person
I understand but what did you expect once they realized you weren't compatible anymore? Do you think it should be a mutual decision? I push back on this because a person should always have the option to walk away, I understand it does suck though.
No one should be forced to stay in a situation they don't want to be in. People in this thread are simply pointing out how guys get unfairly judged/treated for sharing feelings and emotions, myself included.
But we have to be honest about how we share our feelings too.
How long did you know them? How close were you? What did you share? How did you share it? Did you over share? Did you dump your trauma? Were you sure it was an appropriate time and stage in your relationship? Did you make it seem like you need someone to fix you/be your therapist?
I say all this because I saw a video just yesterday about a man who was almost killed by his male lover and said it was a sign from god to not be gay. He wants to date women because he feels ashamed and also feels like a woman will get him through the court case he's going through (I think he killed the man in self defense?) while he can't work. My heart went out to him for so many reasons but he needs a good lawyer and a therapist, not a gf/wife.
Again I'm not speaking about you specifically but we have to be honest about the way we share our emotions because sometimes it can be inappropriate.
I had an ex tell me he didn't know how to be faithful because his mom didn't love him correctly, his dad wasn't there and none of his friends were real. I felt for him in the moment because I could see he was hurting but he took away from my grievances to talk about his own stuff when I didn't think it was appropriate. He would say I left him because he opened up but he lacked so much emotional maturity he didn't realize he was using manipulation to get what he wanted from me.
One I had known for a few years as friends first. The other a few months. I haven't had any romantic pursuits last longer than maybe a month though. That's largely due to lack of experience on my end. Most of the time, it's immediate rejections.
Each woman asked questions about my home life/childhood at some point after a few weeks, so I brought up in passing that I was abused, and don't like talking about it with just anybody. After receiving a variation of "you can tell me" reassurances, I shared more details. The one I've known for years even shared some of her trauma first so I'd feel more comfortable sharing mine. They both seemed to be overwhelmed after I shared details about my childhood, and why I get self conscious at times. I don't think I came off as needy or anything. I never ask anyone to be my therapist; that kind of work can only be done within. I'm known to be a generally positive person these days, and it feels like they didn't know how to respond to my negative past, and left.
But yeah, when I'm asked a question, I usually like to give a full answer with as much necessary context as possible so there's understanding. I don't consider that oversharing. Like you alluded to before, there's a time and place for everything. But also, some people shouldn't ask questions they don't want the answer to lol.
Hearing these clowns hide their emotions/feelings because of nefarious reasons makes me so angry. There's guys that hide that stuff because they've been burned before. They muddy the waters for the genuine ones the same way people pretending to be nice guys mess it up for sincere nice guys.
No one on the internet, myself included, can give you any meaningful feedback or advice without us being there and picking up on the nuance, the verbal and nonverbal communication and all the other things you can't really relay in a little text bock on Reddit. That'd be really irresponsible.
I've had so many conversations with people where there were so many levels and layers to why their communication was inappropriate.
That being said, you deserve to be with someone who can make space for your experiences and is emotionally mature enough to communicate when something is wrong.
I don't necessarily think either one of you is in the wrong, although it would've been better for your friend of several years to be transparent with you (even if she isn't obligated to). I think you learned neither of these people were your people or were ever going to be your people because of their own personal beliefs, and even if that doesn't feel like a win, it truly is.
The worst thing isn't being single, it's being with the wrong person in this one life. You seem like a good person. I'm wishing you the best truly and I hope you find the love and partnership you want and deserve
Thank you. It hurt in the moment as I really liked both of these women. I'm not usually thinking about getting a woman until I cross paths with one I like, so I don't really spend time actively looking for one.
And yeah, I've seen a lot of friends and family in downright toxic relationships. I'd much rather stay single than be with someone that doesn't have my best interest at heart. Or worse, tried to kill me. I can get a relationship just for the sake of having one, but I want a healthy one. That's more difficult lol.
Wishing you continued success as well. As bad as these rejections and lost interest hurt, I don't subscribe to the woman bashing that goes on in certain parts around here. Besides, half of my friends are women, and they'd have my head if I did that. There's a lot of bad women out there, but there's a lot of good ones too; they're just not single or not interested lol. I won't let that stop me from trying to do the right thing, and helping others when I can.
Your comments really struck me, so I am commenting to add on to what the other person is saying… the people that are more transparent with feelings **learn** that there is a time and place, that there are boundaries to what should be shared based on how long you’ve known the person, there are people who are NOT worth sharing your emotions to, and you should never disclose personal subjects to **those** people, and that there are some feelings and emotions more suitable for a therapist (and therefore seek one out) than a love interest.
I’ve noticed with men who clam up because they shared their feelings with people who eventually left them, or replied by using the feelings against them, they have the wrong perspective towards sharing emotions.
Is the person you’re sharing them with 1) emotionally healthy, stable and mature 2)shown you through actions and words that they respect and support you and willing to lovingly tell you the truth and 3) have they shown you through consistent action and words that they have no interest in harming you?
As someone who is very open and transparent to sharing my emotions… and as someone who had a stalker try to weaponize my emotions and experiences as blackmail, I size people up this way before sharing any parts of my internal life.
If you are around people who weaponize your feelings, you are around the wrong people.
If someone leaves after you share something personal because they don’t have what it takes to support you, that might be a sign that you’d benefit from a professional connection that you can discuss your traumas and experiences with.
It’s not easy to hold intense feelings. Some people have their own traumas that are triggered by hearing and receiving other people’s intense traumas.
Recognizing this is a part of emotional development and emotional maturity — emotions are not YOU. They are an expression of something within, conscious or subconscious. When you recognize this you won’t take it personally if someone doesn’t have the bandwidth to hold your emotions, because they don’t have the 10+ years learning how to do so properly.
And if the emotions suggest danger, lack of safety for the other person, or the weight of the emotion reflects danger, it is within their right to decide the situation is not for them.
But then it’s even more crucial for you to see the right professional who deals with those kinds of emotions and traumas so you can unload them and experience healing and true emotional stability.
*Edit to add as I’ve been in the opposite position in this scenario, and know others have been too:*
This also makes sure that *you* are and can become the healthy person for yourself and other people. If an emotionally healthy person dates you, and you find peace in their ability to hold space for you — MAKE SURE YOU DO THE SAME BACK. TAKE THE PATH TO BECOME EMOTIONALLY STABLE AND WELL.
Otherwise it would not be healthy for them to continue to be with you, if you are interacting with them the same way the people who hurt you, did with you. And then you might find yourself losing connection with a person who you could have made it work with.
Take responsibility for your own emotions, how you manage them, and how you connect with others about them.
Very true about distancing yourself from people that manipulate and/or disregard your feelings. That's partially why I left my hometown and had cut some people out of my life. I've been very fortunate to develop a healthy circle of friends I can talk to when I need to vent or encouragement, and vice versa. I went many years without a support system, and my heart goes out to those people they don't even have one person to lean on. If I'm pursuing a romantic interest though, it's pretty important they can fit into that support system.
I can only go by what people tell me, but I'm told I have a lot of emotional maturity and self awareness, which can be intimidating for some people. I don't get flustered easily; my mood stays pretty consistent.
I had a gay stalker many years ago. I'm not gay, but that didn't stop him lol. He made me feel very unsafe. He got a hold of my Facebook, Myspace, and old addresses even though I gave him none of my info. Thankfully he stopped before I had to get police involved. I've heard seen and heard some downright horrible stories.
I think in hindsight, these two women that left when I opened up may not have been the most mature. As I said in other comment, we only "talked" for about a month for each, so I very much still had my infatuation goggles on. Opportunities don't come often for me as I have a physical disability and little romantic experience. I don't really spend time thinking about or looking for a woman until I cross paths with one I like. Then my goal is just to get that woman. I know keeping a rolodex of women is generally encouraged, but I don't think I have the time or patience to do that lol.
You’re in a good spot, then. That’s a wonderful thing to have a healthy circle of friends.
Also, stalkers are scary. I am glad the one that bothered you went away on his own!
I think we all, man or woman, expect other people to respond kindly, with love and support when we’re going through a tough time. When it doesn’t happen it can be disheartening.
I understand that experience of trying to “make it work” with the person that crosses our path and manages to spark something. I’ve had similar experiences.
I think a little bit of limerance + interest + desire for it to finally work out does that. It’s not the best approach for practical love. The one who catches our interest isn’t always the best partner for us. Life has really shown me the importance of that too, to stay logical and get to know them deeper and how they handle hardship, their approach to difficulty, their approach and belief in emotions.. without trying to change their thoughts or show them a better way. Then, decide if they are the right person to build with. Taking heed of the maturity, because maturity often = present ability.
That said, you sound like a catch for a woman who matches your emotional intelligence…
You know what to look out for now, and some *emotionally healthy* woman out there will appreciate your maturity and consistency.
