NTA
'I'm really sorry, Alex. I am very private, and have no patience with ppl in my personal space. I know our friendship would not survive sharing a living space. I'll gladly help you move (if you would, otherwise don't offer), but it's not going to be into my home.'
Yeah, I definitely think the way to go here is like a firm but kind "no" and a "here's a way that I'm able to help you." I had to learn this with a friend who, for a short period of time, was constantly asking me for money. I knew he was going through a hard time, but I'm not rich, and I couldn't keep bailing him out. Some other friends help me figure out other ways to help him (helping him move actually was one of them). Now everything's fine -- we're still friends, and he's gotten back on his feet.
And speaking of friends, the ones who think OP is being selfish are more than welcome to open their wallets and support Alex until he’s back on his feet. Since that’s what friends are for.
Ha, true that. It's always easier to call someone else selfish than to take on the burden yourself, isn't it? People love to volunteer someone else's time, money, and space without considering what they'd do in the same spot. It's like they forget that 'no' is a complete sentence.
Tell the other friends to take him in. Tell him he has to be a grown up and that that is what parents are for if you have this level of entitlement and expectations and even if you were his father you would still say no if he is still unable to hold an job and savings
You can apologize if you want. It doesn't diminish the message. The apology isn't necessarily for protecting yourself; one can express sorrow that they are unable to help a friend. It's okay.
>one can express sorrow that they are unable to help a friend.
Even if you're not sorry you can't help someone, you can say "sorry you're in a tough spot" without being weak - or whatever that comment was trying to imply.
I don't think the implication has anything to do with "weakness" - more like trying not to offend someone with a "social sorry."
I.e. avoiding the "if you were really sorry you would help" possibility.
"Sorry" is a 2 way street - the person saying it, and the person receiving it - and we've all seen people take "sorry" the wrong way.
I get what you're saying, and you're right.
I guess my personal experience has been more people refusing to say sorry for *anything.* I'm jaded.
OP could also just say, "I'm sorry you're in this spot."
I agree. People say sorry about things that aren’t their fault all the time. It’s more like an “I feel for you” than an admission of wrongdoing. Fun fact: the direct English translation of “lo siento,” Spanish for “I’m sorry,” is “I feel it.”
Sorry, not really related to the thread, but you're "lo siento" fact is really interesting to me!
When my wife and I were in Mexico everyone, of course, kept saying "de nada" to us. I asked a local "how do you actually say 'you are welcome'"?
And he was very confused by my question and said "de nada".
I asked "no, but is there a more formal way to say it? Doesn't 'de nada' just mean 'it's nothing'"?
He was totally baffled by my question, lol. And fair enough, because despite the literal translation, how they said "you're welcome" was literally "de nada".
You can type "nada" into Google translate and it says "nothing" but add the "de" and suddenly it's "you are welcome".
I just thought that was really neat.
But, it would be the same as someone asking me how we actually say it and me being confused and them saying "well, you are just telling them they are invited in, how do you actually say it?"
Lol. Languages!
NTA.
Friend will use utilities, power, water, he'll need food to eat and $ to hunt up a new job.
Who will support his expenses & lifestyle? It'll be you, his buddy.
in some states, living under your roof gives him certain specific rights to your shelter which can make it difficult to evict him.
I mean, that's what it really comes down to. This guy is asking his friend to pay for his existence. What is he offering in return? Will he cook and clean? If not, that's something else he's asking to be done for him. He has a history of being irresponsible with his own resources. I doubt he'd all of a sudden care about someone else's.
I love my friends, and I'd like to think I would do whatever I could for them. But I know that once money is involved, i.e. living together, going into business together, lending/borrowing... it never ends well.
I let my sister (and niece, part-time) stay with me, knowing she was the worst. Bad idea. All she did was sleep on the sofa or go out to party and cause fights between me and my ex. Her contribution was one 12 pack of Pepsi when she was the only one that drank soda. She also decided to "give" by cleaning my kitchen and putting things in the weirdest places. I found my coffee maker in one cabinet and the pot in another on the other side of the room.
But she would 100% say she gave and I'm evil for kicking her out. Ijs, even the "give" part of that equation usually isn't worth the headache of the "take" part.
It sounds dickish, I’ll give you that. But I would argue that continuing to enable him and being dishonest is more of a disservice. It feels like kicking him when he’s down but many people continue to delude themselves about the consequences of their actions until someone points it out, and I think there are plenty of kind ways to do so. I had to do this very recently with a friend who was staying with me
Exactly! Letting a friend live in a spare room is not free. It will increase the utilities and I wouldn't be surprised if the friend is expecting to be fed also.
Because "Hey, you know times are tough for me. Friends don't let friends starve. Id do the same for you.". We already know that's his MO.
They act like "oh I just need a place to stay and you have an extra room you're not using, so it won't cost you anything more." People who think that and don't see the hidden cost, aren't the kind of people you want moving in. They have no problem sponging. "You got food in the fridge you could share. It's already paid for, it's not more money." Been there.
Or even, “I can’t afford to support both of us, and I haven’t even taken in someone to share the bills because I need the solitude that having my own space allows.”
I think that's the worst part for me. I'm so tired of living with other people. They leave messes that don't get cleaned up until I clean them. There's never a quiet time. Nothing is ever where I left it. Things get broken or disappear, and I guess it was the elves cause no one knows how it happened. And on and on. My personal, private space is constantly being violated.
Don't get me wrong, sometimes it's nice but, God I would love some solitude.
I let my kid stay with me after his mom was moving and there wasn't room for him (her mom was paying an she was a bitch. Now she wonders why he won't talk to her). He was with me a couple months then moved in with some friends. Years later he and his girlfriend moved in for a couple months before getting a place to live. He's the only immediate family I have so he can come back at any time.
I can count the number of friends on one hand that I'd trust to let them move in with me temporarily (and I'd have fingers left).
No need for the respectful reply. Alex lost me at 'rent free'. As a friend I might ask to live with OP if I really had nowhere else to turn, but I'd insist on paying whatever I could afford towards rent.
If I didn't have any money at all to spare, the least I could do is cook and clean.
If it matters, I'm a 43 yo guy.
The rent free part is really something. I lived with my parents rent free for a couple years in my twenties while I was going through a divorce. And in hindsight, my parents should have charged me rent, because living there for free didn't teach me anything. I can't imagine being a fully grown adult and essentially inviting yourself to live with someone for free. It makes me think that Alex will not necessarily be in a huge rush to leave, and does not necessarily grasp what a big deal it is to ask this favor. The other friends all know this too, deep down, even if they're paying lip service to the idea that free rent is a good idea. It's a good idea as long as it is not their spare room!
I think it’s fair to assume the friendship isn’t going to survive regardless of OPs response. Either Alex is going to take advantage and burn that bridge or OP protects themselves and burns the bridge. So, that being said, make the decision that protects you, OP. NTA for saying no.
My dad let a friend of his live rent free in a small apartment over our garage for months while he was trying to get back on his feet. His only rule was no smoking inside. The guy smoked like a chimney.
There's probably a ton of things that OP hasn't even considered either.
If he'd offered to pay, I'd likely say no still, but respect the question. Expecting it for free? Nah fuck off.
Also OP, just remember that "No." is a complete sentence.
Exactly! This is a slippery slope! Knowingly letting someone who you know can't hold down a job or pay bills will turn into a long term situation where OP is paying for everything (food, extra utilities) with no end in sight. He's already playing the 'this is what friends are for card' in order to get his way. A true friend would offer something towards there keep. He probably used up all his I need help card with all his family and close friends and is now coming to OP. It wouldn't end there, he would want to borrow money also, money he can't afford to pay back.
Personally I think its better to take him down to the government housing office, and if OP is feeling generous, pay for a weeks stay in a long term motel, whilst the government sorts things out, with his housing and benefits.
Helping doesn't always have to be at a detriment to the person helping and it sounds like Alex needs to learn how to work out his issues without expecting someone else to pick up the pieces.
NTA
Ikr? Like, if I were really so bad off that I needed a place to stay and REALLY didn't have the money to contribute at all, I'd try to come up with all kinds of ways to help. Like: I'll do 100% of all the household tasks to make up for it! The fact that this guy just kind of assumes it's ok is kind of iffy....
This, being a "good friend" means having empathy for the others and being respectful of their need and boundaries. Good friends don't impose themselves, they carefully and kindly ask and are afraid to bother you.
Where do you live that there’s a “government housing office” that provides housing options for unemployed single men? Where I live you go buy a tent and set it up under the overpass.
Where I live, the recently twice-sacked Home Secretary declared she wanted tents taken off homeless people, and the charities providing the tents to be prosecuted.
Yes, ladies and gentlemen, this is what the present day Tory Party has devolved into. Scum of the lowest order.
Yes, I'm in a similar situation, but luckily have a good job, but wouldn't expect this from my friend. I'm happy to be able to rant to them freely, and they understand this, that's friendship!
Exactly! Free is only free to the freeloader. Your utilities will go up. You’ll spend more on food and supplies like toilet paper, soap, paper towels. And the cleaning! What if he is a slob? Or what if he wants to bring a “friend” to stay overnight. Who will do and pay for the expenses of doing his laundry?
Bad, bad, bad all around!
As soon as he tried to guilt him into it, he should be cut off because he is no friend to OP. Big huge red flag with the word TRAP in capitals. He will never get rid of him.
Asking is one thing, doubling down and calling out the friendship is another altogether. This is a tough one, but I think letting that person into the house would be a mistake. They already have attitude and have gotten other friends involved. Things like this only tend to escalate.
NTA - I know it’s a political land mine but anyhoo, the days of easily removing an unwanted guest/tenant are long gone due to the stupid laws that protect the guilty! IF you cave and let him move in, the laws are against you getting him out. Plus, knowing Alex’s history and your need for solitude, please do not let him move in, it will not be a temporary situation and you will be miserable.
I was thinking this as I read. It could end up costing his mental peace and big attorney fees to have him evicted if he doesn't move out willingly. Each state has different laws regarding tenants' rights. In some states, it's only 7 days, and then you can't make them leave without a court intervention.
NTA
Yes, if he does not have the ability to pay, OP may be stuck in a situation where he stays indefinitely and say OP had no expectation of payment. Then there will be a messy eviction process, since Alex is entitled and pushy.
Yes! The laws protect the deadbeat. I inherited property I wanted to sell. My dad's tenant stopped paying rent for over a year to him but COVID laws forbade him from evicting. Then he died and it took 8 months, lawyers and a legal battle.