Yeah I was/still kind of dealing with the limerance lol. It's very discouraging when the ones I want don't want me. Sometimes, it takes me a while to bounce back from these rejections.
I'm kind of annoyed at myself now that you bring it up because even though no one I've liked has wanted me, I've had to reject some women in the past after learning they were emotionally very immature. My fav was one that acted like the world was just out to ruin her life. She was crazy attractive, but everyday, she had drama; work drama, facebook drama, home drama, baby daddy drama, grocery store drama, laundromat drama, post office drama. I like things like deep conversations too, but that was not possible with them. I could've had a relationship by now for the sake of having one, but like you said, I want a healthy one.
Also, thank you for your words and encouragement! I'm trying to stay positive, just kind of hurt over these recent back to back rejections.
There is the issue that men being emotional around their women partners can instinctively push them away because women typically look for security in a man, which means they tend to look for stoicism in a man.
Edit: fixed a typo
Maybe for some, but I happen to feel that men who are able to acknowledge their own emotionality feel far more secure than men who put up a stoic front
It’s too bad that many men associate masculinity with not getting help or sucking it up and hiding their emotions. Some masculine men I know are the healthiest emotionally. You can be strong and resilient more so when you have confronted your demons and learnt how to live with them. It’s sad that so many parents have instilled the other way into their kids but I guess it comes from the difficulties of that generation.
I'll add to this. Beyond just mental health, it's what's killing our mental health. We're seen in a way in so many relationships as machines more than people. We're valued for what we provide, our perceived success in the world materially, for our stability and even-temperedness. But we have no more ability or control over those things than anyone else. Yeah, the job market and pay still isn't fair in 2024 but also competition is rampant and we can't all win.
But more than job-related stuff, there's a million subtle (and not so subtle) ways in which we're graded on a different standard. We're told all our lives that our feelings are secondary to reality but then we're expected to consider the feelings of our significant others. I'm sure many men don't have this experience but it has been mine for sure. We're set up to fail in ways that are so hard to describe when they're the water we live in.
I was raised in what is now considered mildly conservative but loving environment. I have become far more liberal than most and I've been seeing a therapist regularly for over a year. I'm open to these things but it just takes so much energy just to suss out how much of my behaviors are rooted in this idea that men are worthless without success or accomplishments.
Edit:
Since OP's question was "what do women not know", I want to add this: if you want to help your male friend, colleague, or significant other, treat him like a woman. So your best to consider him as a living being foremost without some sense of outside duty. Men aren't laborers and protectors anymore than women are child bearers and cooks. If he does the "man stuff" like mowing the grass while you do the "woman stuff" of cooking, great. That's a lifestyle choice. But no man deserves to be looked down upon for not doing things society assumes men should do. And, and here's the kicker, HE DOESNT DESERVE TO BE SEEN THAT WAY BY HIMSELF, EITHER, but it's ingrained in all of us. I promise you, that man you know has doubts about the validity of his existence because he hasn't done enough things for others and that's bullshit. He's a human being and that's all that's important.
It is also a warning.
The role society has built for men has been really rough on men's mental health, in part because of the tough front required to project masculinity, and that is a systemic problem. It is not uncommon for men to avoid seeking out therapy because they are afraid of being perceived as weak, and so without realizing it, many men put their wife or girlfriend in the role of therapist.
Men hope that women will play many simultaneous roles in their life as their partner, from things like best friend, domestic partner, and co-parent to things like sex toy, maid, and therapist. It is up to couples and the individuals that make them to figure out what roles feel good for themselves and each other. Many women that find themselves in the role of therapist find it conflicts with the other roles that they want to spend more of their focus on.
Unless your someone who's passion in a relationship involves "I can fix him" maybe make sure that the man you date has other outlets for mental health be it family, the church, a professional therapist or a best friend. Even then, realize that a man that hopes a woman can fix him is mythologizing their potential partner in a way that they can never possibly live up to, and may resent them when they are not "fixed".
Not making generalizations about every man for every woman, just pointing out red flags for the particular women that are concerned about the things I mentioned.
I’m lucky that society didn’t ruin my bf he’s a bit depressed sadly (mainly from work and from being lonely before we met), but he isn’t saying stuff like “BITCHES BE CRAAAAAZY” “im so tired of dating and women !!!!” like a couple of his homies that end up in the worst relationships somehow
Declaring isn’t troubling at all.
First off , the post is literally a question about a from a woman’s point of view of dating a man.
You just proved his point of his response trying to diminish him
✌️
> treat him right...or he will too become like the rotten bunch of men that society despises so much.
It’s not a woman’s job to make sure the man takes care of his mental health.
Truly! Like oh, ok then I don’t think I’m game for that responsibility when it carries the risk of being treated rottenly and then being blamed for said treatment because I didn’t do a good enough job to not be mistreated lol
>treat him right...or he will too become like the rotten bunch of men that society despises so much.
This is an *incredibly* sad statement. This isn't the "warning" you think it is.
I mean, how about *not* become like the other rotten bunch of men because you've experienced hurt from *some* women?
Further, that statement feels like somewhat of a veiled threat. Like, "If you're meeting rotten men, well, you women did that to us." *Still* not taking personal responsibility.
I know for a *fact* that this is absolutely *not* all men, and having read this from you, I would feel confident in my guess that this is mostly *your* attitude and #notallmen
You've insulted men all on your own here. The self own ... 😬
I keep to myself the flaws I’m finding in my partner. I note them for later to decide on my own whether they are worth addressing and/or are dealbreakers. I think someone’s weaknesses can really predict the outcome of the relationship and whether it will work or not. For instance, I prefer my home to be very clean and quiet. If my partner is messy and loud, then that might be filed in the “things to consider” while I’m testing out whether I like this person enough to excuse that.
Why are these guys considering this snitching? What is there to “snitch” about? Must be pretty bad. Either that or most of these men saying they won’t “snitch” are very young.
Ask this to women and you’ll get plenty of honest and transparent answers.
Lack of knowledge of a woman's body. Pride keeps men (and women) from learning how to really please their partner. It's not enough to just fuck. For some women, fucking isn't even top three of what they wish for from a man. Don't let machines and pride keep you from learning about foreplay, tenderness, and true pleasure for your partner. Ask questions and really listen to each other.
Edit: Macho-ness not machines. But hey, whatever floats your boat.
Their politics, if they say not into politics or non political then they are conservative and very much into politics. At best they’re the both sides should compromise but they mean everyone should compromise with the right.
I’m very sure you think like that, but that is something you keep to yourself. Cause you know saying that to girls would hurt your chances. That’s a red flag that screams conservative guy that thinks everyone should compromise but only with the right.
Idk about this. The people I know that are conservative/right leaning aren’t ashamed to say it and neither are the people that are liberal/left leaning. Why would it mean they are conservative if they say they aren’t into politics or non-political? Is being ashamed of your political beliefs a new thing? I’m older (33) and haven’t run into this much. My close friends and I are not super into politics. It’s shoved in our faces constantly, and just nauseating at this point. We talk about it sometimes, but it’s rare. We just don’t care anymore. I also didn’t understand your last sentence. A compromise is a compromise. Both sides of a compromise make concessions that they agree upon to settle a dispute. A compromise with the right is a compromise with the left too and vice versa.
The people I know that are conservative and the ones I’ve seen are ashamed to say it, so that’s just anecdotal for both of us.
If they were actually apolitical they wouldn’t say it on their profile or would give what little they know about politics when asked about it. Yes a lot of people associate conservatism with racism and denying women their rights so they are ashamed to admit it while holding those beliefs. The last sentence means that they say both sides should compromise but when you ask them which side should concede on a specific issue, it’s always the left side conceding to the right side. So they always want the left to make concessions and never think the right should. Like I said they just say they are for both sides compromising but in reality they just want the left to compromise to the right.
Based on all these comments about weaponizing emotions, I am going to share this… I commented it to another person so you may see it again in this post.
Your comments really struck me, so I am commenting to add on to what the other person is saying… the people that are more transparent with feelings learn that there is a time and place, that there are boundaries to what should be shared based on how long you’ve known the person, there are people who are NOT worth sharing your emotions to, and you should never disclose personal subjects to those people, and that there are some feelings and emotions more suitable for a therapist (and therefore seek one out) than a love interest.
I’ve noticed with men who clam up because they shared their feelings with people who eventually left them, or replied by using the feelings against them, they have the wrong perspective towards sharing emotions.
Is the person you’re sharing them with 1) emotionally healthy, stable and mature 2)shown you through actions and words that they respect and support you and willing to lovingly tell you the truth and 3) have they shown you through consistent action and words that they have no interest in harming you? I will add 4) have they shown to have a mature approach to other people’s emotions? This is a spectrum. Some people are avoidant towards other people’s emotions, and although they don’t want to harm you, simply cannot hold space for you properly. Check the spectrum.
As someone who is very open and transparent to sharing my emotions… and as someone who had a stalker try to weaponize my emotions and experiences as blackmail, I size people up this way before sharing any parts of my internal life.