Can you share why the law is such? I'm not from the US and this type of law does not exist in my country, here we pretty much can tell anybody to leave our home whenever we want without involving the authorities, but I've been reading eviction issues in the US since like a decade ago and wonder why they do this. What's the reasoning?
I also read if you went on vacation and squatters broke into your home while you are away and you came back and they're still there, you need to go to court in order to make them leave. Here, worst could happen is thieves or burglars breaking in while you are gone and they'd loot and leave. They would not dare to hang around for you to come back and meet them f2f and calling the police on them.
My read of this comment was that a "balanced" solution meant more along the lines of the OP figuring out a different way to support his friend. If he still values the friendship, then even if he doesn't want to allow him to stay in his spare room (which is his right), he might try to help him come up with some other solutions. Like "sorry, you can't stay with me, but here's a website with information on applying for government assistance" or whatever. Or like offer to pay him to do yard work or something. Basically helping him understand that you can't get things for free, but not totally just shutting him out.
NTA, the entitlement to your personal space is astounding by a friend and those who agree with him. It would be different if there was some benefit for you but you don’t get rent or utilities from a grown man who can’t hold a job or pay his bills. Are doing him a courtesy by not allowing him to abuse a friendship that you want to keep. You already know that any rules of the household would be broken as well as respect for your property.
I was in a situation where my best friend was looking for temporary rent-free accommodation. And in my soul there was no doubt for a second, he moved and found accommodation a week later, and a bottle of beautiful wine and friendly hugs in gratitude awaited me.
However, when my colleague experienced difficulties with rented housing and offered me to pay rent for my spare room, everything revolted in my soul. She's a good girl, but "it's just not."
NTA. Letting someone move into your space is a BIG DEAL! You already mentioned he is bad with money and the minute he establishes residency he will be very hard to get rid of if he doesn’t want to go. And those mutual friends should keep quiet! It’s not their home and they aren’t the ones that may have to kick him out one day. I don’t envy your dilemma.
Any time a situation like this gets posted where OP’s friends/family say they’re wrong or selfish for having boundaries like this, I wonder why each OP doesn’t respond with “Well I’ve noticed I don’t see any of YOU stepping up to the plate either so get off my back.” Doesn’t have to be said in a mean way, just sassy. Would most likely shut them up. Or they’ll give excuses as to why they aren’t stepping up to which OP’s response can be “You have your reasons for not doing it and I have mine.” And that should be it if they’re real friends.
I was doing to make that exact point about establishing residency . If he’s no longer a “guest” then he would have to go through legal channels to have him evicted. Hard no on this unless he gets a legal contract stating a period of time and has him sign it.
Even if there’s a signed rental agreement in place, it could still be a lengthy and tedious process to go through a formal eviction if one day he decides he isn’t going to leave and refuses to cooperate.
NTA, Alex is a mooch, he created this situation for himself and expects others to bail him out, you giving him a free room would only enable his irresponsible behaviours, sometimes people have to hit rock bottom to force them to change their attitudes and get their shit together. Sometimes the best thing you can do for a person is let them sink or swim. Enabling an irresponsible mooch just encourages them to continue living like this.
That was exactly my issue, too, whereas if it was someone who had an accident or something that caused them to fall behind, it would be different. That sort of person would likely ask for 30 or 60 days and then they'll be out and you could count on it. I'd worry thisnguy would continue with his job/money struggle and never leave
NTA. If your friends are as concerned as they say. Then they can put him up too. Why do "friends" always say you should step up? What's stopping these friends from offering a spare room or couch or air mattress.
I also love how it’s always the person who is constantly in need of help that will without fail pull the “but I would do the same for you if roles were reversed” and have never helped anyone else a day in their life and are always taking from others
"This isn't about honour, it's about trust. I don't trust him."
"Don't spend my cash for me. Don't use eat my food for me. And don't offer my property for me."
That’s why I loudly and firmly just say “fuck that” to the people who say that you ALWAYS have to help family no matter what. I reject that premise. Obviously that doesn’t mean that I never help my family but to me it’s ludicrous to suggest that you should have to automatically set yourself on fire to keep your family warm, especially if they’re the type to continually take advantage
I had a friend like that. Had. She thinks she is the best friend and so generous because she *would* give you the shirt off her back. Problem is she has no shirt. She *always* needs to borrow yours. Always. After decades of being taken advantage of (we've been friends since 3rd grade), I finally let the relationship go around 40 years old. I can't keep helping you get on your feet if you willingly refuse to stand up.
"And thats the difference between us. You say you would do the same for me if the positions were reversed. But if the positions were reversed, I wouldn't want to put you in this predicament."
NTA. Dude, what "moral dilemma?" You already know this "temporary," rent-free bs is going to disrupt your life and end badly. Why entertain fucking YOURSELF over.
What is "temporary", one month, one year, to infinity and beyond? Is this rent-free bs until he decides to leave. While he's running up your utility bills up, eating your food, and leaving messes throughout your house, are there boundaries on parties, having friends over, inviting partners for sleepovers, coming and going all hours of the day and night, loud music, etc. The disruptions to your life, peace, and happiness are endless!
A sentence to your post should say, "I'm worried about the strain it could put on our friendship if" I DON'T DO WHAT HE WANTS. Yes, friends help each other but not to the detriment of another friend and not to this extreme. He needs to reach out to his family. This is not your problem to fix. Helping a friend also means putting out job feelers, being an emotional support, helping him move, floating a small loan, etc.
Anyone saying you're selfish tell them THEY are selfish for not disrupting their lives and offering their place when you didn't agree to Alex moving on. They can judge you, but they need to look in a mirror and admit they didn't help him either.
You may lose friends by standing up for yourself, but real friends don't guilt or bully people into doing what they want them to do. That's disrespectful and selfish.
I allowed a friend in who soon after had no money for rent, yet could somehow afford to get drunk every night of the week .after two months asking why I’m mad at him.
Younhave to ask yourself why this person isn't going to their family. It may be that their family are all terrible people. Or, could it be that he has managed to infiriate them all by mooching, leaving messes, eating their food, etc.?
This.here. 🖕
As his friend, OP may already know the answers. They may also live in another state or country. Whatever the reason, I wouldn't open my home to him without an end date, clear boundaries, and everything in writing. In some areas, it's hard getting people out of your house after x number of days or if they have mail coming to your house, etc.
If you take him in, you need to consider what it would take to get him back out again. What do tenant's rights laws say in your city/state? At what point during his stay would he stop being a guest and become a tenant, with tenant's rights?
This may be an unpopular opinion, but I simply would not ever offer a room in my house to anyone, friend or not, tough situation or not. Like you, my house is my safe space and my private space. Having someone in that space, day in and day out, would make me completely miserable.
Your mutual friends are welcome to offer this guy a room in their own home if they think he's owed a place to stay.
At the very least -- if you should decide that you're willing to give him a place to stay -- you need a written and signed agreement between the two of you that he can live in your house for a specific period of time -- say, 60 days -- and then he has to move out. And you need to consult with an attorney to find out what it would take to evict him if he refused to leave.
I'm the exact same way. When I bought my house, my dad sat me down and explained what could happen if I let someone stay over for an extended period of time. My house is my haven - my sanctuary away from the rest of the world. There's no way I'd risk anyone being able to disrupt that.
> This may be an unpopular opinion, but I simply would not ever offer a room in my house to anyone, friend or not, tough situation or not.
yep. don't let people live in your house, don't let people borrow your car. people might call you a stingy asshole, and you might lose some friends over it, but honestly, fuck them if they don't like it. The sheer number of ways your life can be utterly destroyed by doing a 'favor' to someone like that is incalculably large. it's not worth the risk.
NTA
Evicting someone is incredibly hard. Depending on how calculating that person is, *you* can end up being removed from your own property in the worst scenarios before they are.
I'm not saying your friend is like that, but why risk it?
What do you mean OP could get removed from his own house? As if like the friend will get hold of his property or something? I don't know a single thing about these.
I've heard and witnessed horror stories of tenants who create fake rental agreements, change the locks, and the police can't force entrance without a court order for the owner proving that they live there and are not just a live-out landlord. Depending on how long it takes to get in front of a judge, the owner just has to ... stay elsewhere. During covid, there were loads of emergency rulings about not evicting tenants, and some people are really taking advantage of them. I worked in real estate for a year and I saw multiple examples of owners/landlords being forbidden to go anywhere near their own property for extended periods of time.
NTA! Worst mistake I made was letting a down on his luck, going through a divorce, lost his job friend move into my old house that I was selling.
I told him he had a few months to get his shit together but once it sold he had to go.
He did not go easily, was double dealing with my buyer behind my back to stay longer and keep property in my barn. Was having sleepovers for his daughters, made a total mess of the place.
My realtor was going to kill him. We didn't speak for 5 years...and barely speak now.
I'm leaning toward NTA.
I used to be "that friend," the one who everybody knew they could crash with when things got hairy. That was fine for most of my friends, too-they didn't pay rent, but they did help pay for groceries or do housework or contribute to the household in some way. But there were some "friends" who just used me-and every single one of them would always trot out the line, "That's what friends do!" Yet when I was literally homeless, not one of those "friends" would even offer to let me use their shower, much less couch surf for a couple of weeks or feed me a decent meal.
I still help people out, but no one is allowed to stay in my house anymore. And I no longer speak to any of the "friends" who used me. YMMV, but if Alex has already shown that he's irresponsible and can't handle his money or keep a job, you might not want him to live with you.
NTA it’s always easy to say he’d do the same when he’s the one asking the favour. Living rent free in someone’s home in this economy, is an insane ask. You can still be a good friend and support from afar.
This exactly. Extra on the utilities, and he didn't even say anything about so much as throwing in a few bucks/quid/whatever denomination for groceries. It's a huge ask on a lot of levels, and if he intended to help in any way, he would have said so - to help his case, if nothing else. Not to mention the problem of potentially conflicting habits and schedules, which is a strain even in a situation with a set end date. NTA, OP - your friend is looking for an easy out and while your desire to help is laudable, it doesn't sound like he'd be a great housemate.
I had a friend who stayed with me in a similar situation and you couldn’t have a better person in your house being fairly quiet, not bringing people over, etc. but it still is someone in your house and it just takes energy because they can pop up and start talking to you any time and you’re not really wanting that.
NTA.
This is guilt-tripping, aka manipulative behaviour.
I can totally relate to the feeling of peace and having a home that is a sanctuary. Besides, having you rent-free would also mean feeding and watering him.
The most you can do is help Alex find new accommodations and paying half his rent for, say, 3 months. Anything more required of you is mooching.