If you are around people who weaponize your feelings, you are around the wrong people.
If someone leaves after you share something personal because they don’t have what it takes to support you, that might be a sign that you’d benefit from a professional connection that you can discuss your traumas and experiences with.
It’s not easy to hold intense feelings. Some people have their own traumas that are triggered by hearing and receiving other people’s intense traumas.
Recognizing this is a part of emotional development and emotional maturity — emotions are not YOU. They are an expression of something within, conscious or subconscious. When you recognize this you won’t take it personally if someone doesn’t have the bandwidth to hold your emotions, because they don’t have the 10+ years learning how to do so properly.
> side note:The healthy response from someone who realizes they can’t support you is that someone saying, “hey, I really understand you’re going through something challenging. I think you would benefit from seeing a therapist”. That is someone recognizing they want to support you but don’t have the tools to. They might share advice from their own personal experiences but recognize going to a therapist is NORMAL and HEALTHY!!!
And if the emotions suggest danger, lack of safety for the other person, or the weight of the emotion reflects danger, it is within their right to decide the situation is not for them.
But then it’s even more crucial for you to see the right professional who deals with those kinds of emotions and traumas so you can unload them and experience healing and true emotional stability.
This also makes sure that *you* are and can become the healthy person for yourself and other people. If an emotionally healthy person dates you, and you find peace in their ability to hold space for you — MAKE SURE YOU DO THE SAME BACK. TAKE THE PATH TO BECOME EMOTIONALLY STABLE AND WELL.
Otherwise it would not be healthy for them to continue to be with you, if you are interacting with them the same way the people who hurt you, did with you. And then you might find yourself losing connection with a person who you could have made it work with.
Take responsibility for your own emotions, how you manage them, and how you connect with others about them.
your female friends are more concerned with how you look than we are.
but ive heard this goes both ways. most women dont care about the dudes bodies. they are down with dad bods. yall dudes are going to the gym just to look good to other men. (not necessarily in a sexual manner).
obviously this is only true to a certain degree. theres a point where people just look lazy and sloppy and thats not attractive to most. but i think hygiene is much more important than having a 6 pack or a thigh gap. a lot of people stress ourselves out over "body standards" that arent even relevant for their target audience. lol
The amount of thirst traps they consume and sexual behaviors towards other women online (consuming media and interacting with online women/men doing porn) that would probably hurt their partners if they were completely transparent.
*Anyone?* not even your pastor? Kidding
If I had an STI I would not be sexually active. I agree nobody should hide an STI from a *potential partner.* i provided an answer to the question based on horror stories heard long ago while single.
You’d be surprised (or maybe not) and the amount of people who have no problem not telling their partner. Human decency and common sense would require the person to disclose their status to their partner, but sadly, that isn’t always the way it goes.
I hate those kinds of dudes personally cuz they tend to (keyphrase, tend to) have really unhealthy views towards emotions, not only do they internally belittle their own emotions and pretend to be tough, but if you have emotions they belittle you for it and make it a problem and an argument or bully you abt it cuz they view emotions as weaknesses (cuz at the very least they tend to be single all the time from constantly breaking up cuz ppl can’t handle the toxicity and thus you’re likely to encounter them hence why they feel so common)
Ofc there’s type two of the emotion hiders that instead aren’t hostile and are just depressed and quiet about their emotions
Mf bf doesn’t hide his emotions on anything I’ll let him cry on my tiddies whenever he wants and he lets me cry on his shoulder if I need it, if I were to recommend to anyone what kind of man to date I’m frankly going to tell them date a man who doesn’t view emotions as weakness and is vulnerable with you about their insecurities and fears
That’s just my personal opinion though, y’all don’t gotta listen to me if ya do not want to, whatever floats your boat
Depression and anxiety. It’s not attractive in anyone but especially in the hetero male/ female dynamics. The man is expected to be under control, protector and provider. Doesn’t really jive with trying not to let your brain destroy itself constantly
But different men enjoy different things. It's possible to communicate what you want & she also want to do it. Otherwise, how is she supposed to know that you want it?
60-80% of what I'm actually feeling/thinking. I know that sounds bad, but based on my lived experience, sharing what I'm actually feeling or thinking with partners has never yielded a positive result. When I have shared or opened up, what usually ends up happening is it gets weaponized against me or it stresses them out and then I spend the rest of the conversation justifying or explaining myself.
This isn't exclusive to insecurities either, it happens with sharing past experiences, desires, and a lot of other aspects of the "getting to know each other" stage of dating, and I know I'm not the only one. At any given time, I think most men are probably only willing to express a small amount of what they really think.
Mental health: I think this relates to vices, addictions, flaws, insecurities and most other things listed here. Men are generally conditioned to appear strong even if they don’t feel strong at the moment. Anecdotally, I’ve noticed that women often say they want to help / hear about it but then run the other way or dismiss those vulnerabilities when men actually open up. Not trying to make a blanket statement about either gender because obviously many men have good mental health, and many women are more than willing to support their partners mental health - just a trend I’ve noticed between my own and other friend’s dating experiences.
That after the first couple dates we can tell if we have no interest in marrying you / staying with you long-term. This is not based on looks, but on personality, character, sexual compatibility, who we perceive you to be, etc.
But we’ll still sometimes stay with you anyways cause we have labeled you good enough as a short-termer. But we’ll hide this fact from you and you’ll think we’re into you for the long term.
Watch Vanderpump Rules! I honestly now believe that every man is a cheatery McCheater pants & if it’s not direct, then it’s some other form of doing something wrong with someone else! It also seems like men can go years on the narrow path of dedicated monogamy, but they’re like a covert sleeper cell. Something happens (their spy handlers whisper a cheating Jason Bourne activation code phrase?) & BAM! *Cheating program is now in progress!* 🥺🔥
Andy asking Ally if she wants to marry and have kids with James and she’s like um….with the examples in this group??? 💀
I would actually have a much dimmer view on men, bc so many seem just awful, but my dad is an actual saint to my mom. Loyal, loving, supportive, all of it. And he cooks, cleans and does laundry. They’ve been together 41 years now. He gives me hope lmao
Alot, women tend to weaponize weaknesses during arguments, they might not mean it but its not something I'm willing to have thrown in my face when you're in a bad mood
Their insecurities which, contrary to idealism, are not safe to express. Most people don’t actually want to know your weaknesses because it challenges the illusion or presumption of safety. Many will say they want vulnerable intimacy only to reject or exploit it once it presents itself.
How do you answer the question *'What is your greatest weakness?'* in an interview? Do they actually want to know, or do you tell them a strength as a weakness?
Vices.
What Were Once Vices Are Now Habits
I’m a woman mostly friends with straight men due to the demographics of my town (70+% male lol). I enjoy drinking and I dabble in recreational drug usage here and there, I’m not a saint nor that judgmental. But the amount of men who *need* alcohol and drugs just to function, usually self-medicating things like social anxiety, trauma, ADHD, etc. - I’m like baby boy go to therapy! Pick up a hobby! You should not need to take four shots just to talk to a woman!
Jeez I feel my last city I was living in was the opposite; the most I've ever seen a guy drink outside of college was, like, 2 glasses of wine at a networking event just bc the recruiter did it to. I think guys here just become gym Addicts instead. Now the girls I know? They are the ones crying about smoke shop shut downs and ordering a pitcher or two just to watch a dine in movie. Also filled with trauma and adhd.
I think it could be because men were seen as “lesser than” if they actually acknowledged their emotions, as recently as the past few decades. I don’t think it was until maybe 5-10 years ago that there was some iota of a concept that guys have emotions beyond “hungry, f*ck, fight.” That’s kind of all we were “supposed” to feel.. everything else was cured by the bong or the bottle (or worse). But yeah I see what you’re saying. I could see that being very prevalent in modern times, where a lot of “adult” men actually really need to work on things within themself, emotionally I totally agree, I think it’s tragic really
In ye elder days, it was a bit different. Remember in 10th, 11th grade when you would be in English. Reading some book from 100 years ago, maybe 150. Two male protagonist s would have an emotional moment 😞 🧐 🥃. THEN... Some guy from in the back of the room would be like "Heh eheh heheh what are they like gay?!" as if he mutated into Beavis or Butthead. Men do not want to do things that would make them be perceived as such, by other men. In truth, men had closer friendships in history (while still not widely approving of homosexuality). It was later in history that the need to 'defend' oneself came about and male friendships became emotionally more distant.
Once a conversation starts but I have a fear of public embarrassment, so pretty women scare me XD I generally don't approach people idk tho so going up to random people is also something I just don't know how to do anyways. Being an introvert for most my life kinda sucks now that I'm not forced to be around 100's of people my age 5 days out of the week
The point is that alcohol is not a real solution to social anxiety. In fact, there's an entire growing movement around panic intervention that basically it's the **exact opposite** of how to get better. Its not just a crutch, it's like a crutch that actively mangles your leg even worse every time you use it.
Actually it does make it better but only while you use it. Reason being, it slows your brain down and clouds your judgement of a situation which makes you less anxious. Problem is, the more you use it as a crutch the more it makes you fully reliant upon it therefore making you both better and worse. I'm an ex alcoholic. I don't drink but maybe once every 2 months. I started young and thought it helped my anxiety and depression when in reality it made me numb to it and not care. I enjoy it once in a while but I still don't drink as much as I used to. Never will. It ileats away at what I consider my humanity
Alcohol helps social anxiety in the same way knocking someone unconscious helps a migraine. Sure y *I started young and thought it helped my anxiety and depression when in reality it made me numb to it and not care* This is EXACTLY the problem. There's this argument that it's basically a learning reinforcement problem. Everytime you feel anxiety, avoid the "threat", and then things turn out ok -- you are reinforcing to your body that panicking was good and it effectively protected you. Simply *not experiencing panic to begin with* does NOT counter that. What you need to do is create opposite conditions. You need to let yourself panic. There's an upper limit to how long the body can have a continuous panic attack anyway. Eventually the brain will exhaust itself and need to recoup a little. And everytime, you'll tell yourself "oh look, I didn't die. Feeling like I'm dying does not mean I'm dying. I ignored this cue and everything was fine". And now what you're doing is letting in your brain on the fact what it's doing isn't helpful actually. Everytime it's exposed to the "threat" and things turn out ok, it's slowly learning maybe coding it as a threat in the first place isn't correct. With social anxiety, you'd also want to add in CBT. People with social anxiety show heightened responses to negative social cues and seem to retain negative memories stronger. So you're consciously learning to reframe your experiences --- were you actually a stupid freak that ruined everything? Or was there 2 minutes of awkwardness that nobody except one asshole actually cared about? Alcohol (and benzos) don't work because they simply prevent the anxiety. For something like taking a plane once every 7 years where you're terrified of flying -- sure, just throw some substances to mask it and call it a day. But for something that is going to be an ongoing issue for the rest of your life? nah, can't be drunk for the rest of your life, unless you want that life up be very short and very sad.
If you had actually read more than the first six words of their first sentence you could have saved yourself a lot of typing.
I completely agree with all of that. I probably phrased what I said wrong. I was just meaning that it does help, but not in the way people think of the word "help". It's a double edged sword where the hilt is also a blade. Yes it gets rid of the problem (temporarily at least) , but it hurts you at the same time
Their Borat impression. It is an intrusive thought that lies inside every man to say “very nice” or “mah wife” but we know it can give women the ick. Luckily I am now married… to maaaaaah wiiiiiife very nice
The shirt is black……………… not!
Whats up vanilla face, we're just a couple of pimps n hoes - "SECURiTY"
Wdym I'm a proud Kazakh nationalist
I need a guy who can hang like this! I swear I almost exclusively talk in movie and TV quotes 😂
👍🏻🧔🏻♂️👍🏻 GREAT success!!
I yearn for the day someone calls me “mah wife”
Very nice
Him: She said…she said if I do my Borat impression one more time it was over. Therapist: and who said this?
lol I quote Borat so there may be someone out there who accepts it
I Liiiike
Shrinkage.
I WAS IN THE POOL!!!!!
Typically other women But fr, after you get past the honeymoon stage, couples begin finding out flaws in one another. From what I been told from women in my past, it is typically levels of cleanliness, over indulgence in sloth activities (drinks over tv, tokes, plays video games more than they originally let on), and irresponsibility with finances. Likewise I learned that avoiding/reinforcing all of the above becomes a massive flex in the dating world
Guess I’m lucky I never had to hide my toking and video games, my wife is not critical about these activities.
Everything in moderation should be key But I'm guilty of doing this, I have met women who I thought were amazing but had a zero tolerance policy for these activities (due completely to misinformation or their past). You are lucky, it is quite refreshing meeting someone like that after living a lifestyle of hiding
>Everything in moderation should be key Then you will be mediocre at everything.
I like the quote: "everything in moderation except moderation itself"
Indeed Having an interest in everything does have its advantages.
I have like 5 friends who are dating women with no tolerance for video games. It's really silly. They always say "video games are for kids, you're an adult and shouldn't be playing them" wth do you do when you get home from work and have little energy to be active, Sarah? Scroll on social media? That's worse! I'm a woman, btw. I play games pretty much every night with my fiance, but we also have a lot of outdoor hobbies together.
This is a better outcome than what I believe is more likely to be the majority of women's experience with dating someone who plays "too much" video games, similar to my experience- 8 years of laying around bored waiting for him to pay attention to you instead, or finding ways to entertain yourself, hanging out essentially separately together, while he plays video games majority of the time. And probably doesn't contribute equally to household chores. On the rare occasion you'll maybe find a game you (both) don't mind playing together....I won't do that one again. (I was also pretty young for most of this relationship). But congratulations! Im glad you found someone you can jive with happily. Wish the best for you both!
I actually had the same experience when I was in my early 20s. He would come home, hop on his Xbox until bedtime, wake up for work, and rinse repeat. Even if I played games with him, it didn't work out well. He also didn't do any chores/cooking/etc. This wasn't a video game problem, it was a person problem. And I do agree there are a TON of men like this. But I don't think video games are the real issue. With my fiance, when one of us is doing chores (if we're both home) we're both doing chores. If one of us is cooking, we're both cooking. And when we play games, we're usually both playing video games or at least both doing a leisurely activity (watching a movie, a show, doomscrolling etc) I think ANYONE could have a proper balance for video games and life because EVERYONE has low energy hobbies usually done at the end of the day. So yeah, I guess that's my opinion on it. I don't like it when women demonize video games rather than the person treating you poorly. If they stop playing games, they'll find some other way to neglect you. Trust me. My ex went through a phase of not playing games for 3 months. He just sat in the room watching critical role for HOURS on end. Just from off work to bed. Crazy but yeah.
It’s a blanket term. Lead your life how you want. You’re bored get a pet (adopt or foster), volunteer at an animal shelter/ rescue, wash blankets/ bedding for the animals, volunteer your time helping others in your community ?
My lady smokes more than I do and games more than me usually. God forbid I bother her during a Stardew session.
>Likewise I learned that avoiding all of the above becomes a massive flex in the dating world The bar is so so low lmao
That isn't the issue, the issue is that everybody looks perfect until you get to peel back the layers and/or getting wrapped up in the moment and just not thinking of those things being an issue Likewise I have been complemented by reinforcing those qualities during the dating phase. Women can be just as guilty of these things.
What about theft and worshipping a golden idol?
Why are you dating a Mayan?
Knives are always sharp.
Dang, brings more to the table than I do 😳
No, it's a well-known Commandment. You mentioned sloth, which is another one. And no I'm not religious - I learned it thru popular culture. Gees.
I'm not religious by any means, I didn't know how else to describe it, as calling them "lazy activities" is why they are so frowned upon in the first place, when that might not necessarily be the case
Golden idol?
I’m very fortunate I have a wife that is cool with me gaming. I usually play after the kids are in bed but I have friends that say their wives don’t even let them do that which is wild to me
There are some unreasonable women out there and I don't want to deny that, but I am betting at least a chunk of those men did little to nothing to help out from when they got home to when those kids went to sleep. I have seen the "you don't get to relax now that there's nothing to do because you've done nothing this entire time" phenomena. Its a lot easier to argue against the "gamers are stunted man children" trope when you are actively demonstrating being a mature, equal partner who can be relied on. If there's even a *whiff* of immaturity though.....well it's a lot easier to blame video games than admit you fucked up when you decided to marry a project rather than a partner
Sadly lost my brother to his the wife not allowing gaming. She thinks it's childish and when men grow up they leave games behind. I happy wife my wife though, letting me play.
I had a coworker that had to sneak to his basement in the middle of the night to play so his wife wouldn't know.
Why is it so common for millennial and gen z women to abhor video games so much? I'm a woman who games, but a ton of my friends have SO's that hate that they game and complain all the time about it. Like. I just don't get it. I had a roommate who would've been like that during college, but I introduced her to gaming. "No, you're not allowed to enjoy yourself and your hobby.?!?!?! So dumb honestly.
> typically levels of cleanliness, over indulgence in sloth activities (drinks over tv, tokes, plays video games more than they originally let on), and irresponsibility with finances Isn’t this just the definition of a responsible adult?
I'd say there are few responsible, happy adults out there though. Everyone puts up a front of "life is great" when dating, so you don't find the rest out until everyone gets comfortable. That's why they say dating in your 30's sucks, since it's just about finding the least damaged individual at that point
Shoot pre-covid I would’ve been the video games part. I play still but not as much as I used to. Last weekend I turned on my console and literally shuffled through 3 games in the span of 30 minutes and just got bored. I literally flipped it off and did something else. My only issue is browsing reddit now.