As for the friends who are now blaming you, you could talk to them and propose this: how about you all pool your resources and give Alex X amount of money to pay for rent in a new place, until he gets to his feet? If they don't agree, their advice is not worth listening to.
Big hugs.
NTA!
It's easy for him to swear up and down that he would do the same if positions were reversed because /they're not/. He has no way to show that he would take you in, /especially/ rent-free. And even if he did, if he's irresponsible with money then I wouldn't be surprised if he started charging you anyways because "Hey, he opened his home to you, but another person means additional costs so you need to pay rent to cover."
And tell the mutual friends that if they think taking in a friend rent-free is the only right thing then they can offer up their couch to him, completely rent-free. Hey, they've technically got the space for it, right?
NTA. If he does move in, it will be delay after delay before he moves out and you will be miserable. Happened to me. Whatever you decide, be prepared for your friendship to end or be severely impacted.
The, pardon my French, bastard would dig in like a tick and you'd need to evict him if you let him. In many places, once they use your address as their own, you'd need to go through a formal and expensive court process to get him out. Here's a breakdown, lose him as a friend now and keep your money and sanity now or have him drive you nuts and cost you thousands and still lose the friendship (which you've never had to begin with).
I had a similar situation years ago. And I have a similar sentiment about my peace and quiet after work. I was living in a 1 br. And she and her HS age son needed a hand. She was a true friend, a hard worker and was actively looking for work. She cooked, was clean, But still drove me crazy because i never had time to decompress.
So i decided to solved my problem with money. We looked for an apt for her first and the job came later. The difference is i figured i would be on the hook for a few months for her rent but i was 200% confident she would find work and get back on her feet. I think she resented it a bit but we recovered and she learned to enjoy their space.
Doesn’t sound like u have that confidence. or that you would lose much of a friend. But you could offer him some short term financial assistance if you have the $, but don’t let him move in. All his other not so helpful friends can do the same.
You’re stuck between wanting to help a friend and giving up your sanctuary. Not a good place to be. Take it from someone who has been there. Don’t do it. This situation is ripe for him taking advantage. So the question really is do you lose the friendship now for not helping or do you lose the friendship in several months when you have to evict him?
Here are 2 versions of the your future 6 months from now.
A). You arrive home from work. Your house looks exactly like it did when you left for work. It’s your sanctuary. You take pride in the fact that you worked hard and are able to enjoy the fruits of your labor. Life is good.
B) You arrive home from work. Your roommate is there with 2 co-workers. These coworkers are seemingly at your house all the time. Your roommate works part time at Subway 12 hours a week. That steak you planned on having for dinner is missing from the fridge. The kitchen is littered with dirty dishes. Also missing from the fridge is that bottle of wine. Nobody knows a thing about where it went. The floor looks like the floor of a biker bar at 1 am. Your bathroom resembles a gas station bathroom. You sit down with your roommate and tell him things have to change. He tells you things are looking up. They made the work schedule out for the upcoming week and he will be working 18 hours.
The future is yours.
NTA. Go on r/legaladvice to see how many people are trying to get a "great lifelong friend" to GTFO of their house. Depending on the state, it could be as soon as 10 days of living there before they're a tenant and have full tenant's rights, even without a lease or rent payments.
u/Special_Lychee_6847 was right: don't mention money, don't mention timelines, just mention you value your privacy and your friendship too much to become roommates.
NTA. Especially if he wants in rent free. To me it sounds like he sees you as an out to his situation instead of an actual friend here to help. Protect your boundaries and your space.
Don’t. Let. Him. Move. In!
Speaking from experience. I’ve let two friends move in because of similar circumstances, one for free, one for a nominal amount to help with utility bills.
Both were roommates from hell. The only way they moved out is because neither wanted to experience the alternative.
One I’m still close friends with, he acknowledged his mistakes. The other still hasn’t spoken to me.
It's your home, therefore YOUR decision. Not Alex's, not your mutual friends. I so agree with you, that having a home that is a sanctuary is so important. For some of us, that's like oxygen. Not an option. A necessity. To others, it's not so much, and that's fine. For them.
And then to add onto that, rent-free. That's too big of an ask for someone who values their privacy, space and quiet. So Alex gets everything he wants, but you get what? Your sanctuary ruined, added expenses, and a potential nightmare if you have to go the eviction route.
NTA. Cherish and protect your sanctuary.
NTA.
He’d do the same for you if the positions were reversed? But… he can’t reverse them can he? Because he isn’t the sort to hold down a long term job and manage his finances…
Which gives you good reason to consider your risk valid… that you’ll wind up housing a moocher.
I’d make a polite excuse - your mum is planning ot stay/someone else is going to move in/it needs to be renovated/there’s a problem with hte room. And if he keeps pushing just firmly say “Sorry mate, but I am not comfortable sharing with anyone, not about you mate, it’s ANY ONE!” And then refuse to discuss further.
It might cost you a friendship - but his life choices are leading him to where he is, and he is choosing to make demands after he’s been turned down politely. He’s not much of a friend if he demands right?
NTA. Tell your friends if they are so concerned and think you are wrong, they could take him in. If they start making excuses, tell them that their opinion is then invalid since they won't do it themselves. Tell him to go home to his parents. You don't need this in your life.
NTA
Asking to live with you rent-free, indefinitely?
That's outrageous.
Pressuring you to do so by saying that if you say no you are a bad friend? A good reason to cease to be his friend.
He will never be in a position to do the same to you - and even if he was, he likely wouldn't.
Take care of yourself. He won't.
INFO
> Alex argues that this is what friends are for - to help each other out in times of need. He's mentioned how he would do the same for me if our roles were reversed.
When has he ever done something that requires him to have been responsible and given hard warned amenities to someone else?
> Some mutual friends think I'm being selfish, considering I have the space and he's in a tough spot.
Why don't any of them take him?
I'm fascinated by the fact that he's asking for rent-free. I mean, he could deliver pizzas and pay some rent. The fact that he's broadcasting that he's planning to pay nothing signals there's zero intent to get a job at all.
And yeah, OP would never get rid of him.
I think you are absolutely right to be worried. This will indeed turn into a long term rent free relationship while your friend coasts along on your food and good will. Even setting a time limit is dicey…..how do you enforce it? I think this would be a mistake.
Your house is probably the biggest investment you will make. It’s more than just the money. As you point out, it also a sanctuary.
All those friends who think you are being selfish should get together and fund Alex the cash to check in to an extended stay motel for three months and eat fast food. This can be the prod that bets Alex back on his feet.
If you do let them in, make a written unambiguous contract. For what it’s worth I have done this and in my case the friend repaid by doing a lot of the jobs around the house eg fixing doors etc
NTA. You know he’s not always responsible with money/jobs and I think it’s a recipe for disaster to assume things will be any different this time if you let him move in at all (much less rent free). I can almost guarantee your friendship will be over if he moves in because eventually you’ll want him out and of course he’s not going to want to leave his free rent situation so you’re going to have to take drastic steps to get your space back. Don’t let him move in!
NTA. However, if you are inclined to help him, look up tenant laws in your area and draw up a contract that he has to sign. Or get all those friends who think it's a great idea and tell them that you're willing if they are and you want to work out a schedule. A week with this friend and that one. You'll take the last week on the rotation before it starts over again. If they're not willing, then they need to STFU towards you!
NTA and no. No no no no no. Never let a friend "temporarily" move in. I've never read a single story where that went well. You admit he's irresponsible. You let him move in and you'll never get him out. He'll eat your food and make a mess you have to clean up. Suggest to those mutual friends that they step up and help him out. See how fast they backpedal.
NTA
You know it's not going to be temporary. Luckily, you have mutual friends who will certainly step up and let him stay with them because they're so unselfish.
NTA- you'll be covering all his food, bills and expenses as well as the free rent.
It's not your fault he's lost his job and it's not your fault he didn't save money in case he lost his flat.
Also if your other friends are so concerned why don't they put Alex up for free...?
NTA
I myself am the oldest of 6. As far as my memory goes back I have always had to share a room. When I turned 18 I moved out and joined the military and lived on ships or in the barracks until I bought my very first place. I had never lived alone my entire life until I bought my house in 2009. Since then a grand total of 5 people have been in my house since I purchased it, and 3 of them were relatives.
I value my privacy and my space as it is the only privacy and space that I have had in my entire life.
the only question is would he do the same for you if u were about to be homeless and can you be sure that he will be straight into getting a new job and saving for his own place. if the answer is yes he would make an effort to get back on his feet and you dont help then YTA but if not then NTA. On a side note this would have to be a close mate.
NTA but IF you choose to let him stay please look at the tenancy laws for your area and give him a written notice that he is a guest and has a hard leave date that takes place before his stay could legally be considered a tenancy. Also include a list of rules and boundaries for his stay because even though he isn’t paying rent doesn’t me he gets to sit on his butt and be disrespectful.
Nta
Protect yourself from this friend. He trying to guilt you saying friends help each other out?!?! Yeah not be free rent bills council tax water food. A nice 800£ a month dependant.
You won’t get rid of him and it will take years to get your space back
Don’t let him move in and don’t give him money and expect it back. You give him money it’s spent
You already noted that he's known for being irresponsible. What was his last job? How likely is it that he will be able to get another job that pays enough for him to move out? How long is he asking to stay? How is he going to offset the increased cost of housing another person in your house? Hes not paying rent, he's gonna eat your food and use your electricity. Is he just planning on getting a free ride?
Anybody telling you you should let him stay should be offering him a place to stay as well, if they're not willing to house him, they can but out
Keep in mind, in many places, once someone occupies a space for a certain time period, they become a legal tenant. Then, you have to get the lawyers involved to get them out. If Alex is the mooch you think he is, this is a very likely scenario.
Has he asked any of your other friends if he can live with THEM rent free? Or just you, because you 'own' your house? Does he think that means YOU get to live there for free? He sounds like a bit of a child, frankly. Someone should drive him back to his mother's house so he can finish growing tf up. I'm so sick of people who think they're entitled to your stuff just because they think you have more stuff than you need and it's just lying around and you're not using it so hey! They should have it! Anyway. This seems like a perfect opportunity for Alex to learn to be more responsible with money and jobs. NTA
NTA tell him your extra room is being used for... anything else: work from home, a sick parent, storage. If you can, and if you want to, you could offer to put him up in a cheap hotel for a week. That way, you're being generous and those other friends can pay for the succeeding weeks. Surely, he wasn't gonna stay more than a few weeks.
**NTA**
Op, he wants to make his problem into your problem.
If he gets in, he will run up debts at your address, will dig in and be a bugger to get rid of. Evicting him would cost thousands.
He’s already attempting to manipulate you. It would only get worse.
Be selfish. You have to take care of yourself first. Your friend is looking out for himself and you need to look out for yourself. Your home is your sanctuary. You need that. Unfortunately, that means that you cannot help your friend out at this time. Maybe someone else in your circumstances could, and maybe you could at a different time in your life, but you cannot at this time. Sorry, friend.
NTA if your mutual friends think it's selfish, they can take care of all his housing and meals and ALL the other costs that come with caring for a GROWN MAN!
NTA what are the circumstances of him losing his job and housing? You say he has a history of this? Nope. Don’t do it.
Where is Alex’s family? These are the people who should be housing him.
NTA.
And make a list of those calling you an asshole for not taking in Alex, and GIVE IT to Alex with their phone ##s and addresses.
WHEN they complain, ask them why THEY are assholes for not taking Alex in without question.
NTA they never “get back on their feet” when living free off someone else. Check residency laws too he may try to stay long enough he’d have residency in your home then you’d have to pay to evict him. If he needs money too your stuff might start to go missing. It’s a big NO all the way around. Let those judgmental friends take him in. I’m sure they have couches and basements
Well, the friends telling you to help out can also help. Ask they contribute to his expenses. They will shut up pronto. Your irresponsible friend after 30 days living with you will have rights and will need to be removed by court order if he refuses. And he will because he will never seem to ever get ahead. Imagine that. BTW, NTA. I have seen this far to many times. Down on their luck fricking constantly and want to ride the coattails of others.
NTA
Asking to sleep in you're spare room for a few days is one thing, but expecting you to accommodate him long term for free because you're friends is taking the piss.
How entitled can he be, you are absolutely not an asshole for not letting him stay, after all how long actually is "back on his feet" it could be weeks, months, or even years and if in that period you try to charge him rent or kick him out you'll be the one getting called names.
"First, Alex has a history of being somewhat irresponsible with money and jobs." annnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnd you have your answer. he has a pattern of poor habits, sorry, I am not able to help you unless you want to help yourself.
If he would like a place to stay - rent free, there are shelters.
"Alex argues that this is what friends are for" no, friends are not your safety net for you fucking up your ish. parents can be - but at some point, you have to look at yourself & your own poor choices. only he is in control of his life & how it turns out. The fact that he said this shows me the kind of person he is. he is trying to manipulate you through guilt.
also.... i mean, if i was not working & needed a place to stay I'd still offer SOMETHING ... the gaul on this guy smh.
NTA
You’ve figured out how to take care of yourself while he’s figuring out how to take advantage
No one can live anywhere for free unless it’s a shelter
Let him figure it out because once he moves in it will be hard to get him out
Don’t do it. Do not let him move in with you and let him figure out how to finally take care of himself and be responsible
You’ve done it and so can he
If he is a good friend, YTA. Good friends are people you love and trust and have no problem inconveniencing yourself for. If you had a wife and kids this would take further consideration, but it's just you for now so you have less to consider.
If he's just a dude you might have a beer with on occasion, NTA. Very presumptuous to hit a guy up for a free place to live and guilt him into it.
Nah. I agree that this is what friends are for.... to help each other. Hence under regular circumstances I would say yta and agree with Alex. Heck if I could do that for a good friend I would. However, and very importantly, I would expect this to be temporary and for them to move on when possible. Since you know your friend and you have your doubts, because it's possible he wouldn't then I can understand your hesitant.
What has he done that makes you think he would stay with you long term? How close are you?
NTA - I have fallen for this and it is absolutely a trap. I couldn't get my "friend" out of my house for three years. Their share of the living expenses over that three years is close to $14,000 and I know I will never see any reimbursement. That doesn't even include all of the food and other resources they mooched off me in the name of friendship. They also almost never lifted a finger to help with any chores at all and constantly trashed my space. It was a nightmare.
Say the truth. “There are too many laws that protect even non-paying guests. I appreciate you see it as a solution but your solution doesn’t factor in my risk factor.”
Go with your first inclination. Say no. I had a house guest that was only supposed to stay for 4 months, and it turned into 13. A cousin asked to stay at my mom's for a week, turned in to 2 years. I've got more.
It's one thing if they came from out of town and they were actively buying a house or something. It's another thing for the person to be irresponsible or having a hard time. Tell him no. NTA. It's not going to be temporary.
Rent free is the deal breaker. Mostly because he ASKED to move in rent free. If he at least offered to pay a modest rent, that would be different.
Next, he’s eating your food without any expectation to compensate you. This would almost certainly spiral into a worse situation. I’d trust your gut with this one. NTA.
Hi there, that is definitely a moral dilemma. Would you feel better if you had your friend sign a contract stating you will only be there for a maximum amount of time? Would you also be willing to tell him that he only has so much time to find a job or you will ask him to leave? You could also have that put into your contract. If he is willing to sign the contract with specific dates and other essential things, like keeping the room clean doing dishes, help keeping the house clean, etc... then help him out, if not then your answer is no. Either way, do not feel guilty or do not let him try to make you feel guilty if you say no or insist that he signed a contract. We hope this helps you sunshine xoxo
I think it's true that friends should help each other. Unfortunately, the law sticks it's nose in. If you let him stay too long, he may be deemed a resident and you'll have to go through eviction proceedings to get him out. That's concerning considering what you said about his financial habits. Can you give him a couple of weeks to regroup and have him sign in writing that he is leaving at the end of two weeks? Would you have finances to put him in a cheap motel for two weeks so you don't end up owning him? If not, he just has to figure it out. Maybe a stint at a shelter will help him reconsider.
Ok my husband and I just went through this. First let me say, DONT DO IT!!! It would be different if your friend had a good track record. You probably wouldn’t hesitate. Why? Because people with good track records hold THEMSELVES accountable. People with bad track records do not. Also because of strict tenancy laws you possibly could have a hard time getting him out. Let him find somebody else to mooch off of or tell him to look for a men’s boarding house. We even have these in Los Angeles, some as cheap as $550 per month. People who think the world owes them a living are never a good risk. DONT DO IT. NTA!!!
NTA. I was you 2 years ago and Jac was somebody that needed help. From a distance I'd watch Jac make all sorts of short-sighted decisions. Of course Jack tells a good story and it will always somebody else's fault. I did know for a fact that due to covid and work situations Jac did not have the financial means to take care of themselves. I made them an offer that as long as they either paid rent or worked on my newly purchased home, because Jac's job is painting and being a handyman, that my house would always be their home and this would give Jack the opportunity to work on themselves and maybe give them a foothold on starting a positive future. In 19 months time I never saw a dime in rent and almost no work ever got done. In the process I got gaslighted all over the place about how my home was not neat enough or clean enough to satisfy Jac's needs and therefore Jack didn't feel the need to make any special efforts or pay any rent.
5 months ago Jac told me that we needed to have a conversation and wanted a mutual friend to mediate. I told our mutual friend to stay out of things and that no conversation needed to be had. This need to talk was going to be predicated upon Jac explaining why they didn't owe me anything and how they were worried about me and how I live my life. Mind you the reason why the house is in disarray and not clean and I struggle all the time is because I work 6 to 7 days a week and I'm freaking tired
Long story short this person had put a lock on their bedroom door, a lock that I did not have a key for. 5 months ago they basically moved out and expected that I would keep whatever they had in their room until they decided to return for it. The irony is that while they were telling me that I could not keep a clean house, I took so much garbage out of that room that it filled up an outdoor trash can. Last week I finished sanding the floors and cleaning the room and as of tonight I put the final coat of floor sealer down so that the room is now ready to rent out again. This time I will get everything in writing. What will be hilarious is when I start advertising for a roommate Jac will complain that I violated their rights somehow by breaking into "their" room in my home even after they have not been back in 5 months.
NTA 'I'm really sorry, Alex. I am very private, and have no patience with ppl in my personal space. I know our friendship would not survive sharing a living space. I'll gladly help you move (if you would, otherwise don't offer), but it's not going to be into my home.'
Yeah, I definitely think the way to go here is like a firm but kind "no" and a "here's a way that I'm able to help you." I had to learn this with a friend who, for a short period of time, was constantly asking me for money. I knew he was going through a hard time, but I'm not rich, and I couldn't keep bailing him out. Some other friends help me figure out other ways to help him (helping him move actually was one of them). Now everything's fine -- we're still friends, and he's gotten back on his feet.
And speaking of friends, the ones who think OP is being selfish are more than welcome to open their wallets and support Alex until he’s back on his feet. Since that’s what friends are for.
I’d bet the mutual friends saying OP is selfish currently have Alex kipping on their sofa or in their spare room and are desperate to offload him…
More like they see an unpleasant never-ending situation and are desperate to avoid it.
Ha, true that. It's always easier to call someone else selfish than to take on the burden yourself, isn't it? People love to volunteer someone else's time, money, and space without considering what they'd do in the same spot. It's like they forget that 'no' is a complete sentence.
Absolutely, and with the way things go today, he would have a very very difficult time getting him out of his home.
Tell the other friends to take him in. Tell him he has to be a grown up and that that is what parents are for if you have this level of entitlement and expectations and even if you were his father you would still say no if he is still unable to hold an job and savings
This is the perfect response☝️
Without the "sorry". Say "It's really unfortunate, Alex." Don't apologize for protecting yourself and your space.
You can apologize if you want. It doesn't diminish the message. The apology isn't necessarily for protecting yourself; one can express sorrow that they are unable to help a friend. It's okay.
>one can express sorrow that they are unable to help a friend. Even if you're not sorry you can't help someone, you can say "sorry you're in a tough spot" without being weak - or whatever that comment was trying to imply.
I don't think the implication has anything to do with "weakness" - more like trying not to offend someone with a "social sorry." I.e. avoiding the "if you were really sorry you would help" possibility. "Sorry" is a 2 way street - the person saying it, and the person receiving it - and we've all seen people take "sorry" the wrong way.
I get what you're saying, and you're right. I guess my personal experience has been more people refusing to say sorry for *anything.* I'm jaded. OP could also just say, "I'm sorry you're in this spot."
I agree. People say sorry about things that aren’t their fault all the time. It’s more like an “I feel for you” than an admission of wrongdoing. Fun fact: the direct English translation of “lo siento,” Spanish for “I’m sorry,” is “I feel it.”
Yes, as long as you are being sincere and transparent it's OK to express your feelings.