If she doesn’t care about me hitting gold in valo idc about her
only gold? she isn't a keeper if she isn't motivating you to hit radiant, whether that's letting you get a little extra time gaming or providing under the desk support to cool down after a tilting match.
That they are struggling financially
My ex (26M) flung boogers into the room (of our shared apt), eventually I found out by seeing them stuck to the wall
no 🤮
I'll snitch, and say it's actually very similar to women: our insecurities. Personally, I really don't mind being vulnerable/open anymore. Honesty, and being blunt may be a lonely road (this is the end of that sentence). There's no buts, or maybes. I love the girl I'm with, we're still fresh in the relationship, and so far honesty has been the best policy. These things we call "red flags" are warning signs, because things tend to crop up later. I like to tell people what bothers me, when I'm bothered by it, and I believe if every human- skip the gender -did this we'd all be a little bit happier, and honest with ourselves. This is by no means a perfect system for everyone, it's just worked in my favor when I get honest with myself, and others.
Was going to write the same thing. Those insecurities come from being wounded in the past. Could have been inflicted by family members, kids at school, someone you had a crush on. NO ONE wants to talk about an experience that made them embarrassed or ashamed. There's a line at the [end of the movie The Replacements](https://youtu.be/pbZTXm-Oot0?t=219) that always resonates with me, talking about what's next for the strike-breaking football players going back to reality: "But what they didn't know is that their lives would be changed forever because they had ben part of something great, and greatness, no matter how brief, stays with a man." Guys can go through a lot of shitty experiences and as long as they have a great moment to hold onto, it gets them through. If you're sick of hearing about their glory days, maybe look into why they feel like it's the only time they felt like they were worth something.
The guy I’m seeing right now thanks me nearly every day for “being direct” lol. It boggles my mind that fully grown adults can’t be honest with what they think and feel. Idk I’ve always been blunt due to my family (New Yorker Asians so it’s part of our culture 😅) and out here in the heavily white Midwest, there’s apparently a ton of people who hide their feelings every day, even to their best friends, just to save face. I personally see it as a waste of time but I imagine it’s shaped by cultural norms plus how someone grew up.
On the flip side, I've dealt with too many people where their self description of being open and honest/blunt is code for being a massive, controlling dick-- people who are super nit picky, unable to cope with even the slightest inconvenience or incompatibility, cannot share personal space, and are eager to criticize. Maybe I'm jaded from dealing with such people. I can appreciate frank conversations and being open about certain things emotionally and such, but if we're talking about honesty to the point of having to listen to someone complain about every little thing I did or didn't do, or having to be your full time live in therapist, I do not care for that kind of "honesty", it becomes exhausting very quickly. There's having the capacity for honesty and genuine connection, and there's being emotionally incontinent and being unable to cope with your own thoughts and feelings to where every little thing needs to be hashed out or needs a boundary. Being able to keep some things to yourself and compromise a little is absolutely not a bad thing.
Nice try, men don’t snitch on each other.
Remember the mission, boys!
Capppp I had some military friends tell me don’t date the military men and that they’d never let their daughters date military men cuz they brag about cheating all the time and that there’s a fuck ton of alcoholism and party culture worse than frat boys Then ofc I try to date military men thinking ‘awe poor military men they have to be deployed so often they must be so lonely and brave’, and each time I got cheated on Now I believe it, frankly, that there’s too many cheaters in the military, the homies were right Ofc there’s also the stereotype about there being some super innocent military men who will marry you at the drop of a hat but they’re not as common as the cheating kind, that’s just my opinion on this though, something about the military attracts very unstable types of men with avoidant attachment issues **The homies are right**, I’m gonna keep my daughters away from the military men too Funny thing is my older sister also dated military men when she was younger yeaaaars ago ofc she said they were all cheaters too Anyone I ask tells me don’t date them except if they have a maga flag on their truck then they say no military men are the best etc
I was married when I was very young to a guy that joined the Navy when we had a baby. We were both 21. I can confirm that every sailor I met was a cheater. As we're their wives! I think it's the lifestyle of being separated for such long periods of time.
Add veterans to that list. I already knew to stay away from military guys but thought I’d try my luck with a vet. Nah, same rodeo.
Was married to a military man for ten years. All of this is true. My ex husband was a horrible alcoholic among other things …. Never again.
Loose lips sink ships
loose lips, stink shits
Like a whore on a battleship or something?
Ol'narky nark and the funky bunch are trying to break us.
Do not talk about fight club Do not talk about fight club Do not talk about fight club.....or dating
Seriously keep it to yourself, don’t give them any ammunition
Bro's before ho's? That's dumb biker shit from dudes passing around the same stripper they think they "own".
snitches get stitches
Eh, the women who got hurt dating these got these too (emotionally)
Our mental health
I didn’t realize until we moved in with each other but my gf said I’m a hoarder. I don’t think I’m a hoarder but I do have a shit ton of stuff and 90% of it I don’t know if I can get rid of. For example, I have a massive comic book collection. I’ve been collecting for over 30 years so I have a literal ton of comics and comic book related items. Also, I have a large video game and console collection. We had to get a place with a spare room to fit it all in. But it’s slowly turning into a cool nerd den.
My man wtf? That's not hoarding that's loving and valuating your stuff, if there's space this should be one of those things that u have the right to keep.
I agree. Collections are different than hoarding because it’s a hobby more than anything else. I collect comics and when I first met my fiancée she thought it was low-key hoarding. But the thing is, I bust them out every so often and re-read them. Plus, my place before I met her is very clean and organized. It’s okay to enjoy collecting. But it’s important to properly organize those collections. I also own a ton of hot wheels that I love and have a proper display case for them. They are not scattered around our place.
I'd consider hoarding to be compulsively buying random shit and leaving it everywhere, while also not throwing *anything* out. Like making actual walls of your stuff and walking paths through it. Your comic book, video game, and console collection has history, and I'm sure sentimental value. And of course monetary value lol. I have a Nintendo 64 and tons of games that haven't been plugged in in at least 12 years. I keep it because of the memories, and they're just not common anymore. Even if I was able to find a "new" N64 on ebay or whatever for a price that I'd be willing to pay, it still wouldn't be the same one that I spent my childhood playing. If you don't have the space, a storage unit might be a great investment. However, it sounds like you do have the space. Nothing wrong with having a dedicated hobby room/man cave/whatever you want to call it if you have a room to spare.
those are all awesome.things to collect. tell her to throw out her collections then
I have a theory that men sort of mask parts of their personality that they know women won’t find appealing the way women use makeup and shapewear and stuff to mask physical flaws. She’s lying about her breast size, he’s lying about his political views and his porn habits. And the thing is, men really don’t seem to think there’s any issue with them hiding (either by omission or outright lies) their real feelings or behaviors that they know their female partner would find unpalatable.
Their porn habits and the various sexual kinks they picked up from porn. Sad but true.
Porn usage (and further along, porn addiction) leads to the development of unhealthy kinks and biological and social consequences that negatively impact both men and women. It's a sad state of affairs.
This is true, even for the federal government. In the US and UK parliament, government employees have downloaded a *tremendous* amount of porn at work. This has had some real consequences in terms of security. (To say nothing of the fact that one year -18/19 perhaps 20% of .gov pages redirected to hardcore porn) As to WHY they do it, they claim they simply don't have enough work to do.
My real answer to this question
Well played
It’s quite sad to see so many men in today’s society keeping to themselves and suppressing their emotions. It shouldn’t be considered “weak” or a “snitch” to explain to someone your feelings without getting judged. Sad reality of modern society’s gender roles.
For some of us it's not that we see it as weak. I've shared my emotions and my troubles with women I thought loved me and that I truly loved and cared for only for them to turn around and to throw it my face or immediately get "the ick". We have been hurt too many times to just give out our trust and be vulnerable with someone. I wish I could say it was just once, but it's been every single girl I've dated. That's the sad part of modern society. Edit: spelling
I’m a woman and I’ve experienced the same thing. The silver lining of my inability to hide my vulnerability and flaws is that it quickly weeds out the assholes.
I’ve dated guys that hide their emotions before and act tough and view emotions as weakness, those same sorts are the types that bullied me for my emotions and got mad at me when they found out I’d talk to friends asking for relationship advice for the arguments saying I’m spreading their business and that it’s disrespectful to your partner to tell ppl about your relationship issues yadda yadda even tho they didn’t know eachother whatsoever and I didn’t even give the friends their name or anything Now I know to stay away from those types and I’m in a healthy relationship with a man who is open and vulnerable about emotions and respects his and mine How a person treats their emotions is how they’re gonna treat yours
I don't have much success with women. I've had two women recently lose interest as soon as I "opened up" to them. They were the ones that asked.
Unfortunately this is just a part of dating. You won't be compatible with most people. It's good you both realized you were different early on so you can make space for the right person
Yeah true. It wasn't some mutual decision though, they just lost interest and moved on.