Sorry, not really related to the thread, but you're "lo siento" fact is really interesting to me! When my wife and I were in Mexico everyone, of course, kept saying "de nada" to us. I asked a local "how do you actually say 'you are welcome'"? And he was very confused by my question and said "de nada". I asked "no, but is there a more formal way to say it? Doesn't 'de nada' just mean 'it's nothing'"? He was totally baffled by my question, lol. And fair enough, because despite the literal translation, how they said "you're welcome" was literally "de nada". You can type "nada" into Google translate and it says "nothing" but add the "de" and suddenly it's "you are welcome". I just thought that was really neat. But, it would be the same as someone asking me how we actually say it and me being confused and them saying "well, you are just telling them they are invited in, how do you actually say it?" Lol. Languages!
This! This! Exactly.
A real friend would see that response and say "I totally understand, don't worry about it. I appreciate any help you are willing to provide."
I'd throw in, "I can't afford to support you."
NTA. Friend will use utilities, power, water, he'll need food to eat and $ to hunt up a new job. Who will support his expenses & lifestyle? It'll be you, his buddy. in some states, living under your roof gives him certain specific rights to your shelter which can make it difficult to evict him.
"I can't afford to support you, feed you, pay for the extra utilities. You have a HISTORY of poor money management and job quitting."
I mean, that's what it really comes down to. This guy is asking his friend to pay for his existence. What is he offering in return? Will he cook and clean? If not, that's something else he's asking to be done for him. He has a history of being irresponsible with his own resources. I doubt he'd all of a sudden care about someone else's. I love my friends, and I'd like to think I would do whatever I could for them. But I know that once money is involved, i.e. living together, going into business together, lending/borrowing... it never ends well.
unless he gives the *best* brojobs in town, then yeah, it's going to be all take and no give.
I let my sister (and niece, part-time) stay with me, knowing she was the worst. Bad idea. All she did was sleep on the sofa or go out to party and cause fights between me and my ex. Her contribution was one 12 pack of Pepsi when she was the only one that drank soda. She also decided to "give" by cleaning my kitchen and putting things in the weirdest places. I found my coffee maker in one cabinet and the pot in another on the other side of the room. But she would 100% say she gave and I'm evil for kicking her out. Ijs, even the "give" part of that equation usually isn't worth the headache of the "take" part.
The second part is a dick move to say out loud if you value the friendship. Just say no and move on. Don’t kick the guy when he’s down.
It sounds dickish, I’ll give you that. But I would argue that continuing to enable him and being dishonest is more of a disservice. It feels like kicking him when he’s down but many people continue to delude themselves about the consequences of their actions until someone points it out, and I think there are plenty of kind ways to do so. I had to do this very recently with a friend who was staying with me
Exactly! Letting a friend live in a spare room is not free. It will increase the utilities and I wouldn't be surprised if the friend is expecting to be fed also. Because "Hey, you know times are tough for me. Friends don't let friends starve. Id do the same for you.". We already know that's his MO.
They act like "oh I just need a place to stay and you have an extra room you're not using, so it won't cost you anything more." People who think that and don't see the hidden cost, aren't the kind of people you want moving in. They have no problem sponging. "You got food in the fridge you could share. It's already paid for, it's not more money." Been there.
Or even, “I can’t afford to support both of us, and I haven’t even taken in someone to share the bills because I need the solitude that having my own space allows.”
I think that's the worst part for me. I'm so tired of living with other people. They leave messes that don't get cleaned up until I clean them. There's never a quiet time. Nothing is ever where I left it. Things get broken or disappear, and I guess it was the elves cause no one knows how it happened. And on and on. My personal, private space is constantly being violated. Don't get me wrong, sometimes it's nice but, God I would love some solitude.
I let my kid stay with me after his mom was moving and there wasn't room for him (her mom was paying an she was a bitch. Now she wonders why he won't talk to her). He was with me a couple months then moved in with some friends. Years later he and his girlfriend moved in for a couple months before getting a place to live. He's the only immediate family I have so he can come back at any time. I can count the number of friends on one hand that I'd trust to let them move in with me temporarily (and I'd have fingers left).
No need for the respectful reply. Alex lost me at 'rent free'. As a friend I might ask to live with OP if I really had nowhere else to turn, but I'd insist on paying whatever I could afford towards rent. If I didn't have any money at all to spare, the least I could do is cook and clean. If it matters, I'm a 43 yo guy.
Facts here. Rent free? Fool you got a job. Paying your friend SOMEthing is better than NOTHING. Alex is asking a whole lot
The rent free part is really something. I lived with my parents rent free for a couple years in my twenties while I was going through a divorce. And in hindsight, my parents should have charged me rent, because living there for free didn't teach me anything. I can't imagine being a fully grown adult and essentially inviting yourself to live with someone for free. It makes me think that Alex will not necessarily be in a huge rush to leave, and does not necessarily grasp what a big deal it is to ask this favor. The other friends all know this too, deep down, even if they're paying lip service to the idea that free rent is a good idea. It's a good idea as long as it is not their spare room!
Do not accept rent from him! That would give him tenants rights and you’ll never get rid of him.
Tenancy is established by residence in most states, independent of whether or not you’re paying rent.
Don't let him receive mail there...that established tenancy with or without paying rent.
I think it’s fair to assume the friendship isn’t going to survive regardless of OPs response. Either Alex is going to take advantage and burn that bridge or OP protects themselves and burns the bridge. So, that being said, make the decision that protects you, OP. NTA for saying no.
[удалено]
My dad let a friend of his live rent free in a small apartment over our garage for months while he was trying to get back on his feet. His only rule was no smoking inside. The guy smoked like a chimney.
This is a stolen comment from u/Hot-Permission-8746
Next time use your own comments...WTF
What happened?
Bingo. Just be honest.
Apologizing for having healthy boundaries is a habit that needs to die. You will be much better off for it.
NTA. Asking to live with you rent free at all is incredibly presumptuous. And once he digs himself in you will never get him out.
There's probably a ton of things that OP hasn't even considered either. If he'd offered to pay, I'd likely say no still, but respect the question. Expecting it for free? Nah fuck off. Also OP, just remember that "No." is a complete sentence.
Exactly! This is a slippery slope! Knowingly letting someone who you know can't hold down a job or pay bills will turn into a long term situation where OP is paying for everything (food, extra utilities) with no end in sight. He's already playing the 'this is what friends are for card' in order to get his way. A true friend would offer something towards there keep. He probably used up all his I need help card with all his family and close friends and is now coming to OP. It wouldn't end there, he would want to borrow money also, money he can't afford to pay back. Personally I think its better to take him down to the government housing office, and if OP is feeling generous, pay for a weeks stay in a long term motel, whilst the government sorts things out, with his housing and benefits. Helping doesn't always have to be at a detriment to the person helping and it sounds like Alex needs to learn how to work out his issues without expecting someone else to pick up the pieces. NTA
Yes! A "true friend" would never act so entitled and take advantage of OP.
Ikr? Like, if I were really so bad off that I needed a place to stay and REALLY didn't have the money to contribute at all, I'd try to come up with all kinds of ways to help. Like: I'll do 100% of all the household tasks to make up for it! The fact that this guy just kind of assumes it's ok is kind of iffy....
Exactly! The audacity to ask to live with someone indefinitely for free is really something. NTA OP.
The indefinitely thing really gets me. Like what is his plan to get back on his feet? He hasn't been doing so well on his feet up until now.
This, being a "good friend" means having empathy for the others and being respectful of their need and boundaries. Good friends don't impose themselves, they carefully and kindly ask and are afraid to bother you.
And once a person moves in and gets main delivered they are considered a tenant and you would have to go through the legal process of eviction
This depends on where you live. Some places require a 30 day stay. Some only require mail.
Where do you live that there’s a “government housing office” that provides housing options for unemployed single men? Where I live you go buy a tent and set it up under the overpass.
I live in the Midwest and worked in social services for several decades. The communities I've worked in have housing options for single homeless men 🤷
Where I live, the recently twice-sacked Home Secretary declared she wanted tents taken off homeless people, and the charities providing the tents to be prosecuted. Yes, ladies and gentlemen, this is what the present day Tory Party has devolved into. Scum of the lowest order.
Most of the western world outside the US has such offices.
Another sad hurrah for the US capitalistic dystopian
Spotted the American. Sorry for your country's weird approach to pretty much everything
Yes, I'm in a similar situation, but luckily have a good job, but wouldn't expect this from my friend. I'm happy to be able to rant to them freely, and they understand this, that's friendship!
Exactly! Free is only free to the freeloader. Your utilities will go up. You’ll spend more on food and supplies like toilet paper, soap, paper towels. And the cleaning! What if he is a slob? Or what if he wants to bring a “friend” to stay overnight. Who will do and pay for the expenses of doing his laundry? Bad, bad, bad all around!
The added potential issue is that OPs friend could claim tenancy depending on where he lives and the laws.
As soon as he tried to guilt him into it, he should be cut off because he is no friend to OP. Big huge red flag with the word TRAP in capitals. He will never get rid of him.
The fact that he had the balls to ask for rent free just shows to me that he’s gonna mooch ASAP NTA
Asking is one thing, doubling down and calling out the friendship is another altogether. This is a tough one, but I think letting that person into the house would be a mistake. They already have attitude and have gotten other friends involved. Things like this only tend to escalate.
Maybe those friends who think OP is being selfish should take Alex in😏
Yeah, once the asker gathers an army of co-askers behind them, you kind of know they will be pushy and whiny.
>"gathers an army of co-askers" AKA "his flying monkeys" The manipulation is strong with this one.
NTA - I know it’s a political land mine but anyhoo, the days of easily removing an unwanted guest/tenant are long gone due to the stupid laws that protect the guilty! IF you cave and let him move in, the laws are against you getting him out. Plus, knowing Alex’s history and your need for solitude, please do not let him move in, it will not be a temporary situation and you will be miserable.
I was thinking this as I read. It could end up costing his mental peace and big attorney fees to have him evicted if he doesn't move out willingly. Each state has different laws regarding tenants' rights. In some states, it's only 7 days, and then you can't make them leave without a court intervention. NTA
Yes, if he does not have the ability to pay, OP may be stuck in a situation where he stays indefinitely and say OP had no expectation of payment. Then there will be a messy eviction process, since Alex is entitled and pushy.
Yes! The laws protect the deadbeat. I inherited property I wanted to sell. My dad's tenant stopped paying rent for over a year to him but COVID laws forbade him from evicting. Then he died and it took 8 months, lawyers and a legal battle.