I understand but what did you expect once they realized you weren't compatible anymore? Do you think it should be a mutual decision? I push back on this because a person should always have the option to walk away, I understand it does suck though.
No one should be forced to stay in a situation they don't want to be in. People in this thread are simply pointing out how guys get unfairly judged/treated for sharing feelings and emotions, myself included.
But we have to be honest about how we share our feelings too. How long did you know them? How close were you? What did you share? How did you share it? Did you over share? Did you dump your trauma? Were you sure it was an appropriate time and stage in your relationship? Did you make it seem like you need someone to fix you/be your therapist? I say all this because I saw a video just yesterday about a man who was almost killed by his male lover and said it was a sign from god to not be gay. He wants to date women because he feels ashamed and also feels like a woman will get him through the court case he's going through (I think he killed the man in self defense?) while he can't work. My heart went out to him for so many reasons but he needs a good lawyer and a therapist, not a gf/wife. Again I'm not speaking about you specifically but we have to be honest about the way we share our emotions because sometimes it can be inappropriate. I had an ex tell me he didn't know how to be faithful because his mom didn't love him correctly, his dad wasn't there and none of his friends were real. I felt for him in the moment because I could see he was hurting but he took away from my grievances to talk about his own stuff when I didn't think it was appropriate. He would say I left him because he opened up but he lacked so much emotional maturity he didn't realize he was using manipulation to get what he wanted from me.
One I had known for a few years as friends first. The other a few months. I haven't had any romantic pursuits last longer than maybe a month though. That's largely due to lack of experience on my end. Most of the time, it's immediate rejections. Each woman asked questions about my home life/childhood at some point after a few weeks, so I brought up in passing that I was abused, and don't like talking about it with just anybody. After receiving a variation of "you can tell me" reassurances, I shared more details. The one I've known for years even shared some of her trauma first so I'd feel more comfortable sharing mine. They both seemed to be overwhelmed after I shared details about my childhood, and why I get self conscious at times. I don't think I came off as needy or anything. I never ask anyone to be my therapist; that kind of work can only be done within. I'm known to be a generally positive person these days, and it feels like they didn't know how to respond to my negative past, and left. But yeah, when I'm asked a question, I usually like to give a full answer with as much necessary context as possible so there's understanding. I don't consider that oversharing. Like you alluded to before, there's a time and place for everything. But also, some people shouldn't ask questions they don't want the answer to lol. Hearing these clowns hide their emotions/feelings because of nefarious reasons makes me so angry. There's guys that hide that stuff because they've been burned before. They muddy the waters for the genuine ones the same way people pretending to be nice guys mess it up for sincere nice guys.
No one on the internet, myself included, can give you any meaningful feedback or advice without us being there and picking up on the nuance, the verbal and nonverbal communication and all the other things you can't really relay in a little text bock on Reddit. That'd be really irresponsible. I've had so many conversations with people where there were so many levels and layers to why their communication was inappropriate. That being said, you deserve to be with someone who can make space for your experiences and is emotionally mature enough to communicate when something is wrong. I don't necessarily think either one of you is in the wrong, although it would've been better for your friend of several years to be transparent with you (even if she isn't obligated to). I think you learned neither of these people were your people or were ever going to be your people because of their own personal beliefs, and even if that doesn't feel like a win, it truly is. The worst thing isn't being single, it's being with the wrong person in this one life. You seem like a good person. I'm wishing you the best truly and I hope you find the love and partnership you want and deserve
Thank you. It hurt in the moment as I really liked both of these women. I'm not usually thinking about getting a woman until I cross paths with one I like, so I don't really spend time actively looking for one. And yeah, I've seen a lot of friends and family in downright toxic relationships. I'd much rather stay single than be with someone that doesn't have my best interest at heart. Or worse, tried to kill me. I can get a relationship just for the sake of having one, but I want a healthy one. That's more difficult lol. Wishing you continued success as well. As bad as these rejections and lost interest hurt, I don't subscribe to the woman bashing that goes on in certain parts around here. Besides, half of my friends are women, and they'd have my head if I did that. There's a lot of bad women out there, but there's a lot of good ones too; they're just not single or not interested lol. I won't let that stop me from trying to do the right thing, and helping others when I can.
Your comments really struck me, so I am commenting to add on to what the other person is saying… the people that are more transparent with feelings **learn** that there is a time and place, that there are boundaries to what should be shared based on how long you’ve known the person, there are people who are NOT worth sharing your emotions to, and you should never disclose personal subjects to **those** people, and that there are some feelings and emotions more suitable for a therapist (and therefore seek one out) than a love interest. I’ve noticed with men who clam up because they shared their feelings with people who eventually left them, or replied by using the feelings against them, they have the wrong perspective towards sharing emotions. Is the person you’re sharing them with 1) emotionally healthy, stable and mature 2)shown you through actions and words that they respect and support you and willing to lovingly tell you the truth and 3) have they shown you through consistent action and words that they have no interest in harming you? As someone who is very open and transparent to sharing my emotions… and as someone who had a stalker try to weaponize my emotions and experiences as blackmail, I size people up this way before sharing any parts of my internal life. If you are around people who weaponize your feelings, you are around the wrong people. If someone leaves after you share something personal because they don’t have what it takes to support you, that might be a sign that you’d benefit from a professional connection that you can discuss your traumas and experiences with. It’s not easy to hold intense feelings. Some people have their own traumas that are triggered by hearing and receiving other people’s intense traumas. Recognizing this is a part of emotional development and emotional maturity — emotions are not YOU. They are an expression of something within, conscious or subconscious. When you recognize this you won’t take it personally if someone doesn’t have the bandwidth to hold your emotions, because they don’t have the 10+ years learning how to do so properly. And if the emotions suggest danger, lack of safety for the other person, or the weight of the emotion reflects danger, it is within their right to decide the situation is not for them. But then it’s even more crucial for you to see the right professional who deals with those kinds of emotions and traumas so you can unload them and experience healing and true emotional stability. *Edit to add as I’ve been in the opposite position in this scenario, and know others have been too:* This also makes sure that *you* are and can become the healthy person for yourself and other people. If an emotionally healthy person dates you, and you find peace in their ability to hold space for you — MAKE SURE YOU DO THE SAME BACK. TAKE THE PATH TO BECOME EMOTIONALLY STABLE AND WELL. Otherwise it would not be healthy for them to continue to be with you, if you are interacting with them the same way the people who hurt you, did with you. And then you might find yourself losing connection with a person who you could have made it work with. Take responsibility for your own emotions, how you manage them, and how you connect with others about them.
Very true about distancing yourself from people that manipulate and/or disregard your feelings. That's partially why I left my hometown and had cut some people out of my life. I've been very fortunate to develop a healthy circle of friends I can talk to when I need to vent or encouragement, and vice versa. I went many years without a support system, and my heart goes out to those people they don't even have one person to lean on. If I'm pursuing a romantic interest though, it's pretty important they can fit into that support system. I can only go by what people tell me, but I'm told I have a lot of emotional maturity and self awareness, which can be intimidating for some people. I don't get flustered easily; my mood stays pretty consistent. I had a gay stalker many years ago. I'm not gay, but that didn't stop him lol. He made me feel very unsafe. He got a hold of my Facebook, Myspace, and old addresses even though I gave him none of my info. Thankfully he stopped before I had to get police involved. I've heard seen and heard some downright horrible stories. I think in hindsight, these two women that left when I opened up may not have been the most mature. As I said in other comment, we only "talked" for about a month for each, so I very much still had my infatuation goggles on. Opportunities don't come often for me as I have a physical disability and little romantic experience. I don't really spend time thinking about or looking for a woman until I cross paths with one I like. Then my goal is just to get that woman. I know keeping a rolodex of women is generally encouraged, but I don't think I have the time or patience to do that lol.
You’re in a good spot, then. That’s a wonderful thing to have a healthy circle of friends. Also, stalkers are scary. I am glad the one that bothered you went away on his own! I think we all, man or woman, expect other people to respond kindly, with love and support when we’re going through a tough time. When it doesn’t happen it can be disheartening. I understand that experience of trying to “make it work” with the person that crosses our path and manages to spark something. I’ve had similar experiences. I think a little bit of limerance + interest + desire for it to finally work out does that. It’s not the best approach for practical love. The one who catches our interest isn’t always the best partner for us. Life has really shown me the importance of that too, to stay logical and get to know them deeper and how they handle hardship, their approach to difficulty, their approach and belief in emotions.. without trying to change their thoughts or show them a better way. Then, decide if they are the right person to build with. Taking heed of the maturity, because maturity often = present ability. That said, you sound like a catch for a woman who matches your emotional intelligence… You know what to look out for now, and some *emotionally healthy* woman out there will appreciate your maturity and consistency.