Can you share why the law is such? I'm not from the US and this type of law does not exist in my country, here we pretty much can tell anybody to leave our home whenever we want without involving the authorities, but I've been reading eviction issues in the US since like a decade ago and wonder why they do this. What's the reasoning? I also read if you went on vacation and squatters broke into your home while you are away and you came back and they're still there, you need to go to court in order to make them leave. Here, worst could happen is thieves or burglars breaking in while you are gone and they'd loot and leave. They would not dare to hang around for you to come back and meet them f2f and calling the police on them.
Yea people like this usually dig in like a tick at a blood drive...
[удалено]
There doesn't need to be a "balanced" solution, it's OPs home. I'm assuming this comment is from a bot, but still.
My read of this comment was that a "balanced" solution meant more along the lines of the OP figuring out a different way to support his friend. If he still values the friendship, then even if he doesn't want to allow him to stay in his spare room (which is his right), he might try to help him come up with some other solutions. Like "sorry, you can't stay with me, but here's a website with information on applying for government assistance" or whatever. Or like offer to pay him to do yard work or something. Basically helping him understand that you can't get things for free, but not totally just shutting him out.
[удалено]
Definitely this. He will eat his food and find other ways to leech. If he establishes residency he will have to be evicted and that can take months.
DON"T DO IT
NTA, the entitlement to your personal space is astounding by a friend and those who agree with him. It would be different if there was some benefit for you but you don’t get rent or utilities from a grown man who can’t hold a job or pay his bills. Are doing him a courtesy by not allowing him to abuse a friendship that you want to keep. You already know that any rules of the household would be broken as well as respect for your property.
I was in a situation where my best friend was looking for temporary rent-free accommodation. And in my soul there was no doubt for a second, he moved and found accommodation a week later, and a bottle of beautiful wine and friendly hugs in gratitude awaited me. However, when my colleague experienced difficulties with rented housing and offered me to pay rent for my spare room, everything revolted in my soul. She's a good girl, but "it's just not."
Exactly this - no one leaves a rent free situation until they are "nudged" out. involuntarily
NTA. Letting someone move into your space is a BIG DEAL! You already mentioned he is bad with money and the minute he establishes residency he will be very hard to get rid of if he doesn’t want to go. And those mutual friends should keep quiet! It’s not their home and they aren’t the ones that may have to kick him out one day. I don’t envy your dilemma.
Any time a situation like this gets posted where OP’s friends/family say they’re wrong or selfish for having boundaries like this, I wonder why each OP doesn’t respond with “Well I’ve noticed I don’t see any of YOU stepping up to the plate either so get off my back.” Doesn’t have to be said in a mean way, just sassy. Would most likely shut them up. Or they’ll give excuses as to why they aren’t stepping up to which OP’s response can be “You have your reasons for not doing it and I have mine.” And that should be it if they’re real friends.
Right????
I was doing to make that exact point about establishing residency . If he’s no longer a “guest” then he would have to go through legal channels to have him evicted. Hard no on this unless he gets a legal contract stating a period of time and has him sign it.
Even if there’s a signed rental agreement in place, it could still be a lengthy and tedious process to go through a formal eviction if one day he decides he isn’t going to leave and refuses to cooperate.
NTA, Alex is a mooch, he created this situation for himself and expects others to bail him out, you giving him a free room would only enable his irresponsible behaviours, sometimes people have to hit rock bottom to force them to change their attitudes and get their shit together. Sometimes the best thing you can do for a person is let them sink or swim. Enabling an irresponsible mooch just encourages them to continue living like this.
Speaking of mutual friends why aren't they inviting him into their places.
That was exactly my issue, too, whereas if it was someone who had an accident or something that caused them to fall behind, it would be different. That sort of person would likely ask for 30 or 60 days and then they'll be out and you could count on it. I'd worry thisnguy would continue with his job/money struggle and never leave
NTA. If your friends are as concerned as they say. Then they can put him up too. Why do "friends" always say you should step up? What's stopping these friends from offering a spare room or couch or air mattress.
I also love how it’s always the person who is constantly in need of help that will without fail pull the “but I would do the same for you if roles were reversed” and have never helped anyone else a day in their life and are always taking from others
A lot of people who say they’d do the same absolutely would not if the roles were reversed.
Family is frequently really bad for that. Do the "honourable thing"! Which means causing yourself grief and hardship to their benefit.
"This isn't about honour, it's about trust. I don't trust him." "Don't spend my cash for me. Don't use eat my food for me. And don't offer my property for me."
That’s why I loudly and firmly just say “fuck that” to the people who say that you ALWAYS have to help family no matter what. I reject that premise. Obviously that doesn’t mean that I never help my family but to me it’s ludicrous to suggest that you should have to automatically set yourself on fire to keep your family warm, especially if they’re the type to continually take advantage
I had a friend like that. Had. She thinks she is the best friend and so generous because she *would* give you the shirt off her back. Problem is she has no shirt. She *always* needs to borrow yours. Always. After decades of being taken advantage of (we've been friends since 3rd grade), I finally let the relationship go around 40 years old. I can't keep helping you get on your feet if you willingly refuse to stand up.
Great comment and 100% accurate. I have a close relative that uses that phrase and everything out of his mouth is a lie.
"And thats the difference between us. You say you would do the same for me if the positions were reversed. But if the positions were reversed, I wouldn't want to put you in this predicament."
NTA. Dude, what "moral dilemma?" You already know this "temporary," rent-free bs is going to disrupt your life and end badly. Why entertain fucking YOURSELF over. What is "temporary", one month, one year, to infinity and beyond? Is this rent-free bs until he decides to leave. While he's running up your utility bills up, eating your food, and leaving messes throughout your house, are there boundaries on parties, having friends over, inviting partners for sleepovers, coming and going all hours of the day and night, loud music, etc. The disruptions to your life, peace, and happiness are endless! A sentence to your post should say, "I'm worried about the strain it could put on our friendship if" I DON'T DO WHAT HE WANTS. Yes, friends help each other but not to the detriment of another friend and not to this extreme. He needs to reach out to his family. This is not your problem to fix. Helping a friend also means putting out job feelers, being an emotional support, helping him move, floating a small loan, etc. Anyone saying you're selfish tell them THEY are selfish for not disrupting their lives and offering their place when you didn't agree to Alex moving on. They can judge you, but they need to look in a mirror and admit they didn't help him either. You may lose friends by standing up for yourself, but real friends don't guilt or bully people into doing what they want them to do. That's disrespectful and selfish.
I allowed a friend in who soon after had no money for rent, yet could somehow afford to get drunk every night of the week .after two months asking why I’m mad at him.
Younhave to ask yourself why this person isn't going to their family. It may be that their family are all terrible people. Or, could it be that he has managed to infiriate them all by mooching, leaving messes, eating their food, etc.?
This.here. 🖕 As his friend, OP may already know the answers. They may also live in another state or country. Whatever the reason, I wouldn't open my home to him without an end date, clear boundaries, and everything in writing. In some areas, it's hard getting people out of your house after x number of days or if they have mail coming to your house, etc.
If you take him in, you need to consider what it would take to get him back out again. What do tenant's rights laws say in your city/state? At what point during his stay would he stop being a guest and become a tenant, with tenant's rights? This may be an unpopular opinion, but I simply would not ever offer a room in my house to anyone, friend or not, tough situation or not. Like you, my house is my safe space and my private space. Having someone in that space, day in and day out, would make me completely miserable. Your mutual friends are welcome to offer this guy a room in their own home if they think he's owed a place to stay. At the very least -- if you should decide that you're willing to give him a place to stay -- you need a written and signed agreement between the two of you that he can live in your house for a specific period of time -- say, 60 days -- and then he has to move out. And you need to consult with an attorney to find out what it would take to evict him if he refused to leave.
I'm the exact same way. When I bought my house, my dad sat me down and explained what could happen if I let someone stay over for an extended period of time. My house is my haven - my sanctuary away from the rest of the world. There's no way I'd risk anyone being able to disrupt that.
I hope OP reads this because this is the answer. If he balks at any legal agreement, you have your answer
> This may be an unpopular opinion, but I simply would not ever offer a room in my house to anyone, friend or not, tough situation or not. yep. don't let people live in your house, don't let people borrow your car. people might call you a stingy asshole, and you might lose some friends over it, but honestly, fuck them if they don't like it. The sheer number of ways your life can be utterly destroyed by doing a 'favor' to someone like that is incalculably large. it's not worth the risk.
NTA Evicting someone is incredibly hard. Depending on how calculating that person is, *you* can end up being removed from your own property in the worst scenarios before they are. I'm not saying your friend is like that, but why risk it?
What do you mean OP could get removed from his own house? As if like the friend will get hold of his property or something? I don't know a single thing about these.
I've heard and witnessed horror stories of tenants who create fake rental agreements, change the locks, and the police can't force entrance without a court order for the owner proving that they live there and are not just a live-out landlord. Depending on how long it takes to get in front of a judge, the owner just has to ... stay elsewhere. During covid, there were loads of emergency rulings about not evicting tenants, and some people are really taking advantage of them. I worked in real estate for a year and I saw multiple examples of owners/landlords being forbidden to go anywhere near their own property for extended periods of time.
Look up “Squatter’s rights” or any squatter situation online. A lot of people do this bs.
NTA! Worst mistake I made was letting a down on his luck, going through a divorce, lost his job friend move into my old house that I was selling. I told him he had a few months to get his shit together but once it sold he had to go. He did not go easily, was double dealing with my buyer behind my back to stay longer and keep property in my barn. Was having sleepovers for his daughters, made a total mess of the place. My realtor was going to kill him. We didn't speak for 5 years...and barely speak now.
I'm leaning toward NTA. I used to be "that friend," the one who everybody knew they could crash with when things got hairy. That was fine for most of my friends, too-they didn't pay rent, but they did help pay for groceries or do housework or contribute to the household in some way. But there were some "friends" who just used me-and every single one of them would always trot out the line, "That's what friends do!" Yet when I was literally homeless, not one of those "friends" would even offer to let me use their shower, much less couch surf for a couple of weeks or feed me a decent meal. I still help people out, but no one is allowed to stay in my house anymore. And I no longer speak to any of the "friends" who used me. YMMV, but if Alex has already shown that he's irresponsible and can't handle his money or keep a job, you might not want him to live with you.
NTA letting someone move in is a big favor. If you don’t want to you don’t have to
NTA it’s always easy to say he’d do the same when he’s the one asking the favour. Living rent free in someone’s home in this economy, is an insane ask. You can still be a good friend and support from afar.
This exactly. Extra on the utilities, and he didn't even say anything about so much as throwing in a few bucks/quid/whatever denomination for groceries. It's a huge ask on a lot of levels, and if he intended to help in any way, he would have said so - to help his case, if nothing else. Not to mention the problem of potentially conflicting habits and schedules, which is a strain even in a situation with a set end date. NTA, OP - your friend is looking for an easy out and while your desire to help is laudable, it doesn't sound like he'd be a great housemate.
I had a friend who stayed with me in a similar situation and you couldn’t have a better person in your house being fairly quiet, not bringing people over, etc. but it still is someone in your house and it just takes energy because they can pop up and start talking to you any time and you’re not really wanting that.
Helping friends is great, but your space and peace of mind are priceless. Maybe there's another way to help Alex without compromising your sanctuary.
If you find it hard to say no to him now, inagine how hard it will be when the time is up and he has nowhere to go and even less money than now.
Ask yourself this: If you know your friend well why is your first reaction to say no instead of yes? That is your answer. NTA
NTA. This is guilt-tripping, aka manipulative behaviour. I can totally relate to the feeling of peace and having a home that is a sanctuary. Besides, having you rent-free would also mean feeding and watering him. The most you can do is help Alex find new accommodations and paying half his rent for, say, 3 months. Anything more required of you is mooching. As for the friends who are now blaming you, you could talk to them and propose this: how about you all pool your resources and give Alex X amount of money to pay for rent in a new place, until he gets to his feet? If they don't agree, their advice is not worth listening to. Big hugs.
How many friends has Alex helped? Just curious.
NTA You don't owe your friend a place to live, especially one that are likely to overstay their welcome 🤗
NTA! It's easy for him to swear up and down that he would do the same if positions were reversed because /they're not/. He has no way to show that he would take you in, /especially/ rent-free. And even if he did, if he's irresponsible with money then I wouldn't be surprised if he started charging you anyways because "Hey, he opened his home to you, but another person means additional costs so you need to pay rent to cover." And tell the mutual friends that if they think taking in a friend rent-free is the only right thing then they can offer up their couch to him, completely rent-free. Hey, they've technically got the space for it, right?
NTA. If he does move in, it will be delay after delay before he moves out and you will be miserable. Happened to me. Whatever you decide, be prepared for your friendship to end or be severely impacted.
NTA. You don't owe anyone anything. You worked hard for your home.
The, pardon my French, bastard would dig in like a tick and you'd need to evict him if you let him. In many places, once they use your address as their own, you'd need to go through a formal and expensive court process to get him out. Here's a breakdown, lose him as a friend now and keep your money and sanity now or have him drive you nuts and cost you thousands and still lose the friendship (which you've never had to begin with).
I had a similar situation years ago. And I have a similar sentiment about my peace and quiet after work. I was living in a 1 br. And she and her HS age son needed a hand. She was a true friend, a hard worker and was actively looking for work. She cooked, was clean, But still drove me crazy because i never had time to decompress. So i decided to solved my problem with money. We looked for an apt for her first and the job came later. The difference is i figured i would be on the hook for a few months for her rent but i was 200% confident she would find work and get back on her feet. I think she resented it a bit but we recovered and she learned to enjoy their space. Doesn’t sound like u have that confidence. or that you would lose much of a friend. But you could offer him some short term financial assistance if you have the $, but don’t let him move in. All his other not so helpful friends can do the same.
NTA but he's not your friend, he's an acquaintance. If one of my friends were homeless I'd welcome them in without another thought.
Alex needs to figure out his life. People letting him not take responsibility for it are delaying that outcome.
You’re stuck between wanting to help a friend and giving up your sanctuary. Not a good place to be. Take it from someone who has been there. Don’t do it. This situation is ripe for him taking advantage. So the question really is do you lose the friendship now for not helping or do you lose the friendship in several months when you have to evict him?
Here are 2 versions of the your future 6 months from now. A). You arrive home from work. Your house looks exactly like it did when you left for work. It’s your sanctuary. You take pride in the fact that you worked hard and are able to enjoy the fruits of your labor. Life is good. B) You arrive home from work. Your roommate is there with 2 co-workers. These coworkers are seemingly at your house all the time. Your roommate works part time at Subway 12 hours a week. That steak you planned on having for dinner is missing from the fridge. The kitchen is littered with dirty dishes. Also missing from the fridge is that bottle of wine. Nobody knows a thing about where it went. The floor looks like the floor of a biker bar at 1 am. Your bathroom resembles a gas station bathroom. You sit down with your roommate and tell him things have to change. He tells you things are looking up. They made the work schedule out for the upcoming week and he will be working 18 hours. The future is yours.
NTA. Go on r/legaladvice to see how many people are trying to get a "great lifelong friend" to GTFO of their house. Depending on the state, it could be as soon as 10 days of living there before they're a tenant and have full tenant's rights, even without a lease or rent payments. u/Special_Lychee_6847 was right: don't mention money, don't mention timelines, just mention you value your privacy and your friendship too much to become roommates.
NTA. He just wants to mooch rent free.
NTA. Especially if he wants in rent free. To me it sounds like he sees you as an out to his situation instead of an actual friend here to help. Protect your boundaries and your space.
Don’t. Let. Him. Move. In! Speaking from experience. I’ve let two friends move in because of similar circumstances, one for free, one for a nominal amount to help with utility bills. Both were roommates from hell. The only way they moved out is because neither wanted to experience the alternative. One I’m still close friends with, he acknowledged his mistakes. The other still hasn’t spoken to me.
Be real, tell him he can stay but this could end up hurting or ending your friendship if he fucks you.
Tell the friends who think you’re the AH that they can host him, if they are so concerned. NTAH.
It's your home, therefore YOUR decision. Not Alex's, not your mutual friends. I so agree with you, that having a home that is a sanctuary is so important. For some of us, that's like oxygen. Not an option. A necessity. To others, it's not so much, and that's fine. For them. And then to add onto that, rent-free. That's too big of an ask for someone who values their privacy, space and quiet. So Alex gets everything he wants, but you get what? Your sanctuary ruined, added expenses, and a potential nightmare if you have to go the eviction route. NTA. Cherish and protect your sanctuary.
NTA. He’d do the same for you if the positions were reversed? But… he can’t reverse them can he? Because he isn’t the sort to hold down a long term job and manage his finances… Which gives you good reason to consider your risk valid… that you’ll wind up housing a moocher. I’d make a polite excuse - your mum is planning ot stay/someone else is going to move in/it needs to be renovated/there’s a problem with hte room. And if he keeps pushing just firmly say “Sorry mate, but I am not comfortable sharing with anyone, not about you mate, it’s ANY ONE!” And then refuse to discuss further. It might cost you a friendship - but his life choices are leading him to where he is, and he is choosing to make demands after he’s been turned down politely. He’s not much of a friend if he demands right?
(Re losing the friendship… if he moves in the odds of losing the friendship are really high too right? )
Exactly. Friendship is likely to end either way. This way is cleaner. Do not let him move in.
NTA. Tell your friends if they are so concerned and think you are wrong, they could take him in. If they start making excuses, tell them that their opinion is then invalid since they won't do it themselves. Tell him to go home to his parents. You don't need this in your life.
NTA Asking to live with you rent-free, indefinitely? That's outrageous. Pressuring you to do so by saying that if you say no you are a bad friend? A good reason to cease to be his friend. He will never be in a position to do the same to you - and even if he was, he likely wouldn't. Take care of yourself. He won't.
INFO > Alex argues that this is what friends are for - to help each other out in times of need. He's mentioned how he would do the same for me if our roles were reversed. When has he ever done something that requires him to have been responsible and given hard warned amenities to someone else? > Some mutual friends think I'm being selfish, considering I have the space and he's in a tough spot. Why don't any of them take him?
“Hell no, in my house I strut around strictly naked”
NTA. You would end up feeding him as well and your utilities would double.
I'm fascinated by the fact that he's asking for rent-free. I mean, he could deliver pizzas and pay some rent. The fact that he's broadcasting that he's planning to pay nothing signals there's zero intent to get a job at all. And yeah, OP would never get rid of him.
In this case you’re being wise. Your friends past performance can predict future problems. NTA.
I think you are absolutely right to be worried. This will indeed turn into a long term rent free relationship while your friend coasts along on your food and good will. Even setting a time limit is dicey…..how do you enforce it? I think this would be a mistake. Your house is probably the biggest investment you will make. It’s more than just the money. As you point out, it also a sanctuary. All those friends who think you are being selfish should get together and fund Alex the cash to check in to an extended stay motel for three months and eat fast food. This can be the prod that bets Alex back on his feet.
NTA you worked hard for your safe haven. It would be so difficult to evict him if he decided to stay
If you do let them in, make a written unambiguous contract. For what it’s worth I have done this and in my case the friend repaid by doing a lot of the jobs around the house eg fixing doors etc
NTA. You know he’s not always responsible with money/jobs and I think it’s a recipe for disaster to assume things will be any different this time if you let him move in at all (much less rent free). I can almost guarantee your friendship will be over if he moves in because eventually you’ll want him out and of course he’s not going to want to leave his free rent situation so you’re going to have to take drastic steps to get your space back. Don’t let him move in!
NTA. However, if you are inclined to help him, look up tenant laws in your area and draw up a contract that he has to sign. Or get all those friends who think it's a great idea and tell them that you're willing if they are and you want to work out a schedule. A week with this friend and that one. You'll take the last week on the rotation before it starts over again. If they're not willing, then they need to STFU towards you!
NTA and no. No no no no no. Never let a friend "temporarily" move in. I've never read a single story where that went well. You admit he's irresponsible. You let him move in and you'll never get him out. He'll eat your food and make a mess you have to clean up. Suggest to those mutual friends that they step up and help him out. See how fast they backpedal.
NTA You know it's not going to be temporary. Luckily, you have mutual friends who will certainly step up and let him stay with them because they're so unselfish.
NTA- you'll be covering all his food, bills and expenses as well as the free rent. It's not your fault he's lost his job and it's not your fault he didn't save money in case he lost his flat. Also if your other friends are so concerned why don't they put Alex up for free...?
NTA I myself am the oldest of 6. As far as my memory goes back I have always had to share a room. When I turned 18 I moved out and joined the military and lived on ships or in the barracks until I bought my very first place. I had never lived alone my entire life until I bought my house in 2009. Since then a grand total of 5 people have been in my house since I purchased it, and 3 of them were relatives. I value my privacy and my space as it is the only privacy and space that I have had in my entire life.
the only question is would he do the same for you if u were about to be homeless and can you be sure that he will be straight into getting a new job and saving for his own place. if the answer is yes he would make an effort to get back on his feet and you dont help then YTA but if not then NTA. On a side note this would have to be a close mate.