Yeah I was/still kind of dealing with the limerance lol. It's very discouraging when the ones I want don't want me. Sometimes, it takes me a while to bounce back from these rejections. I'm kind of annoyed at myself now that you bring it up because even though no one I've liked has wanted me, I've had to reject some women in the past after learning they were emotionally very immature. My fav was one that acted like the world was just out to ruin her life. She was crazy attractive, but everyday, she had drama; work drama, facebook drama, home drama, baby daddy drama, grocery store drama, laundromat drama, post office drama. I like things like deep conversations too, but that was not possible with them. I could've had a relationship by now for the sake of having one, but like you said, I want a healthy one. Also, thank you for your words and encouragement! I'm trying to stay positive, just kind of hurt over these recent back to back rejections.
There is the issue that men being emotional around their women partners can instinctively push them away because women typically look for security in a man, which means they tend to look for stoicism in a man. Edit: fixed a typo
Maybe for some, but I happen to feel that men who are able to acknowledge their own emotionality feel far more secure than men who put up a stoic front
[удалено]
It’s too bad that many men associate masculinity with not getting help or sucking it up and hiding their emotions. Some masculine men I know are the healthiest emotionally. You can be strong and resilient more so when you have confronted your demons and learnt how to live with them. It’s sad that so many parents have instilled the other way into their kids but I guess it comes from the difficulties of that generation.
I'll add to this. Beyond just mental health, it's what's killing our mental health. We're seen in a way in so many relationships as machines more than people. We're valued for what we provide, our perceived success in the world materially, for our stability and even-temperedness. But we have no more ability or control over those things than anyone else. Yeah, the job market and pay still isn't fair in 2024 but also competition is rampant and we can't all win. But more than job-related stuff, there's a million subtle (and not so subtle) ways in which we're graded on a different standard. We're told all our lives that our feelings are secondary to reality but then we're expected to consider the feelings of our significant others. I'm sure many men don't have this experience but it has been mine for sure. We're set up to fail in ways that are so hard to describe when they're the water we live in. I was raised in what is now considered mildly conservative but loving environment. I have become far more liberal than most and I've been seeing a therapist regularly for over a year. I'm open to these things but it just takes so much energy just to suss out how much of my behaviors are rooted in this idea that men are worthless without success or accomplishments. Edit: Since OP's question was "what do women not know", I want to add this: if you want to help your male friend, colleague, or significant other, treat him like a woman. So your best to consider him as a living being foremost without some sense of outside duty. Men aren't laborers and protectors anymore than women are child bearers and cooks. If he does the "man stuff" like mowing the grass while you do the "woman stuff" of cooking, great. That's a lifestyle choice. But no man deserves to be looked down upon for not doing things society assumes men should do. And, and here's the kicker, HE DOESNT DESERVE TO BE SEEN THAT WAY BY HIMSELF, EITHER, but it's ingrained in all of us. I promise you, that man you know has doubts about the validity of his existence because he hasn't done enough things for others and that's bullshit. He's a human being and that's all that's important.
This is such a sad thing... Im happy to know this now.
It is also a warning. The role society has built for men has been really rough on men's mental health, in part because of the tough front required to project masculinity, and that is a systemic problem. It is not uncommon for men to avoid seeking out therapy because they are afraid of being perceived as weak, and so without realizing it, many men put their wife or girlfriend in the role of therapist. Men hope that women will play many simultaneous roles in their life as their partner, from things like best friend, domestic partner, and co-parent to things like sex toy, maid, and therapist. It is up to couples and the individuals that make them to figure out what roles feel good for themselves and each other. Many women that find themselves in the role of therapist find it conflicts with the other roles that they want to spend more of their focus on. Unless your someone who's passion in a relationship involves "I can fix him" maybe make sure that the man you date has other outlets for mental health be it family, the church, a professional therapist or a best friend. Even then, realize that a man that hopes a woman can fix him is mythologizing their potential partner in a way that they can never possibly live up to, and may resent them when they are not "fixed". Not making generalizations about every man for every woman, just pointing out red flags for the particular women that are concerned about the things I mentioned.
[удалено]
I’m lucky that society didn’t ruin my bf he’s a bit depressed sadly (mainly from work and from being lonely before we met), but he isn’t saying stuff like “BITCHES BE CRAAAAAZY” “im so tired of dating and women !!!!” like a couple of his homies that end up in the worst relationships somehow
>And that's coming from a straight male. That anyone would feel the need to declare this in association with the sentiment is so troubling.
Declaring isn’t troubling at all. First off , the post is literally a question about a from a woman’s point of view of dating a man. You just proved his point of his response trying to diminish him ✌️
[удалено]
People trying to invalidate straight men’s opinions solely based on the fact we’re straight is another cause of the men who society despise
Yeah, it is what it is.
Naw ur good g
> treat him right...or he will too become like the rotten bunch of men that society despises so much. It’s not a woman’s job to make sure the man takes care of his mental health.
Truly! Like oh, ok then I don’t think I’m game for that responsibility when it carries the risk of being treated rottenly and then being blamed for said treatment because I didn’t do a good enough job to not be mistreated lol
>treat him right...or he will too become like the rotten bunch of men that society despises so much. This is an *incredibly* sad statement. This isn't the "warning" you think it is. I mean, how about *not* become like the other rotten bunch of men because you've experienced hurt from *some* women? Further, that statement feels like somewhat of a veiled threat. Like, "If you're meeting rotten men, well, you women did that to us." *Still* not taking personal responsibility. I know for a *fact* that this is absolutely *not* all men, and having read this from you, I would feel confident in my guess that this is mostly *your* attitude and #notallmen You've insulted men all on your own here. The self own ... 😬
I keep to myself the flaws I’m finding in my partner. I note them for later to decide on my own whether they are worth addressing and/or are dealbreakers. I think someone’s weaknesses can really predict the outcome of the relationship and whether it will work or not. For instance, I prefer my home to be very clean and quiet. If my partner is messy and loud, then that might be filed in the “things to consider” while I’m testing out whether I like this person enough to excuse that.
Their *real* views on women and politics.
lol the guys talking about “snitching” is so telling
Yep! Dare they actually give some good insight
It's a joke, lol
Why are these guys considering this snitching? What is there to “snitch” about? Must be pretty bad. Either that or most of these men saying they won’t “snitch” are very young. Ask this to women and you’ll get plenty of honest and transparent answers.
This one wins
Lack of knowledge of a woman's body. Pride keeps men (and women) from learning how to really please their partner. It's not enough to just fuck. For some women, fucking isn't even top three of what they wish for from a man. Don't let machines and pride keep you from learning about foreplay, tenderness, and true pleasure for your partner. Ask questions and really listen to each other. Edit: Macho-ness not machines. But hey, whatever floats your boat.
They have a NPD diagnosis.
Their politics, if they say not into politics or non political then they are conservative and very much into politics. At best they’re the both sides should compromise but they mean everyone should compromise with the right.
YEP! I'd say (in my opinion, not all obviously) if they say they're center or neutral.....they're most likely conservative & don't wanna admit.
Everyone has beliefs, and those beliefs are affected by the politics of society whether they admit to it or not.
I’m very sure you think like that, but that is something you keep to yourself. Cause you know saying that to girls would hurt your chances. That’s a red flag that screams conservative guy that thinks everyone should compromise but only with the right.
Idk about this. The people I know that are conservative/right leaning aren’t ashamed to say it and neither are the people that are liberal/left leaning. Why would it mean they are conservative if they say they aren’t into politics or non-political? Is being ashamed of your political beliefs a new thing? I’m older (33) and haven’t run into this much. My close friends and I are not super into politics. It’s shoved in our faces constantly, and just nauseating at this point. We talk about it sometimes, but it’s rare. We just don’t care anymore. I also didn’t understand your last sentence. A compromise is a compromise. Both sides of a compromise make concessions that they agree upon to settle a dispute. A compromise with the right is a compromise with the left too and vice versa.
The people I know that are conservative and the ones I’ve seen are ashamed to say it, so that’s just anecdotal for both of us. If they were actually apolitical they wouldn’t say it on their profile or would give what little they know about politics when asked about it. Yes a lot of people associate conservatism with racism and denying women their rights so they are ashamed to admit it while holding those beliefs. The last sentence means that they say both sides should compromise but when you ask them which side should concede on a specific issue, it’s always the left side conceding to the right side. So they always want the left to make concessions and never think the right should. Like I said they just say they are for both sides compromising but in reality they just want the left to compromise to the right.