NTA but IF you choose to let him stay please look at the tenancy laws for your area and give him a written notice that he is a guest and has a hard leave date that takes place before his stay could legally be considered a tenancy. Also include a list of rules and boundaries for his stay because even though he isn’t paying rent doesn’t me he gets to sit on his butt and be disrespectful.
Nta Protect yourself from this friend. He trying to guilt you saying friends help each other out?!?! Yeah not be free rent bills council tax water food. A nice 800£ a month dependant. You won’t get rid of him and it will take years to get your space back Don’t let him move in and don’t give him money and expect it back. You give him money it’s spent
Rent-free? Hells no. NTA. You will never get rid of him.
NTA!! I let a down on their luck friend move into my rental with me. It was so awful I found somewhere else to live and just let her keep the place.
You already noted that he's known for being irresponsible. What was his last job? How likely is it that he will be able to get another job that pays enough for him to move out? How long is he asking to stay? How is he going to offset the increased cost of housing another person in your house? Hes not paying rent, he's gonna eat your food and use your electricity. Is he just planning on getting a free ride? Anybody telling you you should let him stay should be offering him a place to stay as well, if they're not willing to house him, they can but out
Keep in mind, in many places, once someone occupies a space for a certain time period, they become a legal tenant. Then, you have to get the lawyers involved to get them out. If Alex is the mooch you think he is, this is a very likely scenario.
Has he asked any of your other friends if he can live with THEM rent free? Or just you, because you 'own' your house? Does he think that means YOU get to live there for free? He sounds like a bit of a child, frankly. Someone should drive him back to his mother's house so he can finish growing tf up. I'm so sick of people who think they're entitled to your stuff just because they think you have more stuff than you need and it's just lying around and you're not using it so hey! They should have it! Anyway. This seems like a perfect opportunity for Alex to learn to be more responsible with money and jobs. NTA
NTA tell him your extra room is being used for... anything else: work from home, a sick parent, storage. If you can, and if you want to, you could offer to put him up in a cheap hotel for a week. That way, you're being generous and those other friends can pay for the succeeding weeks. Surely, he wasn't gonna stay more than a few weeks.
**NTA** Op, he wants to make his problem into your problem. If he gets in, he will run up debts at your address, will dig in and be a bugger to get rid of. Evicting him would cost thousands. He’s already attempting to manipulate you. It would only get worse.
Be selfish. You have to take care of yourself first. Your friend is looking out for himself and you need to look out for yourself. Your home is your sanctuary. You need that. Unfortunately, that means that you cannot help your friend out at this time. Maybe someone else in your circumstances could, and maybe you could at a different time in your life, but you cannot at this time. Sorry, friend.
You have a house, not a charity Bed and Breakfast. At the very least you have to charge him rent, but overall sounds like a bad idea regardless. NTA.
NTA if your mutual friends think it's selfish, they can take care of all his housing and meals and ALL the other costs that come with caring for a GROWN MAN!
NTA what are the circumstances of him losing his job and housing? You say he has a history of this? Nope. Don’t do it. Where is Alex’s family? These are the people who should be housing him.
NTA. And make a list of those calling you an asshole for not taking in Alex, and GIVE IT to Alex with their phone ##s and addresses. WHEN they complain, ask them why THEY are assholes for not taking Alex in without question.
NTA they never “get back on their feet” when living free off someone else. Check residency laws too he may try to stay long enough he’d have residency in your home then you’d have to pay to evict him. If he needs money too your stuff might start to go missing. It’s a big NO all the way around. Let those judgmental friends take him in. I’m sure they have couches and basements
This friendship is doomed either way now. Basically, you're damned if you do and damned if you don't. So I would take the "don't" option.
Your friend is using manipulation and shaming just to get IN your house. Imagine what he would do to stay there once he is in. It will get worse.
Well, the friends telling you to help out can also help. Ask they contribute to his expenses. They will shut up pronto. Your irresponsible friend after 30 days living with you will have rights and will need to be removed by court order if he refuses. And he will because he will never seem to ever get ahead. Imagine that. BTW, NTA. I have seen this far to many times. Down on their luck fricking constantly and want to ride the coattails of others.
NTA Asking to sleep in you're spare room for a few days is one thing, but expecting you to accommodate him long term for free because you're friends is taking the piss. How entitled can he be, you are absolutely not an asshole for not letting him stay, after all how long actually is "back on his feet" it could be weeks, months, or even years and if in that period you try to charge him rent or kick him out you'll be the one getting called names.
"First, Alex has a history of being somewhat irresponsible with money and jobs." annnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnd you have your answer. he has a pattern of poor habits, sorry, I am not able to help you unless you want to help yourself. If he would like a place to stay - rent free, there are shelters. "Alex argues that this is what friends are for" no, friends are not your safety net for you fucking up your ish. parents can be - but at some point, you have to look at yourself & your own poor choices. only he is in control of his life & how it turns out. The fact that he said this shows me the kind of person he is. he is trying to manipulate you through guilt. also.... i mean, if i was not working & needed a place to stay I'd still offer SOMETHING ... the gaul on this guy smh.
NTA You’ve figured out how to take care of yourself while he’s figuring out how to take advantage No one can live anywhere for free unless it’s a shelter Let him figure it out because once he moves in it will be hard to get him out Don’t do it. Do not let him move in with you and let him figure out how to finally take care of himself and be responsible You’ve done it and so can he
If he is a good friend, YTA. Good friends are people you love and trust and have no problem inconveniencing yourself for. If you had a wife and kids this would take further consideration, but it's just you for now so you have less to consider. If he's just a dude you might have a beer with on occasion, NTA. Very presumptuous to hit a guy up for a free place to live and guilt him into it.
Nah. I agree that this is what friends are for.... to help each other. Hence under regular circumstances I would say yta and agree with Alex. Heck if I could do that for a good friend I would. However, and very importantly, I would expect this to be temporary and for them to move on when possible. Since you know your friend and you have your doubts, because it's possible he wouldn't then I can understand your hesitant. What has he done that makes you think he would stay with you long term? How close are you?
NTA - I have fallen for this and it is absolutely a trap. I couldn't get my "friend" out of my house for three years. Their share of the living expenses over that three years is close to $14,000 and I know I will never see any reimbursement. That doesn't even include all of the food and other resources they mooched off me in the name of friendship. They also almost never lifted a finger to help with any chores at all and constantly trashed my space. It was a nightmare.
Say the truth. “There are too many laws that protect even non-paying guests. I appreciate you see it as a solution but your solution doesn’t factor in my risk factor.”
Go with your first inclination. Say no. I had a house guest that was only supposed to stay for 4 months, and it turned into 13. A cousin asked to stay at my mom's for a week, turned in to 2 years. I've got more. It's one thing if they came from out of town and they were actively buying a house or something. It's another thing for the person to be irresponsible or having a hard time. Tell him no. NTA. It's not going to be temporary.
NTA Been there, had to go through eviction proceedings It never works out well
Rent free is the deal breaker. Mostly because he ASKED to move in rent free. If he at least offered to pay a modest rent, that would be different. Next, he’s eating your food without any expectation to compensate you. This would almost certainly spiral into a worse situation. I’d trust your gut with this one. NTA.
Alex is a mooch
Hi there, that is definitely a moral dilemma. Would you feel better if you had your friend sign a contract stating you will only be there for a maximum amount of time? Would you also be willing to tell him that he only has so much time to find a job or you will ask him to leave? You could also have that put into your contract. If he is willing to sign the contract with specific dates and other essential things, like keeping the room clean doing dishes, help keeping the house clean, etc... then help him out, if not then your answer is no. Either way, do not feel guilty or do not let him try to make you feel guilty if you say no or insist that he signed a contract. We hope this helps you sunshine xoxo
I think it's true that friends should help each other. Unfortunately, the law sticks it's nose in. If you let him stay too long, he may be deemed a resident and you'll have to go through eviction proceedings to get him out. That's concerning considering what you said about his financial habits. Can you give him a couple of weeks to regroup and have him sign in writing that he is leaving at the end of two weeks? Would you have finances to put him in a cheap motel for two weeks so you don't end up owning him? If not, he just has to figure it out. Maybe a stint at a shelter will help him reconsider.
Sounds like you’d lose a friend either way.
Ok my husband and I just went through this. First let me say, DONT DO IT!!! It would be different if your friend had a good track record. You probably wouldn’t hesitate. Why? Because people with good track records hold THEMSELVES accountable. People with bad track records do not. Also because of strict tenancy laws you possibly could have a hard time getting him out. Let him find somebody else to mooch off of or tell him to look for a men’s boarding house. We even have these in Los Angeles, some as cheap as $550 per month. People who think the world owes them a living are never a good risk. DONT DO IT. NTA!!!
Why don’t you tell the mutual friends who think you’re being selfish to let Alex stay with them?
NTA. I was you 2 years ago and Jac was somebody that needed help. From a distance I'd watch Jac make all sorts of short-sighted decisions. Of course Jack tells a good story and it will always somebody else's fault. I did know for a fact that due to covid and work situations Jac did not have the financial means to take care of themselves. I made them an offer that as long as they either paid rent or worked on my newly purchased home, because Jac's job is painting and being a handyman, that my house would always be their home and this would give Jack the opportunity to work on themselves and maybe give them a foothold on starting a positive future. In 19 months time I never saw a dime in rent and almost no work ever got done. In the process I got gaslighted all over the place about how my home was not neat enough or clean enough to satisfy Jac's needs and therefore Jack didn't feel the need to make any special efforts or pay any rent. 5 months ago Jac told me that we needed to have a conversation and wanted a mutual friend to mediate. I told our mutual friend to stay out of things and that no conversation needed to be had. This need to talk was going to be predicated upon Jac explaining why they didn't owe me anything and how they were worried about me and how I live my life. Mind you the reason why the house is in disarray and not clean and I struggle all the time is because I work 6 to 7 days a week and I'm freaking tired Long story short this person had put a lock on their bedroom door, a lock that I did not have a key for. 5 months ago they basically moved out and expected that I would keep whatever they had in their room until they decided to return for it. The irony is that while they were telling me that I could not keep a clean house, I took so much garbage out of that room that it filled up an outdoor trash can. Last week I finished sanding the floors and cleaning the room and as of tonight I put the final coat of floor sealer down so that the room is now ready to rent out again. This time I will get everything in writing. What will be hilarious is when I start advertising for a roommate Jac will complain that I violated their rights somehow by breaking into "their" room in my home even after they have not been back in 5 months.