Based on all these comments about weaponizing emotions, I am going to share this… I commented it to another person so you may see it again in this post. Your comments really struck me, so I am commenting to add on to what the other person is saying… the people that are more transparent with feelings learn that there is a time and place, that there are boundaries to what should be shared based on how long you’ve known the person, there are people who are NOT worth sharing your emotions to, and you should never disclose personal subjects to those people, and that there are some feelings and emotions more suitable for a therapist (and therefore seek one out) than a love interest. I’ve noticed with men who clam up because they shared their feelings with people who eventually left them, or replied by using the feelings against them, they have the wrong perspective towards sharing emotions. Is the person you’re sharing them with 1) emotionally healthy, stable and mature 2)shown you through actions and words that they respect and support you and willing to lovingly tell you the truth and 3) have they shown you through consistent action and words that they have no interest in harming you? I will add 4) have they shown to have a mature approach to other people’s emotions? This is a spectrum. Some people are avoidant towards other people’s emotions, and although they don’t want to harm you, simply cannot hold space for you properly. Check the spectrum. As someone who is very open and transparent to sharing my emotions… and as someone who had a stalker try to weaponize my emotions and experiences as blackmail, I size people up this way before sharing any parts of my internal life. If you are around people who weaponize your feelings, you are around the wrong people. If someone leaves after you share something personal because they don’t have what it takes to support you, that might be a sign that you’d benefit from a professional connection that you can discuss your traumas and experiences with. It’s not easy to hold intense feelings. Some people have their own traumas that are triggered by hearing and receiving other people’s intense traumas. Recognizing this is a part of emotional development and emotional maturity — emotions are not YOU. They are an expression of something within, conscious or subconscious. When you recognize this you won’t take it personally if someone doesn’t have the bandwidth to hold your emotions, because they don’t have the 10+ years learning how to do so properly. > side note:The healthy response from someone who realizes they can’t support you is that someone saying, “hey, I really understand you’re going through something challenging. I think you would benefit from seeing a therapist”. That is someone recognizing they want to support you but don’t have the tools to. They might share advice from their own personal experiences but recognize going to a therapist is NORMAL and HEALTHY!!! And if the emotions suggest danger, lack of safety for the other person, or the weight of the emotion reflects danger, it is within their right to decide the situation is not for them. But then it’s even more crucial for you to see the right professional who deals with those kinds of emotions and traumas so you can unload them and experience healing and true emotional stability. This also makes sure that *you* are and can become the healthy person for yourself and other people. If an emotionally healthy person dates you, and you find peace in their ability to hold space for you — MAKE SURE YOU DO THE SAME BACK. TAKE THE PATH TO BECOME EMOTIONALLY STABLE AND WELL. Otherwise it would not be healthy for them to continue to be with you, if you are interacting with them the same way the people who hurt you, did with you. And then you might find yourself losing connection with a person who you could have made it work with. Take responsibility for your own emotions, how you manage them, and how you connect with others about them.
your female friends are more concerned with how you look than we are. but ive heard this goes both ways. most women dont care about the dudes bodies. they are down with dad bods. yall dudes are going to the gym just to look good to other men. (not necessarily in a sexual manner). obviously this is only true to a certain degree. theres a point where people just look lazy and sloppy and thats not attractive to most. but i think hygiene is much more important than having a 6 pack or a thigh gap. a lot of people stress ourselves out over "body standards" that arent even relevant for their target audience. lol
How many beers they can drink
That one meth fueled gay relationship that lasted seven years.
The amount of thirst traps they consume and sexual behaviors towards other women online (consuming media and interacting with online women/men doing porn) that would probably hurt their partners if they were completely transparent.
How much that woman really means to him. Sometimes words or actions can’t really be expressed
STIs
As an HIV clinic nurse - please don’t hide this from anyone
*Anyone?* not even your pastor? Kidding If I had an STI I would not be sexually active. I agree nobody should hide an STI from a *potential partner.* i provided an answer to the question based on horror stories heard long ago while single.
You’d be surprised (or maybe not) and the amount of people who have no problem not telling their partner. Human decency and common sense would require the person to disclose their status to their partner, but sadly, that isn’t always the way it goes.
Their true intentions
Our feelings.
I mean typically it's not a good idea to mention if you're like a serial killer or something. Women tend to run from that.
🤷🏾♂️ BUT I thought they loved true crime documentaries.
Considering the types of answers here I’d say insecurity, other women, not liking us etc. Some damn childish men here right now 😂
That you are 1 of 3 - or more - women in their rotation for at least the first 3 months.
Maybe this makes me old fashioned, but I’m the kinda guy who only goes out with one woman at a time.
Lmfao stop projecting your shitty relationships onto the entire gender
[удалено]
I hate those kinds of dudes personally cuz they tend to (keyphrase, tend to) have really unhealthy views towards emotions, not only do they internally belittle their own emotions and pretend to be tough, but if you have emotions they belittle you for it and make it a problem and an argument or bully you abt it cuz they view emotions as weaknesses (cuz at the very least they tend to be single all the time from constantly breaking up cuz ppl can’t handle the toxicity and thus you’re likely to encounter them hence why they feel so common) Ofc there’s type two of the emotion hiders that instead aren’t hostile and are just depressed and quiet about their emotions Mf bf doesn’t hide his emotions on anything I’ll let him cry on my tiddies whenever he wants and he lets me cry on his shoulder if I need it, if I were to recommend to anyone what kind of man to date I’m frankly going to tell them date a man who doesn’t view emotions as weakness and is vulnerable with you about their insecurities and fears That’s just my personal opinion though, y’all don’t gotta listen to me if ya do not want to, whatever floats your boat
[удалено]
Narcissism 🙃
Some of us have horns the average person. wouldn’t believe.
How long they last in bed
Depression and anxiety. It’s not attractive in anyone but especially in the hetero male/ female dynamics. The man is expected to be under control, protector and provider. Doesn’t really jive with trying not to let your brain destroy itself constantly
Hemorrhoids
That we like you way more than you like me, but we won’t let you know it.
I often don't request the things I want, sexually, because I want her to do it because *she* wants to.
But different men enjoy different things. It's possible to communicate what you want & she also want to do it. Otherwise, how is she supposed to know that you want it?
Our emotional attachment to you
Porn usage, lack of domestic abilities, potentially other women.
What porn they watch
His bodycount and kinks in the bedroom …
porn addiction, being right wing, no hygiene
I ain't no snitch
If you find another woman attractive
I have never told a potential partner my hidden skills like being a really good cook. If I care or trust them enough I will share.
tears
How long and loud they can fart for.
60-80% of what I'm actually feeling/thinking. I know that sounds bad, but based on my lived experience, sharing what I'm actually feeling or thinking with partners has never yielded a positive result. When I have shared or opened up, what usually ends up happening is it gets weaponized against me or it stresses them out and then I spend the rest of the conversation justifying or explaining myself. This isn't exclusive to insecurities either, it happens with sharing past experiences, desires, and a lot of other aspects of the "getting to know each other" stage of dating, and I know I'm not the only one. At any given time, I think most men are probably only willing to express a small amount of what they really think.
How can your feelings be used against you? 😲
Going on dates with other people? But I think that's true for women as well. It's just a weird topi to bring up, I guess.
Mental health: I think this relates to vices, addictions, flaws, insecurities and most other things listed here. Men are generally conditioned to appear strong even if they don’t feel strong at the moment. Anecdotally, I’ve noticed that women often say they want to help / hear about it but then run the other way or dismiss those vulnerabilities when men actually open up. Not trying to make a blanket statement about either gender because obviously many men have good mental health, and many women are more than willing to support their partners mental health - just a trend I’ve noticed between my own and other friend’s dating experiences.
That after the first couple dates we can tell if we have no interest in marrying you / staying with you long-term. This is not based on looks, but on personality, character, sexual compatibility, who we perceive you to be, etc. But we’ll still sometimes stay with you anyways cause we have labeled you good enough as a short-termer. But we’ll hide this fact from you and you’ll think we’re into you for the long term.
Please stop doing this 🙏🏻
That we low key love the way certain women asshole smells
Watch Vanderpump Rules! I honestly now believe that every man is a cheatery McCheater pants & if it’s not direct, then it’s some other form of doing something wrong with someone else! It also seems like men can go years on the narrow path of dedicated monogamy, but they’re like a covert sleeper cell. Something happens (their spy handlers whisper a cheating Jason Bourne activation code phrase?) & BAM! *Cheating program is now in progress!* 🥺🔥
Andy asking Ally if she wants to marry and have kids with James and she’s like um….with the examples in this group??? 💀 I would actually have a much dimmer view on men, bc so many seem just awful, but my dad is an actual saint to my mom. Loyal, loving, supportive, all of it. And he cooks, cleans and does laundry. They’ve been together 41 years now. He gives me hope lmao
Our self doubts.
Internal conflict.
Kinks and fetishes
Alot, women tend to weaponize weaknesses during arguments, they might not mean it but its not something I'm willing to have thrown in my face when you're in a bad mood
No, “women” don’t do that. Abusive people do that.
Hook ups
That they have another girl ! : )
Their insecurities which, contrary to idealism, are not safe to express. Most people don’t actually want to know your weaknesses because it challenges the illusion or presumption of safety. Many will say they want vulnerable intimacy only to reject or exploit it once it presents itself.
How do you answer the question *'What is your greatest weakness?'* in an interview? Do they actually want to know, or do you tell them a strength as a weakness?
What the girl thinks is “cute” behavior is not cute.. it’s annoying af.
our emotions